>>36355984
>We need artificial wombs stat.
Might happen for few decades.
>OB/GYNs see plenty of gaydens having kids but can't fathom the idea of a troon who breastfeeds.
Neither sounds healthy for children.
Both should be banned.

>>36355984
Thirsty poondoods scraping their vulvas over the floor, BEGGING for COCK and MARRIAGE to their "gay" husbando~

>>36355984
Anon. I hate to tell you this but troons and fags are born of straights. It's not hereditary

>>36355984
>bodyfeeding

Are there people regurgitating their recent meal like a fucking bird into their neonate's mouth?

>>36355984
>OB/GYNs see plenty of gaydens having kids but can't fathom the idea of a troon who breastfeeds.
I called one up after being told they'd see trans patients and explained in detail about the mtf srs operation I had and asked whether they'd see me and they said yes. Then for good measure I waited a month and called again and asked the same question, and they said yes again. I had been told to call this particular one because they are "trans experts." I made the appointment. I thought maybe somebody would finally look at my yeast/bv/something situation.
Then I await the appointment. I consider cancelling because I'm pretty sure I'm not supposed to go there, but I don't. Then on the day of the appointment, I get a call. They really only see theyfabs, and I should probably go somewhere else. No they don't know where. Just not there.

>>36357249
It's hereditary. Just not usually so directly.
For instance whatever genes control androphilia would be not great in a gay man but helpful in a straight woman. Can't totally weed it out.

However, gaydens can be directly selected for if their behavior is beneficial. Imagine if most women took some T, might solve the birth rate crisis.

>>36357278
>we don't treat manually-induced fistulas near male scrotum, sorry

Sorry, theyfabs outnumber you 500:1 and you're basically a gross and weird outlier.

>>36357304
Also as the OP image shows we've devalued the role for estrogen as a society. All mothers/ gayden fathers are considered equal.
Breasts that have been chopped off are considered equal to full breasts. A body that has a feminine fat distribution designed to aide a fetus's brain development is considered no better than an obese drunken hood rat or a gayden on T.

And these changes are partly real. A gayden can carry a pregnancy to term due to advances in medicine. A gayden can formula feed their baby.
In that environment maybe uterus + T to increase drive really is the way to go. Maybe gaydens are the future of humanity.

>>36357317
they specifically told me they'd see me multiple times before pulling out the bait and switch
also you're intersex so I hope you never get any medical care on similar logic

>>36357335
Uh
yeah, but they know what I am and I'm not asking them to reach into a stinky yeast hole
You big stinky tranny

>>36357368
it wasn't yeast it was bv and once I finally found someone it took like one pill to cure now why was finding someone a multi-year ordeal involving doctors pulling bait-and-switches on me that seemed intended to strip me of my dignity

>>36357384
Just scared of AMABs, I guess

>OB/GYNs see plenty of gaydens having kids

They definitely do not, lol. I am one and I'm getting prenatal care in a big medical system in an extremely liberal area and I made this assumption as well. But when I started asking providers mostly told me I was the first they'd ever worked with. Nonbinary people are also vastly more common in every trans or LGBT pregnancy support space I've ever been to--or people just figuring out they were men...surprisingly.

We're not unheard-of but it's definitely uncommon. It's about the most dysphoria-inducing shit humanly possible.

>>36358612
Appreciate your perspective on this.
How long were you on hrt for beforehand? Have you had top surgery? Do you intend to breastfeed?

I honestly don’t blame you for having kids. I’m just jealous I can’t do the same.

>>36358612
I am the mtf above and now have found someone who claims to be lgbt-specific (which must mean trans because gays won't see an obgyn and lesbians don't need anything special) and apparently means it and uh I still haven't knowingly seen another trans person (either direction) in the waiting room. Not even an obvious nonbinary person.

>>36358645
>How long were you on hrt for beforehand?
14 years, since basically the week I hit 18.

>Have you had top surgery?
Yep, also a long time ago

>Do you intend to breastfeed?
Nope. Many people can after top surgery, but not with the type I had. There's no connection to milk ducts.

