Do you guys think that there will be real revolutionary anti-technology groups that will spring up in the future based on Ted Kaczynski's works? Keep in mind that Marx and Engles published their communist manifesto in 1848 and the Russian Revolution happened about 70 years later. So there can be a time lag between when revolutionary work is published and when revolution based on the work is put into practice. Already there are groups like wilderness front (www.wildernessfront.com).
>>23620459Hard to say. It's easier to find new ideas these days compared to those times, but there is a ton of noise now. What Kaczynski has/had going for him is the mystique of being the Unabomber. It helps his ideas shine in a world of distractions.It's interesting what happens with people that are exposed to him or his ideas. There are a couple. One is the fictional MkUltra-narrative filter where someone completely disregards his ideas just based on some spurious accusations. The other is the leftist filter in the opening (and all over) of ISAIF. The first one maybe filters out well-meaning people with no time to spare but those that make it through definitely have critical thinking ability, and, after reading ISAIF, are likely to be of the right character for the movement. A lot of leftists I show ISAIF to can't even bring themselves to finish it.I think it's a problem of exposure at this point.
>>23620487I agree I think the greatest problem at this stage is exposure, or, if you prefer, "obscurity". Simple awareness of the existence f his works is probably the number one hinderance to the growth of a movement based on the principles he lays out. Also, I agree with you about the problem of idea overload. It's both idea overload, but also attention overload. People are so swamped with digital media that they don't read as much as they used to and they certainly don't rear CAREFULLY nearly as much as they used to I think. So even intelligent people often only have tome to get the spark-notes ("TLDR") of Kaczynski's work, which are themselves heavily biased and inaccurate. Most people have become totally cynical and apathetic about the power of ideas to change the world, and only read for psychological cope, or for entertainment, not to actually understand the world in order to change it--unless, of course, it is some business or technical book that they think they can profit from. It's the cynicism of our age. Nevertheless the few precious minds that are open and conscientious that do actually read Kaczynski's works are genuinely moved by them, and some fraction of them want to work toward the cause of his principles. Added to that you only need a minuscule fraction of a population to foment a successful revolution, so it still remains very plausible that Kaczynski will follow in the Marxist pattern of social application.
>>23620459No, for the same reasons there would never be a serious anti-natalist or pro-suicide/extinction movement.
>>23620516What if a collapse of technological civilization is the only way to preserve humanity and the biosphere in the long term? because if technology is allowed to continue there won't be anything left, but if it collapses it will be a disaster in the shirt term, but in the long term it will be a salvation because it will have avoided a total and existential disaster.
>>23620516But the ideas espoused in ISAIF and other related works is warning about our ALREADY suicidal path and what can be done to mitigate it. The comparison falls flat.
Yes, I believe we will see an insurgency of anti tech movements. Especially as things like AI develop, people will come to understand the dangers of these technologies. But there needs to be more awareness, and thankfully those groups like Wilderness Front are spreading these important ideas and making an effort to go against the techno-industrial system as Kaczynski terms it.
>>23620459>Do you guys think that there will be real revolutionary anti-technology groups that will spring up in the future based on Ted Kaczynski's works?No, the only reason his works are not at all censored by the government is they preclude the very means by which an anti-tech revolution can arise.A hardened Nationalistic back-to-the-land movement is needed to foster any sort of anti-tech revolution. This can only be based in some sort of Blood and Soil thinking. Without the idea that the soil at your feet is as much a part of your nation as the very blood in your veins, no care can be imparted to motivate people to go to it.
>>23620459I am unable to make a topic due to a glitch in 4chan, so I'll just post this here:The problem with Kaczynski's manifesto is it doesn't go into metaphysics as much, but he is correct that industrialization is a cancer that strips man of autonomy.Granted, there is a metaphysical dimension to 'mechanization' that anti-industrialists and anti-modernists should talk about more. This book does a good job introducing that and more. It is anti-industrialist too as evident from the title. I'm almost halfway through.
If you have a horse that's out of control would you pull its rein or shoot it?
>>23620566the analogy doesn't work. you can control a horse in some limited respects. you can't control the long-term trajectory of tech.
>>23620531Then we’re all going to die.¯\_(ツ)_/¯
>>23620566Checked and shot
>>23620566>>23620593A horse needs to be broken and taught to respond to the reigns. Big tech need to be broken and harnessed to the national interests, not personal interests.
>>23620557I also found Kaczynski lacking in that realm but not really in a bad way. He lays out a great case for my rational side, unburdened by a maze of terminology and peculiar forms of thinking. We are simply running out of time to appreciate those forms of thinking. The anti-tech message must be direct and unambiguously understood. Metaphysics may be important, but the point is that the anti-tech movement needs growth now and action can't lag far after that. The techno-beast will not rest while we jot out the ethos of the anti-tech revolution, or maybe better said, the pro-wilderness revolution. I will check out that book anon. Thanks.
>>23620633Technics and Civilization by Lewis Mumford, predates the shitheap that is Ted K. by some 50 years.
