A bunch of photos that I took at the Polish Army Museum in Warsaw during my visit back in July. First out is, according to the only sign associated with it, a "KEEP OUT"
The museum appeared to have three main exhibition areas. There's Hall 1, which was probably the old main exhibition and now closed despite the signs still being up. The there's the temporary exhibition hall, currently closed, presumably they're switching out out the exhibits there (I guess my timing wasn't brilliant, but still, there's photos enough for a full thread and then some). And finally the new(ish?) main exhibition in Hall C, titled "Millennium of Polish Arms Glory", which is certainly a title. In effect this means we get things from the 11th century up to 1945.Replica great helm, in the style of mid 14-th century Germany.Fragment of a sword, 12th-13th centurySword, early 13th centurySword, dated 1331Mongolian sabre, early 13th centurySpurs, dated 1331
This Mongol empire sabre bears comparison to earlier Hunnish sabres, as well as the kogarasu-maru over in Japan. It's by and large the last hurra for the Pan-Asian single edged sword, instead of s specifically Mongolian design.
Shishak helmet, 11th century
Here it seems I forgot to photograph the sign, but the swords could certainly be 11th century, or the top one a bit older, and the axe I guess thereabout or a bit younger.
>>62502814Based anon, thanks.That saber is longer than expected if it's a cavalry one
Late 15th century cavalryman. As with nearly all gothic harnesses around in museums today, the one for the man here is a hodgepodge of pieces scraped together form all over (the right gauntlet for example isn't just a mismatch with the left one, but of the older hourglass style), with a number of them likely being modern(ish) replicas.
Bombard, 15th century.>>62502865I don't know what the Mongolian preferences were, but when we see a difference in size between infantry and cavalry swords it's (in my experience) usually the latter that are the larger ones.
>>62502775Museum, mind you is still moving it's exhibits from old location to new one
1: Falchion (their classification, I'd probably say messer), 15th century2: Sword, 14th century3: Sword fragment, 14104: Sword, late 14th century5: Dusack (here I'd absolutely say messer), 14106: Axe, 1409-14117: Axe, early 15th century8: Spurs, late 14th centuryDo note the somewhat randomly assigned numbers here.
Swords, around 1400Mace, early 15th centuryDagger (they specify misericorde, a term which I reflexively but perhaps unfairly associate with 19th century romanticism), early 15th centuryCannonball, early 15th century
Knightly armour (parts of it at least), early 15th century. The sign specifically points out the mail aventail attached to the houndskull helmet... Perhaps (some of) the signs are from before the move >>62502890 mentioned?
Cervellliere helmets, around 1400Kettle hat, late 14th centuryPavise with the colours of the Teutonic order, mid 15th centuryPartisan and halberd (the latter currently hidden behind the visor), early 15th century
Bombard and light culverin, 15th century
Militiaman's armour with pavise, mid 15th century, and assorted polearms, 15th century. Behind that we have a pavise bearer's (yes, that was a specific battlefield role at times, carry a pavise in front of a pike block and then cover behind it as best you could when things got violent, dangerous and prestigious) armour, mid 15th century. Or so they claim, I note that while sallets do appear around then (I*m too tired to try and figure out the exact styles date) the breastplate there is absolutely clearly an early 16th century affair. So sadly we must apparently treat the dates on things here with some caution.
Another one to wave around at people who thinks Europe went "monosteel" for its blades in the late Viking age.
The oddly dated armour, along with more 15th century polearms. The two-handed sword appears meant to belong with the armour..
>>62502890>moving it's exhibits from old location to new oneAw fuck, I never even knew they were moving. Used to go to the old one with my late father as a kid. So many memories...
A look at the breastplate in profile, flat it ain't.
Crossbowman's kit, and yet more polearms.
>>62502887That's because you are thinking in correct terms.I was thinking about "curved swords" in general and if one asked me I would have guessed that one in the OP is some kriegmesser usable on foot with two hands or one, not a cavalry item.But you said Sabre so it's a long cavalry one and that's it.
>>62503049Is there a specific name for the axe second from left
>>62503056>>62503110That glaive is straighter than most seen.Thanks anon
monitoring this thread
Watched thread. I am enjoying your postings, OP.
>>62503059They are moving museum to the citadel. When I was there last year, there was only one display room open.
>>62503023>>62503049for some reason I thought pavises are larger than that
>>62502865If you look at it's only a little bit longer than the (3) bastard sword. As someone else already stated, cavalry swords like to be long. And cavalry sabres were typically long swords. I was going to say that being a long one-handed curved sword intended for cavalry is practically the definition of a sabre. But etymological drift destroying the original meaning of the term means that I'm just going to get accosted by autists so I'll refrain.
