The Hunters and Anglers act passed the house 215-202, almost entirely but not quite on party lines. there was 1 nay, 7 yays and 15 no votes that weren't on party lines. This bill would ban the secretaries of the interior and agriculture from banning leaded ammo (and fishing weights) in national parks and is in response to a 2022 executive order banning leaded ammo in national parks https://www.nps.gov/pinn/learn/nature/condor_video.htm>use full copper bullets, they penetrate deeperfinna spray and pray my lead all around the national parks when this passes >there are multiple federal government web pages for multiple different fed agencies pushing the virtue of using lead free ammo as a superior hunting projectile because it has less fragmentation and deeper penetration
>>64996168Good. But I will say I hunt with Barnes TSX now almost exclusively if it's available for the caliber I take out that day. Nothing against lead, I miss using it on waterfowl as much as the next man who remembers how great it was for ducks, and how CHEAP. However after testing at elevated lead levels, I avoid using it on anything I intend to eat.
>>64996177I should also mention it has fantastic terminal effect, but you need to prioritize speed. I wasn't impressed by the 180gr 30-06 but when I dropped down to the 150gr oh boy does it smack a doe. The 62gr out of a 14.5" was also gnarly and turned a heart to actual mush on a nice 8pt.
I'm sure this applies to no one but me. Winchester has zinc rifled shotgun slugs for smooth bores, but it's winchester so idk how good or available they are.Brenneke has 2 SKUs for discarding sabot tin slugs. Both 2/3rd oz slugs, made from food safe tin and the brenneke site says they are fine from rifled barrels or smooth bore with any choke. both are 12 gauge 2 3/4 inch. One is advertised as being super accurate out to 35 meters and the other has way, way higher muzzle energy and is advertised as only having 1.6 inches of drop at 100 yards if you zero it an inch high at 75 yards or an inch and a half high at 50 yards
>>64996168I agree with not using it for hunting purposes for health reasons. If you don't mind cool but I do, already get enough lead exposure from recreational shooting.Im mostly glad because banning lead ammo is a slippery slope and do not want to begin it.
>>64996232This, the slippery slope is real and I like being able to target shoot with cheap ammo.
>>64996168Using lead to hunt land game, outside of a watershed or away from a marine environment yeah okay. But using lead shot for goose hunting or dove hunting in a water wild life area should always be bad. Don't put lead in the water. I don't want to be like those Chinese towns where they legally prevent people from moving there or leaving, because everyone's got generational genetic deformities and disabilities from all the lead in the ground water.Shoot it in the burm. Hunt a deer with it idc, even on a national Forest go crazy. Just not near over or in a body of water please. Unless it's camp perry. Don't fuck with my camp perry
>>64996168you sissy LIBERALS probably want to us to use ONIONS bullets for pete's sake. Back in my day, we had lead in our gasoline, lead for our pipes, and lead in our paint and we turned out just fine. This country was FOUNDED by REAL AMERICANS who used LEAD to free us from sissy red coats who wanted to tax us like democrats.God bless
>>64996698>goose hunting or dove hunting in a water wild life areayou mean duck?
>>64996713>sent from Bob's iphone using taptalk
Lead, and other metals and pollutants are excreted through sweating. Melanin is an extremely effective chelator of heavy metals. So getting a good amount of sun, and making yourself sweat a lot (sauna, hot water immersion, etc) is an extremely effective way to remove lead from the body. It's also just a really good way of detoxing environmental pollutants in general, including microplastics. Brian Johnson made that sauna video where he was able to reduce his serum microplastic levels by like 90% with just a month of daily 20 minute sauna sessions.
>>64996918are niggers immune to heavy metals and microplastics?
>>64996918I forgot what board I was on and I was about to /pol/ reply
>>64996168Why do you faggots use words such as "yay" and "nay" instead of basic "yes" and "no"? Honest question.
>>64997023
>>64996232>>64996647Kind of goofy to insist on slippery slope for lead ammunition and fishing weights being banned in national parks... Which is like 1% of US wildlands. The whole point of these places is that they receive special protections. I would agree with you if it was a ban on all USFS/BLM land but it wasn't and this kind of thing makes gun owners own the stereotype of being the worst class of outdoor enthusiasts (though shitbags littering does most of the heavy lifting for that). Obviously this issue is pretty marginal compared to what mining companies do but there is plenty of evidence that recreation derived lead does cause problems, notably with the California Condor which is now bordering extinction with lead poisoning as the leading cause of death, but also with bald and golden eagles who scavenge carcasses, loons who swallow fishing weights, and broad swaths of bird species are at risk because of how their digestive systems work. It takes very little exposure to kill most birds, and local population surveys show the incidence is very high in some areas (30% of birds tested showing high levels of lead in their systems is a frequent number). I don't think this is a cynical gun grabber thing, there is a reason lead shot is banned for waterfowl.
>>64996168The lead came out of the ground in the first place so what's the big deal about putting it back into the ground?
>>64996168>LIBRULS WONT LET US POISON LAND SET ASIDE FOR FUTURE GENERATIONS?>NOT IN MY AMERICABoomer moment. National parks aren't for hunting anyway. Ban ammunition entirely.
>>64996168Lead pollution is not from bullets. The California condor that is the only real example people can point to was suffering from lead poisoning from legacy gas being dumped into the ground and lead paint on fire and water towers. The amount of lead in bullets and shot is doing absolutely nothing to the environment. Lead is in many places still used in collars and flashing on homes. You are not getting lead poisoning from handling it. You are not getting any levels of lead in your system from shooting. People still shoot and handle lead ball on a regular basis even in advanced age and do not test for elevated lead levels. If you are testing high lead levels you may want to check your work, home environment as well as your water source, cooking tools.
>>64996177Barnes VorTx is very consistent. It's sub-MOA in my .308 compared to about 3 MOA for surplus M80.I clean up fishing line and stuff from my local lakes. I never have to buy my own lures. I've collected several pounds of lead. Most of it is huge weights used by retarded catfish anglers. Like, one catfish weight is as much lead as 50+ normal line weights.The only thing lead is really needed for is airgun pellets.
>>64996168Does that happen with lead bullets that aren't jacketed?
>>64997023why are you an ugly, gay and retarded thirdie?
anyone against this is a fucking idiot. lead is incredibly hazardous and damaging to ecosystems.
>>64998577wait I misinterpreted the article.this is a ban on -BANNING- lead?what the absolute fuck? we're run by blithering idiots. fucking hell.
>>64997522how else would you control wildlife in the parks?
>>64998277it's a function of velocity. pretty much all high velo bullets are jacketed to keep them together and to stop lead fouling. they also cherry picked a bad bullet. some bullets just dump their mass with like 13% retained, but partitions retain 70% of their mass and bonded bullets retain 90%+, close to 100% and comparable to lead free which also retain close to 100% of their masshttps://www.sciencedirect.com/science/article/pii/S0048969723049136>>64997738.22lr and other cheap range ammo
>>64998585>we you write like a bong
>>64996723Where I used to live in northern Ohio a lot of the good dove hunting was in wetlands areas, and there you are required by the state dnr regulations to hunt them with steel shot. In my own personal experience I've found the ballistics, on doves specifically, with steel #7 shot to be superior to lead #7 shot. But that's just how I feel esoterically. I have no real way whatsoever of validating or testing or proving that. I just feel like I have a higher hit and kill ratio.
>>64997152>Kind of goofy to insist on slippery slope for lead ammunition and fishing weights being banned in national parks... Which is like 1% of US wildlands.I know but the government has proven that if you give them an inch with gun guntrol they take a mile. They'd have to repeal the entirety of the NFA before I'd ever be willing to negotiate on any form of gun or gun related item ban again.Repeal the NFA and I'll be down with banning lead ammo for example. The NFA was proof the government can never be trusted and the only way to undo that mistake is to undo the NFA.
