The four horsemen - the big four of the /classical/ /music/ edition.https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=QCDUfNFGC6EThis thread is for the discussion of music in the Western (European) classical tradition, as well as classical instrument-playing.>How do I get into classical?This link has resources including audio courses, textbooks and selections of recordings to help you start to understand and appreciate classical music:https://rentry.org/classicalgenPrevious: >>128414985
>>128456203nice pic
you DO listen to Beethoven's Missa Solemnis at least once a month, right, anon? a-anon!?https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=p46g9iUTeq4
What makes almost every Passacaglia so good
recommend me some messiaen
>>128456203awful pic
>>128456717https://youtu.be/oeOu0WGcreU?si=YhdY8Ji-ygu2kUts
>>128456203>no Wagner
>>128456203who is top right
>>128457840Medtner.https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=7qcm5w0QbH0>>128457257You are looking at 4 of the greatest composers who ever graced the earth. Ergo none of them can be omitted from the quaternity for the big W.
This is what Bach's Cello Suites sound likeR0T0Mhttps://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Z5EKTfx0GdE
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=LpylxBKtyMQ
I have two questions-what is this:https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=LKUyNARNF2c&list=RDLKUyNARNF2c&start_radio=1and what is that cover?
Medtner is the king of alchemy, turning absolute chaos and forming it into beauty. Prokofiev might have great moments of dissonance and the reverse, but Medtner's compositional talent far exceeded it. https://youtu.be/NO77Z6G1V9s?t=361
now playingstart of Brahms: String Sextet No. 1, Op. 18https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=rhBX2p7UOvw&list=OLAK5uy_m6_Cpxbsqmav4YO_j5z-5ESgn1P3-V78g&index=2start of Brahms: String Sextet No. 2, Op. 36https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=QiRHYUI2q3c&list=OLAK5uy_m6_Cpxbsqmav4YO_j5z-5ESgn1P3-V78g&index=5https://www.youtube.com/playlist?list=OLAK5uy_m6_Cpxbsqmav4YO_j5z-5ESgn1P3-V78g
>>128456717Turangalîla-Symphonie, Vingt regards sur l'enfant-Jésus, Quatuor pour la fin du temps, Visions De L'Amen, the list goes on...
>>128460112I pray you come to recognize the genius of Prokofiev someday anon
Beethovenhttps://www.youtube.com/watch?v=x3aMXJRAmTA&list=OLAK5uy_n7WYYyxij87v2HdcnHm8MOmYGTQ_4HMdk&index=2
>>128460734Prok's sonatas are totally underwhelming in comparison, he lacks the countrapuntal and textual mastery Medtner does. Prok is good, Medtner is just much better, there is a strength and spirit in his works that the other simply lacks.
>>128460972>there is a strength and spirit in his works that the other simply lacks.I'll give you that but only because Prokofiev was down the modernist "oh hey there are emotions like anxiety too" rabbit holeSo for someone who wants more of the traditional romantic spirit, Medtner is more applicable.
>>128460972Medtner is virtuoso slav slop.
>>128461032and THAT'S A GOOD THING
>>128461054so true, Indian child.
virtuoso slav slop sounds so good when you ain't got a bitch in ya ear telling you it's nasty
>>128461005Prokofiev is simply too irony poisoned, self aware, and insincere to truly be great. Scriabin - even if you believe him to be a fraud - at least faked or inflated his beliefs so much so that he probably began to become what he was faking. He was sincere in the actor role, sincere in his want to create a perfected image of what he believed or wished to believe. So too I believe Medtner to give nothing else but an image of what he felt was good and correct, creating music too dense for the average normalfag, even as his Russian peers all became famous. Refusing to budge an inch, he would basically only play pieces he felt were right, so his own and some Beethoven. It shows in his music as well, unforgiving, uncompromising, the strength of one who stands supported by himself and needing nothing else. It sounds as he was. >>128461032Boring post.
>>128461076Calling Medtner virtuoso slav slop is complete nonsense anyways, he was the closest to the German tradition. Just empty shitposts from people who haven't even listened to him.
>>128461174close enough to spread an infection.
>>128461234You wish.
>>128461241>Russian>Musicpick one.
>>128461261Boring post.
Schumannhttps://www.youtube.com/watch?v=gItzIWEU7V8&list=OLAK5uy_m2Dj1XZCnRtKP6ndAwhJcuVxYU9JwLl-0&index=40
>>128461265Boris post.
are there composers with reasonably extensive "discographies" where you've heard every piece they've written? it just occurred to me that i can't name one like that. for example, despite being a big beethoven fan, i've probably realistically only heard 50-60% of his total output. bach, mozart, liszt, chopin, certainly less than 50%. makes me feel like a poser t b h.
I'm starting to think you guys were right, that the Adagio and finale of the Hammerklavier only holds together if performed at a reasonably quick tempo (~max 15 minutes). Anything further it becomes meandering, diffuse, unstable. I'm not 100% on this opinion, but I know that in the past couple weeks, when listening to Hammerklaviers with 17min-20min Adagios, it just doesn't seem to click, whereas listening to Gulda's right now at 13:44, it's perfect and coherently holds together.https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ql-5Dnn3LBE&list=OLAK5uy_m_afPa6Mlu26qm3BjKrYKKDCFhkrLRxAo&index=92
>>128460813This guy had such a tragic ending.
>>128461602I hope you will too.
>>128461310I guess the hardest part with Chopin is hearing all of his Mazurkas?
>>128461681???
>>128461569But people who follow the metronome tempo unironically have to stoop to making the argument that Beethoven wanted the Hammerklavier to sound bad.
>>128461773I don't care about arguments for fidelity to the metronome markings, all I know is Gulda's Hammerklavier sounds fantastic and its a,9:302:2013:4411:24performance
>>128461761he was a socialist. also, if socialists care so much about "the working class" and "the masses" why are they allergic to doing a single day of honest work in their entire pathetic lives?
>>128461860>I don't care about arguments for fidelity to the metronome markingsIsn't that where the whole debate started?
>>128461920I just care what sounds good
>>128461912He cared too much about art, he was a sensitive soul. His whole life was dedicated to the honest work of providing music for the working class.
>>128461912worst post I've seen in /classical/ in many threadsyou baited me, gj
>>128461927I care about art too. does that mean I should get handouts from everyone else?
>>128461933>socialism :(>socialism with german characteristics :)
now playinghttps://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ALgIk3aydms
>>128461983I've had this on my backlog for a while. How's it?
>>128462020listen to it and find out.
>>128459900>I have two questions-what is this:see
>>128462059Yeah I know what it's called-what is it?
Gentlemen, it is with great sadness to inform you thatperformers
Recommend Mozart that doesn't suck.
Why does Mozart suck so much compared to his Baroque predecessors?
