With all the talk of "the competency crisis" floating around on the Internet I got curious: what causes a society to become incapable of maintaining itself and repeating things it has done in the past?Are the alarmists just scaremomgering?
>system creates safety measures>this prevents catastrophies to happen>society feels safe for a while>midwits midwitting take it for granted>don't aware of anything>think safety measures are useless and a waste of money since catastrophies do not happen
>>16464064competency crisis is mostly caused by unqualified people in goverment institutions altering school system to suit arbitrary useless metrics like>diversity>equality>no child left behindand a bit by greedy capitalism system where a lot of corporations prefer short term gains over long term sustainability. for example they will rather fire older skilled worker and hire 2 newbies for same cost. also a lot of corporations have completely useless human resources departments, where they dont understand the concept of junior job and think that experts with 10 years experience in the field will work for minimum wage.TLDR schools dont teach anymore, corporations dont train employees anymore and suddenly you have incompetence pandemics
>>16464064
>>16464064Unlikely in the US which is a shining city on the hill. Other places will suffer brain drain, not the US
>>16464064nothing really its another fake y2k scare.even the most complicated systems are easy to figure out nowadays.
>>16464226Meanwhile tens of millions of the third world bottom dwellers are flooding in but since they didn't come in through legal channels, you pretend that they don't exist. For every "smart" software developer from India churning out Java Spring code, there are dozens of Central Americans with no skills showing up with the expectation of being given resources and a say in how things are run.
>>16464064we don't "need" that knowledge anymorelike how you don't need a smith nowadaysyou don't need people that know how to work steel at a "master" level... until you do
>>16464064competence crisis is artificially created by people in powerit happens because they want to extract every last drop of value out of everything at the cost of lonevity of the systemthey do it in preparation for the final push of creating eternal slave race out of 99% of the population
>>16464064We are fucked because we're going to run out of cheap energy in the next few decades.we are so fucked. climate change ain't nothing compared to the energy crisis which normies are completely are unaware of and the media never talks about.we don't have enough fossil energy left to build a nuclear reactor for every couple of cities in the world. fusion is a pipedream scam.
>>16464095>crudely quantitative priapic characterlmao he admits it. this whole things a cope for ytboiz losing to bbc
>>16464280some day a real rain will come and wash all the garbage off the streets.
>>16464064It's going to be all ran by AI unironcally, I'm already seeing this in my work where normies are using AI to create policy documents used to interact with other organisations.
>>16464064E.g., Boeing
>>16464083It's why Rule #1 in safety is "don't get comfortable". Most accidents occur because you take shit for granted and get too comfortable working around shit that isn't safe.
>>16464280Unskilled people existing dont ake skilled people disappear. And smart people only get to use their skills if theres unskilled people to do the backbreaking physical labor that still has to be done. Those manual laborers have an intellect well suited to their jobs anyway, a match made in heaven.
>>16465390>Unskilled people existing dont ake skilled people disappear.Sure? I hear research and developmenrt funding is being redirected to save new countrymen. The funding for the highly educated is evaporating and in some countries such as France jobs are being defunded and redirected.The problem is real and it is here, now.
>>16465399>I hear research and developmenrt funding is being redirected to save new countrymeJust doesnt happen. Day laborers just add labor and take very little from the system as they are paid low wages. Without them the smart people would have to mop the floors.Perhaps you are confusing hispanics with american blacks, hispanics are notorious hard workers
>>16465399>and in some countries such as Francei was talking about the US, a shining city on the hill where all the smart people migrate to.
>>16464064>"the competency crisis"Look to present day Africa... Zimbabwe, South Africa, etc. Skilled competent Whites left, incompetent Blacks are unable to keep the basics of a modern civilization running.
>>16465466>teaching unionadd it to the list
>>16464064Overcomplexity.Nature is simple humans are simple.Adding all this complexity requires an abundance of knowledge that isn't normal for people to aquire.Semiconductor photo lithography is so complex and hard make the fab machines because. You have to understand opticsElectromagnetism Integrated circuits Chemistry and material science PhysicsMathematicsAnd economics to create a price efficiency to scale production on the supply side and maintain consumer demand on the price side(cheap products)
>>16465538I may add also that once someone dies that has this knowledge the complexity could be so great that people just can't figure out how it works
>>16464064My generation, as a whole, is NOT ready to enter to workforce. The average genZ-er has the mindset, and corresponding competence, of an eleven year old.II hope to God that AI comes in time to save us, because we are NOT what the previous two generations were, much less the ones that built the industrial world. The people coming into adulthood today are not ready for self-determination, they need parents to look after them, and AI will hopefully be able to fill that role once their actual parents can not.Also, society is mostly brown now.
>>16465545Ai won't save you.Good luck.
>>16465542>I may add also that once someone dies that has this knowledge the complexity could be so great that people just can't figure out how it worksPretty typical when things dont get properly documented but also not a real problem as things get reinvented all the time. The typical research that gets lost is things like optimized production parameters like temperatures, chemical mix ratios and minor shit that can be researched in a few months time. Often these things just dont get documented for job security.Or they are overblown. Consider how allegedly NASA forgot how to make rockets, it doesnt matter as the knowledge still exists, obviously many countries can make rockets that can go to space and now private companies make them as well, the "loss of knowledge" was fixed by just hiring a team of engineers to develop things again.
>>16465545>The people coming into adulthood today are not ready for self-determination, they need parents to look after themOk Irving
Everyone keeps blaming DEI when the real problem is the decline in the rigor of high school and college education due to grad inflation among other things.