Lucerne hammer, a type of pollaxe. The defining feature, seen quite well here, is that its head slides down onto the top spike and shaft. Pollaxes, despite their name, don't actually need to have an axe blade, I'm less certain if we'd still consider something a lucerne hammer even if it lacked a hammer side. Whereas pollaxes in general vary immensely, I can't think of a lucerne hammer that didn't go for the pointy-hammer-and-back-spike combo off the top of my head.>>62503140That explains it. And given the sword directly above I can see why you'd think it was a two handed weapon.>>62503159Digging through Waldman's "Hafted Weapon in..." I suspect it's probably best just called an axe, though it may be a late example of a proto-halberd and/or proto-guisarme form. It's also somewhat similar to the civilian doloir axe, though considerably larger.
Gunner's kit.>>62503293They can be bigger. There's also the hand pavise", which can get down towards buckler size.
Speaks for itself on the whole. Wooden vanes appears to have been the default on military bolts, likely due to it taking better to lying around in an armoury for a decade or three than feathers would.
A pair of mid 15th century "hand cannons" flaking a late 14th century "hand culverin". The pair here would in German lands be called hakenbusche, basically "hook guns" due to the protrusions from the barrels that may have been there so you could have a wall or so help with the recoil. Later on it would help secure these barrels into more modern-ish stocks, and with the addition of a matchlock and some other detail fiddling we get the arquebus. The name arquebus likewise comes from hakenbusche, it's basically just the result of the French trying to pronounce it without exploding and the English gratefully running with the result.The "hand culverin" is often simply called a tiller-stocked gun in English. The stock was often a good deal longer than what is seen here, while the hakenbusche can have built-in sockets for short-ish tiller or fattened-tiller stocks as seen with the gunner's kit above.
I keep disagreeing with the museum about the falchion/messer thing.>>62503396Note the paint fragments. It's possible that very few of these would have been left bare metal back in the day.
Jousting armour, late 15th (early16th?) century along with "feder"(ish) style foot tournament sword.
Jousting armour, made in Nuremberg, early 16th century. Signed by Valentin Siebenbrürger.
Sword, 15th-16th centurySword with birds-head pommel, 16th centurySword, early 16th centuryBuzdygan mace, early 16th centuryWar hammer, early 16th century
Awesome thread, OP, keep posting. Makes me remember my childhood when I read The Crusaders by Sienkiewicz.
Another piece of Valentin's work, this time a Maximilian harness made ca 1540-50.
Estoc, 16th centuryEstoc, early 16th centuryEstoc, 16th centuryWar hammers, early 16th centuryI do note that the museum used "koncerz" for the swords over on the Polish language side of the sign.tgh8y
Note the belt hooks.
>>62503524I guess "koncerz" is a correct term for long and narrow swords. In Russian the word is "konchar".
Another 16th century estoc.
Maximilian armour, early 16th century
Maximilian armour, first half of the 16th century
Armour for tournament on foot, made for Elector Christian I of Saxony by Anton Peffenhauser in Augsburg, 1591. One of twelve identical harnesses commissioned by his wife as a Christmas present.
Mostly hidden by the armour we have a German two-hander (rather Montante-style IMO). Next to that is a two-handed estoc, and on the right a two-handed flamberge. All 16th century, the estoc "western Europe" and the Swords German.
Extending rapier, as the base of the blade can slide up and down this collar "ricasso" section, mid 16th century.
3/4 armour, made in Augsburg, mid 16th century. Signed by Desiderius Kolman Helmschmied, alongside various 16th century weapons.
So far so good.
Katzbalger and a "case of rapiers", ie a pair of them with their hilts essentially cut in half, so that they can both fit into a single scabbard and look like a single sword form some distance. This kind of "double sword" is also seen in China, mostly in the 19th century IIRC, though liekly not very common in either place.
Katzbalger, first half of the 16th century.
>>62503661Cool stuff.
>>62502775u will find more interesting historical polish stuff if u visit a swedish museum lol
Leather cap and mail "bishop's mantle", alongside some guns from the first half of the 16th century and assorted polearms.
>>62503797Ouch
>>62502775Based thread op
>>62503797Oh I've been running around Swedish museums alright. Of particular interest relative to your post was the temporary exhibition of loot they had at the Royal Armoury some years back. One large display case each for Prague and Warsaw.
