Post gear, discuss gear. Night fighting edition.Old: >>64382304
/gq/ Infographic Emporium:https://imgur.com/a/gq-infographic-emporium-1-00-1lZ5xw6Legacy Infographics: https://imgur.com/a/k-infographic-reserve-AIKzwWFQuick and dirty "what plates should I buy on a budget?":Level III: Hesco 3411 (7.62x51 M80 / M855A1) or LTC 19513 (concedes 7.62x39 BZ API and NIJ cert for Level III but is lighter).Level IV: Hesco 4403
Are RMA XRTs worth looking for common 5.56 threats? If not what's a good alternative? They're 200$ a plate right now and check all my boxes for armor protection. Buffman had pretty decent results too in his video
>>64414770Heavy for 5.56mm and it's RMA.You're better off with Hesco T212s or M210s.
>>64414770No, they nearly went over the NIJ 44mm BFD limit for NIJ 0101.07 RF1 and come with all the classic RMA baggage. They recommend you run trauma pads with most of their plates for good reason.>common 5.56 threats?I'm going to assume M855A1 is included. If yes, Hesco 3411 or LTC 19513. Both much more reputable than RMA, lighter than the XRT, and the 3411 has an active NIJ cert for Level III (6x 7.62x51mm M80). If no, keep M855A1 protection anyway - you don't want to be in a situation where you've got Hesco 3811s and somebody has A1 on you. Bad juju.>They're 200$ a plate right nowBecause it's an RMA and they need to beat the bigger companies on price to remain competitive. >check all my boxes for armor protectionThey go a little north of "common 5.56 threats" because they also handle 7.62x51mm M80A1 and 7.62x54R B-32 API. The strike face is robust but the PE backer, the expensive part for Alumina-PE layup plates, is weak. At 6lb for a SAPI M (the shooters is nominally-sized) you're at nearly Level IV weight for not-Level IV protection.>Buffman had pretty decent results too in his videoThe RMA 1192 he tested that was 10oz heavier (by his admission) than the ones you could actually buy tested flawlessly. He has affiliate links with most "alt-armor" guys like RMA, Adept, Stealth, and had a huge debacle with the Highcom 4SAS4 late last year. He's not as objective as some people make him out to be, and he isn't a substitute for the NIJ or good lab testing. The XRT isn't a robust option and you'd be better served with either full Level IV protection or a "III+" from a more reputable company.
>>64414786These are also good. The T212 is $395/set and 4.7lb for a 10x12 shooters, but it's basically an L210-redux and will likely get creamed by common hunting rifle calibers - no 7.62x51 or 7.62x54R rating at all. The M210 is rated for 7.62x54R LPS like the new L211, but like the L211 it will likely "piss hot" over the NIJ 44mm BFD limit on 7.62x51mm M80 and similar-composition rounds. That can result in additional behind armor blunt trauma. You want to keep the BFD numbers low, which means a III+ like the LTC 19513 or Hesco 3411 that can still handle M855A1. On the other hand, "SRTs" like the T212 and L211 are much thinner than III+ plates (thinner backers) and can be concealed more readily. T212 is thinner than some of SOCOM's less than overt plates.>also busting out the RMA sucks infographic. XRT guy, read pic related please.
>>64414754https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=x9B02pFKpJoI can't wait for this. What's the closest we can get today?
>>64414858I'm gonna socoom...https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=vdFrAxjuQtA
Spoon feed me LBE equipment. Do not want chest rig, spiritus systems offering seems like nobody likes it. My current heading is to buy a surp usmc padded belt+suspenders and then molle on buttpack, deep gps, spud pouches etc. I don’t think I want a turnkey rig cuz modularity. What am I missing what should I consider? Yes me and the bois go on camping/larping so it will prob get dirty/wet
Made a quick mini-infographic explaining the RMA 1192 "ringer problem" - there's some interesting quirks with the timing of when RMA changed the weight. The whole "they changed it from Boron Carbide to B4C-SiC" theory doesn't explain the full story. Notably, the ones Buffman tested were 0.19" thicker than advertised, too, not just over half a pound heavier. Could be either the backer or the strike face that was beefed up. Both 1192s put on an impressive show, even stopping .300 winmag Swiss P AP and M993 tungsten-core at reduced velocity, which would be a big ask for a pure B4C strike face due to the amorphization issue. I'm thinking strike face was beefed up - possible they switched to B4C-SiC that was mostly SiC. I did find it humorous he wrote identical weights and thicknesses (down to the hundredth of a millimeter, excellent quality control good lord...) for both plates but later admitted in a comment it was 6lb 4oz on a scale, not 6lb 3oz. So basically the entire test was bogus. He still put the 1192 as the third best IV in his list, behind only the XSAPIs he tested as #2 (which used mystery meat soft armor) and the Adept Colossus as #1.
>>64414891Just buy the German LBE surp for $50. Fuck it.
I collect saffie gear for larping, is that the sort of thing that the people in this thread might appreciate? I have more practical gear but those nutria browns just have the drip factor
>>64414969
>>64414969https://www.robertrtg.com/german-army-load-bearing-web-gear
>>64414990I have this thing, without the pack though. I've been wanting to be rid of it for years now.
silly americans u go in debt for look like this? Shamefull...
>>64414891ALICE belt
>>64414995>I've been wanting to be rid of it for years now.What are you waiting for? If you want to do something do it or shutup about it. Good God I hate wishy washy, indecisive losers who can't determine thier own future and then whine about it.
>>64415004*sips...*
>>64415005
>>64415037
>>64414845> T212 is thinner than some of SOCOM's less than overt plates.How thick are those "less than overt" plates?
>>64415101LTC 28780 is 0.7" thick, the LTC 28791 that replaced it 0.6" flat, and VelSys PBZ-SA 0.52" - which is nearly as thin as the older, ICW II or IIIA LTC 28720.The PBZ-SA is hands down the best M855A1 / M80 / BZ API plate on the market at only 4.15lb, but it's a pricey sucker. LTC has two plates better than it in theory but they have yet to surface. Do not confuse these with the ULV (ultra low vis) plates, those are at or under 0.4" and are much, much weaker.
I've been looking at this Beez BALCS LVR. I like the idea of something that I can conceal under bulky clothes and kit out with a TAPS rig for more utility. Anyone got experience with this carrier?https://www.beezcombatsystems.com/collections/balcs-carriers/products/balcs-lvr
>>64415554I mean, you put a taps rig over that, and it's going to be just as bulky as any other carrier.
>>64412892I swear, this shit has gotten more confusing over the years following RMA's issues>4403>8lbMan, that's going to be aids but that's the price you pay for budget
>>64416012>RMAThere's a lot of debacles with them, so it's easy to get mixed up. Doesn't help that everyone else has debacles too that weigh in on theh trustworthiness of their armor, just not as many as RMA. We've got all of RMA's down since 2013. Let me know if you have questions about any of them. My expectation is we'll get a lot of people asking about the 1155 / 1165 G2 when Buffman's vids come out. Reportedly they "tested well.">4403It helps that it is multi-curve, but it's the lightest of the "cheap threes" (4403, old 1155, 4S17M). Possible new contender is the Chinesium Gilliam 1023, but I did not get a good answer out of GTS when I asked about the upcoming 6.3lb tungsten-rated 9969. They haven't tested it yet (bruh) and it's "primarily" an RF3 plate for M2AP, although other rounds will be tested. Yet it's advertised for M995 / M993. Got back to me in an hour though, so that's way better than Apex / Highcom that never said a word about how Apex's listed v0s for that helm are faster than Highcom's v50s.Bottom line, the entire armor industry is shady.
Update on the turkshit magfed shotgun FLC rig. I got one of the Idogear GP pouches in and it actually fits three 10 round Defenceport 12 gauge mags with no difficulty. I only expected two. Top still closes. Build quality is robust.Four of these across means 120 shells ready to go.
is there a simple vest vest soft and hard armor that has molle slots like pic related? Or just hard plates
Recommend me a belt better than this one for under $100Captcha : ARGAY
>>64417328>>64415004
>>64417388This fucking guy
Which boots/trail runners do you lads like for general innawoodsing?