>>64997669>People still shoot and handle lead ball on a regular basis even in advanced age and do not test for elevated lead levelsYou are unironically getting exposed to more lead shooting a high volume of jacketed ammo than people shooting bare lead because of primers and handling steel targets. And the fact that you're just going to be shooting a lot more.
>>64998918yeah, I refuse to >shoot indoors>shoot steel that isn't like the permanent ones at 200yd at my range>shoot without showering w/ d-lead shampoo after & d-lead detergent for washing clotheshoward Hughes levels of paranoia is worth it for keeping lead outta yer system
>>64997669>The amount of lead in bullets and shot is doing absolutely nothing to the environment· 46-47% of eagles have chronic lead poisoning (2022): Slabe, V. A., et al. "Demographic implications of lead poisoning for eagles across North America." Science, 375, 779–782. DOI: 10.1126/science.abj3068 · 4% population growth suppression (2022): Slabe, V. A., et al. Science. DOI: 10.1126/science.abj3068 · 5% annual population decline in Northeast (2022): Hanley, B. J., et al. "Population impact to bald eagles by ingested lead in New York State, 1990–2018." Wildlife Society Bulletin. DOI: 10.1002/wsb.1444 · 30% of PA eagles had lead (2006-2016): Pennsylvania Game Commission data via Pittsburgh Post-Gazette. https://post-gazette.com/life/outdoors/2024/07/11/lead-poisoning-bald-eagle-impact/stories/202407090071· 33% of caseload at Tamarack Wildlife Center: Tamarack Wildlife Center records via Pittsburgh Post-Gazette. · 67% of adult Condor deaths from lead (1992-2009): Rideout, B. A., et al. "Patterns of mortality in free-ranging California Condors." Journal of Wildlife Diseases, 48(1), 95–112. PMID: 22247378 · 98,985 lead shot pellets per hectare (1976): Schranck, B. W., & Dollahon, G. R. "Lead shot incidence on a New Mexico public hunting area." https://www.jstor.org/stable/3781148 · 49% of adult loon deaths from lead (1989-2012): "Population-Level Effects of Lead Fishing Tackle on Common Loons." The Journal of Wildlife Management, 82(1), 155–164. JSTOR: 26609141 · 43% population reduction in New Hampshire: The Journal of Wildlife Management, 82(1), 155–164. JSTOR: 26609141 · 25% of loon deaths in Maine (1990-2016): MacDonald, B. S. "Lead Poisoning in Maine's Common Loons." https://umaine.edu/mitchellcenter/wp-content/uploads/sites/293/2019/04/MSWC19-Brooke-MacDonald.pdf
>>64998577>>64998585The NRA style of retarded gun owner will gobble this up instead of anything resembling an actual gun rights victory
>>64997738Surplus M80 is a horrible comparison to any civilian .308, including civilian FMJ target loads>t. has thousands of rounds of it stockpiled because it's cheap
we'll look back on this like asbestos (or leaded gas, I guess) pretty darn quickly.
>>64998586By reintroducing the natural predators humans exterminated.
>>64997152>Kind of goofy to insist on slippery slope for lead ammunition and fishing weights being banned in national parks... Which is like 1% of US wildlandsHave you been in a coma since 1993?
>>64998956OP is a fag who worded his post poorly. This bill reverses a previous measure that banned lead ammo in national parks, and additionally prevents agency heads from trying to do it again. Banning lead ammo will now require a formal act of Congress, if we wish to do it in the future.
>>64998967which is... kinda good? because then a grumpy admin can't take the ban back easily in the future (if the ban is codified in a proper law)
>>64998964Protecting the environment is far more important to me than your paranoid delusions about Jade Helm 2.
>>64996168National and state parks should have lead bans. An attempt should be made to have them be a step above "normal" public land in terms of ecological integrity.
>>64998982I don't know what the fuck Jade Helm 2 is. Is that some sort of liberal/leftist projection idea assigned to their "opponents" like the "pull yourself up by your bootstraps" phrase that nobody ever actually says?
I wouldn't mind prison sentences for people that litter in general, desu. Singapore has the right idea there.
>>64998586Arent national parks managed by park staff? My local one has a deer cull every year
>>64999002Its crazy how much duck hunters and ice fishermen litter. I got if you take a couple shots near dark and cant find your shells but the amount i find in some areas seems like no one is evening trying. And the bottles and cans of beer and gatorade, empty worm containers. Fucking bums, you'd think they hated nature.
>>64998995Then what exactly are you crying about?>advocating for environmental protection makes me a leftist/liberalI wish retards like you would go extinct already, but even after the boomer die off we will still have morons like OP who "finna spray and pray my lead all around the national parks when this passes". Draw your own conclusions on what kind of subhuman uses that locution exactly.
conservation is what all true Americans strive for.With that in mind, why yes we should in fact be QUICKSINK-ing foreign fishing vessels that dump equipment overboard.https://www.nature.com/articles/s41598-022-16529-0
>>64998990Could't agree more.
Shooting lead intended for your table is retarded. Doubly so if the backdrop is a fresh body of water.
>>64999019After sportsmen/target shooters who by far litter the most based on the residues I've seen all over the US, the fat fucks in their OHVs seemingly love dumping trash wherever they can. Americans in general have a littering problem amongst the population, but it's just strange to see it in the backcountry where you would think people would care more.
>>64999042>Shooting lead intended for your tableShooting lead at meat intended for your table*
>>64999055I wonder how Americans compare to other western countries in terms of littering. I assume there is a study or two out there
>>64999024Who's crying? You?>finna spray and pray my lead all around the national parks when this passesNot only was the lead ban a very recent thing that hasn't even gone into effect yet, nobody was "spraying and praying" in National Parks anyway.
>>64999071>the lead ban a very recent thing that hasn't even gone into effect yetThe why are you whining about 1993 anon?
>>64999080You're now incoherent, drifting off to other points. Are you even aware of what happened in 1994?
>>64999071>Not only was the lead ban a very recent thing that hasn't even gone into effect yet,BTW lead shot has been banned since 91 much to the consternation of geriatric retards. >>64999102You're projecting because you have no argument. Are you seriously comparing environmental protections to the AWB? I was right initially you are a paranoid idiot and can't even keep your years straight.
>>64999122Just out of sheer curiosity, were you here before 2022 or did you come with the NAFO bunkertroon invasion?
>>64999304I hate them as much as you do but this board along with /out/ really took a serious nosedive around covid and neither have recovered since. It is what it is but I use this board in particular much less than I did a decade agoTo my mind conservation is generally more important than almost any other political issue and we aren't talking about ripping rifles out of hunters hands here dude
You WILL give up your IQ-reducing ammo and your children WILL be smarter for it, even if it's too late for you Same as boomers and their leaded gasoline which is superior by all technical merits.
I just want to enjoy my favorite metal in peace.
There is no threshold for lead exposure to be harmful. This isn't some kooky slogan, decades of research has yet to find a safe minimum level.Fucking poorfags.
>bought 10k rounds of lead free 22lr before it was discontinuedphew
>>64996232>>64996647I mean, no lead outside the range seems feasible.But then you gunfags wouldn't have something to do. The ATF doesn't exist, no need for it.
>>64996922Not immune, but the increased retardation and aggression is so insignificant compared to the baseline that it isn't noticeable, unlike when humans are exposed to heavy metals.
>>64998941>jew science Fuck off. Reminder the same jew scientists who say smoking is bad for you literally rape and eat children.