>>16465983>due to grad inflationand grade inflation is because giving failing grades to negroes is verboten
>>16464064>outsource complex jobs like manufacturing to other countries>hire immigrants to become doctors, engineers, lawyers, etc. Because they are dirt cheap and you don’t have to train them>meanwhile your own institutions and infrastructure rot, and your native populace turns to the service industryIt’s way overblown by chud fear mongering (“I’m incompetent = everyone is”) but there is a pearl of truth there.
>>16464064>Are the alarmists just scaremomgering?No. I wish they were but skill failure is everywhere to be seen, people insist on not staying abreast of their fields. They did it this way for 30 years and they shall continue so, just don't dare to tell them there are better ways. The ever growing complexities mean normies give up on keeping up to date. So we have a competency crisis that is fuelled by complacency crisis.Hot take: why do you think Elon is forging ahead while the industries he paved over had som much more "experts"?
niggers
>>16466445reddit
>>16465983>the decline in the rigor of high school and college education due to grad inflation among other things.STEM is far more rigorous than it has ever been. A third year undergraduate student of physics today is at the level of a PhD student from the 1920s.
>>16464064>Are the alarmists just scaremomgering?Yes. "Competency Crisis" isn't real and never was real. People are unironically more competent, knowledgeable and better educated than ever thanks to the internet and the global interconnectivity of the economy and trade. It's just retards unable to compete and keep up with the rapid progress of knowledge that screech.
>Are the alarmists just scaremomgering?Book a plane ticket to Johannesburg and let me know what you think.
>>16465279Worked out pretty well in Zimbabwe when they kicked out all their white farmers and subsequently starved to death
>>16465404>take very little from the systemConsidering that the housing and wages of these scab labourers is taxpayer subsidized, that's simply untrue.
>>16465983>everyone keeps blaming DEI when the real problem is DEI
>>16466291In my experience, women of all races are the ones that complain about classes being too hard. Blacks just don't turn in assignments.>>16466533I admit I know nothing about the education level in the 20s, but an undergrad education is less rigorous than it was in the 50s and 60s. I do know that grad students in the 20s would have been much more self-directed than they are today.>>16467109DEI has nothing to do with high schools and affirmative action has existed for years without the drop in competency we've seen recently.The real issue is that America is addicted to immigration. Since we can ship in talent from other countries, we believe it's not necessary to train our own. Picrel talked about this: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ZIYwryWSwm4
>>16466516why did you feel adressed?answer: you knew its true and it offended you.only possible answer here and a nice proof to what I posted.
But for a fleeting moment in time....we created a lot of value for shareholders.Time. To die.
>>16467106>Considering that the housing and wages of these scab labourers is taxpayer subsidized,If its not paid with taxes it has to paid with wages, its all the same. Any worker requires material support to be able to work, the same would be true for a literal slave. Theres a material cost in keeping a human being alive.People need food and medical care if they are meant to work. And if you want their kids to work too, you have to pay for that too.I'm talking from a "big system" perspective, day laborers simple take very little from the rest of the economy, just the bare bones required for their material needs which is physically required if they are going to supply labor>but they take more tax than they paySame point, if they dont get paid enough in wages, they get paid with subsidies, they get paid by the rest of the economy. The labor they supply is far more valuable than what they take, which is the same for all wage labor in general.
>>16467117>affirmative action has existed for years without the drop in competency we've seen recently.it took a while for the problems affirmative action causes to take hold and become obvious.
>>16464064It's what happens when you totally land on the moon several times and you shoot these cool boring movies and then suddenly you forget everything and you never get there again.
>>16464064When wealth started flowing in to Spain, people stopped working, went for consumption, and created a demand that French and German craftsmen supplied to. Local competence went out of the window. One historian claimed that is the reason why Spain, 500 years later, still has problems.
>>16465390>Unskilled people existing dont ake skilled people disappear.Unskilled people existing do commit homicides. Criminals are historically those with the most reason to illegally migrate.
>>16464064Outsourcing skilled manufacturing. Demanding services for things the average person should be capable of doing. Forcing schools to teach irrelevant knowledge to borderline retards.>wearing structural gear to a brush fire
>>16471539>Unskilled people existing do commit homicides.Crime is done by criminals, not by unskilled laborers. Start by jailing black people if you want a big reduction in murder rates and leave unskilled workers for the next phase but that alone will solve 70% of the problem
>>16464064>Are the alarmists just scaremomgering?No, the problem is very real:https://igwiki.lyci.de/wiki/Stagnation
competence crisis is just niggers
>>16471691>Crime is done by criminals, not by unskilled laborersDo you really not see how unskilled people, that may not speak the language or understand local culture, could be at high risk of turning to criminality due to those circumstances? Especially in a society that idolizes wealth and envy.
>>16472610>could be at high risk of turning to criminality due to those circumstances?I see the risk but you know who actually commit crime? Criminals, and crime is already illegal so just jail criminals, not people "at risk" of becoming criminals.And if you just want to prevent all crime in advance, just jail everyone. Literally send everyone to jail, lock it and too the key out so no one can open the cell.Then there wont be any crime.
>>16465279priapism = fucking everything you see, not "having le big penis" (this is an idea not compatible with reality, by the way)
>>16473020>Criminals, and crime is already illegal so just jail criminalsIllegally crossing the border is a crime.
>>16464089>no child left behindthis is a big one12 years of school and the 17-year old coming out of it can barely read.Do you know how smart someone should be after 12 years of real schooling? They should be able to run a business but instead they're only supposed to do pathetic menial labor for $8/hrYou can see this in schools. Older professors are hardasses and you actually have to learn things in their classes. Younger professors just let everything slide and grade as generously as possible to compensate for their inability to teach.
