>>16147165The capitalist jew has brainwashed you to think that wealth transfer from poor to rich via taxation to subsidize big corporations is communist but communist = robin hood and climate change = reverse robin hood.>b-but muh taxation and regulation *drool*
>>16147165>>16147224https://twitter.com/cloverhogan/status/1783429995852964162Climate change isn't the goal. Equity is the goal. They dont want solutions.
>>16147165>communism is when Blackrock, Goldman Sachs, JP Morgan, Pfizer, Exxon, BP, Google, Meta, Amazon, Microsoft, IBM, Raytheon, and Lockheed Martin dictate the governments and the central banks to force the population into living in the pod, eating the bugs and owning nothing
>>16147246>Equity is the goal.How? One lbs of meat per week maximum for everyone? But carbon credit scores are like catholic indulgence fees so those can't create equality.
>>16147165I think I got the message.Just one thing I don't understand. Why is there value in shitposts that are public anyway?
yes, the planet's climate and temperature changes all the fucking time, it's naturalwhat isn't natural is the stupid amounts of CO2 humanity has pumped into the atmosphereit's poison and can make people retarded if it goes much higher
>>16147224>wealth transferfancy word for "stealing"
>>16147288You sitting at your desk creates a high CO2 environment than what you'll find outdoors.
>>16147165why did this guy make electric cars if he hates the concept of green energySounds like he doesn't believe in his product at all and just wanted to make money.
>>16147303EVs can be powered by coal as well as solar.
Bruh I can't afford a house or groceries. I'd be happy living in a commie block at this point
>>16147165A manufactured crisis
>>16147224>The capitalist jew has brainwashed you to think that wealth transfer from poor to rich via taxation to subsidize big corporations is communist but communist = robin hoodadulthood is realizing that both communism and capitalism are poor to rich subsidization systems in practice because all economic systems have always been. It's a feature of human civilization that the people in power eat first. There is no way to impliment robin hood and there never will be. All we can do is get richer as a species so there is more left over for the common man.
>>16147325Agreed in principle but in practice inequality can increase or decrease. The bottom of the hierarchy must play their role but are demoralized instead. That's not natural.
>>16147165Of course climate change is real. The alternative position is that the climate is unchanging but a cursory examination of reality reveals that everything changes. More useful questions would be: To what extent are human activities driving the change? To what extent can we purposefully alter that change? How much will it cost? Who will pay? What happens if we do nothing? etc.The climate isn't changing at the same rate everywhere or in the same way. Some areas are becoming more habitable for people, some areas are becoming less so. This has been happening since forever. Things might be faster now. It's unclear because as a topic climate change draws in many disingenuous actors i.e. people whos motivation appears to be seeking power or seeking to punish perceived opponents.
>>16147363>More useful questions would be:No because rational debate benefits the experts who are so knowledgable and skilled that they are better than anyone else in abusing facts to create false narratives and win the public debate. They must be defeated with retarded memes.
>>16147363>To what extent are human activities driving the change?A negligible amount, if any at all.>To what extent can we purposefully alter that change?Not at all.>How much will it cost?Way too much.>Who will pay?The average citizen, through taxation and inflation.>What happens if we do nothing?The climate keeps changing back and forth in cycles like it always has as far back as we can observe.
>>16147261They dont want nuclear power because that would mean people would still continue to functioning society.They want electric deficient power. So they can remove people's ability to own and drive their own car. All CARS. They dont like electric cars. They dont like gas cars. They want to remove all private ownership. The solutions offered by capitalism doesn't work because it enables individuals to still have freedom.Their proposed answer is public transportation, expansion of government powers, reduction of energy usage, reduction of meat usage, eating the bugs, depopulation campaigns, castration campaigns, etc.
>>16147272>posts regularly on 4chan>complains about incessive shit postingdilate
>>16147381good summary
>>16147303He is a grifter.Tesla is doing bad and he tries to pivot.