>>64999410>>64999506The government has autistically been removing lead from consumer goods (and ruining them) in a misguided effort to "protect the hecking children" for 50 years. Guess what? The average IQ is going down. Not because of lead, but because America is getting browner and fatter. Being fat and brown makes you more stupid than literally eating lead paint. Couple a fat brown population with iPad babies and the IQ is going to drop to single digits in the coming years and lead will be entirely banned (as will guns bcause the slippery slope is fucking real). Stop believing in fake jew science and start living your fucking life.
>>64999589You know it's feasible that they speak true AND burn baby foreskin in moloch''s name every Sunday.
>be bird>don't have teeth>have to swallow rocks and use them to grind up solids in my finely tuned digestive organs>see a nice looking rock, perfect for my gizzard>swallow that shit>turns out it's bubbas spray and pray residue>my powerful gizzard micronizes that shit straight into my bloodstream>micronized lead shuts down my digestive neurons>everything I eat rots before I can digest anything with my paralyzed intestines, begin to starve no matter how much I eat>lead also shuts down my red blood cells and kidneys causing anemia and gout>die in horrible miserable pain after suffering weeks of starvation and ataxia
>>64999613Raptors don't digest that way.
>>64996168Can somebody explain the environmental bullshit arguments to me?Like if I take a pound of lead and dump it into a lake - will it dissolve over time or what's the issue here? How many rounds would I need to shoot into a tree or forest before it leaks into the water table or whatever at a meaningful level.I'd even ban lead ammo at indoor ranges before going after hunters. Like how many rounds are even expended during deer season totally? It's not like people are magdumping into bambi.
>>64999626Metallic lead goes nowhere. It simply stays put.In certain acidic conditions it can form compounds that are more bioavailable but most are also also insoluble and don't move.Organic lead compounds used in industry are both soluble and bioavailable. They were mostly banned before most here were born.
>>64999618Yeah they get their exposure from gut piles filled with micronized lead from hunters usually. Raptor stomach acid might even be more effiencient at transferring lead than the mechanical route though. I couldnt find a good picture of a lead poisoned loon, sue me
>>64999626>It's not like people are magdumping into bambi.every year on opening day I hear someone rip off 5-10 rounds. and that's from different places.
>>64999633So then I genuinely don't understand who or what is protected by banning lead ammo. Like this >>64999613 seems like a fucking stretch.
>>64999626Almost all the lead poisoning is from processed lead. Factories. Legacy gas that was dumped into the ground. Old buildings that still have lead paint. Transfer stations and landfills are full of every bird in the area and the amount of car batteries, lead mercury tech just running out into the local waterways and underground is mind boggling. You toss a roll of lead flashing into a lake and what will happen is absolutely nothing. Everything will be fine. If a duck eats a fish with lead shot in it the duck will just pass the lead shot and will not be affected. Of it is it is minimal. When kids were getting lead poisoning back in the day it was from lead dust, lead paint and ancient piping and collars where water and chemicals had been running through them for a very very long time. Ancient rome used lead pipes for drinking water. Even now scientist admit that hard water with no chemicals calcified over the lead pipes. There was no issue. However dies and glazing on pottery the romans used (processed) lead definitely messed them up.Short version. Bullets and guns are not causing lead poisoning. But the companies and products that are sure pay a lot to not have to take responsibility for what they are doing.
>>64999645It's a backdoor way to ammo bans in general.>>64999613 Is a stretch because it's completely fucking wrong.
>>64999637Lol. Probably followed by 7 hours of silence after bubba just cleared out half the county.
>>64999635>Gut piles with micronized lead in themAre you fucking retarded?
>>64999645>>64999650Before it was banned, lead shot killed an estimated 1.5-3 million waterfowl annually. The MBTA is almost 40 years old, is one of the most successful environmental regulations in history, and did precisely nothing to harm 2A. Insisting otherwise is fearing the demonrat boogeyman under your bed.
>>64999663Because I grew up in the woods, I can verify this is correect.There may be fewer bugs on windshields, which would be a laminar-flow aerodynamics improvement. But one thing's for sure, no doubt.There are a fuck of a lot more birds around than when I was a boy in the 1970s.Everyone else can get fuck.>opinions discardedWe have a lot of gear queer gunstore fags around here. They can lead at the range, and harvest from the sand, as we said and do. Should be free. If you can't take down geese with steel shot, you should probably get an AR and stick to the range, Grange.
>>64999648factually incorrect; you're comparing raw tonnage of lead versus the amount in parts of the ecosystem where it can be ingested/absorbed/used by animals. in that context, hunter/rec shooter bullets and shot is a massive problem.
>>64999648So it's the classic "individuals blamed for gigantic corporate fuckups" play? I figured as much. Some of us are old enough to remember when the government told us to put a brick in the toilet tank to save water meanwhile industrial farms used cities worth of water in a day.
>>64999648>If a duck eats a fish with lead shot in it the duck will just pass the lead shot and will not be affected.This is just flatly wrong. Lead is soft enough to be digested in one pass by animals with gizzards. Which is why it was banned. >>64999662>anon doesn't know that lead fragments when hitting tissue and bone I'm not the retard in this exchange
>>64999663>and did precisely nothing to harm 2A.Nontoxic shot costs more than lead and cost is a primary issue keeping younger people from hunting. It's death by a thousand cuts and you're celebrating new wounds. Kys
>>64999633>In certain acidic conditionsNigger, a tomato is acidic enough to make metallic lead bioavailable.
>>64999410>superior by all technical meritsFar from it. The lead came from tetraethyllead, which is an additive used to significantly increase the octane rating of gasoline. Important for back when gasoline production could vary greatly and getting consistently high octane fuel in places was difficult. Meaningless now when 86+ is absolutely everywhere. They still use it in some aviation fuels, though
>>64999663>>64999677The major source of lead was still sediment deposit from industry. Hunting was a minor input.Banning of leaded fuel happened at the same time and eliminated the major source. Neither sediment or shot was cleaned up after the bans but one was washed through the system.
>>64999683Metallic lead isn't really digestible. Lead salts and organic lead compounds are the problem, which don't really come from hunting
>um acktually sweetie while lead is horrible for the environment, you shouldn't care (and that's a good thing) because... other people also use lead!I am very smart
>>64999694>Metallic lead isn't really digestibleFucking lie. What do you think an acidic environment does to it? You should swallow some pellets right now to prove me wrong.
>>64997023they could at LEAST spell "yea" properly
>>64999694>Metallic lead isn't really digestible. In humans? Sure. But it certainly is when you have an organ that turns metallic fragments into microscopic particles, or when your stomach juices have the same pH as battery acid that chemically transforms metallic lead into lead chloride or lead acetate. Are you implying that lead poisoning in birds is entirely fiction?
>>64999708Not all environments are the same.Converting a non soluble metal to a non soluble compound is not that big of deal.
Thank fuck. Ever since California banned lead I assumed other cuck states were going to follow suit. This should be a bit of a bulwark against the latest antigun fuckery
>>64999688>a few extra dollars for the dozen rounds you might use is the factor keeping people from hunting and is in fact an insidious conspiracy It seems like you may have been exposed to too much lead
there are simply too many human beings for things such as "sustainability" and "natural ecosystems" to existpray for nuclear fire
>>64999613So i did look into this for a hot second:>(((finkelstein))) actually did a study in california>compared lead isotopes found in scavengers to storebought ammunition and known lead contamination in the environment>isotope ratio matches ammunition>ohcrap.jpg>sample size: 26 birdsOh but there's a follow up in 2012 you say?>sample size 110 birdsBruh.
>>64999597>The average IQ is going down
>>64999756How does the isotope ratio match?Lead in ammo is recycled from industrial sources.
>>64997120Such a good movie. God Bless the Jews, in Jesus' name, amen!
