Why did he hate Germany/Germans so much?
>>23819439>he thought alcohol was one of mankind's greatest vice>he thought martin luther killed the renaissance
>>23819439Because Germans are just niggers with a higher IQ.
>>23819439He hated what Germans became but always loved what they were or could be.
>>23819445Didn’t he also said that the German philosophy was poisoned with theology?
>>23819439Because he was based and redpilled on the Mediterranean
>>23819439https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Bildungsb%C3%BCrgertum
>>23819439He was a disciple of Luther, whether he liked it or not.>If this is the way things are to go in the German lands, then I am sorry that I was born a German, or ever wrote or spoke German.
>>23819489Ah yes, and Luther did a great by job shiting and shattering christianity. Luther truly was an antichrist of respect.
>>23819502>it takes one man to destroy your religionThat's hilarious.
>>23819439His later life was entirely based around seething resentment towards Wagner. Kind of hard to take him seriously when you realize this.
>>23819439Unlike southern and Greek/Latin Europeans who affirmed their being without any problem, Germans didn't have their own Latin identity (they had a "barbarian" language), but were trying to fit in with that Roman/Latin civilization (hence the whole Holy Roman Empire aspirations). The biggest lie today is that "Germans" are some master race of self-affirmers. In reality their psychology is a deeply slave morals psychology. Nietzsche knew this. He felt even the Poles (and the French, the Italians, the ancient Greeks) were more life-affirming than the Germans. The Germans turned to ultramontanism because they had a reactive attitude to theological papal sovereignty over them. It led to Luther and the Reformation, a slave morals revolt through and through. And then, it led to further revolt against that. While their neighbors achieved nation-states, Germany was a bunch of fractured small princedoms. They had an envy of that effortless master-morals status, so they made up for it by engineering modern nationalism, which by its nature is too us vs. them to ever be master morals. Nietzsche preferred pan-European post-nationalism, he says so in The Gay Science. But this envy against other Europeans (and against Jews) turned the Germans into militarists. They couldn't get empires when the other Euros did, so they tried to make up for that again. You have to imagine yourself living in Nietzsche's time, the late 1800s. Germans during this time had this whole psychological complex about how much they NEEDED to be like the other nation-state Europeans (via nationalism and German unification) to compete, how much they NEEDED to have an empire in Africa or whatever to compete, etc. And after Nietzsche died they just kept at it. Nazism was full-on slave morality complex: it employed the same tactics of projecting everything onto a chosen enemy taken to stand over and against you and oppresisng you, be it Jews, or Anglo-American capitalists, or Soviet communists and European socialist allies, Hitler's three major enemies which he lumped into some Judeo-Marxist-Masonic hodgepodge bogeyman enemy. If you look at neo-Nazis today they're exactly like what they paint their opponents as: easily flustered, always enraged, always hating their enemies and resenting them to an unhealthy degree, always defining everything about themselves around their opponents, inverting their values. This is slave morality. Nietzsche did not hate slave morality entirely though, nor did he like master morality entirely. But he disliked when both degenerated into dead ends. He supported the sublation of both (the overman). This is to take from slave morality the transvaluation of all values, and from master morality the affirmative (rather than negative) attitude. The problem is the Germans clearly were going down the dead end route, and it got worse after Nietzsche died with Hitler. But remember: Nietzsche loved everyone he hated. He has nice things to say about Germans sometimes.
>>23819612what a retarded post. when did /lit/ get this bad?
>>23819439Germans are a vile lot
>>23819577>thinks friend called him a pedophile>gets mad>poster thinks this is abnormalare you autistic or just a hypocrite?
>>23819439He didn't. It was a love/hate. He loved Germany but thought the society was headed for a catastrophe because, in his view, Germans were mechanically intelligent and artistically gifted but socially retarded
>>23820032I didn't say anything about his reaction being abnormal (although it was). I was just pointing out that it's hard to take him seriously when most of what he did was just (dishonestly) presenting himself as the antithesis to Wagner. An example of this is when he wrote favorably about Carmen. Although this was part of his published writings, we know from his private letters that he didn't believe it at all.>"What I say about Bizet, you should not take seriously; the way I am Bizet, does not matter to me at all. But as an ironic antithesis to Wagner, it has a strong effect."This is late Nietzsche. Irony upon irony as a façade to hide his seething resentment. Then you have foolish readers taking it all at face value.
