>only one country
Which one?

>>16384511
China. The US gov invested a little bit a decade ago but gave up way too early after one VC scam went bust

>>16384492
>Doubles every 5 years
So in 20 years we will have replaced all energy in all forms with solar power. Neat.

>>16384492
thank you lucifer

>>16384581
Because the US gov incentives structures were broken. Instead of giving a goal and asking companies to meet that goal, they choose companies to meet that goal. Which led to failures of various companies.

Put up a prize. Whoever reaches 1-5 gets the prize.

>>16384581
>gave up way too early after one VC scam went bust
the US political will can easily change on a whim after every election. it's hard to invest anything long term unless it gives immediate benefits. one scam is enough to make solar uninvestable. on the other hand, china and russia usually have the same president for 10 years and they also have cabinet members that might stay there for 20 years.
if instead the US have term limit of 1 but a term last 10 years, it might've been different.

>>16384492
It's not really a scientific problem, it's a public policy one. Financial forecasts would give better predictions because what's being measured is consumer demand for solar.

However, it's fair to say that scientists get things wrong all the time and we should expect more from them every day. It's just that this comes from the anti-science crowd whose real motivations stem from personal beliefs and politics.

>>16386115
China is completely different from Russia, which is purely a kleptocracy run by various oligarchs and government spooks who engage in drug/gun/human trafficking alongside the foreign ethnic mafias they hire. Sad state of affairs.

>>16386420
>kleptocracy run by various oligarchs and government spooks who engage in drug/gun/human trafficking alongside the foreign ethnic mafias they hire
How is this any different from China? Or any different from the US, for that matter?

>>16386427
Why the fuck do all of the incels on this board always simp for Russia and Putin?

>>16386441
Married with kids but how is agreeing that Russia is
>a kleptocracy run by various oligarchs and government spooks who engage in drug/gun/human trafficking alongside the foreign ethnic mafias they hire
simping for Putin? Are you a Chinese incel?

>>16386427
China certainly has plenty of corruption, and the US it's bread, circuses, and morally bankrupt managerial "elite", but Russia is entirely a criminal operation larping as a country, with very little pretence to any sense of professionalism, whether it be bureaucratic, military, academic, or anything. The common man is almost entirely impotent in the face of this criminal operation.

America's managerial class of vindictive bucket-crab trash undeserving of their positions who're sinking the US are still forced to don this thin veneer of caring about social justice (while imposing collective guilt for nothing on an entire demographic), and the working class (while replacing them with taxpayer subsidized foreign scab labour, then scolding them for complaining).
Meanwhile if the FSB determines you're too loud of an actual dissident voice, they will simply coordinate your assassination and outsource the killing to Chechens, Azeris, whatever.

I already mentioned 'professionalism'. China despite it's problems is quite potent in the aggregate, and the US remains fairly competent. Russia is neither of these due to (perhaps intentional, pre-engineered) gross mismanagement ---> misallocation of resources & wild brain drain.

>>16386441
Disaffected westerners conceive of Russia and Putin as dissidents against the world order, when it really couldn't be any further from the truth.
It's ultimately just another occupation government, the difference is that the US is competent enough to fabricate sophisticated propaganda. People feel guilt all on their own and police their own thoughts, walk around on eggshells. 'Better' social engineering. Russian mafia state on the other hand must resort to physical intimidation/outright murder.

>>16386459
Funnily enough even the CCP isn't particularly fond of the Russian 'government' nowadays. I guess that's what happens when you start wars you were never willing to actually fight, let alone win.

Anyways to get back somewhat on topic, does anyone here happen to be plugged into what's going on with Chinese battery technology development?

>>16386463
You seem to think you're some sort of Raymond Reddington character with a secret network of CCTV observing how money and power flows at the highest level of three different world powers. How can you nonschizophrenically substantiate the difference you've hallucinated?

>>16386479
Thank you for confirming that you're a Chinese incel.

>>16386494
No idea what you're talking about. This is just a normal observation.

Russia is indisputably a mafia state with significant brain drain and plummeting birth rates due to preserve incentive structures built into every single facet of society, with all the chronic corruption that follows.
You don't need to be some kind of CIA analyst to understand demographic trends, you read a bar on a graph.
Nor do you need to be a think tank researcher to have a gander at how their government officials, corporate executives, and military generals behave.

Stop projecting your own lack of understanding and even lack of desire to understand in the first place onto me. Russia is not the grandiose Soviet caricature you've had built up in your mind.
Nothing I've said is remotely controversial, unless you're retarded and don't have eyes or ears. I'm super interested to see exactly how and why you disagree that Russia is a shithole run by incompetent thieves to the detriment of the natives.
Surely I'm the schizophrenic lunatic, and Russia is actually a beaming ray of intellectual progress, military professionalism, moral, robust government bureaucracy.