>>16474163>compensate for their inability to teachit is not that younger teachers cannot teach, in fact i would argue they have access to tools older generations didnt have like stealing animations from youtube or textbooks from anna archive. teaching about probability of electron being there or there is easier when you have it in spinning animation showing all probabilities, instead of rigid textbook with zero images.the issue is that if young teacher will fail kids in his class, the parents will complain to the principal that the teacher is bad, instead of beating their kids to give them motivation to learn.older teachers already have credentials in their CVs so they no longer have to give a fuck. young teacher with blank CV cannot afford to go against the system, he needs to polish the door handles to avoid starvation.
>>16473207priapism isn't fucking everything you see, it's having a non-stop erection
>>16470903OP made no mention of politics or race, you liberal niggerfaggot.
>>16465983Future historians will regard racial integration as one of the primary driving factors of the West's pending societal collapse. We tried integrating lower races and treating them like anyone else, they failed. We tried giving them special attention while keeping the standards high, they failed. So we gave up and just lowered the standards for everyone until it was down to a level where they no longer failed.
>>16475257I think it's an experiment made by aliens. They found Earth and are debating on how contacting us would go."Ayyyy lmao why don't we make the human contact the bottom feeder niggers and try to help them and we'll see a reflection of our own outcome in their interaction"In a hundred years the Voyager probe will fly past a huge red sign facing outwards that say "don't contact, space niggers beyond this point "
>>16464064You can think of computers.The first users had to tinker with it to have them bend to their will and eventually built tools to make the process easier and more reproducible. Eventually these processes became the norm and now most people are so used to comfortable and overengineered UI/UX that they actually cant use a computer anymore.Although the comparison with IT is flawed since this field pays extremely well and millions flock to study it, but in other fields that are at the other end of the CS brain drain, you have boomers with exceptionally rare and critical knowledge dying with no heir.
>>16474150>Illegally crossing the border is a crime.So then legalize crossing the border and there wont be any more "crossing the border crime"
>>16474150Crossing the border and becoming an american citizen used to be as easy as just showing up.Just show up and register, now you are a citizen.Tons of people hated it and everyone wanted the laws to be changed, initially by the original angloamericans but then the immigrant themselves that wanted to be the last to be let in.Yet, it was still legal until the laws were changed so all you have to do to stop illegal immigration is to change the laws.If you want to make a case that immigrants have a greater propensity to be criminals, that is something you can say without mixing it up with the legality of immigration. Black-americans are completely legal and have been more time in the americas than most europeans, yet they are a criminal subhuman race that commits 10 times more crime than a recent ukranian fresh off the boat.All im saying is no one cares about your dumb rhetoric, you are coming off as a coward and a faggot for mincing words like that and hiding under the technicalities of immigration, as if you were a cop or a lawyer.
>>16475257>We tried integrating lower races and treating them like anyone else, they failed. We tried giving them special attention while keeping the standards high, they failed.Whos we? The media has fanned social grievances since mass media was a thing. Black gangster culture is something that is only learned through media, you dont really see those things in Africa and were non-existent in rural blacks that had no access to media.Not saying blacks are not naturally violent, but that specifically they get brainwashed with a culture that explicitly encourages them to be violent, along with many other trappings like a whole gangster lore manufactured for blacks
>>16475792That's anon's "rhetoric" is literally fact. If you commit a crime, you are by definition a criminal. You're projecting heavily, accusing anon of playing word games while you're playing word games. Also your understanding of history is complete shit. The US has gone through many periods of high immigration and low immigration, with most of pre-1980s 20th century being a low immigration period. High immigration periods had a purpose, and of course not everyone agreed with that purpose. When the purpose was obsolete, immigration would be reduced. Unfortunately in the current age the purpose is to drive down wages and to select the electorate, something those in power have an endless taste for and the latter preventing the incumbent population from being able to stop through democratic means.What's funny is eventually your dedication to self indulgent ideology and luxury beliefs is going to cause the environment around you to decay to the point your life will be endless suffering until its ugly end. And because your ideology demands there to be nowhere to escape from its corrosive effects, you yourself will be unable to escape.
>>16475803>If you commit a crime, you are by definition a criminal.Then just make immigration legal, hence the crime you are referring to gets immediately solved
>>16475803>When the purpose was obsolete, immigration would be reduced.Funny how immigration is the only act that needs to be labeled as illegal to be a crime.No one would say theres such a thing as legal murder, or legal theft, or legal rape.But with immigration, it need to be explicitly called "illegal immigration". Because on its own its clearly not a crime and it isnt, its a misdemeanor, a minor issue that leads to a fine or deportation and never considered a crime in the legal system.You dont want immigration because of reasons that have nothing to do with the legalities of the immigration process. By the same token, you oppose legal immigration because you are simply against immigration
>>16475792>just make murder legal, then you'll have less crime
>>16464064Rapid reduction in complexity.Collapse.
>>16464083>system creates safety measures>without harsh negative selection, lower castes proliferate>previous innovations are so overwhelmingly beneficial, complex society carries on with momentum.>midwits overwhelm institutions, incorperate actively dysgenic practices into society (welfare, women's suffrage, etc), upper castes penalized to the gain of the lowest.>groundbreaking innovations no longer made, established technology falls into disrepair as society lacks people smart enough to maintain it.>society undergoes rapid reduction in complexity. Collapse.Communism and other leftwing ideologies are a result of dysgenic breeding practices.
>>16464089>unqualified people in goverment institutions altering school system>He doesn't consider that government's ought not even be involved in education.
>>16464089>greedy capitalism system where a lot of corporations prefer short term gains over long term sustainabilityEncouraged by government meddling.E.g banks, 200 years ago there was a robust department monitoring the saftey of a bank's investments. Today such departments have atrophied, the excuse is "Well the government mandates particular targets which keep our operations safe. So why bother checking things ourselves?".Regulations reduce competition. Without competition, companies get sloppy because there's no need not to be.
