So has everybody on this board just read Fagles' Iliad translation? I know we're all actively avoiding Wilson's translation, and I never see Lattimore mentioned, so I assume for everybody on here the go-to is just Fagles.
>>24938203FaglesFitzgeraldGreenChapmanVerityThis are the common recs. Pope so recommended too but his version strays way too far from the original. Wilson is rightfully despised.
>>24938203What? Lattimore is one of the most popular translations here. Anyway, I read Fitzgerald>Alexander PopeAchilles' wrath, to Greece the direful springOf woes unnumber'd, heavenly goddess, sing!That wrath which hurl'd to Pluto's gloomy reignThe souls of mighty chiefs untimely slain;Whose limbs unburied on the naked shore,Devouring dogs and hungry vultures tore.Since great Achilles and Atrides strove,Such was the sovereign doom, and such the will of Jove!>FitzgeraldAnger be now your song, immortal one,Akhilleus' anger, doomed and ruinous,that caused the Akhaians loss on bitter lossand crowded brave souls into the undergloom,leaving so many dead men—carrionfor dogs and birds; and the will of Zeus was done.Begin it when the two men first contendingbroke with one another— the Lord MarshalAgamémnon, Atreus’ son, and Prince Akhilleus.>FaglesRage—Goddess, sing the rage of Peleus’ son Achilles,murderous, doomed, that cost the Achaeans countless losses,hurling down to the House of Death so many sturdy souls,great fighters’ souls, but made their bodies carrion,feasts for the dogs and birds,and the will of Zeus was moving toward its end.Begin, Muse, when the two first broke and clashed,Agamemnon lord of men and brilliant Achilles.>LattimoreSing, goddess, the anger of Peleus' son Achillesand its devastation, which put pains thousand-fold upon the Achaians,hurled in their multitudes to the house of Hades strong soulsof heroes, but gave their bodies to be the delicate feastingof dogs, of all birds, and the will of Zeus was accomplishedsince that time when first there stood in division of conflictAtreus’ son the lord of men and brilliant Achilleus.>ChapmanAchilles’ baneful wrath resound, O Goddess, that impos’dInfinite sorrows on the Greeks, and many brave souls los’d.From breasts heroic; sent them far to that invisible caveThat no light comforts; and their limbs to dogs and vultures gave;To all which Jove’s will gave effect; from whom first strife begunBetwixt Atrides, king of men, and Thetis’ godlike son.>GreenWrath, goddess, sing of Achilles Pēleus’s son’scalamitous wrath, which hit the Achaians with countless ills—many the valiant souls it saw off down to Hādēs,souls of heroes, their selves left as carrion for dogsand all birds of prey, and the plan of Zeus was fulfilled—from the first moment those two men parted in fury,Atreus’s son, king of men, and the godlike Achilles.>MerrillSing now, goddess, the wrath of Achilles the scion of Peleus,ruinous rage which brought the Achaians uncounted afflictions;many the powerful souls it sent to the dwelling of Hades,those of the heroes, and spoil for the dogs it made their bodies,plunder for all of the birds, and the purpose of Zeus was accomplished-sing from the time when first stood hostile, starting the conflict,Atreus' scion, the lord of the people, and noble Achilles.
>>24938223>Emily WilsonGoddess, sing of the cataclysmic wrath of Peleus’ son Achilles,cause of so much suffering for the Greeks,that sent many strong souls to Hades,making men a feast for birds and prey for dogs:the plan of Zeus was moving to its end –beginning when those two argued first:lord Agamemnon and glorious Achilles.>VeritySING, goddess, the anger of Achilles, Peleus’ son,the accursed anger which brought the Achaeans countlessagonies and hurled many mighty shades of heroes into Hades,causing them to become the prey of dogs andall kinds of birds; and the plan of Zeus was fulfilled.Sing from the time the two men were first divided in strife—Atreus’ son, lord of men, and glorious Achilles.
>>24938223>>24938227>>24932624
>>24938203>coolstorybro
>>24938223Fagles is the best. Idk why people here hate on him, but I guess that would be a strong motivator for a group of contrarians
We really needed a 5th active thread on The Illiad. Please make a Homer general or something.
>>24938249>the first great work of Western literature>still arguably the greatest>capable of moving readers thousands of years after its composition>the grandaddy of all epic poemsThe Iliad can have as many threads as it wants.
>>24938253if we really cared about homer we’d make a rule that nine out of ten people here need to shut the fuck up about him.
Rodney Merrill and Caroline Alexander are the only two really GREAT translations
No
>>24938223>>24938227Fitzgerald has all the gravitas and rhythm. Elegance and strength in simplicity.