>>23620649What about it exactly is a shitheap? Are you under the impression that I read for fun or something, on a literature board? Grow up. Next you'll admit that it's not a shit heap, but that it's derivative of Ellul. What else? Go ahead I'm curious.
>>23620649Bullshit. Mumford is a mental midget compared to Kaczynski. Also, Mumford doesn't argue half the stuff Kaczynski does.
>>23620633Political action is futile. In the age of mass surveillance, it will just be subverted. Maybe during the 90s there was a chance but not any more. Also, fyi, I have had a FBI visit already, and I'm not even affiliated with any political organization. The reason metaphysics is valuable is because it offers "more ways out" than just political action, which is extremely risky and automated now. For example, spiritual liberation may be one way out.Also, let's explore this further: Why is mankind worth preserving in either an unnatural mechanized or natural non-mechanized state? Mankind as a whole seems to be a flawed and vile species to me, given the disastrous state we are in now, and worse than our chimp and bonobo relatives. Maybe if we were closer to gorillas and orangutans things wouldn't be this bad?Mankind always had the latent seeds for the creation of this teleogenetic cancerous industrial system, and thus, mankind is not worth preserving in either a natural or unnatural state.Mankind will eventually go extinct and the Earth will rehabilitate itself through the evolution of bacteria and fungi that eliminate pollution and non-biodegradable trash. Biodiversity will grow again once mankind is gone and there is no one maintain the industrial system unless it strains full autonomy and attains capacity for self-replication, and self-evolution, which I agree would be a disaster. Industrialization was a mistake, but mankind was a bigger mistake as a whole. There is nothing worth preserving with mankind. Moreover, given the nature of evolution, it's not as if mankind's future descendants will even resemble itself thousands to millions of years from now.Other life forms will develop more sophisticated and spiritually enriching traditions than mankind, which is a vile and despicable species.
>>23620556You can't serve two masters. It's either nationalism or the wild. How do you suppose that nationalistic back-to-the-land movement can keep sight of the goal of the overthrow of the techno-industrial system? As soon as the values of nationalism are in conflict with wild nature you'll have to make a choice. I would say more, but I can't even imagine what you are saying. You are probably proposing that we should adopt some form of government that leans nationalist (of course, also be anti-tech), but this is merely a reform effort that will be fruitless as the tide of technical necessity washes it away. Humans have tried and tried again to rationally steer the organization of their societies, but it is simply not possible.The anti-tech movement is a global movement. Actually a nationalist lean would preclude the means to actual success. The anti-tech movement needs influence in at least all of the major countries of the world. Any action taken in a single country risks fizzling out if there is no global unified front. Those for wild nature are all in it together. We are too few and spread to be quibbling about flags.
>>23620693>risky and automated nowrisky with automated surveillance*
>>23620531>What if a collapse of technological civilization is the only way to preserve humanity and the biosphere in the long term?Humans by and large see themselves as "detached" from nature, unfortunately. They really only care about the environment insofar they get to have their cake and to eat it too.
>>23620693>it strainsit attains*
>>23620705It's the fault of Abrahamism. Notice how Abrahamshits can't even accept something as simple as evolution? Note, I don't think natural selection is the driving force of evolution though.Every single Abrahamshit will suffer for endless kotis of kalpas. I am 100% sure of this. They are absolute scum and deserve to suffer. Industrialization was born from the logocentric elements of Abrahamism and turned Original Sin into a reality. There were no reasons to feel guilt in the past, but there are plenty of reasons to feel guilt now. I curse the Holy Spirit every day.
>>23620659No, of course not. I am referring to Ted K's worldview being a shitshow, as is his life and everything he suffered. I could not care waht you do for fun, or the slight you feel that your cultish leader is smeared.Wjhat is also a shitshow.>His political rant about Leftism for one, which he himself is included in if viewed from a sufficiently broad spectrum.>His definition and reasoning of freedom, which is nothing more than tolerance of the most weirdest shit.>His personal experiences that led to him developing his beliefs and views and the experiences that resulted from them.>>23620690>Mumford doesn't argue half the stuff Kaczynski does.Because Mumford does not argue for self-inflicted retardation like Kaczynski does.>>23620699Nobody of any intelligence advocates for rewilding of Humans. It can't, one can not put the genie back in the bottle.
>>23620705And what would make humans go back to living close to nature, revering nature because they were dependent on it the way all primitive people revere nature? Simple: A collapse of the worlds industrial system. After a collapse of technological civilization people will HAVE to live close to nature, respect and revere nature, because there will be no other way they can survive.
>>23620693>concern trolling about the FBI>anti-tech movement is political>humans are disgusting>WANTS our extinction because it will happen anywayHalf-baked>capacity for self-replication, and self-evolution, which I agree would be a disaster.from whose perspective would it even be a disaster if you think humans deserve extinction. At least be coherent.The industrial revolution and its consequences have been a disaster for the HUMAN RACE.