>>64417818Merrell moans are what I use besides what ever surplus .mil boots I have
Update on the newest member of the SAPI family, the newly awarded LSAPI. According to a Lt. Col. Ken Elgort, the LSAPI offers the same protection as the ESAPI but is fully standalone and is 1.5lb lighter. Going off of VTP weights this means it is rated for 3x .30-06 M2AP @ 2,880ft/s or 3x 5.56x45mm M995 @ 3,350ft/s at 3.5lb VTP medium, ~58mm BFD limit. No soft armor required, so it's saving 3.5lb "for the same protection."https://www.armytimes.com/news/your-army/2025/10/14/heres-whats-new-in-soldier-gear-in-2025-and-beyond/I have a hunch this isn't accurate information, only because this is 0.8lb lighter than the LTC 28570, a recent, state-of-the-art single-hit B-32 API only plate, while offering vastly superior ballistic protection. It is over a pound lighter than already-underbuilt B4C-PE Level IVs like the Dayton RF3 and Hesco 4800 that can only stop one .30-06 M2AP, and no M995. Lastly, if we divide the contract price ($65.5 million) by the number of LSAPIs ordered (72,179) it comes out to $907 a plate, so it cannot be using especially novel materials.I still think it's maybe a mass-produced version of the GEN-6 less-than-overt plate made by LTC in 2023 for USSOCOM, but with the backer thinned due to the 58mm BFD limit versus the regular 44mm to save weight. Nonetheless, 3.5lb for M80 / M855A1 / BZ API defeat is badass.
>>64418026> I still think it's maybe a mass-produced version of the GEN-6 less-than-overt plate made by LTC in 2023 for USSOCOM, but with the backer thinned due to the 58mm BFD limit versus the regular 44mm to save weight. Nonetheless, 3.5lb for M80 / M855A1 / BZ API defeat is badass.This makes sense. There's literally zero chance it's a Level IV plate. Last anybody heard, the VTP ESAPIs barely made it, and the VTP XSAPIs are still fucked. And those are still ICW.
>>64418665Not to mention LSAPI is nearly the same weight as the USMC Lite plate, which is M80 / M855A1. I found a PEO Systems article clarifying LSAPI increases the tiers of protection from 2 to 3, so it definitely sounds like it is below VTP ESAPI. The VTP XSAPIs are still cooked. They got one model of XSBI (side plate) to pass first article but the 5.5lb, ICW, weight target for 3x M993 defeat for the full XSAPI is still elusive. I think they should can that idea and just accept a 6-7lb solution is necessary to address even semi-modern tungsten ammo.
>>64418682I figure the question is really how these plates perform against modern Russian and Chinese ammo. I've heard that the 7N10M is better than M855A1, and everybody knows that the elusive 7N39 mogs M995.If the LSAPI is like the lite plate, then it might be no good in so-called near-peer war. And it's not clear how ESAPIs copes with tungsten 5.45mm.lol at that LSAPI pic, btw. I thought woke was over?
>>64418734Bottom line up front, LSAPI is intended only for low-risk situations. ESAPI is the actual combat plate and XSAPI is near-peer reserve. 7N10M is probably closer to 5.56x45mm P112, the actually AP version of M855 from the mid-80s. Russians are able to defeat 7N39 using Aluminum Oxide "Fillin" ceramic tile array plates, 7.15lb. M995 only pens well against boron carbide plates like early ESAPIs due to the amorphization problem. 7N39 though is closer to Nammo AP4.One thing to keep in mind with Russian ammo is their machining used to be shit. 7N24 was blunt tungsten 5.45 resolved by 7N24M in the 90s and later 7N37. 7N24M is probably par with 5.56 M857 tungsten core.LSAPI and USMC Lite are both likely boron carbide-PE, and because of the B4C strike face will get their asses kicked by 7N24M and up. VTP ESAPI, rated for M995 up to 3,350ft/s +-50, is probably fine unless they have a heavier, AP45-esque long-core equivalent to 7N39 like how 7N51 is the long-core 7N37, or maybe a 7N39M. XSAPI REV C. needs 7N37 to reliably kill, which will be still the case if they unfuck the VTP XSAPIs. We know this because 7N37 beats the Adept Colossus. Then we have 7N37M and then 7N51. Rumored XSAPI REV. D is stronger than C.As for China their 5.8mm DVC-12 is probably outside the scope of LSAPI / USMC LITE, but will be trounced by ESAPI REV. G through GEN IIIS VTP. Their new .338 APs will beat any known US inventory plate. Russia's 7N45 / rumored PFO BS are the same way. Western .338 APs have been like that for ages. I've heard the swedes have a .338 Lapua PTR 10 PRICK SLAP loading that will probably mulch any known plate.Fortunately this is all ultra-exotic that rarely appears, for now.
>64418857>and later 7N37.Meant to say 7N39 here, GRAU system doing me dirty. lol
>>64418857Thanks for the effortpost bro. I agree with all of your conclusions.I found data on 7N40, BTW. It looks a bit like Swiss P, but it has a steel penetrator rather than a tungsten one. Apparently designed for accuracy and consistency at intermediate range rather than armor penetration. Low velocity, around 2700 fps, so it might be a much heavier bullet than usual for them, maybe around 72gr.If the steel penetrator is hardened well, it could be more or less comparable to M855A1. Otherwise it's probably a bit weaker?
>>64418934It's basically like Israeli 73gr "AP Match" steel core. I agree it's probably a little north of M855A1. I wouldn't like my odds against it with just T212s or another SRT. Just to be safe, overkill with a M61 AP-rated plate like Hesco 3814 or Highcom 3S9M, preferably B-32 API / M80A1 mix. LTC 28570 is probably fine. There is a 7.62x54R 7N41 and a 7.62x51mm 7N43 as well.I see 7N41 as basically a refined 7N14 and is probably in the same pool as B-32M API and 7N26. All roughly similar to M2AP and should be ineffective against ESAPI GEN IIIS at realistic combat distances. Not positive B-32 API TSAs can handle it (28570 / 28590 / 28595).Of course, with all Russian ammo we should expect an "M" modernized version. 7N37M showed up in 2017, a few years after 7N37 made its debut in 2012-2014. 7N37 was likely designed to kill XSAPIs - which were first developed in 2006, 7N37M to defeat XSAPIs with more standoff and/or fake-ass Ukrainian super plates from Hyperion. 7N51 is likely even nastier due to its WC long-core design. I think it's a standoff thing and it's unlikely Uks, even SOF, are fielding plates significantly stronger than XSAPI REV. C. XSAPIs are nothing to write home about, LTC has been selling their 28601 commercially since 2008. We know China has patented TiB2-SiC ceramics like that used in the Adept Colossus and Gilliam 9969 that have better counter-tungsten performance. It's possible Militech or another smooth operator has TiB2-SiC models in the back catalog that aren't shown publicly. All armor manufacturers have back catalogs of plates they don't sell to the public.Otherwise, Russia has tungsten core 9x19mm, 7N31M, which could likely handle the new, all-PE ULWSAPI. This is about a pound going off the Hesco 3801LV with BFD limit raised to ~58mm. ULWSAPI is below LSAPI and likely is a Tencate incorporating the same high-end PE as the 1.5lb, 7.62x39 MSC only VS-PXULV covert plate. Will get trashed by M855 / 7N10. Maybe even 5.7 SS190 out of a PS90.
>>64414995Bruder, help me defend the Fulda Gap
>look at BDU size chart>have 38 inch chest which is just barely in the medium category>buy medium BDU>it's basically 41 inch and it looks like im swimming in it
>>64419059Medium what? Believe it or not the length plays a role in the sizing
>>64419059It's better that way. The worst thing to deal with is having clothing that restricts your nuts, and sleeves you can't roll up. Embrace the comfy.
>>64419072Man I had a pair of sweatpants that tore the skin off my nuts because the seam was too tight. This is gear related btw.
>>64419036> ULWSAPI I've gotta say that I totally don't see the point of this. Anti-frag armor, maybe? Simply something rigid to stuff in plate carriers? LRRP-type guys who march 35 miles every day and would throw away anything heavier? (Does this still exist? US SOF are probably too roided out, and regular troops are too soft.) There are handgun rounds that'll go straight through it!
>>64419059they probably also have the same problem as acu's where every single individual garment fits wildly differently so you can't actually trust the sizing at all
>>64419082For what it's worth, a full front + back + 6x8 sides of ULWSAPI will weigh less than one original 1998 SAPI. It can probably handle M193, 7N6 (no 7N6M), maybe M80 but that's probably pushing even the VTP BFD limit. If the ULWSAPI is like the VS-PXULV it'll be under 0.4" thick and can be readily concealed. The same source for the VTP ULWSAPI also mentioned a VTP SAPI - the OG black one from 1998, so I think maybe they're going to a five-plate medley. It'd be weird for LSAPI to be stronger than 7.62x54R LPS @ standoff / M80 / M855 SAPI, so maybe SAPI is a B-32 API plate now that splits difference between LSAPI and ESAPI.They've been trying to make LSAPI a reality since 2014. The original plan was a plate that weighed as much as a SAPI (4lb), had ESAPI REV. E protection, and also had standoff (100 / 50 meter) protection against X and Y threats - respectively M993 and M995. This is impossible so that got shitcanned. The idea was that boron suboxide would develop faster and wouldn't amorphize like B4C against tungsten.We'll know LSAPI's true rating if we can get a thickness number. If it's 0.6" or below, likely a TSA/LTO like the PBZSA and ergo BZ API / A1 / M80. If it's 0.78-0?9" then Overt and B-32 API / M80A1 like Blackbeard RF2+ / LTC 28595 / LTC 28570. Also, the rise of TiB2-SiC ceramic available to Chinesium dudes like Gilliam is concerning if we're concerned about penning "OPFOR" plates. China can in theory make a plate on par with the Adept Colossus.