MORE LEAD MORE LEAD
>>64999733>there are simply too many browns for things such as sustainability to existFtfy
>>64999763They did have captive birds as a control group, but the actual comparison was modelling based on real ammo isotopes and known soil contamination rather than a forensic type confirmation.But given the low sample size (and i get it condors aren't exactly a super common bird) even a single outlier source like eating a dead animal that choked on an AA battery would change those numbers.
>>64999693>Hunting was a minor input. Again you are just wrong>However, the general consensus among wildlife biologists is that the primary sources of lead contamination in wildlife in Iowa and throughout the upper Midwest is through direct consumption of lead from spent ammunition or discarded fishing tackle.https://naturalresources.extension.iastate.edu/wildlife/lead-contamination-wildlife>Prevalence of elevated blood lead in black ducks declined by 44% from before (11.7% prevalence) to after (6.5% prevalence) the implementation of non-toxic shot.https://pubs.usgs.gov/publication/1003869If hunting were a "minor input," banning it would not have caused such a massive and immediate drop in mortality.
>>649997784 billion browns exist because 500 million white people keep giving them moneyall must die
>>64999597>the IQ is going to drop to single digits in the coming yearsBRAWNDO it's got what plants crave!
>>64999756I'm pretty sure there's only like ~150 California Condor individuals left
>>64999779The ammo and industrial sources are using the same lead though. They should not have an isotopic difference.
A huge part of the ethos of firearm ownership is responsible use. Doing what you can to not damage the environment is part of that responsibility. This shouldn't be controversial.
>>64999790>>64999792Yeah hence: >>64999779I'm not saying they deliberately tried to keep the sample size low, but it's very easy for this data to get skewed by single digit datapoints. I.e. multiple birds feeding on the same carcass or consuming any other lead source which barring unique isotope combos like leaded gasoline or paint would also be filed under ammo in this study.
>>64999780The lead from hunting was not removed from the environment though. There should have been no immediate effect from the ban.The ban on tetra-ethyl lead would have have produced an immediate effect as the contaminated water and sediment would more rapidly flow through the systems. IT was banned at at the same time.With no way to actually isolate the variables the studies are guessing.
>>64999756Can you link the studies? >>64999792Are you being paid to kill condors or something?
>>64999674Depends on the type of bird. Prairie species and shorebird aint doing so well.
>>64999804Many of the studies are linked to anti hunting groups. There is also very little work done to confirm them.I remember when the condor study initially claimed they were being poisoned by game that had been shot and left rather than gut piles. The numbers for that were rather suspicious. Now with the claim that it's from gut piles they are just as suspicious. Very few hunters are going to get lead in the gut, even with bullets fragmenting.
>>64999804Those studies were debunked. An independent group actually followed birds and scoured the area the testing was done. Birds in the California studies were found eating paint chips off fire towers that were found to have lead paint on them. Peeling lead paint. Same area same birds being tested the birds were found to be frequenting an area that thousands of gallons of legacy gasoline with lead in it had been dumped directly into the ground. Ammunition is not poisoning animals. What they did prove is they can't tell the difference from lead in gasoline, lead in paint chips, lead from bullets.
>>64999796It's very easy for bad actors to get thwir way these days. All they have to do is relate their agenda to a political extreme, and people's preconceptions do all the work for them. They could convince millions that literacy is bad just by saying that most/all books are written by liberals
>>64999792I sincerely doubt they're all using the same alloy, though.
>>64999820Can you link the independent group's findings? Nta but I'm following along and this sounds interesting
>>64999832Isotopic analysis has nothing to do with alloy. It's source and age of the lead.Alloy analysis might be more useful but the same properties used in bullets are useful in industry. Large amount of overlap between them. Since even the "pure" lead in bullets is from industry it's going to still have a similar alloy.
>>64999803>There should have been no immediate effect from the ban. The studies were done a ~decade after the MBTA. Of course the numbers go down when pollution is not being actively added to these ecosystems anymore >IT was banned at at the same time. It was banned with the Clean Air Act a full decade and change earlier than the MBPA. If the decline in duck blood lead levels was due to the gasoline ban, that decline should have been visible by the early 1980s (it wasn't, which completely invalidates your argument that leaded gas was the major source of pollution). Instead, researchers measured a 44% decline in lead exposure after 1991—specifically comparing 1986–88 (pre-ban, post CAA) to 1997–99 (post-ban, post CAA)>the studies are guessing.You aren't nearly as intelligent as you think you are
>>64999836I too would love to see this. Time to blow the academic liberal conspiracy wide open
>>64999839I thought they used certain isotopes for particular alloys, though. Lead from a given source being more readily refined to a desired alloy, but what the hell do I know
>>64999842The EPA started a phase out for lead in gas in the '70's. It wasn't banned for most automotive use until the mid 90's. It's still in use for race engines and planes.
>>64999792>The ammo and industrial sources are using the same lead though.I don't believe this is true, industrial sources are typically monolithic while ammunition is hugely varied
>>64999831Not to be that guy, but not reading drivel may actually be beneficial compared to consuming it without scrutiny.I don't want to derail the topic but the other day Glenn Beck tried to explain how Joe Kent is actually a palestinian agent and he wove this actually impressive net of semi-related half truths and lies where he connected Kent via his second wife to the greyzone, max blumenthal, alexander dugin and al jazeera and hamas, and the only connection was Kents wife wrote an article once about USAID spending. But meanwhile you will have a bunch of boomerslop consumers just slurping it up. >>64999832The alloy isn't the issue. What was investigated where pb isotopes. And all ammo is basically manufactured using scrap/recycled lead from industrial sources. The lead isotope combination in your ammo is indistinguishable from all other lead products sourced from the same source. Differences would present themselves if you for example hunted using a brand from bangladesh that was made with bangladeshi sourced lead. But that would also mean your lead is likely the same isotope ratio found in bangladeshi made car batteries or wheel weights.
>>64996177>However after testing at elevated lead levels, I avoid using it on anything I intend to eat.Generally speaking unless you subsist solely off of game, your lead levels are going to correlate much more significantly with how often you shoot, and if you shoot indoors.
>>64999848The MBTA wasn't overnight either, but in 1991 leaded gas made up less than 4% of the consumer market. The level of motivated reasoning you are displaying is kind of incredibleTo say nothing of the basic absurdity of>the birds aren't being poisoned by lead actively being deposited in their habitats and food chains, it's the highways and paint chips from 20 years ago!
>>64999854Why are lead free primers still so uncommon?
>>64999820>Those studies were debunked.So let me see them then.
>>64999867There was 100+ years of lead shot built up. None of that was removed after the ban went through. Even without any additional input there would still be a large amount of fowl being poisoned.Compare that to a source that is magnitudes more mobile and would clear out of the system comparatively fast.It seems perfectly reasonable that fowl were being poisoned by contaminated sediments. Without controlling variables in the studies though there is no way to actually prove a source. They may list likely hoods for their conclusions but ultimately it's still just educated guessing.
>>649998674% of the gas sold is magnitudes more lead into the environment than hunting.
hell I don't even want to live by a GA airport because the surroundings have elevated lead levels.
>>64999814>Very few hunters are going to get lead in the gut, even with bullets fragmenting.More baseless claptrap. Just because they aren't readily detectable doesn't mean they aren't there.https://www.nature.com/articles/s41598-025-20285-2?proof=t%29.
>>64999873lead free primers are eitherA) corrosiveorB) expire after a few years
Environiggers need to know that everyone hates them exactly because of how they're acting in this thread. "Oh it's just a little change! It's to save the environment! You won't even notice!" So we end up with toilets that don't fucking flush and 70,000 dollar cars that turn off at stoplights. Meanwhile Dow chemical dumps an oceanliner sized chunk of plastic into the ocean every day. Now they're coming for hunters meanwhile half the gas stations in the country and superfund sites. Environiggers will ALWAYS make your life slightly worse so giant companies can pollute freely. Fuck you.