Sign included.
And speaking of, this parade shield (likely of Sigismund II) is on loan from the Royal Armoury. Though as the sign doesn't specify how it ended up in Stockholm it may simply have been a gift to someone somewhere around the days of Johan III and Sigismund III/I.
Hussar's kit, late 16th-early 17th century.
>>62503624>the base of the blade can slide up and down this collarbizarre, were those at all common? were they just carried unextended, or were they used like that as well?
And the weapons of it.
Hussar's armour (as you can probably tell the Polish have a rather more general idea of what makes a hussar than just the light cavalry of 18th-19th century), late 16th-early 17th century. The multi-piece breatsplate here usually has these called anime cuirasses due to their extra (supposed?) range of motion, the museum instead called it a crab armour.>>62503885As far as I can tell they were quite rare. The idea was probably to carry it collapsed and extend it for fighting, but I seem to recall having seen at leats one that was spring-loaded and which could thus likely be extended mid-fight. All said and done I suspect these may not have been terribly good as actual weapons, and have been more mall-ninja gear and conversation pieces, possibly with someone hoping to get around sword-length laws as long as he kept his rapier in its scabbard as well.
Karabela on the left, mid 17th century, a 17th century koncerz disappearing up out of frame (mostly visible in the previous pic, and note that for this style koncerz becomes the main term in English too, though they also had estoc there in paranthesis), hussar sabre with scabbard from the first half of the 17th century and the rightmost sabre I can't seem to find the info for, but clearly a hussar-suitable sabre and likely same period as the rest.
A pair of wheellock "puffer" pistols, first half of the 17th century (hm, usually I see these ball pommel pistols put into the latter half of the 16th).
Reiter-style armour and weaponry, first half of the 17th century.
>>62503655>>62503661Neat ive never seen that before.
>>62503932Wheellock firearms are cool as fuck.
"Fanfare flame" from the time of Wladyslaw IV Vasa, 1632-48. The Vasa royal house was originally Swedish, but had a bit of a split when "Old King Gustav"'s grandson first became Sigismund III of Poland and Sigmismund I of Swedish and then lost the latter crown to his uncle Karl IX. The Polish kings would at times try to retake Sweden, but as Karl IX's son was Gustav II Adolf... Also perhaps worthy of note is that Sigismund's father, Johan III, had himself become king by deposing his older brother, Erik XIV, when the latter went insane. The fourth of Gustav's legitimate sons went stark raving mad well before Erik, and thus never took part i the family fights. (While never loosing it completely Johan is to have been prone to depression and religious seeking, while Karl inherited dad's nuclear temper.)
17th century fashion statements. Some pretty neat "dimple" fullering on the top sabre.
Hunting shotguns, Upper Silesia, 1650-1700.
Sequence breaking...
Snaphaunce revolver rifle, mid 1717th century.
Brass hauberk of King Johan Casimir, 1649-1668.
At leats it's riveted.
Those firearms are works of art.
Another koncerz, likely late 17th century.
The scabbard style reminds me of one I've seen for a schiavona.
Medium cavalry kit, late 17th century.
"Kalkan" shields. A woven rattan affair also popular down in the middle east and into central Asia.
Leather cover and copper storage/transport case for a kalkan. Late 17th century.
Medium cavalry officer's kit, late 17th century.
"Karacena" armour and a Turkish-style estoc, late 17th century. Medieval art from central and European Europe has quite a number of scale helmets in them, but to the best of my knowledge no specimens survive, resulting in some debate how common they may actually have been. But a bit eastward sand a bit later... Also worth noticing is that the Austrian armoury in Graz has a whole bloody lot of "panzerstechers" that are basically common-grunt-plain variants on the Turkish estoc here.
Karabela and cartridge-pouch, early 18th century.
Flintlock pistols, early 18th century.
Mace, early 18th century.
Warhammer/horseman's pick, first half of the 18th century.
Caplock pistols, mid 19th century.
Revolvers, third quarter of the 19th century.
1:1.62 scale model of an Albatros D III, as used in 1920. The stars and stripes in the emblem is due to the eight US volunteer pilots in the squadron.
Renault FT. First used by the Polish in 1919 at Babruysk, later on in the battle of Warsaw, and finally in September 1939.
>>62503655Like Butterfly Swords, basically.
German M1908 Maxim gun.
French M1914 Hotchkiss>>62504300Yep, and I've also seen duan jian and niuweidao is such configurations.