>>16147381>that would meanNot necessarily. Either way the powerful will find excuses to increase their control over our lives like for our health, for our safety etc. That's the fate of any system like the other anon said. By the way it needs to be mentioned that Musk's technology supports the plan to totally control our lives.
Yes, and it's human caused. But it is not the end of the world. The media and the powerful use it to push their agendas and control the people, their best strategy is marrying truth to a lie. But they have a whole dialectic playbook. >truth and lie to manipulate>set up to feed any reaction so it becomes an overreaction >use overreaction to take back power or just infiltrate it and wait for the next pendulum swing to the left to make even more commie shitExample:>industry fucks climate>we need carbon tax and government control or we all die!!!>push, push, push ridiculously>reactionaries push for fascism>help fascism happen>government now huge>infiltrates already there, all power figures can be blackmailed from their data, from their epstein island visits, from their woke brainwashed kids>feed revolution against fascism>get the government and make it even harder>>16147317All according to keikaku.
>>16147306petrol and diesel cars can only be powered by fuels so they're more fascist and suit him more.Teslas are associated with liberals and communists. Fascist conservatives don't buy them.>>16147401he should make Tesla pollute the environment more
>>16147303No, its because regular folks dont understand what the "climate" agenda extremists want.See >>16147381Meanwhile solutions like nuclear energy, electric cars, solar panels, etc are seen as evils by the the extremists. They are evil because it allows individual ownership and individual means of control. Thats antithetical to their "climate" activism, which is socialism.
>>16147447this guy gets it
>>16147165I don't give a fuck what Elon Musk is talking about
>>16147165>Is Climate Change Real?From a natural, "the planet doing it's thing in order to preserve and achieve homeostasis"? Yes. Climate change has historically happened and will continue to happen. There's nothing wrong with acknowledging that and making adaptive decisions in response to natural phenomena. From an "industry is making too much pollution & carbon and if we don't stop we'll cook like a dog in a van" Sort of. There's problems. -The first problem is we're collectively very bad at making predictive models for the environment because we actually know jackshit about biology, ecology, and the environment in general. We're excellent at collecting data, making lab models, simulations, understanding particles, physics, chemistry, etc.. But the environment could be considered 'alive'ish' and it's constantly doing new things we can't account for that in turn make 'us' look stupid. -The only 'real' method of environmentalism is restoration and conservation: grow things back and leave them alone. But then our environmentalist models of action have been completely hijacked by globalist consultants & industrial capitalists and their, frankly insane, carbon markets that have it in their head that it's perfectly fine to remove a biome or ecosystem if they can compensate it's 'estimated value' and/or cultivate a new one of equal or greater value in some hypothetical future. Do you know that thing Wimpy from Popeye always says? The, "I'll gladly pay you Tuesday for a hamburger today" ? That's basically official policy now.In 1969 Lake Eerie was so polluted it caught on fire and burned for 30 minutes. In 1972 Richard Nixon signed the Clean Water Act that effectively made it illegal for that kind of thing to happen and set the EPA on the war path to cleaning the rivers and lakes of America. Something like this is basically impossible in our super cool 'reductive' carbon emission meme future.
>>16147447One of the most eye opening parts of the pandemic was how many of my friends I made from when I was a transit activist were angry about the huge expansion of work from home. They should have been overjoyed by it. It had always been one of the "commute alternatives" that we pushed but once it finally happened on a large scale, many of them revealed themselves to really be authoritarians in favor of forcing everyone to live in dense city centers with only government supplied transportation to get around. Turned out many of them were anti-car not because of worries about climate change or pollution but because cars allowed people to live distant from the problems of the city. If they can do that, they don't have an incentive to care about and help solve the problems of cities. In the end, it comes down to a desire to make their problems into everyone's problem so everyone will be forced into solving their problems for them.pic unrelated
>>16147502>falken's maze>global thermonuclear warDoesn't look very different from the total war on climate, so where is the difference, i.e. not complete annihilation of whatever?This is why I oppose action on climate change btw.PSThe IPCC only discusses scientific theoriesPPSthe only winning move...