>>64999903you are the problem, anon.you see everything as zero-sum.going to lead-free ammo would be a grand improvement. but, you're already brainwashed (you hate auto-stop) so I don't really see any reason trying to, reason, with you.:)
>>64999814The goal is to ban hunting. Jews hate hunting because they think it's not kosher. They will use whatever studies they need to demonize and eventually ban it.
>>64999878>There was 100+ years of lead shot built upMostly only the fresh lead gets consumed because that's the lead in the bloody viscera after you clean your kills.
>>64999903please point to exactly 1 "Environigger" who doesn't want to also clamp down on Dow?sigh.....
>>64999910You're literally evil. Misplaced utilitarian utopianism has infected your brain. You're a hypnotized goycattle.
>>64999903Based>>64999890Who'd win?>me in a lead poisoning competition>a $5 plastic jarUnless you meant major georgia airports, in which case your problem is more related to ammo
>>64999917uh oh schizoid melty
>>64999917uh, what? care to elaborate? I would honestly say the same about you, you seem to be absolutely seething that someone could dare to (gasp) want to take away your precious toxic bullets.> goycattlelol I'm jewish :)
Lead bad. Making hunting ammo a dollar more expensive per shot is negligible compared to the value of meat that you can harvest.We can still poison ourselves all we want at the range/yard.
>>64999921it's true.https://www.epa.gov/regulations-emissions-vehicles-and-engines/epas-data-and-analysis-piston-engine-aircraft-emissions
>>64999927nuance? in my /k/ thread? impossible. I must continue to shriek and pout about 'da joos'.
>>64999926>lol I'm Jewish
reminder: EDTA/ASML is the only proper chelating agent for lead. soap/water has 1/20th the effectiveness.
>>64999927>making an already dying 2A hobby more expensive is fine because it keeps lead out of the environment (please ignore lead is mined from the enviroment) :^)Talmudic post
>>64999936considering someone itt said I 'eat and rape' children, I find it funny that I'm contributing to the discussion, yes. perhaps I don't want my delicious children to be poisoned with lead?
>>64999939are really this stupid, or just trolling?do you not grok the previous 150 posts and see why lead ammo is terrible as fuck for wildlife?
>>64999937lead will just make me a based retard so why worryunironically dont care about cognitive decline. this world isnt worth thinking wondering or pondering about anymore. fuck this gay earth
>>64999941>crashing out because the Epstien files revealed the depths of jewish degeneracy At least you don't deny it. You're still going to hell though.
>>64999930It's one of the funniest "problems" we have to me. Because unlike ammo there's no downside even monetarily speaking avgas is the most expensive fuel. There's also no technology problem where in typical nannystate fashion "let's ban X and eventually someone maybe figures out a solution" would be required to scramble for retarded innovations to be compliant.We COULD just nuke a few thousand pages of regs and get engines airborne from this century at scale that aren't 1960s tier garbage but for whatever fucking reason we prefer paying out the ass for 100LL.
There are two ways to reduce lead on your body.1. ISML + Citric acid. Hygenall has the patent for this https://patents.google.com/patent/US20060160230A1/en2. EDTA, found in other brands.The differences from plain soap and water is dramatic.https://www.researchgate.net/profile/Kevin-Ashley-2/publication/239522749_Handwipe_Method_for_Removing_Lead_from_Skin/links/00b4951c1b0eb5ee68000000/Handwipe-Method-for-Removing-Lead-from-Skin.pdf>>64999954ok sweetie
>>64999956oh noes barnyard pilot morons with their old Rotex engines don't want to invest in new piston seals. watch me shed a single tear.
>>64999956The FAA is the last meritocratic agency left in the federal government and they realize allowing chinese pot metal and mexican-assembled engines made after 1965 will literally kill thousands of private pilots. A small amount of lead in the environment is worth keeping the boomer GA knowledge base alive a little longer. We simply cannot make things like we used to (seething globalist free-traders will respond to this post).
>>64999961Rotax engines are actually one of the more modern ones that can run on premium lead free gas.It's the continental/lycoming boxers that are in every fucking 172/pa28/cirrus that make up the bulk of GA piston fleet.The only real contestants is Changs (formerly Hans) diesel and a handful of diesel conversions. And I'm a turbinenigger so I haven't cared about the blue slop for years.
>>64999974may we see the thousands of pilots dying in places that use those engines?
>>64999878>there would still be a large amount of fowl being poisoned. There are still a large amount of fowl being poisoned. The ban didn't undo the damage, it just stopped it from getting worse. The isotopic evidence doesn't point to the industrial concerns that manufactured leaded gas either (that have a very distinct fingerprint, mind you), toxic ammunition bans have a measured causal relationship with declining lead levels in fauna in locations that are also heavily isolated from both major roadways and heavy industry. That relationship has been repeatedly observed in North America and Europe. There is also zero motive for the academy to simultaneously lie about this and let big oil off the hook of any blame, these are generally conservation minded people who care about results, not rabid antigunners. It's apparent this conversation has run its course.>>64999884No it isn't, especially accounting for geography and infrastructure. In 1976 the fish and wildlife service estimated that 3000 tons of lead shot were being deposited annually in just their wetlands.
we have the power to fix the earth.good book about it (she mentions lead in a chapter)
>>64999981anon should I spend $20k on a open-cockpit gyrocopter? I want to zip around the desert
>>64999982They don't exist. But not because you're right, but because those places don't exist either.US regs are actually pretty ok compared to the rest of the world where the requirements are almost always higher than here. It did blew my mind that euros don't treat basics like the gatsjar as standard equipment and dump their fuel on the apron like savages tho.in the US basically every newb gets taught to treat avgas like liquid gold.>>64999994>gyrocopterIf you got a bit more cash go with an actual microlight heli. If you do have enough land for the runway gyros are an ok choice. I'm paranoid about being in autorotation all the time so I'm biased. Oh and Idgaf if you skip all the maintenance items and get your wheels from home depot: don't skimp on the rotor TBO/hours check. I've had a buddy who shall we say wasn't diligent with his bookkeeping, didn't do inspection/maintenance on it for a couple THOUSAND hours and his final landing was a bit harder.
>>65000018>dump their fuel on the apronDump their fuel on the what?
>>65000035future cirrus pilot here everyone
>>64999757There's this thing called longitudinal comparison.
>>65000035The ramp. The flightline. Where the planes park.In the US basically everyone has >>64999921 pic related. A little jar so you can test your fuel tanks for water (no bueno) and contaminants. It has a little filter screen so you can put it back in the tank if it's not contaminated. In europe they just dump the sample next to the plane on the ground. Which on bigboy airports is concrete, but on small airfields is grass lol>>65000046lel
mogas cost savings pays for any kvetching over possible increased engine refurbs anyways.also this is a good article https://avweb.com/insider/g100ul-rebuttal/
>>65000063I will kvetch about mogas and avgas until jet fuel reigns supreme. I will even suffer the boomers with their hushkits and water-methanol injections.Having said that there some very niche issues like fuel bladders not dealing well with the ethanol fuels. Which should also not an issue in 2026 AD, but that sweet sweet FAA-PMA stamp...
>>65000000
>>64999536"The range" is anywhere I decide I want to go shooting that isn't someone else's private property. If I wanna go shoot on BLM land, I should be able to use lead projectiles. If I'm hunting, I'm using copper solids anyway, so the risk of scavengers ingesting lead from my shot is 0.
>>65000112BLM is *my* property. It's all our property. you cannot speak for the majority.
>>65000116The lead exposure you would get from someone shooting in the woods is negligible. Same goes for the wildlife in the area.
>>65000158do I need to post a 5th grade science textbook image of the water cycle for you?
>>65000159Where do you think lead comes from? Be honest.