I'm 100% okay with this, as pregnancy is already pushing it. I'm probably going to use at least some amount of donor milk though.

I'm very sorry if pregnancy is something you really wanted to do and you won't be able to. I can relate for other reasons that I won't get into. I do hope that you build a family in future if you want to, though. I chose this for a couple reasons, legal protection first and foremost, but it's far from the only way people go about it.

>>36358679
I guess I'd assume they're invisible. Hard to tell which ladies are cis or trans just hanging out in a waiting room.

>>36358990
>14 years, since basically the week I hit 18
And everything uterus wise is working fine for you?
Did you do any sort of prep or low dose T?

I've heard of pooners getting a sort of "vaginal death" after 5 years on T so wondering there.
If you did it intentionally and had some prep beforehand, similar to how mtfs will go off hrt and on clomid to prep their sperm, makes sense.
>legal protection first and foremost, but it's far from the only way people go about it.
Don't blame you, like I said I'm a mad jelly mtf who's dysphoric I can't get pregnant.

>>36359008
well at the obgyn a number of them are pregnant but yeah it is possible... I am surprised I've never seen a ftm. maybe they all go to the one that refused to see me.
>>36359034
yeah I've heard about that too which is why I'd like to think they'd go to someone with ftm-specific knowledge but then again given my own experiences that's probably wishful thinking... either direction we're just too rare.
I did the math once and concluded that there's probably like 10 of us who go to the doctor (they don't exactly encourage us to) in the area.
(I wish I could have children too)

>>36359058
>(I wish I could have children too)
Stick with it. There's a lot of research going into lab grown organs such as ovaries and uterus. I think we'll see it within 50 years.
May be an old lady. But an old lady with a fresh womb.

>>36359097
I think I'll see it but it'll start the mother of all transphobia I'm sure and as you say I'll be an old lady and old ladies aren't supposed to have children

>>36359034
>And everything uterus wise is working fine for you?
>Did you do any sort of prep or low dose T?

Nah, you'd discontinue testosterone completely for at least 3 months and then you're good to go. I think the general rule is that DFAB people who have been on blockers since the very start of puberty may need to freeze eggs (getting pregnant not being the issue, just egg quality), but I hear that research is changing, apparently, as some people haven't needed to.

>I've heard of pooners getting a sort of "vaginal death" after 5 years on T so wondering there.

You can definitely get atrophy, dryness, and more delicate tissue from being on testosterone, though I don't think it's as serious as all that and people vary widely in it. I was using a medicated estrogen ring for a while (some use topicals) bc I have some other health issues that they thought might have been a little aggravated by changes from testosterone.

>>36359145
The estrogen ring seems like it would help. And 3 months off makes sense.
Fairly easy pregnancy so far or any particular issues?

Also wondering if you actually are a gayden or just a straight/bi den who wanted custody? Like did you get pregnant by a boyfriend or a donor?

>>36359058
>I am surprised I've never seen a ftm. maybe they all go to the one that refused to see me.

Trans men usually avoid repro healthcare like the plague and only go when something is terribly wrong and they can't ignore it. Which can end up being quite dangerous. Doctors do often make it miserable to go, though.

>>36359193
well that makes sense. Given how often I find material at the intersection of trans and vagina like completely ignores my situation and focuses on trans men (which is fine for what it is but in the moment makes me feel rather unwanted), it's hard for me to remember that despite the medical industry's love of them, they're not wanting to go any more than we are. Meanwhile the medical industry just hates us. I think I read somewhere that 2? 4? something like that percent of trans women have ever had a pelvic exam which is just sad.
Like I had aerobic vaginitis but all I can find on it says it might happen in trans men from testosterone atrophy. Okay.. and interesting info.. but not particularly actionable for me. I get the impression I'm not supposed to be there, not supposed to have problems, and not supposed to seek medicine. (I had antibiotics; I know some in germany have used topical estrogen on mtfs but I'm too scared to ask about trying that)

>>36359224
Sheesh! I am very sorry and also completely unsurprised to hear that trans women are neglected in gyn literature and it's having a negative impact on your life. I honestly wish more trans people could go into those fields as both doctors and researchers, because they're sorely lacking and we could use people that give a shit. I would kill for a trans woman OB/GYN right now.