I want to fight climate change AND to eat the rich.
>>16147521>In the end, it comes down to a desire to make their problems into everyone's problem so everyone will be forced into solving their problems for themEven then it sounds slightly positive. But thats not it either. As I said before, they dont want a solution to fix the problem. They want THEIR solution. Which is to implement fascist socialist ideology. They see technology as a threat to their ideology. They see prosperity as a threat to their ideology. They see free people as a threat to their ideology. When free and prosperous people propose a technological solution, they hate them for it. I want to say its a subversion of the original "climate" ideology which has morphed into a globohomo socialist order cult. But I think I might be bit too naive on that. Its possible that the original ideology of climate relies upon hatred of free society and the seed of communist ideology was supplanted to destroy the society itself. Yes grand conclusion, but the way its going, I cant rule it out yet
>>16147539those are not conflicting ideologies.they're both part of communism these days
>>16147794Not if the rich wrap themselves up in a rainbow.
>>16147165no
>>16147165Yes but humans can't do anything about it
>>16147959
>>16147165Of course it's real. But it is natural. The climate changes throughout the day because the Earth rotates on its axis. The climate changes throughout the solar year as the Earth rotates around the sun. The climate changes throughout the galactic year as the Sun orbits the Milky Way.
>>16147165>Is Climate Change Real?yes, but human CO2 emissions play only a smaller role
>>16147165we live in an age where chang and igor will employ pajeet to convince barry, hans and pierre that climate ain't real, all while pajeet will get fucked first and the hardest.
>>16147255Corporations have somehow brainwashed people into thinking corporations are communist but to oppose them we have to prop up the corporations. And both conservatives and liberals fall for it hook, line and sinker.
>>16149564Just one flaw with this analysis: a substantial portion, perhaps even a majority of "woke" people are white. Non-racist white people are not shunned or ostracised by the movement. The people this is supposed to "divide and conquer" aren't divided by it. Keyboard warriors like you who whine about mentions of racism in the media are, because you feel personally attacked. So if you want to do something about it, look to yourself.
>>16149680>(((WHITE)))
>>16147303Teslas aren't about saving the environment
>>16149735current EVs are transition EVs, you cannot have good EVs without a causal chain for having them. everything we do we make better in incremental steps. if you want that super clean proper EV with all that, you need something worse before it, makes logical sense anon.the most retarded twitter tier argument is seething that last 5 years EVs are not all that when you had 100 fucking years of gas cars before. it's not reasonable, and all of this while the whole fucking planet tried to fuck with Tesla so they aren't successful.
>>16149726There aren't enough Jews in the world to substantiate your aspersions
>>16149680>a majority of "woke" people are white.Almost all Woke people are White.The rest of the world can clearly see the truth.
>>16147224mentally ill narcissists get excited about taxation because their inner fantasy life revolved around power fantasies of "this is what i'd do if i was in charge" and because they are hopelessly jealous of everyone who has more money than they do.
>>16149677Fabian Society
>>16151081>>16147255
>>16147255Look at this typical rightwing conspiritard gish gallop. Why do you censor the most important part of their message?Sure, they will be in the pod.Yes, they will be eating bugs.And yeah, they will own nothing.But you forgot one thing: they will be happy.And isn't that what really matters?
>>16147224The capitalist has brainwashed you into thinking there just isn't enough for everyone, but the only scarce things are jobs and money, and it's set up that way on purpose, or at least there is no reason for it to be that way.
>>16147296You think the poor in the ghetto care? They need thrir food stamps and medicaid. Sooner or later these guys are going to vote in real socialists and we are all going to really suffer.
>>16147317Then I suggest moving to Cuba
This is a /pol/ thread. The mods have udderly failed in their only job.Sage
>>16147288>it's poisonThat kind of poison that makes plants grow.
