>Let's capture a city.>20 soldiers, 3 BMPs and 2 tanks should be enough.>Repeat this until the city is captured.>After 30 waves of this small unit, 6000 people died and 150 tanks exploded, but the city was captured and ruzzia won!Can't they just send 6000 men all at once?
>>62869869Small indie superpower, please understand.
Were you paying any attention at all to the opening stages of the war?
>>62869869How do you combat this?
>>62869869Neither side has decisive counter battery or accurate, massed long range munitions. Neither side has the equipment needed to actually contend with minefields. Neither side has decisive air power. Neither side has a decisive armor advantage, neither side has particularly elite infantry. Neither side has shit, so they can't do shit. Hence why the fighting for Donetsk has moved a whopping 35km since 2014.
>>62869869>Can't they just send 6000 men all at once?They do, it's just spread out across multiple parts of the front line. Basically advance via probing. They send 20 waves with 30 people, most get fucked, some get through and then get reinforced. If they concentrate 6000 pidors in a single attack they'll just get decimated. Actually many would get fucked over even before the attack, e.g. by GMLRS strike on their group.
>>62869901You're looking at it wrong. It's specifically because of arty and air power (even if the form of simple drones) that large concentrations aren't a thing anymore. The moment you group 1000+ people in a single location, like a day before the attach, it get instantly hit by a missile. You retards thinks of war as 19th or 20th century lol. There's almost zero fog of war now (only fag of war lol), the battlefield is transparent, recon drones are small, cheap and plentiful, getting sent in hundreds. Good luck concentrating anything close to the frontline in large numbers.
>>62869915>You're looking at it wrong.>You retards thinks of war as 19th or 20th century lol.NTA but I for one won't stop finding it funny that thirdies *still* think they're seeing :muh REEL WAHR" in Ukraine. So much so they think they're actual, regular Clausewitzenkos enlightening we plebs with REEL reality of two (very) poor post-Soviet nations slapfighting each other, both of them requiring *serious* external support to even stay in the fight.You're looking at precisely what happens when 20th century, Soviet-brained militaries play with toys they *never* thought they'd have, let alone be using in a hot war against each other. And it's gone appropriately retardedly. Anon wasn't lying about the frontline in Donetsk has moved a whole 35km in ten fucking years.
>>62869869Indeed. Gradual cumulated force projection is one of the worst thing to do. Imagine poking something hard one finger at a time and breaking your finger each time. When one solid punch with a closed fist would've done the job the first time. Japanese did the exact same thing during ww2. >"Oh, only 5000 lazy American pigs are defending this location? then 6000 of our emperor's finest would easily done the job!" >6000 japs got slaughtered by well entrenched American. >"Send in 3000 more! Surely that will do, now that the American have been properly softened up by our 6000 men prior!"
>>62869955Bold (more like bald kek) words from a retard who's country never fought a real war in the last half century.
>>62869869The Russia-Ukraine war is a deliberate meat grinder for NATO and the Kremlin to get rid of excess males, hence the total lack of diplomacy AND decisive strikes.
Neither side has the organizational capability to conduct large-scale operations, especially large-scale multi-domain / combined arms operations. Just listen to Ukie and Russian radio chatter, they sound like excited civilians, not serious, trained doctrinal command net. I believe the main failure point for both Ukraine and Russia is that they have a very weak officer corps. It’s really hard to create and maintain a strong officer corps; it’s maybe even impossible for poor countries with peasant soldier armies.
>>62869869>Can't they just send 6000 men all at once?Yes, but then you'd lost 6000 instead of 50. Modern recon tools have made concealed maneuver and force concentration completely impossible. Large maneuvers into minefields are likely to end badly; they are absolutely certain to end badly when the enemy knows you're coming and has loads of indirect fire on tap. The accuracy, lethality, and speed of modern OODA loops means you will almost certainly be targeted by fire support before you reach your objective, and the accuracy of said fires means you will almost certainly take serious casualties, which means enemy fire support must be suppressed for you to operate. Russian intel and recon is VASTLY worse than what the West is working with, and one of the better ways for the Russians to feel out the defences of a location is to send an attack that's just large enough to force a fire support response, and then attempt counter battery when it reveals itself.
>>62869955Sorry that’s nonsensical. 80 years ago the Red Army conducted massive combat operations, including battery barrages of THOUSANDS of guns and THOUSANDS of tanks in major battles — during a time in which only one vehicle in a platoon would have a radio for example. The issue is something else entirely.
>>62870002I mean that's kind of the point. As communications have proliferated, fire support has become more ubiquitous, easier to coordinate and correct, etc - those kinds of large maneuvers have become more difficult, not easier. Better communications benefit the myriad forms of indirect fire far more than they benefit more traditional branches.
>>62870002But now since every vehicle and man and passing cloud has a radio and automatic rangefinder and everything worth firing has accuracy measured in inches, thousands of tanks each take a single missile to the top as soon as they mass up. When the soviets fired thousands of shells, they were turning a grid coordinate into soup. Modern barrages are aimed at units, not sections of a map.
>>62869869shit supply
>>62870002>80 years ago the Red Army conducted massive combat operations, including battery barrages of THOUSANDS of guns and THOUSANDS of tanks in major battlesAnd as a result they lost those thousands of tanks. Please check how many soldiers and tanks the red army lost in 1941 alone, let alone during the whole war. At it was able to sustain™ that only because of murrican industry. A couple of such operations in 2022-2024 and russian army stops existing entirely.
>>62869869What everyone in this thread has been saying, Russia has somehow degenerated to the point that they cannot operate on the level of a modern military only in piecemeal. The Nork threat is that they mass enough troops and their own equipment to operate on a Division level under their own command; A Nork armored/Mech division could smash a huge hole in the front anywhere they wanted although at high loss. It would be humiliating for Russia and very expensive but given Koksans being moved up means Putin may have already paid that price. It is my opinion that current developments are laying the ground work for full divisions of Nork troops with independant command structures, even a single Nork Armor/mech Division that could operate as a whole is a deadly threat. If this happens i predict many of the DPRK troops and equipment will come from the 105th division, it's the armor division assigned to Pyongyang and the one that has all the advanced meme tanks.
>>62870034it's not just russia's fuck up, most armies wouldn't even bother attacking in those conditions, they're pushed politically to show map painting results, hence the shitfest
>>62870002how many GPS guided munitions, drones satellites and video streams did they have in WW2?
>>62869869Something about isr seeing any force buildups and dropping endless amounts of arty and drones on them. Do you even pay attention?
>>62870022The point is that neither side shoots in battery like they’re supposed to. Ukraine shoots single guns, and Russia shoot maybe 2 guns in battery. 80 years ago they could organize battery fire counting in the THOUSANDS of guns. If the Red Army of 1945 appeared on the frontline of Ukraine today, the Ukie lines would disappear under coordinated fire missions, entire tank armies moving across the front at once, massed ground-attack missions, etc. There’s literally no reason, zero, for such weak artillery usage aside from the lack of organization. Not that they can blow millions of shells like they used to be able to, but they SHOULD be able to DELETE a grid square using massed battery fire — and they are simply no longer capable of that. Instead of dozens of guns shooting at once, only one gun shoots. That’s just a fact.
