Just…in general.How about we start with K-431 which blew up in 1985 because the lid got stuck? Yarding things is a bad idea apparently.
There’s also the K-320, K-27, and of course Hiroshima herself K-19. Oh and that time in 1995 they didn’t pay the power bill
>>63053839This is the same country where two Chechen guys got the highest acute radiation dose ever and I can’t even calculate it because square cube law calculations for that level of radiation right on the skin pressed against you are very frightening
>>63053871Which incident was that? Not the one in Georgia right, with the portable nuclear battery? Russia had so many nuclear incidents that it's hard to tell. One of the worst must be the one with the nuclear waste facility where the pool with the spent fuel was leaking and workers were trying to cover it up with plates and one guy fell into the fucking pool and got stuck under something. The facility was on the North Sea coast, fairly close to the Finnish border. A collegue saved him, but goddamn. That probably wasn't the highest acute radiation dose ever, because the water doing a good job shielding it, but it's nightmare fuel(heh).
>>63053932We don’t know all the details, this was 1999 so it’s not declassified.But what we do know is->Chechen thieves in 1999 break into a facility in Grozny to steal cobalt >6 Colbalt-60 rods measuring 27,000 curies each are taken. (So 162 thousand curies, like 6 PBQ) >One of the thieves holds onto them against his body for a while, one report says he was shirtless not sure>Someone dies within 30 minutesNormally I’d dismiss dying that fast. Cecil Kelley took 2 and a half days. But holy shit I can’t even calculate the dose
>>63055294I used the best calculator for this I had with the biggest units, closest I could get was 10 thousand sieverts per hour at a range of around 38 cm. Anything closer broke it. So if he was standing a foot and a half away he’d be getting about 2.7 sieverts a second. Chernobyl’s core was like, 14.4 an hour. You’d get that in 50 seconds.Granted that’s Gamma/Beta, Chernobyl has a lot of Alpha and that’s 10 fold worse at least up to 20fold, so it could be closer to only 3-6x Center of reactor 4 instead of 80-100x. Of course all the Grozny numbers are at 38 cm and the report mentions it being held against the body for a while so….
>>63055294>Someone dies within 30 minutes No wonder their casings read "DROP & RUN".
>>63053932>the nuclear waste facility where the pool with the spent fuel was leakingAndreev Bay.Worth a googling if you're interested in how not to deal with nuclear material.And, to be very specific, the main accident (as the design and very existence of that facility could arguably qualify as a nuclear accident) involved one of the storing pools leaking up to 30 tons/day and the repair work causing the other pool to start leaking 10 tons/day.
>>63053871>I can’t even calculate it because square cube law calculations for that level of radiation right on the skin pressed against you are very frighteningRP? CHP?
>>63053811all the issues involved with using titanium for hulls where the drawbacks end up outweighing the benefits is something i always thought was funny
>>63057105I thought the issues were just in cost, manufacturing and repair, are there others?
>>63056402It’s something in the range of 9 million sieverts per hour(900 million rads).I’m not surprised they keeled over
>>63055647Imagine jumbo rods bigger then those tiny ones, then imagine there’s 9 of them, then imagine they’re fresh and at full potency
>>63053811>Repairing and refueling reactor>Near the final step of things >Sealing up the reactor>Something somewhere hooks the reactor lid>Snags>They pull on it to get it unsnagged>Lid rips up>In this reactor the control rods are attached to the lid>All the rods instantly fully removed>A few milliseconds later >Reactor explodes>Lid is launched over a kilometre high>Top of submarine torn open>Entire contents of the reactor shot upwards like a confetti cannon >10 people on board die instantly, not from the radiation, but from the steam and physical trauma >Multiple people get ARS during cleanup>Uranium spread over 400 KMsJesus Christ, I don’t think having your entire reactor shot into the atmosphere is great for the environment
>>63057156Without getting too much into it, titanium doesn't compress like steel does, so when it undergoes serious pressure changes like submarines do, it deforms instead of reverting back to it's original form. So the Soviets were discovering that after a few years the hulls on their boats were starting to deform in places and significantly affect the acoustics of the submarine. To fix it they'd have to cut out sections of the outer hull that had deformed and replace them, increasing costs and time. It's why they reverted back to high strength steel with the Akula class and all following submarine classes.