>>16386497
?

>>16386536
>shithole run by incompetent thieves to the detriment of the natives
Jesus fucking christ. Can you try paying attention and reading for once? I AGREE with this description of Russia. What I disagree with is that there are any sufficiently populated countries right now that can't also be described by this exact language. To pretend you have access to any sort of unfiltered information that would allow you to do that is the height of grandiose delusion.

>>16386570
The US and the West continues to lead the world in social, economic, and scientific progress. The stock market is at an all-time high, AI is progressing rapidly, and the US now has not just 1 government funded space agency (NASA), but at least half-a-dozen private companies with the kind of technological capacities that were only possessed by the US and Soviet governments just a few decades ago. Now compare this to Russia, with a space program that is a shadow of the USSR's. Most of the biggest tech companies are also based in the US, and new ones are being founded all the time. Take Nvidia and OpenAI, for example.

We also continue to lead the world in the arts, with most of the most popular movies, TV shows and artists coming from America. In fact we are making a lot of gains in these respects. E.g. a lot of the demand for "Western" pop culture that was met by European countries is now supplied by America, so that now the top fashion designers are not from Paris, France or Milan, Italy, but rather New York and LA (which was not the case even a few decades ago). American science, technology, art, and pop culture are all dominant at a global level, and continue to evolve on a constant basis. Russia science, technology, art, and pop culture are completely stagnant and not even relevant to people living in neighboring countries like Ukraine, Kazakhstan, or Mongolia.

>>16386598
>The US and the West continues to lead the world in social, economic, and scientific progress.
Are you ESL? How does your definition and measurement of leading the world in "social" or "economic" or "scientific" "progress" have anything to do with whether the US is a shithole run by incompetent thieves to the detriment of the natives?
>The stock market is at an all-time high
You must be some sort of AI bot because (absent reform) the US stock market is literally a measurement of thieves stealing from the government to the detriment of the natives.

How do you expect anyone to take you seriously when this your argument?

>>16386570
My bad, guess I skipped over
>substantiate the difference you've hallucinated?
I never pretended to have access to any insider information. Sure, one can say that every government is marred by crooks and subversives.
But obviously, it's to differing intents, extents, and outcomes.

To reiterate, the difference can be substantiated by broad intention and overall sophistication.
In the aggregate, I believe it'd be fair to say that above the petty inter-corporate & party corruption, the CCP predominantly serves the interests of China very broadly speaking, even if it is merely a consequence of personal ambition. There is plenty of corruption to be found. Tofu dreg buildings, contaminated food scandals, extortion, so on and so forth. Despite the propaganda, I think a lot of people take for granted just how many live in the woefully undeveloped rural regions of inner China. However ultimately, as long as there is a 'net positive' move forwards for China, all is well.

Whereas in Russia, there is no such thought given to the broad well-being of the state and it's people *in the first place*, because that isn't the goal to begin with, or even *a* goal whatsoever, regardless of political party. The goal is personal enrichment and empowerment of the ruling caste first and foremost, even if to the detriment of everyone else. Anyone who meaningfully challenges this status quo, however minor, is simply liquidated by the FSB.
How many disillusioned American journalists have their assassinations extremely blatantly arranged in advance by the FBI, who then outsource their legwork to a local Mexican cartel?
Nothing else besides wealth extraction is relevant. It isn't important to fund academics and their institutions, it isn't important to fund the military to the extent that soldiers are actually assigned functioning gear instead of being armed by their families, it isnt even important to properly fight the war you started and condemned tens of thousands to die in

>>16386640
I probably should've mentioned that I'm neither Chinese, nor a China shill. You'd have to force me at gunpoint to live there. From what I've heard, even Hong Kong is a shell of it's former self due to rampant CCP nepotism throughout 'private' industry. Many financial professionals and other white-collar workers have left for Malaysia, Indonesia, even the states and UK.

>>16386640
>differing intents, extents, and outcomes
Yes, but
>can be substantiated by broad intention
How do you know the intent?
>and overall sophistication
This is orthogonal to abusing natives. The level of sophistication doesn't change the magnitude of abuse. You could even make the case that the more sophisticated a system is, the more natives (and nonnatives) it can abuse without being violently rejected.
>the CCP predominantly serves the interests of China very broadly speaking
Serving the interest of China isn't the same as serving the interest of the Chinese natives. It's serving the interest of the people that extract value from Chinese natives.
More accurate to say that the CCP predominantly serves the interests of the CCP, and that the other interests served are almost exclusively those of other governments, not of other Chinese natives.