>>62869955The US couldn't support itself in this kind of conflict. Maybe China could. Literally all that matters is how much war material you can make, transport, and crew.
>>62870051What they had were 10s of thousands of aircraft flying THOUSANDS of sorties a DAY in 1945. Stop making excuses.
>>62870065>neither side shoots in battery like they’re supposed toSupposed to in 21st century?>Russia shoot maybe 2 guns in batteryThey did shoot batteries in 2022, look where this got them: buying shells from norks
>>62870072>10s of thousands of aircraft flying THOUSANDS of sorties a DAY in 1945and even that gave you shit intelligence data, not even a fraction of what's visible today.
>>62870065You mean currently they are only firing that amount. In the beginning of the conflict they fired much more. Both sides are limited by stores of munitions. That is the single largest limiting factor to indirect fires.
>>62870072Against a foreign invader that posed a legitimate threat to overthrow the native government and seize control of the country. Ukraine isn't marching into Moscow at full sprint like Nazi Germany was. The Russian Public simply won't support an all-out offensive in the current context
>>62870048It isn't even the conditions, a couple of battalions of infantry supporting a armored/mech division should be able to make a hole in the lines. Does Russia not have the ability to operate about a battalion level?These niggas need some Juche and sooner rather than later.
>>62870097Ok, say you make a hole in the line. Now what?
>>62870079Comms and sightlines are way up, but the ability to capitalize on those decisively are way DOWN. You’re just making excuses. Doing this organic thing where an artillery unt’s spotting drone sees something which they shoot at without any or very minimal organization around wider tactical objectives is what has made this war hopelessly static. That artillery unit SHOULD be operating in concert with many other units in pursuit of specific operational goals in a multi-domain (combined arms) in a top-down active operation.
>>62869869neither side has sufficient manpower for adequate force concentration
>>62870097>a couple of battalions of infantry supporting a armored/mech division should be able to make a hole in the lines.My brown friend, to facilitate such an attack you'd need to accumulate ~300 tanks, 450 ifvs/apcs, ~75 arty pieces, a shit ton of other transport and shit (so that your tanks, mech and other shit has logistics support), as well as 10K+ soldiers all in a narrow section of the front line. This instantly creates two issues:1. they would get identified ahead of time (while you're accumulating them) by a) enemy drones and countered by moving in enemy forces to the same area and b) doing long range attacks on them by missiles and arty;2. to get them into a small section of the front line, you'd need to take them away from the others parts of the front line, making them less protected and giving the enemy a chance to attack and push you there;
>>62870111>You’re just making excusesGet a load of this armchair general kek. Life isn't a HOI4 game retard. Old rules of war don't exist anymore.
>>62870107 Logically Russian forces would follow up and exploit the break through however...They would leave their own soldiers without support and not do their part. The Norks would do the hard work and the Russians would let them down. The only real way for DPRK forces to make a real impact is for them to be independant of Russian command, otherwise the Russians are just dragging them down.
>>62870070The US could basically eat the losses from this war from both sides combined, wtf are you talking about
>>62869915>suppression of enemy fire support doesn't exist because slavs can't fucking do it
>>62870125Except Norks rely on the Russians for everything from ammunition to medicine to food. Even if they did punch a hole in the line (lmao), the break would close behind them and they'd become so weak from starvation and immobile from lack of maintenance they'd be easy prey for Ukies
>>62870118It’s an issue because they don’t have the competence to prepare the battlefield for the staging. This is what multi-domain operations are supposed to facilitate. Russia has HUNDREDS of combat aircraft and (used to) have THOUSANDS of medium- and long-range fires. Enemy defenses are prepared with long- and medium-range fires in conjunction with air power and other effects (EWAR, spec ops, etc) so that your ground forces can group up while the enemy’s ability to strike them is suppressed. What I just described requires a high level of organization, something Russia (and Ukraine) LACKS. This was is NOT “real war in current century”, it’s real slap-fight between peasant armies with very poor officer corps / organization. If the Ukies were magically replaced with US forces with exactly the same numbers and equipment — the Russians would be routed within a week or however long it took for a competent US command staff to build an operation to do it.
>>62869984Still don't see any NATO troops in Ukraine
>>62870118So a months worth of armor losses and a extra bit of massed infantry assaults to distact you while they build their forces doean't make you notice things? >Nork missiles>Nork ATGMS>Nork ammo>Nork LMGs>Nork Artillery guns>KoksansNope, no chance there will be Nork armor showing up anymore in Ukraine in the near future.......
>>62870140>Except Norks rely on the Russians for everything from ammunition Idiot, nearly half the ammunition being used comes from the DPRK. They supply more than NATO and Russia combined.
>>62870141something you should have learned from 2022 is that hubris makes empires fall
>>62870118Yeah, try to pull that attack without a proper communicationd network, one than russia never had to begin with, and most important at all, inter-arms organization and doctrine to pull at all levels to have infantry, armor, arty working together.Russia just has a paper that says "doctrine" that has "artillery, air force and infantry need to work together to win battle" and none of the foundations to pull it out, they have no way to communicate together lower than the regimental command, their junior officers don't know shit because they do the work of a sergeant, they only can wrangle the soldiers forward as they were told by the regimental commander who doesn't talk to them anymore.Then the clusterfuck happens, they attack, artillery misses but they cannot correct the fires because they don't have a clue on how to do it and no means to communicate with the battery as everything goes through regiment hq first, the armor support goes too fast, leaves the infantry behind and get shred by mines and antitank weapons, by this time the infantry is just cuddled together on a crater waiting to get droned.We have seen this hundreds of times already.It takes literal generations from going from a soviet doctrine to a modern, combined arms one because you have your entire officer corps retooled, it takes twenty years to train a colonel.Small attacks is the best they can do, is what they can manage with a leutenant, a baofeng and maybe a drone operator coordinating their attack through a discord channel.
>>62870151I mean in this scenario of Norks conducting their own operation on Ukrainian frontlines. I can't imagine Norks could support their own logistical supply lines at that range, they'd have to rely on pre-existing Russian logistics
>>62870065>. 80 years ago they could organize battery fire counting in the THOUSANDS of guns.You mean tens and hundreds guns standing wheel to wheel (important because twngeing fire was done by single gun and then whole battery fire with the same settings) with tons of ammo crates stacking right behind themWhat if someone shoots that I wonder?
>>62869869"Why are there only small scale skirmishes?">There are not only small scale skirmishes, there are giant pushes at a scale not seen since the beginning of the war that are destroyed for almost no gain.>>62869891"How do you combat this?">Specifically at a time when it is combatted, not just in Kursk, but where places like Terny are taken back off Russians, or idiotic shit like Kupiansk is even dared to be mentioned as if the perfidious troopers would not be lanced like a boil. "It's only drone warfare waaaaah">At exactly the moment we see Leopards shred VDV.