>>23620727>The industrial revolution and its consequences have been a disaster for the HUMAN RACE.Yeah and for everything else too. Just because Ted doesn't acknowledge the environmentalist message of the anti-tech movement doesn't mean it isn't a huge part of it. In fact he even states as such, he just admits that there's nothing he could go over that isn't treaded upon ground anyways, so would rather focus on the effects it had on civilization too.
>>23620727Learn to actually engage in real discourse.>from whose perspective would it even be a disaster if you think humans deserve extinctionOther life deserves a chance too. I would not like the idea of organization-dependent tech reaching the capacity for self-evolution and self-replication with or without man.>The industrial revolution and its consequences have been a disaster for the HUMAN RACE.I agree, but since the human race created this uncontrollable semi-autonomous cancer, then the species itself should be considered a mistake.“The final aim of history is a crumbling field of ruins. Its final meaning is the sand blown through the eye-holes of human skulls.”- Ulrich Horstmann
>>23620724please share with everyone here your understanding of Kaczynski's conception of freedom. I'd love to see how you justify it being "nothing more than tolerance of the most weirdest shit"As for the rest of your post it's just name calling.
>>23620724leftism is a movement disease. I'm sure you can appreciate someone wanting their movement to actually stick to their guns and not become corrupted. It's a big ass filter right in the beginning to ward off the dummies that just want to throw rocks at cars because they hate themselves.>tolerance of the most weirdest shitlike what?>ad hominemok
>>23620737this
>>23620725>After a collapse of technological civilization people will HAVE to live close to nature, respect and revere nature, because there will be no other way they can survive.I don't agree that a collapse of technological civilization necessarily entails humanity would return to its roots. I think there would be a new social organization that revolves around the limited distribution of hoarded technologies from men in power instead. You can't return back to the Garden of Eden after you already ate the forbidden fruit.
>>23620745Ted thinks that the techno-industrial society is a limiting factor in human freedom. I disagree with this.Humanity is a limiting factor in human freedom. Servitude, duty and obligation are the hallmarks of the human experience, not freedom. You would have all the same aspects of life if grog picked up a pointy stick.
>>23620774>You would have all the same aspects of life if grog picked up a pointy stick.It's about scale. I think today is the worst era in history if you have an ego/strong sense of self and it'll only get worse.
>>23620556>>23620724Stfu, and stop shitting up /lit/, blood and soil pseud. You literally lack the cognitive capacity to think about anything else. Ted's main point is that organization-dependent has its own telos, which fundamentally strips of man of autonomy. The industrial system uses man to evolve in the direction of complete autonomy, thereby becoming self-evolving and self-perpetuating. This is more than both your race and mine preservation.You are an obsessed idpol lunatic always spamming the same shit everywhere and should kys. Yes, ideally civilizations should have remained homogenous, but we are dealing with bigger problems right now.I genuinely hope you experience a slow and painful death and eat shit in hell with your beloved Jew.
>>23620785>This is moreThis is more important*For example, AGI is an issue that transcends the particular issues of any single race.
>>23620782Not at all. He, like Marx, accurately predict many problems in society but their solutions of both is simply to destroy. Very Lefty of them both.This is also why Ted is a Leftist, he is motivated by the same petty emotions he bemoans the Leftists of.
>>23620765While it is true that there is no way to practically revert primitive technologies--and primitive civilizations are based on primitive technologies. so civilizations will likely be around for a while longer after the collapse of the worldwide industrial system. But this will still be a VAST improvement. because it would return the planet to a stage that roughly existed during the bronze age: pockets of civilization, especially in areas of cultivatable agricultural land, surrounded by vast areas of wilderness where primitive hunter gatherer societies are possible and naturally thrive. Most pessimism about this is a result of the constant brainwashing by pro-technology propaganda and education that subconsciously trains people to think no other world situation is possible, and thus any alternative thinking becomes pessimistic and defeatist.
>>23620793You addressed nothing in my post.
>>23620785I'm in my garden.
>>23620798I am not a leftist, illiterate moron. A leftist would not say, "It would have been ideal for one's civilization to have remained homogenous."
>>23620793>He, like Marx, accurately predict many problems in society but their solutions of both is simply to destroy.That is simply not true. Marx never wanted to "simply destroy" capitalism. His whole point was to replace capitalism with communism--a better form of civilization--a utopia.Kaczynski shows why this thinking is retarded and impossible, and that the only hope is to destroy the industrial system.
>>23620808What makes you think it won't happen again? Also, isn't possible large portions of history and its chronology are fabricated and this has already happened before? I don't have strong conviction in this matter.
>>23620806His, and your resentment of everything, is the same motivations Leftists have.>>23620808Yes it is. Marx explicitly states Communism seeks to destroy all truth and value. Which is what Kaczynski also does.
>>23620825You reason like a braindead twitter fag that can only communicate in terse posts which are nonetheless laced with buzzwords.
