>>42231213
Didn't read but yes, the world doesn't need more sexual competition

>>42231231
trans is the most sexual competition stupid fucking tranny

>>42231213
You have early-onset AGP.
Are you still a crybaby? Transition isn't for the faint of heart.

cont.

And then for the reasons why I think it might not be a good idea to transition:

>1. I'm scared I don't have actual dysphoria, and I'm just an AGP, I feel like that might be the case actually :/ I do really wish I had a feminine body, and I'm so scared of things like balding lol, and twink death in general i guess. But I also see that objectively my body as a guy is actually quite attractive, and I'm scared to ruin that by going on hrt.

>2. I feel like in my teens I have pretty much established a male identity, it would almost be cringe to say I'm a woman now, if that makes sense.

>3. I would just be so ashamed to tell my family. I'm pretty sure everyone already thinks I'm weird but I feel like I could never have a normal relationship with my family again.

>4.I'm so so so so scared I wouldn't pass and ruin my life basically. I have no idea if my facial features and body type would be able to pass, I feel like I could, but I don't know...

I don't know what to do, and I don't know how I want to live my life, I am going insane

[2/2]

>>42231246
>You have early-onset AGP.
Yeah I think that might be it. I hate myself so much for that desu... Is there any way I can make it go away without transitioning

all of these are stereotypes that could be present in women OR men. What you nee to focus on is: "will I be happier as the other gender", not any trivialities. Don't transition from people killing bugs, for example.

>>42231249
you sound like a classic trans woman since childhood and you need to transition immediately, because every minute counts. it might hurt a lot at the start, but it will make your life better

here is one obvious tell: you said you like crossdressing, but feel so upset that you can't transition. if you weren't actually trans and didn't have dysphoria, you wouldn't care that much. sissies love crossdressing.

>>42231249

Only being agp but not dysphoric isn't actually a reason not to troon, even AGPers are generally happier after trooning, idk if you can de-agp yourself as an alternative to trooning even

you sound like a retard

>>42231274
>Don't transition from people killing bugs, for example
lmao yeah, makes me feel dumb that i even wrote that in the post, i was just kinda rambling at that point.

Im not that unhappy as a guy, but idk this stuff always just in the back of my mind and idk what to do about it. I think I might actually be unhappier as a women, but mainly because of the shame, and alienation from family.

>>42231270
You can't make AGP go away. The question is whether transition is the best way to manage it. What's clear is that total repping leads to a life of misery.

>>42231354
I am

>>42231358
>mainly because of the shame, and alienation from family
The least legitimate reason not to troon out.

>>42231286
>>42231297
I'm really scared to transition, I don't wanna do something I might regret later. Should I see a psychologist maybe, will that do anything for me?

>>42231376
KILLYOURSELF stiuiod TROON

>>42231427
I guess... Im also scared I might regret it later

>>42231443
uhh no

>>42231452
Detroon if that turns out to be the case.

t. >>42222223

>>42231213
probably

don't wait on it

waiting sucks

it's bad for your body and your brain

t. consciously repped at 17, trooned out anyways at 25

>>42231457
do you really think its that simple? idk , it doesn't feel that way. I honestly don't know if it is the right choice for me, alot of you seem to think so... Is there anyone here that has had similar things happen to them and ended up transitioning?

>>42231503
There will be permanent changes to my body even if i detroon right?

>>42231249
sounds pretty trans to me

most of your fears are because of dysphoria or social stigma

>>42231549
Sometimes. Depends on physiology, desu
Most detrooners reverse even their breast growth without surgical interventions.
Even your fertility comes back after a while. Might have mild erectile dysfunction though, depending on how you've treated your dick while on E.
Yes, it's not easy as trans activists describe it, but it's also not the death sentence chuds want it to be.
Also, what if it works? I was unsure even 2 years in. But when it started working for me, then it really did work.
The only good decision my former khv self ever made was to allow transition.

>>42231627
Fuck idk... yeah i guess it wouldn't be that bad to just try and see how it is... How did you stick with it for 2 years without getting, i think i might get scared and detroon you know :///
would it be a good idea to boymode and not tell anyone im on hrt when i just start out? how do you even get hrt, or start transitioning?