Austrian 37mm infantry cannon M1915. Also seen in the lower left in the previous photo if anyone wonders about its size.
TK-3 light reconnaissance tank(ette)
Polish 46mm mortar wz. 1936.
>>62503661Learning new things, thanks anon
Luftwaffe He-111, slightly redecorated by the Polish air force.
Sexton SPG, once again I appear to have missed photographing the sign, but given the insignia I'm suspecting Polish volunteers in the western allied forces.
>>62503800Pole... armshaha, I am of genious
>>62504335>niuweidaoI had no idea, wonder if (lighter) arming swords existed with that, if rapiers did
And some Polish volunteers on the other European front.>>62504413For what it's worth I've never seen or heard of any such.
T-33 pistol used by Zygmunt Berling.
Uniform of lt. colonel Witold Urbanowicz, who appears to have served in the Polish air force, RAF's 303rd squadron, and the flying tigers. Below is the control yoke from a Hurricane.
>>62504025>Poles aren't Persia-
German bombs, 100kg and 250kg.
>>62504052Holy shit that's awesome.Reminds me that there was a thread a few days ago where anon posted a painting and was asking whether that was a revolver rifle in there. I guess it might have been it after all.
Polish army uniform with USSR canteen mess-tin and DP 28 machien gun.
Flintlock wall-gun with seven rotating barrels, 17th century.>>62504455Didn't look like one to me, but they certainly existed in the painter's time and IIRC would have shown up not that long after the event the painting was supposed to depict. IIRC the very first show up ca 1600, with pepperboxes being a few decades older.
>>62502904>>62502908those are some of the best photos I've seen of that messer. Thankyou.
Grenadier's cap and bag, 18th century.
Tatar kit, surrounded by a lot of other things. I'm not sure how characteristic the carbine is, but the sabre is very typical.
Scythe-bearers outfit and war scythes from the 1794 uprising (one of multiple occasions where various Poles tried to make Poland an independent nations again).
>>62504419OP delivers. Also nice T-34.
>>62504442so some supplementary information, the 303 Kocisuko (named after Polish rebel kociusko who fought in the American Revolution, and later in the Kociusko uprising against Russia in defence of the first Constitution in Europe) squadron was the highest fighter scoring squadron in the battle of Britain (though there top ace was a Czech) , >>62504200 this is actually their emblem, founded in the 1920s by Americans ( Mericam C. Cooper director of the OG King Kong)>>625043961st Polish Armored, fought with mainly the canadian army, Nickname: Black Devils. Closed the Falaise Pocket
War scythes are, at leats in the majority of cases, not made as weapons straight away but rather converted from agricultural scythes. The big thing is to get them mounted in-line with a longer, straight shaft, and as we can see here the tip may also be modified for better thrusting performance. The result should be much better than, say, a normal scythe, or trying to crotch the opponent on his knee, but compared to a bill or halberd (or, this being the late 18th century, guns)... Scythe blades do tend to be quite thin affairs, and as the first step from broadaxe to halberd seems to have been finding a sturdier attachment method I have some doubts about what we tend to see here.
>>62503159This one? Looks like some kinda fucky bardiche to me.
>>62504556Nice extra info.
>>62504566And this was a hussar officer's dolman alongside more war scythes, Prussian flintlock guns and this sabre, from the 1794 uprising.
>>62504566The Czech was such a fucking lunatic and kept getting disciplined for flying off on his own and slaughtering Germans when they were retreating that command staff made him " a guest of a squadron" so he could do whatever the fuck he wanted he just wouldn't get covered by the rest of the squad. https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Josef_Franti%C5%A1ek#Royal_Air_Force
Sabre of Józef poniatowski, presented to him when he was promoted to French marshal in 1813.>>62504585How very gallant/Galland of him.
Things from around 1830.
>>62504603>>62504619Pałasz? Very beautiful weapon.
Rifleman's uniform, 1826-31.>>62504620Yep, or pallasch for the common English spelling.
From the 1863 insurrection.
A pair of shaskas used by Bolshevik forces, the rightmost one possibly being a regular sabre with most of the guard removed.
Smith & Wesson No.3 Russian
Mace and sabres, ca 1700-1750.
>>62504559The other weapons are also interesting, sort of choppy glaives with a small spike, they are new to me.>>62504562Sparth axe-like? Proto-baediche?
>>62504585An hero for bipolars everywhere. What a champ.
>>62504559The return of the Rhompaia and Falx! With a longer handle.
>>62504684This is nice, but are there any spiked maces or morningstars? I love those things.
