I just rewatched Macross Plus via the movie version with a friend after seven years and I wanted to make a thread about it, because I am once again questioning what people see in this show. I really don't get the appeal at all.What really ruins the OVA for me is the absolutely retarded dynamics between the love triangle. Why did Isamu and Myung decide to pretend like Guld didn't beat the shit out of them, which was a complete overreaction to seeing them cuddling or whatever the fuck they were doing? Considering most of the tension in the OVA is generated by this rivalry, as the main antagonist has basically zero presence until the last episode, it seems like a piss-poor reason for Guld to hate Isamu. I genuinely want to know if someone can explain this to me in a way that makes sense. I know there's a lot of terrible bait on this board but I am genuinely asking. I hate to put it this way, but I'm approaching this in the best possible faith I can, why do you like this? Please don't give me the trite answer of "the rest of the series is idolshit", the entire franchise has always been idolshit. There's entire scenes dedicated to Sharon Apple's concerts, it's basically just as much idolshit as the rest of the series.
>>23064517Nice planes. Good music. Main character is a fun playboy. The love triangle is indeed retarded. It boils down to "no one wants to tell Guld he's an attempted rapist". But, you're literally just supposed to be wowed by the YF-19 and hum Information High and ignore the retarded parts.
>>23064583This, it's great
>>23064517>>23064583>which was a complete overreaction to seeing them cuddlingGuld is a Zentradi, their race has a trait that makes them more violent and emotionally unstable.The love triangle also has this racial component that people seem to gloss over or not understand.It's also why Guld has to be a straight A type of military guy while Isamu gets to be the wild cowboy archetype. Guld is dealing with the stereotypes of being a Zent.
>>23064752>socio-economic factors MADE him be a violent spazMakes sense.
>>23064517>Why did Isamu and Myung decide to pretend like Guld didn't beat the shit out of them,Because they were really good friends before it happened, Isamu and Myung were trying to protect the friendship the 3 of them had. Even though Isamu and Guld gave each other a lot of shit during the series, deep down they were best friends, and they knew even though Guld attacked Myung out of jealously, they knoe theu still had that friendship that they made as kids, and they final found it again at the end of the show when Guld and Isamu teamed up against the drone and the promise of saving Myung.
It's the only Macross where people can pretend the characters are mature adults because of the art style, even if the dialogue makes it clear they're all messy twenty-somethings. Guld, Isamu, and Myung are supposed to be 25, 24, and 23.
Isamu should have stayed with best girl.
>>23064799Many channers and viewers of /a/ and /m/ related materiel in general tend to freak out when characters act like actual people instead of stamped steel archetypes.
>>23064801
>>23064801THIS
>>23064808
Lucy > Sharon > Fangy McChicom
The VF-11 is so fucking gorgeous
>>23064752Guld is not military but a civilian contractor.
>>23064822I want Ranka's VF-11 backpack
>>23064770NO that's not what I'm saying.In Macross' world Zentradi are genetically dispositioned to be violent and wild, the mircrosized ones even had to take pills to not crash out all the time.Because of this Guld overcompensates by developing an autistic level straight edge personality.It's part of why he resents Isamu, not just the Myung situation, but how careless he can live.>>23064824Ah I forgot, but the gist of it is that he's trying to be that straight laced type of dude and go against his genetics.
>>23064770He literally couldn't help it.
>>23064752>Guld is a Zentradi, their race has a trait that makes them more violent and emotionally unstableThis is not present in the entire rest of the series, including SDF post-war. I cut it out of my OP for brevity.
>>23064804I really didn't want to come into this thread and argue with people, because the whole point of this thread is for people to explain what there is to like about Plus, but this is a shit argument for why Plus is good. For starters, the main characters are "stamped steel" archetypes. Secondly, there is nothing "realistic" about how these characters behave. I understand that trauma is complex and everyone experiences it differently, but Myung has no reason to be remotely friendly towards Guld after the shit he pulled of borderline raping her for no good reason. I don't know if you've talked to many women before in your life, but here's a newsflash; women don't enjoy getting beaten up and raped. And I'm sure this isn't just a Westard perspective at play, there's a reason rape is almost universally despised including in Japan. This is a bit different to a character like Reccoa or Nina causing /m/ to shit themselves, I can agree that they are actually realistic characters to an extent, but the whole love triangle is predicated on the most retarded unrealistic drama I've ever come across. Every other Macross handles it way better.