>>23820157if you believed that somebody accused you of being a pedophile after you have established yourself as an intellectual by publishing books that you'd like to be take seriously, would you react normally, would you be rational
>>23819439self-loathing cope
>>23820614His soul was med
>>23819439Just trying to escape the shadow of Wagner.
>>23819612what an insightful post. when did /lit/ get this good?
>>23819439He was a contrarian and nationalism was popular then. Seems simple as that.Also he was all about "muh warrior elites and conquerors," but came away scarred and traumatized from his non-combat role in the military. Funny, because he makes fun of Socrates for essentially being too much of a bitch to rise in Greek society despite Socrates fighting in several battles against the Spartans and reportedly fighting quite fiercely and valorously, even holding back a break in the line when his surrounding comrades were slain or injured and taking out several Spartans.
>>23820820The whole thing is sort of ridiculous because Socrates was essentially a father figure and mentor to a number of Athenian elites and obviously had been at least somewhat influential in Athenian politics. That was the whole point of killing him or trying to get him to flee or stop teaching.He was a celebrity. Aristophanes wrote a whole play focused on him. People traveled across the Greek world to see him. He was also a father and seemingly happily married.He wasn't a nobody. A nobody wouldn't be worth killing. He was poor by choice. The whole thing about him being a resentful, ressentanent-fueled bitter failure is pure projection on Nietzsche's part.And look at his immediate influence. His student Plato and his student Aristotle. The Academy and the Lyceum. The guy was an overwhelming success in his life's mission.
>>23820842Nietzsche's point is that someone like Socrates could only gain influence through dialectic in a decadent society. He wouldn't have been able to do that when the Greeks still valued commanding over arguing and physical beauty over logic.I don't remember N saying that Socrates was physically weak, if he did say that where was it?
>>23820820>>23820842>>23820852The Greek people, because they were Aryan, had too much common sense, and because they were Semitic, had too much wit, not to feel that their situation was worthless and that there had to be a better political organization. But for the reason that the contents could not embrace the container, the Greek people did not put themselves outside themselves and did not rise to understand that the source of the evil was in the dazzling absolutism of the governmental principle. It sought in vain the remedy in the secondary means. At the most beautiful time, between the Battle of Marathon and the Peloponnesian War, all the eminent men leaned towards the vague opinion that today we would call conservative. They were not aristocrats, in the true sense of the word (1). Neither Aeschylus nor Aristophanes wished for the restoration of the perpetual or decennial archontat; but they believed that, in the hands of the rich, the government had chance of functioning with more regularity than when it was given to the sailors of Piraeus and the slackers of Pnyx.No one noticed the real evil and could not, since it was due to the intimate constitution of the Hellenic races. All the inventors of new systems, starting with Plato, missed, without suspicion; what do I say, they took it, on the contrary, as the main element of their reform plans. Socrates provides perhaps the only exception. By seeking to render the idea of vice and virtue independent of political interest, and to elevate the inner man alongside and outside the citizen, this rhetorician had at least glimpsed the difficulty. So I understand that the homeland has not done him grace, and I am not at all surprised to see that in all parties, and especially among the conservatives, there have been voices, among which that of Aristophanes was unfairly counted, to ask for his punishment and bring his sentence. Socrates was the anthagonist of absolute patriotism. As such, he deserved this system to knock him. Yet there was something so pure and noble about his doctrine that honest people were in spite of themselves. Once in the tomb, the sage was regretted, and the people gathered in the theater of Bacchus burst into tears when the choir of the tragedy of Palamedes, inspired by Euripides, sang these sad words: "Greeks, you have put to death the most learned nightingale of the Muses, who had done no harm to no one, Greece's most learned figure." If the sky had suddenly rekindled him, no one would have listened to him anymore. It was the nightingale of the Muses that we regret, the eloquent man, a skilled discussor, an ingenious logician. Artistic dilettantism wept, the heart grieved; as for the political sense, it was inconvertible, because it is an intimate, integral part of the very nature of each race, and reflects their faults as well as their qualities.
>>23820896Where do you get these ideas? It sounds very similar to a lot of 19th century German commentary on the Greeks, and I mean prior to Nietzsche.