>>64419069>>64419072I bought a medium short cold weather BDU top. Didn't want to admit I'm a short kang teebeeqh. I can fit my motorcycling armor underneath it but there's way too much slack I'm not a big fan.I looked up some eBay tape measure photos for a small short which is about 39-40 inch chest should fit me better. Will try to see if I can find a tape measure photo of an extra small also.Didn't have any issue with BDU medium short pants, those were fine.
>>64419145I'm about your size, and I can wear small and medium. I prefer medium because it has more room and the small restricts my arm movement. like the other post said, stick with medium, it's better that way.now, if you don't care about functionality and you just want something that looks tailored, small should be fine. it just restricts my arm movement, especially with gear on.
>>64418026Standalone ESAPI performance at minus 1.5lb?Finally technology is improving.
>>64419234You didn't read the rest of the thread, did you? It's BS or misquoted.
>>64419192>bootsI decided to get Grenada War DMS boots which came out a bit after the 'nam jungle boots. They're *really* nice. There's some ankle support, nothing armored but it's better than nothing for motorcycling. https://www.ebay.com/itm/253808230864Only mod I did was swap the do not boil plastic sheet insoles with Dr. Scholl Work All-Days. My boots were dated 1984 and had a manufacturer code of PH is apparently McRae footwear.
>>64419145You can skip all the guessing and go to a surp store near a large base, and try all the different size combos yourself. US sizing has been about the same for decades so any BDU/ACU/OCP/whatever will work.
>>64419234>>64419242At absolute best it's a B-32 API plate, and maybe colonel dude was thinking it was equivalent to ESAPI because B-32 API is the highest threat in the sandbox that falls under ESAPI's umbrella, or maybe they're evaluating it against "common" RUS / PLA ammo under the ESAPI umbrella. We need to know how thin it is before it can be fully determined whether it's BZ API / M855A1 or B-32 API. I'm still thinking the former, only because if B-32 API protection can be had for 3.5lb then GEN-IIIS ESAPI should be much lighter than 5.068lb.
>>64419192>wants to larp as 90's US army>uniform looks like complete wrinkled shit
>>64419331the best part about larping is you don't need to adhere to any uniform standards :^)
>>64419275>They're *really* nicethey look like it. the code on mine is PJ and it looks like they were made in 93.
>>64417322sober up and ask again>>64419331looks like clothes laying on the groundyou chinks are really starting to stretch with your demoralization tactics>>64419340you're probably not even clean shaven
my flc is so smelly
>>64419341>PJprobably Altamahttps://cartalana.com/002-40.php
>>64419331I don't want to larp that I'm in garrison and have to look neat. I also keep all my woodland in a storage tote.>>64419356thank you
>>64417818Jim green
>>64414754Am I stupid for wanting a wool 550Gm cloak from five star alterations even though it's sold out and 200 some Dollars?the ponchos seem cool, also whoever decided WEBP files should be used commonly needs to have horrible torture done to them
>>64419666just get a medieval larp cloak or make one yourself. though it's not the worst price I've seen, some of the higher end cloaks are about the same.
>>64414956I hope everyone spams this in his youtube comments when he uploads the Gen2 versions coming out. Has everyone archived RMA's new product pages?
>>64414754>Night fighting editionAnd yet, every time I ask about where to buy a simple, gen 3 green phosphor monocular with mil-spec glass I get five spergs arguing about photonis/gen 2+ tubes (for no reason) and git-gud FOMs for half the thread and not ONE SINGLE tangible recommendation.So anyway is custom night vision (the website, I don't feel like purging housing kits with wine preservative) still the go-to? Seems like they have good stock and actually let you pick tubes depending on how much you want to pay.
>>64419901It's like asking for a vegan steakhouse.Just move on desu.
>>64419352Dawn dish soap. Does a great job. >>64419901CNV is alright but you’ll end up paying for it either way. If you’re after Omni tube, I’d try to track down basque. Dude sniffs out fairly decent tubes like truffles. Side note going to be playing with a 6moa dot in the dark soon on the fabled crew served beretta.
>>64419901Side note, what is your budget? I think that’s a little more important to know and why you might be getting photonis recommendations. That being said, before I ended up getting an Omni, I was heavily considering a photonis tanto combo.
Any recommendations for prescription ballistic glasses? I've been wearing my usual Ray-Ban's but want something more durable for the end of the world
>>64420048Rx safety. There are a few others that are likely cheaper. I have no knowledge of some of the “mail order” services like zenni or China direct have offerings, but as long as you buy for the relevant ansi rating for safety Glas, you’re likely golden. I hope your eyes get better soon.
>>64419666Medieval larp cloaks cost about the same.The larp cloaks are actually better, though. > also whoever decided WEBP files should be used commonly needs to have horrible torture done to themDownload the "save image as type" browser extension
>>64421019Oh forgot link.> https://knightweave.com/products/cloak-for-adult?variant=49313563115830
>>64419666>>64421019Just give me this guy's cloak. The pattern probably even blends into the environment. https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=yN8cYd3poIk
>>64419666If you want to save money just get a cloak pin and a surplus blanket
>>64421038Harbor freight blue tarp and paracord. The future is now you filthy peasant.
>>64421107
>>64419352Thats a strange name for your mom's pussy.
>>64421114Don’t forget the ring on your way to Mordor
>>64421038I use one of these with a wool blanket. Peak cozy
>>64421267lol, noIts mint green color, from a distance, sticks out like a sore thumb.Any kind of desert camo, going back to the 1970s -- including the infamous "chocolate chip" -- works better. Especially after you get them dusty.There's just no salvaging UCP. It will never work well. Even fashion camo from WalMart is 100x better.
>>64421267>twitter
>>64421267This has always been a gay cope. If you're reliant on local dust to blend in, then you might as well be wearing block colours or simply a better pattern.
>>64421267>black pilledIs he black?
>>64421299Now you're coping. Using local soils and native vegetation is peak conformity to your environment, regardless of camo pattern. You now that.
>>64421318I doubt dispute that, but its irrelevant to the pattern. That defence could as easily be applied to a dayglow clown costume or bare skin.
>>64421342Nta but I appreciate ucp. It works better than you think. That being said the all brand new ultra grey look was godawful but that mostly was limited to the first batches of the stuff.
Update on the RMA 1165 G2. The model submitted for testing does NOT have full drop foam. There is an edge foam layer. They will be submitting a revised version (1165 G2.5?) later with drop foam added.RMA: >"1165 DOES NOT include a full strike face foam layer, just like the Gen 1, which is typical of mid and high-end Level IV plates from all manufacturers. It DOES have some edge protection foam wrap for protection and wearer comfort."Also Buffman's response to the 1192 controversy, replying on reddit to "Guano":>"RMA doesn't produce ceramic strike face cores. for them to send me a cooked plate, not knowing what I would shoot at them, would be a huge shot in the dark/risk on their part. They stated the variance was from ceramic manufacturer.. It's also not the first time a webmaster/web guy hasn't updated a spec sheet on the website.">"The 1189 and 1199 did have the cheat rings. IIRC the 1199 was a very niche contract fulfillment. That didn't last long. I would have liked to see the 1189 in a G2 variant as it was one of the very few plates that could stop M2AP at 3200 over multiple hits."He's handwaving the weight / thickness disparity, because the webmaster updated the plate's weight to 5.9lb, when his again was 6.25lb and 0.19" thicker than advertised. They never corrected the thickness. Guano, since you're obviously in this thread, he's deflecting and not addressing the points you're making.
Which retention lanyard for the flat range and big larpa is more hype? Crye ASR, Yates Helo, or AWS 50428.
>>64422352Classic SPIE harness or bust faggot
>>64422417Roger that snake.
>>64421929>They stated the variance was from ceramic manufacturerSo, basically, they're conceding the plate was badly overweight and it's implied the ceramic in particular was heavier / thicker than advertised (ding ding ding), they're just trying to deny the INTENT to send an overweight set of plates for the purposes of the test. This is admittedly impossible to prove without access to internal communications, but it can be speculated on to no end. Buffman's concession is that the 1192's advertised weight was inaccurate and others' 1192s are closer to 6lb or over. I don't see instances of that, especially since there are supposedly two 1192s. The 5.7lb B4C one advertised at the time of his test and the later, apparently 5.9lb hybrid.This doesn't address why he wrote the exact same weight / thickness for both plates in the 1192 test, then said 6lb 4oz in a comment. So did both plates have the exact same variance from the mfg? Also doesn't address the thickness. 0.19" thicker is a big deal. Also very convenient, for the purposes of the test, that the "variance" was that the plates were much heavier and not lighter. Yes, other armor manufacturers have variances too, but that doesn't somehow absolve the 1192. The fact the 1192 wasn't certified isn't an excuse either. RMA should have caught that in quality control, since if they're allowing plates to go overweight this much, then surely like their other plates they must be allowed to go underweight. Did they not check? Variances go both ways, +-. How would a 5.4-5.5lb 1192 handle? Probably not that well.