I think Mozart sucks!
>mfw listening to MozartHoly fuck Germans are really awful at this music thing aren't they?
>mfw not listening to Mozart
Mozarts string quintets ain't too shabby, g minor kind slaps, especially that 2nd movement.
Hey this Mozart fella ain't bad at all especially the late works.
>mfw MozartGuys, I think I'm finally getting it
>Mozart>Nozart
Alexis-Emmanuel Chabrierhttps://www.youtube.com/watch?v=I84v8khxStchttps://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ifN4T9aVq-Q
>>128456717Préludes Pour PianoLes Offrandes Oubliées: Meditation SymphoniqueLe Tombeau ResplendissantL'Ascension - 4 Méditations SymphoniquesHymne Au Saint-SacrementThème Et Variations (1932)Poèmes Pour MiFête Des Belles EauxQuatuor Pour La Fin Du TempsTrois Petites Liturgies De La Présence DivineVisions De L'AmenVingt Regards Sur L'Enfant-JésusHarawi: Chants D'Amour Et De MortTurangalîla-SymphonieCinq Rechants Pour 12 Parties Vocales RéellesQuatre Études De RythmeCantéyodjayâTimbres-Durées Pour Bande MagnétiqueOiseaux ExotiquesCatalogue d'OiseauxChronochromieSept Haïkaï - Esquisses JaponaisesCouleurs De La Cité CélesteEt Exspecto Resurrectionem MortuorumDes Canyons Aux Étoiles...Saint François D'Assise
>>128463367Debussy, Ravel, and Satie don't quite make much sense until listen you bridge them with Chabrier, who bridges himself to the great poetic geniuses of the French baroque. The French revolution took a toll on the Gallic spirit, but like the Battle of Tours, the Frankish people are resilient in the face of the foreign intruders, these intruders were the Germans and Italians, not the Saracens of North Africa.Emmanuel Chabrier is the French musical embodiment of Charles Martel, although his successor Charlemagne(Debussy) was more well known, He will forever be the remembered as the valiant spirit who stood firm in the face of invaders.
>>128463436yeeeah, I love Chabrier, but you come off as an annoying, pretentious cunt
>>128463367Chabrier just puts a smile on my face, his music is effortlessly charming and happy, only Borodin, early Debussy and Ravel matches it imo.>>128463447I'm drunk m8, lets please just enjoy some Chabrier together
>>128463367Not too bad
>>128463494Poulenc considered his 10 Pièces Pittoresques as important to french pianism as Debussy's Preludes, for whatever that's worth to ya. He did very little but his piano pieces and some standalone orchestral works are delightful. Somewhere between Liszt and the Impressionists (even if they hated that term. I mean both Debussy and especially Ravel proffessed themselves indebted to and admirers of Chabrier.)https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=UYiCkTSaqqAhttps://www.youtube.com/watch?v=geDc5tLG5vE
only tone-deaf contrarian retards deny the superiority of Germany in music.
>>128463741>t. neuroticlet me guess, you had a bad day at work and that led to a week long depressive episode?
>>128463804my adult life is a depressive episode.
>>128463811That's because you listen to Schubert, Schumann and Shartzart and not Bach and Before, Ives and After
>>128463822what are your thoughts on Krebs?
>>128461005I think Prokofiev is almost on the same level as Medtner and the rest, but his style is much different.>>128463741Only unsophisticated plebs deny the superiority of music by the four horsemen of /classical/.
>>128463842if he had any thoughts he would not be the BABIAA poster.
test.
This world would have been so much better had the Germans won WW2. Only the Germanic race understands the concept of work, passion and soul. It is nerve wrecking to witness other races even allowed to exist. We should all kill ourselves and let the Germans progress Earth.
Actual big four of /classical/ btw
>>128464284I unironically believe that. This is a Teutonic world and all ethno-religious groups are just secondary characters at best.
*other*
>>128456717Any recordings by his wife Yvonne Loriod.
Favorite strauss pieces? Been listening to his poems recently. I like Don Juan alot, Till Eulenspiegel is a little obnoxious at points for me, Don Quixote overstays it's welcome a bit. Granted I listened to all of these without really knowing the source material (besides Don Quixote) and just listening to them as single movement symphonies. So maybe I am missing something from them. Will check out Heldenleben as well, probably in Bohm's recording as that's the one i got on hand (Got it for the Hollander overture he did on that recording)
>>128464897Probably tied between Metamorphosen and Ein Heldenleben, followed by the Alpine Symphony.
Random thing but I realized that generally the progressive rock songs I like the most are the ones which would make for good scherzos. 21st Century Schizoid Man for example would, when arranged for orchestra, make a genuinely great scherzo.
strauss was first and foremost a composer of operas, and that's where his greatest work is to be found. https://youtu.be/Nz8wt98tZHQ?si=7UvcCpCv9ngkteBj
>>128465027Of course. A lot of that kind of music is literally classical-as-rock.
>>128465044>>128465027>homophobic riffs, repetitions, and a splash of jazz harmony>classical-as-rockCompletely fucking delusional, prog fags are utterly stupid. GB2/mu/
>>128465072Whether it's as good is its own question. I'm merely speaking about the intent, the vision, the background and skills of the artists.
>>128465027a lot of AC/DC songs (especially "thunderstruck") are basically toccatas arranged for a rock band/ensemble. a good 90% of pop songs are still garbage though.
So many Faure sets do this ordering system of # first, no matter the piece, so it goes like,>Nocturnes No. 3>Barcarolle No. 3>Impromptu No. 3>Nocturnes No. 4and so on, so annoyingFinally a set that has each cycle discretely organized.https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=4ki3nmjdg1U&list=OLAK5uy_l7P89uKl0OXIw53fxq-Pokmzlr6mFOTpM&index=1>Paul Crossley has appeared on more than 50 releases including the complete solo piano music of Franck, Faur, Debussy, Ravel, Poulenc, Janacek, Tippett and Takemitsu and has won major recording awards including the Diapason d Or for the complete solo piano works of Faur, Ravel and Tippett recording.
>>128465081>the intent, the vision, the background and skills of the artists.Of which nothing in prog lined up with classical, most of it was closer to jazz, especially King Crimson. If you were to speak of rock which was to reach closer to classical and influenced by it in some regard, then you would listen to metal music. If metalfags just stopped using repetitions as their form they would have recreated a retarded version of Bartok by now.https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=5UDJktLao18
>>128461310There are a few composers where I've listened to all their works with opus numbers. Of course, most composers wrote a bunch of stuff that they never published or that got lost etc. so trying to be a completionist is a fool's errand anyway.
>>128465145>If metalfags just stopped using repetitions as their form they would have recreated a retarded version of Bartok by now.But who wants a retarded version of something that is actually good? It's such a waste of time.
