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This is what garou look like according to /v/

>>92548310
That is a Pooka.
Or a Black Fury Metis with healthy dose of mixed-morphing in her withered crinos form

>>92548310
>noooo, don’t rape me noooo

>>92547794
>Have you ever played a game with roadtrip thematics?
No, not really. I would like to but I haven't found a good premise for a game like that.
>>92548310
Let's be honest, most apocalypse players imagine something like that.

>>92548310
Looks edible enough.
10/10. Would rape and vore

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tfw no Tzimisce gf (x2)

>>92549588
Maybe its just people not reading the old lore but do you think most people like the tzimisce solely by Vicissitude as biomancy? Not even the demon bullshit it is supposed to be but just the ability to customize your retainers, animal servants and PC beyond normal specs.
>>92548346
No, that's just what appearance 5 does to a Metis.

>>92549885
It is very fucking good, and I love the whole concept of Vozhd, turning up to a negotiation with your elephant-sized amalgam of Ghoul Meat has impeccable vibes. That said, I also love Koldunic Sorcery, and any Tzimisce I play always dips into both.

>>92547794
>Have you ever played a game with roadtrip thematics? How was it?
Never, though I'd love to. I did have an idea for a VtM journey across Asia, from India to China/Japan

Too bad I'm too much a faggot to ST

>>92549588
Unpopular opinion
Vicissitude was a mistake
Should've just been higher levels of Protean (5+)
And Protean shouldn't have been clan-exclusive

>>92549588
Haha, imagine if that was her ass instead, haha

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I swear this general gets more retarded every time

>>92550171
No shit.
>>92550066
While I get the sentiment, I think it's the result of the Vicissitude rules being pretty shit and not giving decent guidelines for what people what to do with it.

>>92550066
Careful, Vicissitude being lumped under Protean was basically how 5e does it,and we don't want to imply that 5e did anything right, do we?

>>92550016
That sounds like a pretty neat scene.
>>92550274
V5 tried to address a problem the previous editions had to avoid having to come up with 10 different powers for each niche discipline that barely has enough for 5.
The biggest two examples being Vicissitude and Serpentis. The fact that they were sloppy about solving it doesn't make the problem any different.

Serpentis being literally snake-flavored Protean was clearly a hint Set was really a Gangrel all along

Also See: Tlacique.

How does Cloak (Obfuscate 7) work?
Is it just Soul Mask to show no aura from 2e or does it force the contested roll before the normal Auspex vs Obfuscate contested roll?

>>92549885
>but do you think most people like the tzimisce solely by Vicissitude as biomancy? Not even the demon bullshit it is supposed to be but just the ability to customize your retainers, animal servants and PC beyond normal specs.
I don't let my players play Tzimisce because I can't be bothered dealing with all the nonsense stats. It's hard enough stating Tzimisce and their Szclachta as it is as much as I enjoy doing it. Conceptually they're very cool tho
>>92550066
>Vicissitude was a mistake
No it was not: it's a mistake to let players use it (unless you can trust them but with mine it's like herding cats as it is) since it makes everything fucked, but having NPC Tzim as antagonists(or occasional allies) is very very good because you can be very creative with their designs.
>>92550155
No don't be unwholesome: tzimisce gf is for cuddles (and weird body horror vampire sexo but don't talk about it)

Should I take both Tabula Rasa and Rationalize?

>>92550576
>can't be bothered dealing with all the nonsense stats.
Yeah it's like having a life mage centred around animal companions.
>>92550576
>it's a mistake to let players use it
That's a table problem compounded by the rules being shit.

>Yeah it's like having a life mage centred around animal companions.
I once ran a mage campaign and one of the PC's had a fey artefact that changed every session (it could do it more often in lore but I couldn't be dealing with that mid game)
>>92550633
>That's a table problem compounded by the rules being shit.
I do love my Vitae-Crack Addict players who still think that vampires are "witches" thanks to some Malk ghoul's incoherent ramblings, but they cannot be trusted with Vicissitude

>>92548310
>you may not like it, but this is what prime garoussy looks like

>>92550274
>Careful, Vicissitude being lumped under Protean was basically how 5e does it,and we don't want to imply that 5e did anything right, do we?
V5's sin is that it didn't do enough, it stopped halfway through being a reboot and is damned to this half-sequel existence. Fitting, isn't it.

>>92551015
The problem is that Requiem already exists and does the whole ''Vampire without the metaplot'' better.
>>92550456
Eh, who gives a shit?

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>>92550480
it's just applying obfuscate to your aura alone in case you don't want anyone to read your emotions or see those diablery stains during conversation

seems kinda underpowered for a 7th dot power for me, but then again it's a first and second edition power and these just sucked sometimes

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>>92550480
soul mask is in the same book
soul mask allows you to buy one color to hide your aura with
cloak allows you to turn aura invisible
both fucking suck

>>92548310
I hope it's Garou. If that's Gangrel it couldn't have more than Humanity 2.

>>92549338
Rape AND more? Sounds like you swallow your own cum. That's gay

>>92547794
>Have you ever played a game with roadtrip thematics? How was it?
Not yet, but for a long time I've been wanting to run a MtAw quest focused on a Lictor main character, going around judging and fixing messes of other mages, occasionally breaking into side stories devoted to other cabal members and their stuff.

daily games, including right now if you're fast enough. only world of darkness stuff.

https://discord.gg/u6VGEeBr

Why the fuck did MtAw have to useshitty East Asian terminology so fucking much I fucking hate the word Yandra

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>>92552063
Anyone who wants to play house games (that gold shit) should join we will help you make a sheet

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Newfag to Mage, really interested in the cosmology of the universe and the Spheres in particular to the point where I want to take inspiration from it for my own writing but I have some questions and would appreciate some clarification, or if one of the books spells it out somewhere I can read through that as well.
>Is the Consensus the main force that limits Mages in what they can do, and if so how would that work in a fantasy-style setting?
>I've learned that pretty much everyone is a Sleeper and can become a Mage, so does that mean that a person can awaken without realizing it and simply develop 1-2 skills that just become more refined over time with use instead of study?
>I understand the Mage generally uses Foci depending on their personality to cast magic, but is there any other ways that Mages cast magic beyond this?
I may have more questions in the future but these are my biggest ones atm, just really trying to understand the fundamentals of the system before really drawing inspiration from it.