>>16386640
And as for the US, it's really only chugging along due to it's sophisticated private sector. The government is full of empty suits that happily use taxpayer money to subsidize ethno-engineering the country with foreign scab labour by housing, feeding, and employing them at the expense of citizens, while individuals profit from it on the ground. Socialize the losses and privatize the gains, then browbeat and gaslight you when you complain about rampant criminality and alienation.
I guess the goal is deracination of the population to the furthest extent, from everything. Race, religion, family. Introduce violence and chaos in the lives of civilians, then manufacture consent for increasingly stealing their ever dwindling "freedoms" (temporary privileges).
Although what motivates your average DC bureaucrat freak along the way here is likely to be mostly just servile resentment, not much more to it than that.

>>16386640
>in Russia, there is no such thought given to the broad well-being of the state
How do you know this?
>meaningfully challenges this status quo, however minor, is simply liquidated
How is this different in China?

>>16386677
>manufacture consent for increasingly stealing their ever dwindling "freedoms" (temporary privileges)
And China already stole all of those temporary privileges. How is 0% better than 8% (or whatever we have left)?
>deracination of the population to the furthest extent, from everything
Maybe I don't see the comparative value in being deracinated into a Han machine vs. being deracinated into a stew of racial goblins. In both cases, the 0.01% elites keep their family lineage while deracinating the 99.99% other native people.

>How do you know the intent?
A simple heuristic is "the purpose of a system is what it does."
The CCP and Russian Duma are populated by egotistical, sometimes psychopathic 'strivers', yet the results of their respective management is almost polar opposite.
It could be said that the purpose of the CCP is to enrich and empower the party members, while the rest of the country is dragged along and sees increasing standards of living as a result of the personal ambitions chased by the 'elite'.
The purpose of the Duma is [the same], while standards of living stagnate or outright decline as a result of [the same as above.]

>>16386676
>This is orthogonal to abusing natives. The level of sophistication doesn't change the magnitude of abuse.
I'm not saying it's here nor there, merely that sophistication between the three differs. Russia's managers and their institutions are unsophisticated, so they must resort to cruder punishments like outright murder.
America's sophistication is abused, for one example, by government-funded NGOs to deploy millions of ethno-nepotistic foreigners upon hapless civilians.
"...the more natives (and nonnatives) it can abuse without being violently rejected."

>More accurate to say that the CCP predominantly serves the interests of the CCP, and that the other interests served are almost exclusively those of other governments, not of other Chinese natives.
I don't really disagree here, which is why I added that it could be just a consequence of personal ambition (and it is).
However, those CCP officials who extract value from Chinese natives are undoubtedly returning far more, even if unintentionally, than Russian officials do to their own.

>>16386684
>How do you know this?
By observing how the government has plundered the MoD, and staffed it along the way. Tuvan gangsters such as Shoigu aren't qualified to work as beat cops, let alone top-ranking military generals.
Bureaucrats who seek to uphold the well-being of their state don't promote imbeciles who deploy thousands to *possibly* die in a municipal siege (such is the nature of war), but then almost certainly condemn them by withholding supplies that they require to... actually besiege and capture the city.
One small example in a vast unending ocean of crippling Russian incompetency, except this one directly resulted in who knows how many dead, rather than merely inconveniencing the public through death by a thousand bureaucratic cuts.

>And China already stole all of those temporary privileges. How is 0% better than 8% (or whatever we have left)?
Well, I'm not Chinese or a resident of China, so it doesn't affect me how the CCP jerks the chain of it's slaves one way or another.
On the other hand, it does physically affect me when the value of my personal citizenship is diluted by foreigners who're offered streamlined pathways to citizenship & jobs programs whose positions aren't advertised to the public, where wages are publicly subsidized, and it also affects me when they're housed next to me on my dime, and it affects me still when an inner-city cosmopolitan dog decides for me that I'm not responsible enough to own XYZ firearm(s) because it's a "weapon of war", yet they arbitrarily draw the line at other rifles. Specific Kalashnikov models aren't weapons of war, or is it because you don't want to upset the sacred minority chugs who predominantly own them?

>>16386705
>increasing standards of living
>standards of living stagnate or outright decline
I get what you're saying but this all depends on what propaganda filter you use. Even within the US, from the same data (which itself is already state proganda), we get two opposite but perfectly convincing meta analyses of the data and depending on which of those subpropaganda filters you use, you will either think we're going to hell or doing great. How could I possibly believe the accuracy of IMF or other global corporate data about other countries' standards of living when I know that even my own country's take on its own standard of living is garbage in garbage out?
>deploy millions of ethno-nepotistic foreigners upon hapless civilians
Easy to argue that this is worse than crude political murders because it spreads the pain and corruption to normal apolitical natives. But I suspect you'd agree.