>>62870156Koksans require specalist crews and a extensive support system, all Norks. Specalist operators, specalist crew, special ammo. No one has answered a very basic question: How much do they cost? I am reasonably sure that the DPRK doesn't sell the use of the gun with the biggest range on earth cheaply. How much is Putin paying the DPRK?
remember when ukrainians had their armored assaults during the counter offensive get wiped? that was around the time both sides learned that you're just wasting precious resources for nothing.so you only see a platoon or so of vehicles at most being supported by drones and artillery. most vehicles being battle taxis.
>>62869984Why is russia just playing along then? They ruin the wests entire plan in an instant by just pulling the fuck out of Ukraine
>>62870322Russia cannot pull the fuck out, that means they are weak, not a world power only a match for China and USA, and that's a no-no, they need anything they can sell as a victory, as phyrric as it sounds.This begun trying to get the whole ukraine, then all the coast and everything east of the dnpro, then the annexed oblasts, now they are just consolidating everything they have now, get anything close resembling a ceasefir and freeze the conflict.>Putin said that they are going to keep figthing until Ukraine unconditional surrenderBullshit, if they offer a deal like one, he'll jump on it faster than a chechen jumps into a mobik asshole.This is regimen survival 101.
>>62870254>How much is Putin paying the DPRK?More missile/ space tech I'd assume
>>62869976>>62870070You niggers need to read up on the Gulf War.
>>62870743you already know the bs cope responses they will make
>>62869992This reminds me of the webm of ""niggers tongue my anus" in morse being posted during the 1st day of the war by some ukranian on the field.
>>62869976>never fought a real warNeither has yours, and Ukraine still isn't a "REEL WAHR" lmfao>>62870002>Sorry that’s nonsensical.I agree, your post is fucking retarded.>The US couldn't support itself in this kind of conflict.>Maybe China could.And there it is. The cope that the *US Military* couldn't handle Ukraine has been a favorite of russoids and chinklets since the invasion went sideways. It assumes two very, *very* retarded things>The US military would do the exact same shit the russoids did and have the exact same results/performance that led them to be mired in this retarded slapfight>The US is somehow incapable of production, logistics, and training (literally delusional)If your cope requires things which are provably, demonstrably false to be true, then it's very premium cope and not useful to real world discussion.
>>62870070Meant to include your retarded post in >>62871272, too.
>>62869976>Bold (more like bald kek) words from a retard who's country never fought a real war in the last half century."No skull fucking the 4th biggest army in the world doesnt count because you beat them too easily" Favorite cope btw.
>>62869955No true scotswar
>>62870154nta but even if we assume U.S. forces are only half as effective today as they were in Desert Storm, they'd still wipe the floor with Russia given the same resources as Ukraine
>>62871272I agree with a lot of your points, but ukraine is most certainly a real war. Just because neither party can use their air force doesnt make it fake.
>>62871281You don't understand, anon, REEL WAHR demands that your utter military incompetence, unpreparedness, and lack of real force projection gets you stuck into a protracted WWI-shitshow, which then forces your supposedly modern "supah powah" military to resort to literal horde-tier "tactics" and "strategy", all at the cost of *hundreds of thousands* of your (very poorly trained) military personnel.THAT'S le real, tough, big, stronk boi war, anon.>>62871297Honestly got a chuckle out of me but you know that's silly. The issue with Ukraine is it's a situation that's kind of artificially created by the retarded restrictions put on Ukraine for the (minimal) toys they've received, and because of Russia's pretty embarrassing failure to meet the occasion they told everyone would be a cakewalk. It's *a* war, sure, but trying to extrapolate lessons from it that are supposed to apply to all war - especially war among great powers - moving forward is at least pretty retarded, if for no other reason than because of how much both sides lack relative to any one else that could possibly wind up in a war so big (US/NATO/assorted frens and China).Fucking airpower (not with Alex Hollings) has only entered the realm of serious discussion as a major factor on the battlefield in the last year or so, and only because russoids figured out you can "put wing on big bomb and lob from big far away" while Ukraine has minimal ability to do shit about it (no help from arbitrary restrictions put on them by Western powers).If that's not a major reason to be skeptical about how much you can apply to future Real War™, there's a very, very long list of other reasons to anyone that's been paying attention since Feb '22.pic unrelated
>>62871319Obviously the Ukraine War itself isn't fake, it's the biggest war in fucking decades that's claimed probably north of a million lives, altogether, if not on its way their.When I say "reel wahr" I'm meme-ing on the idea that Ukraine is a *definitive* example of what warfare was, is, and will be like.>Just because neither party can use their air force doesnt make it fake.Agreed, but it does make it all very fucking gay. I'd still be bitching about not sending them Gripens and JASSMs if I wasn't blackpilled on what they'd be *allowed* to do with them, at this point.
>>62869915>There's almost zero fog of war now (only fag of war lol)Finally, my time has arrived.
>>62869869Constant surveillance of the battlefield by drones means that any massing of troops is likely to be spotted and thwarted by drone swarm or arty.
>>62871281This was also what people were saying in the lead up to the Gulf War, the US only had recent experience losing to rice farmers and in a REAL war against the battle hardened elite Republican Guard it was going to be a brutal slog and all of the fancy new wunderwaffe was sure to not work. And then it actually happened and then it suddenly wasn't a REAL war since the Iraqis were always zero IQ retards, wait until the US has to fight a REAL war!
>>62871319It's an actual real conflict but the point of people claiming it's a "real war" or that it's not is in relation to it being a war that global powers would fight. It definitely is not, Ukraine-Russia is much closer to the Iran-Iraq war in terms of how it's fought and the capabilities of each side. It's not equivalent to how first rate militaries would fight.
>>62869869>Can't they just send 6000 men all at once?this requires staging, amassing and concentrating formations into key areas, quickly and quietly enough that your enemy can not prepare for it, its difficult to get right.
I would argue that the US is the only nation on the planet capable of “modern warfare” as we consider it, ie, formed from the experience in Iraq. Every other nation lacks some of the required parts.
>>62870065There's some blog posts by Russian artillery officers talking about their experience at the start of the war and how they've adapted their TTPsEach gun is now operating with its own ISR asset, sometimes one gun will have multiple aerial observers assigned to it. Each gun is dispersed km apart and camouflaged with their own separate dug outs with overhead cover to hide from hexacopters and himars when they aren't operating. Decoys are heavily used, and actual guns rarely get hit anymore. Fire missions can be against single vehicles, squads, or strong points being observed for that individual gun or larger coordinated fire support to support an operation.Seems to me like adaption to increased proliferation of ISR assets both friendly and enemy, more deadly and available counter battery fire in the form of OWA munitions etc. If I could find the article again I would link it to you.At the start of the war he talks about firing as battery, being dispersed only 100s of meters instead of km, and how they weren't prepared for modern command and control. Doing battery missions against grid coords, which they would never do now.