>>65000163you are retarded
>>64996232It's not banning lead ammo, just banning its use within national parks, which is reasonable enough I guess. The national park service has already had its balls viced these past few years, and I'm starting to feel bad for rangers. Not game wardens, though, fuck those guys.
>>65000163>water cycleExplain how metallic lead contaminates water.
>>64996168Aim for the head or neck and the lead won't matter.
>>65000233that's not how this works.
>>64998918>>64997669this, the primers are bad and you are inhaling them. guys shooting lead ball don't kick their fingers
>>64998954NRA is basedthe GOA funded the bill >>64998961sounds gay
>>64998956>>64998967>>64998973it doesn't require an act of congress. there is a provision where they can ban leaded ammo if>there is a decline in the wild life pop of an area>studies show the decline is linked to lead>such a ban is consistent with the laws in the state the park is in
>>64999002based singapore caning faggots who vape>>64999002>>64999019arguably they should make it a crime to leave plastic hulls or ban the use of plastic hulls. they should 100% ban plastic wads for hunting. I thing the bongolians are doing or have done that
>>64999004deer cull with what?>>64999024>we will still have morons like OP who "finna spray and pray my lead all around the national parks when this passes".are you autistic? how can you read> "finna spray and pray my lead all around the national parks when this passes".and not assume that's sarcasm or shitposting ?
>>65000158Doesn't mean the next admin won't ban it on all federal lands it to spite gun owners in the next escalation of them playing political football with this particular issue for the past decade and a half. If Republicans weren't born losers on 2A they would codify reasonable regulations on toxic ammunition in select sites like wilderness areas and wildlife refuges while they had full control of the legislature.
>>64999034we should preform military action against the nations that throw all the plastic into the ocean>>64999080>>64999102>>64999122the bill in OP is in response to a 2022 EO
>>65000259I'm not autistic but you might be retarded if you don't think that shitpost reflects a very real sentiment I was using to make a point. I don't care if OP is so fat he couldn't huff it past a trailhead, the "fuck you I do what I want" attitude is incompatible with ecological protection. People used to use dynamite to make new trail paths in the southwest 80 years ago. People in the town I lived in liked to get drunk, magdump into riverbeds, and leave all their trash there. It's not an uncommon attitude which is why these laws exist at all.
>>64999080>>64999102>>64999122ok, but what happened in detroit in 1992?
>>64999410>>64999692>>64999597except it's even funnier because leaded gas is based and makes cars work better, but nonleaded rifle ammo works as good or better than leaded ammo at typical hunting ranges. Leaded rifle ammo only becomes better than leadless at like 400+ yards or some crazy ranges most people aren't shooting durr at
>>65000279it requires self-reflection which lots of rural folk lack
>>64999426based lead maxer>>64999536>man breaks into my home>forced to shoot him with steel shot or lead free AR ammo because not at the range
>>64999597>single digits>Based on the IQ score, the severity grading appears below.>IQ 50 to 70: mild intellectual disability (85% of cases)>IQ 35 to 50: moderate intellectual disability (10% of cases)>IQ 20 to 35: severe intellectual disability (4% of cases)>Q below 20: Profound intellectual disability (1% of cases)https://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/books/NBK547654/
>>64999626why the fuck use leaded rifle bullets when we have lead free bullets that don't suck dick? it's not even like the waterfowl shit where leadfree shotgun ammo (other than TSS) is ass. lead free bullets are fine
why is it that every time we realize something is dangerous and should not do it we have to have a "doctors refuse to wash their hands" tier retard debate about it?
>totally organic enviroshills come out of the woodwork to complain about a GOA backed bill because the government said bullets are poisoning birds or some shitThis is an antigun concensus-cracking thread
>>65000323I will have my popcorn ready for when we inevitably ban red meat with sulfites.
>>65000331I'm more pro-gun than you'll ever be, traitor. I care about the Earth.
>>65000323>UH UH UH DR. SHECKELBURG SAID THIS THING BAD! BAN IT! Same logic libtards use to try and ban guns. Cuck fag.
>>65000338Sorry I trust GOA more than you.
>>65000323You can take my radium water from my glowing dead hands>>65000331Wow better let some fucking advocacy group in DC do my thinking for me, true democracy in action
Concern trolling is still trolling.This is a wedge4 issue deliberately being pushed by groups that are against both gun ownership and hunting.>Even by their own studies less than 1000 raptors a year die nation wide from lead.
>>65000339>having your ego so tied up in manufactured race/ethnicity/religious divisons engineered for the purpose of controlling you that you decide lead absorption is just finehumanity deserves everything bad that will happen to it in the next two decades
>>64999674>than when I was a boy in the 1970s.ok boomer
>>65000350let's make that number 0 then?
>>65000352>manufactured race/ethnicity/religious divisons I tip my le hat to le you my fellow le redditorWe truly are all le statdust
>>65000350>less than 1000 raptors a yearYou got a source for that big guy?
>>65000357a riveting retort my good sir, I am not fully in favor of poisoning our wildlife because the alternative is 'reddit'
>>65000354No. I will not trading my fucking rights for a thousand birds a year. It's the same fucking argument libtards use to ban guns>IF IT SAVES JUST ONE LIFEFuck off.
>>65000354As a cause of mortality lead is so far down the list it's a statistical blip.The high temperature swings kill far more and people just don't give a fuck.
>>65000361*now fully>>65000362is the gun ban in the room with us right now?
I would bet money redditors itt so concerned about birds and bullets are pro windmill
>>65000350All else being equal, even the grabbiest of gun grabs is easier to roll back than ecological damage. Hang corporate polluters.
>>65000368>guve up your rights for the birds, we'll give them back when we fix the environment :^)
these are the sorts of people I share this board with? good grief. I understand why the shooting spot in my local nat forest is such a dump now.>>65000367you've literally fallen for right wing fake news lmao, wind turbines cause less overall harm to the environment than just about any other form of power. but feel free to nitpick I guess if it makes you feel better, kidD- see me after class
>>65000362You've already traded in your "right" to hunt ducks with lead ammo. Better march on the capital
>>65000367i barely can tolerate 4chan anymore let alone use that fuckass website and i'm a fissile material enjoyer so sure i'll take your money.
>>65000374>giant blender in the sky doesn't kill birds>but a few grams of lead in a gut pile totally doNuclear is literally safer than windmills but radiation scares jews so we can't have it.
>>65000365Where are you taking that from? Your ass?
>>65000376>machine guns are already banned so turn in your AR, chuddie!Same argument. Fuck off.
>>65000367>what is nuclearI bet this post goes hard if you have lead derived brain damage
>>65000380I am jewish, remember?wind power is less than 0.01% of bird deaths. and you can cut that number by 70% if you paint the blades black (recent research).https://www.fs.usda.gov/psw/publications/documents/psw_gtr191/psw_gtr191_1029-1042_erickson.pdfif you cared about birds, kill all housecoats lmao
>>65000381Monitoring a few dozen nests and watching every single chick die during a temperature inversion. The ecological damage done by fossil fuels has fucked whole ecosystems and nobody enough of a fuck to even slow it down.
>literally jewish shill ITT defending gun bansThis board is COOKED, chat.
>>65000372You don't have the right to pollute in national parks, no>>65000384Shit bait
at the end of the day if you're on the pro-polluting side, regardless of your petulant fervor for defending it, I just laugh
>>65000386FUCK those housecoats you will wear t shirts indoors and you will like it
>>65000391is the ban in the room with us right now?
>>65000391if you can't hold a debate just because the person on the other end is jewish, I really doubt your evidence was strong to begin with.>oh no a jew!>I am defeated, I can't argue my stance in these onerous conditions
>>65000403Kike
>>65000390So your position based on anecdotal reporting is that the ecological damage is already so bad we shouldn't do anything to stop further damage from different means. OK. >>65000391I wouldn't mind if your guns in particular got banned, no.