>>16465466genetic based problem. Technology & culture are downstream of genetics in the long term.
>>16465538>It's that all the low hanging fruit has been picked!wrong
>>16465542>the complexity could be so great that people just can't figure out how it worksThat holds true if the successors are dumber. The genetic component of intelligence is dropping, so this will happen unless that rate of change is reversed.
>>16464083Reminds me of many many IT departments >Why am I paying you? Everything is working fine.>Why am I paying you, nothing is working right now!
>>16466533>STEM is far more rigorous than it has ever beenYour whole post is so wrong that not even the opposite is true.t. university lecturer
>>16476710The lower classes had always made up the majority of society.
>>16466542Dude, people don't learn to think anymore because of the Internet and especially because of AI. Pupils and students literally let ChatGPT do their homework, sometimes they don't even alter it. There is no thinking process involved anymore and people hardly think anymore. If you had witnessed the following generation do their thing you'd know were fucked.There was also a recent study about "digital natives" showing that despite them growing up with the technology, they don't understand it at all.
>>16476855If anything, it's evidence that nature > nurture.
>>16476865How?
>>16466542>People are unironically more competent, knowledgeable and better educated than ever thanks to the internet and the global interconnectivity Maybe in the upper levels of society with wealthy established older men. On the ground the newer generations of students are getting more and more fucked. Look at the children's slang:>skibidi toilet>rizz>brain rot>BRAIN ROTEvery child in America is forced to sit through twelve years of mandatory education and half of them can barely read after that.Also "unironically" is a funny joke word but don't use it if you're trying to make a case for intelligence
>>16476896If you read "The Shallows" there and "Amusing Ourselves to Death" here then you get a takeaway lesson.The primary driver for intelligence is books. "IQ" is a low level intelligence where it's just grasping patterns, taking things in quickly, like wittiness. There might be ways to train that but people chalk it up to genetics - it doesn't matter. The ability to understand large complex issues is done through literacy.A non-fiction paragraph or chapter can list out any sort of complicated issue in an explanation that's thorough, consistent, and unchanging. Anyone having trouble grasping one part of a concept can revisit the area they're missing. This can happen at any pace, quickly or more slowly pending one's capability.Instructors therefore are really just for helping slower students that can't sort it out independently, and providing encouragement through grades. You can't really teach people, you can only provide tools and motivation for them to teach themselves.Anyway, share of time spent reading took a slight hit with radio, a large hit with television, but there was still a niche for hand-held alone time quiet entertainment. Now phones have cornered that out and the younger generations are totally absentmindedly lost.Even fiction has it's merits. Doctor faggot will say fiction "builds empathy" but it really just enables your ability to retain information consistently. You'll take in new information through dialogue while still holding in the setting's appearance and character's pasts. Fiction is great training-wheels for non-fiction. Even if you think it has no merit otherwise, it imparts slightly different skills.tl;dr literacy = skills. no books = no brains = no skillsread books nigga
>>16476673>>just make murder legal, then you'll have less crimeMurder is a crime regardless of some legal code saying it is. But immigration only becomes illegal because some law says it isThis is why you have to add "illegal" to immigration to explain that its a crime, while you dont have to write something like "illegal murder" to make clear that murder is a crime.Theres nothing criminal about immigration. And the illegal variant isnt a crime, its a misdemeanor.
>>16464064>what causes a society to become incapable of maintaining itself and repeating things it has done in the past?>invent engineering>ship engineering to foreign countries because it's cheaper>local engineering expertise dies because all the factories close and the skilled machinists now have to work in call centres>also technological advances render older knowledge obsolete to the point nobody really knows the steps they took to get where they are today
>>16464064>what causes a society to become incapable of maintaining itself and repeating things it has done in the past?Cultural Marxism destroying Western Men and Western values.
>>16477204What's the point of legal immigration if illegal immigration isn't a crime?
>>16477287Its not a crime, its a misdemeanor, and only because a law was passed to make it so. Unlike acts such as murder, theft or rape which are near universally seen as criminal regardless of some law saying they are soThats why you dont have to write "illegal murder" because its redundant.Illegal immigration is as illegal as illegal rainwater collecting or illegal misgendering.
>>16464064Pushing competent white men out of every important facet of society that matters just *might* have something to do with itThe system would rather collapse than admit this openly, though
>>16467103>Worked out pretty well in Zimbabwe when they kicked out all their white farmers and subsequently starved to deathThat was more cronyism than anything. The Communist terrorists forced out the minority rulers and then gave all their lands to their mates instead of the actual skilled blacks. All the intelligent blacks fled the country because they could see that Mugabe and co weren't ever going to give them any opportunities. At least in Rhodesia people like Ian Smith saw some utility in giving smart blacks some form of education so their skills could be exploited for the whites' benefit, in Zimbabwe there isn't even that hope, if you're not some general's son then you're never gonna make it. Why stick even around? Especially after giving the govenrment the benefit of the doubt for a few years to stabilise itself. Only the politically connected and the retards stayed.
>>16476713education has ALWAYS been gatekept hardcore, preventing plebs from climbing the social ladder and keeping them eternally poor and powerless right where they belong: the wageslave pit.While i can see private schools existing (and they indeed provide better service in utterly broken education systems like USA or UK), they are not desireable outcome. Private owned school will just focus on the profit:>as long as you pay A LOT, you will passwhich is obviously wrong and you can see its effect in usa where the schools admit only the rich foreigner students whose parents pay out of their asses for the privilege.i do not believe every single problem can be solved by total deregulation aka anarchy. imagine that amazon or microsoft opened its own universities, but before joining you would have to sign an EULA forbidding you from ever working in any other company. This is the end game of anarchy: back to the slavery. Certain systems NEED regulation to prevent them being focused purely on money gain.