>>128465104I suppose it's because all of the Nocturnes have different Opuses, so technically they aren't a singular piano cycle. Excepting the first three, which are all Op. 33.
>>128465174The whole point of this conversation was about rock translated to classical. There is also an argument that unlike rock, metal managed to create its own unique techniques unknown to classical or jazz via its vocals, and its overall goal of ugliness is unique in the place of music history. Prog rock is quite literally just a retarded version of jazz fusion most of the time.
>>128465145what the fuck is "metal"?
>>128465104Absolutely based Fauré enjoyer. For me it's pic related.
>>128465251I dunno.
>>128465256I think I tried that set once and wasn't into the sound quality. Might give it another go
>This is a thin sounding rushed reading with little emotional impact. There is no sense of awe or majesty. The organ is some electronic one and it is weak. The chorus is also weak...they were wearing masks during the performance! Who the hell wears masks while singing??? Covid insanity crap.lol
>>128465081>>128465216Scherzo is the ABA form that differs fron minuet in tempo, there's nothing more to it. So any pop song can be technically be a "scherzo", the original post had a point.Baroque pop and neoclassical genres are closest thing to classical music from popular genres, as they learn from the classical traditions, be it counterpoint or harmony>overall goal of ugliness is unique in the place of music history. There are many, even early 20th century composers who had similar if not the same "goals" - which is irrelevant since the finished product is what truly matters.
did my usual search for a piece and see if there's any new recordings, and saw there's a new live Mahler 8 by /classical/'s favorite wunderkind conductor https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=NwoqjqQCykA&list=OLAK5uy_lfRSNC8KfkrNCN-6nA3l8LFQDa4q2Kb5U&index=5fuck this part is so goodSeems there's some positive reviews of it too>As harps and violins beseeched their Maker, time stood still. No words can convey the beauty and magnitude on offer. Mahler’s all-encompassing sound world ushered us towards a glorious fulfilment. >[5 stars]https://bachtrack.com/review-makela-royal-concertgebouw-mahler-festival-amsterdam-may-2025
In my opinion, each number in Figaro is a miracle; it is totally beyond me how anyone could create anything so perfect; nothing like it was ever done again, not even by Beethoven.
>>128465330David Wallace speaks of this.
>>128465289>>128465289>there's nothing more to it.There is, the tradition of western classical forms of harmony and melodic structure. Of which prog rock like King Crimson is worlds away, closer to jazz than classical. >Baroque pop and neoclassical genres are closest thing to classical music from popular genresBut they literally aren't, I'm sorry but the Beach Boys are not even close to the hilarious levels Baroque worship in metal. This was made by a metalfag:https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ING7SNSHBQ8That isn't just "influenced by", thats a straight up nice piece. >even early 20th century composers who had similar if not the same "goals"Its not even close to the same, classical is almost directly ugly for the sake of it. Maybe some of the tone cluster lovers like Scelsi, and some moments of Ornstein? For the most part there is a always a goal of beauty and the sublime in the western tradition, and during the turn to modern classical it became instead abstract and alienating, not necessarily ugly and looking to impose that ideal. Perhaps for some they created unintentionally ugly music, but the goal was an academic sense of eliminating the spirit and human altogether, not to keep indulging a human outlook of beauty or ugliness.
>>128465379>classical is almost directly ugly for the sake of it.*is almost never directly ugly*
>>128465379jazz improvisation is just a dumbed down niggerfied version of thoroughbass improvisation taught by the likes of CPE Bach.
reading Mailer while listening to Mahler
>>128465471which symphony?
>>128465480https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=RFXdF42umJA&list=OLAK5uy_lfRSNC8KfkrNCN-6nA3l8LFQDa4q2Kb5U&index=16
We commence with a premise that underwrites Western Civilisation and further afield too: "Non in solo pane vivit homo, sed in omni verbo, quod procedit de ore Dei.” Man does not live on bread alone but on every word that proceeds from the Mouth of God. Even if one does not ascribe, say, to the Old Firm or its variants, acceptance of the proposition that God – or the concept thereof – mattered to the likes of Bach, Haydn, Mozart, Beethoven, Bruckner et al can only deepen one’s appetite for their exertions and triumphs. Oh, trip the light fantastic.Now, on the evidence at hand, it cannot be easy writing Zeitgeist reviews for Uncle Dave Hurwitz of Classics Today. Get it wrong and a gruesome encounter with an update of Jabba the Hutt could ensue. In the Overflow Room, no-one can hear you scream over the hammer-blows of fate. . . . . Jens Laurson works for this demiurge. At the behest of his master, he penned the following - a review of Rudolph Lutze’s Christmas Oratorio (Bach) which I read with interest and rancour. This passage drew fire:“And that’s what this recording is: a top-notch modern post-ideological HIP performance without vocal weaknesses, excellently performed to current taste, musical, and in very good sound. It has everything to be a reference recording of today.”To this we have come – post-ideological. So this luminous creation must be purged of metaphysics lest it offend the Oompa Loompas in our midst. Since when has ideology been synonymous with Faith? OK – go ahead and terminate Baby Jesus. Send Mary to a Women’s refuge. Consign Joseph to a Woke Re-Education Camp. The three Kings and their entourages are intruders without the requisite paperwork: book ‘em Dano! And remember these words of the carpenter’s son: For if men do these things when the tree is green, what will they do when it is dry?
>>128465495Stopped reading upon encountering the jewish fairy tale references.
>>128465495I automatically consider a writer to be a pretentious fucktard if he randomly inserts Latin quotes in order to sound smarter.
>>128465495Great writing, though I am suspicious it's AI. Anyway, I'm not so sure "post-ideological" means stripped of reverence and religious undertones. Seems to me more like free from the weight of performance tradition.
>>128465379>the tradition of western classical forms of harmony and melodic structure.That is classical music. The term "scherzo" is most often used in classical context, but is not limited to it. Scherzo simply means tenary form, an abstract musical structure that any piece of music can use as its mold. >made by a metalfagYou had one chance, and you posted something that isn't even part the genre you're advocating for, ridiculous. This is far from "hilarious levels" worship.>For the most part there is a always a goal of beauty and the sublime in the western tradition, This only betrays your lack of exposure not only to the philosophies of the composers, but the music itself. Hauer completely rejected the notion of beauty or emotion in music (as you suggest, this applies to your category of eliminating "human" from music), whereas Schoenberg goes as far to evoked the horrors of holohoax in A Survivor from Warsaw, most music by Webern completely avoids the notion of "beauty". You can get as pedantic as you want but their goals were as clear as a day: depiction of the ugliness and unpleasantness of the human experiece. You may say you find them "beautiful" "sublime" or whatever, but that's completely subjective, whereas the composer's intentions are not. Ives goes even further in that aspect.And the finished product is much more important than the goal (who cares what the goal is?). An uneducated pleb will never reach the goal as well as an experienced, talented composer, no matter what the goal is, that's just a fact.