>>65000406Exhibit Aenjoy your lead!
>>65000407Focusing on incredibly minor shit is pointless and wasted effort.It's fighting a house fire with a fucking teacup. Actually act and fix the big problems.
>>65000414we can do this in parallel with preparing the invasion force for shore bombardment of factory complexes along the Yangtze/ Yellow/Hai rivers.stop thinking so limitedly.
>>64999728this only applies to national park EOs
Remove Moo
>>65000427Oh well, a good start anyway. Hopefully we can roll back the federal ban on waterfowl lead ammo sooner rather than later too.
>>65000433why?
>>64999756to be fair 26 and 110 is a huge sample size for social "sciences"didn't they ban straws due to a 9 year old's science fair project?
>>65000434Because it's antigun cuck legislation that makes hunting more expensive? Why else do you think, dummy..
>>65000432>WeyerhaeuserWhat is this
>>65000435At the same time Hollywood had a bunch of rape accusations and a drug indicating straw was invented.
>>64999756>>64999763>>64999792>>64999851>>64999832>he doesn't know about the nosler centrifuges and enriched lead
>>65000438One of the rape and pillage logging companies.
>>65000436no, I think it's more for protecting the environment.you're a goddamn lunatic if you legitimately believe lead legislation cannot stand on its own environmental merits.you're worse that awful.
>>65000436should there even be hunting permits with that logic? bag limits? after all those make it more expensive.should we not have federal taxes to pay for public land upkeep? that makes hunting more expensive!it seems to me you're actually brainwashed into rejecting anything that scary jewish liberals might be in favor of, because what it might make you look like a fag? just pathetic, really
if this bozo is truly basing his argument off of pure monetary cost added to his hunting hobby then he's ultra-delusional. that isn't even an agreement. it's just anger.
>>64999832>>64999839>>64999847might be harder to do the alloys. like does antimony get absorbed and excreted at the same rate as lead?
>>65000452*an argument god damn autocorrect is bad today, thanks Tim Apple
itt
>>65000453No. It's also a fair bit more toxic.
>>65000455>give up all your freedom and we'll have a utopia I promise :^)Commie bullshit. Kys.
>>65000447>should there even be hunting permits with that logic? bag limits? after all those make it more expensive. should we not have federal taxes to pay for public land upkeepNow you're speaking my language, anon!
>>64999842leaded gas wasn't banned federally until the 90s. not sure when california banned it >>64999853>that glenn beck clip where he fucking seethes over Georgia and South Carolina rejecting the part of the declaration of independence where Jefferson calls king george a muslim for allowing slavery and then talks about how Georgia and South Carolina were evil for pushing slavery and starting the civil war
>>65000459how does poisoning an 'Environmental Good' make you free? seems to me you've just been programmed to lash out at anything possibly spearheaded by liberals just 'because'. do you realize who created the EPA?
>>64999853>xe doesn't know about nosler and federal using centrifuges to produce enriched lead
I was promised when the boomers died we'd have a good chance at fixing the env mess they left us with. now I see that might be a bit harder to do. there are still lots of people that need to die.
>>65000467>the world is just a big problem to be fixed so we have to give up all our freedom to make the weather happyPagan commie bullshit.
>>64999903I 100% get your argument, but copper bullets work. if leadfree hunting ammo was ass like steel shot or flow flow toilets that would be one thing, but copper based bullets are good Federal trophy copper penetrates 30 inches and opens up to like 0.55 inches and has like 99% mass retention https://www.americanhunter.org/content/first-look-new-federal-30-30-winchester-trophy-copper-load/
>>65000474*cough cough* I'm so.... *cough* ....freee....
>>65000474so it's pagan, jewish, anti-gun, AND communist to want to not poison birds?yow.
>>65000476Give it time for copper to be banned.It's also toxic and environmentally motile.Tungsten will also go. Already banned on a lot of military firing ranges.
>>65000432>Remove MooCows are better people than you.
>>64999926
>>65000481clearly we need beryllium bullets. gotta have the highest LD50 possible.>>65000487sorry who is that?
>>65000485we have better things to do with 1/4 of our land than cows.
>>65000491Not if everyone wants beef for 2/3rds of their meals we don't
>>65000494>>65000337
>>64998961We do that because they are a threat to us dummy. I want to enjoy nature not be eaten by it.
>>65000279you're autistic. the fucking >spray and pray leadshitpost come directly after an acknowledgment that lead free bullets are good, asspie
>>65000520for what, your pocketbook? traitor
>>65000323washing your hands is gay and feminine
>>64996168lead for cull, copper for hunt
>>65000362lead free rifle bullets aren't even worse or less effective, lmao
>>65000528copper for both, moron
>>65000367>>65000374call me Don Quixote because I hate the goymill
>>65000444>if you don't give up your freedom for some birds you're crazy!!!Yeah I'm just a crazy old gun nut. No need to pay me any heed. I'm insane for eanting freedom so you can feel good about taking it away.
>>65000386>housecoatsas opposed to outside coats? wait, how are your coats alive?
>>65000390global warming is fake>>65000391I know, I was on the anti lead side, but now I'm pro lead
>>65000414This is a child's mentation.
>>65000534what freedom does a lead-ammo ban restrict?
>>65000536ok so just change the wikipedia page saying it's fake, if you have evidence to prove it.
>>65000536>>>/pol/
>>65000539>ERM IT DOESN'T ACTUALLY BAN HUNTING IT JUST MAKES IT MORE EXPENSIVE AND PUSHES AWAY NEW HUNTERS AND AND AND AND
>>65000432>tfw corn syrup country>>65000440I'm noticing also FUCK paper straws>paper straw>in a plastic cup>as thought they don't chuck that cup into the ocean
>>65000444DDT is based. it kills west nile, malaria, sami zayne and other diseases
>>65000543those are freedoms?you fucking idiot.
>>65000543a $1 bullet makes it more expensive? after you've bought a truck, a gun, etc?can you just admit you don't like liberals and this is your strange punishment for them, is the reason you're against it? otherwise you look like an absolute tard
>>65000551>UMM THAT'S NOT FREEDOM BECUASE I THINK IT'S STUPIDI think you living is stupid. Can you please KYS?
>>65000555do I have a freedom to have healthy wildlife in my public parks? somehow you paying a few bucks extra a year in ammo trumps that?
>>65000553>IT'S JUST A LITTLE CHANGE, GOY!Slippery slope is real, nigger. Look at all the states passing AWBs now.
>>65000479>>65000474jews do worship a panthion of beezilbob, satan, molach, yawah, the monopaly man and bhaalthe old testimate literally mentions other gods until like exodus
>>65000557Healthy wildlife for what? To covet? You don't hunt. Jews can't eat game.
>>65000558slippery slope is a logical fallacy.
>>65000489>clearly we need beryllium bullets. gotta have the highest LD50 possible.enriched uranium or osmium >sorry who is that?the guy who owns Henry. I thought you were a different jew. there is some jew on here who sperg's out about Henry because the owner is a republican
>>65000433Good thing they made it a treaty so all fags like you can do is impotently seethe lmao
>>65000563Hey remember when they said that in the 90s about fag marraige? How did that work out?
>I want to poison birds because I'm antisemitic holy balls
>>65000565The senate can repeal treaties.
>>65000566what are you implying?also I went to one of the first five gay marriages in MA :)
>>65000491like what?>>65000524see>>65000476copper rifle rounds are as effective or more effective than bonded soft points or partitions. bonded soft points and partitions only start getting better than copper at extreme ranges well beyond the ranges the lion's share of people hunt
>>65000435Avian biologists trapping, drawing blood from, and testing and tagging live animals is not social science moron
>>65000540wikipedia is owned by a sino-isreali cabal who is pushing global warming to deny us of our lead smelting and heavy industry>>65000539if it's for hunting not much, if it's in general it makes shooting to expensive >>65000542where do you think we are?