>>62870154The US going back to divisions is pretty much because of this specific issue. Concentrated power needs to happen on the division level and above, or it won't be able to gain success.On a modern battlefield, you either go spread out and light (what's happening in Ukraine right now), or intensely concentrated (very early war + future planned conflicts)
>>62870065>The point is that neither side shoots in battery like they’re supposed to.>like they’re supposed to.Yes, please do..t ukie zergfaec
>>62869869>put 6000 men in one place>get fabbed/himarsed
>>62869869they were too busy getting butt raped by their officers. they're all pidors :(
>>62871373>*definitive* example of what warfare was, is, and will be like.no such thing exists. Every war is different. You fantasies of red aemy batteries lining up and firing like a Nork parade rehearsal died sometime in the 70s.
>>62870322>They ruin the wests entire plan in an instant by just pulling the fuck out of UkraineGood like trying to explain to the population that you've wasted billions and hundreds of thousands of human lives just to simply back out.The regime would fall the next day, and what would come next could be much worse for them.
>>62870141Thing is Ukraine is still fighting with one arm tied behind its back, there are likely still NATO toys they aren't allowed to use to the fullest extent.
>>62869869>Can't they just send 6000 men all at once?A blob of 6000 men is very vulnerable to artillery.And to manage 6000 men efficiently without creating a blob you need to be extremely skilled, beyond Shoigu-Gerasimov levels.
>>62871306>given the same resources as UkraineUS Army wouldn't even fight with the resources Ukraine has lol, since without air power literally no other component of the forces works.
>>62871281ah yes, an underdeveloped desert country of 17 million sandniggers against a coalition of the three most powerful western armies with local sandniggers on the side is "le epic win against 4th biggest army in the world", sure...
>>62871517My favorite brand of cope is the switch between "Russian and Ukrainian troops are super experienced, hardened veterans now, they'll surely BTFO western armies!" and "Iraqi troops weren't experienced, hardened veterans, they were exhausted!". Funny stuff
>>62869915The fog of war is obviously gone, as information gathering and transmission is instant and satellites/drones are everywhere. But what I'm wondering is how the fuck did Ukraine pull off Kursk? I mean some (russian) sources claimed UKR have 20-30k guys there. It's an honest question, I know nothing about military (personnel) logistics.
>>62869869Occam's razor tells me both sides have been running on fumes for a while now.
>>62870097Russia would benefit greatly if somehow NK ruled over them. They would have to be recivilized 100 years later, but the basic brain repair en masse can start on a foundation of discipline.
>>62872001Thank you. I've been getting tired of that no-life-experience kid
Slav(e) demographics were destroyed in the 20th century and both sides can’t afford to lose males.
we just had attacks in kursk with hundreds of russian vehicles
>>62869869>wonders r*ssian sutpidity>picture depicts Finnish soldiersWhat did he mean by this
>>62869869Drones and artillery. Any large concentration of forces will get immediately spotted and shelled.
>>62869872more like bootleg USSR lmao
>>62874593>But what I'm wondering is how the fuck did Ukraine pull off Kursk?It's a combination of factors that led the russian to thinking it would happen:1. local dysfunctional russian shit in terms of top-down control structures, it's not only tied to command, but also passing along info;2. thinking ukie forces are preparing for defense operations, since russians did in fact plan on attacking in the same region;3. thinking it's a fake out, hurr-durr, at most a "glorified PR incursion like the previous one";4. thinking that they wouldn't do it, because that would be "wasting forces", which could be used as additional defense around donbas;5. "they wouldn't dare";
>>62875996>Why worry about something that isn't going to happen
>>62872001>no such thing exists. Every war is differentI agree 100%>You fantasies of red aemy batteries lining upI said nothing about such fantasies. Would you like to try again?>>62875489>no-life-experience kidProjection doesn't magically make you correct in your retardation.
>>62871569It's looking to be the case, as of now. *Maybe* China, but you know all of the usual caveats associated with them.
>>62872657>He actually responded unironically with the classic cope.Pottery.
>>62876103Well yes, soviets prior to 22 June 1941 also thought the same.
>>62874593Kursk is a trap
>>62873878You can't even use a drone effectively like hohols
>>62869869>Can't they just send 6000 men all at once?Unique conditions where neither side has meaningful Air Dominance for offensive purposes. Drone observation (plus 5 Eyes satellites and intel) = masking build ups is largely impossible and extremely HIMARS hazardous. Then there's Ukes going after Russian transport trucks to the point of the latter having to be scalped off domestic civilian vehicles. They can't full send because the core of that competence has been profligately wasted in the initial phase of the 'SMO', and NCOs aren't functionally a thing to organically build it back out as an organization through sheer frontline Darwinism. That's just the size that isn't worth expending precision rockets or artillery on for the cost/materiel.
>>62870213>Leopards shred VDV.Proofs?
>>62869992You can kind of have one with a conscript army (Napoleon, Nazi Germany) even if it might be harder
>>62869869https://x.com/bayraktar_1love/status/1857899374153441784Because this is what happens when you amass troops in one spot.
>>6286986920x30 is 6000?
>>62869869>be commander kleptosky>report you have 600 men, 10 tanks and 20 IFVs>collect all the suppies and pay you are sent based on these numbers>pocket the money and sell the fuel>get ordered to attack>you can't tell the Kremlin you actually have 150 men, 2 tanks and 5 IFVs or they'll hang you>order attack with 30 men, 1 IFV and a bunch of stolen civilian cars>claim you sent 200 men, 3 tanks and 7 IFVs>repeat until your actual numbers and claimed numbers match>never get caugh
>>62878374>neither side has meaningful Air Dominance for offensive purposes.>3rd largest airforce in the world.It's not a unique condition. Russia has simply just been lying about their fleet all these years.
>>62879354https://x.com/wartranslated/status/1856986406830145962
>>62869901>Neither side has decisive counter batteryRussia is plugging gaps in their artillery coverage with 170mm Nork SPGsThe Soviet Union left a lot of guns behind, but stores are steadily being depleted. Once that happens you'll be able to make qualitative statements on the decisiveness of a certain sides counterbattery fire.
>>62870254>How much do they cost?Your dignity.
>>628698693rd world war.Russia tried massive attacks in first few months, remember how those went?
>>62869915This is exactly why you need air domination. It was already like this in WW2.
>>62879481>This is exactly why you need air domination.no. you need to start arresting and executing own politicians.
>>62879476i member columns upon columns and the whole world standing in awe of the mighty bear. lmao. good times.
>>62872076>Good like trying to explain to the population that you've wasted billionsVietnam, Iraq, Afghanistan.