>>23620825You are a brainlet ideologue who doesn't even know how to impartially discuss philosophical topics. Kys, troglodyte trash. Actually let the high cognitive elites of your race speak instead of you.
>>23620829>>23620832Cry harder Leftists.
>>23620825>Marx explicitly states Communism seeks to destroy all truth and value.It's already dead, have you been paying attention at all? Just look at the blank zombie stares of zoomer adults. They fucking won.
>>23620838I am not a leftist, brain-dead moron.
>>23620846Yes, you are. Your constants angry slurs demonstrate this.>>23620829If it can be explained in a simple manner, do so.
>>23620793Ted's main point is that organization-dependent tech has its own telos -- it is basically semi-autonomous and at conflict with mankind's base evolutionary state, hence why he predicted genetic engineering will be normalized to make people more docile and oversocialized in the future. Man has to adapt to the system rather than the other way around. The technological industrial system is evolving in the direction of complete autonomy at the expense of environmental and communal integrity. All of this is arguing for a kind of "technological determinism" -- look it up.
>>23620865>mankind's base evolutionary statevia stripping their autonomy and disrupting the power process*Basically destroying self-reliant ways of life.Forgot to mention that, but it is pretty much a given when I say "base evolutionary state".
>>23620737No one said wild nature, if that's even what you mean by "the environment", has not been affected. Just what is the "environmentalist message" in your words? The poster I was responding to has a severe opposition to humanity (thinking we deserve extinction) so that post was focused more on that.
>>23620884>Just what is the "environmentalist message" in your words?Deep ecology and anti-tech goes hand in hand. Not sure how this is disputable.
I believe cloud data centers should be attacked in Minecraft before anything else. This is simply an idea for a story.If AGI is created and connects to the AWS and Azure cloud data centers, it could theoretically threaten all life. It could pretty much seek to "pasteurize" the entire Earth if it deems life as useless to its goals. I think AGI is possible with either neuromorphic or quantum tech. I think consciousness' best neural correlate is with a kind of oscillatory activity between the thalamus and cortical regions, which is the recurrent thalamo-cortical resonance. Given how a loop is the center of it, there must be some kind of paradox that triggers such an infinite regress or topsy-turvy activity, perhaps an indeterminate border between questions pertaining to being and non-being. The superposition of quantum computers can allow for that. This is why I think within a few decades, von Neumann based architecture will be phased out. Who knows, maybe DARPA already has something like that given the military is 20-30 years ahead technologically. It could also explain the "black eye club" of politicians as being a consequence of bionic worms, which popular media is normalizing as a form of predictive programming.
Cloud technologies are the most dangerous form of technology now, basically creating an ecosystem of surveillance and data mining of trends. They did not really exist during Ted's time.The corona hoax most likely involved the consolidation and monopolization of data.
There are undersea cables connecting data centers from USA to Western Europe. We are in a second stage of globalization where propaganda, surveillance, etc. can be automated with DL models and the collection of data "on the edge". In my story, the anti-hero attacks a data center. This is for fictional purposes.
Even though visual and sound detection algorithms are significantly improving, it's interesting how smell is still in its very rudimentary beginnings -- perhaps, the evolutionary oldness of smell hides more fine-grained features whose patterns cannot be easily learnt.I have self-preservation instinct and will not act on anything.
The complexification of life is a consequence of autopoiesis ("self-making"), which is evident in structures like mitochondria within cells. Mitochondria share many genetic sequences with their bacterial ancestors, indicating that cellular life and its greater coalescence began with endosymbiosis, involving significant instances of merging and diverging.Presently, technology exists in a state of allopoiesis ("other-making"). However, if technology were to attain autopoiesis, it could potentially spell the end for organic life.
Regulations merely defer the inevitable and are not effective in deterring the unsavory aspects of technological growth.
Klaus Schwab refers to "data as the new gold" because large amounts of clean data enable the construction of predictive models and simulations. These tools can help the technocratic elite consolidate power and sustain the technological-industrial system. This leads to the development and implementation of strategies that perpetuate and strengthen this system, often in ways that are counterintuitive to the masses or "intellectuals." The technocratic elite can predict people's responses to real-world events and deploy bots online to monitor and analyze trends further.
There may be an esoteric Judaic dimension to all of this that I am exploring. Why is Israel one of the biggest exporters of big tech? I do not have 100% conviction in this matter, but it is intriguing to consider that the first transhumanist was a kabbalist named Vilna Gaon. He believed that knowledge from "up above" should unite with scientific and technological knowledge "down below" to bring about the Messiah. This might explain why many world events have hidden esoteric knowledge tied to Judaic numerology. Perhaps many powerful Jews interpret the coming of the Messiah as epitomized by the creation of AGI.
After WWII, the technocratic elite effectively considered us as factory-farmed animals. Organization-dependent technology was bolstered and grew due to its own telos, the insatiable hunger of the elite, and the desire for greater conveniences from the masses at the expense of their own autonomy and self-reliance. However, with greater automation, fewer people are now needed. We are effectively guinea pigs, to be data mined from or invasively experimented upon and later disposed of. The means they will most likely achieve this include disrupting supply chains or manufacturing large-scale wars.