And yeah I can definitely see how your average mildly transphobic gyno would probably prefer working with a trans man than a trans woman, fucked up as that is. Everyone needs medical care, and if you have a vagina the vagina doctor should have enough education to keep you well.

>I know some in germany have used topical estrogen on mtfs but I'm too scared to ask about trying that

Are you particularly scared to ask about that one or is it that it's just part of not feeling comfortable needing care?

Also, NOT that you asked, but the best way I've found to ask doctors about course of treatment (as someone who has a lot of experience with this) is to talk yourself down quite a lot beforehand, taking the attitude of "I'm a big dumb dumb who doesn't really know anything about medicine but I heard about XYZ..." and then ooh and ahh at everything they tell you about it. Ask questions and let them "educate" you. Doctors with an ego usually prefer that to being directly requested. Sometimes they come to the conclusion that it would be a good idea on their own.

>>36359331
>neglected in gyn literature
oh we're not neglected the acog says to use soap and there's several papers out that say we have incurable bv not that they bothered trying to cure it
>average mildly transphobic gyno would probably prefer working with a trans man than a trans woman
Yeah it frequently seems they are more interested in affirming the agab than in responding to the reality of our situation. And there's no way to do that when it's my vagina, so they just shut down entirely. "Birth sex + pronouns" are emphasized over meidcal history and "male (she)" is actively misleading... Although mine is set to female which is just fucked that this specific thing they did for trans people isn't actually useful.
I've noticed they're much happier to be dealing with trans men, but I have this nagging feeling in the back of my mind they also treat them in ways that are counterproductive by ignoring the reality of their situation.
>estrogen
It's just a little controversial because others say what we really need is testosterone... I'm a little suspect of the agab-essentialism okay but most men don't have vaginas. Personally I think my systematic levels confirm the estrogen-helps theory but I'm not certain.
idk if you've noticed but there's a ton of misinfo about our vaginas including in published medical material so it's difficult for me to put myself against all that. The mere fact that I have discharge is controversial so how do I even begin to ask about it.
I mean my pcp seemed to treat the whole thing as a dysphoria accommodation and not a physical health thing.
>working their ego
I've been given soap(!) and given diflucan several times for antibiotics and when I complained I didn't have yeast symptoms was told maybe it presents different in trans woman. So yeah it would be nice to make them feel good but they keep giving me the most stupid treatments. Most recently I got a big lecture about being a woman so I guess that made her feel good

>>36359331
>>36359448
anyway that was right at 2,000 characters and I don't mean to take over your thread but this stuff annoys me so much and although it seems at times they focus on trans men I'm sure it's not all rosy. I suspect they really focus on the non-transitioning types who aren't really medically affected by being non-binary. And if my experience is any guide they're possibly just as neglectful of the actual effects of transitioning on your body as they are on mine.

>>36359470
Nah it’s the point of the thread it’s all good. Point is to show things like chestfeeding language are superficial.

>>36355984
>AGP: Need to court a cis woman and then have their sperm frozen or go off hrt.
You underestimate the cunningness of autogynephiles. Many of them wait until they've already had kids with their wife to troon out. This way they can attempt to force the wife to stay with them.

>>36359448
>idk if you've noticed but there's a ton of misinfo about our vaginas including in published medical material so it's difficult for me to put myself against all that. The mere fact that I have discharge is controversial so how do I even begin to ask about it.

Nope, I haven't. I have trans woman and -femme friends but unlike with other guys I rarely discuss body woes. I figure they get enough prying and critique and commentary on their bodies and they probably want to be left alone until they talk about it on their own. But that and being gay does mean I don't know a lot about the day to day issues of having a vagina as a trans lady.

Dealing with misinfo in literature vs your own experience is pretty common with disabled people though, so I do know what that part is like. It sucks terribly. Sorry I can't be more help with it.