>>64421929>They stated the variance was from ceramic manufacturer..Thier failure in receiving inspection does not inspire confidence and the quality "variances" are still 100% thier responsibility. >just ship itFuck that. What else does this attitude obscure?
>>64423055My big problem is that because Buff's magic pair of 1192s stopped .300 Winchad Swiss P AP and M993 at reduced velocity, that strongly impies it was the, later, not advertised at the time, 5.9lb B4C-SiC hybrid ceramic 1192. Pure B4C would amorphize and perform poorly. Perhaps this "variance" is an altered ratio of B4C, which sucks against tungsten, and SiC, which is the best common ceramic. If this variance goes the other way, people with majority B4C plates would have gotten torn a new ass by those rounds. Yes, the 1192 was only advertised to M2AP, but the outstanding performance in Buff's test, plus his strong endorsement of the 1192 and his close affiliation with RMA (he's a youtube affiliate, ran defense for them on the NIJ 1155 suspension, and did R&D with them on the XRT), would lead any reasonable person to think the 1192 would perform that well (in other words, this test was basically an ad). That's risky shit, especially since it was a no-cert plate.Basically, from my reading between the lines:1. Buffman concedes the 1192s were 10oz heavier than advertised. He conceded this years ago.2. He states that RMA said to him it was a ceramic variance.3. RMA thereby concedes his 1192s were much heavier than advertised and they were, in fact, not the listed specs. Ringers.4. It's okay because other companies have variances! Look at this cherrypicked Paraclete 9900X that's +-0.5lb!5. It's also okay because they did ship other people 1192s around 6lb! No, no, ignore the 0.2" difference in thickness. (did they?)Long story short, the position is that these did vary from the "advertised" 1192 but it wasn't INTENDED to send him 6.25lb 1.09" and not 5.7lb 0.9" plates. Also his "RMA doesn't know what I shoot them with" defense is crock. RMA instructed him to not drop test one of the 1165s. They send him plates. Plot twist, the original 1165 doesn't have drop foam! When did they disclose that? Looks like today! Talk about chicanery...
>>64423143Pretty sure it was closer to 6.5 lbs than 6, and way more than the 5.7 lbs they advertised. Kinda sus all around.Real talk, have you noticed EVERY single RMA plate has something off? Like there’s always a corner cut that they, uh, forgot to mention. (It's the "web guy's" fault!)At this point the new 1165 looks nerfed and basically like a gimped dogshit plate: undersized, no foam, not drop-safe, underbuilt, with that famous RMA quality control. You literally can't make a 5.5-pound Level IV plate with "hipure" alumina without cutting literally every corner possible. Holy shit, nigga, it's a 4SUS4 "GEN 2"!
>>6442334010oz over advertised is Buff's final number, since the 1192 advertised at the time the plates were shot (verified by wayback machine) was 5.7lb, that's 6.325lb. This is beyond even the 0.5lb variance of the 9900X plate he cherry picked to defend RMA.Let's not forget he wrote the exact same thickness and weight for both 1192s on their front covers, but corrected himself in a youtube comment.1. How come the variance only happened one way? 2. How come the variance was precisely, down to the hundreth of a fuckin' millimeter, the same for both plates?3. When he corrected himself to 6lb 4oz, was that for just one plate or both?I'm suspecting some nasty shit if those questions hold true. You thinking what I'm thinking?>kinda sus all aroundUnderstatement of the thread.>Every RMA plate has something off?This has been my exact contention for a long time. RMA always has an excuse and they need to play a little dirty to beat Hesco and LTC on paper. I hope any of you people that have 1165s never dropped them. I hope the mailman was real careful getting them to you. I hope they were packed properly, because that could be a repeat of the 4SAS4. You better xray that shit because tap/torque might not cut it. That goes for both 1165s. Sorry if you bought the old one thinking it was just an 1155 with a PE backer and not fiberglass. Surprise bitch, they took the drop foam out. Glad to find that out the week after it was discontinued.>4SUS4 GEN2I remember saying a year ago this would happen again... guess it's just RMA trying to catch up with the big boys now.
Marshmaxxing.
>>64424121Any decent pack covers so I can help old blue hide?
>>64423340>At this point the new 1165 looks nerfed and basically like a gimped dogshit plate: undersized, no foam, not drop-safe, underbuilt, with that famous RMA quality control. You literally can't make a 5.5-pound Level IV plate with "hipure" alumina without cutting literally every corner possible.You wanna take a bet on how it'll do in the video?>pic semi related
>>64420065Thanks anon. I can actually get Lasek for free but haven't bothered putting in the paperwork
>>64424126>decentLiterally, just pick one off Amazon, I got a waterproof, in some version of Realtree.
>>64425023>Lasek for free but haven't botheredPut it in!>t. was blind, now I see.
>>64425023Inb4 anon's eye balls are perma fucked from lasik.
>>64425627they're dry... so dry... like rotten feesh
>>64419901Got an old Gen3 Litton mx-10130 tube and put it in a modified M2021 housing. Sub $800 overall for the build.
>>64425803Post pic.
>>64425836It's in police evidence rn so can't. Just praying i manage to it back soon
>>64425959you break into a2's mcdonalds at 2 am or sumthin?
>>64425998Nah just made boomsticks in a country where you cant legally own themTL;DR they come and took it :(
>>64424216Also see pic related, turns out RMA contradicted themselves (again)! When asked why they had nothing new certified, they previously said that "nobody has been able to certify anything since January 2024" and that NIJ 0101.06 has been closed for two years. Not true, Shorta07, their community manager, just said .06 was closed in January 2025.>>64419878Screengrabbed and archived. I like how the current 1165 GEN2 specifically says it achieves "incredible weight reduction without sacrificing performance" and declines to mention they had to remove the drop foam.
>>64414990+1 for LBE
>>64426009damn, should'a hidden them in a box down by the river
>>64426239My cocky "Nah i wouldnt get raided that happens to other people not me." thinking was in fact incorrect
>>64426332Should have used NordVPN
>patiently waiting for Militech to get certs so we can end this budget plate charade
>>64427070Aieeee I hate arasaka!
>>64427081Morgan Blacktip gonna hit you in the cheat ring with a .22 choom
In other armor news, Buffman got a set of Hesco 4403s in from MIRA Safety four months ago. I don't see the vid has been published yet. I'm hoping he's not stalling it until the 1155 / 1165 are out.
What are my options as far as mounting a holster (specifically a G19) to a padded molle belt? I know there are few universal holsters that just use velcro but is there any way to mount a plastic/kydex holster with retention?
>>64427234
.
Good read if anons are interested in instances of bad guys with armor. Mostly soft with mixes of AR500 plates in, but this is liable to change. I expect 4SAS4s. https://pistol-forum.com/showthread.php?50596-Suspects-With-Body-Armor-Thread
>>64427899i blame obama
I am in debt
>>64427910bad guys are still in danger of Poorfags with a yugo mauser and surplus 1943 S.M.K.well that and 2 3/4 9 pellet buckshot to the pelvic cradle works fine, not like any of those morons kitted themselves up like Emile Mataseranu or Larry phillips jr.I still haven't figured out what particular vest Emile wore at the time, a safariland vest with a steel heart plate I saw on eBay was close but the tails of the vest weren't correct.And I definitely don't know the pants or shoes,Larry had black Levi 560 jeans if I remember right.
>>64428280I prefer the S&B 12 pellet 2 3/4. It's evident that bad dudes roll bad armor, SmK should handle the lot easily. SmKH will obliterate all.
shoot in dick
>>64428257That's on you, in every way.
>>64429217he is typical american
Best rain layer without spending Arc’teryx dollars? Either surp or commercial is fine, I haven’t tried PCU stuff above lvl5
>>64429874>Without spending arcteryx dollarsDefine that dollar amount.
>>64429892I’m willing to spend a few hundred dollars on something that’s g2g and will last, but finding second hand LEAF stuff for under retail (600+ for their hard shells) is impossible now.If a lvl6 PCU jacket from a decent manufacturer will hold up and do the same job I'll jump on one.
>>64429874excellent elite spanker
Does anyone have any tricks for using an LBE with buttpack with a backpack? I struggle to stop the pack from resting on the buttpack and putting a ton of pressure on my hips.
>>64430319frame
>>64430319This right here, is the exact reason I went with a split chest rig.