>>16384492
All math is bullshit based on a fallacy of the unit. Holism is the way

>>16386727
>Tuvan gangsters such as Shoigu
Don't know him but would you argue he is somehow less qualified than Rachel Levine?
>value of my personal citizenship is diluted by foreigners
I don't disagree but I'd argue that Russia and China are equally protectionist in terms of citizenry.

>>16386699
>Maybe I don't see the comparative value in being deracinated into a Han machine vs. being deracinated into a stew of racial goblins. In both cases, the 0.01% elites keep their family lineage while deracinating the 99.99% other native people.
That stew of racial goblins will manifest itself as simmering sectarian gang violence in your everyday life. See Brazil, or even better, South Africa. Sorry Cracker, it's time for you to pay for systemic racism and slavery... with your life!
This is obviously not remotely comparable to living amongst your own racial group.

Thing is, there *is* meaningful upwards mobility in China. It isn't that the majority of the population is condemned by law to exist as subhuman, second-class citizens. Is it a difficult upwards battle? Undoubtedly, but what isn't? Plenty of middle and upper class folk in China, many of whom came from nothing, literally. Look at what Shenzhen looked like 60 years ago, there's nothing. The majority of it's inhabitants are descendants of impoverished farmers who lived near or migrated to the ongoing development.
I'd sure as shit take that over dealing with aggressive foreign ethno-nepotists. Good luck with upwards mobility and upholding a decent standard of living when affirmative action on
meth'd-up steroids gatekeeps universities, let alone jobs, housing...

>>16386746
>Don't know him but would you argue he is somehow less qualified than Rachel Levine?
Imo it's a moot point, because he would never be assigned any wartime position that oversaw actual engagement with the enemy.
Let say the US was dragged into a fairly isolated conflict with Iran, and we have a repeat of the GWOT, except with further modernized equipment.
Unlike Shoigu, Levine would not be given any authority over combat units, whatsoever. "She" is there for peacetime political pandering. Not leadership, not competence, nor valour, or even just physical strength. Purely a political commissar, and not the kind that marches into battle, or is ever placed anywhere remotely near one.
If you can put your bets on one thing, put it on the bloodthirstiness of the American spook state and their political vanguard in the Republican Party. If you give them an Iran war, they're not going to let a fucking tranny run the show, or any show.

>I don't disagree but I'd argue that Russia and China are equally protectionist in terms of citizenry.
China takes citizenship far more seriously than Russia, which has taken the opportunity to bus around who knows how many Central Asians and (geographical) Caucasians.
Tbh, I'm not sure how much of it is just more government incompetence (inefficient, uncaring processing of peoples), or purposeful ethno-engineering.

>>16384672
it's literally just sand, copper, steel, aluminium and plastic, if you think about it

>>16386754
>This is obviously not remotely comparable to living amongst your own racial group.
Ethnic violence is easier to see but no worse to experience at an individual level than being born to an unfavorable family or being subbullied by your own ethinc group due to any number of dysgenic social or physical traits. You could argue that the latter somehow benefits the overall genetics of the ethnic group but you could also argue that the former somehow benefits the overall genetics of the multiethnic swamp. In either case it presumes that people should subvert themselves to an imaginary group that they aren't really part of.

>>16386738
>Easy to argue that this is worse than crude political murders because it spreads the pain and corruption to normal apolitical natives. But I suspect you'd agree.
We do agree here.

As for your other point, I agree that one should avoid deriving opinions on quality of life from intentionally cooked books. I guess this is the sort of thing you can only figure out for yourself by travelling and seeing it with your own eyes. I'd say Americans generally have a superior standard of living compared to Russians and Chinese, the latter largely due to their rural poverty and otherwise stable but undeveloped rural settlements.

>>16384492
Scientists stay conservative

I dont think any scientist is an optimist you can’t predict the future even with enough Iq

>>16386766
For blood thrist, we use Eric Prince and Russia uses Wagner Someone. But more to your general point, do you really think Biden makes a better battlefield commander in chief than Putin?

>>16386777
>figure out for yourself by travelling and seeing it with your own eyes
I want to agree with this because I can't think of a better way to pierce through different media shields. But I live in NYC and I've never been mugged, shot, seen anyone get mugged or shot, and the only public urination I've ever seen was 20 years ago. So is NYC going to hell? Maybe. But I'd never know from my own eyes and experiences. Same thing with Europe. The most ghetto experience I've had was probably Barcelona late 00s. When I was walking around in Paris a couple months ago, everything I saw was normal. No migrant tent cities. Again, I'm not saying there aren't any, just that I didn't see any with my own eyes.

>>16386774
I would prefer being bullied and ostracized amongst my own than murdered by [insert ethnicity here]. It's easy to take functioning civilization for granted. My parents saw firsthand what even minor ethno-religious diversity brought, and it wasn't holding hands, singing Kumbaya around the campfire and happily eating "ethnic food", it was genocide campaigns, mass rapes, etc.