>>92552072
>Why the fuck did MtAw have to useshitty East Asian terminology so fucking much I fucking hate the word Yandra
Because it sounds fancy.

>>92552072
>East Asian
It’s South/Southeast Asian mostly.
Gnosis is the Greek equivalent of Qi/Chi.

>>92552120
Consensus is how your Mage rationalized their powers with its own internal logic, even if it works against other people's logic. Like one Mage sees magic as the great song of the universe & everything in creation sings, if you change the tempo & the beat you can change reality. Others might see magic as a big physics machine. Others may thing it works on faerietale rules. The more people you can convince to go along with your own philosophy, the easier magic is for you

>>92552120
>As of M20, the only things that limit a mage are his own Excellence (Arete) and Expertise (Sphere progression). Paradox just punishes mages who extend their reach too far, or perform something blatantly magical in front of people. The Consensus determines Paradox, because normal people can also do magic, just unconsciously, and they don't believe you can fly, even though you believe you can.
>There's a flaw called Sleepwalker, which refers to a mage that doesn't believe in magic at all and can only perform simple magic, but the awakening is a profound thing that usually results in a huge magical burst of power. It is VERY obvious. If you want a mage that has a few very specialised skills then you should look at the M20 Sorcerer book instead (Physic Powers specifically).
>Akashics use Do, which is a form of martial arts, to use magic. Basically, if it's a bunch of weird, complicated and nonsensical rituals and equipment and clothing and atmosphere and weather and star movements or chemistry then it counts. As a mage's Arete improves, their reliance on their tools slowly disappears, but an Arete above 5 is rare, meaning most mages will use tools in accordance with their paradigm

>>92552135
It's a sounds like a new age chick in a coffee shop

>>92552137
I would prefer Hermetic & western terminology

>>92552454
Yes, it does.
>>92552481
Maybe the wod lore soured them for me but I can't be bothered to care about the Harry Potter looking assholes.

>>92547794
So I dipped out of WoD around second edition material, lived to see the Time of Judgement stuff and the idea of the timeline ending, found out they kept going in several iterations lately, and people seem very opinionated/upset about the reboots.
Can someone do a quick summary of the current situation? Is there any reason to look into the new stuff or are people who care just adapting the old stuff?

>>92552567
>Can someone do a quick summary of the current situation?
V5 made some major changes to the setting but because of organizational fuck ups the new books are mostly a bunch of nothing burgers.
The optimistic side hopes that the release of VtMB2 will get the ball rolling again.

>>92552857
>VtMB2
kek

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Reminder that Damsel is a whore for white nationalists

>>92552567
They broke the Pyramid because muh patriarchy. Tremere suck hot ass now. Thinbloods on the other hand have blood alchemy powers. There is a gay muslim bash the fash dude. Where other games feel like the default is the Camarilla the new one feels like the default is the Anarchs. Also, you aren't allowed to play or feature a nazi unless they get murdered or renounce their ideals.

>>92552567
WoD was cancelled with the end of the world.
Sucessor 'modern monsters' games were made, also called World of Darkness (requiem, forsaken, etc.) Unofficially it was called NWoD by the fandom.
White Wolf was bought by CCP to make an MMO.
2011 had an anniversary edition of VtM that sold well so they were allowed to continue making original WoD revival books
CCP tanked the MMO (not enough 'psssssh') and traditional book sales dried up and 'books in stores' traditional publishing stopped.
White Wolf dissolved
Bunch of people who worked for/with WW made Onyx Path, who licensed the WoD from CCP to make books; books at this time were only released as physicals through kickstarter and they only sold the books through a niche website
Paradox bought all the WoD IPs (renaming NWoD to CofD for brand differentiation) to make video games and also made a 5th edition as a backbone for their multimedia goals, forming White Wolf as a subsidiary
The first White Wolf team screwed the pooch by being too 90s edgy and not realizing that they now had to answer to a multi-million dollar multi-national corporation. They got shitcanned and new management rolled in (some oldbies like Jason Carl work on the brand).
Onyx Path licensed NWoD still for a while but PDX isn't approving new books, and OPP Can't write without referencing the old metaplot so they have been cut off from writing 5th editions.
5th editions of Vampire, Hunter and Werewolf have been released, both online and in physical stores, and apparently sell well. Vampire started out as more of a continuation but is now more of a soft reboot, Hunter and Werewolf are more hard reboots. The l5th editions rework the mechanics, and Vampire has 14 years of timeline advancement (it ignores the Gehenna scenarios and advanced from 2004, basically) and Hunter and Werewolf reboot their lore particularly.
The lore changes hit different people different ways (this place is generally hateful of them).

That should cover you.

>>92552548
I don't care. Mage should feel more Greek & European, I don't give a shit about india

>>92553053
Oh shit I forgot. They also started an international incident with gay Chechnyan vampires politics.

>>92549885
>Maybe its just people not reading the old lore but do you think most people like the tzimisce solely by Vicissitude as biomancy?
No. Outside of the level 1 because of disguise, none of my Tzimisces even cared about the discipline. Domination and koldun sorcery alongside the path of soul are the key things to play a tzimisce in my personal opinion.
It's actually a discipline that I don't care or see the point, similar to animalism and protean.
Although its better than Serpentis. But everything is better than serpentis.

>>92548310
Very breedable/10

Hello, frens.
What are we angry about today?

>>92553086
Mages exist all over the world, and Indian mysticism shares a lot of similarities with Western esotericism.

Calm down, you biased nard.

Indian belief has much to do with awakening, ascendance, transcendence, etc.

>>92549885
I think people play tzims because they are classy monsters.
>>92550191
It definitely needs guidelines. I had a Tremere character who lucked (diablerized) his way into a few dots of Visisitude & I did some weird stuff. I put plating & Kevlar around my ribcage to protect my heart, I stuffed myself with Blood Pennies made of glass beads so I could refresh my vitae in a pinch & I crafted a ghoul into a people suit to protect me from the sun

>>92553392
apparently the fact that MtAw is also not arsmagica

>>92553467
WTF? I'm mildly outraged!

>>92553392
All the bait people are putting in these threads, especially since the poster count no longer exist.