>>16477785Shitty retarded take from a moron. Your government brainwashing center is a modern invention of a duplicitous regime.
>>16475786>Get rid of laws and there will be no crimeHistorically people fleeing prosecution for crimes in their own country are those with the most motive to illegally cross the border.You are contributing to having unskilled people disappearing skilled people.
>>16475792>If you want to make a case that immigrants have a greater propensity to be criminals, that is something you can say without mixing it up with the legality of immigrationYou are the one mixing up the legality of immigration.By your rhetoric, slavery used to be legal, so that's justification for practicing it today.
>>16464089>completely useless human resources departmentsFar from being useless they tend to be actively harmful
>>16477793You are dumb.>>16477785Even universities are like that nowadays; purely economy-driven. I work in an aerospace department and boy, I don't want to fly anytime soon.I also have a little son. Every school in our vicinity, including the elite paid ones, were infiltrated by leftards. Do any of them mention pastime activities, quality management or extracurricular activities? Well some do, but all of them focus 300% on diversity and anti-racism and other new-age anti-Western agitprop.
>>16477403Are you sure? Every country around me, immigration is illegal. Several reasons for that. The government needs to know who is inside of its borders. For taxes, census, mitigating crime like terrorism. In most countries you cannot even take a vacation without a visum.
>>16477888Its also people who are worthless and unwanted in their own countries And people who have such atrocious personalities that they burned all their bridges at home
>>16466468>So we have a competency crisis that is fuelled by complacency crisis.this. The sheer amount of experts resting on their laurels &or dragging their feet when it comes to any kind of innovation is staggering. You'd think people would have learned from the missed opportunities of major conglomerates who gave up on early access to phone technology, polaroids, personal computing, etc.
>>16465983We lowered standards to accommodate DEI because obviously it must be racism to blame for some races doing worse than others in academic pursuits. But nobody ever complains about racism when some races do better than whites in academia, then they just get lumped in with white people.your average black or Mexican doctor got accepted into school with significantly lower scores than their white or Asian counterparts in order to fulfill diversity quotas. This applies to everything. No surprise when results drop across the board after dropping standards to make sure everyone could pass, because failing teenagers or young adults for being literally illiterate is racially and culturally insensitive.
>>16477403Misdemeanors are crimes no matter how much you try to redefine things. Not sure why you even bother any more as everyone has become wise to that particular trick. The shot your entire wad during the pandemic era and now you no longer have your favorite toy to play with any more. But continue to insist that reality isn't reality. This is how Trump got elected and why Republicans control more of the government at all levels than any other time in the past generation. Keep at it. Maybe you can turn the entire west into one party conservative states by keeping at what is now failing you over and over again. Or you could just accept reality that immigration crime is a crime and no amount of word play makes immigration criminals not criminals. Personally I hope you keep acting more and more retarded as it is destroying your tiny grasp on power you once had.
>>16464064I wonder if this is one of those fermi paradox things, when a society gets more and more technologically advance, fewer and fewer people are able to understand the tech and the whole society becomes more and more fragile as a result. And if anything were to come along to upset the delicate nature of the advanced society, eg an invasion or a pandemic, then the whole house of cards comes crashing down.
>>16477888>Get rid of laws and there will be no crimeNo, a crime is a crime regardless of a law saying it is. Nearly everyone recognizes that murder is a crime>>16477888>Historically people fleeing prosecution for crimes in their own country are those with the most motive to illegally cross the border.Not true and irrelevant if that was the case, as crime is already illegal, and i mean actual crime not misdemeanor>>16477890>By your rhetoric, slavery used to be legal, so that's justification for practicing it today.Immigration IS legal today. Today. You are the one with cognitive dissonance to believe that immigration is magically legal or a crime at the same time.How do you say that immigration is wholesome and ok if a person just signs a bunch of forms and pays a lawyer and files a ton of paperwork but if someone doesnt sign some document and does the same thing, then the same action becomes ebil?Such a thing doesnt exist with any other alleged crime, not even with misdemeanor. Theres no such thing as legal murder, or legal theft or legal jaywalkling. Such acts are considered bad to one degree or another, and no paperwork makes them legal, except specifically in the case of immigration?
>>16478041>The government needs to know who is inside of its borders.I have been to many countries as a tourist and the govenment knew where i was because i had to show them my passport at the airport. I was not an immigrant but i could have simply decided to overstay, like many illegal immigrants do, and the government would have still know that i was in the country. Being an illegal immigrant doesnt mean the governmemt doesnt know where you are, so your point is wrong. You imagine illegal immigrants just sneak in in secret through forests and rubber boats, yet even those are still received in government funded asylum centers.>>16478041>For taxes,Everyone pays VAT and illegal immigrants cant work>>16478041>mitigating crime like terrorism.Sure, but then the crime is terrorism and not immigration>>16478041>In most countries you cannot even take a vacation without a visum.Plenty of illegal immigrants enter countries as tourists, then simply dont go back
>>16478207>Misdemeanors are crimesMisdmeanors are not crime and its you trying to redefine things. Theres a reason these things dont get called crimes.>Trump, Reagan bla blaTake your meds
>>16478252>You are the one with cognitive dissonance to believe that immigration is magically legal or a crime at the same time.If I sell drugs without a license it is a crime. With a license, I'm a doctor. You are clearly being dishonest and projecting your problems.You contradict yourself constantly. >Not true and irrelevant if that was the caseSee? You know it's true and you're literally saying the truth doesn't matter if it disagrees with you. Thank you for demonstrating to everyone how dishonest your side of the debate is.
