You do carry a proper independent GPS on you? Wouldn't want to be lost when SHTF and relying on your phone would you now?Right /k/?
wtf is that? Some gameboy knockoff?
>nothing personal kid
>>62507292god guides my path
Is picrel reallly too fucking hard to understand?Oh I forget this is the zoomer brainrotted phone generation. It's amazing we manage w/o GPS to begin with.
>>62507663a compass doesn't tell you where you are, it tells where you are going/facing at what bearing though.
>>62507674>but muh heckin zoomers bad!!!even god damn boomers don't know how to use a compass with a map, but that nigger isn't even gonna acknowledge the fact
almost every phone has receive-only GPS capability and the ability to download detailed regional maps.
>/k/ Approved Navigation
>>62507292I have a GPS watch, a handheld standalone in my innawoods pack, and maps of my surrounding areas as well as a compass. For land nav I work the map and compass primarily, then if I fuck up I have GPS as a fallback but practising land nav is something I find rewarding.
>>62507688OP has a military GPS which is useless/about the same as a phone unless keyed for the military GPS. Unless hes actually military or glowie.
>>62507292>Wouldn't want to be lost when SHTF and relying on your phone would you now?Why not?I've got local topo maps loaded onto my phone and the gps connectivity is the same whether you're using a phone or a dedicated unit. The only real differences are robustness (buy a good case for your phone) and battery life (carry a battery pack or solar charger if you're going to spend more than a couple of days navigating). In exchange for that my phone has a ton of additional functionality and I'm more likely to have it with my when shtf.
>>62507292relying purely on GPS is stupidLearn how to read a map, and have physical copies
>>62507292The problem with carrying GPS is that the military can track your signal with it. You should be using maps and orienteering skills to navigate.
>>62507711I'm retarded, forgot pic
>>62507663What is the function of iron sights on a compass?
>>62507709relying on a literal spyware device in a life saving situation.There's a reason why military and SAR people use standalone GPS.>>62507712lol wut a standalone GPS is passive unless you cucked out for a garmin Inreach/PLB
>>62507718When you buy the real surplus ones not the chink knockoffs there's a recessed pic rail underneath to use them as back up back up irons sights, or BUBUIS
>>62507718The same as a firearm. Aiming for an accurate azimuth.
>>62507718to shoot a bearing nigger, do a land nav course
>>62507718its to line up a true bearing/azimuth aka plumb line
>>62507292how long do you think GPS will work without running upkeep? do you even understand how GPS works as a system?
>>62507728>>62507732I don't know what that is, but can't you just look at where the arrow is pointing?
>>62507735The constellation is extremely robust and could easily run for decades at least before orbits decay. Even with loss of multiple satellites you can still use it. It be one thing if the ground stations get compromised though.>>62507740Yeah you can its just not as accurate if say like your trying to maintain a "course of 288deg" or whatever. Its just gives you visual reference
>>62507740When you use one of these for realsies, you will find that if you are not quite careful and deliberate, a small error in judging bearing can translate to being quite a long way off your intended path. If you hold your compass at waist level and try to eyeball your bearing - whether that is to find a marker or feature to walk towards, or whether that is to take bearings to features to establish or confirm your position - an error of only a couple degrees can translate to many many yards at distance. Using the lens and sight allows you to be much more precise if you're careful and consistent with how you do it.
>>62507740Azimuth laying, finding the degree heading you are looking at, is not always related to land nav. If you are calling in mortars a degree or two can be hundreds of meters off.Land nav it is easier to use the hash marks as you have your leasure updating your direction and points of interest you are usually larger if walking to them versus a precision strike.
>>62507292give it back Jamal
>>62507740Yes and no, the plate with all the degrees and mils and cardinal direction works because it's suspended in liquid inside the actual compass so that way you can rotate the compass and north will be north. You can hold it away from you and just start following the arrow, however the disc will wobble, so using the actual wire + the optic thingy will let you move more precisely in a given direction. t. failed land-nav
>>62507700what exactly does a "millspec" gps do better anyway?