>>128465531i agree, i also think it refers to the hip thing and not religion. still kinda funny... jabba the hutt...
>>128465516he literally was a seminarian at one point lol
now playingstart of Mahler: Symphony No. 9https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=iwHtS85yFpg&list=OLAK5uy_nAJQ3objDF9XuaaVe2Ibbp8Z41ta2cyMY&index=1https://www.youtube.com/playlist?list=OLAK5uy_nAJQ3objDF9XuaaVe2Ibbp8Z41ta2cyMY>For the latest instalment in their Mahler series, the Minnesota Orchestra under the direction of Osmo Vänskä presents what many consider to be the pinnacle of the Austrian composer's entire work, the Ninth Symphony, his last completed symphony. After a vast and emotionally intense first movement that shows an astonishing fluidity of form, theme, texture and tonality, 'the most glorious thing Mahler has written' according to Alban Berg, the second movement brings joy and playfulness and seems to evoke both an urban Straussian world and folk music cultures. To the bitter irony and anger of the third movement the last movement, a mystical Adagio, seems to respond with ineffable tenderness. Often regarded as the composer's monumental - both in terms of scale and emotional scope - leave-taking of the world, the Ninth Symphony can also be understood as a requiem for his daughter who died a few years before, an acknowledgment of the transience of life, a memorial to Vienna, an evocation of fading Austrian and Bohemian landscapes, a homage to a vanishing European cultural world.warning: this recording has received pretty mixed reviews, not to mention Vanska's Mahler is pretty hit-and-miss as is. Still, the orchestral performance will be top-notch, produced by perfect, gorgeous sound quality.
>>128465531>AI, schizobabble and desert cult worship>great writing
>>128465552I learned Aramaic just to mess with literature/arts faggots.
>>128465560it's not a.i. you absolute noob, bmoh was writing reviews on amazon long before that shit even became a thing
>>128465576>just to mess with literature/arts faggots.t. bitter philistine
>>128465537>but is not limited to itDelusional statement, these are literally classical forms, the inherent idea of making a scherzo, sonata, symphony, or any other implies classical music. You're just arguing to win a point, not arguing in good faith. >You had one chanceAnd I proved myself correct. I'm sorry that you were ignorant of the neoclassical metal culture, maybe next time learn something of what you argue about.>Schoenberg, Webern, Ives, etcProbably the worst counter examples you could have chosen, serialism produces abstraction and alienation as its core characteristic, not ugliness. I was expecting a Pederecki or Ligeti counter attack, at least then you could use the horror movie angle.
>>128464307Schoenberg without Mozart is nothing. Replace him immediately. We ALL know the big four are Bach, MOZART (fptmiu), Beethoven and Wagner (pbuh).
>>128465583very ironic considering who the philistines were.
Schumannhttps://www.youtube.com/watch?v=oyW2tIClQeU
>>128465600>impliesIt really just implies structure. I'm not going to call a random tenary structure a 'scherzo' - I don't listen or even care about it - but it's not "wrong" to do so.>ignorant of the neoclassical metal cultureI'm not, it was implied in "neoclassical popular music genres" I mentioned earlier. >serialism Is only a tool, not the end goal. The goal is defined by the composer's intentions, title, program etc. A Survivor from Warsaw is ugly music as ugliness as its prime "goal". And it had directly influenced horror music. I'm not going to run in circles with this, so I expect you to either add something valuable next time or quit wasting our time.
BachMozartBeethovenWagnerThey are the greatest composers.
favorite?
>>128465604>We ALL know the big fourAh yes, the OP taught us those big 4, we all saw the pic I guess lol
>>128465681you are gay.
>>128465379>the Beach Boysthe Beach Boys aren't even Baroque Pop, they are more like Psych Pop
>>128465681Not even top 10
>>128465666>It really just implies structureIt does not. Other genres will simply call a sonata "ABA", because in order for it to be a real sonata, it must follow classical tradition.>it was impliedIt was not, because you specially used Baroque pop and "neoclassical popular music genres" in opposition to metal, forgetting that the biggest Baroque worshippers in all of music outside of classical itself are metalfags. Neoclassical metal itself is just a slightly more advanced version of power metal, that contains the exact same baroque worship.>Is only a toolAnd a hammer cannot turn a screw. "A Survivor from Warsaw" is not very ugly, I don't know why you are dying on the hill of serialism of all things, Threnody for the Victims of Hiroshima and Polymorphia would have been much better for you. You just a serialist fan or something?
>>128465698>the most quintessential baroque pop artist is not baroque popJust another 4chan moment.
>>128465724just because RYM says it is doesn't mean it's trueBaroque Pop is stuff like Scott Walker
The Real Top 4:NancarrowStockhausenCagePiotr Zak
all music is shit, yes even classical
>>128465729Delusional.
>>128465681hard to argue with this.
>>128465747yeah
stop arguing about Metal for fucks sake, Metal is the most boring, uninteresting, repetitive slop "music" almost as bad as hip hop, just fuck off back to /mu/ and argue about it there.
>>128465775This, but in regards to baroque pop.
>>128465721Sonata is not "ABA", and is much different from a scherzo. >It was not,Sure, you know my intentions better than I do apparently. Could've just told me you're a dishonest ass right from the beginning.
>>128465780No one gives rat's ass about metal or baroque pop here, don't you see?
>>128465785>Sonata is not "ABA"Only if you include its classical tradition would this statement be true. For the rest of music it would in fact just be ABA. >Sure, you know my intentions better than I do apparently.Yeah, one of ignorance and bad faith.
>>128465793This, but in regards to Schoenberg.
>>128465799>For the rest of music it would in fact just be ABA.No, at best you could deduce sonata to ABCAB, even that would be an oversimplification, if not completely incorrect most of the time, but you seem to have surface level knowledge, which tends to come with overconfidence. Enough said.
>>128465834Incorrect, it would be ABA: exposition, development, and recapitulation. All whimpering about how development and recapitulation are shown is negated because only classical tradition can shape proper development. In the musical world outside of it, a "sonata" form can only be expressed in ABA. Which is why you cannot use classical forms outside of its tradition without also implying the music is following its traditions of harmony and progression.
Tatiana Nikolayeva's Bachhttps://www.youtube.com/watch?v=uWBTTONbQ2U&list=OLAK5uy_nE57a5TrrE-WvwBqbCHyqpd1YQTpCE5MA&index=1I've read this live performance is even superior to Nikolayeva's more famous Goldberg Variations on Hyperion. Let's find out.