>>16478252>How do you say that immigration is wholesome and ok if a person just signs a bunch of forms and pays a lawyer and files a ton of paperwork but if someone doesnt sign some document and does the same thing, then the same action becomes ebil?How can you say practicing medicine is wholesome if someone just gets a degree and gets certified and becomes a crime if they don't?How can you say performing reference and background checks to hire someone is sensible but doing so to allow them to cross the border isn't?You are subhuman.,
>>16478335>If I sell drugs without a license it is a crime. With a license, I'm a doctor.Doctors sell drugs for medical uses in the proper dosages to people that need them, Drug dealers sell you random poison, they are not the same thing.A better analogy would be a doctor that lost his license selling you medicine. That would be illegal, but not a crime.You cant even explain what the alleged badness of illegal immigration is because if you did, you would also be explaining why legal immigration is bad.Explain then what is so super ebil about illegal immigration that magically doesnt apply to legal immigration. That would be a feat of mental gymnastics.The funniest part of this is that i have not even advocated for immigration.
>>16478339>if someone just gets a degree and gets certified and becomes a crime if they don't?The certification proves you are competent in what you do. Theres no similar requirements for legal immigration.You can demonstrate to the state what a "good person" you are and they would still not let you in. While an actual criminal can pay some slut $20.000 to get married and now hes a citizen too. Your analogies with professional qualifications simply do not match the realities of immigration
>>16478343>You cant even explain what the alleged badness of illegal immigration is because if you did, you would also be explaining why legal immigration is bad.Dishonesty. I have stated it and you engage in obvious doublethink about it. People without criminal histories are willing to go through the proper legal channels to enter. Their first act is one of respect for our laws and customs.People with criminal histories must enter illegally to avoid them, and even if they are a person without a criminal background, their first act is one of breaking a law meant to stop those who do. >a doctor selling medicine without a license isn't a crimeReally? So if I lose my drivers license for a DUI and continue driving, that's not a crime to you?You are demonstrating, to everyone reading, that pro-immigration people are dishonest and pro-crime.
>>16478345>Theres no similar requirements for legal immigration.The immigration process is meant to demonstrate you aren't a criminal in your home country and that you will be able to integrate in your new country. You can criticize the process as being imperfect and having loopholes, but you don't seem to make any good point for having no filter when allowing people in.
>>16478352>People without criminal histories are willing to go through the proper legal channels to enter.This still doesnt explain what is criminal about illegal immigration. Surely anything can be illegal if a law is passed to make it illegal, but you are still not explaining whats bad about it.>>16478352>People with criminal histories must enter illegally to avoid themJust because criminals have to immigrate illegally doesnt mean that illegal immigrants are criminals.Still waiting for you to explain whats the crime actually commited by an illegal immigrant.And i dont mean "alleged crimes commited in the past" or "alleged crime that might be commited later"But the actual crime of illegal immigration. Where is it? What is it about?
>>16478356>The immigration process is meant to demonstrate you aren't a criminal in your home countryNot true, that gets done by checking your criminal background in your home country, this is also requested to apply for a tourist visa. This doesnt lead to any kind of path towards immigration, its just something that is done for tourists when they apply for a visa. The bare bones. You can demonstrate anything you want and still not be allowed as an immigrant.For instance you can just marry a local and that gives you automatic legal rights to immigrate. What does that have to do with not being a criminal?
>>16478356>You can criticize the process as being imperfect and having loopholes, but you don't seem to make any good point for having no filter when allowing people in.I never said there must be no filter about letting people in. You are brainlet that thinks im even "defending" immigration.All im saying that if immigration is not a crime, then its not a crime. Thats all it is.It is not a crime to move somewhere else. It is not a crime to walk or to fly somewhere else. It is a crime to commit crimes and a person at high risk of committing crimes is still not a criminal unless the actual crimes get commited.If you wanted to reduce the risk of crime, just check an potential immigrant criminal background and interview him, make him do a few psych tests, check his educational achievements and that ought to do it. Whole process would take a few weeks, most of it waiting for documents like police reports. Thats whats done to grant tourist visas.But instead you grant citizenship to complete randos who just marry a local or that buy a property. There is simply no path for an alleged "good person" to simply immigrate to a country. All paths are closed, people get fucking green cards with a fucking lottery!
>>16464064>what causes a society to become incapable of maintaining itself and repeating things it has done in the past?Not willing to admit exactly what they need and commit to it. If you need more competent teachers and doctors train them from childhood instead of this round about methodology.>Are the alarmists just scaremomgering?Yes, always remember that "Competency Crisis" is just another way of saying there isn't enough people willing to do ---insert here--- labor for cheap or private enterprise isn't interested in spending there own money to train workers specific for their needs.
>>16478352>People without criminal histories are willing to go through the proper legal channels to enter.What proportion of undocumented immigrants are people who overstayed their visas?
>>16478454>If you need more competent teachers and doctors train them from childhood instead of this round about methodology.You can train adults, you just need the proper incentives and management of the resulting workforce.The thing that bothers me is that we clearly need a lot more people with medical training who can apply well-documented processes to manage preventative and basic therapeutic care, but we insist on millions of people being employed as office drones in positions that should have been automated away 2 decades ago. We let an executive mandate to dictate their own profits and business practices, no matter how unrealistic, get in the way of a proper and sustainable distribution of labor.
>>16478360>This still doesnt explain what is criminal about illegal immigration.It's trespassing, essentially. You're saying there's no difference between someone knocking on your door and asking to come in, versus climbing in through an open window. You honestly seem like a terrible person, so I hope you take your own advice and immigrate to another website. >Just because criminals have to immigrate illegally doesnt mean that illegal immigrants are criminals.Right, but those people are the ones we're concerned about. The ones that aren't concerned about abiding by the law. The ones that would be disproportionately skewed to be illegal immigrants rather than legal ones.