>>64414754What jackets do we like? Long story but I got rid of most of my old clothes and forgot to buy new cold weather stuff before it started getting cold out. Water resistance not important. Wind resistance semi important.
>>64420048I have some wileyx's and I'm not sure I would recommend them. To be fair they are the only ones I have tried but they have some flaws. The lenses are super reflective, in bright sunlight I can see my eyeballs reflected off the lens. I can also see someone coming up behind me though, which is kind of cool. Like on airplanes I can see people coming up the aisle before they get to me. They got scratched up pretty easily, I guess the durability part doesn't extend to that.
>>64421283>infamous "chocolate chip"Why is it infamous?
>>64427234The belt doesn't have a passthrough or anything?
>>64429874Outdoor research forray rain jacket.
>>64430319What backpack? I just got my lbe and haven't used it but my understanding going into this was that I wouldn't be able to use my normal pack. You need like a short stubby pack.
>>64426088well they went full 4SAS4. If the shield logo is the same size on both plates, and if the "SAPI" is ackshually 9.5x12.5", then the "shooter's cut" is basically 11.25x9.3". With the lower corners cut (literally! lol) it's smaller than a SAPI S. > Uh 10x12" Shooters Cut. Nominally 9.5x11.5". Ackshuallly 9.25x11.25".> And, uh, we removed the foam from the strike-face, but there's still foam around the plate rim.So it's a 9x11" plate fr? I guess that's one way to make a lightweight plate, lol.
>>64430968If we're playing by those rules, the Hesco 4601 weighs 5.55lb and keeps the drop foam - unlike the 1165. Hesco 4403 weighs 6.68lb, with foam, and the light-on-foam no-cert 4800 a fantastic 4.42lb! Incredible!We got used car salesmen trying to make Alumina into something it's not.
>>64430968Also forgot to mention that if we pulled all stops, Hesco could use the B4C tile array 4801 they had at shot show in 2022. Using that math, this would go from 4.8lb for a 10x12 to 4.16lb. LTC 28570 mogged beyond belief. Nearly on the cusp of sub-4lb Level IV, a capability only reached before by polycrystalline diamond vaporware courtesy of Diamond Age. If only Hesco knew such genius.
>>64430746Best pattern ever.
>>64431217naked snake's buttpack
>>64431172Yes, taking a 9x11" plate and calling it 10x12" . . . uhhhh . . . nominally. That is genius.I can go beyond genius.I have a nominally 10x12" plate. Super shooter's cut. See picrel. (It's a 3x4" gorget, weighs 8 oz.)
>>64431449Forgot pic, lol
>>64430798Mystery ranch 3 Day. Drives me crazy. Even my camping osprey backpack sits too low and cranks down on my hips because I just can’t comfortably get them high enough without a PC on.
>>64431887It's because you're 5'3". We established this in /arg/.
>>64431449>It's genius because everyone's favorite armor youtuber is trying to pass that off as normal *cough* affiliateman *cough* restore faith in Highcom *cough* backer is trash *cough Highcom showed me confidential test reports on a 16 year old plate showing 6x BZ API defeat no I can't show you them because ITAR even though I dissected the plates on live video *cough* RMA was upfront with the cheat rings on the 1189 and 1199. *cough* RMA builds their plates to spec and someThere are limitations to nominal sizing chicanery. For a 10x12, whatever the dimensions of the plate - ballistic or otherwise - the fair hit box must be 6x8. Two inch from edge rule. Level III plates because of the 6 shot multi hit have less leeway because of strike face "room" required.
In terms of night vision, are there any cheap surplus night vision options that are actually worth it?I went hunting today with my old Mauser, and when the deer came out it was just a little too dark to see.
>>64432142can you even hunt with night vision? it's illegal in my state.
>>64432142>I went hunting today with my old Mauser, and when the deer came out it was just a little too dark to see.How exactly do you propose to hunt the deer? Laser?>cheap surplusDepends on what you think is cheap.
>>64432151Not in my state.>>64432155>laserWdym?>cheapLike 200 bucks.
>>64432192>Wdym?How do you plan on seeing? Nods can't necessarily see very well through scopes. You could get a night vision scope or thermal scope though.>Like 200 bucksMaybe those chinkshit night vision devices might suffice.
>>64432192>Not in my state.sweet>Wdym?you need a laser or red dot to aim with night vision>Like 200 bucks.no
>>64432208>>64432214I hunt with irons. Do any surplus NVG’s hit the market? Doesn’t have to be the best gen. Just something that works pretty good in low light.Also, what’s the minimum price you’d be looking at?
>>64432269>I hunt with ironsTake it from someone who did some retarded shit, irons don't work with nods.
>>64432269>what’s the minimum price you’d be looking at?$3000 would be nice gear.
>>64431984>you're 5'3"Is she a girl?
>>64432290No, mostly just a victim.
>>64432142If you're strapped it's G1 or digital. Digital is slowly getting there but it's definitely not "there" yet and it's troubled by a lack of honest reviews. Digital falls flat in latency, refresh, and passive performance. The GNG2K is $350, 60hz, and claims to be 0.0001 lux capable but there's nobody honest who bought in yet and can vouch.>>64432155An HFXC or SMS Trinity could get you there.>>64432192$200 is poor by digital even. Can you up to $350-400? If so GNG2K.>>64432208NV analog scopes are wonky to use in the day because of exposure unless they have a cap. NV digital scopes are behind a bit and have meh lux values. He could totally get a Pulsar N550 for $150 or something but the battery life is ass, VGA resolution, it sucks the battery dry even when off and it needs illumination to work.Oneleaf for $1,400 is dominant "semi-budget" thermal scope, no comparison, but that's way out of our guy's budget.
>>64431217took me several seconds to tell that this wasn't an old picture of my closet
>>64432285>>64432319But do you need 3k to see in the dark? What about those cheap Russian gen 1 nods?I mean I could maybe do 350 idk.>>64432269How much are old nv scopes?
>>64432458>But do you need 3k to see in the dark?Absolutely not. You can get blem G2+ analog NV for well under 1-2k depending on your tolerance for blems and specs. Russian analog NV is mostly Gen1 and good digital is already caught up with that. I say wait a month, see if the GNG2K doesn't suck, and continue saving for analog and watching for deals in the meantime. Buy cheap, buy twice. Buy once, cry once. I advise against buying an Nvg30. Mine works better than the naked eye but the 0.001 lux sensor is already badly out of date. GNG2K and Nvg3rd are 0.0001 lux on paper, which is more competitive with low-mid analog that doesn't really use lux as a measure. Digital moves quickly but incrementally.
>>64432458>How much are old nv scopes?I just saw an old PVS-2 on eBay for $900.gen 1 is actually trash, you're better off with digital.
>waits for the NVG-90 to go on discount because nobody's paying 1k for digital
>>64431887That one sits pretty low still.>>64431984Damn I was hoping to get away from the people that ruined /arg/. This board is fucked.
>>64432269>I hunt with irons.Successfully? Or was yesterday your first time?
>>64432491You're gonna have to either head to discord and worry about being tangentially related to the next groomed by the FBI looking ass or sit in an altchan with one post per month.
>>64432504It's a relief to know this is a conscious effort and things didn't accidentally get this bad.
>>64432497Last year I took 2 deer with irons. I used an old 1916 Spanish Mauser in 308 Winchester (yes, it is stamped 308 Win on the barrel)I prayed to God, and was like “Lord Jesus, I gotta be honest- I don’t care much if I kill a deer or not. I just want to glorify you.” Something along those lines.So when I was in the stand, something told me to pray more specifically, so I was like “Alright, I want a 10 point buck.” So a little while later, a doe and her baby came out into the clearing, then shortly after a buck. I lined up the sights and took the shot. He reared back and took off into the woods. Went down to check it out and a chunk of meat and some blood was on the ground. Called my brother, and while I was waiting on him I tracked him halfway into the woods. He helped me track him the rest of the way. At first when we got to him, we thought he was 9 points, but we looked closer and the 10th point was broken off. Was an awesome day, and Glory to Jesus Christ.>>64432473>Russian analog NV is mostly Gen1 and good digital is already caught up with thatNo kidding? That’s pretty impressive.>GNG2KAwesome, thanks anon, I’ll wait on that and look into it. I’ll look into the blem stuff too though. How many times better is gen 2 than digital?>>64432481For 900 I’d rather have nvg’s.
>>64430319>weight on hips as opposed to shouldersThat is the whole point? That being said if it is too much, just tighten the pack straps?
>>64432687What inner belt do you use?
>>64432704Those don't have an inner belt. It's just one giant padded "belt" that wraps around your waist.
>>64432712Okay then whatever that thing with the cobra buckle and d ring is called. The belt that is inside the other belt. That's the one I want to know about.