>>62871747too many bradleys, not enough tanks, how do you keep functional when you start taking vehicle losses in combat
>>62869869>When I see my brother's Parola pics posted on /k/>Fug
>>62869962Anon, you don't compare Japanese soldiers with vatniks?
things are so fucked bros... i hate modern warfare
Send thousands of men at once? Idk dude, seems like it would turn into a total clusterfuck. Those quantities of men and material *are* being used in single battles but not all at once (keep in mind that battles can last months or years). You can't really put 6k men into a field in this day and age without them being massacred by massed fires from drones, arty, cluster munitions, HIMARS, tanks, etc. (it's not Napoleonic warfare anymore). So you have to put your 6k men to use in waves or in small groups that constantly get sent out into the battlefield.
>>62870065>There’s literally no reason, zero, for such weak artillery usage aside from the lack of organizationYou are a moron. Drone surveillance and counterbattery fire is the reason. Remember this video from 2022 outside Mykolaiv? https://www.theguardian.com/world/2022/may/31/plea-for-heavy-weapons-ukraine-frontline-mykolaivThat was back in 2022 when there was only a fraction of how many drones are swirling around now and Ukraine didn't really have anything bigger than a Mavic other than around a dozen Bayraktars and some Lelekas.
>>62870097There have been battalion level attacks in Kursk and Kurahove where russians used 30-80 vehicles in one go but they didn't achieve much at all
>>62869915>There's almost zero fog of war now (only fag of war lol), Can you create artificial cover from satellites?
>>62875996>>62876103At least one Russian commander was switched on, because a full team of russian reconnaissance special forces got wiped out across the border from Kursk just before Kursk kicked off and there were rumours of several more teams were deployed. Somebody knew something was off and wanted eyes on the situation there.
>>62869872lmao
>>62870132>Bro if AMERICA were in this war then we'd suppress their heckin s-300s/s-400s in like 48 hours with SHOCK and AWE because we've got heckin' f-35s bro like BRO then we'd just take out their entire airforce then we'd start MANEUVERING bro like MANUEVRE WARFARE we'd outflank their mine fields bro with our MANEVURES and then we'd send in 1 F-22 and it would take out all 17 of their SU-57s in one sortie bro
>>62872144>Ukraine is still fighting with one arm tied behind its backDo retards really think that?>For my military to shine I need expensive toys from abroad that I might not even get, and if if I do, a person entirely disinterested in my life will tell me how to use it.>If I don't get these toys, I am simply fighting with one arm tied behind my back, it's not that I am incompetent and lacking basics of a military force.>Uhm no I didnt buy or build alternatives for these toys despite apparently my doctrine is entirely impossible without them.
>>62872644>US Army wouldn't even fight with the resources Ukraine hasI know what you mean when you say that, but in this ridiculous hypothetical in which the Ukrainian army that is currently defending against Russia had all of their soldiers and officers magically body-swapped with U.S. Army equivalents, they would be forced to fight. And they'd kick the living shit out of the Russians, even harder than the Ukrainians. They're much more professional and better trained at every level, and most importantly are better at coordinating at scale.
>>62882973>Ayo nigguh where da blue force tracker at?They'd need to be army special forces, since they'd find themselves in control of equipment and capabilities befitting of an indig force.
>>62882878>1 F-22100 F-22s and 500 F-35s, quantity has a quality all of its own
>>62882878unironically, yes
>>62883012I guess I was also assuming for the hypothetical that they were familiar with all the equipment. My point was just that the Ukrainians, brave and adaptable as they are, simply don't have the training and organizational know-how that the Americans do, and if they did they'd have given the Russians an even bloodier nose than they already have.
>>62883025>simply don't have the training and organizational know-howSo all the advisors sent that way were useless? I too often dream of having control of a force that comes pre-trained on any equipment issued to them, excelling regardless of logistical hurdles and attrition. I once saw it in a movie, they called it Attack Of The Clones.
>>62883039I'm not trying to diminish the abilities of the Ukrainians, they've done amazingly all things considered. But it's quite obvious that their army shares some qualities with the Russians, namely the incapability of organizing operations beyond the battalion level and a generally low-by-NATO-standards level of training for their soldiers and officers. A few advisors huddled in an embassy somewhere in Kiev aren't really going to undo that during an active war. Hopefully after the war is over they will have the time and money to get up to NATO standards.
>>62883039> So all the advisors sent that way were useless?Apparently. We probably won’t know details until years later when participants report details and historians start writing books but there has been reports of Ukrainians thinking NATO training / methods are useless. That makes sense; a Western military with a well-developed officer corps and strong C4 will train a lot different than how a peasant army with a very weak officer corps at every level with meager C4. We’ve helped them with equipment but even then they seem to be short on radios for some reason (if that Kursk specops manual is factual). Also there’s no way around building out a strong officer corps but to do it from the beginning.
>>62882878I swear you guys post this as a cry for help because the answer is unironically yes. America is a GOD compared to any other military.
>>62883060>>62883052The key issue if this whole Ukraine debacle isnt the officer corps at any level below Minister of Defense, because, starting from 2014, the goals issued by the Ukrainian government are consistently unachievable and exacerbate the political situation until any conflict is undecisive and thus unwinnable.The civil war that began in 2014, right after the popular revolution, was both hypocritical and demanded of the military and police forces to achieve a political victory - violently occupy a seceeding territory with no negotiations and with no defined enemy, resulting in the entire population of those regions throwing their lot with spontaneously formed guerilla force that would later assault anti-terror positions with tanks acquired from overwhelmed military bases. All in order to display the new government's capacity to control the territory of Ukraine and thus represent Ukraine on a world stage.If there was more finesse to the orders issued, then the matter could be resolved by shrewd negotiations and direct action by secret police.Instead there was 8 years of trenches and stalemates vs some miners, their GRU advisors and some free russian gibs, continuously aggravated by refusal of negotiations at the top level, atritting a lot of the skilled military officers and agents, many of whom already trained with NATO, and some even deployed to Iraq in support of NATO.With the 2022 invasion being an escalation of that civil war, Ukrainian government and top brass still cannot issue effective and swiftly-executed orders, demanding things like the famous Counter-Offensive or the Kursk invasion that, ultimately, lead to no strategic victory over the adversary they specifically refused to not fight.Maybe they expect that NATO will come in to finish off attrited Russia, but that is not a victory because it will not leave a standing Ukraine behind. Officer corps cannot fix that if the orders they execute are not part of an actual victory plan.
>>62882059You can, but it will have just a partial effect, thus you'd fuck over a ton of resources for not too much gain. The issue isn't just satellites, but also recon drones. Also the other side can often not see the grouping of forces, if they are camouflages enough, but they'll notice shit moving into specific locations.
>>62882973>all of their soldiers and officers magically body-swapped with U.S. Army equivalents, they would be forced to fight. And they'd kick the living shit out of the Russians, even harder than the Ukrainians- half of the soldiers would cuck out from fighting because they were conditioned to fight on easy mode, where they can call in an air strike at a push of button and where the other side doesn't have NVGs and thermals;- the other half would get fucked over by the losses, thus you'd lose your "toned fighting machine" and have to use drafted fags, god forbid you start drafting regular joes from US of A;
>>62883129>The civil war that began in 2014>civil warBait post.