>>16151125>a happy life in the stone age is of the same quality and equally valuable as a happy life in modernityRelativism has damaged your brain.>>16150511>power fantasies of "this is what i'd do if i was in charge"The bigger concern is that they don't self-correct when they see that the real consequences of what they think is good are actually bad. >>16151138>thinking there just isn't enough for everyoneAs long as there are people who prefer predatory strategies over symbiotic strategies the symbiotes must act like predators to predators and as symbiotes to symbiotes. Climate change policy is a wolf in sheeps' clothing. That's what the controversy is about.
>>16150511but the right side of the picture is in fact from another religionhttps://www.youtube.com/watch?v=YfwMpxhrCYE
>>16151431Stop talking in riddles, it doesn't make you sound smart, and people will think that you are schizophrenic.
>>16151642>riddlesWe use abstractions to summarize a truckload of details. That's how conversations on an academic level work because a shared knowledge base between conversation partners is assumes. If it's not clear what I'm referring to, like the word ''relative'' of who ''they'' are or why I use terms like ''predator'' and ''symbiote'' then you can just ask me to clarify so you can check whether or not my words are empty before you label me as a schizo.
>>16151652People speak like that when they lack sufficient abstraction to grasp the problem.
>>16151671Instead of attacking what content of my statement you don't agree with you're attacking the way I use language. That reminds me of political ideology derived from post-modern philosophy: very telling.
>>16151694Think of a neural network, which is trained to identify tachycardia. You can train it to read the ECG, and tell you if it's tachycardia, even identifying various kinds of tachycardia, and it doesn't have to know what a heart is. Tahycardia is much less abstract than a fast heartbeat.
I'm an Earth scientist. The data you need to understand that question is freely available. The best source of information is the IPCC but for some reason people have poisoned the well and claimed that anyone who claims man made climate change is real is somehow a shill of .... 'science' I guess? With some tenuous claims about a conspiracy or something based on misunderstanding emails from 15 years ago that were long ago debunked.So here's sources not related to the IPCC, however, keep in mind, the IPCC's job is literally to inform the public about the reality of man made climate change.Here's ExxonMobil admitting climate change is real and caused by humans:https://corporate.exxonmobil.com/sustainability-and-reports/advancing-climate-solutionsHere's BASF a major petroleum chemical company admitting climate change is real and caused by humans:https://www.basf.com/us/en/who-we-are/change-for-climate.htmlHere's BP pretending they care about reaching netzero, which is addressing the damages their own company causes:https://www.bp.com/en/global/corporate/sustainability/getting-to-net-zero.htmlFriend, even the oil companies admit climate change is real and caused by humans. You can fudge numbers all you want, you can pretend some super conspiracy by ordinary scientists but you can't escape the fact that even oil companies now are forced to admit their product is dangerous and hurting people. Something they would never do if the evidence weren't completely against them.
>>16151708A human is a pattern recognition machine. The goal of my posts is to point out those patterns because that's one level up in awareness from not recognizing those patterns at all. Now we can misunderstand what those patterns mean like the famous example of the rooster and the sun, but it's still up to you to point out where my interpretation is wrong. Stop stringing me along if you're serious or continue without my reply.
remember when the ozone hole was correlated with refrigerant patents?
>>16151736Yes there's a picrel suggesting how it could be seen as a business model.
>>16151734Your reply had nothing to do with what I said. I said that capitalism only pretends scarcity - so for example, there isn't enough houses for everybody, so we have to determine who gets to own one. There isn't enough bread for everybody, so we have to somehow decide who gets to eat. But this almost never happens in reality, and the only two scarce things are jobs and money, and there are empty houses, amd people who can't afford to buy one.
>>16151748There's a bunch of careless people at the top of capitalism that don't care about these problems the lower end face and are controlling things and stopping help from coming so they can keep their top position. Largely due to luck
>>16147165Didn't Elon used to market his electric cars on the basis of them being environmentally friendly? What changed?