>>63055294>6 PBQ>>63055338>closest I could get was 10 thousand sieverts per hour at a range of around 38 cm
>>63053839Two of those(1965 and 1985) went kaboom when a bunch of rods accidentally got yanked up. One was only partial and just made the reactor jump and fatally irradiated a dozen men with water. The other one was everything and shot the thing a thousand feet into the sky.Out of the other two, K-19 had a Large Pipe Break LOCA, something never planned for in the design that they couldn’t really handle especially as none of the backup pumps were working. Shit broke, reactor drained, got hot. In the other one they used Liquid Metal as a coolant. Since if it got hard it would literally brick the reactor the pumps had to be run hot. They leaked their fluid into the reactor, and when it hit the core it turned into solid gunk that clogged the coolant channels. That caused the temperature to gradually climb dangerously high which eventually crashed the reactor power due to the negative temperature coefficient. The crew decided to pull out all the rods to power through it, which melted the core. Since the coolant was metal the core kind of just flowed and bits of it ended up in unshielded areas. They spent a couple days trying to restart the reactor and only returned when guys started vomiting blood. 9 men died
>>63057302>In the other one they used Liquid Metal as a coolant. Since if it got hard it would literally brick the reactor the pumps had to be run hot.Why?That sounds like a terrible idea.
>>63057296>10 thousand sieverts per hourIs that a lot? I know Chernobyl was 15 thousand…>>63057251>9 million an hourThat sounds like a lot
>>63057251Ah, no m8 I was asking if you work in nuclear plants. I'm a senior radiological technician. > 900 million ROn contact? Well ""contact"" because lol infinity.
>>63057319Efficiency, makes the fuel last longer. Less corrosion and neutron flux. Also helps serve as shielding so you can cheap out elsewhere.Sodium does the same thing, but you can’t have that in a submarine. So they used Lead Bismuth.
>>63057320>That sounds like a lotIt's a mind boggling number. Highest I've seen was 28,000 R/hr and that was because we poked around with a drone.
>>63057325I don't think nuclear reactors and cheaping out is a good combination.
>>63057325>Sodium does the same thing, but you can’t have that in a submarineDue to size or...?
>>63057348Google sodium metal + fire
>>63057343It’s a good idea in practice, especially since apparently they have a habit of cocking up refueling There were two other incidents with that sort of design, one bricked cold and one leaked and may or may not have Han Soloed a compartment of sailors. Neither released radiation though.K-27’s issue was shit from the pumps leaking into the reactor coolant constantly and eventually turning into gunk that clogged the coolant channels. That and the crew had very little training. They saw the core surge in temperature and then the power crash from 100% to 7% over the course of a day and decided the logical conclusion was to yank out the rods. Then the temperature went off scale and all their radiation detectors pegged so they decided to spend a few days trying to restart the damn thing until they returned home because those pussy ass crew man wouldn’t stop puking and peeling.
>>63057348Sodium metal does not play nice with water.Not that the Russians generally care about that, nitric acid and hydrazine don’t play nice either and they decided chronic leaks of both in their subs was fine. Hydrogen Peroxide doesn’t even play well with itself, but hey that makes it a great torpedo juice! But apparently Sodium was a bridge too far.Not that molten metal can have water touching it either, but it’s not quite as bad. Hence the pumps using weird chemicals instead of water
>>63057358Isn’t that what happened in Simi Valley?
>>63053811thread themehttps://www.youtube.com/watch?v=_y6hwrfPehs
>>63057268Isn’t it supposed to take a while for it to heat up enough for that to happen? How does it explode in an instant?
>>63057343I don't think nuclear anything and russians are a good combination
>>63057368>nitric acid>hydrazine>leaks>on a subImagine the cancer and lung damage
>>63057368>Sodium metal does not play nice with waterAh, right. It's rather... reactive... with water.
>>63057401It went prompt critical. The control rods were the neutron absorber, and then there was none, so *poof*, prompt critical.