>>42231617
>most of your fears are because of dysphoria or social stigma
yeah true, is social stigma a bad reason not to transition though? i don't wanna be stigmatized my entire life

also im a little scared this is just basically a circlejerk, and i might not get the most nuanced opinions here lol. idk though im just confused and need some more time to reflect on everything that is said here i guess before i take any decisions irl.

>>42231709
>How did you stick with it for 2 years without getting
without getting what?
I simply soldiered on while being unconvinced whether this will work or not. Then got hit by an internal crisis. My new me "won" I guess. From there on I took this very seriously. I already explained in the linked thread.

>would it be a good idea to boymode and not tell anyone im on hrt when i just start out?
That's what I did. Literally zero people knew for 3 years.
Granted, it helped that I was a lonely khv incel living alone with zero friends. So keeping it hidden was really easy.

>how do you even get hrt, or start transitioning?
I went to a psychiatrist and got a diagnosis. Then adjusted the dosage at home based on online documentation. I ended up "teaching" the endocrinologist, kek
DiY is a thing. Look up otokonoko.
Here (in Europe) there are other options too, unless you live in Germany.

>>42231813
>without getting what?
Sorry im not typing very coherently lol. i guess i meant without getting discouraged.

>I simply soldiered on while being unconvinced whether this will work or not
okay yeah I read through the tread. this seems really hard though, I'm glad it worked out for you. I'm so scared that I fuck up my body though, I can tolerate my body, and it would kinda suck to become an ugly, non passsing girl if i do decide to transition. Im pretty short,and i think my face doesn't look tooo masculine, but yeah my shoulders are pretty wide and i dont think you can change that easily....

>That's what I did. Literally zero people knew for 3 years.
okay yeah if i go for it i will do this as well

>DiY is a thing. Look up otokonoko.
seems kinda shady lol

>Here (in Europe) there are other options too
Im from the netherlands, Ill look how it works here, thank you

>>42231781
I mean it’s better to be in a pro-trans circlejerk than an anti-trans circlejerk, right? Loads of trannies here are self-hating. You end up with a lot of opposing views anyway.

Depends on what kind of stigma. If it’s “I’m going to be beaten to death” then it’s a good idea not to troon until you can get out of there. If it’s “people are going to judge me” then you may as well never do anything because people will always judge you for something. Is it better to be happy or to fit in?

>>42232033
>this seems really hard though
never claimed it was easy. Just that it's doable.

>I can tolerate my body,
So could I. But that was a low bar. What's the point if nobody desired me?

>and it would kinda suck to become an ugly, non passsing girl if i do decide to transition
That was my fear too. But then again, I was already kinda ugly and total incel loser so not much to lose.

>Im pretty short,and i think my face doesn't look tooo masculine, but yeah my shoulders are pretty wide and i dont think you can change that
You're from NL. You have even more latitude (both literally and figuratively) than I had.
I guess we differ on expectations. I just wanted to no longer be lonely and be out of the void.

>seems kinda shady lol
Then go via the official route at least at first if the waiting lists aren't long. Lots of drugs are actually made in NL or DK anyway.
Yeah, it looks shady, but it works. With all the anti-troon propaganda nobody has once come up with a case of death of severe side effects from DiY. And there's tens of millions invested in antitroon propaganda efforts.

>>42232109
Yeah youre completely right desu, im not gonna get beaten to death. I'm still not 100% sure if this is what i actually want, but im gonna look into it more seriously, and at least try to get an appointment with a psychiatrist

>>42232113
>I guess we differ on expectations. I just wanted to no longer be lonely and be out of the void.
I mean no disrespect, but I think I might be less desperate than you were. Well im also a khv, and i don't see that changing any time soon. But thats mainly because im just a socially awkward, overthinking, anxious idiot lol. idk if changing my gender will actually change that, might even make me more insecure.
So yeah im not 100% sure. but from what people on here say I guess it might be the right decision. I think i want to go to a psychiatrist, and just be very open and honest, and see what they think as well.