>>92553501
>especially since the poster count no longer exist
Why they did that?

>>92553412
>>92553400
Don't care I don't like it. Hell, cultivation would have been better than stupid tantric shit

>>92553542
I've genuinely never heard an official justification for it, but I rarely leave /tg/ and only sometimes visit /v/, /tv/, /vrpg/, and /k/.

The leading theory I've heard is it's so that the site can be flooded with bots and spam, usually with financial backing. Be it shilling campaigns on places like /v/ or political shit on /pol/, without a poster count you can't know for sure if a thread's being spammed or botted.

>>92553392
I'm angry at myself as I feel my current chronicle lacks an identity or good feeling. It doesn't help I've been getting progressively sicker the last 4 weeks and I worry I'm not as engaging or on the ball as I should be. Hopefully next Friday when the story arc concludes, I'll be able to open the game up more and make it more like what I originally proposed. Things have taken longer than I thought, maybe that's a good thing? 3.5 sessions on the "tutorial" session I thought would be rushed through in one, maybe 2.

Hey, people are showing up, considering 2 of the 5 players are strangers I recruited online, neither dropping out within 4 sessions must mean I'm doing something right.

>>92550611
Anyone capable of offering any advice?

>>92554233
Which splat are those powers from?

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>>92552567
I like this blog post, it explains pretty well what happened and where things are now.
>https://wodnews.blog/informationen/erklart-wod-cofd-editionen-wermachtwas/explained-wod-cofd-editions-whodoeswhat/
No idea about the rest of the site since it's mostly in German and my knowledge of that language is basic at best.

>>92554233
Not without more information

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>>92554333

>>92554321
>>92554336

I'm a v5 malk, former sabbat, and my DM will let me sacrifice my level 5 abilities (temporarily) for dominate if I want two level 4 abilities. I've got enough exp to take them but am conflicted about it

>>92554435
No

>>92554630
Rationalize seems really useful but Tabula Rasa seems fuckin terrifying

>>92554663
You shouldn't fuck with the rules though

>>92554802
It's within our campaigns rules though

>>92552063
If you're chill join, they're very cool & fun to play with!

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decided i'd actually start with mechanics in the Final Nights 2020: Vampire supplement rather than doing all the fluff first.

Been looking at fan games for monsters to use in my Hunter game and learned there was an alien one so now I'm considering having my players hunt them
>Maybe involve the tecnocorcy

>>92554854
You wanted an opinion. You got one. Stop complaining.

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Do pre change metis still get the physical stat bonuses?

>>92554983
I hope it turns out well.

>>92552219
>1
Yeah the Consensus operating in a fantasy setting is what's getting me atm. In universe I have society set up a lot like the technocracy anyway but considering there are other fantastical creatures in the world people know that there are at least supernatural things in the world even if they don't believe in magic. Paradox for me currently is kind of a pataphysical/monkey's paw effect if they ask for too much. Like people can teleport but if they try to make themselves incorporeal they turn into air and essentially die on the spot. But I feel that's too loose of a system to make sense narratives and I don't want the heroes able to do anything too crazy because that means the bads can do it as well.
>2
Sleepwalking I wasn't aware of, I'll definitely look into it, I definitely want to have "mutants" out in the world here and there that aren't outright wizards to keep things interesting.
>3
I'm starting to think if Paradox is less powerful in a fantasy world then perhaps Paradigm is what I should lean into for weaknesses. Like how magic is able to be used by only 1-2% of the pop but 99.9% of that percentage are hugely limited by their own egos/biology/theology to ever use it to its full potential.
Thanks for the info frens, >>92552198 as well

I'm very glad that Paradox decided to never add worthless bloodlines loresheets again because they are snowflakey and defy v5's design philosophy.

I will be happy if they do the same to Fera and make them antagonist only because they are stupid bloat.

>>92555212
i wish people in this thread would try harder with their bait, like at this point i'd rather see a shitstorm in the thread because of someone unironically going off about how the black spiral dancers are "problematic" than another low effort piece of bait like this

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>>92555099
Also what the fuck does a appearance 5 metis look like?

>>92555014
There's an alien fangame? That's news to me.
>involve the tecnocorcy
Ew.

>>92555237
I'm not trying to bait since I approve of V5's wonderful design philosophy except the Hecata for they are snowflakey because of their stupid bloodlines and the Giovanni should have remained as a clan. People that play Cappadocian or other necromancer clans are problematic because they are cowards who are afraid of dealing with beautiful themes such as family and incest. Cappadocians are problematic because they are generic dnd necromancers.

The Black Spiral Dancers are of course antagonists only no matter how problematic they are. There are more better and diverse player options that do not deal with problematic themes such as the white supremacy of the Cult Of Fenris. The other tribes are very diverse in concepts such as my favorite character, The-Death-Of-New-Life. My antinatalist Red Talon that wants to reduce human birthrate through ethical means. Such as beating pregnant women that pass by a dark alleyway with a baseball bat until they get a miscarriage, kidnap couples who want to have children by castrating the male and ripping out the uterus of the woman while force feeding them their decapitated genitals, and massacring pro life groups.

>>92555398
Keep going, I think you might get something interesting out in a couple posts.

>>92554435
> let you sacrifice
You do realize buying a level 4 power in a level 5 slot is just RAW, right?

>>92547794
So I've been away from /tg/ for about...two years, has anyone tried playing a Deviant in a cross splat game? How'd it go? And what cool shit did you do with your telekinesis, since that's obviously the best variation to have?

>>92552120
>Is the Consensus the main force that limits Mages in what they can do
Yes, in two ways. Paradox punishes mages for trying to use blatant magic in front of sleepers, while the collective background belief of sleepers requires a Paradigm to focus a mage’s power.
>how would that work in a fantasy-style setting?
It would be an inversion of the standard consensus. Magic would be commonplace & varied, dragons & other mythical beings would exist, widespread folk cures & other superstitions would function, but the laws of reality and physics would be bent out of shape
>I've learned that pretty much everyone is a Sleeper and can become a Mage, so does that mean that a person can awaken without realizing it
Yes and no. When someone awakens, they know something is up. But there’s also a good chance they explain away the awakening as finding a new system that helps them access that power
>and simply develop 1-2 skills that just become more refined over time with use instead of study?
Sort of. As mentioned before, that system could involve practice more than study, like martial arts or snorting cocaine. But what actually defines their grasp of it is belief in the paradigm, rather than study or practice
>I understand the Mage generally uses Foci depending on their personality to cast magic, but is there any other ways that Mages cast magic beyond this?
Foci are usually necessary for mages who are just starting out, but the need to use them becomes less severe the stronger a mage gets, until they can cast magic without a Foci. Still, powerful mages continue to use Foci because it’s less difficult than without it, even at the higher echelons of their abilities

>>92555517
Not yet, but I'm running an open-splat game for my group soon and I think one of my players might be interested in a Deviant.