>>24938249We have a rare case of Homer threads outnumbering Gurm threads.Just be thankful, anon.
>>24938257>weWho?
comparing these, I've noticed that the Wilson translation follows the Fagles very closely for a number of lines. Given that, in the UK at least, they're both published by the same publisher, do you think it's likely she was handed that translation by Penguin and just produced a cheap copy of it?
>>24938223Pope sounds beautiful but yeah... it's clearly a bit weird compared to the others
>>24938203Fagles is very respected in general. Not as much as Lattimore perhaps, but he's up there. He translated a lot of the ancient Greek texts. I like his Sophocles the best out of everyone, but prefer Lattimore and Fitzgerald for Homer.
>>24939821You guys are so god damn stupid>>24939845Pope is beautiful & a worthy poem in its own right but the accuracy is poor & the diction & meter don't fit
>>24939882Translations can't be accurate anyway
>>24939882>English poem isn't in dactylic hexameter
>>24939888If you think a translation can't be comparatively more or less accurate than another you are a slobbering retard>>24940000It doesn't need to be in fucking dactylic hexameter but iambic pentameter is an entirely wrong choice especially for a line-by-line translation
>>24938223Why would you ignore Chapman's? It's at least just as important as Pope's as a work of English poetry, and has a long history of advocates as the best translation of Homer into English, from Coleridge to Pound.
>>24940027>iambic pentameter is an entirely wrong choiceNot in English, Mr ESL saar.
>>24940060It's got more testosterone than /lit/rannies can handle.
>>24940060I gave Chapman's a shot, I think I got filtered, it lost my interest after a while.Isn't there a version in English that at least attempts dactylic hexameter? I'd like to read that one.
>>24940443Suicide NOW
>>24940972Cotterill. It's shit. Read Green, it's close enough without being flat & boring & it's not as obnoxiously anglicizing as fucking iambic pentameter
>>24938223Fitzgerald is kino
I've read Fagles and Lattimore and Lattimore is better.
>>24938203I read Lattimore's Iliad and Fagle's Odyssey. I'm happy I went like that, as those were the copies I found at used bookstores. Lattimore's translation is definitely more rigorous and scholarly, and Fagles' is far more readable. I remember when this board was extremely angry about Fagles before of course Wilson came on the scene, and they insisted on Lattimore
>>24938203T.E. Lawrence version has best opening.O DIVINE POESYGODDESS-DAUGHTER OF ZEUSSUSTAIN FOR METHIS SONG OF THE VARIOUS-MINDED MANWHO AFTER HE HAD PLUNDEREDTHE INNERMOST CITADEL OF HALLOWED TROYWAS MADE TO STRAY GRIEVOUSLYABOUT THE COASTS OF MENTHE SPORT OF THEIR CUSTOMS GOOD OR BADWHILE HIS HEARTTHROUGH ALL THE SEA-FARINGACHED IN AN AGONY TO REDEEM HIMSELFAND BRING HIS COMPANY SAFE HOMEVAIN HOPE—FOR THEMFOR HIS FELLOWS HE STROVE IN VAINTHEIR OWN WITLESSNESS CAST THEM AWAYTHE FOOLSTO DESTROY FOR MEATTHE OXEN OF THE MOST EXALTED SUNWHEREFORE THE SUN-GOD BLOTTED OUTTHE DAY OF THEIR RETURNMAKE THE TALE LIVE FOR USIN ALL ITS MANY BEARINGSO MUSE.
>>24938227>Emily Wilson Tell me about a complicated man.Muse, tell me how he wandered and was lostwhen he had wrecked the holy town of Troy,and where he went, and who he met, the painhe suffered in the storms at sea, and howhe worked to save his life and bring his menback home. He failed to keep them safe; poor fools,they ate the Sun God’s cattle, and the godkept them from home. . . .Translated by Emily Wilson (2018)
>>24943750That's the odyssey
>>24938223What was that one translation that people said was terrible? The one that appears in a meme picture.
>>24938249bump :)
>>24938203no, i read chapman's
>FaglesSounds gay.
>>24938203Lattimore is the best, but Fagles is alright. These are the only translations I've read though, besides Butler's prose Iliad.
>>24940972Dactylic hexameter doesn't work in English, it's based on vowel lengths which are quite regular in Greek (and Latin and its descendents) but not in English. Poetry in English is based on stress, which is not equivalent to vowel length, so trying to substitute stressed/unstressed for long/short vowels doesn't produce pleasing prosody.
>>24938203I finished reading Pope recently (it was my first time) and I loved it.