>>62507674determining your position with a compass and map is one of the first things you learn how to do in land navigation in the army>>62507688>receive-only GPS capabilitywtf does this even mean. there is no "transmit gps capability," all a gps receiver does is receive time from satellites. there is no two way communication with any gps device.>>62507700>keyed for the military GPSnot a thing, there is no longer any offset programmed into gps signals to limit the accuracy of non-military users, it was done away with in the early 2000's. there is no different "civilian" and "military" signal.>>62507712gps devices do not transmit any signal and do not communicate with satellites in any way.>>62507735>>62507750>could easily run for decadesgps relies on regular time and orbit corrections from ground stations, it will steadily become more and more inaccurate without regular maintenance.holy shit you people sure do love to be confidently wrong about things you know nothing about
>>62507735GPS is fucking easy to understand. If you played marco polo its basically the same thing.
>>62507790>gps relies on regular time and orbit corrections from ground stations, it will steadily become more and more inaccurate without regular maintenance.I was always under the impression the constellation was designed with cold-war era thinking in mind if there was a nuclear attack the constellation would still function for a very long time.|I also thought the timing corrections were done on atomic clocks in the actual sats themselves.
>>62507292> he doesn't carry a sextant and a copy of the latest edition of the Nautical Almanacngmi
>>62507808gps satellites both compare their clocks to each other, but also receive time corrections from more accurate clocks on the ground twice per day. the clocks in the satellites drift naturally (as every clock does) and have more drift than the ones on the ground due to the constraints of spacecraft.
>>62507816I unironically want to get a sextant to see how accurate I can be with it. If I can get within a horse's ass of competent with it I then want to take it to work and try it in our airplanes but unfortunately nobody builds airplanes with astrodomes anymore.
>>62507804He's right though, GPS would be useless in a matter of few days without any upkeep. In Marco Polo you only care about the relative position, GPS on the otherhand you care about the position relative to Earth so you need a good idea of where the satellites are relative to the Earth. That means you need ground stations to monitor and constantly update the orbital elements of all satellites in the constellation, given that perturbations are always present and need to be accounted for.
>>62507872My understanding is positional accuracy will drop to about half a kilometer within two weeks of no contact and around 10 kilometers within six months
>>62507872I agree, its just I know enough it wont decay in a matter of days and the system is designed inherently to be very robust. Even if a few nodes are knocked out it will still be reliable.But I guess its a moot point because in a real STHF situation the airforce would likely scuttle the system and/or someone would intentionally fuck it up.ITT I used to work as a (not gps) satcom controller. Miss that job it was piss easy but the money from the contractor was not great.
>>62507709>>62507699>He's gonna rely on satellites during SHFTLMAO, implying WW3 isn't in part gonna be the first and likely the last for a while space battle what with all the orbit debris that will be circling the earths orbit at bullet speeds for decades from all the satellites shot down with ballistic missiles or even worse if someone just outright shoots a nuke up there. GPS ain't gonna work so well at that point pal.>inb4 it will never happenNever underestimate how fucking stupid people are collectively.
>>62507913>My understanding is positional accuracy will drop to about half a kilometer within two weeks of no contact and around 10 kilometers within six monthsSo still combat effective for the Russian Air Force.
>>62507919>>He's gonna rely on satellites during SHFT>LMAO, implying WW3 isn't in part gonna be the first and likely the last for a while space battle what with all the orbit debris that will be circling the earths orbit at bullet speeds for decades from all the satellites shot down with ballistic missiles or even worse if someone just outright shoots a nuke up there. GPS ain't gonna work so well at that point pal.Anon I take my innawoods backpack... innawoods. Why should I not have a backup to my map and compass while there is not shit dripping from any fans? Do you hate camping?
>>62507292why did OP blur out the screen?
>>62507917honestly any navigation technique relying on an outside signal would be pretty much useless in a SHTF situation. Most of these systems would be knocked out or rendered inoperational for most of the users and jamming would take care of the rest. That's why cruise missiles use inertial navigation and Trident missiles even use astronavigation. still I think in theory a future GPS constellation could remain operational for a longer time if the satellites could determine their orbits from measurements taken onboard the satellites themselves instead of relying on ground data, though I don't think that's currently feasible
>>62508002i was about to say, they don't even need to take the out the constellation, GPS is piss easy to spoof and jam even a kid could do it with not alot of materials/know-how.
>>62507292imagine not knowing land nav by stars, compass, and map LOL
>>62508151>he doesn't know how to land nav using trees and rockslmao ngmi
>>62508192Most people who "claim" to be able to do land nav w/ dead reckoning, landmarks and even a map an compass cannot.Its hard even for trained soldiers and mountaineers/through hikers let alone fat larping civilans.