>then go via the official route at least at first if the waiting lists aren't long
Yeah im gonna look into it, I definitely think i wanna try it for at least a while. How do I know if i don't like it or if i should just keep going though. sorry you probably don't know all the answers either, im just trying to get as much information as i can.

>>42231249
>in my most vulnerable and intimate moments i want to be treated/seen as/feel like a woman.
>this means im fake trans
yeah ok whatever

>>42232490
Not OP but I always heard that fantasising about being a woman during sex or porn was an AGP thing and not real dysphoria. Is there a way to tell them apart?

>>42232490
Yeah when you put it like that i guess it doesnt makes sense... Idk it does kinda feel like i am fake trans though, i think im not as dysphoric as other people on here if that makes sense. So maybe i shouldnt transition, i guess that was my thought process...

Most people on here seem to think i should transition tough, so im looking more into it now

I started at 20 and jumped on that shit

Just do it desu
Everyday that goes by you further masculinize.

Bonus points to passing and looking beautiful if your white

>>42232324
I believe you that you're less desperate (for now anyway). I became more desperate as years went by and nothing changed.
Granted, I wasn't anxious. But nothing I tried to tone down the social awkwardness and the overthinking worked. And I was mortally afraid of ssris after seeing what that shit did to a colleague. In retrospect, not getting on ssris was a really good decision because it allowed me to focus the overthinking on the practical aspects of transition.

>How do I know if i don't like it or if i should just keep going though
I knew ~2yrs in when I had the internal crisis. It was the hardest time by far. Double hard because I faced it alone (though in retrospect it was for the better - online brainworms or dumb psychiatrists would've likely made things worse).
During the crisis my mind basically fought with itself. The woman I am now won, ig. I have no idea how to describe this in words. But the result was "okay, so I gotta make this girl thing work now. at least i know that".
Sounds simple but it really wasn't. But ig the euphoria I've been feeling ever since makes the memory more bearable? idk
But broadly speaking, your body and your mind will tell you. You just have to listen and let the crisis happen, give it time to happen and listen to the result.
A lot of trannies describe something similar but in the first few months, not years in. I suppose (but idk for sure) it took me longer because i didn't have crippling dysphoria.
If the science and the doctors weren't absolute dogshit, I'd be willing to subject myself to tests and brainscans. But, ig we're all born too early.

>>42232598
Yes. If you can think about being a woman non-sexually as well and dedicate significant amounts of time to doing just that, you're not AGP.

>>42232607
>it does kinda feel like i am fake trans though
That's an internet brainworm.
Who gives a shit if you're "fake". The question is whether it works for you or not. And there is no "wrong" answer.
If it works, go for it. If it doesn't, then stop. That's it.
Transition is ultimately a combination of body modding and self-actualization. The opinions of other people are really not that important. Yes, that includes the tranny spaces.

t. >>42232644

>>42232598
>AGP thing and not real dysphoria
sure but that doesn't mean anything

>>42232607
>not as dysphoric
>not as

>>42232598
and what about the opposite? being treated as a man?

>>42232644
>I believe you that you're less desperate (for now anyway). I became more desperate as years went by and nothing changed.
okay yeah that makes sense, I guess i shouldn't wait for that to happen and just transition already.

>dumb psychiatrists would've likely made things worse
you don't seem very positive about psychiatrists, why is that? have you had bad experiences with them?

>>42232651
>Yes. If you can think about being a woman non-sexually as well and dedicate significant amounts of time to doing just that, you're not AGP.
I mean I can, outside of sex it doesnt matter too much for me what gender i am. but I guess thats because I don't look too masculine rn. If i had more body hair or was balding i think id hate my body way more.

>>42232676
>That's an internet brainworm.
I guess youre right, I really should care less about what others think about. thank you for all the information, and sharing your experiences i really appreciate it.

>>42232709
>sure but that doesn't mean anything
Why doesn't it mean anything

>>42232855
what do you think it means??

>>42231213
No. Just stop watching porn and also stop being infected by the normgroid view of masculinity.