>>23064517It's a really well-scored and beautiful movie, very peak 90s in that sense, but coincidentally one other thing I find that marks it as the peak of its era is that the storytelling could often fall behind the great presentation; 0083 and 08th come to mind in that respect as well.Like >>23064583 said, nobody is just plainly up front with Guld, and the triangle in general is just forced; Myung clings to Guld and shuns Isamu for no real reason, just to stir up drama. The base elements are fine, but the fact that it has to be a Love Triangle instead of just, like, an equally strained interpersonal relationship between three parties.
>>23065102People stay with their abusers all the damn time. Myung's reaction is entirely plausible (if still stupid, but people often are).
>>23065116Yes that's true but that's usually a survival situation. Their abuser threatens to kill them if they tell anyone, or they basically feel like they can't leave because of children or financial pressures. Myung is not even in a relationship with Guld or Isamu, and she makes more money than both of them because of Sharon Apple. There is zero reason for her to act the way she does beyond forcing terrible drama to make the plot happen.
>>23065116It wasn't a long-term abusive relationship she was in, though. It was a one-off situation, she doesn't have Stockholm Syndrome.It's like saying it's plausible to be friendly to someone who mugged you.
By the way, would highly recommend watching the OVA over the movie version if people haven't already, or if you've only seen the movie version for whatever reason. The movie cuts out a lot of the great early action scenes, I was really disappointed watching it and seeing all that reduced to like a bad montage.
>>23065127When Rihanna got the shit beaten out of her and the quite graphic images thereof were at the top of every news broadcast, there were hundreds if not thousands of women on twitter saying they wished he'd beat them up like that because they were so infatuated with him. People are a lot dumber than you are giving them credit for.>>23065139>It wasn't a long-term abusive relationship she was in, though.That was an example of a more severe case that people still don't part ways over. And yes, there are other details that matter there.The three of them were friends for years. This is absolutely something that happens and people remain friendly on the surface.>>23065178The gunpod bayonet is especially noteworthy. Love that thing's little flip up.
>>23065204Yes but Rihanna wants little to do with Chris Brown now for that reason. Myung is akin to Rihanna, not a fangirl of Chris Brown. And a few thousand bizarre women with a dom fetish does not mean women worldwide are okay with being beaten. The series was apparently written by a woman so I suppose that individual woman might be like those idiots on Twitter, but there's a difference between fantasy/fetish and reality.I'm not sure why you have to deny reality like that. Have you ever had the shit kicked out of you before? Would you forgive your attacker so easily, even if they were previously your friend, and especially when they show no signs of stopping that behaviour like Guld does when he beats up a recently hospitalised Isamu (mind you, hospitalised because Guld fantasised about killing him)?
>>23065221No, but I've known people in similar situations. It's hardly "denying reality". It just sucks.
>>23065178Wasn't The movie version is the definitive version? Most people don't know that, but the initial plan for Macross Plus was always a movie, they did the OVA to have more funds since they were originally not allowed. From what I read at least. It has a few cuts but also new scenes. It's not just a recap type of thing.
>>23065102Anon. Just of curiousty. How many girlfriends have you had? How many woman have you fucked casually? How many chicks have you known intimately? Do you often talk to chicks that you don't know?
>>23064822I paid out the nose for a Yamato 1/60 VF-11B off of Mandarake last year. The neck filler flaps have cracks, the cockpit feels like it is held in place by a prayer, and it's old enough that the plastic could spontaneously crumble on me within my own lifetime. Also it looks like a gorilla in battroid and it's clearly from that era of Yamato toy engineering where all variable fighter feet nozzles were ratcheting plastic assemblies with limited lateral pivoting. Absolutely love the goober, shame it was doomed to shelf warm in its time between being forgettable cannon fodder for Macross as a whole, and being released maybe a bit too close to the tail end of the 2008 recession. Can't see a successor toy for it coming any time soon, not without a future Macross work returning to a time where the Thunderbolt could get aggressively pushed as a hero machine.