>>23820896It would be nice if you gave the book and the page(s) where this excerpt can be found.
>>23819439Why wouldn't you hate Germany and Germans?
>>23820906>>23820909First you must comment on the ideas presented.
>>23819502Imagine a church so rotten that Luther could push it over that easily. It was bound to crumble sooner or later.
>>23821001I refuse to.
>>23821101I pass on the results of public education - I say nothing about the contests of naked girls in the Stadium, I do not insist on this official exaltation of physical beauty whose recognized goal was to establish for the State haras to citizens sharply trimmed, full-bodied and vigorous; but I say that the end of all this bestiality was to create a branch of wretches without faith, without probity, without shame, without humor, capable of all infamies, and shaped in advance, slaves as they were, to the acceptance of all turpitudes. I refer to the dialogues of the Demos of Aristophanes with hiselection.They certainly weren't wrong. There were more lights more to be found in the noble house of Xenophon than in the corrosive intriguers of the comedy 'Chevaliers'. But, basically, if the government of the bourgeoisie and the rich had fully consolidated, the radical vice of the system nevertheless persisted. I want to believe that business affairs would have been conducted with less passion, finances managed with more economy; but the nation would not have become one point better, nor its foreign policy fairer and stronger, nor its whole of its destiny different.https://gallica.bnf.fr/ark:/12148/btv1b8626715t/f477.item
>>23821157You could've just said De Gobineau and I would have understood.
>>23820765I know he RAPED my mind. I know I was a celibate. One after Christ "himself". As if I could ever partake in such debauchery. Never. Never! I just – I just couldn’t restrain it. He covered his notes, he got that conductor and orchestral unit to play his opera perfectly >Herr Nietzsche you don't have t-You think this is something? You think this is bad? This? This polemicist? He’s done worse. That opera house! Are you telling me that a man just happens to start masturbating like that? No! He orchestrated it! WAGNER! He enchanted his mind! And I enabled him! And I shouldn’t have. I mailed to Cosima! What was I thinking? He’ll never change. He’ll never change! Ever since he was 9, always the same!Couldn’t keep his hands out from anti-semitism! But not our Wagner! Couldn’t be precious Wagner! RAPING them blind! And HE gets to be a COMPOSER? What a sick joke! I should’ve stopped him when I had the chance! …And you, you have to stop him! You
>>23821394kek chuckposting really is the gift that keeps on giving
>>23821168Well I passed you the link in case you were interested.Despite all the racial slop, de Gobineau seems to be one of the few authors who expose what societies in decay look like throughout history. The similarities between decaying Greece, Rome and this modern society of hours are alarming, to say the least. But, as explains de Gobineau, political measures, even couping the state and establishing a fascist regime, like did Julius Cornelius Sulla, can at most temporarily halt the inevitable decline.
>>23821580Thanks.
>>23819439How many times will you keep repeating this retarded lie?He loves the blond beast aspect of the ger,am race but hated the tamed nature of germany of his age because it was too christian too jewish
>>23819439They cucked out and started worshipping Jews.
>>23819445Wagies accept their grim fate because they can get drunk every weekend. Once that's too expensive, it's go-time for revolutionaries. 30 year war killed HRE and its interesting economic developments. For example, they had given up on money in some principalities, instead trading promises of work.
>>23819439Because that was after the insanity you dingus
>>23819612Germans have a certain high level of ingenuity, which makes their innovations in engineering critical to the development of humanity, but I'm not foolish nor arrogant enough to pretend to be able to sum up German society in all its trappings and contend to know the truth about them.
>>23819612This is all very true and astute but you get low marks for lack of eloquence.
>>23821811It's actually a mark of slave morals to be creative. That's what Nietzsche himself says over and over. He says Jews and Christians, women, and socialists, as well as Germans, are creators of new values, the issue he has with them is not the creativity but the ressentiment and lack of affirmation. Nietzsche very much associates artists with slave morals, but in a good way. Like I said he doesn't think slave morality is 100% bad, nor master morality 100% good. They both have good aspects and bad aspects, so they need to be overcome by a new ubermensch morality.
>>23819577It's really funny how much of Nietzsche's later philosophy is just outright seethe at Wagner and everything he stood for. Even funnier how people actually think his bullshit is wise.