>>62507663Just look at the sun dumbass
You can also use an analog watch as a compass if you need to. This is pretty helpful because it allows a watch to serve multiple purposes, as both a timekeeping device and a navigation device. Plus, while it's not as accurate as an actual compass, it might be easier to setup and it's not effected by shit like magnets.
>>62508199To be fair, the basic maths required for converting bearings is beyond the average retards ability
>>62507292DAGR isn't a "proper independent GPS" without crypto fill, which you won't have in SHTF. Otherwise, you're using the same L1 band everybody else is.
>>62508269>you can't fucking win>everything is locked up because muh "freedoms"I hate the US so much sometimes.
>>62508294>reee the government won't let me use their encrypted missile guidance GPS to larp!You dumb nigger, your GPS is worthless in SHTF anyway because the GPS constellation won't be able to receive updates from the Space Force's GCS. You will lose accuracy within days.>>62508208It has fuck all to do with the math, and more the minutiae of being able to handle the idea that your straight, perfect line on grid-magnetic/vice versa isn't actually perfect IRL. People get fucked up doing stupid shit like going around trees to the same side consistently, up/down cuts and fills, navigating through brush, not knowing their own natural deviation of space/pace, etc.On the other hand, the military's idea of "Go find this 30x30cm orange point in the middle of the woods" is kind of retarded for almost any actual use case.
>>62508310>>reee the government won't let me use their encrypted missile guidance GPS to larp!Oh no the horror, its just proof everything good has be locked up behind some bullshit.>On the other hand, the military's idea of "Go find this 30x30cm orange point in the middle of the woods" is kind of retarded for almost any actual use case.What happens if you are getting chased by dindus post SHTF, that 30cmx3cm square might save your life.
>>62508328You dumb nigger, your GPS is worthless in SHTF anyway because the GPS constellation won't be able to receive updates from the Space Force's GCS. You will lose accuracy within days.
>>62507292>>62508269Larping aside is actually a decent GPS otherwise?They have both the civilian and military models for sale.
>>62507292phone is just fine as a GPS they literally have a GPS chip on. the only issue is battery which can be mostly solved with a solar charger you can carry around.also if you want off-grid communication i dont think anything beats a LoRA system which you connect to your phone
>>62508354No, it's fucking awful. Heavy, clunky, god-awful UI, shitty battery life. Doesn't do anything special.Buy a Garmin Foretrex 401, figure out how to use it, and have fun.
>>62507735after a few months without upkeep from spaceforce the GPS system will be hundreds of meters off in most cases.it will continue to function as a great accurate clock for many years but within 1-2 years it's only usable as a very rough positioning system that can tell you which side of a mountain range you're at but not much more.
>>62508377why the fuck would the give it the military besides the bands other than L1?
>>62508382Fuck off, ESL monkey.
>>62508151If it's dark enough to see the stars, it's not bright enough to read a map.
>>62507790>receive only gpsMost smartphones now have true GNSS receivers, but in the past most cellphones would calculate position by pinging cell towers. Many people are surprised to find that Google maps/Apple maps/preferred location service still works in an aircraft
>>62508379This sounds like some 40k shit, where in the post apocalypse, the tech mages will worship the time give by the "star people" and seek its guidance in really backwards way when "navigating"
>>62507292Whats wrong with phone? I have downloaded offline maps of my region, so the only thing not working would be pathfinding.
>>62507292
>>62508470phones still do this for higher location accuracy but it's not gps and has nothing to do with gps
>>62507292I have a Motor Carriers Road Atlas in each of my trucks and a compass in the glovebox. I've done that since long before smartphones. It's simple, it works and I don't have to maintain yet another gadget.
>>62507663Okay, I have to go to X street... Lemme fire up my compass!Yeah It's totally telling me where X street is, Google maps is for zoomers eheheheh
>>62508491i mean thats how navigating was before GPSnowdays you can prey to these things (pic related) i guess because theyre the ones updating the GPS almanac. the almanac being the list of all gps sattelites and their orbits which each of them transmits every 12.5 minutes to everyone on the ground. if the almanac is not updated the accuracy of GPS will keep dropping as satellites drift from the orbits that are in the almanac.the big antennas do ranging (you set the satellite radio to repeat any signal sent to it back, send a signal to it and measure the time it takes to get back to you) from multiple points on earth to get the position and velocity for the almanac.t. has worked as satellite operator , not GPS i worked in much bigger and further away satellites but they do ranging the same way.