Sure, I'll take schoolyard bullying and returning home to a lower-middle class family, alienated from the hyper-wealthy of my hypothetical society over dodging genocidal militiamen whenever I step outside.
Besides, all it takes is one person to change the fortunes of a family. Yeah, maybe you won't be accepted by the already established rich, boohoo. But your children will attend their schools, and your children's children, and suddenly there's no difference.

>>16386782
Prigozhin was assassinated lol, yet another Russian (albeit Jewish) oligarch swept under the rug.
He wouldn't have chimped out at the govt if Shoigu didn't play politics and withhold supplies from the mercenaries. Reap what you sow, now the Ukrainians are invading Kursk and blowing up all their bridges. Will he face consequences? Of course not.

As for Biden, moot point desu. Everyone knew throughout the entire presidency that he's mentally unsound. Did George Bush meaningfully preside over the invasion of Iraq? No, it was his government spook advisers and their colleagues in the military. Soldiers fight the wars, presidents just sign all the relevant forms put in front of them.
This is exactly why citizen surveillance, overseas drone programs, 'blacksite' concentration camps, etc increased in scope during the Obama presidency. Presidents get a mere 4 years. Unelected bureaucrats throughout intelligence services and the State Department get decades, if not a lifetime. Who has more leverage, the intelligence officers running a dozen overseas operations for a decade, or the paedo who just got elected?

>>16386796
I've never been to NYC, but I always assumed that the reports were overblown and over-exaggerated. Also worth noting that the city has been taking steps to house many of the illegals, idk to what extent that's dealt with the 'tent cities'.
I imagine it's sort of like Chicago in the sense that people conceive of it as a failed-state warzone of gang violence and overpriced housing, whereas in reality it's a (relatively) small part of the city producing the majority of criminality, and you're quite safe in any other part.

>>16386803
>prefer being bullied and ostracized [...] than murdered
Well if you put it that way lol. I get the social cohesion argument but is there really any truth to it? We didn't start forcibly turning states into transracial sewers until very recently and there's never been any historical shortage of civil war or depraved intraracial gang violence and murder. The entire history of China is warlords abusing their own people, Mao killed what 40-80 million of his own ethnic ingroup, Tiananmen massacre, etc.

>>16384492
The simple reality is that science is dogmatic as dogmatic as religion
A scientist has no less pride or attachment to his theories as a religious person has to their scripture

>>16386832
>I get the social cohesion argument but is there really any truth to it? We didn't start forcibly turning states into transracial sewers until very recently and there's never been any historical shortage of civil war or depraved intraracial gang violence and murder.
I'd say there's absolutely truth to it. Ethno-religious diversity has always led to sectarian tensions, if not outright war. There isn't any actual upside to it, outside of receiving foreign delegations, merchants, but that's not really 'diversity', it's diplomacy and commerce.

As for China, I can't say much about their medieval history, but from what I do know, a significant chunk of their history was spent ruled by foreign invading minorities, whether it was Manchus, Mongols, whatever. So I can't say for sure to what extent their contemporary warlord states were a legacy of balkanization when the rule of these foreign groups crumbled.
It's worth noting that these are organized conflicts against another state, where otherwise, life goes on business as usual for the commoners. War is one thing, endemic gang violence in your every day, normal-civilian-going-to-work life is a different circumstance.

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>>16386832
>Mao killed what 40-80 million of his own ethnic ingroup, Tiananmen massacre, etc.
I don't even know if thats true. If you look at history, the (((experts))) seem to claim that any culture or socioeconomic system outside of the framework of Judaeo-globalism has supposedly been responsible for untold millions upon millions of deaths.

Nazis - Millions upon millions dead.

Soviet Union - Millions upon millions dead.

Maoist China - Millions upon millions dead.

North Korea - Millions upon millions dead

Colonial British Empire (prior to Zionist takeover) -
Millions upon millions dead

Khmer Rouge in Cambodia - Millions upon millions dead (Pol Pot supposedly target journalists, professors, and beaurecrats, which sound pretty redpilled desu senpai)

Ho Chi Minh's Vietnam - Millions upon millions dead

I honestly can't believe any of that shit at this point. I'm sure people died, I'm sure their was political repression, I'm sure there was forced labor, etc., I don't doubt any of that. But how sure can I be that Stalin killed 100k vs. 1 million vs 30 million vs 50 million? All of those numbers sound like bullshit. The (((experts))) don't even agree on their own (((estimates))) which are mostly based on intuition, anecdotal evidence, and muh feels. What are the odds that every single socioeconomic system inevitably result in MILLIONS UPON MILLIONS of dead people, except for the specific socioeconomic system that just happens to be used by Israel and the US?