That said, it also appears I might be bamboozled into just running Mage: The Awakening from how the other players are all talking.

>>92555517
I've not played it cross splat but it'll be very easy to do. There is little reason they can't fit among any of the rest of the splats.

Also Telekinesis with Target Restriction to metal to do kick ass Magneto things.

>>92555601
*Early Magneto

>>92555605
I said what I said.

>>92555631
I know, just wanted to make the distinction

>>92555099
Yes. It's their breed bonuses, it's natural from them.

>>92555015
After you gave your opinion you added a ludological non sequitur you stupid nigger

>>92555798
Stop running your mouth bitch

>>92555731
Huh... I wonder why they don't use more child soldiers like that?

>>92556284
Because they're still kids born with some deficiency and have no access to Gifts or Rituals.
Plus the whole stigma of being a Metis etc.

>>92556284
They're infertile so they're not a great long-term solution, though IIRC some Shadow Lords support creating Metis since they know the Apocalypse is almost here and therefore don't care about the prospect of future generations.

>>92556284
They already use since a Garou normaly Changes during their adolescence.
A Metis Change a little earlier, so yeah, they have child soldiers.

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>>92556408
Just throw enough of them at whatever blender fomori you have and eventually they will learn something magical.

>>92556442
I thought metis could breed with metis?

>>92556442
>They're infertile so they're not a great long-term solution
And since when do they think about that?
>>92556448
Yeah there are a few, literal, battle babies here and there even if they are supposed to rarer and rarer as times go on.

>>92556506
no, they are infertile and the perfect metis is the only one of them who could have children since they lack any defects.

>>92554983
Good luck bruv. Hope it turns out well.

>>92555500
No I didn't but point is that mass manipulation is cool but kinda meh on the use scale without having rationalize with it.
Terminal decree is just kinda shit. Like ordering somebody to kill themselves, is kind of cool, but also there are a ton of different ways to just kill them yourself once you've got them mesmerized.

So I've been debating on buying two level four abilities, I've got 3 in resolve and would have 5 in dominate with both abilities purchased. I could always rouse my resolve too

>>92555569
> I might be bamboozled into just running Mage: The Awakening
That's how they get you. They pretend you're playing another splat and then BAM you're dealing with paradox and nerds with giant reality warping brains.

>>92553071
I have no idea why people get upset by v5's lore reboots or the way it shakes up Sect membership when Revised and 20th did the same shit. Newfaggots that have only played 20th I guess.

>>92556821
Its just that the whole thing feels underdeveloped.

I want a paradigm that fuses old school alchemical philosophies & hermeticism, with modern metaphysics & atomic principals. Like declaring that Quantum Entanglement & the Hermetic Law of Contagion are the same thing. I know the technocracy does some of this but they are a bit too science & not enough Mystic. Like, if my Mage sees the world as a grand machine & proposes that the Jungian concept of the collective subconscience is nothing more than Psychic internet & our own brains being essentially wifi connected to it. Which group comes the closest to this ideology?

>>92556821
V20 didn't break the Pyramid. Fuck v5, Tremere 4 unlife

>>92556908
may your soul be violated.

>>92556902
>Which group comes the closest to this ideology?
Modern day hermetic or Son of Ether.

>>92556980
Are there any sons of ether in m20? I thought they all got killed or disappeared or something

>>92556968
I'll violate your mother

>>92556231
You started the race dumbfuck

>>92553465
There's nothing classy about the dick-throwers.

>>92557018
Good luck larping as a Gio you Baali knock off.

>>92557093
I'd ask what clan you were but we all know you're a sireless thinblood lick. You'd do well to remember who founded the Camarilla or you'll taste two things in quick succession, the taste of my brogues & then ash

>>92557015
Nah they're still around, the only ones who got disappeared are the Wu Lung, who got swallowed by the Order of Hermes, and the Wu Keng, who got a sidebar stating they've been Squatted out of the setting.

>>92557147
Bitch, you are more of a mongrel than a Caitiff Shovelhead. Your kind was saved by the Camarilla because your predecessors were too moronic to not die off as Mages. You are a slave, without the protections of your masters your kind would be extinct because you don't know how to exist without pissing off every last thing that sees your abomination of a bastardized bloodline.

I'm thinking of rolling up an Abomination PC for a quick game where the limits on what you can do ae being blown right out the window. What's a good Tribe/Clan mix?

>>92557205
>What's a good Tribe/Clan mix?
Red Talon/Brujah for maximum retardation.

>>92557205
Anything with Nosferatu. Add potence and obfuscate to your war form and invisibly punch clean through people.

A thousand enemies yet stand above all the rest undefeated... you think to throw your hat in the ring against us too? Ask the antitribu how well that went

>>92557237
And you are still too retarded to quote a post.

So can we dial back the attempts at starting an edition flamewar and general shitposting? It feels like 60% of the thread here, I have no idea why you want to have the same angry debates over and over again.

Honestly, on the topic of lore, do any of you guys actually even run stuff closely following the metaplot of any edition? I obviously like some editions WAY more than others, but I've never liked any enough to run them exactly at setting default. Plus, the whole thing is about making your own stories, so things like metaplot are guidelines at absolute BEST for me.

But I'm curious as to how others see it, because from the posting it seems a lot of you guys actually do follow the Revised/V20/V5 metaplots in your games.

>>92557205
Uktena Gargoyle. You'll be a beautiful monstrosity with a lot of options

>>92557270
>Honestly, on the topic of lore, do any of you guys actually even run stuff closely following the metaplot of any edition?
No, I can't be bothered to follow a single edition. I just graft whatever tidbits mesh well with the plot I am working with.