>>64432704I wear this belt on my pants belt loops:https://www.amazon.com/dp/B00H9HV0HY?ref_=ppx_hzsearch_conn_dt_b_fed_asin_title_2&th=1&psc=1And the inner belt that runs inside the padded outer belt is this one:https://www.amazon.com/dp/B01CLOU3HC?ref_=ppx_hzsearch_conn_dt_b_fed_asin_title_6I believe it is made by the same OEM as AWS. >>64432712There is an inner belt dummy.
>>64432603Not all digital is the same and neither is all gen2 the same. Early digital like the nvg10 is very poor. However, people are reporting great results with the Nvg3rd, which is/was the $350 pricepoint model between the Nvg30 and GNG2K, even without illumination.Good Gen2 will not suffer from the framerate issues (it's analog, not a mini-screen and digital sensor) of digital. Less latency too. A lot of digital however is full color. Analog has a major edge in runtime. Digital can see into the "SWIR" band usually up to ~1100nm while a lot of analog needs a "COSI" clip-on. Digital can also be readily run during the day. Good Gen2 tubes with good specs will beat most digital for "combat" use, but digital keeps inching along. There is higher-end digital too, the Binock NVG-90 and the ADNV stuff, but that gets into analog prices. No known consumer digital can compete with well-specced G3 tubes.>something unrelatedAlso unrelated, Gilliam Technical Services just released a video on their 9969 TiB2-SiC plate. Guessed right, strike face is from Adept. It's a monkey model Colossus for less that weighs less. One .30-06 M2AP (thought this was supposed to be M993-rated). Backyard. You guys know the drill.>*sips*https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=JjSvn8qup_o&
>>64414891Just a dainty old belt that can be attached to suspenders does the trick. A small little upgrade is threading bungee cord from one end to the other to silence the pouches. The only thing that would attach to the suspenders at chest level would be a lil compass pouch or holding an angled flashlight.
>>64432725ty. Nice picture. I'm using the lbt for my belt kit and the buckle is not very friendly.
>>64432725>wuggypost your plate carrier with the upside down mags
Guy asking for hunting at night advice still hasn't acknowledged that you can't hunt with irons with night vision.
>>64433441he has special eyes and is a special man
>>64433499
>>64431984I lurk /arg/ way too infrequently to be living rent free. You should shoot your guns and use your gear. It’s more fun then shitposting randos online
>>64432491It’s a nice pack and fits how I’d expect but I just can’t find the sweet spot between the two items but I’ll see dudes running backpacks and buttpads.
>>64431887>>64433764You can either do the "Loot sack" or get a shorter more squat pack. WGWS is right that having it resting on buttpack is the objective but if your pack is too long obviously thats going to try to strangle you like a poorly fitted PFD>LootsackLoot sack method is basically putting buttpack contents in a tiny silypoly overbag and when you run your ruck you just pull the lootsack out and place into the top of the ruck. When ditching ruck you pull loot sack and place in buttpack. Pros are ability to have a much larger ruck and access to modern hiking packs. Cons are that the modern ruck is going to have difficulties with hip belts.OR >Shorter squat packModern backpacks are designed to be long and tall so they can place the kidney straps correctly on the hips and distribute weight. When wearing belt kit you basically already have a hipbelt so anything designed to work around a second hipbelt is going to be kinda shit. The brits have a concept of short vs long back bergens wherein the shortback ones are designed for normal wear for absolute manlets (sub 5'6") and the long backs were for adults. That said, if you intend to wear web kit people will immediately swap to the short back so they end up with a bergen thats nice and short to sit atop the ruck as described by WGWS. Domestically bags like the LBT 3 day and Platatac spur pack will be modern and meet that short and squat requirement. Pros: You get a ruck shelf with the web kit so it makes it very easy to put the ruck on and stand up and move. Cons: Ruck size more limited and ruck less optimal standalone.I opt for the shorter squat packs because I like the surplus PLCE bergens and the spur pack. I dont find myself wearing assault packs with the belt kit because I like big buttpacks I cannot deny.
>>64433441What if you hit them with some glow in the dark paint?
>>64433847victim of the latest chinese directed energy weaponpoor lad never stood a chance
For me its the ALICE pack
>>64433931Then the deer would see you and you lose your tactical advantages.
>>64433947ALICE doesn't live here anymore.
>>64433214Played urself>>64433847Waiting on an improved outer LBE belt that isn't just a "flat" ring, but is contoured with a higher back section and lower front section to properly rest on the hips. Biggest complaint I have about the HSGI is that it is just a "straight" flat ring.
>>64433931It doesn't work. I went to a night vision event thinking I could shoot my handgun with irons under nods - after all, it worked when I was trying it at home! Boy was I wrong, it doesn't work whatsoever. The night vision can't focus on both the irons and the target. Irons do not work under nods.
>>64433214>upside down mags>>64433968This is the meta where you use gravity assit to reduce mag removal fro. The pouch and retain strength, speed and agility. This is the tactical operator's protip that will help you survive and thrive in the post-apocalyptic wasteland. I'm just doing the opposite of this because I am a rebel without a cause and a defiant boomer-to-be. Join with me and fight the meme, we will die with dignity.
>>64433990Akshully it is about opening up space at the front top of the carrier, and truly it is a bit more ergonomic to pull the mag out in a downward motion and insert it into the firearm with an upwards motion, than to pull the mag out in an upwards direction, reverse direction to get it below the gun, then insert the mag with an upwards direction, but I digress, the real benefit is the real estate up top.
>>64432687It doesn’t sit well on the hips ime. That moment you create by pushing justThe buttpack down sucks after a while.
>>64433847This was helpful. Didn’t know they made specific shorter packs that sit above the buttpack
>>64433738It's more fun than*Opinion discarded, because you're 5'3" and brown.
real NV on sale for $1,250, just saw the deal. https://www.argusnvs.com/products/argus-pvs14-monocular-night-vision-1
>>64434049>>64434040https://www.ebay.com/itm/187473397296?_skw=virtus+40L+pack&itmmeta=01K8941ABESJP1TDH4S73Z8J3Y&hash=item2ba6490630:g:ElIAAeSwA1Vold7I&itmprp=enc%3AAQAKAAAA8FkggFvd1GGDu0w3yXCmi1cGvQg3FIGQXuSz1BcibxUK7sEmRspwA%2BQ587TYketvd68%2B%2BL13WR8Osljcsua%2F0mdwW0c8ywXk6G1s%2BTsuo8M0P5B2jrCb1bLNI%2Fnaje9o7DvVF6MDANe%2Bg2infJok2r7Cj278OiiD3iKQ2KBIxTi3Iq4t8mdrcp%2BrCk3JD9mGx07qa7Pq%2B6ykBH1RhP0Swq5nYmDzYEJlNaoR6dg%2BgzwntYwxUUqJR1EaZQXa98RDj6S0y%2BXQCyYd1fYTETi5YuLMWm68U5KR3d9R3ewqhimP3Dd%2F6sYPj%2BvgKgZexVenCg%3D%3D%7Ctkp%3ABk9SR-ilhaTCZgThat is the pack I use, 40L is honestly pretty conservative, but it has zip sides that can accept the 5L, 7L, 9L, 13L, side pouches, and/or a 17L assault pack zipped on, so it is very expandable and modular up to what, 73L or so? Plus the capacity of the belt rig set up? The buttpack totally gets pushed down. I've taken to hooking my stock onto the cobra buckle in front to use the weight of the gun and my arms to push the front of the belt down to rotate the rear up. I've hiked over 40 miles in 3 days this way, plus vert. That being said, I REALLY wish someone would make a tactical web rig belt that wasn't just a simple ring in a single plane, but rather had a contour such that the rear was higher than the fronts. Maybe the CRYE AVS is worth a try? See the contour which effectively puts the front of the belt lower than the rear? This might help to offset the feeling of the rear sagging, which IME is the biggest problem with these setups.
>>64432570I lost the war my men had no contour in their belts and they sagged on the way to engage the enemywe r reddit naow i surrendered
>>644342211. KC anon isnt brown I sold him my ACOG and met him in person2. Im not KC anon
>>64434049Cheers.I really like the spur pack, with a fat buttpack it holds a decent amount of shit and the way the hip pad works it just will sort of splay out when using it with belt kit but will curve you when running standalone. I wish they made one in a larger size but I just use the PLCE shortback for that. Wug's terrible link is the Virtus shortback that replaced PLCEProgression of packs went; ODG PLCE -> DPM PLCE -> MTP Virtus. If your're surplus maxxing there were a couple other countries that copied the PLCE bergen and made use of them as well. If you hate surp then look at kitmonster, dragon supplies and similar bong companies.Crossfire sort of works as well but has more of a defined frame I dont like for belt kit.>>64433936many such cases
>>64434552Damn nigga he didn't even mention me
>>64434674Kek didn’t mean to send shots at you just know arg retards thought it was funny calling you brown so I assumed he had us confused >>64434431The big question being how much contour is needed before the belt becomes unusable normally. Seems the simplest option is get a short pack that sits high as fuck on your back or skip the buttpack unfortunately. Seems like it’s a universal issue trying to make the two work toghether
Do I go with a medium or large ALICE pack?
where do you sell all your shit in bulk
>>64435767ebay and set the minimum price at what you'd be happy with
>>64434959alice pack fucking sucks>inb4 9000 alice fag replies
>>64435791you fucking suck
where do you get pic related??? Seems unabtanium
my $30 huntvp backpack is good enuff
>>64435784I'm perma banned on there
>>64435819You can get similar here plus a vest. $225https://www.catalystsurplus.com/product-page/point-blank-plate-carrier-1Try ebay, tacswap.