>>62883025>simply don't have the training and organizational know-how that the Americans doNo amount of training can compensate for the realities of that battlefield.
>>62883251more like Blyat post, amiright?
>>62883129>The civil warlmaoGirkin says hi
>>62882878Glad you agree.
>>62883248>because they were conditioned to fight on easy modeMeanwhile in reality, I have literally never been allowed to actually call for fire in training because we constantly prepare for absolute shit-ass worst case scenario where you're relying on regular 11Bs to perform tasks for elements 3x their size with fuck-all support deep in the middle of nowhere.
>>62883337>>62883251>It's not a civil war because it was instigated by foreign intelligence??? When did /k/ become so retarded? All civil wars, every single one, are instigated by an enemy, but they cannot happen without local manpower. If Donetsk GUR/SBU office assassinated Girkin and negotiated with the Ukrainian lead of the uprising, things wouldn't escalate. Instead they allowed Girkin enough time to organize a militia, and then came over to kill everyone involved after he handed out free guns.Straight up open wikipedia and read about it, its public and open facts.
>>62882936>Do retards really think that?Having drip-fed support with political limitations on which weapons could be used where (no strikes into russia, no strikes into oil industry, etc) is indeed fighting with one arm tied behind their back.
>>62883765>All civil wars, every single one, are instigated by an enemyEspecially the ACW, right?>but they cannot happen without local manpowerThat's why the initial LDNR+ forces were composed of russian regulars, russian PMCs, russian glowies and russian merceneries. Fried tank buryats are very local to Ukraine, sure.
>>62874593Ukraine's high command use the previous russian's kharkiv incursion to mask their deployment as some form of QRF against further russian breakthrough in kharkiv. Even then, there is a reason the Kursk invasion was done by detachments of basically every existing ukraine's maneuver units.
>>62883765>Instead they allowed Girkin enough time to organize a militiamy nigger in Christ, the initial "militia" was from russia, the local forces were formed many months after that
>>62883765>??? When did /k/ become so retarded? All civil wars, every single one, are instigated by an enemy, but they cannot happen without local manpower.Yeah, a local militia that just happened to have a complete completely of combined arms assets and the sudden ability to apply those assets on part with trained, experienced troops.This is like having a bunch of countryside farmers go from civilian available firearms and a couple "boating accident" rescues to being geared and trained on par with the USMC in a week.
>>62884882that's not one arm behind your back, that's both arms and someone else's sword when you asked for their spear
>>62869869You're being very able-ist. They are doing the best the can.
>>62870107>russian general getting tips in /k/
>>62883129There was no civil war, that was Putin's whole problem. His rabble of crisis actors, criminals and larpers like Girkin couldn't get the Ukrainians to actually fight themselves, and Putin wouldn't send in the army until they did so he'd have an excuse on the world stage...until many years had passed. Covid lockdown and his own aging mind turned him from merely megamoniacal to completely insane, and he decided that since he'd be dead soon anyway he may as well go for it the hard way.
>>62882936>>62884882>Having drip-fed support with political limitations on which weapons could be used where (no strikes into russia, no strikes into oil industry, etc) is indeed fighting with one arm tied behind their back.Exactly.>>62883052>But it's quite obvious that their army shares some qualities with the Russians, namely the incapability of organizing operations beyond the battalion level and a generally low-by-NATO-standards level of training for their soldiers and officers.Well apparently "low-by-NATO-standard" is still lightyears ahead of Russia...
>>62885966>apparently "low-by-NATO-standard" is still lightyears ahead of Russia...Russia absolutely fucking sucks at war, there's no question. The Ukrainians are good enough to beat the fucking piss out of the Russians on the daily despite being like three weight classes below them on paper. Unfortunately, thanks to Russia's natural advantages (by which I mean sheer mass) this has only resulted in a stalemate.
>>62884913>>62884947>>62884947>>62884990>>62885938>Insane nonsense about buryats and shit, local forces 50 years later with combined arms etcI straight up told you to check out wikipedia instead of your insane reddit fanfics.Here, I'll help you.https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Donetsk_People%27s_Republichttps://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/War_in_DonbasApril 7th, a crowd of up to 2,000 unarmed locals attend a pro-Russian rally. Later, up to 1,000 unarmed locals took over parts of the admin building. Key figures proclaim their positions of power in DNR, some GRU, some local Ukrainians. Luhansk SBU unit was raided, weapons acquired and prisoners released.April 8th, another thousand-strong pro-Russian rally. Around 100 agents seize weapons fron SBU unit in Donetsk. Ukrainian leadership orders their services to take back Donetsk government buildings.April 12th. Against background of total inaction, despite orders, from local Police, Militray, SBU and GUR, Girkin and only 52 men storm local government buildings with arms. He seizes weapons and vehicles.Slovyansk is also captured by a 50-strong unit of armed men. At this point they already have armed local militia supporting them, acting as containment unit for the GRU strike force.>They attacked and occupied the town's administration building, police station, and SBU building, and set up roadblocks with the help of local armed activists. >DNR insurgents entered Sloviansk on 16 April, with six armoured personnel carriers they claimed to have obtained from the 25th Airborne Brigade>Members of the brigade were disarmed after the vehicles were blocked from passing by angry locals.In another incident, several hundred residents of the village of Pchyolkino surrounded another column of 14 UA armoured vehicles. Following negotiations, the troops were allowed to drive their vehicles away, but only after agreeing to surrender the magazines. These incidents led President Turchynov to say he would disband the 25th.
>>62884913>All civil wars, every single one, are instigated by an enemy>Especially the ACW, right?Check out the involvement of the French into it, who really wanted to fuck up England by making them lose control of US.
>>62886421Nice try, Vanya. But as any actual expert on any subject will tell you, Wikipedia is not a credible source.https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=exJ024Zdzdk
>>62869869Russians are basically NPCs, and they fight like the enemy AI in an RTS campaign.
>>62886434>VanyaI understand that you're being paid to make these posts, but trying to screech about m-muh russia when faced with facts just makes you look even more retarded. Especially when you decry Wikipedia's credibility (which comes with sources for al assertions), and then post a fucking YOUTUBE CARTOON!
>>62884882>is indeed fighting with one arm tied behind their back.no its what prevents them from being abolutely fucking plastered by retaliatory strikesyou fundamentally refuse to accept the reality that Russia is nuclear armed nation, and ukryin' is NOT
>>62886441Russians (that means you) are the most perfidious lying sacks of shit that have ever disgraced God's green earth. Whenever a Russian opens his mouth, a lie comes out. Whenever he shuts his mouth, he bites in half a lie that was trying to GET out. You can try to grandstand for the feckless retards in the peanut gallery all you like, but the truth is the truth. Luckily you'll be conscripted soon and die in 4k for my amusement, as is just and proper.