>>63057410Oh I saw that documentary on BBC. Having leaks of one or the other was pretty common, they used these fold out hoses to manually drain them if they had to because the leaks got too big(imagine a firehose just sort of dangling across a space).In the K-219 both leaked at once. Highest ranking guy told them to clean it up by hand and get on some gas masks, some rushed repairs, a bunch of fire alarms go off, officer forbids them from dumping the missile as it could alert the Americans, thing explodes. A bunch of guys suffocate or burn to death, reactor automatic shutdown systems all fail. Guy ends up having to go in and manually lower all the rods, radiation levels aren’t too high, but the combination of the heavy rubber suit and the 100% humidity and the 110 Celsius temperature made it take longer than normal and he popped out a couple times to cool down. Then he did it, but the rubber seal on the hatch to leave melted and they couldn’t get him out and he died after a while from internal drowning and heat stroke.
>>63057420Exactly. SL-1 also did this. Except that one(and the 1965 one) were only partial and just made the reactor jump up. K-431 was all of them and turned it into a buckshot confetti cannon. From what I’ve read the fact it happened with the new fuel load which was unenriched uranium reduced the scope of the aftermath. If the snag had happened earlier with the spent fuel at the end of its life cycle…
I remember watching a documentary on the Kursk and being horrified that Test Torpedo’s didn’t need to have their welds inspected(Duh no warhead means safe comrade). Now I’m thinking at least the fucking reactor shut down, what the fuck IS the Russian sub fleet doing?
>>63057302>none of the backup pumps were workingThe version I read from either the CIA or "Cold War Submarines" was there was a backup cooling system in the plans that wasn't installed before the first cruise
>>63057467> what the fuck IS the Russian sub fleet doing?Scraping by being the red headed stepchild of the branch that is itself the red headed step child of the Russian military.
>>63057348He's wrong. Originally the US navy was considering both pressurized water (Nautilus) and sodium (Seawolf) sub reactors and constructed prototypes of both. The USS Seawolf originally had a sodium reactor but there was some interaction between the sodium and stainless steel that damaged the steam superheaters so the seawolf couldn't extract full power from the reactor, and it ended up being replaced with a pressurized water reactor instead of refueled.
>>63057942Way I read it (might be wrong, though), it suffered from the same predictable issues all other superheated steam plants of the time did. Namely metallurgy not up to par with the operating pressures. IIRC none of the navies who tried using superheated steam managed to make it work (with the Germans in particular being notorious for their fuckups).
>>63057439Sergey Preminin is ultra rare Russian hero
>>63055294>Someone dies within 30 minuteshonestly, would it be better to shoot yourself, if you knew?I can't imagine the pain of the last few minutes
>>63057401>How does it explode in an instant?essentially the same way a nuclear bomb does
>>63057935>being the red headed stepchild of the branch that is itself the red headed step child of the Russian military.that would be the Russian surface fleet, actuallySoviet naval priority was submarines > naval aviation > surface fleet
Jesus christ, Russia.I see where Games Workshop gets the inspiration for all the grim 40k shit
>>63056089> involved one of the storing pools leaking up to 30 tons/day and the (attempted)repair work......was to dump some flour into the pool. To seal the crack, you see.
they make good boats.
>>63058209Leak is now nuclear cake, much better than woke western yellowcake.
>>63057411That isn't even a Carlos joke. Are you a bot? God, please stop.
>>63057358>Han Soloed?
>>63057358>It’s a good idea in practice>when it blew upIt clearly wasn't a good idea in practice.It was a good idea in theory and in practice it turned out to not work very well.
>>63058856The compartment became part of the cooling loop
>>63059409>>63058856
>>63053839>K-19>Ten deaths before it was even launched
>>63057251>900 million radJep, that should do it.
>>63058169Still beats slowly rotting from the inside over the next two weeks.I guess.
>>63055338Weren't Alpha particles basically harmless unless you swallowed the source? Just a single Proton that doesn't travel very far in air? >>63056089I'm not sure you could call it a pool if it leaks that much lol. Did they try closing the tap? >>63057268>The one where the entire reactor blew upwards?>Yeah that's not very typical I'd like to make that point.