As if I would make it easy for you. You'll just have to keep obsessing, searching for my insults like a rat seeking a meal in the trash

>>92557270
I do what I want, but there's a lot of solid stuff in there.

>>92557302
You call me a rat yet you are the one scurrying away. Go cry to the Ventru or whomever the fuck sustains you subpar sorcerers and maybe they will actually do something about it.

>>92557270
I run with the assumption of the default metaplot that's adjusted whenever needed. Of course blindly sticking to it isn't a good idea, but there's no need to make everything from scratch if it isn't especially relevant to the current story.

>>92557205
CoG/Malk with delusions about becoming the diplomatic bridge.

>>92557483
And he has to be min maxed enough that it could actually work.

>>92557205
I mean, does it have to be a Werewolf? Do a Salubri Gurahl.

>>92557503
Could you still get the Unicorn stuff that roadblocks everybody from fighting?

>>92557205
shadowlord+lasombra had a darkness obsessed bad guy camp that works with vampire and some combos in their abilities
like for example there is a shadowlord gift that allows you to hurt people by striking their shadow and obtenebration 1 allows you to shape natural shadows so you can make someone's shadow come to you even if the poor guy is running away and then strike it with all the might of a potence enchanted werewolf

Vampire question but also more generally. When things like Vigor and Potence are getting used, do you lay on the superhero thing of punches sending people flying? If you use the active power of Vigor you can lift something up to your strength, have you ever seen an NPC get thrown in combat?
Two players have gone with Daeva characters and neither are dumping physical stats and skills, so I figure I ought to prepare myself.

>>92557205
Silent Strider/Kiasyd for maximum cross-splating and exclusive Disciplines (Mytherceria, Necromancy, Obtenebration)

>>92557632
you keep the gifts you already have, but unless you stay in your morality above 7 or are able to hide your wyrmtaint you are not learning new ones from gayan spirits

>>92555364
It's more so my players can have someone to rob
They have weapons taken from a ship locked up for study and if the players get in they get a cool laser rapier and a gun that fires condensed sunlight with one shot
And no it's not just for vampires it can easily permanently disfigure and cripple a wearwolf in war form

>>92557201
>abomination of a bastardized bloodline
>says the thin-blood who needed a whole shitty edition to make them playable and palatable
lol
lmao even

>>92557270
>So can we dial back the attempts at starting an edition flamewar and general shitposting?
No, go fuck yourself. Stop trying to be the "voice of reason" poster that comes up every now and then. Get used that people will fight over editions. It has been this since 2nd and Revised, Wod and nWoD, and now V20 and V5.
It's a never-ending cycle and you cannot stop it. Go with the flow or ignore the posters just like the majority has been doing since ever.
If you don't like, go to reddit, discord or whatever hole fits you better. Nothing of value will be lost anyway.

>>92557270
I like running metaplot, signature characters and ready-made characters and settings because I see people not doing it normaly and it's more comfortable for me. I always thought it was the opposite until I found out not many people care for that, preferring building their own characters, cities, etc. I had my quota creating my own stuff and 'til today I look back and enjoy what I did.
But I'm really enjoying my new era of metaplot storytelling. I see these characters and settings ready to play and I want to play with them. I still obviously create my own characters for the setting because, welp, the setting is just a base, but I have lots of fun using what we already have in hands!

>>92556902
Order of Hermes. I'm playing as a Kinfolk alchemist who follows same paradigm, fusing alchemy and contemporary science.

>>92556908
No idea why people like playing Tremere. You have zero agency as a player, basically an NPC.

>>92559377
NTA but I like to play the Telyavelic Tremere, they're much less lame than the "oops I got bloodbound on accident" main clan.

>>92559377
Only if you're all Tremere. Otherwise the GN can't possibly invest enough focus on your character to really capture the MLM nature of your unlife without alienating and boring the rest of the party.

>>92556643
So yeah, you're good, just buy Rationalize then Mass Manip, no ST fiat weird homebrew needed.

>>92556908
Tremere Pyramid being broken was the single best plot point out of V5. Tremere now has so much conflict and plot stuff to play with, including the ability to just 'be part of a faction that is still holding the Pyramid-style stuff together'.

>>92557270
I pick and choose what, if anything I'll use from the main meta and setting. But doing this for a few decades now, this fandom is full of mentally and socially stunted spergs who follow exactly what the books say because they can't be arsed ot do any work themselves, their 'pet thing' that they love is so sacred they won't make changes, or the worst, they identify and have built their personality and existence around the game and changes are very personal offenses to them.

I've had people get just short of frothing temper tantrums in games when I've been up front during setup to say 'okay, so common knowledge, X and Y are different'.

>>92559408
That's not Tremere, it's a snowflake bloodline no different than the Daughters or even the Baali.

>>92559419
A chantry that doesn't have directly control over its Apprentices' night-to-night is a shit chantry that is abnormal. It's not like any given city has dozens of Tremere running around, it'll have 2 or 3 at most, and a short scene every few sessions should be enough to showcase that the player, by design, has literally no freedom of choice and no upward mobility. If it's not played this way then the ST is running it against how the Clan is written.

>>92559456
Tremere Telyavelic had a good deal of interesting things if you read the Dark Ages novels. I love them as well and the novel ended with one Telyavelic running away, meaning the bloodline could survive into Modern Nights, but I get your feeling.
My love for them made me do a extensive timeline on how they survived, what happened to Telyavel and so on. I even solved Telyavel issue in my Demon the Fallen game. Not everyone can do that or want to do that for a single nothing burger bloodline.

Also, you're 100% right about Tremere. I like them too and I try to do everything right to transport the feeling of having no freedom.
But getting on the dilemma on why people enjoy the Tremere, this is something I wrote couple of threads ago: Not every ST wants to make the effort and many players only want Thaumaturgy (I see many wanting Path of Conjuring).

>>92559586
>Tremere Telyavelic had a good deal of interesting things if you read the Dark Ages novels.
Oh I'm not saying they're bad at all, they're great in Dark Ages games like you say, but they're definitely not Tremere in the same sense as the main clan is.
>My love for them made me do a extensive timeline on how they survived, what happened to Telyavel and so on.
That sounds pretty interesting, I haven't played in a modern setting outside of a random v5 game about a year back.

