What do the “you are gods” verses mean in the Bible?It first appears in Psalms, 81 in the Greek numbering, 82 in the Hebrew>A psalm for Asaph. God hath stood in the congregation of gods: and being in the midst of them he judgeth gods.>2 How long will you judge unjustly: and accept the persons of the wicked?>3 Judge for the needy and fatherless: do justice to the humble and the poor.>4 Rescue the poor; and deliver the needy out of the hand of the sinner.>5 They have not known nor understood: they walk on in darkness: all the foundations of the earth shall be moved.>6 I have said: You are gods and all of you the sons of the most High.>7 But you like men shall die: and shall fall like one of the princes.>8 Arise, O God, judge thou the earth: for thou shalt inherit among all the nations.It’s referred to again in John chapter 10>30 I and the Father are one.>31 The Jews then took up stones to stone him.>32 Jesus answered them: Many good works I have shewed you from my Father; for which of these works do you stone me?>33 The Jews answered him: For a good work we stone thee not, but for blasphemy; and because that thou, being a man, maketh thyself God.>34 Jesus answered them: Is it not written in your law: I said you are gods?>35 If he called them gods, to whom the word of God was spoken, and the scripture cannot be broken;>36 Do you say of him whom the Father hath sanctified and sent into the world: Thou blasphemest, because I said, I am the Son of God?It seems to break a lot of common interpretations of biblical polytheism. The traditional view is that the other gods in the Bible are demons or false gods, but these specific passages seem to show God giving power and approving other gods, and Jesus seems to affirm it as a form of polytheism. The scholarly view tends to say the ancient Israelites believed in a council of gods (Elohim) of which Yahweh was a part, but this passage refers to God (Elohim) not the LORD (Yahweh).The Mormon view seems to have been invented solely to explain these passages, but even their view doesn’t make sense. They say Elohim is the personal name of a god (former Mormon) and that these verses prove you can become a god too. But what the verses are saying is “Elohim stood in the council of Elohim” and in verse 6 “I have said you are Elohim.”If this is just a holdover from ancient Israelite polytheism, why wasn’t it removed from Psalms during the redaction process? If it was just an obscure passage nobody thought of, why is it referenced in the New Testament?
>>23541395>They say Elohim is the personal name of a god (former Mormon) and that these verses prove you can become a god too.I mean I don't even see how someone could read even just Genesis and not pick this up from the Book. Man's potential divinity is alluded to throughout.
>>23541395>The scholarly view tends to say the ancient Israelites believed in a council of gods (Elohim) of which Yahweh was a partYahweh isn't "a part" of the council, he is the judge of the council.>but this passage refers to God (Elohim) not the LORD (Yahweh)The choice of Elohim rather than Yahweh contrasts him with the gods of the council. They are gods; he is God.I don't see it as out of line with the rest of the Bible. Elohim has a broader meaning than "god" in English. Samuel is called a god when the witch of Endor brings him up from Sheol, for example. But I do understand the gods in the council to be the same as angels. Michael is identified in Daniel as the angel of Israel. Deuteronomy 32:8-9 sees the nations as each having their own angel (I take "son of God", angel, and "elohim" to be equivalent)>When the Most High gave to the nations their inheritance, >when he divided mankind, >he fixed the borders of the peoples >according to the number of the sons of God.>But the LORD's portion is his people, >Jacob his allotted heritage.So Yahweh, the Most High God, judges the gods/angels of the nations (which are closely identified with ruling regimes anyway) for failing to judge justly.
>>23542065This. If you want to read more check out Lord of Spirits podcast, especially the first episodes. They lay it all out. There are transcripts if you would rather read than listen.
>>23541395Good question.The term "God" or "gods" in the Old Testament has several usages, and they don't all point to the Lord, the one true God of the Bible. The first one is what you already alluded to, which is the false gods. Psalm 96 makes it clear that these entities are nothing more than idols, but idols to which people ascribe divine attributes rather than to the Lord God."For all the gods of the nations are idols: but the LORD made the heavens."(Psalm 96:5)Now the meaning of the term "gods" in Psalm 82 is yet another meaning, and it isn't the first time that this use of the term "gods" is used. For instance, Exodus 22:28 in the KJV says this:"Thou shalt not revile the gods, nor curse the ruler of thy people."(Exodus 22:28)Here we see the use of a hebraism, which is where synonymous terms are used in parallel. "The gods" here in this verse is not meant to refer either to the false gods nor to God proper. Instead, this application of the term (elohim) is actually in reference to judges who are appointed to render judgements to Israel. In fact, the KJV translates this same term (elohim) as "judges" earlier in the same chapter of Exodus. In this context, it is referring to human magistrates.The divine author of the Bible seems to be very well aware of His own usage of this term in this way by referencing it later in Psalm 82, as you read here. He draws a distinction between the fact that these people were called "gods" (alternatively translated as "judges) in places like Exodus 22:8 and 22:28, versus the reality that they shall die "like men." Of course, Jesus makes use of this same passage from Psalm 82 (which, itself, references back to Exodus 22) as well in John chapter 10.The use of this term seems to be intended to indicate the relative position of these "judges" and the authority they would to have over Israel during their tenure. They were to have the role of deciding the truth in matters of great consequence. In a sense, they were (at least temporarily) standing in the place of God for the people who they governed. Even so, the use of the term "elohim" to describe these judges is a striking one, to the point that the Psalmist in Psalm 82 is able to make a dichotomy between the fact that these people are "called gods" yet they shall ultimately "die like men." Hopefully that helps.The term "God" in this context can be thought of as a role. In this sense God is a recognized authority to decide truth. The one true God is really that authority. But He can and has set people up to stand in for Him at times, such as Moses and others, apparently to accomplish His own purposes. Hence, we have statements like the following as well:"And he shall be thy spokesman unto the people: and he shall be, even he shall be to thee instead of a mouth, and thou shalt be to him instead of God."(Exodus 4:16)"And the LORD said unto Moses, See, I have made thee a god to Pharaoh: and Aaron thy brother shall be thy prophet."(Exodus 7:1)
>>23541395I would explain it, but I don't feel like it. I'll at least say this: stay away from Mormonism, and just study your Bible well. If you're a Christian who has received the Holy Spirit, you'll understand eventually. If not, well, now you know what you need to do.
>>23541395We are made in the image of God.That said, even though I don't believe what you said, I'll add that Jesus called himself "The son of Man" a lot.