>>128465875Yup, as I said. Classic surface level understanding with overconfidence. You haven't read a single book about the form or harmony, I don't blame you. Your overconfidence is what's embarrassing.
>muh booksif you want to learn about music, you should listen, not read
>>128465964No argument, butthurt levels critical.
>>128465092AC/DC is infamously "silly fun" boomer music, not something to larp as being sophisticated. prog rock sucks ass.
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=SIrWiEtEJ6E
>>128465998careerist youtubers need to be fucking gassed and turned into ash.
>>128465875>In the musical world outside of it, a "sonata" form can only be expressed in ABA. WhichNTA, but the recapitulation is not an exact repeat of the exposition so it'd be already AB'A at best according to your definition. But this also fails to keep into account that the usual exposition is made up of 2 sections (or more, sometimes) in different keys. So it has to be ABCA'B'. But this is still ignoring the fact that Sonata Form has it's roots in binary form and can just as well be expressed as AAB as one of the main differences between a sonata-allegro how it would eventually be written and the binary form sonata is just whether you repeat the B section.Take this prelude from WTC Bach wrote in binary form for example (Also just as an excuse to post this one because it's lovely):https://youtu.be/nJZ_DHdG27QIn many ways this can be expressed as a early sonata form. A section serves as a exposition and the B section as the development and recapitulation. And it's very clearly Binary Form, not ternary. When you look at Scarlatti's sonatas and some of Mozart's which keep the B section repeat, this becomes even more obvious. Most textbook sonata form pieces, even as late as Brahms still have binary elements to it. This obviously doesn't account for all composers (Bruckner most definitely doesn't have any binary elements in his sonata form pieces), but the textbook form is as much AAB as it is ABA as it is ABCA'B'. But AAB makes the most sense to me given the sonata's history. All of these would also be perfectly fair to express the sonata as in non-classical circles as your ABA definition, if anything it probably is the least sensical expression of the form outside musical circles.
>>128466069>the recapitulation is not an exact repeat of the expositioYet you are missing the fact that popular music does not do "recapitulation" in any form besides repetitions, such as a chorus, that is what separates popular music and classical traditions of progression. Which is why you cannot use classical forms without also implying classical development.You are in a hurry to speak of sonata from the mind of classical, fine, but that is not what this is about, this is about how popular non-classical music would express a "sonata" form, and the very fact that suggesting they follow a classical form must also intrinsically mean the piece is following classical traditions in some manner. Otherwise it could only be expressed as "ABA", which would not be "accurate", but to be accurate to the form, it would require proper development, which popular music does not have, thus it would by necessity require it to be following classical traditions.
>>128466069>All of these would also be perfectly fair to express the sonata as in non-classical circles as your ABA definition, if anything it probably is the least sensical expression of the form outside musical circles.*ABA is probably the least sensical expression of the form outside classical music circlesTo add to this, that is mainly due to that nobody hearing a sonata-allegro movement would genuinely think that it's ABA. When I first heard Mozart's concertos when I was younger and didn't know much about form, I used to hear it as something closer to how you would describe a rondo (Sure, concertos aren't technically the same type of sonata we are talking about here, but just an example). The conclusion of sonata-allegro being ABA can only be made from someone who reads up on how the form is described and not someone who listens to the music in that form.I would recommend you to listen before you read, I used to make similar assessments to you when I was trying to study the music more than i was listening.
>>128466122>Yet you are missing the fact that popular music does not do "recapitulation" in any form besides repetitions, such as a chorus, that is what separates popular music and classical traditions of progression.I mean, depends on how you define what even a recapitulation is. If it's simply re-stating themes that were developed beforehand in a non-exact manner, then you can definitely say Close To The Edge by Yes has a recapitulation.
>>128466209And what is it that is said of the nigh 20 minute long rock epic? Certainly no radio station is putting that on very often, and probably that it was beginning to run away from popular music in this single regard (but not in any other, such as harmony and so on). The most classical informed prog rock I've heard was Univer Zero, which at some point in their music was questionably even rock, as it had clearly steeped in modern classical for a long enough. https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=fE9EOogwq-gRegardless, the inherent inseparable tying of classical forms with classical development are undeniable. Anyone using classical forms in discussion of popular music are implying it to also carry the same traditions, or are simply uninformed.
>>128466069You are talking to illiterate overconfident anon who lost the previous argument already, but could not acknowledge it. Your explanation is pretty accurate though, but there's a lot more nuance, the development section itself usually divides in more than two sections even in classic sonata examples.
>>128465274Yes, the sound quality is far from perfect, but the performances are simply too good to dismiss.
>>128465681Facts.
>128466721samefag more
Someone else rates the 4 greatest composers of all time? It must be a samefag!
>>128466797>4 greatest composersNone of them were mentioned in this thread.
Bach (W.F.)BocceriniBusoniPärt
>>128466866>can't even spell his name
>>128466824Until now:Steve ReichJohn AdamsJohn CageHans ZimmmermanHEIL
>4 greatest composers of all timeI do this, but for each period/form/instrument separately. It only makes sense.
>>128467313And even then, you're wrong each time, because I disagree.
1) Medtner2) Handel3) Bach4) Scriabin5) Scarlatti6) Reger7) Durufle8) Busoni9) Rameau10) Mozart11) Scelsci12) Faure13) Wyschnegradsky14) Antonio Soler15) Beethoven
>>128465314"Not bad"https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ln0Tk1Tsb_g
I just don't get this cycle, yet a lot of enthusiasts claim it's even better than Kempff's superb stereo set. Oh well. Maybe someday.
now playingstart of Brahms: Double Concerto in A Minor, Op. 102https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=GOpisXY9pZg&list=OLAK5uy_lMTAxfam7UZuzam6c9lsK018qq654kyeM&index=2start of Clara Schumann: Piano Trio in G Minor, Op. 17https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=9W2ri4KMMso&list=OLAK5uy_lMTAxfam7UZuzam6c9lsK018qq654kyeM&index=4https://www.youtube.com/playlist?list=OLAK5uy_lMTAxfam7UZuzam6c9lsK018qq654kyeM>Anne-Sophie Mutter and Pablo Ferrández – a musical team united by friendship, inspiration and mentorship. Established as musical partners for many years, Anne-Sophie Mutter discovered the Spanish cellist’s extraordinary talent early on. Described by her as ‘someone truly special’ the world star violinist invited him into her foundation and circle of “Mutter’s Virtuosi”, young talents she supports and tours with. Since then, Pablo Ferrández has made himself a name on his own, developed into a sought-after, award-winning soloist home at the world’s most prestigious concert halls. For this recording, both artists, mentors and friends unite once more to capture their musical friendship on their first joint album with pianist, long term collaborator and friend Lambert Orkis, conductor Manfred Honeck and the Czech Philharmonic.