>>23065273My bodycount is irrelevant to the discussion, especially when I know it can just be handwaved as trying too hard to impress fellow losers on a Mongolian basketweaving forum. Ask any woman you know whether they would take kindly to someone like Guld assaulting them. I know plenty of women in real life and I know none of them would act like Myung.
>>23065368So woman are universal correct? And what they tell YOU is what is in their hearts correct? That is not even touching upon things deeper and darker. Final question anon: In your opinion are there any woman out there who enjoy being punched in the face? Have a great non-argumentative evening anon!
Tbh, isn’t Guld is horrified about his actions when he manage to remember them ? He just after does a suicidal attack.Myung also has deep psychological issues. She isn’t a common women. Her reaction with Guld isn’t grounded in logic.In fact, pretty much every main characters are very damaged people. Even Isamu to some degree.I would even say that neither Isamu or Guld should be allowed to fly. Both are used because they are skilled but the top brass completely ignore their psychological issues. Myung also should have some big psychological support but instead she is pretty much used for her voice.
>>23065374I'm fully aware that most people wouldn't open up fully to me and reveal their darkest desires, woman or man. Are there indeed women with a strange fetish for getting beaten up? Yes, I've certainly seen and heard of such examples. But there's a mountain of difference between erotic roleplay/BDSM and a previously trusted friend barging into your room and beating the shit out of you. People don't enjoy having their trust in another person broken. It's that simple. Once that happens, it's hard to ever trust that person again.All of this could have been sorted with a bit more backstory, maybe they actually forgave Guld but he got self-destructive about it, but all that's really shown in the OVA is "Guld beat the shit out of us but we pretended it never happened for some terrible drama seven years later". They had plenty of time to come up with a plausible scenario, but didn't.
>>23065368>I know plenty of women in real life and I know none of them would act like Myung.I thought the same until some told me they basically had. What people say they'd do is rarely identical to what they'd actually do. Things are always more complicated.>>23065384Even with the mass cloning and Zentraedi population joining, they probably don't have enough people to afford to be picky, assuming the brass even know about their issues.
Lol anyway.
>>23065468I'd Sharon that Apple.
>>23065537Sharon sexo.
>>23065468my beautiful wives and some humie
>>23066050Kinda hard to compete.
>>23066119Why did you post a superior character from a superior show?
>>23066192Three! (3) years old!
I dunno, I just enjoy the animation and Isamu "Thundercock" Dyson brings in the Top Gun vibes.But it's take it or leave it, 7 and DYRL are much better for me.
>>23065102Myung knew about Guld's zentradi nature and forgave him. Guld hadn't forgave himself and projected onto Isamu.
>>23064822>>23065300I picked up the Hasegawa 1:72 kit of the VF-11D a few weeks ago, got my first airbrush and I'd been promising myself I'd do some of these kits once I had one, so this is keeping myself honest I guess.First time really getting hands-on with a more traditional model kit. It's a pretty recent one and I suspect this is first run stock so I haven't seen any obvious areas for correction work, very impressed with the quality of surface detailing.Still need to learn the damn brush better before I commit to a project that requires it, though.Curious to see if Bandai's HG Macross line extends much beyond hero valkyries. And if it does, how many are left in p-bandai hell.
It's giant robo-style. If you don't get hung up much on that one bit, it's a really fun show. I could see it being such a dumb reveal that's pivotal to the story that it instantly turns people off. I just didn't care that much.It's kind of funny. There's a scale of how much you can look past in terms of dumb story. Certainly plenty of people who hate 0083 but ignore giant robot or plus' twists.
>>23066656I like the YF-21.
Plus also has the involvement of both the writer and director of Cowboy Bebop so it makes American fans cream themselves. Story wise it was inspired by "The Right Stuff," which is as much about test pilots being shitheads as it is about them flying the damn planes.