>>16386859
>There isn't any actual upside to [Ethno-religious diversity]
If it's piped in like diarrhea, I can't imagine anything but downside for whoever has to live it in. If it's curated and controlled so that it doesn't overwhelm any local culture or infrastructure, I can't imagine any downside. Upside? I don't know. Singapore may be the best argument for upside but having gone out of my way to ride busses there and talk with random natives who speak English I'm not convinced that most of them feel like they share in the upside, even if by all global IMF type metrics they've been catapulted out of poverty and live a peak first world lifestyle.

>>16386874
I share your general and specific skepticism about all this data.

>>16386705
Putins policies have been very succesful in increasing the standard of living for Russians. His government would never be as stable as it is otherwise.

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>reality...............IS BAYESIAN IN NATURE?!???

>>16386938
>everything that fails is bayesian
If you can't tell who the sucker is, it's you.

>>16384492
Shitbrained extrapolation, just like modern monetray theory, is doomed to fail. It has been a scam from the start. Truth prevails, even if no one talks about it.
God damn some of those modern academics arent better than witchcraft in their predictive power. Anybody that hasnt lost his senses is well advised to use them to debunk all those pseudoscientist "scientists".

>>16384492
A lieral 5 year old, drawing some random lines could have made better predictions. Modern "academic" economics is a cult of shekel paid jews. Anybody that knows at least a little bit of the profession knows how much of a scam it is

>>16386874
This is the final redpill. Not just holocaust "denial" (although "minimization" would be a more accurate term), but outright denial of all historical and political boogeyman. Liberal democracy is not some super special political ideology that is unique in it's ability to support a civilization. This is just globohomo propaganda to convince you that the only viable political system is liberal democracy.

>>16384672
Not exactly, nuclear power and wind had exponential growth in its early years too and got a chunk of the market but beyond a certain point their disadvantages start to show and they kind of just grow at a similar rate to everything else

>>16384492
>governments handing out free money
>people take free money
why do you think this is complex? there's no revolution going on with solar

>>16386463
>Russia is entirely a criminal operation larping as a country
this is all governments, taxation is objectively theft

>>16384492
>people still but the solar energy meme
God, I love making money off retards.

>>16384492
Kurzweil actually predicted this decades ago. Hats off to him.

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>>16387307
Nuclear has never, and will never, enjoyed exponential growth. Wind continues to approximate an exponential curve.

>>16386965
This is true

>>16384492
Really? Nobody mentions big oil's influence on renewables? Damn you are all behind.

>>16384492
The more I see of green energy garbage the more I realise it's nothing but a government scam

>>16387307
>beyond a certain point their disadvantages start to show
Nuclear's only flaw is that it was subject to a Cold War propaganda campaign.

>>16386420
>>16386427
Obviously oligarchs can be different.

>>16386640
>How many disillusioned American journalists have their assassinations extremely blatantly arranged in advance by the FBI
Change that to CIA and you will find a surprisingly high figure

>>16384492
read austrian economics.

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>>16386420
2024 China as a political system is closer to 1950s USA than 2024 USA
2024 Russia as a political system is closer to 1920s China than 2024 USA
2024 Europe as a political system is closer to 1980s Russia than 1980s USA
2024 USA as a political system is closer to 2010s Russia than 1950s USA

>>16384581
They are faking it. There a huge fields full of fake "solar panels" that dont do anything. Just so they can say look how enviromental we are

>>16384492
I keep telling you on grid losers. I'm off grid. Every year I read about local electric rates going up. Every year solar panels get cheaper. Today I can get a 100AH solar battery for about $170 with bluetooth connection. Three years ago the same battery with no bluetooth was $320!


>>16384672
very house should be off grid, solar, small wind turbine, huge battery bank. The reason they won't tell you this is it eliminates tons of jobs and publicly traded mega corps. All the power plants would need to shut down or only used for industry. No reason a normal US home can't cover it's roof in panels and make all it's own power. It makes people independent from the government, harder to control, and less profitable to corporations. So instead they push stupid solar arrays on industrial scales that destroy good land when the roof tops remain unused. It's criminal.
My cost to expand or replace my energy infrastructure is going down fast while people paying the power bill only see increases. I remember people saying once solar reached $1 per watt it would be a game changer. I'm paying like $0.60 per watt off Amazon buying a few at a time. When I upgrade to the 48v system next year i'll bulk order from China for even less than that.

>>16391390
>very house should be off grid, solar, small wind turbine, huge battery bank.
This. Ideally they will also be energy efficient designs that don't require a fuck ton of energy to heat and cool.

