How did scientific fraud become so normal?
>>16373720It's not unless you only look at the social sciences + 3rd world.
>>16373731I doubt social sciences use westernblotter.
>>16373720In general- it's an aristocracy. Money comes down from heaven, so the incentive is to cater to each other and the gods. The result is open corruption, office politics, egotism, and other petty horseshit pretty much instantly.Fields with practical applications tend to be much more resistant, because at some point somebody has to actually transplant a liver or get a rocket into orbit, but it's not immune. Especially if nobody in charge really cares how many patients die or rockets fail to launch. Fields where nobody actually does anything are entirely composed of this from Day 1, because it makes literally no difference what you spew from a practical standpoint, so power games are all that's left.For China specifically- communism absolutely disintegrates social cohesion and morality, and that lasts for generations afterwards. Russia is still built almost entirely out of bullshit and corruption, and it's been a noncommunist police state for decades. China is still basically communist, despite numerous concessions to reality, and so it's renowned for the absolute lack of fucks its people give about each other.
>>16373740Yeah, hence why I said 3rd world AND the social sciences. Predominantly China and India.
>>16373743reddit spacing
>>16373720When science became a profession rather than something rich people do in their spare time. If you need to get results to get paid then morality and good principles can be discarded as soon as they become inconvenient
>>16373743Great job pulling 3 paragraphs of shit right out of your ass and making me read part of it.
>>16373720There's a lot of garbage biology in the bottom half, but I see plenty of strong and interesting Chinese papers at least in biochemistry/molecular biology.
>>16373731>It's not90% of published peer reviewed papers are fraudulent and made upAlmost as if having peers pat themselves on the back in a massive corruption circlejerk wasnt a good idea
>>16373731>only + 3rd worldthis isn't true. there were two nobel prizes in medicine at top 3-5 institutions in the US caught committing repeating scientific fraud just the last year.scientific fraud have been widespread for awhile. it's just now we have the tool to start catching a (small) portion of them.
>>16373771This is the real issue. The physical sciences are cruel and unforgiving, and the rate at which novel ideas can be discovered is fundamentally incompatible with the jewish work structure of weekly deadlines and having to pay off goyberg's monthly rent.
>>16373720Bureaucracies like Academia but also government attract Machiavellian who corrupt the system to satisfy their immediate needs of wealth and status.
>>16373720Well at least they gave us CRISPRCan't fake that shit
>>16373720>china
>>16374380Yup. People don't realize that data corruption happens here in huge amounts as well. I worked for a small nutra/pharmaceutical company some years ago and we'd send shit to Cameroon for trials. When data didn't come back with the desired outcome they would make calls and tell them to "run it again." Then, magically, the results would become more favorable in almost all cases.One difference is that in West people don't just corrupt certain data points they've also become masters at using statistics to manipulate people and lie. It's not just limited to fields of science either but all mediums of business that have statistical reporting.There's a book titled "How to Lie With Statistics," by Darrell Huff.Here's a free copy from Internet Archive. It's only like 70 pages but a good read. It even made Bill Gates' "recommended books." That figures, right? https://archive.org/details/HowToLieWithStatistics_201608Here's the description:>Have you ever wondered how the people who publish statistics so often turn up numbers that support their position? Sometimes, the numbers really do support the person or group publishing them, but statistics aren’t as objective as we might like to believe.>In How to Lie With Statistics, author Darrell Huff explains how people with agendas manipulate figures and how they’re presented to create statistics that support their views. You’ll learn how to spot shady sampling and graphs that are technically accurate but visually misleading. You’ll also learn why suspiciously precise numbers really are suspicious. Finally, you’ll learn about a quick questionnaire you can use to evaluate the legitimacy of any statistic you’re presented with.I doubt anyone is nerdy enough to care, but still worth sharing.
>>16374389He knows it's not true but he will continue to post that because poisoning the well is his goal, which is exactly what you should expect from people who think fraud is ok as long as it's done by people they like.
>>16373720Chinese don’t have morals. Study Taoism
>>16374389>>16375201What fraud? Can you provide a link?
>>16373720>HowResearch was tied to public funding instead of private sponsors.The solution is to bring back the patron system
>>16373720There is way too much science being done to even scrutinize it all any more, let alone verifyIt's a ripe environment for scams because as long as you produce something kinda plausible-looking there's a decently high probability it will just go through because it would take too many resources to deboonk you
>>16374380It's turtles all the way down. If they expose fraud, they themselves are fraudsters and their fraud is at risk of getting exposed.