>>16478402You are a terrible person and so full of yourself that you are a drag to everyone around you.You have decided you can arbitrarily decide what is and isn't a crime, and that laws don't matter in that.You ignore trespassing is a crime for good reason. You ignore that flying or walking somewhere is a crime depending on if you go to restricted space. >There is simply no path for an alleged "good person" to simply immigrate to a country. All paths are closed, people get fucking green cards with a fucking lottery!Your doublespeak is astounding. Marriage is a not entirely unreasonable way of vetting people. The lottery is after they've demonstrated they're good people. You say there is no path and then lay out paths. You are a moron of the lowest caliber.
>>16478475>It's trespassing, essentially.No it isnt, the land outside of your house isnt your private property. The country isnt your homeNow try to make an argument that doesnt involve some stretched analogy. Talk about the actual issue at hand>>16478481>You have decided you can arbitrarily decide what is and isn't a crime,Pure projection on your part. Its you calling immigration a crime when the legislature has called it a misdemeanor, yet you accuse me of being "arbitrary" when its you changing the meaning of words.>>16478481>Marriage is a not entirely unreasonable way of vetting people. The lottery is after they've demonstrated they're good people.There are no paths to citizenship except pure luck or shit that has nothing to do with being a good person. Marriage? Ha, anyone can pay anyone to marry for a green card. Still waiting on you to show how a good person immigration becomes ebil if the same person living the same life doesnt jump through a bunch of retarded loops like winning some lottery.In the past the path was as easy as just showing up at the border. I bet thats how you or your grandpappy became a citizen, didnt he? Your greasy fatfuck of a grandfather just rolled into ellis island, zero checks and zero fucks given
>>16464280>churning out Java Spring code>smartWhat the fuck am I reading...
>>16466414Zoomers are retarded in jeetland too it's not a location issue. It was the plastic in the water
>>16478605Anon he said "smart", not smart.
>>16478257>govenment knew where i was because i had to show them my passport at the airport. I was not an immigrant but i could have simply decided to overstaySure. To minimize this risk, they check whether you also bought a ticket back. If you didn't, you'd be subject to more thorough searching and questioning. >Being an illegal immigrant doesnt mean the governmemt doesnt know where you are, so your point is wrongI never claimed that. My point can't be wrong because that's literally written into law (that the government must know who's inside).>You imagineNow you're just plain trolling. I talked about a single thing and specifically said that it's ONE reason. I'm fully aware that there are various methods of becoming an illegal immigrant.
>>16478257I don't get what you want to say with the rest of your points btw. They add zero arguments or insight or anything to this discussion.
>>16478557There is no reason to discuss something any further with someone as wretched as you.
>>16478221It doesn't take much to destroy an advanced civilisation. If a major solar flare hit the earth 100 years ago not much would happen, if it would hit today, you can kiss civilisation goodbye.Actually, never mind a solar flare, would an average person even know how the electric infrastructure works in any real detail? There are now so many advanced systems that are so complex that you can't possibly expect people to understand them all beyond a surface level, and when you try to learn about everything, you end up knowing nothing.
>>16465983The decline in rigor is directly related to No Child Left Behind which specifically made it impossible to ever fail those who are now today's DEI beneficiaries. Are you even 18?
>>16477403Your shitty sophistical argument gets debunked by the word invasion.
>>16478178>Or they are overblown. Consider how allegedly NASA forgot how to make rockets, it doesn't matter as the knowledge still exists, obviously many countries can make rockets that can go to space and now private companies make them as well, the "loss of knowledge" was fixed by just hiring a team of engineers to develop things again.Negro doctors are a separate issue. Doctors are customer service product, they don't do real science. That is all done by Phds. Minority doctors have better outcomes with minority patients as people are more likely to follow council of their doctors if they are of the same race. Blacks and asians will rate a white doctor more intelligent and more competent and still not do what he says but they will listen to their race doctors. Also in the heighday science there was more black doctors than there are now. The flexnor report that resulted in the removal of part time schooling in med school being acceptable for accreditation kept both rural whites and inner city blacks out of the profession as most of them paid their way through school working as surgical scrub techs or medical assistant equivalents under local doctors while going to school with half the course load. We are still feeling the fallout in this in that inner cities and farm communities do not have doctors anymore. Only WASP whites and Jews got to stay in the club, they even try to keep both kinds of asians out to hoard the shekels to themselves. You are saving money on healthcare by having black GPs as the blacks will take their cholesterol medication when a black GP tells them too.
>>16478091>this. The sheer amount of experts resting on their laurels &or dragging their feet when it comes to any kind of innovation is staggering. You'd think people would have learned from the missed opportunities of major conglomerates who gave up on early access to phone technology, polaroids, personal computing, etc.Because they don't care. Engineers are no longer in charge of engineering firms. Bean counters and middle management types just care about expanding their personal fiefdoms as large as they can within the structure until they retire. Even stock sharing doesn't incentives them enough to manage long term as the short term reward social status in the power structure of the company and lack of loyalty from companies in general now incentives get what you can now and sleep with the hot interns over retiring with a few extra shares.
>>16479670>Flexnor Report How the flying fuck did a failed psychology major who never did medical school himself was allowed to lead and advise the logistics of medical education resources?It's one thing to advocate for higher standards in medical training/education. It's another to gut entire regions of local doctors and basically stratify the profession itself.No wonder so many Americans have shit health overall. More local doctors might have actually prevented the high obesity rates and regulate opioid usage.