>>128467322I'm sure we would agree in some category, anon.
>>128467354>1) Medtner>2) Handel>3) Bach>4) Scriabin>5) ScarlattiExtremely based top 5.
>>128466797>Bach>Mozart>Beethovenpretty much the mainstream consensus>Wagner>Mahler>Schubertretarded anons who might as well be ragebaiting
>>128464284>We should all kill ourselvesyou first>>128464438you second
>>128468153Nah. We wouldn't.>>128468206>mainstream consensusmeans nothing
>>128468318you mean nothing
>>128463426only good post in the thread
>>128468382>messiaen>good postAnon, I...
>>128468341True, and you mean nothing, and the universe means nothing, there is no objective meaning to anything and there can't be one.
Does the conductor Kurt Masur have any essential recordings?
>>128469076Mozart piano concertos with Annerose Schmidt
feels like a Das Lied von der Erde dayhttps://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Dt62oaynoFo&list=OLAK5uy_k4mCIE43ypz5saHSbpjczWWkrvzaxPKRk&index=1
Mendelssohnhttps://www.youtube.com/watch?v=8ETa4X-O0go&list=OLAK5uy_nzhGFN2sA5UoRtVKmd_fVW2GwEd_GuR7U&index=24
listen to Aaron Coplandhttps://www.youtube.com/watch?v=StjRTrR9A0g
>when regular people hear the dissonant chord:/>when modernists hear the dissonant chord:O
>>128469425Depends on the chord and context. V7, suspensions, passing tones and other non-chord tones etc. are all dissonant, but used by pretty much every composer. Dissonance is all over music, and the interplay of consonance and dissonance is what makes music sound so rich and colorful. Music was getting more and more dissonant by the decade, reaching its climax with Wagner and Liszt, at which point composers didn't know where else to go with these ideas (as if they "had to"), so they turned it into monotonic pure disonance, which the modernists worship.
>>128469648An oversimplification if I've ever heard one. Maybe it's true for the Germans (not all), but the French and Russians were more interested in color and timbre than pure dissonance for dissonance's sake.
>>128468318>Nah. We wouldn't.You can't possibly know that for sure.
What I really love about Bach and Debussy is when I'm not in the mood for anything, when nothing I put on is doing the trick musically, their works are always a surefire refuge.
>>128469813It is possible that I don't know for sure, however I can predict with high enough certainty that we would not agree in any category, which is what led me to make the comment. It is also possible that I am contrarian by nature, so my subconcious would not let me agree with you. Both are probable to some extent.
Looking for a nice recording of Haydns Trumpet Concerto in Eb Major any ideas?
>>128470453>haydn>trumpet concerto
>>128470453https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=bYGH7XUlxeA&list=OLAK5uy_kfz3i6jHjr7BH6wmMDmLxHmoYJHBG_Yiw&index=21
>>128470494you will never be a sleepy woman
>>128470494Thinking about my cock on her face tbqh.
>>128470520This, except on Timberly's face.
Post African Repetitions:https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=cZWDrjLO7r4&list=RDcZWDrjLO7r4&start_radio=1
>>128470547Correct.
>>128470497>signature look of German superiority
>>128470578Superiority at pride parades maybe
I seriously can't tell if classical era or popular music is more boring.
>>128470904thank you romanitislopper
Time for some real music https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=vcx-4olgf10&list=RDvcx-4olgf10&start_radio=1
>>128470904>>128470949No need to fight, lads. All music sucks and is boring.
>>128470979It really is astonishing that Ligeti's Requiem can be utilized so many times and have such a hold on pop culture, and yet you still hear something new every time you listen to it. There’s a 50 year graveyard of pieces that try to emulate Ligeti’s micropolyphonic music, but can you imagine being the first person to write like that? There was zero precedent for music like that before Ligeti. He expressed emotions that had never been expressed before in art. It’s also astonishing that after centuries of Catholic tradition, a Transylvanian Jew came along and beat every previous composer at their own game. Ligeti wrote the greatest requiem of all time despite viewing the religious tradition behind the form as, at best, a fascination. If anything, that distance is key: Ligeti understood Catholicism as a vehicle for complex horrors, which is the perfect foundation for a work informed by his experience during the Holocaust. I don’t think a true believer could have done that as effectively.
>>128471018
>>128471073Cool story brohttps://www.youtube.com/watch?v=x0__tgrjTkc&list=RDvcx-4olgf10&index=2
All music is terrible. But some music is more boring and worse than others. Medieval music for example, is the most boring (along with popular and contemporary classical musics), followed by renaissance, then baroque, then classical, then modernist, and least boring is obviously romantic. Still boring and shit of course, but not as boring and shitty the others. But again, all music is terrible.
More like this?https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=utL8DfB6m7o&t=10s
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=kkaOz48cq2g&list=RDvcx-4olgf10&index=7
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=kCoOqsxLxSo&list=RDkCoOqsxLxSo&start_radio=1
>>128471148If you like this, you're gonna love Jute Gyte.
>MetalNot music.
Debussy's Images would blow the mind of all previous composers.https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Ap4oNa--E2E
I can't be botheredhttps://www.youtube.com/watch?v=GLvaTn2KdeY&list=RDGLvaTn2KdeY&start_radio=1
i literally saw wagner today
Gardening with Mauricehttps://www.youtube.com/watch?v=nSLgsg6NJKM
>>128471651well yeah. that's what happens when you say his name three times.
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=4vE6_1zsCtMi don't even know if it's his piano that makes it sound like shit or the piece is shitof course it's like a lullaby because brahms, come up with something new for once
>>128471406A well respected composer of the modern era, the bright horizon shines when the hour is darkest.
>>128471884Yeah that piano and/or the mic is making it ugly. Brahms' late piano works are sublime.get aware anonhttps://www.youtube.com/watch?v=w4nnjhHe15U
>>128468597Yes?
>>128471073>you still hear something new every time you listen to ityeah, *you* do
>>128465743>>128471018>>128471118All music is shit.Nine months ago, I was walking along a road and at the roadside, there were a few conifers, planted right next to each other, creating a dense barrier. It was a windy day. The sound the wind made when it hit those trees, this particular, well-tempered noise, it can only be described as a religious experience. Truly sublime. It stopped me dead in my tracks. I had the privilege to listen to it for half an hour before I had to get moving again.Now, up until that day, I always thougt that Josquin Desprez or Orlande de Lassus were the closest semblance of what might be called "God's voice on earth". Not anymore. That half hour of divine, fractal noise of streams of wind, thousandfoldly bifurcated between the trees' needles, profanized those composers for me. For good. To say nothing about the rest of all musicians.A few days ago, I segmented music into "art music" and "entertainment music". Not anymore. Art is entertainment. At the very best, it can point, like an index finger, to the divine and open our eyes and ears and soul to it. The noise of the wind hitting these conifers that day, however, WAS the divine itself. Never have I derived such deep satisfaction, found such profound and existential solace than I did that day next to those trees.I stopped listening to music. I shall meet the divine on these rare occasions in nature. Listening to consumerist music - and ALL music is consumerist! - will not fill my cup anymore. If anything, it can only remind me of the cup's existence.I hope, for all of you, that one day, just like me, you also will have an opportunity to discard this earthly, profane dirt called music. I so much wish it for you.I will repost this every day from now on.