>>16373720its always funny when muttmericans blame china for fake data when they’ve been faking entire scientific fields since the 50s
But muh meritocracy...
>>16375113why are we taking people from the bottom third of that and flooding them into the countries on the top third?
>>16378070because they ask for less money to do the same work and our enlightened and progressive society rejects racism and nationalism and embraces capitalism
Academia is an atheist bourgeois social construct, so it was never about truth and sincerity. Bourgeois don't believe in truth, they said there's not truth to justify their bourgeois revolutions.
>>16378040Yeah, meritocracy, not honestocracy.
>>16375113>Mexico
>>16373720Academic circles need a massive anti-fraud anti-plagarism campaign.>>16373743This.
>>16373720Thanks capitalism
>>16375194People have been swallowed up by leftist mentality.Begin a 16 year process to restore civilization.
yeah and this shit is why nobody reads or trusts chink papersit's reached the point I unironically start raising eyebrows if there's even 1 Chinese coauthor
>>16373743>communism absolutely disintegrates social cohesion and morality Yeah, China totally has less social cohesion than the west. You dumbfuck, you know nothing about China. Reddit is a CIA hotspot and you’re gobbling up their cum
>>16373720Scicence has ALWAYS been full of frauds, misinformation, and people fudging their data. It only seems to have increased because the number of people with science degrees have increased as have the number of publications. The sheer mass of stuff being published has overburdened the peer review system, meaning fuck ups are almost never detected unless they are blatant. In the 19th century or early 20th cen. you only had a handful of journals for any given field while today there are hundreds, not to mention bot generated articles. Scientists have found that letting this continue is much better for their careers. Publish or perish culture leads to cut throat competition, so poor review processes are great because they allow you to reduce the quality of your work or put out flimsy papers to pad out your resume. Corporations and politicians often want a specific scientific opinion so they have a vested interest in fudging data or hiring scientists specifically tasked to fudge data. >Fields with practical applications tend to be much more resistantSee the Macchiarini scandal. That guy was a star surgeon at University College London, one of Europe's most prestigious colleges part of England's version of the Ivy League. Despite his theories being absolute junk, nobody lifted a finger untill a dozen patients wound up dying in his human experiments.
Somehow related:I chose to be an engineer (aerospace) instead of a scientist (planned on either astronomy, astrophysics or physics) because of how much of a detached, paper mill bullshit modern science has become. No place to be in if one wants to actually do something meaningful.Even the few scientists that I know that are actually doing something worthwhile also have to make bullshit papers that are just rehashes of their previous ones so that they can fulfill the quota and get money for actual research.
>>16379228Scientists would be happy to work in a place they feel is secure, their presence is respected, and the funding (as far as their reasonable imagination can reach) is limitless. The current paper mill set up would be the exact opposite of this ideal environment. If people are losing British pilots and scientists (no matter how small the number) to the PRC, there is a reason for it. Entrenched interests insisting on some form of plantation minority enlightened rule vs. majority niggers, which is a throwback to 18the century way of doing things, is why we are losing our edge and the society becomes more and more degenerate until actual productive members leave for greener pastures.This can happen in any groups and institutions, not just academia.
>>16373720The Han are animals, but data itself is nothing but manipulation.
>>16379216Peer review is not science anymore than spellchecking is journalism.
>>16373743aye
>>16375113what is this graph depicting?
>>16373720Results are all that matter. It's gotten so bad that they've had to 100% tariff chinese cars because they can't compete and sanction the export of Chinese chips which led them to develop new chip technology that uses light.
Fix this
>>16384107Atheists are perfectly capable of being their own godhead, you slave morality faggot
>>16373720>another anti china postSo brave, so unique
>>16373767indians and chinese have huge brains compared to their bodies.extremely cerebral cultures.leave your science to them
>>16373720This is America's way of coping with how quickly Chinese scientific research is growing, already surpassing America. We have a problem with people believing in science in general, so being concerned with academic inflation in China seems very poltical.
>>16373720scientists don't have consciences
>>16373720Is science Chinese? Was it invented by China? No.Is there a benefit to ignoring it?Yes.So then you don't have to respect it.
>>16384323is something only of merit if it's brave and unique?
>>16374609he's antisemitic, but he's right