>>16151748>But this almost never happens in realityIt is reality. It's the darwinian nature of living beings, the biological motivation systems of fear/desire, punishment/reward, pain/pleasure and all the psychology that derives from these biological motivation system like the will to exercise power over others, territorial behaviour etc. Human emotions are a dashboard for how well we satisfy these drives. It feels good to do better than anyone else.You seem to want to downplay the reality biology in favor of the fantasy of social constructivism and morality. Instead I propose to recognize that some humans have a different kind of biology: they feel better when sharing and cooperating rather than dominating.
>>16151757Elon is a hack fraud but here he is right. There's too many climate change grifters who have ulterior motives
>>16151757People want electric cars to be a good alternative. What people don't want is to be forced to switch and pay through the nose. Teslas were marketed more as a high-performance electric sportscar than a save-the-planet-mobile.
>>16152183that's how you make it cheap. start with expensive small number models then expand build capability and make that cheaper and cheaper. I think it's a business model or something
>>16152183Electric motors are superior, it has always been propaganda to show electric cars as slow and weak. An ICE can never reach the torque of an electric motor.
>>16152701EVs are trash
>>16153556Try beating one in a race.
Here's how to cut the Gordian knot:https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Carbon_fee_and_dividend
>>16153810You're going to have issues with step one and step two. You'd have to beat the lobbying power of fossil fuel corporations who would lose money from having to raise their prices. You'd also have to convince politicians to evenly distribute a bunch of money to every citizen, which is a political nonstarter. Instead of the perfect solution what we need is any solution because what we have currently is a plan to delay action for as long as possible.
>>16147363This. It's literally a coin flip argument. Either nothing happens or something happens. The former is more absurd than the latter. Full stop.
>>16153931You are retarded beyond belief. This is already happening and you don't even see it.
>>16154750Which part is already happening? People winning lobbying wars against fossil fuel companies? Taxes are being evenly redistributed to the citizens instead of just the rich people? One of us is definitely a retard.
>>16153931>fossil fuel corporations lose money from when they sell their product for higher pricesextremely low iq
>>16147303>why did this guy make electric cars if he hates the concept of green energyWhere'd you get that from?
>>16155953Take an economics class, moron. Raising prices reduces sales.
>>16147303Whats wrong with making money? Your daddy makes money to pay all your bills for you, do you think he should stop?
>>16147224https://www.bitchute.com/video/8AHkAJrpAxd4/
>>16157139People get angry at Musk for being successful because they're jealous of him
>>16147347So what if they’re demoralized, they’ll still keep making money and serving the rich until they drop dead. The rich are untouchable gods and you should respect them.
>>16147165Yes, it's called the sun getting brighter and the Earth's core cooling down, plus ninus whatever random events happen on the planet surface.>>16147224fpbp
>>16158224That's not what's happening
>>16159252Gistemp uses NOAA surface stations and NOAA surface stations are almost entirely badly sited on asphalt in and around urban areas and as such are ruined by heat island effect.
>>16159283Even if we took what you said at face value that wouldn't explain an increasing trend, especially not when solar insolation is decreasing.
>>16149680>>16149726>>16149816>>16149826don't see any unmentioned relevant points left here, but do see the lack of some coup de gras that rebinds this ideological divide which probably would be something like /sci/ is >>16156998 and not being racist means you're okay with >>467082268 or in other words people are still only parroting their respective echo chamber's bs
>>16159752scuse me it's a post on /pol/
>>16147165Yes. It is. It can be and has been measired. /thread
>>16147165It doesn't matter if it's real or not for two reasons.1)>It isn't related to humans and is completely out of our control2)>It is caused by humans and the only solution is to wipe out a massive percentage of the human populationWhether it is or is not our fault or if it is even real at all it doesn't matter because the only solution would be more horrendous then the problem itself.