>>62886866>Muh russians personally editted Wikipedia to alter historical facts (with sources) to trick ME!>Watch this fucking youtube video instead (no sources).Please use your shill money to buy some meds and start taking them, schizo.
>>62886866dang bro, did the shahed literally fly in through your window?take deep breaths
>>62886441>Wikipedia's credibilityYoung people really are retarded holy shit
>>62874593alcoholism
>>62886970Where do YOU get your information about ongoing Ukrainian conflict? Do you also watch Youtube videos that provide no sources and earn money from clickbait?
>>62887056may we see YOUR source?
>>62887173Yeah they're right here, idiot.>>62886421Ctrl+F any of my assertions or quotes and you'll find a note with a reference link to it on wikipedia.
>>62886421>No, you see, they captured locations held by the SBU>That's why them having top of the line Russian gear makes senseYeah.
>>62887829Who're you quoting? Nothing like that is in any of my posts.
>>62870132WW1 also had chemical weapons they used on trenches too.
>>62886421>up to 1,000 unarmed localsYeah, "locals", like the arse-n "motorola" pavlov whom were in the odesa protests, right?
>>62886835>retaliatory strikesAre a meme and don't exist. Every strike you see is pre-planned and pre-organized months in advance.
>>62888592Wikipedia calls them locals. You have nothing but your schizophrenia to contend with that. Why do you keep trying?
>>62889038>Wikipedia calls them locals
>>62869869Last time Russia tried sending a large number of men at once they got stuck in a traffic jam with no fuel.The only reason the Ukrainians didn't just kill them all to the last man is that they hadn't properly mobilized yet and simply didn't have the artillery/missile/air capability to focus in a single sector of the front to do it.
>>62869869>Can't they just send 6000 men all at once?If they want the artillery spotters, drone operators and the friendly neighborhood HIMARS crew to die of uncontainable erections, they can do that, yes.It will be less URAAAAAAA and more URAAA-ACK.
>>62869869Russian kia total (+6800) would be so fucking funny to see
>>62889589Every day until morale improves.
>>62879948>namParis Peace Accords were signed so they had a "proper" exit. Whatever happened after it was signed notwithstanding. >sandbox<10k deaths for 2 decades in the sandbox. As for the financial aspect, you can argue that's well worth the control we get in the region and it's not like we don't get something back (ex. saudi oil and maybe afghani opium).
>>62886441Wikipedia has barely any more credibility than /b/ or fucking reddit. It isn't immune to circular referencing nor is it immune to mods and admins with a clear bias or agenda. Anyone that isn't a retard, indian, serbian or other flavor of subhuman can easily tell you that wiki pages with clear political topics are practically worthless.
>>62870070>The US couldn't support itself in this kind of conflictThere is this thing called "air force", which would guarantee that the US wouldn't have to support itself in this kind of conflict.
>>62883088> America is a GOD compared to any other military.> proceeds to get BTFOd by literal Nigers
>>62890296Let me guess. they asked for us to leave and we did so?
>>62890309if the US is so stronk then why do they have to bend the knee every time some 4th worlders "ask them to leave"inb4:> we didn't want that 5 year old air-base anyways and giving russia control of the country was part of our plan all along
>>62890326>why did you leave when asked?Because we arent russoid rape apes
>>62890326We don't have to, we just choose to do so.If they want their country to go to (further) shit, who are we to deny them their wishes?And why is it that whenever some african shithole goes for russian "support" instead of Western, the entire situation goes to hell immediately?
>>62890361>>62890368> uhm actually we are just super nice ya-know?I guess that's one way to cope
>>62890423Ah its a just normal contrarian shill, yes sure, wect has fallen but you still gotta clock in
>>62890326>>62890423It's not surprising that a Russoid literally cannot comprehend people honoring requests and promises peacefully and in good faith. Yes Ivan, we are in fact that "nice" (human). If we sign a contract with someone and they terminate, we'll leave. Shocking, I know. I suppose we should have just raped all of their men and bombed a children's hospital instead.
>>62869869Large concentrations bad. You'll get blasted by drones and missiles.
>>62869998Warfare is so fucking gay now. Sensors are everywhere, people cant do tunnel warfare like good ol days. Why cant people just shoot down satellites and have Jammers just fry everything in a two mile radius.
>>62889839As opposed to what, LSD dreams? Where do you get your historical facts about this conflict?
>>62891313Not wikipedia like your retarded ass for sure. The fact that you're this adamant on pushing it just reeks of desperation like all pro-russian subhumans are with their telegram pisschambers so all the more reason to doubt it's credibility.
The war has come down to this because of surveillance and long range weapons. The solution I can see is giving all companies or battalions more autonomy to move around and equip them with dedicated drones, mortar/arty units and logistics vehicles. In ukraines case their army needs more strategic airlift, and more helicopters to transport troops and equipment.
>>62870213Jesus Christ dont greentext if you dont know how to format this garbage is unreadablefucking war tourist retard kill yourself
>>62891424>seethes in slamming enter after every statementOk zigger shill, lmao
>>62891458post guns.
>>62891472Why do you wanna see my cock so bad, fag
>>62891480Yeah, thats what I thought.
the only strange thing is western militaries haven't learnt anything at all about this, or even saw it coming
>>62891494>western militaries haven't learnt anything at all about thiswhen did the western military fail exactly for you to say they haven't learned anything from this?
>>62891491Gonna post your broomhandle again or your zigger cope collection?
>>62891399Asked your retarded ass, where exactly do you get your facts, and you went on an insane rant of>Hurp de durp russia telegram pisschamber ahurr hurr hurr subhumanWhich honestly just proves that you operate off of mental illness. Even a brainwashed scumbag could link to the propaganda piece he uses to base his worldview on. With that in mind, take your meds.
>>62890326Are you unable to understand what honoring your word is? If the US was a cunt like Russia, nobody would want to deal with them, like with Russia. If I am a guest at somebody's house and he asks me to leave, I will leave. I am not a nigger.
>>62890326The very concept of law and trustworthiness eludes the Russian.
>>62883765>All civil wars, every single one, are instigated by an enemyDa. Czechoslovakia and Hungary were done by CIA. Lying Americans are just better at hiding involvement than us honest Russians.
>>62886434That was a very nice 4 part series. Thank you, anon.
>>62892688Sarcasmitron is an interesting case because while he is a leftist, he's literally the only person that seems to have anything beyond a superficial insight into what actually happened regarding the Russo-Ukrainian war. Nobody else seems to have done any actual research. His opinion on China is very strange though (he seems to think that U.S. fears over the Chinese are mostly paranoia), and he has yet to explain it. Just goes to show a broken clock is still right twice a day.