You can be your own type of man, it doesn't mean you need to become a woman.

>>42232869
seem like youre implying AGP is a valid reason to transition

>>42232651
Well, I can. But I’m too scared to troon. I wouldn’t pass and I’m scared of needles.

Also I worry that I’m just making up the non-sexual part of it to justify some kind of weird fetish. Like I’m only doing it because I think I have to.

>>42232709
>doesn’t mean anything
As in like, it’s one of those weird kink shit things I always see. Crossies who dress up with their wives in bed at age 50 or something. I’m worried I might be one of them instead of a real tranny.

>>42232773
I don’t really think about it. I’ve never tried to have sex.

>>42232878
yeah maybe, i thought about it like that as well... Although I've been cross dressing since i was a kid, and i've had thoughts like this since before i started watching porn. porn probably made it worse though, but i don't think it's the only reason im like this...

>>42232840
>outside of sex it doesnt matter too much for me what gender i am
But it does matter, though. What gender you are routinely decides how many friends you have, what social support network (if any) and how fast (if at all) people open up to you or accept your friendship.

>you don't seem very positive about psychiatrists, why is that?
because psychiatry is like alchemy: it's partially a science but partially still dark voodoo shit. And on tranny stuff, I'm now very confident that psychiatrists don't actually know more than the fine people at /hrtgen/
My psychiatrists (yes, plural, not a type-o) prescribed me ssris and/or to spend time in the hospital under surveillance. No matter how often I'd tell 'em that I'm not suicidal and that shutting down the brain via ssris would merely postpone the problem, they simply wouldn't listen.
I ignored their ideas and was better off for it. One of them now refuses to talk to me because he doesn't want to admit he was wrong.
Yes, a lot of trannies are self-hating. And this board is choke full of bad-faith actors and self-hating baby trans (who usually have more than two mental health comorbidities). So I'm not saying go completely around psychiatrists (in fact I explicitly told you to ask them too), but I am saying that you shouldn't take their word as gospel or as inherently superiour/more trustworthy just because they have a diploma and a coat. On trans stuff, they're actually not that up to date (altho in NL I heard they're above EU average).
In Europe we're taught from a young age to trust the authorities. Well, I just... don't. The authority told me that I'm a man, that that's unchangeable, that i need ssris and that i'd never pass. 100% wrong so far.
Tread carefully.
Hugs

>>42232884
i just dont think its a reason not to if there are other factors and also that it can obscure other factors. the "fetish" could be just a cope because its something private and intimate where you can express your true deepest feelings. but idk you

>>42232894
>I don’t really think about it. I’ve never tried to have sex.
what about being treated as a man in a romantic relationship. like even outside of sex or top/sub dynamics

>>42232952
hi @european ex incel, current trans woman
(I posted this message in your own thread as well)
I am nearly 3 months on HRT, 21 y/o, with passing potential.
I've been terminally AGP since before puberty. So much so that I never craved intimacy with anyone, and only ever fantasized about becoming a woman myself. Also developed dysphoria regarding body, facial hair, hair loss, masculinizing face.

Yet, I immensely struggle, because I can't let go of my male identity and male stereotypical qualities. Like being dominant, assertive, high-achieving. I am also simply not very empathetic.
All in all, terminally malebrained.

You mentioned going through a crisis period, with the female side winning.
I feel like going through a bit of a crisis myself.
Do you have any idea on how to make one side decisively win? Because the current flip-flopping of my desires and will to continue HRT is tearing me apart.

>>42233003
>in a romantic relationship
I don’t know. I don’t really want relationships either. They sound like a lot of hard work for what’s basically a good friend.

I don’t know what that would mean anyway. Like, is it the whole “being a strong protector/provider” thing? I wouldn’t want that but also it sounds very 1950s. Are there male and female roles in modern relationships?

>>42232952
>But it does matter, though.
I know you said your social life has improved since transitioning. I guess it has made a big difference, does sound like a nice benefit as well desu.

>I'm now very confident that psychiatrists don't actually know more than the fine people at /hrtgen/
ah okay thank you for the info on this, i really appreciate it. I'll watch out for that stuff when i'm talking to a psychiatrist eventually.