>>16159755about hunger
I mean yeah to some extent. Is it as chronic as purported by the media? I cannot imagine so, but things such as ocean acidification are certainly real. Also, it would be nice to just not live in a chinese esque shithole if possible, even if there weren't any side effects, I don't want smog in my cities and garbage in my rivers. Let's keep the third world in the third world if possible
>>16159830>but things such as ocean acidification are certainly realno it isn't
>>16153702insanely easy in any endurance racetry driving it on a highway for any amount of time they are for cities only
>>16159334cities are growing and heat island effect grows with city sizeand we are more and more obsessed with paving every inch of soil within the cities
>>16149735All motorized transport is for the degenerate and doesn't help the environment either.
>>16147317>posts communist/statist divide and conquer tactics between the genders
>>16161129helps the people. you alive doesn't help the environment so you know what you have to do to save "the environment"
>>16147377>>16147381this>>16147408>the fate of any systemof government. If you could set in to motion a system devoid of government, this fate would be avoided
>>16153810>surely price controls will work this time!Price controls don't work. You're ilk just want to steal from other people and call it a tax. KYS promptly.
>>16161145youre a bit confused arent you ? Degenerate motorist. The minds weakness rivals that of the body. Typical for your kind.
>>16153810This cycle would reduce the size of the econmy by forcing people to use costly "climate friendly" (reality is untaxed products) alternatives.By increasing the price of goods, you reduce people's wellbeing. You are scum.
>>16156391Sadly most people don't even understand how prices are determined. This is a principle reason for why the vote should not be universal, or at minimum highly restrict what can be voted on.
>>16161162how tf do you get around, ride a fucking horse?
>>16159766>2)>It is caused by humans and the only solution is to wipe out a massive percentage of the human populationExactly. This is the logical end point of all climate change nonsense, and I'd suggest the wider concept of leftism as a whole.The problem leftists/climate types point out is humans making an impact on the environment. The only foolproof way to eliminate human imapct on the envrionment is to exterminate all humans.This dovetails perfectly with the wider antinatalism of leftism, and is part of why envrionmentalism attracts them so much. That and it gives them an excuse to further steal other people's things.Leftism is the product of dysgenics.
>>16161168Healthy and functioning humans have legs and are capable of bipedal locomotion. For the extended trip I recommend a bicycle. Cripples, elderly, women, weak, injured, children and other degenerates of course have my blessings when using motorised means of transportation as everyone should have the possibility to participate.
>>16161179bruv that'll just make everyone get a cripple permit. or literally get crippled so they get the permit.
>>16161192I don't see how my opinion of them would make anyone want to do anything.
>>16161126The magnitude of the effect doesn't increase with city size and decreasing solar insolation would lead to decreasing temperatures even if the weather stations are all on asphalt.
>>16161123t. Never even seen an EV
>>16161056how
>>16147165Yes it’s real. The denialists just like slurping oil nozzles too much to admit it is real. It is seen with your very eyes, every average temperature has been higher than the last. Does this mean the socialist solution? Of course not. Texas already mogs California on green energy despite California being socialist and socialist China is making more coal. Free market forces are solving climate change more than the socialist countries, explain that.
>>16162125>explain that.Subsidies
>>16147165>Is Climate Change Real?yes.
>>16147246>Climate change isn't the goalit's not a goal, it's a phenomenon. Attempting to stop CO2-induced global warming is a goal
>>16162125>Free market forces are solving climate change more than the socialist countries, explain that.I won't explain that because it's simply not true.If it weren't for governments' socialistic environmental efforts, the green economy would not have gotten started
>>16162209CO2 doesn't cause global warming
>>16151731Over a week. My post is still ignored.You guys don’t want facts about climate change. You want propaganda.
>>16162828nobody read your self indulgent wall of text, you only presumed they would because you have a personality disorder that clouds your judgement