>>62883765>Russia sends military/paramilitary forces into neighboring country>Border region declares independence>"Civil war" starts>The breakaway state is diplomatically recognized by Russia>The breakaway state asks for Russian assistance in the 'civil war'>The breakaway state is fully occupied by Russia>The breakaway state overwhelmingly votes to become part of Russia>The breakaway state is the Finnish Democratic Republic>Pic unrelatedFunny how after nearly a century this exact chain of events keeps happening, but only to Russia.
>>62886421Where'd they get the equipment that wasn't used by the UAF?
>>62883248that's why NTC takes exquisite pleasure in handing every "I'm finally getting competent at this" officer his ass. Wrapped in a bow.
Large unit concentrations would get easily spotted in advance.Ukraine gets intel from NATO (which is a good thing) to strike Russian military targets. There were multiple cases of bigger Russian vehicle formations that were completely annihilated by Ukranian artillery.Add to this all the minefields and no one having air superiority.Last factor I can think off is that both Ukraine and Russia are currently afraid of engaging in a decisive battle. For different reasons, neither side wants to force a large scale engagement.
>>62869955I'm sure that regardless of how I put this, I will simply be accused of being [strawman here] by some shill or other, but I would nevetheless like to preface this by saying that I've long since gotten sick of "Ukraine this, Ukraine that", so the factuality of your post is irrelevant to me.I'm simply chiming in to say that typing like *this* with asterisks around shit *like* some *hysterical* predditor *makes* you *sound* like *a* fucking *faggot*The only good things to come from this whole shitshow was ERA memes and dead redditors.>>62871356>>62871373>*muh* *re*st*ri*cti*o*ns*They're a sovereign nation, are they not? They can throw those restrictions into the trash at any point they feel like, so long as they stop expecting to receive gibs. It's the international version of>My house, my rules. Don't like it? Then move outGod I fucking wish they'd move out and take Isn'treal with them.>*muh* *hundreds* *of* *thousands*I'm sure if you ask the oinkranians, they'll say they've killed 90 gorillion "ziggers" and their population will never recoverIf you ask the vatniks, they'll say they've killed 90 gorillion "hohols" and their population will never recover
>>62892779From Russia of course, which was given to them as aid. Retards keep thinking that its some big gotcha, but its obvious that GUR direct action team led by Strelkov came in armed with Russian gear, and then continuously received more arms and ammo from their handlers to distribute to the separatists. But these shipments were covert, and thus capture of UAF equipment served as the main source of equipment in the first stage of the conflict, as well as cover for the russian shipments.Indeed by overwhelming multiple military units, police stations and SBU facilities, done by either Girkin's direct action team or unarmed protestors, DNR separatists could immediately form into fighting units and keep the momentum going without wasting time on receiving and distributing shipments from across the border, and thus outrace the incoming ATO task forces, meeting them in direct, quasi-conventional combat, rather than as a Taliban-like hit-and-run force.
>>62883765>are instigated by an enemyWas instigating by Yanukovich who went back on the agreement he was elected for.
>>62893951Total nonsense btw. The presidential election was in just 6 months, and Yanukovich didn't even claim he'd run for it. The opposition could, just as easily, participate in that upcoming election and take control legitimately, without risking unrest.But it seems that they, or their handlers, did not believe that they could win the democratic vote and instead chose violence.>inb4 m-muh rigged electionAll of Ukraine's elections, including the upcoming one at the time, featured UN oversight and were certified by UN as legitimate.
>>62894129>Total nonsense btwKill yourself>The presidential election was in just 6 months, and Yanukovich didn't even claim he'd run for itAh yes, a corrupt voter fraud faggots (as proven in courts way back in 2004) who broke the constitution (illegal reverse of the constitution reform) will definitely run a legit election. Kill yourself 2x.>The presidential election was in just 6 months, and Yanukovich didn't even claim he'd run for itThe opposition did take control legitimately, via the parliament. That's how chain of succession work, pidor. Kill yourself 3x.>All of Ukraine's elections, including the upcoming one at the time, featured UN oversight and were certified by UN as legitimate.The 2004 election was literally proven in court as having fraud done by Yanukovich&Co.
>>62894129The presidential election was in a year. They have 5 year terms. Yanuk moved the elections himself because of protests. You're either a shill or a poltard who gets all his info from shills.
>>62892728>His opinion on China is very strange thoughTrue. For my taste the whole fourth part, where putinism is just an export of early 00s american neoconservatism is a bit far flung too. Still kinda refreshing given that where I'm from the left is split between silently supporting russia ("all wars are bad, we shouldn't support either side, mkay!?!") and openly supporting russia ("imperialist american NATO expansion emboldened the banderites, comerade!")
>>62894314>Kill yourselfI'd tell you to kill yourself, but the ziggers will kill you soon enough.>corrupt voter fraud faggotsThe inb4 was there for you, sad that you don't know what it means, war tourist.>The opposition did take control legitimately, via the parliamentActually didn't have power to depose the acting president. Sad that you don't know.>The 2004 election was literally proven in court as having fraud done by Yanukovich&Co.In your schizophrenic dreams maybe.>>62894340If I was getting all of my info from shills, I'd be agreeing with you. Sadly your shilling is ineffective and erroneous, thus there's no reason to pay attention to you. Try to absorb what I told you, check wikipedia articles out, maybe you'll embarass yourself less.
>>62889038Requesting the webm of Girkin confirming they were all Russian gloaies
>>62884882Except both arms are prosthetics they are borrowingThey are free to not comply and try to kick and bite their way to victory
>>62890326If they are so nice, why do they have to invade in the first place? why do they always lose hundreds or thousands of men before being ''asked to leave''...
62894473>If I was getting all of my info from shills, I'd be agreeing with you.>check wikipediaIndependent free thinker right here folks!
>>62895099Where do you get your information on current events?>inb4 exclusively from drug induced hallucinations.
>>62894747
>>62883017>Murica will win WW3!>Says the ESL slav who wants America to start a war and save his assJust look at the captions lmao
>just check wikipedia>just check wikipedia>just check wikipediaholy fuck the meatwaves must have really dealt a blow to the vatnik shitpost brigades that this is your best response
>>62895320the captions are a translation of a Russian 2ch post, pidor, because some of your people actually have brains
>>62895890
>>62896070Cute quote with weird text and filter people use of little dark aged edits. Glad I finally got proof the board is full of people who aren’t old enough to buys guns
>>62880070I'm the biggest weeaboo but in the 40's they were similar in their tactics
>>62871373I don't think we will ever have another war like the two previous world wars (actual superpowers throwing everything at each other)The biggest armies are incompetent and have shit equipmentThe most modern armies will never used hordes for various reasons (too small, morale concerns, too advanced to need it)
>>62896063>Russian>Using ''orcs''and ''russian scum''Big inferiority complex if true
>>62896395If you were sane and lived around russians you'd be the same
>>62880022By being a country that can actually produce large numbers of armor
>>62896101>Cute quote with weird text and filter people use of little dark aged editscould you try that again, but in English?
>>62896395the only thing Russians hate more than the rest of humanity is themselves