>>92559426
Why not Tabula Rasa

>>92559456
>>92559377
I played mine like an old "company man" idk why you'd think they suck so hard unless you have a narrowminded view of them & won't accept any other interpretation. The Pyramid is ridged but it's not like you can't move around. Hell sometimes the point is to subvert it & get away with it to move up & prove yourself worthy of the position. It's one of those "if you can't pull this off you'll be killed, but if you pull it off you'll be promoted" type structures. Breaking the Pyramid just gets rid of that fun, sometimes you need a box to exist to be able to think outside it, but the modern writers aren't that insightful or creative. Sounds like you aren't either. Tremere are one of the most powerful clans, Blood Sorcery needs to come with a certain level of setting Lore, flavor & baggage attached, that way not everyone & their mother will be running around with it. You might as well bitch about Malk players & or Nossies. Wah I'm ugly, wah I'm crazy, wah I'm part of a system within a system. If you don't want to be a Tremere errand boy then don't act like one. Kill your superiors, scheme like a motherfucker, lie, blackmail, steal, get leverage & never take your fangs off their throats. Youre a warlock, act like it. Your complaint is that you're too beholden to the Pyramid, but it's not that much different from being beholden to a sire.

Y’know what’d be awesome? Sword Fighting Toreador vs Soldier Wizened

>>92559724
Most people don't play the Pyramid correctly anyway, so there's really no reason to get upset that it got broken.
>It's one of those "if you can't pull this off you'll be killed, but if you pull it off you'll be promoted" type structures.
It's not. It's a "Do it or you get punished or killed" with zero upward mobility outside of moving up in the circle you're already in, which largely means nothing because there's never going to be enough Tremere around outside of cities like Vienna or London for it to matter.

You're also Bonded to your superior and their powers well-outrank yours, so it's not like you can ever act against what they ask like in other structured clans. If you're able to do this, then the Chantry there is just weak, and if it's that incompetent you're probably not well-trained anyway or the ST is just fudging the setting/clan to give you something to do.

The whole theming of the Clan is that you don't get to do anything you want to and you answer to a bunch of death wizards that only care if you're doing what they ask.

>>92559724
>Kill your superiors, scheme like a motherfucker, lie, blackmail, steal, get leverage & never take your fangs off their throats.
Just remember you're making Willpower Diff 8+ every time you intend to even do one of these things.

>>92559779
Nah, see you just contradicted yourself.

>if you don't toe the line you'll be killed
>there's not many Tremere outside of a few cities

Sounds to me like I have tons of freedom as long as eyes & ears don't get back to some stuffy Eldar with a bee in his bonnet. Don't be a pussy, if you don't like it play another clan. Are you gonna bitch about Nossies being ugly & how that's oh so limiting too?

Neonates are bonded to their sires too so this is a nonarguement.

>>92559821
Then stack the deck, make allies, & don't fucking miss. It's better to have them taken out by proxy anyhow.

>>92559824
You're telling people how to play the Clan against what's written and intended, then telling them not to whine about playing it. So bizarre.
>Neonates are bonded to their sires too so this is a nonarguement.
It's not the same level of Bond and you know it. Their Sires are also NOT bound to someone above them that tells them what to do or they'll be brutally punished.

You can argue that the player is exceptional (as they generally are), but the mechanics and dice are there to test this extensively, per intended and written. If you don't play by that experience you don't actually care about the Tremere in 20th/Revised.

You cannot act against your superiors without a high Diff Test.
You will never learn the Thaumaturgy they have access to without a high Diff Test.
You won't move up the ladder without someone else asking for massive boons or getting a metric ass-ton of blackmail on you.

Even if you DO manage to do these things, the nearest Chantry will just send a new Regent or Magister that immediately Bonds you or erases you and the process repeats.

Tremere are not a flippant Clan of structureless fuck-ups Pre-V5, they're a rigidly structured chain of command with tons of options to ruin your unlife. The fact that you're embraced into their Clan at all is because you're good at doing what you're told first and show some academic capability second. If you're not than you're broken into becoming that over decades. That's the Clan. If you want to pussy foot around and ignore the narrative and rules of play that's fine, but you might as well just play something else at that point because it's clear you don't like what's intended.

>>92559831
Just remember that every time you think of how to stack the deck you're making a Willpower Diff 8+ every time. Even asking someone to help you requires such a test if the end result is to harm your superior or the Pyramid in general, and unless you get a crap ton of successes, explaining anything to them other than a time and place requires another Diff8+ test.

>>92559925
>>92559880
My buddy, just because you can't handle it doesn't mean the rest of us can't. You're too narrowminded & can't see your own blinders. You say they WILL do all this stuff like they have the time, energy or the insight. Yes you play by the rules, but there is always wiggle room & eventually you can jump on an opportunity when it appears.

>>92560067
So if the ST makes an incompetent and completely detached Tremere Sire who embraced you for very little reason without any thought, investment, or foresight and pretty much ignores the entire point of the Pyramid as a concept, the player will have some agency to get ahead. We'll also ignore that there's, inexplicably, no contingencies anywhere nearby amongst the Clan to replace or fix what you've done, and no one that's your Sire's immediate superior, or no one with authority that's smart enough to realize what you've done / are doing.

Doing any of this is not playing or portraying the clan properly, so you may as well play something else.

>>92560141
You seem like some crazed anti authority tranny who thinks that just because their are rules & people above you means you have no freedom. I'm not here to sort out your own vitriolic hangups.

>>92560154
Nah. I'm just talking about the game and a part of it accurately. You're the one who wants to dismantle it and create your own version, which is totally fine, just don't pretend that's how it is normally.

>>92560067
Look buddy. I'm just telling you what the requirements are for what you're doing, don't get pissy. Probably just another nogames.

>>92547794
Salubri bf NOW

Guys, guys... You are all making Pyramid structure too much complex.
The Tremere is a huge fancy and prestige university. Expensive as shit and only the elite goes there.
And (You) are the poor student with a scholarship.

Not that difficult to portray a place like that.

>>92560345
>You are all making Pyramid structure too much complex.
I didn't make it that way, the people who wrote it did.