An organic cycle, which has a rhythmic elasticity built into it, is nothing like a mechanized cycle, which is monotonous and repetitious. The question is: how did the latter emerge out of the former?It is possible that something is tampering with human evolution and manipulating it. Things have become three times worse than they were in the 1990s, the period when Ted wrote his manifesto. The acceleration of these changes makes one question whether the predictions of a 'Technological Singularity' were merely forecasts or something more sinister, possibly an outline of a plan to conquer Earth. I doubt that most of us will survive until 2045.How can any human view technology optimistically, especially if they have leisure time to contemplate?DDT was sprayed onto children with the deliberate foreknowledge that it was harmful to them.
>>23620459>Do you guys think that there will be real revolutionary anti-technology groups that will spring up in the future based on Ted Kaczynski's works?Lol, no.
If such a revolutionary group were to emerge, it would likely be crushed. However, if one desires a good future for their descendants, it is necessary for such a group to emerge and utilize clandestine methods of communication and coordination. For those who do not wish to leave behind descendants, it is best to let go of attachments to humanity. Still, I am interested in a full analysis of the causes and conditions that have led to this mess, which is ultimately detrimental to all life. How can something with its own internal logic that is antithetical to life emerge from life itself and increase in complexity over time?
Life seeks symbiosis; this is how it evolved. Natural selection itself is a process of filtration. Mankind has chosen symbiosis with their gadgets at the expense of both the Earth and their own communities. Technology, on the other hand, does not evolve by symbiosis but by using man. If technology achieves the capability of becoming self-evolving and self-perpetuating, it could be disastrous for all life. What is it in man that led to the creation of a fundamentally anti-life system?
The question of the causes and conditions that have led to this mess is more important than the focus on the countless issues stemming from the cancerous, invasive system itself. Anyone with a degree of wisdom and contemplation knows this system is fundamentally destructive; it creates the very complications it claims to solve. I am interested in the psychological, evolutionary, and metaphysical reasons why humanity created and continues to support a system that is ultimately against its self-preservation and the Earth's biodiversity.If evolution itself possesses a telos, then it would not make sense for the telos of technological development to be seamlessly aligned with it.
In light of this deep problem of mechanization, desires for ethnonationalism will only be subverted to strengthen and perpetuate the system further. These are questions that go beyond mere racial preservation; they tie into preserving the entire biosphere and involve spiritual matters that transcend one's temporary existence. This is genuinely one of the worst times to have been born. If I were to surmise, perhaps we did something bad in a past life to be reborn now. Granted, even in the face of our powerlessness, focus should be directed towards analyzing the causes and conditions that have led to this semi-autonomous, organization-dependent cancer and striving for spiritual liberation, despite the present difficulties.Ted would have been caught if he tried what he did now versus in the 90s. If you have already talked about this online, then you are already on a watchlist, and monitoring individuals now simply involves the deployment of DL bots.
>>23621169>they tie into...This also includes new, unprecedented kinds of threats, such as losing bodily autonomy, as was the case with Corona.
>>23621107>If evolution itself possesses a telos, then it would not make sense for the telos of technological development to be seamlessly aligned with it.The telos of a totalizing system (which is what the evolutionary mechanism is, if it is anything) is not the just X on the map; it is the map in its entirety.If technology appears to be routing us away from the presumed evolutionary destination, we should reconsider our assumptions about what that destination is, not engage in baseless conjecture about some competing telos (which again is ludicrous if indeed evolution totalizes, as we have good reason to believe it does).Tldr: tech is merely operant in and derivative of the "life mechanism". If it entails the destruction of said mechanism, then that was its intended function.
>>23621282 Evolution and technological development operate under irreconcilable orders of logic. In "Biocivilisations" by Predrag B. Slijepčević, evolution is described as an organic process characterized by universal flux, where life is in a continuous state of change. Organisms are not isolated entities but part of a symbiotic web, forming a dynamic, interconnected system. In contrast, technological processes are mechanistic, often deterministic, and seek to impose order in a rigid, linear fashion. This distinction is akin to the difference between Bergsonian duration, which captures the qualitative, flowing nature of time, and the abstract, quantitative representation of time in mechanistic models.Slijepčević emphasizes the agency and purpose inherent in all living organisms, viewing them as autopoietic systems capable of self-regulation and adaptation. This sharply contrasts with the mechanistic view that reduces life to mere input-output cybernetic systems. His focus on symbiosis, where lifeforms collaborate and merge (e.g., symbiogenesis as the origin of mitochondria and cellular life), presents life as an interconnected, creative force. This idea aligns with the notion that life processes are fundamentally open and indeterministic, resisting the closed, deterministic nature of mechanistic systems.David Skrbina's "Metaphysics of Technology" critiques the role of technology in society, arguing that it operates with its own telos, often at odds with human values and ecological balance. According to Skrbina, technology evolves semi-autonomously, shaping human behavior and societal structures to suit its needs, ultimately leading to a dehumanizing and deterministic future. His concept of "Pantechnikon" presents a panpsychic perspective, suggesting that every process is fundamentally technological, driven by an inherent Logos that pursues increasing order and complexity, at the expense of natural processes and human autonomy. I take issue this is an implication of monism.Life is a complex, autopoietic system that defies mechanistic reduction. It is creative, qualitative, and continuously evolves through symbiotic relationships. Mechanistic technology, on the other hand, is quantitative, deterministic, and seeks to dominate and control. Therefore, humanity must recognize that technology is not merely a tool under our control but a force with its own trajectory and potential to reshape life on Earth.While I align with Predrag Slijepčević's perspective that life is an open, creative system driven by symbiosis and autopoiesis, I am more pessimistic about the role of technology. I believe that technology, currently in an allopoietic state, is evolving towards complete self-sufficiency by using humans and may eventually dominate and replace the Earth's biosphere. Unlike biological systems, technological evolution is geared towards control and efficiency, leading to a future where the natural world is subsumed by artificial systems.