>>62502919That's an interesting eye socket shape, never seen one like this. >>62504056Wow, a masterpiece. Have you ever visited the Museum of the Army in Brussels?
Turkish sabre presented to "the king" (Stanislaw August?) to celebrate Sultan Selim III's coronation, 1790.Sabr presented to King Stanislaw August by the burgers of Warsaw, 1791.Polish sabre, 1791.Karabela given to a cavalry officer by the king for gallantry during the war with Russia, 1792.>>62504677>The other weapons are also interesting, sort of choppy glaives with a small spikeAll four in that photo should be war scythes of varying styles.>Proto-baediche?Proto-proto-bardische, as the guisarme is the proto-bardiche.
>>62504709I'm afraid not, if these flanged maces don't suffice then the studded flail in >>62503023 is as good as it gets.>>62504716>Have you ever visited the Museum of the Army in Brussels?No, I haven't been to Belgium yet.
better look at the montante.
SMGs made by the Polish resistance during WW2.
Uniform of Edward Ryds-Smigly and a number of swords he was given as presents when he was promoted to marshal of Poland in 1936.
Another "KEEP OUT", showing how this somewhat exotic troop type has developed over the years.
Bofors 37mm AT gun, license built as the M1936. A pretty popular gun ont he international market, and thanks to a good HE shell it remained useful even after tanks got a bit too much for it, though that mattered little to the Poles.
Unexploded 208mm shell, along with various bits of exploded shells, from the SMS Schleswig-Holstein's bombardment of the Westerplatte depot.
Persian shamshir, 18th century.
And I think this is the file limit, so to round it off a WW2 cavalryman.Zip archive (with a few hundred extra photos): https://www.mediafire.com/file/vq17tm1u0fo9b7q/Poland_-_Warsaw_Army_Museum.zipOther museums: https://www.mediafire.com/folder/4v4c0uwexuyo7/My+Photographs
>>62504839Looks painful...
>>62506387Likely not intended for long hours of regular practice, no.
>>62504734B-but flails don't exist, bro. It's a fake weapon concocted by amateur Victorian historians. I was told all about it on Reddit.
>>62503110>15th century fupa
>>62503655 Based katzbalger enjoyed
>>62504861Based OP.If you don't mind a three hour train ride fro. Warsaw, there's a cozy museum at Malbork. They have a surprisingly well preserved collection from middle east and India (I think).
>>62504762>>62504774What even is that weird weapon with the, uhh, pearls and a peacock (?) on the handle? Doesn't look like the other sabres, in fact it kind of reminds me of chinese swords.
>>62508509That's a torikubi no tachi that he got from the Japanese ambassador. It's a somewhat ceremonial style that was taken to extremes like that in the late Edo period and onwards.
>>62502814>Mongolian sabreWhere where these actually made? Workshops in the Altai? Purchased from China in the same way the Huns purchased iron arrowheads from the Romans? What about the steel for them? I seem to remember something about the early Turks being blacksmiths for the Rouran, although that's a few centuries early.
>>62509238Under the Yuan dynasty (aka Mongolian rule, starting in 1271) the Chinese military used such sabres, and so Chinese forges likely made a bunch of them. This style was in use with the Mongolians (and others) before that though, but not China proper, so if there was any Chinese production pre-Yuan it would have been purely for export.Now the Mongolians themselves supposedly didn't really have any sabre style truly their own, which to me suggests they didn't have much production of them either. (Sadly the extent of my actual knowledge about Mongolian metalworking is near zero, thus all the puzzle pieces and guesswork here.) The Manchurians on the other hand do appear to have had a lot of specific ideas about their swords, and so likely made a bunch for their own use and may have exported some, and there's been a decent amount of steel making in the central Asian -stans since rather ancient times, so to me that also seems like a plausible source for a lot of them. (Extensive production in Central Asia also appears to me to fit well with the Huns showing up in Europe a few centuries earlier with pretty much the direct ancestor of these Mongolian sabres.) The Persians were usually an industrious bunch as well, and at least later on would end up exporting a whole bloody lot of swords and sword blades. With all these though it seems we actually know very little about the swords used from the introduction of Islam (as that usually ended any tradition of burying people with weapons for archaeologists to find), if not the start of the iron age (aka the invention of rust...), and up until quite recent times.
>>62502775Just bumping to save pics later
>>62503533>>62503524Koncerz is specifically a cavalry sword, a replacement for a lance when it breaks.
>>62503524Cavalry sword-spear.
>>62514853This.
Good thread as always OP