>>92560226
>>92560175
This is just pathetic. Good luck with yourself bro

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>>92560345
To me it really didn't click until I saw that clip from Alfabusa's Kevin explaining just how pervasive the pyramid's blood bond is in your mind, and how static your position in the hierarchy really can be.

>>92560440
Watches youtube, has a shit opinion...

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>>92560154
>>92560402
What's with all this projection?

>>92560476
Playing the Tremere without the Blood Bond is just playing them how they are in v5.

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>>92560476
Brother I just mean I didn't understand how the pyramid functioned exactly and why Tremeres seemed to still get rogue elements all the time if they were so united, I don't care about whatever nonsense beef you had with that other anon.

>>92547794
V20: can someone help me get the whole picture of the Giovanni?

I understand they are necromancers mixed with the wealthy crime family, but I don't really get how the wealthy merchant mobster mixes with the scholarly necromancer aspect.
It's just different parts of the family that deal with those things? How do they actually use their undead powers and how do they deal with their curse? The only thing I am able to imagine as a result is a clan of vamps that leaves a huge trail of corpses everywhere it goes.

Also: how serious and committed are most Giovanni into the whole "lets destroy the Shroud"?

>>92560600
>Also: how serious and committed are most Giovanni into the whole "lets destroy the Shroud"?
Depends on the game and how player portrays their character. Not every Giovanni knows about this and not every player or ST cares for that. I know lots of players who plays as Giovanni and didn't even bothered to go deeper on Giovanni lore to know about this aim.

>>92560600
>I don't really get how the wealthy merchant mobster mixes with the scholarly necromancer aspect.
That's the neat thing: it doesn't. The Giovanni are not scholarly necromancers, and this is reflected even in the paths of necromancy they practice. They use necromancy as a tool to get shit done. Originally the family was more scholarly minded, having been brought into the fold by Cappadocius for this reason, however over the years with more and more inbreeding they have considerably degenerated and become a necromantic mafia.

>how serious and committed are most Giovanni into the whole "lets destroy the Shroud"?
This is something I'm unsure of myself, I'll admit, I think it was always something Augustus and the methuselahs of the Giovanni wanted to do the most, a secret goal kept away from the lower ranks of the family and for good reason because it's completely fucking insane.

>How do they actually use their undead powers and how do they deal with their curse? The only thing I am able to imagine as a result is a clan of vamps that leaves a huge trail of corpses everywhere it goes.
Necromancy among the Giovanni is mostly practiced within a familial context, they prefer using corpses in places where they aren't likely to be seen by prying eyes. As for their curse (the painful kiss), there's a myriad of ways you could theoretically handle it, like feeding only on the incapacitated (such as in a hospital setting), feeding on a dedicated cult whom you insist that you'll grant your power to someday, or feeding on the kine of the family who understand that this is something they'll have to deal with before they get the proxy kiss and later the embrace.

>>92560600
>I don't really get how the wealthy merchant mobster mixes with the scholarly necromancer aspect.
They're a family of merchants who tended to sell their natural talents in Necromancy and developed it more and more to sell it for more and more. Early Giovanni Necromancy could really only talk to Wraiths, and was themed around something akin to a roman séance than what the Cappadocians did, which was more involved with manipulating and controlling the energies of death here in the Skinlands.It wasn't until they became vampires and usurped the Caps that they diversified and used their wealth to make inroads elsewhere.
>t's just different parts of the family that deal with those things?
Yes. Not every Giovanni is good with Necromancy. Some of them are good with money, others are good at pummeling the shit out of people and getting things done.
>How do they actually use their undead powers and how do they deal with their curse?
They murder a lot and use their bite to torture the non-turned members of their family.
>The only thing I am able to imagine as a result is a clan of vamps that leaves a huge trail of corpses everywhere it goes.
They tend to control all the graveyards and hospitals in any given Domain where they're present, and have an extensive system to cover their murders up.

>how serious and committed are most Giovanni into the whole "lets destroy the Shroud"?
It's an old secret kept by the higher-ups and it changes from edition to edition. In Revised most Giovanni that are gen 6 or lower are in on it, because they have enough mastery over Necromancy that they can gain an advantage from it. In 20th it's a different thing entirely and that edition flip-flops and just tells the ST to run it how they want without a lot of insight into how it's recieved. In V5 it's revealed that around a third of the elder thought it was a retarded idea and helped rise up against Augustus and killed him, causing a 6th Maelstrom that's fucked all kinds of shit up.

>>92560513
You are supposed to have the blood bond not ignore it, don't be dafty
>>92560519
The Pyramid is self contained. You just have a massive blindspot on how you can have fun while inside its rules

>>92560675
>>92560692
>>92560705
Awesome, this helps clear the picture for me.

Thanks!

>>92560724
>supposed to have the blood bond not ignore it
Right, which is why you make those WP Diff 8+ Tests.

>>92560705
>because they have enough mastery over Necromancy that they can gain an advantage from it
They think. They still don't know a bunch about specters at that level.

The fuck are you guys even on? Only problem I've ever had with Tremere at the table is players trying to make cheesy Thaumaturgy combos. This feels like making a mountain out of a molehill.

>>92560993
If a player finds the ability to do some Thaum combos like that they used their wits and stacked the deck in their favor, that's how it should work.

>>92560759
Got a problem with that pussy? Play like a corporate shark & the Pyramid works as intended. Play like a thinblood brujah who whines at being constrained & you won't have fun

>>92561054
Nah, I like making players do WP tests.

>>92560993
People are discussing how they portray a certain type of vampire in their games and how they interpret their hierarchy, power and game structure and how they apply it on their own games in comparsion on what the books advises them to do.
If we can't do edition wars like we ever do like a bunch of autists we are, we need to find another topic of discussion within this general for us to apply our autism.

>>92561023
One of my favorite Thaumaturgy powers is is the telekinesis one. It gives you flight & you can toss grenades/molotovs.

>>92557300
That's more or less my approach as well. Though some editions I lean much more heavily on, a lot of stuff from 2e or V20 makes it in, a decent amount of Revised, and virtually nothing from V5 has wound up in my games.

>>92557311
Interesting. I personally tend to dislike more than I like from the metaplots, especially the very metaplot heavy editions like Revised and V5.

>>92557371
That's reasonable, though I like my games interconnected and feel like they share a setting so I can't take as agnostic an approach.