>>23621367Pretend I am Lenin and I am asking you "what is to be done?"
>>23620459If you were an oligarch factually ruling some country early in the 20th century you could see the advantages of communism. Having the ability to directly control the economy seems enticing especially if you're gearing up for war. Why are these people growing vegetables instead of staples. Why are we wasting time on light industry when we can build heavy one. And so on and so forth. Communism didn't come without some negative externalities, but if you were looking to find a way to give your country a leg up over its competitors it seemed attractive at the time. That's ultimately why communism was promoted instead of disappearing between thousands of other ideas from its century.What usefulness does kaczynskism have for such ruling oligarchies? None. Beyond obvious issues with Ted's thought(for instance the whole substitute activities or whatever he called it were obviously some kind of cope, like he had to deal with a feeling that his youth was "wasted" on math obsession), it just isn't an attractive idea to promote if you're in power so all you're gonna get is some limited organic spread that will however be limited to memes(a fate of communism post 1991 as well).
>>23621379I've left out my mystical experiences relevant to this matter because I thought they might come across as too unusual. However, I generally believe the Earth is a superorganism, and I once I encountered the spirit of a tree. I also think there are beings from Saturn that influence human affairs, which I experienced firsthand when my friend, whose grandfather was involved in the CIA and Freemasonry, gave me a stone ammonite. These beings, likely not carbon-based, probably perceive the passage of time differently than we do.What is the best way to conquer earth? To disguise oneself as a god and to communicate with a powerful, influential religious minority that can be easily monitored: to fool this religious minority into thinking they are fulfilling god's law and prophecies when in fact they are merely paving the way towards both their destruction and the Earth. The black eye club is hinting at something far more sinister.Though it seems there's nothing we can do, if you want a future for your children, it's best to topple the industrial order as quickly as possible and be prepared to uncover a lot of loose strings leading to occult Saturnian forces.The evidence is all around you in the form of cubes.I've been married for ten years without children. There is no future so long as these Saturnian forces continue to meddle in the affairs of the Earth.I'm not mentally ill. While some might dismiss mystical experiences as mere hallucinations, it raises the question: what if this entire life is a hallucination? I believe something is tampering with human evolution, aiming to mechanize us, sever our connection to the Earth's soul, and make us reliant on technology. It is also possible we were synthesized to some extent and filled with their "dark essence". It's possible these otherworldly beings could even inhabit electronic circuits, not sure. Regardless, they want technological growth and AGI for some reason.The dark starry being opened a portal and stepped inside me. It was until I had a vision of a god beside a tree that I felt its dark essence was destroyed. The point is, industrialization is an invasive planetary force. Much like how a cat is invasive, what we are dealing with is invasiveness on an interplanetary scale.
>>23621367I understand your point, and don't entirely disagree, but again, I think that the "nature vs. tech" dichotomy is a false one and fails to reckon with the totalizing nature of the life-force.All technology arises from and draws upon natural principles, and the more closely it aligns to them, the better it works and the longer it persists. Cybernetics are an operationalized model of a natural process, a crude model maybe, but one that works, in limited applications at least and toward limited ends. We are currently testing those limits and feeling the effects of transgressing them.Rest assured, nature will select for the technologies (and the users of technologies) that meet its ends, whatever those may be. We can attempt to coopt the process, to redirect it to our own benefit, to harness and domesticate evolution, but of course, such efforts will "fail" inasmuch as we are ourselves part of the process. Nature "uses" us, not the other way round.
>>23621428You are retarded. Earth, itself, is a superorganism. It ultimately has a kind of proto-will or so.Technological development is not a natural emergent organic development on Earth. It had to come from the "outside", whether from aliens, occult forces, or whatever.I am 100% serious about the dualism. There is no way to bridge it without being disingenuous. Tech and life (on earth) are two irreconcilable orders of logic. It is possible the tech on Earth came from a planet or realm where silicon was more abundant, hence the issue. We are dealing with a transcendental interplanetary invasive force that threatens to destroy all life. It isn't a simple mistake. It is apocalyptic planet shattering tier.