>>128472116>blocks your pathhttps://www.youtube.com/watch?v=oYaf1xx1BGM
>>128472116Mongrelized post. Why don't you go buy a motorcycle and get your testosterone checked?
No I don't want to listen to Tombeau de Couperin
>>128472182summer's entirely too far away for posts like this
>>128472294Riding in the rain is based, anything beats being a dumb fucking cagiecuck. Feeling the wind force, the pelting rain drops, the rooster tail you kick up through the street rivers. We love that here.
>>128472322what do you imagine your post is a reply to
Michael Tippetthttps://www.youtube.com/watch?v=6A1XSpzjREc
>>128472332I considered two options:1) Some old baId 4cuck.org addict who has been here for 2 decades and will probably dying still typing "summer" 2) Someone saying he doesn't want to ride a motorcycle because its not summer weather atmI decided the pick the second option because I'm tired of old fat worthless faggots on this site.
>>128472364huh, the mind of a schizo can truly be a thing to wonder at
>>128472388Yeah, sure is a lot more interesting being me than you, thats for sure.
>>128472361Yes :)
>>128463367agreedhttps://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ZmvvAwRvTMAhttps://www.youtube.com/watch?v=sPdFj4PYh2Yhttps://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ZjxYVIAiYzghttps://www.youtube.com/watch?v=cQfGUWdIAsY>>128472361>>128472743also agreed
Milhaud, Tippet, Hindemith, Messiaen, and Křenek: the greatest XXth century composers*. No one else comes close. *to be understood as: A composer whose earliest attested piece was composed in the XXth century. Szymanowski and Medtner, for example, have works that date from the 1890s so I'm not counting them.
>>128473783Replace Krenek with Bartok and I'm game (he didn't write anything before 1902 as far as I'm aware; is this right?)
Just listened to Kletzki's Beethoven and man that was awful. He flips through it like a notebook, everything is so lightweight and unstressed.
I wish Bach had lived another 20 or 30 years
>>128474327Why? He had accomplished everything a musician could, and more. Now, Mozart living an extra 20-30 years, that would've been interesting
>>128474353He might have written 30 years worth of more identical pieces
>>128474456That's a bleak prospect even when applied to the greatest musician of all time
>>128474353>>128474456late Mozart would have been a better version of Tchaikovsky or at least pointed in that direction.
>>128474806I think late Mozart would've been a cross between Hummel and Mendelssohn honestly. Which is already saying a lot. Still, man was a genius but he didn't have that much left of the visionary in him I don't think
>>128474099Kletzki with Czech philharmonic is the only cycle I listen to.
Hey, Beethovenians, do you think you could recognise an ensemble+director+recording of a symphony just by listening to a snippet?
>>128474911If it's totally random, no. If we're talking about a controlled test in which the only selections are from cycles I own, I'd probably do pretty well.>Blomstedt/Leipzig>Harnoncourt/Chamber Orchestra of Europe >Barenboim/Berlin>Vänskä/Minnesota >Wand/NDRThese are the ones I own. I'd highly recommend all of them.
suspensions can resolve by a step or a skip in any direction and I'm tired of pretending they can't.
I hope to one day get Bartok's string quartets
>>128475714that depends on what you're trying to get.
>>128475742First and foremost, to enjoy.
now playingstart of Bartok: String Quartet No. 1, Op. 7, Sz. 40, BB 52https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=HYnPhopWzs0&list=OLAK5uy_mYMoQt3ZGNSJC7MOZBIqOoaMmNhL7jtXU&index=2start of Bartok: String Quartet No. 3, Sz. 85, BB 93https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=F7ODH_t1R_w&list=OLAK5uy_mYMoQt3ZGNSJC7MOZBIqOoaMmNhL7jtXU&index=5start of Bartok: String Quartet No. 5, Sz. 102, BB 110https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=_kBG1h7FDD4&list=OLAK5uy_mYMoQt3ZGNSJC7MOZBIqOoaMmNhL7jtXU&index=7https://www.youtube.com/playlist?list=OLAK5uy_mYMoQt3ZGNSJC7MOZBIqOoaMmNhL7jtXU>Solid performances and sonic excellence place the Vermeer Quartet’s Bartók Quartets near the top among budget-priced recommendations. ---- Jed Distler
>>128470412No, it's not merely possible that you don't know; it's inevitable. You can't know for sure. Predictive confidence isn't the same as knowledge, because a prediction isn't truth-bearing in advance, and knowledge requires justification, belief and truth. And since you yourself admit it's possible that you're contrarian by nature, I also can't know whether you'd just shift the goalposts or refuse to agree out of habit. That uncertainty alone makes absolute certainty impossible.
can someone please tell me if it's Shoo-mon or Shoo-min?
>All of our world leaders were having gay sex in private all alongSome Tchaikovsky for this feelinghttps://www.youtube.com/watch?v=R3gLJaGKJ9I
>>128477140>>128477140Some gloomy, anxiety-ridden modernism would probably be ideal: Shostakovich, Weinberg, Schnittke.
>>128477140>>128477166Oh, and Allan Pettersson.https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=KMG-QHu5QFs
>>128477166>>128477173Honestly Haydn makes more sense because the news is hilarious and confirms that all of this current warmongering is actually a gay relationship drama between old men
now playingAllan Pettersson: Symphony No. 2https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=OPI3DRldCCQ&list=OLAK5uy_mn5BEPZK6YgEAR15iWw0ZM6iTA0dDQfhM&index=2Allan Pettersson: Symphonic Movementhttps://www.youtube.com/watch?v=bDJjIXLiikw&list=OLAK5uy_mn5BEPZK6YgEAR15iWw0ZM6iTA0dDQfhM&index=2https://www.youtube.com/playlist?list=OLAK5uy_mn5BEPZK6YgEAR15iWw0ZM6iTA0dDQfhM>Allan Pettersson (1911-1980) was a Swedish composer whose seventeen symphonies stand as a powerful record of this composer's prolixity. His music also does its best to go beyond both modernism and neo-romanticism. His symphonies are usually one-movement affairs that tend to avoid any kind of emotional blather or self-pity; they are instead rigorous, unyielding, assertions of a very somber (and sober) musical personality. They have power and a kind of intellectual charm, but they are among the best written in this century. You can hear where Schnittke, Segerstam, and Silvestrov got some of their ideas. --Paul CookFeels like a modernism day.