>>16476713There should be standards, otherwise you have christcucks claiming the world is 6000 years old and teaching billy joe to die for israel
>>16474163Former teacher hereThere are a lot of reasons that the education system is failing. But the big ones are>Rampant corruption>Lack of support from parents or lack of parents for that matter>Low expectations >Bad behavior from kids across the board >teachers being heavily restricted on what they can do and end up being delegated as baby sitters/paper pushers
>>16470781Or maybe it's just because they're arab mutts who only know how to plunder
>>16480095>Flexner grew up in an Orthodox Jewish family; however, early on he became a religious agnostic
>>16480148
>>16480114Exact same things happen at universities, although bad behavior is not as rampant as in schools.
>>16476853But only in recent human history have they been allowed to thrive at the expense of higher classes.
>>16464064Unlike the retards here I am a skilled tradesman(welder). I can tell you the reason why its hard to find GOOD tradesman of all kinds. Mexicans destroyed the job market. I can make more money at a warehouse or a factory with better working conditions, pay and benefits. There are ultra high skill jobs that pay well BUT its almost impossible to get one since you have to be extremely skilled and experienced which is impossible since nobody will hire you if you dont have that insane skill and exp already so young tradies are forced to do shit jobs with spics forever, never improving or moving forward in his career while the number of old boomers who pulled up the drawbridge behind them dwindles. Youll always be able to find a spic that can booger weld rebar on a construction site but the number of people who can do FAA certified x ray inspected welds will continue to shrink. The same is true of all trades. The problem is that society would collapse without these people, forcing companies to hire people with no exp and train them would be a good start. All the smart tradies under 50 all work at walmart, in a factory/warehouse or are in university if they havent started their own business to boss around spic slaves with.
>>16464879Peak oil in 2 weeks
>>16464064The root cause is an insufficient level of learning to properly deal with society's ever-changing problems, resulting in the accumulation of problems that demotivates learning in a death spiral of ignorance and carelessness.The cause of this is an insufficient societal value of learning that comes from insufficient ability to inspire learning.What is needed is a massive project to promote love of learning: to promote curiosity and creativity.
>>16465466Best way to fix a school is wholesale replacement of shitty children with good ones
>>16481622To add to this there are actors, organizations and trends that actively demonize education and learning because it is a threat to their power and profit.
>>16475820>>16475820>funny how immigration is the only act that needs to be labeled as illegal to be a crime.>illegal settlements>illegal shelter>illegal parking>illegal tender>illegal trespassing You were saying?
>>16476929propensity to read books and understand them will correlate with complexity. Also, "just follow the unchanging instructions" doesn't scale with difficulty and complexity of the subject. For instance, most people wouldn't just be able to pick up a math undergrad book and just be able to start following the proofs.
>>16476847>Your whole post is so wrong that not even the opposite is true>>STEM is far less rigorous than it has ever beenIf this isn't true then does that not mean that you agree with the anon?
>>16481645There isn't just >thing and>opposite of thing in this world, Anon. There's nuance. And you both lack it.
I'm stuck demoralized.School didn't prepare me for a job, it was expressly for college, and it was not interesting.Maybe I missed out because I left early but it had already wasted my time too long.If trades and manufacturing is undercut by illegals, and college looks like more of the same uncertain grind, what does one do?I don't know anything pertinent to real life, I don't have any profitable passion, and I blame school for wasting my time. Though now I am wasting my time without clear directions and hope. Too fast for the simplegoy production line but too dull to pathfind outside of it.
>>16483056>what does one do?Found your own startup.
>>16464064It means that the productive intelligent minority in this system of managerial feudalism, that we live in, is getting tired and exhausted of breeding billions of niggers and that they are so stressed out, that they are no longer reproducing.The entire world is turning into an IQ shredder, sourcing intelligence and competence from the least intelligent, most miserable human subspecies.If you don't understand what I mean - one bricklayer or programmer should have enough money from the material wealth he produces to basically own a mansion, a small harem, slaves and a car.But instead of that happening, the government, corporations and social groups step in to first tokenize that wealth.They then take it away to redistribute it to those slaves and to the harem, who they also give half the mansion and the car to.This all happens under the guise of morality (which the only purpose of morals is to enforce the status quo of society) and is enforced under threat of violence.Either way, those slaves and the harem remain retards and whores respectively. Only now, they live for free, excluded from the one guy who single-handedly provides for all of them with his work.The dichotomy of the economy:https://youtu.be/RYdmWa-i7Gshttps://twitter.com/i/status/1565416437946224643https://www.tiktok.com/@natasha.badger/video/7066158697243823406
>>16483056Good news for you is that most people don't have a clue until their late 20s. If you are figuring this out right after highschool you are lucky. Don't listen to the previous generations and just prepare yourself with one of the professions that won't be obsolete in next 15 years and you'll be good.
This is a good thingEach day I become more and more hateful of technology and scientists
>>16483056I’m planning on buying rural land in Maine and trying to fuck off from technologyIndustrial society is a sinking ship and I want outb
Why has nobody mentioned stuff like iPad kids and TikTok? Generation alpha is going to be even more lobotomized than gen z, they will know nothing more than instant gratification
>>16486243Wealth is forcibly redisitributed because regardless of how highly you think of yourself, you're more often than not a byproduct of your environment and upbringing, and the society you live that allowed you your current lifestyle is sustained by the less fortunate. You're not self made, you constantly use what others have produced and leverage these services and infrastructure to sustain your lifestyle, to make up for that and to maintain a peaceful and functional society, you have to give back to the community that allowed you to be where you are in the first place.Not all professions are profitable, but everyone needs food on their plate to keep society running.
>>16478734My bad. My emotions got the best of me when I saw India, Java, Spring and smart in the same sentence.
>>16480095corr propa good kittingtonahire diss one, hafta be said