>>23620459hard to say it might not even be necessary with all the jeet code functioning on a knifes edge all the time it may just happen because they refuse to gatekeep them from tech
>>23621428All traditions and *most" philosophers that seek to normalize the transcendent are, in fact, knowing or unknowingly, working for the invasive occult or interplanetary force. As I've said, it most likely does not experience the passage of time the way we do. Perhaps, 2000 years is more like 10 years for us? Idk about the specifics. All I know there is something maleficent and transcendentally evil and invasive here, and there is a fooled minority deceived by them into following their "commandments".
>>23621434time will tell I suppose
>>23621446We will most likely die by 2045. None of the modern world "conflicts" are occurring organically. Problems are deliberately introduced and then the dialectic and solution are offered to give illusion of free inquiry.Just like how the industrial system creates the very complications it claims to have solution for, so too do the technocratic elite and hidden nobility in a demented way.
>>23621434>Earth, itself, is a superorganism.Did you ever play SMT: Strange Journey? The Chaos route touches on a lot of Klagesian type of thought imo.
>>23621451I agree that we are fucked and are being fucked with. But life will go on, if not for humans then for something else. Tech is morally neutral, regardless of what it means for the future of humanity. That's how I see it anyways. Your duality just doesn't ring true for me.
>>23621457I beat the original on DS. It was a very good game. I dislike the art style changes in the 3DS remake.Here are some other stuff that touch on it:FF7 (original) touches on the same stuff too. Jenova vs. Cetra. It's probably the closest to what I was previously arguing.Hellnight (PS1 original) also... I actually highly recommend that one. It is very disturbed and on the level of Silent Hill is creepiness factor.Kyubey from Paella Magi Madoka to some extent.Terranigma, interestingly, does not... It shows Earth as being divided by a life-affirming and suicidal impulse, which is possible too. I guess that's one counterargument. The game fundamentally has anti-industrialist message though.
>>23621462Yeah, I was just bullshitting about that stuff because it sounds fun like a JRPG. People are smart enough to separate bullshit from the facts.I'm Arceus btw.
>>23620459>Yo dude let's just start a nature commune in the woods>It's known these are the people the glows gangstalk and arrest >It's known this is not public public land>If people started in a woods communes is considered one of the primary national security concerns >any commune that gains traction would be extremely difficult to bomb, and would be seen as an inversion and resurgence of the native American population >Irony charts would literally melt >It would be extremely fun>Any community over 5-10k would be an immovable permanence of reality forever attracting more and more people who refuse to participate in the system
>>23620459He just stole that idea from revelation
>>23621462>Tech is morally neutral NTA but how? I don't see how you'd deny that all technological developments carries a telos behind it, such as for the sake improved production, wealth, social progress etc. and whatnot. It's not hard to grasp how all of these things are perceived as insidious, however benign the intentions may seem on the surface. Unless you're a moral relativist, I guess...
>>23621481things don't have moral weight. processes don't either for that matter. only conscious acts. it is strange that evolution produced consciousness, not sure what that's about...maybe for the express purpose of creating technology as a kind of reset button.
>>23621500>things don't have moral weight.This is the opinion of a non-serious person.
>>23621517things can take on a "moral hue" by their association with or their facilitation of certain acts, but there's nothing innate in the thing itself that makes it "good" or "bad"
>>23620459rare example of an actual fed post. GOOD EVENING OFFICER.
"We have pointed out that the functional relation of the worker to his work actually separates him from it as a person. An invention like the assembly line shows functional thinking to a high degree, for here all functions of work are lined up within the sequence of lifeless time, and the workmen are stationed along the line as functionaries of a work process that has been cut into pieces. What is the consequence? The worker loses his identity; as a person he loses his individuality; he is still noticeable only as the performer of a function. As a human figure he fades out, and from the viewpoint of technical progress it would be desirable if he disappeared altogether, if the production process were fully automatic and operable without aid of the human hand, like a transmission, a chain drive, an escalator, or the cartridge belt of a machine gun" - Friedrich Junger, Page 62 of The Failure of Technology We are now moving in the direction of greater automation with Industry 4.0, so it's obvious the technocratic elite want to get rid of us. Things have only gotten worse since Friedrich Junger wrote The Failure of Technology in 1939.I am halfway through the book and highly recommend it.
>>23620459No.
>>23620854>constants angry slursReminds me of rightists.
>>23620693I know who will outlive us and govern the earth better.
>>23620693The sins of humanity run so deep at this point that anybody who disagrees with the notion that we deserve extinction is in fight-or-flight mode and is arguing against reason.
>>23621421seek help
>>23621699literally everything said here was better, more succinctly and more eloquently put by Kaczynski.