>>63059651One of the reports from a guy in the room who wasn’t handling the stuff said everyone was blinded when their eyes suddenly were filled with blue light.Not Cherenkov radiation in the air, but in their eyes from the immense neutron bombardment
>>63059739K-431 would have been worse if the fuel was spent, fresh natural uranium isn’t super radioactive and all the fission products from the prompt criticality were mostly short lived. Also would have been worse if they were using a different fuel type. Those subs could run on highly enriched, standard enriched, nearly unenriched, just different Rod settings and configurations. If it buckshot like that on the 2% stuff what the fuck would happen if 97% enriched sub fuel was loaded when they yanked it?
>>63058172>>63057401The soviets got really good at making nuclear bombs based on the ideas they stole from the Americans.Their civilian nuclear program was a cover to spend more ressources on nuclear weapons so they were not good at making reactors.They were so good at making bombs and so bad at making reactors that the reactors behaved like bombs.
>>63059780Hey the US Army Core of Engineers did the same thing>slaps SL-1
>>63059760An unrequested fission surplus
As someone who hates the INES nuclear event scale as it’s muddled and not very useful, I’d remake it something like the following.>Magnitude 0-3 mostly unchanged, maybe the absolute worst of the worst Level 3 gets bumped up>Level 4 is now toned down a bit, most of the old Level 4s plus one or two really bad 3’s.>New Level 5 is a mix of really bad Level 4’s like Lucens and SL-1 and less bad Level 5’s like Three Mile Island.>New Level 6 is for the really bad Level 5’s and some unrated stuff. Chalk River, Rocky Flats, Sodium Reactor, , probably some of those sub disasters. >New Level 7 is Windscale, the other sub disasters, maybe Fukushima?>New Level 8 is Chernobyl and Mayak
>>63059748Jesus christ. Blessed be the ignorant for they do not know that they are fucking dead.
>>63056089severt alpha beta blob blob neatSee this I know what those are wowFins need to retake korelia.
>>63057942I thought US subs had BWRs rather than PWRs.
>>63057325>>63057319I dont care how great molten metal or salt coolant is if job bob and his diesel pump cant keep the reactor cool its no good.Very good nuclear news websitehttps://world-nuclear-news.org/
>>63057406RMBK-1000s are doing ok, running em to exactly 26 years.The VVS are good even better with western upgrades and fuel.There nuclear icebreakers and barges haven't popped yet. TZD tho
>>63057319>Why?That sounds like a terrible idea.It makes it possible to make a smaller or more powerful reactor which is why the alpha class could reach 40+ knots underwater.
>>63059739>Just a single Proton that doesn't travel very far in air?*helium nucleus. And yes, usually, but you can be knocked over by a feather if it's going at mach 3. Alpha charges through DNA like an autistic freight train once it gets under your dead layer of skin, which given enough of them, some percentage will.
>>63060558>RMBK-1000s are doing okDid they actually learn their lesson and make them retard proof?
>>63059739>Did they try closing the tapWhat few reports and analyses are available lead me to believe that, in typical soviet fashion, the problem was only really acknowledged when it turned out that dedicating every pump and fire-hose available on site to keeping the pools topped up failed to achieve that.At which point, and after failing to plug the leaks by dumping flour in the pool, then concrete in the basement, the decision to "remediate" the issue by emptying the pools of their nuclear waste, to be relocated in dry storage, was taken. That went as well as you'd expect a soviet nuclear cleanup to go.
>>63057105We had an ONI recruiter come to campus and he was apparently the guy who acted like a hobo near the subyards and collected the metal shavings off trucks to confirm that the new hulls were Titanium. Was a cool dude. The whole foreign military exploitation branch is pretty neat
>>63060391I feel like at those levels you’d feel something
>>63060747Yeah IIRC this is why it's highly toxic if you swallow it but otherwise not that harmful. Polonium is one of the worst things you could get in your body, but for a while you could have tig welding electrodes enriched with a little thorium, that you'd breathe in when grinding.There are thorium samples in Spinthariscopes, which are basically curious items for kids. I believe in the US you can get a magic brush for removing dust from vinyls that has a polonium sample to neutralise static electricity on the dust.