>>16391390
>>16391415
You're both retarded. It wouldn't eliminate all power plant jobs, because industry needs energy and industry does not just need energy from oil but also bioproducts like chemicals and plastics. And factories need to run at night and cannot rely on batteries. What you need is a lot of nuclear. It keeps prices down when it is not windy or sunny and prevents your industrial base from going tits up. Well, it depends on your political philosophy I guess. If you're a neoliberal or libertarian you probably don't care about your industrial base and are fine with getting everything from a foreign country.

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>>16389522
>can't summarize something in his own words
You're retarded.

>>16387761
As a matter of fact, all energy sources have enjoyed the same eponential growth, if you just take the correct cutoff point. Solar has obvious downsides (needs batteries, doesn't work at night, doesn't work equally well in every part of the earth, doesn't work with bikes, cars, any larger vehicles (unlike for example nuclear submarines)) so it's obviously going to be replaced at some point.

>>16386874
Capitalists started all of those wars. Britain started WW2, and was the cause of all of these millions of deaths together with the other allies.

>>16386463
>Russian mafia state on the other hand must resort to physical intimidation/outright murder.

Spoiler: US gov does this too.

>>16386598
Counterpoint:
Russia has Maxh 25 hypersonics and nuclear jet engines.
The US does not.
The US is run by effeminate social engineers. Most AI is lobotomized shit.

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>>16384492
solar punk fucking sucks
we already had solar panels
they are called PLANTS
they are free, produce no waste and remove carbon from the atmosphere
imagine... our technologicaly progress halted by 20 years because a bunch of retarded faggots were scared that our nuclear power plants would blow up like tiny nukes
and now they want to live like plants
fucking die die die die die (pic rel)

>>16384492
>subsidized by the gov
Moores law has been off for years now retard

>>16386479
Seethe hohol

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>>16391492
Wait until you learn about agrivoltaics. You could generate something like 10 times the electricity used in the US by covering beet farms in the US with solar panels and the beets yield better in the shade.

>>16386570
>What I disagree with is that there are any sufficiently populated countries right now that can't also be described by this exact language
Describing a place like Denmark or Japan in the same language would be such a mischaracterization of these countries that any contrast with Russia is rendered impossible. Language is not your political playground and you're basically a tranny by proxy when you engage in these disingenuous arguments.

>>16391665
Do you know what'd be much better than solar panels shading those plants?
TREES
YOU FUCKING RETARD

Besides, you are wasting the solar panels by reducing their fucking efficiency.

>>16386598
>The US and the West continues to lead the world in social
The social progress of importing third worlders, neglecting their own young citizens and giving them nothing, gay rights, destroyed family structure, hypergamy, widespread pornography use, alcohol and weed use, and the privilege of living in a studio shack for $2000 a month.
>economic
Such as kleptocrats enriching themselves? Aided by and benefiting from the imports inflating their real estate prices, income, and reducing their labor costs.
>and scientific progress.
China leads the world in most scientific progress.
>The stock market is at an all-time high
The majority of young people do not participate in the stock market and do not have 401ks. It is a scam that enriches people with money by allowing them to embrace inflation because their assets appreciate with it.
>AI is progressing rapidly,
To further reduce labor costs and maximize profits

>>16386598
> and the US now has not just 1 government funded space agency (NASA), but at least half-a-dozen private companies with the kind of technological capacities that were only possessed by the US and Soviet governments just a few decades ago.
They can all go to hell. Look at the job salaries for random postings on SpaceX. They pay nothingburger prices for engineers. The other companies are awarded lucrative contracts to make weapons of war.
>Now compare this to Russia, with a space program that is a shadow of the USSR's.
I wouldn't want to do any space stuff if I was them either. Didn't the US sabotage their last lunar launch a few years back?
>Most of the biggest tech companies are also based in the US, and new ones are being founded all the time. Take Nvidia and OpenAI, for example.
It requires capital to found a new tech company so the virtue of them being founded does not negate the claim of the US being a kleptocracy.
>We also continue to lead the world in the arts, with most of the most popular movies, TV shows and artists coming from America.
Needs to have gay and diverse characters and promotes an agenda, even good shows were shoehorned to fit the
>In fact we are making a lot of gains in these respects. E.g. a lot of the demand for "Western" pop culture that was met by European countries is now supplied by America
Not only supplied but ruined by.
>American science, technology, art, and pop culture are all dominant at a global level, and continue to evolve on a constant basis.
Yet almost only a minority of wealthy people benefit while everyone else pays the price.

>>16391390
>Today I can get a 100AH solar battery for about $170 with bluetooth connection
Post link nigger

>>16384581
Solar expansion in the southwest/west US is going on at a steady pace and has been for over 10 years now. It's going to triple by 2050.

>>16392280
Lol no. Solar panels outperform trees by every single metric. Photosynthetic efficiency is garbage. Like 1/200th of an average solar panel.