>>64435823Ah shit are you the same guy that got permabanned before like a year ago?Maybe make an account under your wife or mom or something. Ebay also monitors IPs so things get tricky.
>>64435791It's poorfags first framed pack. I don't mind them myself though, I remember what it was like to be poor.
>>64435829i need just the insert thank you Thing is it seems so rare Idon't think anyones selling it
>>64435915Stealth armor systems can get you similar-cut IIIA.
>>64435925thanks but its not gonna be the same thing as government made/issued current year shit
>>64435936Do you need it to replace a lost set or are you just looking to run it behind SAPI family plates that need it?
these can't stop a 9mm like American pasgt right?
>>64425627>>64425023InLasik back in 97 when it was pricey and I had perfect vision for 23 years, now a little nearsighted again. >>64428280Based buckshot enjoyer>>64430086LEAF GTX shells are way over $600, more like twice that. I had one the .gov paid for and it lasted many years. Currently enjoying the OTTE eVent patrol parka. I’ve see PCU L6’s for cheap.
>>64435958Depends on exact kind of 9mm and the velocity, along with condition and angle of the armor. That stuff is very old at this point and storage conditions will impact performance, especially since it's way before 0101.06, I think it's "0101.03-era" like the Italian PE plates and basically anything went at that point.
>>64435987>three (3) different types of ammo on his pcwhymst
so since you niggers have autism and hate RMA what's the next best plate that's 5.5 lb for 10x12 and is level IV with sub 1 inch thickness? Give me your recs. Preferably LTC/Hesco.
>>64436084rifle, handgun, breaching and counter FPV drone shotgun. I'm thinking based. Bit light on rifle mags imo, I only see three
>>644361092 extra handgun mags seems excessive but fair enough
>>64436103>5.5 lb for 10x12We've gone over this before, the 10x12 1165 isn't actually 10x12. It is closer dimensionally to a SAPI S but with bottom corner cutouts. It also doesn't have drop foam typical of an 0101.06 plate, so there are durability concerns similar to the Highcom 4SAS4. It's 6.3lb SAPI M. Hesco plates are usually no more than 0.2-0.3lb lighter for the 10x12 versus SAPI M 9.5x12.5 because their "nominality" is a lot less than RMA.The 4601 is a much stronger plate but goes over your thickness target, and it's also expensive. 4403 is close price-wise but much heavier at 7.7lb, albeit NIJ certified like the 4601. Do you need full Level IV or are you just looking for an M855A1 solution with headroom? Both LTC and Highcom have very strong III+ options. It's worth noting III plates have required multi hit at 2" minimum shot spacing and IVs do not. Honestly, look into surplus ESAPIs too. I also saw Buff's new vid came out. Will look at it tomorrow.
>>64436127>Both LTC and HighcomMeant to say LTC and Hesco here, lol, I was thinking of the 3S9M but forgot Highcom plays the same nominal games as RMA.
>>64436109Do people not put their pistol mags on their belt anymore? If I don't have my pistol on me then I don't care about carrying pistol mags, don't want ammo for a gun I don't have.
>>64436127what are some LTC III+ options then? I admire the autism and explanations.
>>64435987Dude, put some pants on, you sicko.
>>64436140LTC 19513, good for 6x 7.62x51mm M80 with 2" spacing or multiple M855A1. 5.25lb for an honest 9.5x12.5 SAPI M. It would weigh 4.5lb if it used RMA style sizing. 1.1" thick. IIIs are thicker than many IVs because they have the composite backer necessary to stop multiple .308 under 44mm BFD with tight spacing. IVs only need to stop one hit of M2AP with <44mm BFD. See >>64414823and >>64414845 for how RMA 1155s and XRTs do against .308. Two shots beat the old 1155 at 100 meters. The XRT nearly goes over 44mm BFD versus M80 because it's a thinned IV, aka an SRT plate. The Hesco 3411 is a little heavier than the 19513 but has NIJ cert and picks up BZ API protection. Either one is solid. For your case try and get some ESAPIs, REV. G or later with soft armor.
Pistol mags/holster on flc yay or nay? Wondering If I should delegate those to a belt. Trying to hit that just right spot in setup.
lol buffman is getting ripped in the 1165 comments because he wasn't allowed to drop test the plates.
>>64436248Add it the sketchy shit RMA has pulled. I can't believe he didn't do at least one plate. Hopefully he'll buy his own and test it with a drop. Also that back face deformation doesn't look good, I doubt these will be certified by the NIJ.
>>64436078pasgt still stops 9mm in 2025
>>64436538>>64436248lmaoSo RMA was like "we gonna send you plates to test, but you CAN'T drop test them or we'll sue!"?Fr that puts Buffman in a shitty situation. And another thing to add to the RMA list.
>>64436798The only thing stopping him from going rogue and dropping the plates anyway is potentially losing his affiliate relationship with RMA.>>64436538RMA said they'll do a foamed version at some point and submit that for .07. My math says it'll be 6.7lb and 0.9"For anyone looking at these, RMA told Buff to not drop these for a reason. This is a repeat of the 4SAS4 situation. If you ever need to dive on the plates it is probable they will be ineffective against stated threats afterwards. Way to vindicate the steel fudds on this one, RMA. I hope they ship these better than Tacticalshit did the 4SUS4s. Tap and torque will not work. Like tbe 4SUS4, which passed those checks but failed Buff's first test, you will need to xray.>inb4 RMA said this is normal for mid and high end platesThe Highcom 4S16, Hesco 4800, and a bunch of .04 holdouts from Protech (9812-R1), Highcom (4SSS2) and LTC (23600 / 23610), do not comprise the entire mid and high end armor market.
>>64437010>RMA said they'll do a foamed version at some point and submit that for .07. My math says it'll be 6.7lb and 0.9"Why not just release it with foam to begin with? Who the fuck would buy the no-foam version? You'd literally have to be RETARDED.
>>64437130One part deception and the other part 0101.07's drop protocol is still a WIP. If you go on the 1165's page you will find no mention of the lost drop foam. This has been true with the original 1165 as well.>At only 5.5lbs (Shooter’s Cut) and 0.7″ thin with multi-hit level 4/RF3 protection, there’s nothing else like the 1165 Gen2, anywhere close to the same price.>The 1165 Gen2 combines our all-new Hypure Alumina strike face with Dyneema UHMWPE for incredible weight reduction without sacrificing performance.>without sacrificing performanceThat's the fuckup line. Because they said Level IV and did not say .04, the natural inference is that this is capable of meeting 0101.06, which is the current standard that DEFINES what Level IV is, and that includes conditioning tests - which RMA told Buff specifically not to do. This plate is deceptive just like the 4SUS4. Also, if the manufacturer specifies multi-hit Level IV then it needs to be able to stop M2AP with minimum 2" (51mm) spacing. Good luck with that.
>>64437173>0101.07's drop protocol is still a WIP.It's BS. They're saying that they are going to make the drop protocol easier, so any foam layer that works for .06 should work here.Also, doesn't their new 1155 have foam anyway? Or not? Who the fuck knows, lol...
>>64437197Their argument is that it doesn't make sense to foam the 1165 until they can determine how much foam is needed. They want to minimize weight. The 1155 does have foam, you can tell from the thickness and areal density increase from the 1165. The 1155 is fiberglass (they're still calling it PE, lol) backing the new Hypure alumina. The 1165 on paper just keeps the strike face and replaces the glass with Dyneema UHMWPE. Also they did test the 1155 conditioned. In the test reports the 1165 was not dropped.They need to have a big fat disclaimer that the 1165 is a .04 plate or inevitably someone is going to treat it rough, it's not going to work (why else would RMA shitcan the Buff drop test...) , and RMA will have two lawsuits on their hands. Just because Highcom doesn't disclose the 4S16's lack of foam either, and Apex lying and saying it does, doesn't make this okay.
lol this guy tested plates in the future.
Best way to mount cheaper electronic ear pro to an Ops Core bump?