>>128477179Which news?
Chopin's musical language is emotionally ambitious but operates within a harmonic and textural idiom that (in my view) cannot fully support that ambition. This creates an aesthetic mismatch that I find less satisfying than the proportional unity in Baroque or the fully realized harmonic depth of late Romantic/early modern music. Sorry, that's just the way I think it is.
>>128478218Chopin's musical language (and pianism) is perfection and the height of harmony and music itself. Boreque doesn't compare, and late romantic is an insignificant elboration on Chopin's language, but without the bel canto melodic gift that only Chopin (and the Italians) possessed, making Chopin the ultimate, greatest composer. >I have still enough of the Pole left in me to let all other music go, if only I can keep Chopin.-NietzscheCan't disagree with Nietzsche, rather have the highest quality than high quantity.
Hofmann performing Chopin, what could possibly be betterhttps://www.youtube.com/watch?v=0K8CH1RUWH8
>>128478305Chopin's musical language is emotionally ambitious but operates within a harmonic and textural idiom that (in my view) cannot fully support that ambition. This creates an aesthetic mismatch that I find less satisfying than the proportional unity in Baroque or the fully realized harmonic depth of late Romantic/early modern music. Sorry, that's just the way I think it is.
>>128475714>>128475776>doesn't enjoy the greatest quartets of the last 125 yearsno hope>>128476597It's shoon-berg>>128477140maho more like my whore, closeted fag
>>128478497rarted and farted
>>128478305full quote:>For my own part, I have still enough of the Pole left in me to let all other music go, if only I can keep Chopin. For three reasons I would except Wagner's Siegfried Idyll, and perhaps also one or two things of Liszt, who excelled all other musicians in the noble tone of his orchestration; and finally everything that has been produced beyond the Alps—this side of the Alps.[3] I could not possibly dispense with Rossini, and still less with my Southern soul in music, the work of my Venetian maestro, Pietro Gasti.I guess you can't disagree with Nietzsche that a mediocrity like Peter Gast is a 'young Mozart' and I expect you to be regularly listening to his music.
>>128478832>greatest quartets of the last 125 yearsThey were mostly composed by Shostakovich.
>>128478848>Shotaconbitch>goodno hope at all
>>128478859>filtered by Shostatruly, no hope.
You're a wizard Harry
>>128478876>eating up trough musicenjoy your slop, swine, oink oink oink
>>128478911Could you translate that to English?
>>128478846>Ecce Homo, "Why I Am So Clever" That shit was written at peak edgy contrarian Nietzsche. No drive left in him other than being reactionary for the sake of going against whatever he thought was the "norm". Truly sad.
>>128478954>According to one of Nietzsche's most prominent English translators, Walter Kaufmann, the book offers "Nietzsche's own interpretation of his development, his works, and his significance.">Kaufmann's Nietzsche: Philosopher, Psychologist, Antichrist notes the internal parallels, in form and language, to Plato's Apology which documented the Trial of Socrates. In effect, Nietzsche was putting himself on trial with this work, and his sardonic judgments and chapter headings can be seen as mordant, mocking, self-deprecating, or sly.>Within this work, Nietzsche is self-consciously striving to present a new image of the philosopher and of himself, for example, a philosopher "who is not an Alexandrian academic nor an Apollonian sage, but Dionysian." On these grounds, Kaufmann considers Ecce Homo a literary work comparable in its artistry to Vincent van Gogh's paintings. Kaufmann you unending embarrassment
>>128478986>merely pretendingThe ultimate and final cope for a hack.
>>128478986Kaufmann is the stereotypical academic midwit trying to find as many smart sounding hot takes as he can.
>>128478943Oh for sure:>eating up trough musicenjoy your slop, swine, oink oink oink
>>128479022Nice selfie, maybe try >>>/soc/?
>>128470148based, if only these other g*rman loving neurotics could see the light
>>128479165>I don't listen to germans. Anyway, Bach is based
>>128479225Bach is Franco/Italian mixed with German craftsmanship. He doesn't write incel chords/lines like Beethoven or Mahler. He's a very sensuous composer which is why the guy had 20 kids and Beethoven had none.
I don't listen to germans. Anyway, Handel is based.https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=-jDlRFoQPQ8
>>128479278>Bach is Franco/ItalianQRD?
>>128479302yeah, source is me
>>128479309Retard.
>>128479278Beethoven had none because he was a real genius, an innovator who pushed classical era into the romantic, Bach was only a culmination of what came before him, he was not a genius. Hs son CPE however, arguably was.
>>128479324neurotic incel
>>128479356Holy mother of incel cope
>>128479356>he was not a genius. Hs son CPE however, arguably was.Classishits and romantisloppers everyone
>>128479359>>128479368Thank you for the cliquespam.
>>128479525https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=2qJ1KN1pVIU
>>128479525Listen to the big four (Chopin, Scriabin, Rachmaninoff, Medtner)Did you already listen to our Scriabin recs?
>>128479278>Bach is Franco/Italian
>>128479816Everyone knows the Erfurt Line had its home at the heart of Francoitalia!
>>128479278>Mahler>germanwhat next, Mozart was actually portuguese, actual name Lobogango Deudoro Mosartão
Anderszewski's Bachhttps://www.youtube.com/watch?v=EFGHUso9AUI&list=OLAK5uy_n4_-FrDrutK2DJuC1BjaLJIO7Paa_09P0&index=7>Piotr Anderszewski takes a characteristically creative approach to Bach's Das Wohltemperierte Klavier (The Well-tempered Clavier). Rather than recording all 48 of it's prelude-and-fugue pairings, he has focused on 12 pairings from Book Two. "I decided to put the pieces together in a sequence of my own subjective choosing, based sometimes on key relationships, at other times on contrasts. The idea behind this specific order is to create a sense of drama that suggests a cycle: 12 characters conversing with one another, mirroring each other." Anderszewski's last Erato album of Bach prompted BBC Music Magazine to write: "For anyone who loves Bach (or the piano)... this life-enhancing disc is required listening."
>>128480144>"I disfigured Bach on a whim">required listening for Bach lovers
>>128480227lol, but see >>128451776
Aalampour edition next?
>>128480242>I picked the ice cream off the menu and threw it into the soup, that I got off the menu. My dish is valid and if you don't like it you're a narrow-minded traditionalist
>>128480667
>>128480667...?It's not like a mix of Bach's WTC with Chopin's Nocturnes lmao, or Schoenberg's piano pieces. It's just a selection from the WTC. What's the matter with you...?
>>128480405Kuala Lumpur edition?
new>>128481027>>128481027>>128481027