>>16391377
That would cost just as much as installing real solar panels.

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>produce millions of tons of photovoltaics
>they last about 30 years
what will we do about all those panels by then?

>>16392987
Recycle them. You might be surprised by this, but we originally extracted those materials from sand. Extracting the materials to build a solar panel from a solar panel is a lot cheaper than extracting the materials to build a solar panel from sand. The reason should be obvious.

>>16392977
>ignores hydrology, biodiversity, biomass, carbon cycles, air quality, cost and previously mentioned EROI/efficiency reduction, etc.
You are thinking like a logger.
Trees are worth far more than just the land they occupy and the wood they produce when felled.
They are part of our ecosystem. Solar panels are not.
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=IDgDWbQtlKI

>>16392977
A large but obscure reason solar panels and microreactors in particular are being shilled so hard is because of the MICs influence.
You see, the biggest advantage they have over older powerplants is that they can't be efficiently bombed. Our military overlords are salivating over this fact.
If you spend a little time googling you can find tons of articles on the military origin of much of the research efforts.

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>>16384492
kek the /twg/ market is really shit now huh

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>>16392987
We are pretty efficient at recycling photovoltaics.

>>16393903
>They are part of our ecosystem
Not for long if you try to use them for power.

>>16395295
Either we invest into regenerative agriculture and try to improve the condition of our ecosystems, or our top soils simply erode away, at which point the countries of the Earth will slowly turn into deserts while hundreds of millions live in poverty or starve.
We cannot sacrifice fertile land for solar panels.

>>16395295
Watch the documentary, btw..

>>16395430
So put them above beet farms, retard. You return to monkey types are very nearly the most retarded people on the planet.
>>16391665

>>16386874
>>16386885
>>16387239
>>16391432
>>>/x/pol/

>>16395599
so we only gonna eat beets?

>>16395818
As many beets as you eat now, retard. Those fields already exist.

>>16395599
How many beet farms do you think they are, retard?
Trees will always do a better job than solar panels at enhancing the ecosystem, providing shade and improving hydrology.
Plus, solar panels are less efficient when installed on agricultural spaces.

>>16386121
>scientists
>wrong
>all the time
I fucking knew it

>>16397586
>How many beet farms do you think they are, retard?
Sugar beet harvested area was forecast at 1.088 million acres, down 38,700 acres, or 3.4%, from 1.127 million acres in 2023.

>Trees will always do a better job than solar panels at enhancing the ecosystem
Beet farms are not an ecosystem. You cannot improve a beet farm with trees.

>Plus, solar panels are less efficient when installed on agricultural spaces.
Nonsense.

>>16397590
>Beet farms are not an ecosystem. You cannot improve a beet farm with trees.
Which is why our fucking soils are eroding...
>Nonsense.
Installation costs rise, labour costs rise, crop yields decrease for all but the most marginal shade crops, etc.
On Wikipedia it says that these systems need a 300% subsidy to become cost-effective for investors in Germany.
It says that they aren't viable anywhere but in China and in Japan.
It also says that a simulation of agrivoltaic geenhouses reduced crop output by 64% and panel productivity by 84%.
Stop acting like this is not just a gambit for receiving tax money for virtue signalling.
This shit STINKS. It's a shitty inefficient niche solution with tons of issues that isn't going to change shit, unless you stuff the assholes of anyone who employs it with mountains of paper.

>science

ECONOMICS IS NOT A SCIENCE YOU MORON IT IS A HUMANITIES DISCIPLINE

>>16397686
You've picked a random assortment of complaints and none of them are very good. Most of them can be dismissed by saying "now compare that to biofuels" but there's a few specific things I'll address.

>Which is why our fucking soils are eroding...
Irrelevant. Farms aren't going disappear just because you don't like them.

>It also says that a simulation of agrivoltaic geenhouses reduced crop output by 64% and panel productivity by 84%.
Read the decade old study that's pulled from. They picked inappropriate crops and put the panels on a steel roof. Beets and certain other crops yield better when shaded, which is why I used beets as a specific example. Solar panels perform worse with heat. If you look at any study where the panels are installed in a field instead of on steel panels on top of a greenhouse then you will see an increase in the performance of the panel.

You should stop pretending you know what you're talking about.

>>16397851
How would I know what study that refers to?
Half the statements on Wikipedia don't even have sources to back them up.
But sure, a totally serious technology... Which needs a 300% tax funded subsidy to be cost-effective.
You're a clown.

>>16397894
>How would I know what study that refers to?
It's called a citation. Jesus, anon. You know this is /sci/, right?

>But sure, a totally serious technology... Which needs a 300% tax funded subsidy to be cost-effective.
Now do biofuels.

>You're a clown.
Said the guy who wants to get rid of farms and doesn't know how to check a citation.