>>6305608930 tons a day is 30m3 of water, which is less than a faucet on medium all day. What matters is the dosage, risk to the water table in the short term, and whether people were sourcing drinking water downstream or not. Radioactive water dumping into the sea for instance is pretty much harmless once it finally dilutes due to the sheer scale of the sea, and the radioactive materials it already picks up naturally from erosion. Harmless being relative of course.It's arguably the least worrisome of all the nuclear accidents Russia has done, and not even as bad as some of their biological weapon fuckups in terms of risks to other.
>>63063499>biological weapon fuckupsDo I want to know?
>>63061009>...emitting gamma radiation at levels ranging between 800 and 17,000 roentgen per hour>...apparently creating the conditions where a local critical mass would accumulate in the pipes and lead to a spontaneous chain reaction - or a nuclear flashJesus fucking Christ, I have no words for this. Imagine being the poor conscript required to pick up spent nuclear fuel with a fucking shovel. Some shit you just can't make up. TZD
>>63063615>set up militarized anthrax production plant in the middle of a large city>make literal metric tons of the stuff a year>oops, someone forgot to put the new air filters in the ventsat least it was just russians dying rather than random people that'd suffer if terrorists got their hands on the stuff that russians just dumped on the ground in barrels sitting in the open on an island in Kazakhstan amidst the dried up sea
>>63060755Retard proof, sureJust not vatnik-proof
>>63061009Is this pic from a book?
>>63063848its a 50 page report on Andreev Bay by Bellona, you can google it
>>63053811What books or literature would you recommend about nuclear war, nuclear tech and subs in general?Specially fucked stories lik K-19
>>63063910I got Rhodes' book on the Manhattan Project, but havent read it quite yet. Fingers crossed
>>63063910Cold War Submarines: The Design and Construction of U.S. and Soviet Submarines by Polmar and Moore
>>63063910>subs in general?Blind Man's Bluff is essentially THE Cold War submarine book.
>>63063910The old Oppy list has some good ones for history of nuclear weapon programs, though I've mainly stuck to the policy ones myself
>>63064497God i miss Opp
>>63064013Rhodes work is fucking excellent, you're in for a treat and I'd highly recommend the rest of his stuff as well.>>63063910You could also do picrel for the nuke side of things (Oppenheimer's reading list, plus a few more that I picked up or like the look of)
>>63063910Blind Mans Bluff
>>63063499I agree, it's objectively not that big a deal, though we'll never know how bad it ended up being due to the lack of investigations.What fascinates me about Andreev bay is more how everything was wrong. Stupid design, poor construction quality, completely untrained staff, uninterested leadership, fucking around for months not really doing anything to fix the issue then "fixing" it with as much incompetence as before.It wasn't a Chernobyl or a Mayak with a big boom, it's been months, then years, then decades of vatnik irresponsibility where any improvement was (and still is) financed by the evil wect.
>>63063910>>63064497I'll also add pic related as some other good ones I've read recently for policy stuff. Roberts was actually one of Oppy's later additions (similar to Paper Tigers mentioned by >>63064527)
>>63057942>there was some interaction between the sodium and stainless steel that damaged the steam superheatersFrom my understanding, their was an ablative reaction in the super heated lines of those sodium reactors. I think it had to do with the metallurgy of the materials not being up to the task.Our knowledge has come a long ways and the alloys they would use today are beyond what they had back then.
>>63063785>an island in Kazakhstan amidst the dried up seawasn't that dried up sea caused by Stalin's great expansion and modernization projects (in this case, a hydro-electric damn that caused the sea/lake to dry up)?
>>63064509Last I heard, he still lurks and posts from time to time. He just doesn't trip any more.
>>63064668>>63064527>>63064497>>63064193>>63064407Thanks, looks like i have to update my Amazon wish-list
>>630580161986 was not a good year for the Soviet nuclear industry.
>>63064928Just fucking pirate them from libgen, anon
>>63053811Russia amazes me. They have some of the best mathematics minds on Earth and this little math booklet they made in the Soviet era is literally the savior of all poorfag math students worldwide But at the same time they keep doing shit like this lol