>>64437869By buying 3m range guards, putting gel cups on them and using standard comtac mounts. You might have to do unity mark's over the OE comtac mounts, it all comes down to head shape and helmet sizing no real good way to predict which works best imho>But I already have X Y or Z Good, put them aside for when you dont want to wear a helmet
>>64437886Conveniently I have none yet to put aside
>>64437896Rangeguards are my favorite budget earpro. I wear them a lot while just doing CCW shit or zeroing. The chinese gel cups on amazon make them a 9/10 experience. Be wary of fake comtac rail mounts
>>64437911Word. Thanks. Hopefully the mounts will work, helmet is gonna be an XL
>>64437911Fake comtac rail mounts work fine. I have them on my chinkshit helmet and they genuinely work.
>>64436146You guys wear pants? That explains the weird looks. >>64436084Well anything on the home will probably be addressed with an SBS, and I haven’t built a belt rig up yet. Moved some stuff around. >>644361093 rifle mags is light, I’m gonna get a 6 mag pouch to add as needed. I think 3 is fine for some basic lawlessness in my golf course community. Also working on getting a rear pack/htdration. Rear pack:hydration.
>>64438199I’ve used that print more than anything else when I was OTJ. I have a small ASP baton mirror who ch Mindy for corners and attics.
>>64438199If you need a baller GP pouch the IDOGEAR tall one is fantastic. I can fit three 12 gauge 10 round mags in it with no difficulty. It's under $30 too.Haven't tested it under IR yet.
>>64438385>Havent tested it [...] yetFTFYIdogear is chinkshit junk, very fitting for turkshit shotgun rig so you can cosplay as a mexican or detroit security guard.
>>64438405>mexican security guardAction-packed and based to me. I'll let you know if they ever blow out on me. Maybe some of my turkshit shotgun luck will rub off on the pouches.
>>64438385I want a vertical GP pouch and DESU that IDOGear IFAK is great, and it was like $25, so I’d check them out again.
>>64438506Here it is senor.https://www.ebay.com/itm/157259957765?
>>64438405Didn't you know? Chinkshit gets recommended here now. How far /gq/ has fallen.
>>64438580I preferred a dead thread over /gqpfgbag/
>>64438580What kind of chink shit? A mount? Fine. A pouch? Probably fine. Night vision? No no no nonoo.
>>64438535Thanks fren, that is exactly what I had in mind. I’m not going to be deploying on too many ops so I think it will outlast me.
>>64438580If only American pouches were the same price and juzzasgood. Condor versus IDOGEAR? I'm leaning Ido. The Chinese have made significant headway in armor, which the guy you're replying to has said is workable before. Their thermals are world class. Nobody can beat that Oneleaf on value. Their LAMs are great. Holosun sights are great. China is more "wild west" than it is universally shit.
>>64414891Bongaloid PLCE are going for cheap right now. I've heard recommendations for the paratrooper version as the mesh is comfy. If you go this route, get the hippo pad, too. Otherwise, build your rig up from an H-harness that you find comfortable. Here's one Anon's take on it.
>>64438605you forgot /nvg/, but yeah this is the state of play right now. If you want a dead thread start /gq/ on an altchan and enjoy the... one post per month?>>64438637Glad to help.
buying china is based
>>64437010Buffman did have the 4sas4 x-rayed, zero cracking on the ceramic. I still want to know why the fuck the ceramic didn't show any signs of cracking. It has to be the backer delamination. He said he sent it off to be water jet cut but has completely fell silent on that. >>64437130Because then they couldn't go "look how light and thin these plates are".
>>64438628Jerry Infiray is good stuff. You can get gen3 thermal-fused binos for $6k. You'll never hit that price with American tech.
>>64438757Thermals you basically have no choice, they're all chinkshit. But the straight night vision is not going to be too great.
>>64438737Buffman is wishy-washy on why the 4SAS4 failed. His current position is that he doesn't know why, and it's really just a one-shot basic Level IV. He's silent about that 6x BZ API report he talked about. See comments in the 1165 vid. He said the backer was trash right after the first test, supporting your position, then said the drop compromised the plates, then now said he doesn't know a year later.I think Highcom / Chase aren't letting him talk. He got quizzed on the 1192 problem and is similarly quiet.
>>64438776They're improving but it'll be a minute before they're at good gen3. Their thermals are no-contest superior on price and value.Armor I'm wishy-washy on only for quality control concerns. Militech basically only has youtubers and a handful of test reports, and they're the top shelf openly Chinese outfit. They beat RMA up badly because their PE is cheaper than American fiberglass. Also they make SiC strike faces for a fraction of Bitossi.
/nvg/gers, I got an email from steele about a new(?) recorder and it seems to be a decent price.
>>64438737They're still getting their asses ripped up in Buff's comments. RMA prolly fucked up by thinking people wouldn't remember the 4SUS4 and what happens when drop protection isn't there. This should have been the "1165LV" released after the foamed version.Never seen RMA get caned this bad outside of here.
Now that it's starting to get cold out, is there an inforgraphic for layering properly? Also what sites are good for getting clothing? I'm thinking about getting some merino wool base layers from smartwool. Maybe some gloves and a balaclava too.
>>64439545>merino wool base layersyeahI like surplus waffle layers but the civilian market has good options too, maybe better.>inforgraphic from the army
>>64439558 (me)and what each layer is
>>64439532good. fuck RMA for making this bullshit, acting like it's their gift to the world and fuck buffman/mac for shilling for them. I got ripped off falling for the 4sus4 meme and got my money back and kept the plates when tacticalfaggotry didn't allow me a return or response after 2 weeks. my cc issued me a chargeback and I promptly put that towards a set of 4403MCs which are heavier, but are larger, fit better and actually work for the money. there are better options but I don't want to spend a couple grand on plates.
>>64437457...its October 2025 right now, 10/25 is fine.
>>64439847Same, got them as a backup set now, but honestly wouldn't trust them as far as I could drop them. I do wish someone made a covert car seat cover/organizer that you could slide a plate into. That would be neat to throw in the car for the fuck of it. Right now they sit in the window frame of my office.
There's no /nvg/ up right now, so I figured I would ask here. Have you guys had your PVS14 not turn on until you rescrew the battery cap? >Battery in correct orientation, not turning on>unscrew and screw back in battery cap>pvs14 turns back on Battery doesn't show any corrosion
>>64439847Based>>64439983Also based>4SUS4I think the easiest explanation for the 4SUS4's failures is that Highcum made the strike faces in 2022 (this is known), they sat in storage exposed for two years, and they were not bonded to backers and wrapped until 2024 - at which point no QC was done because people were getting plates with bad labels and which didn't tap / torque. They were just flipping them out the door no shits given because Highcum needs money (they're financially in poor shape - this is also known).>RMAThe old specter of the 1192 came home to roost in the comments too and Buffman's "variance!" explanation held zero water. It makes no sense that the plates can simply vary by 0.625lb, which is a huge range, and then the two he got be literally the same weight and thickness. His 1165s were also right on with the 1165s sent to labs. So there really isn't major variances even with these "non-CPL'D" plates and his 1192s were 10oz heavier and 0.19" thicker than advertised for... well... you can be the judge of why.IMO, these affiliate agreements youtubers have with armor companies cause a lot of problems.
>>64432728Gilliam just updated all their models to have a big "DROP TESTED" sign. lol they are gunning for RMA so bad. Their 1023 does mog the 1155, but only because they use import materials and Chinese PE is cheaper than American fiberglass.
>>64440349without knowing fuck all about nvgs or anything in general I would guess you have a poor contact point in the cap or housing
just recently got comms. will likely get a gmrs license when government reopens, and ham license down the roadalso going to get cb next month most likelywhat do you guys use? everythings good but whats the cool pretend army guy bands to use? i imagine most of you are gmrs guys if I had to guess
>>64442019>what do you guys use?Baofeng. I don't have anyone to talk to.
>>64442019Leixen UV-25D. A lot of the guys here don't really care about legal transmitting, so ham band radios are ideal. Radtel has some promising but untested options that can transmit across CB, VHF, and UHF bands. RT-880 and RT-950 Pro. However, they lack the security / encryption features of radios from other manufacturers.
Quick infographic on Stealth Armor Systems, the current makers of Dragonskin and Hexar flexible rifle armor. The information surrounding what versions do what is somewhat confusing so I made this infographic to clear things up.Basically SAS has the same issue as Gilliam Technical Services where they keep coming up with new stuff and their own testing runs behind. For example, there's three versions of Level IV Dragonskin, the B4C standalone 7.25lb version, the SiC ICW IIIA 8.2lb 1.4" thick version Buff tested years ago to stop really heavy shit like .338 Lapua Swiss P AP at 2,699ft/s, and then a TiB2-SiC "2024" version using ceramic supplied by Adept that in theory should provide similar performance to the SiC version but for less weight. Only one you can buy right now is the B4C, and it's 7.25lb / $1,200 for a single panel. Hard bargain in terms of weight-price but the multi-hit in theory is robust.