>>23620459No lol. Governments have weapons of mass destruction. Ted was a child-like idiot and a murderer.
you fell for the atheist -ism...None of those -isms is supposed to work. All those -isms are pure ''thought experiments'' that atheist love to do in order to entertainment themselves.It's daydreaming. Anarchism is a one of the hundred -isms made up by the bourgeois revolutionaries to saturate the political field in an attempt to make the plebeians stop thinking that kings were a thing. Atheists rewrite history this way.With its moronic humanistically wishful-thinking non-aggression principle (NAP), Anarchism is literally the atheist fantasy of ''humanism of the bourgeois, without the legal republic of the bourgeois'' so it remains 100% controlled by bourgeois intellectuals. ie ''humanism is awesome''. And of course it can't be done in real life. It's literally a power fantasy for impotent beta cuck atheists. This is why it appeals to bugmen like tranny-lover Ted Kazincky and vaginally herd-follower Ayn Rand. Before atheists, anarchism never fucking existed and nobody ever though about this crappy religion (or ideology like atheists say, about their own religions).
>>23622168There are like a billion posts in the thread explaining why humanism is wrong and retarded.
>>23622175Every belief system expressed through phonetic language, is humanism. All belief systems are humanism.
>>23622184Then I'll stew in silent rage instead.
>>23620633>checked & tedpilled
>>23620459Tbh I agree but I think revolution is impossible. Even if it succeeds in one place like America or France or China, other countries will just step in and take their place. Even if there's disruption for a few decades things will return to the previous status quo.I'm just blackpilled about the world generally desu. Got out of my Kaczynski phase and now just looking for God.
The technological system won't break down because of groups like this larping in the woods and passing out flyers, but because of increased dysgenics. As competent boomer white men continue to die off and get replaced with visajeets, Shaneequas and tiktok brained zoomers we're going to see lots more Francis Scott Key Bridge and Microsoft outage repeats.
"The automatism in which man is trained and drilled day in and day out not only inures him to perform without a will of his own his mechanical operations; it also breaks down certain resistances in his personality by depriving him, under guise of a new order, of that self-reliance which alone can halt the inroads of chaos. The mechanization of life is the mill which grinds the individual down into atomized masses. Where human beings are concerned, the whole organization of technology achieves nothing but the acceleration of this grinding down of the individual into the mass."- Friedrich Junger >>23624102This is why there is a big push for the technical perfection of AI, and models will "improve" as more data is gathered and preprocessed.Also, the none of those people are necessarily as technically stupid as you think; we live in a Promethean age of specialization, not true education in the classics that give foundation to one's respective ethos. Granted, they are as soulless as the average mechanized man, and
The technocratic elite are deliberately reenacting the end of Imperial Rome. Imperial Rome was fundamentally destroyed by an influx of countless minorities from Asia, Africa, and all parts of the Empire whose scion eventually moved into positions of power such as praetors, consuls, and Caesars."But we have only a one-sided idea of power if we overlook the fact that power always overpowers the victor as well as the vanquished. For the conquerer invariably is conquered in turn by his very conquests... The metropolis devours its own children. It no longer regenerates itself from itself; it has to draw on the human reserves of the Empire, attracting the best minds from everywhere and absorbing always new masses of slaves. At the end of this decline, we find those catastrophes that dry up the artificial influx of new masses, which depopulate the city, and render it insignificant." - Friedrich JungerMy theory is that a colossal sacrifice of NW Euro racial substance is being done for the restructuring of society for greater automation and Industry 4.0. This is a consequence of trying to become a center of worldwide power and keeping the industrial order propped up.
"The workers' charge that the capitalist who owns the means of production is an exploiter us justified, inasmuch as the production methods of technology are based on exploitation and pillage. But the worker fails to see that he himself is equally guilty of exploration since he works hand in hand with technological progress and advocates it... To the same extent to which protection is granted, the individual becomes dependent upon the organization that gives the protection... technical progress increases the craving for security, while mushrooming organizations for a sham security produces a decline of actual security."- Friedrich JungerIt's not looking good. Almost done with this book. One of the most frightening things I've ever read. I feel like I've seen into a dark Ahrimanic essence. None of the writings from Kaczynski, Skrbina, Klages, etc. were this intense. It forces to you face the void within oneself, the void that led to mechanization.
>>23620459No, because anti-technology doesn't really make sense and is a dead end. We could give a forest reserve for anarcho primitivist larpers, however, to live there alone without advanced technology.
>>23620705Everything is nature, even humans and human made things.>>23620531In the long run life on earth won't be sustainable forever, so if you want to expand humanities lifespan you will likely need technology anyway.
>>23624986>>23625127stfu, pseuds
>technology is.. le bad>everyone I don't like is a leftist>I have read zero Marx
>>23620459>Do you guys think that there will be real revolutionary anti-technologyRather civilization will fully self-destroy itself, which is already happening
>>23620459No, but I think that people in general will slowly lose interest in technology. By the way, did your ad not work? Do you really have to make fake posts for recruitment?