>So yeah it would be nice to make them feel good but they keep giving me the most stupid treatments. Most recently I got a big lecture about being a woman so I guess that made her feel good

Oh yeah, when I say that I'm not saying it's right for them to be undertreating and patronizing you. It's dangerous, and if they were good at their jobs they'd care more and pay more attention. Some of these people are such assholes there is literally no way to get them to try what works than learning how to make yourself small so they can feel big.

Also, soap? Do you mean like...just antifungal/antibacterial soap?

>>36359497
I mean you're right but I was only counting post transition stuff

>>36359448
>I've noticed they're much happier to be dealing with trans men, but I have this nagging feeling in the back of my mind they also treat them in ways that are counterproductive by ignoring the reality of their situation.

People who are transphobic to trans women might be happier to associate with trans men and give lip service to us, but yeah it doesn't mean they actually respect or understand us. Cis women who are like that think I have some kind of secret feminine essence, like I have the soul of a woman or some shit. I don't think it's possible to only be transphobic to one kind of trans person.

>>36359510
>probably want to be left alone
Idk we often suffer in silence. You seem okay but I used to be in a support group and there were several trans men in there who would shut down any discussion from trans women about our vaginas (although there was also a post-phalloplasty trans man in there which was interesting). We quickly learn not to talk about it ever. Even in groups of trans women there's plenty of pre-ops and non-ops quick to gaslight us about our bodies.
>Also, soap? Do you mean like...just antifungal/antibacterial soap?
No like just soap like you'd use to clean yourself in the bath. To be used internally. It was horrible I only did it because I was depressed about the fact that I wasn't getting better medical care and it was pretty much just self-harm and of course it completely threw off my body and failed to do anything but make things worse. My vagina immediately swelled up and I couldn't fit anything up there at all. Maybe with lube.. (when I'm healthy I do not typically use lube). A day or two later it smelled awful. I could see how somebody could get into a cycle of doing this every day and thinking it's needed. But no thanks. I'd rather have my good bacteria up there, which seems to be perfectly possible, despite conflicting reports in medical literature.

>>36359595
What I mean is like if you have atrophy from testosterone that's not really a condition that affects women and when it does (menopause? but that's not testosterone. pcos? maybe) the treatment can be to remove the excess testosterone, but that doesn't work at all on trans men. It's easy for the doctor who sees trans men as essentially women to decide they'll treat you, but then to give you no real useful treatment because they pretend your transition isn't actually happening or important to you.
Similar logic when a cis woman with a testosterone of say 200 is seen as excessively high and needing treatment and a trans woman is told "that's low that's really good" which is true by male standards but not at all by the standards by which her body should be judged.
>>36359599
continuing since you made me think there's a big connection between my bacterial situation and my vaginal health and I see next to nothing about it. I had to find that for myself and basically get gaslit every step of the way..
Early on when I still dilated with any regularity, I noticed that if I smelled bad, dilating was harder. And the treatment for dilating being hard: dilate more. But that just resulted in more inflammation and made things harder. A break is what I needed, but it's not what I've ever heard prescribed.

>>36358990
I'm a cis lesbian and the thought of getting pregnant makes me ill. I don't know how you manage to do the most female thing imaginable with dysphoria

I feel jealous of people who are sure they want children or are sure they don't want children. I'm getting to the age where I have to figure it out soon, but no switch ever flipped in me. I don't feel baby fever or anything at all when I look at a child besides mild anxiety and annoyance. When I look at a puppy or a kitten I want to take it home and hold it, and I thought that's what I was supposed to feel about babies. I don't know, I think I'm too solitary a person to be a good parent. I'm happy for people who find happiness like that though.

>>36357249
it is hereditary. identical twins have a statistically significant higher rates of both being trans/gay over random chance, and it isn't the same for fraternal twins

>>36355984
>bodyfeed
The term "bodyfeeding" is repulsive

>>36357270
its gey men mouth fucking todlers
quite comon

>>36360358
I love kids and plan on having lots but I think the puppy vs newborn comparison is bad.
Human newborns are weird and underdeveloped. You really need to look at 1-5 year olds if you want to see cuteness