>>62508464i'll let you chew on this one for a while brainlet, maybe you'll get it :)
>>62507790>wtf does this even mean.it means you can have full capability because you can download maps to use offline. having your GPS coordinates has only so much value without a map to reference those coordinates against. >>62507913I would argue that 10km really isn't accurate enough to be useful. hell, a mile is pretty bad. think of trying a one acre clearing in a forest from a randomly dropped within a mile of it. at that point you are MUCH better off with landmarks or roads.
>>62507303that's a DAGR, a military GPS who recieve crypto key.The OP is an idiot to post that pic.
>>62508751Heh, I accept your concession.*smirks*
>>62508208>mathsget off an American board, faggot
>>62509317>americanFuck off newfag
Most americans don't know how to find north using the stars. They also can't find south with the stars when in the southern hemisphere.
>>62507292i know how to read road signs
>>62509277>a military GPS who recieve crypto key.No anon, you are are the idiot. Learn to fucking speak.
>>62507663Yeah bro, lemme just sightline to 2-3 landmarks to determine my position on this map I've got.
>>62509670>implying a visual fix is the only way>implying I wouldn't already have a previous fix to work off of>he thinks landnav is hardNavlets are ngmi. I shudder to imagine how y'all would handle old-school seanav.
>>62508464>If it's dark enough to see the stars, it's not bright enough to read a map.If only there was a simple solution to this problem... Perhaps one already attached to your firearm even?
>>62507776It has ports to directly load gps data into sat terminals and other comm equipment that cares about where it is. I imagine this would also work for ballistic computers and the like.It also has the ability to accept crypto so that if they ever encrypt gps signals again you'd maintain current accuracy and not get the 100m/10m accuracy it gets reduced to. I don't remember which. So absolutely nothing for a normal person.
>>62509852Ah okay, just like with the radios. I see them for sale on ebay and fedsurp.I figured they be more rugged for innawoods but doesn't sounds like there's any benefit
>>62507820>gps satellites both compare their clocks to each other, but also receive time corrections from more accurate clocks on the ground twice per dayThey dont. They're a stratum 0 time source. They have multiple atomic clocks on board.
>>62510052And they suffer from relativity.
Hurr durr, buying a road map and and a handful of hiking maps for your area is hard
>>62510634>buying a mapJust remember where you're going, retard.
>>62509451I'm not English sorry.I am military, and we have the DAGR for our planes
>>62508593
i've got these green signs all over the place that tell me what direction i'm going and where i'm headed
>>62509712>implying a visual fix is the only wayOh tell me your ways wise sage of orienteering. Us braindead navlet plebs throw ourselves down before you.>implying I wouldn't already have a previous fix to work off ofJust don't get lost, cool thanks.>he thinks landnav is hardDidn't say that but thanks for conceding that in my pic visual fix wouldn't work sweatie. :^)
>>62509277why is the OP an idiot when this is very clearly a larping troll thread?
>>62509277what is it about these things that get faggots so butt hurt?
>>62509813>Turn on light at night>Get sniped
>>62510781what does this offer over the 401 other than a bigger screen?
>>62513483It's below par. GPS should show you an actual map, like google maps does. Or the GPS in my car. I wouldn't spend $700 on a glorified Tamagotchi.
>>62507663>millennial complaining about zoomers being the 'phone generation'
>>62507292if you can't landnav without a GPS/electronic device, just kill yourself. between all the roads in the country, the mountains, the rivers, i am convinced that only a retard gets lost and dies in the forest these days.
>>62508491what's worse is the amount of tape reel computers this stuff still has to get translated through. try not to think about it too much.
>>62513937ok tough guy, try that in a war zone or hostile area/country as fugitive. See how long you last.There's a ultra marathon in Appalachia that requires people to landNav and its still difficult as hell.
>>62514305>try doing the thing that is standard activity in a war zonenotrain
>>62514316Correction, try that in a real /out/ environment when you don't have landmarks, gps and burger signs to tell you where you are.
>>62507663>blocks your path
>>62513728A lot, actually. For only $50 more:-MIP display instead of normal LCD-320x240 resolution(vs. 100x64)-night vision mode-multi-band gnss-5x the battery life(100h vs 17h)-usb-c interface for loading-much better compass-bluetoothThere are more bells and whistles like a 3-axis gyroscope and accelerometer, and more, but the ones listed above seem to be the biggest upgrades to me.
I just bought a garmin montana 700 with 2x AA battery packs and a couple of 32 gig microSD cards. Time to have some fun.
>>62514327You always have landmarks.