>>65000571why should I, a retarded MAGA anon, believe 'biologists' when they went to the same liberal schools as the climatologists who push fake news global hoax warming? >>65000536
>>65000543It's not even that much more expensive>yeah the box of 20 bullets was $43 instead of $33, I am financially ruined
what a pleasant thread.
>>65000566good post>>65000567is he wrong?
>>65000579>it's just a little more edpensive goyDeath by a thousand cuts
>>65000576This but unironically
>>65000584do I as a public land owner not have a right to the health of it as a public good?
>>65000571a. >biology>not a social science b. we don't sign our posts here, retard. it's against the rules>>65000576climate retards didn't go to school. that's like the lowest of the low in terms of sciences
>>65000467So true king. When our time comes we will make no excuses for the terror.
>>65000580>>65000569there the faggot is. I knew he was here
>>65000589*paves over wetlands for fucking solar farms*
>>65000481Could you be any more delusional if you tried?
Environiggers be like:>"LEAD AMMO IS KILLING BIRDS!">*imports 10 milion Indians*
>>65000592I'm really not sure what you're implying.>>65000596I have a feeling the Technology Connections video I want to post for you to watch wouldn't be received well :^)
>>65000520Whatever fatass
>>65000600yes, those two things are directly equatable.
>>65000601>I was going to post a jewish guy talking to a camera but you might not like it
that's the bump limit - another thread in the bag for seeing how decrepit /k/'s true beliefs are. enjoy your workweek
>>65000568Have fun with that. Great use of political capital. The GOP can do shit like deregulate harmful chemicals and mouth breathing fools will consider it a victory for 2A. Maybe tell them to fuck off and use that effort on something real like attacking AWBs or the NFA. But retards will just clap.
72 of these posts are mine
>>65000600this is a good post>>65000601>I'm really not sure what you're implying.are you not the henry hating sperg?>>65000602you are literally autistic. anyone who isn't a fat retard would read that as sarcasm because it comes directly after a sentence pointing out copper bullets are effective anyway.Why would someone praise copper bullets and then earnestly say he or she was going to spray lead everywhere?
>>65000587They have no answer for this >>65000588Chemistry is a social science then I guess (if you have brain damage that is).
>>65000604importing indians is bad for the environment if you believe in global warming theory >>65000609/k/ is slow. this thread won't 404 for like 20 more hours unless there's a war tourist spergout
>>65000616based>>65000619no, chemistry is a real science, since that's what I do.
>>65000618>no you have to read my shitpost genuinelyOK fat OP. I know you're no threat to wild nature because you would pass out 20 feet from your car without a mobility scooter.
I ran this thread through an LLM and asked it to summarize the pro-lead position:"nature is for fags"
>>65000621You are nothing compared to physics. Enjoy the lower life expectancy gayboy
>>65000625This board has always been stupid, but "pro-lead position" is just lol
>>65000625based>>65000622did the bear at the mall tell you that I was fat and serious, sperg?>>65000626physics is for homosexuals, homosexual
>>65000628how else would you describe it? these blithering morons are willing to poison themselves, their children, and the environment simply to not lose Face with their /pol/ buddies, of whom most are probably brown or bots.
>>65000633No I mean lol at the fact that's even a faction, although a lot of it is newfags baiting
>>65000632Go taste your lab chemicals and drop dead faggot
>>65000633>hunters are poisonong the environment with bullets>but we need more bomalians
>>65000637bait hasn't meant anything on 4chan since 2015.all statements are legitimate and taken at face value.which is why it is terrifying that so many people are in favor of wholesale genocide.
Take the guns from litterers and polluters. Voting dem in 28.
>>65000651thank you.
>>65000651>>65000653Dems are pro pollution. They import the worst polluters on the planet by the millions.
>>65000641go experience terminal velocity, homo>>65000644it's the pro environmental position>>65000651>>65000661this. importing third worlders into nonshit countries makes their CO2 emissions go up exponentially
>>65000641lmao sent that freak flying
>>64998941>98,985 lead shot pellets per hectareThat's 107,639 square feet.>Effects of Lead Fishing Tackle You're retarded.
>>65000732congrats on being illiterate and blind to context cues
>>64996168Is there anything at all to this except making shooting unaffordable ie a soft ban?
>>65000432Eat ze bugs, live in ze pod and maybe I let you uze ze bus
>>65000682samefaggot>>65000861> the box of 20 bullets was $43 instead of $33, I am financially ruined
>>65000737Learn to take an L like a Man and use punctuation and capitalization like a White.
>>64997152>Kind of goofy to insist on slippery slope for lead ammunition and fishing weights being banned in national parks... Which is like 1% of US wildlands.According to ONx, about 60 percent of the acreage of national parks are huntable.>In all, 75 of the total 419 units managed by the National Park Service allow some form of recreational, subsistence, or tribal hunting. In terms of size, however, those 75 units make up 60 percent of the National Park system.National parks total 193 million acres in the US, and 60% of that is 115.8 million acres. There's 640 million acres (nearly 30 percent of the US's land) of public land. 115,800,000 acres out of 640,000,000 means it's about 18.09% of public land. I'm not taking including privately owned undeveloped woods here (which I'm not completely sure how to define, let alone find and add up) but even if private undeveloped forests (or other wildlands) are double that, that's no small percent given total acreage. Texas might be your biggest undeveloped area that's private. Or one of the states that have actual mountainous middle of nowhere farmsteads.
>>64996223That's neat; first I've heard of relatively cheap lead free. Wonder if it's too hard or light to make rifle bullets from. I was also going to mention tin pest but really unless you have like a case of it and leave it in the freezing cold it ain't gonna do shit unless it's ancient ammo and you get a case of really bad luck.>>64998616>cherry picked a bad bulletYeah a V-Max is literally the most cherry picked extreme example that could've been chosen. Shit is basically meant to grenade to make coyotes drop like a rock. And most don't eat coyotes, hence the choice to fragment so aggressively.>>65000238>guys shooting lead ball don't kick their fingersThat is a hell of a mental image.>>65000252If not, felt wads are way more fucking common over there. I didn't even know they existed for the longest time. Now watch that those "felt" wads are actually acrylic felt or some shit and not waste wool. Downside is no Federal FliteControl wads then but I really don't hunt with shotguns.>>65000313Anon, lead free is like $1.00-2.50+ per round.>shotgun ammo/TSS (yes I know you mention this as an exception)Seriously who the fuck uses this stuff unless you have a hunting show and like 9 sponsors? I think I've seen guys on hunting shows magdump coyotes probably with TSS or copper. Fucker better have really been worth the $30+. But at least that $90 box of FIVE also includes a donation to the National Wild Turkey Federation®! Gee thanks Federal! Oh also it still spits plastic wads out lol.
>>65003138>tin pestI've never heard of this, neat
>>65003154Cody'sLab taught me that. IIRC he had a piece of tin roof in his parents freezer, then his for years until anything happened. Still odd that can happen. Also poorly made or handled ZAMAK or similar alloys can crumble after some time if they were contaminated or were improperly ratioed IIRC. Mostly affects vintage/antique cast toys. Hell of a thing; your $100 cast toy can be fine for years and then one day the wheels or body just starts corroding and crumbling and you can't do shit. As for tin pest I think high heat cures it? Been years.
>>65000732>~1 lead pellet per square foot isnt a problem>in a wild area no less>>65000861Do you only go shooting in national parks? >>65002475>about 60 percent of the acreage of national parks are huntable. OK, what about sport shooters? Hunting is just part of this equation