>I ignored their ideas and was better off for it.
Okay so I guess I should just try get on hrt, see how it goes, i guess that is just my best option rn.

Also I was wondering, is it possible to kind of determine how well you will pass before starting hrt?

>>42233036
>Because the current flip-flopping of my desires and will to continue HRT is tearing me apart.
Yeah I'm still a little scared of struggling with this kind of thing as well.

>>42233128
>is it possible to kind of determine how well you will pass before starting hrt?
Not realistically, no.
And a lot of the perorations on this board are basically honscience. In reality it really is an individual thing.
Height, shoulders and face help, but they're not the be all and end all either. FFS exists and it's a lot more effective than self-hating trannies on this board make it be.
Demeanor/mannerisms and voice are a lot more important to passing than most physical aspects. And these two are 100% under your control too.

>sounds very 1950s. Are there male and female roles in modern relationships?
YES!
Most people aren't gigaprogs and "enlightened". They may say they are, but they aren't. Because a lot of these roles and preferences are at least partially hardcoded.
Would my bf still be with me if I weren't sweet fem and deferring to him? Likely, maybe,... idk. But what I do know is that it makes him feel really well and in return I get the hugs that I crave and we're better off for it.
Real life is neither "liberal" nor "conservative". But a very idiosyncratic mixture of the two. It's why gigacommies and /pol/tards are so laughable. Because they live in an imaginary world.
I learned this the hard way as a man. The world isn't just. The world just is. A lot of it's "rules" can be bent, but some cannot, no matter what people say in order to hugbox or make themselves feel better.

>>42233036
That's a hard one. Will reply on the other thread. Apologies in advance for the wall of text.

>>42233272
Thank you so much in advance!

>>42231213
you are really young, I'd say go for it, and fast. Don't rep at all, just get the meds try it, and if you aren't feeling it stop.

>>42231249
Im saying this as somebody that transitioned in their mid 30s, but knew I was probably trans since my late teens...

You can do it now, have doubts, and wonder how your life would have played out if you stayed male, at the same time you will get way better results if you transition.

Or you can wait until you have zero doubt you are trans but then all you will have to look forward to is being a tranny milf or cougar. And you will be lamenting the time and experiences you lost.

For me its really nice having zero doubts but I also wish I had done this sooner.

>>42233240
>Not realistically, no.
Ah okay, thats too bad.

Well anyway, thank you for all of the information. I truly appreciate you taking the time to answer all my (probably dumb) questions. It was really helpful hearing your perspective. Thank you.

To be honest im still not 100% sure that i want this. But i think im gonna try it anyways, just see how it goes.

>>42233354
>Don't rep at all, just get the meds try it, and if you aren't feeling it stop.
Yeah i think thats what i'll do... Still though, how should i know if im not feeling it, im kinda worried ill chicken out too fast.

>>42233459
>im kinda worried ill chicken out too fast.
Legitimate worry.
Read this wall of text on how it ends up working in practice. No sugar coating.
>>42233426
>>42233543
>>42233656

>>42233827
It feels like there is already some kind of internal struggle going on while deciding if I even want to start this or not lol. I cant imagine how much worse it will get when i get on hrt lol. I guess we will see. I'm not gonna do anything drastic just yet, ill think everything through a few more times. For now I am leaning towards transitioning though.

Well okayy, thank you so much for all off the information. It really has helped me a lot, so I just can't thank you enough lol. I'm gonna go to bed now.

>>42231213
I was in a similar place at 20, so I'll give a brief history and where I'm at now, alongside some other thoughts. take from it what you will.

firstly, you're saying all this shit like "I've been cross-dressing since 5" and "I've never had any male hobbies - I like art" to seek validation and justify why you should transition.

none of this stuff is an indication you were born in the "wrong body". you're just a sensitive, neurodivergent, agp boy like so many of us on this board - but that doesn't necessarily mean that you shouldn't transition.

I socially transed at 17, medically at 20, and then detransed at 21 after realizing I had agp and feeling my lifestyle misaligned with my religious views.

I was on hrt for < 1 year, but after stopping med transition and working out, nobody would've guessed I was trans the year prior. you won't irreparably ruin your attractive male looks by just going on hrt if you decide to detrans later.

I spent 22-24 dating girls and socializing as a man. it was an empty, depressing time and I disassociated a lot, but I don't regret it.

it gave me contrast to compare lifestyles, which helped me decide what I really wanted. I think it was a necessary experience. I retransed shortly after my 24th birthday and went back to being gay.

from my experience, these thoughts don't go away. I think they can be managed, even ignored entirely, but this can be very depressing after a while.

the good news is you have a choice, but you need to really commit to managing these feelings if not transitioning is the path you choose. try to build such a fulfilling and busy life as a man that the thoughts have no place in your life.

the bad news is if you revisit these feelings with any genuine consideration, they can take over your life and become something you rue over until you're a dysphoric mess. it's tempting to return to these considerations at your low points, which makes navigating the lows as a man more difficult than it already is.

>>42235254
>try to build such a fulfilling and busy life as a man that the thoughts have no place in your life
different anon
I tried that. Did it successfully. For 20 years.
Starting hrt today.
The option you're proposing was likely very good for 1926. But in 2026 it's torture. And I'm done with the masochistic phase.

>>42235287
But why doesn't it work in 2026? I'm not the OP but I don't see any point in trooning if I know I won't pass.

>>42235357
True. Just boymoder and cross dress in private. Its the based and tradpill.

>>42235357
>>42235383
Not interested in tradpill. Or crossdressing for that matter.
my thought patterns just don't fit. At all. Fembrained would be an understatement. I basically function on autopilot.
The neurological effects of E is what I'm looking for. Then I'll see for anything else.
I'm very healthy, still cute face and at ~171cm I'm not super tall. I'm still okay if I never pass. But you betcha I'll make an honest attempt.

>But why doesn't it work in 2026?
Because ffs exists and hrt exists.
It's like clinging to using a horse carriage in 2026. Sure, technically still possible but why torture yourself?
Technology (especially somewhat successful technology) does come with changes in human behaviors. It was always like that and will always be like that.

>>42231213
>Should I transition
stopped reading there, answer is yes.

>>42231813
>unless you live in Germany.
elaborate!

>>42235428
>The neurological effects of E
There are none. It's a placebo in that regard. AGPs get tickled by the idea of having female sex hormone levels in their body.

>>42235551
long waiting lists, the new weird digitalization law that makes getting treatment for chronic conditions difficult (not just gd, but diabetes, some forms of cancer and quite a few others) and the hondosing
the official way in Germany is simply fucked. It's 3 years just to get a diagnosis. And the official dosages are just bad.

>>42231213
From the way you type I'm willing to bet that you have more female friends than male friends. Regarding your question, you probably shouldn't but you'll probably do it anyway

>>42235357
Hrt is cognitohazard

>>42235847
Aah I see, I thought you're taking about diy somehow getting banned in Germany.

>>42236042
>diy somehow getting banned in Germany
i don't think it is. But deutsche post can be weird with the customs paperwork.
i don't live there but i understand some german and saw several news about the new "reforms". Also on another forum/board the german trannies were complaining about deutsche post sometimes blocking their DiY shipments.
it really sucks balls to live in germany in general, not just as a tranny.

>>42235642
>>The neurological effects of E
>There are none
Sure buddy.
Everyone's just imagining things.

https://pmc.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/articles/PMC4491541/

ig you're on a crusade because transition didn't work out for you but you also need to remember not everyone is you either. And not everyone has your fetishes and not everyone has the same objectives in life.

>>42235642

It does influence how neurotransmitters and their uptake but there is no evidence for this 'feminine shit' people describe

>>42235642
There probably isn't some "hormone correcting" effect that the troons describe but remember that AGP and dysphoria are two sides of the same coin for AGPs. E suppresses the sex drive which cuts off some oxygen from the problem, and the physical changes are emotionally and aesthetically satisfying for them. Both seem to help.