>>92559338
Interesting. As someone who usually dislikes far more than he likes about the metaplot, what parts of it do you enjoy, and are you specifically talking about a certain edition's metaplot?

>>92559452
I get the notion of using the setting as a guideline and baseline and little more. Though I have to say I'm fortunate enough to have never met anyone like the people you're describing.

>>92558178
I did a fastball special a couple times but it wasn't all that interesting or effective when parkour does the same job more reliably. When you can grapple and throw people like that, you are better off breaking necks(just doing damage) or knocking them out(stun locking).
good luck with your game.

So how much experience do you guys have of different Vampire editions? Is V20 always the best one, or would you use Requiem for some games? Or has 5e something that handles well, or maybe the older editions were the best?

>>92561591
Fair enough, is there a table I've missed for Strength and how much you can throw/lift? I'm getting quite fond of the idea of Potence punches sending people flying across the road.

>>92561563
>what parts of it do you enjoy, and are you specifically talking about a certain edition's metaplot?
That is real variable. But let me give you an example: In the far future, I wanna do a Berlim anarch game using V5 (both TTRPG and LARP book, plus some fanmade books because I've playing nu-V5 straight for three years now and it sucks. My friends were right when they said V5 is better with custom content because this shit is too bland).
What I'm going to use for this setting:
>Berlim by Night
>couple of updates do the scenario seeing in V20, Beckett Diary
>obligatory Blood Curse novel that affected Berlim
>VDA Cainite Heresy
>V5 metaplot update on Berlim
>V5 LARP metaplot update on Berlim

Now, the tricky part here is: I like crossover and Berlim by Night was also a book in an era that crossover was ok to do it (different from Revised that they tried to distance themselves from it). Which means I'm going to get some points from all other books (werewolf, mage, changeling and wraith, probably Demon) and get some points straight.

After that, I go through official NPCs, see what happened to them and etc. Then I got for my own stories, what I put, what I cut and so on. There are some ready-made adventures that I like and I put as something that happened in my world and I see how this affects this city.

And also, since Berlim nowadays don't have too much information, I need to create new characters and I'm enjoying doing collective worldbuilding with players (this also makes them more involved in the world and also let me have some breath when it comes to NPC creations).

There are more points, but this is the base outline for what I do.

TL;DR: I pick some points on metaplot and do what I want with it together with things of my own creation.

>>92561563
>lot of stuff from 2e or V20 makes it in, a decent amount of Revised, and virtually nothing from V5 has wound up in my games.
V5 has very few plot points worth porting. Most people aren't all that interested in managing the details of their territory or what they feed from.
The weirder shit like alchemy is such a nothing burger most of the time I don't see why would you use it.

>>92561740
Are you incapable of typing the German capital correctly?

>>92561633
>is there a table I've missed for Strength and how much you can throw/lift?
Only in WoD for some reason.

>>92561796
He's probably one of the brazilians who post here. That's how they write Berlin.

>>92551894
Gotta marinate my cum in garou juices first. Infuse the nutrients

first post ruined this thread

>>92561996
So it did nothing.

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>>92555355
like this I guess

>Tremere micro-managment
now this is retarded, why should a Tremere Regent who is most likely busy studying Thaumaturgy bother himself with every little detail of what those beneath him do? just give them like a checklist or something and then let them figure the rest out themselves.

>>92562260
The tremere who rise to lead chantries would be those best suited to management and politics. You wouldn't waste dedicated researchers and scholars by forcing upon them the task of overseeing half a dozen others.

Rather than hyperventilate about whatever the fuck the Council of Seven/Clan Tremere is doing, just think about what your specific Tremere chantry's purpose is. I'm setting up a game right now in a tier-two American city where the local Chantry specializes in teaching one of the more obscure Paths. In any given year, they typically host 1-3 Tremere from other Chantries who are there to learn the Path, plus the Regent and her two childer. Otherwise they make themselves useful to the Prince, protect the boundaries of the Domain and keep to themselves. The Regent is the Regent because she's a master of this particular Path, and as long as they aren't retards she doesn't care what her Apprentices get up to in their downtime. Just figure out what role you want the Tremere to play in your game and ignore anyone who tells you there is ONE AND ONLY ONE way to use them as some kind of hyper-constipated ultimate fun police.

>>92562260
It's just one tranny who thinks the Tremere's elders live in their walls & constantly spy on them to know everytime they farther so if they step out of line they murder them or something idk. More than likely he doesn't have a good relationship with his father

The anon who bans Tremere on their games was right.

>>92562580
No shit, sherlock.

>>92562580
Tremere and Tzimisce attract powergamers. Brujah, Gangrel and Lasombra attract disruptive assholes. Filter your players and you won't have to filter your clans.

>>92562608
How do you do filtering for WoD/CofD? I'm planning for a game in near future some tips would be good. I thought on posting a google form questionaire, but don't know which questions should be good for it.

>>92561818
Is this New or Chronicles? The layout of these books is such a pain in the arse that I'd rather ask than waste time scanning through both of them.

>>92562661
If they want to play Beast you should call the Police

>>92562443
Sure. In my game, the Washington D.C. Chantry is the largest Chantry on the East Coast, and likely all of America. It has several satelite chantries all throughout the district, connected to the main chantry via portals. The main chantry is built into and under the Smithsonian museum, and all of its satelite chantries are based out of the other Smithsonian museums and academic institutions. The Tremere have been in the Smithsonian since its founding (which was really odd irl, look it up if you want an interesting read), and most of their mortal power in DC comes from it.

The D.C. Chantry is impossibly large on the inside, likely using very powerful blood rituals to make it so large and labyrinthine when it was created. Its official purpose is the storage and study of anomalous objects and entities, and chantries all over North America send them things for containment and research. The inside of the Chantry is mostly brutalist in design. Concrete, glass, basic geometric shapes. However certain areas for habitation or more ostentatious rituals can be very beautiful though remarkably "old world". It's something of an open secret the DC chantry has a lot more apprentices in it than it publically discloses to the Prince, and which is the result of a problem the chantry has been wrestling with since the new Milennium.

The current Regent, George Henderson was embraced in the 1940-50s. Though incredibly young for his position, his blood is quite potent. He is only in charge because both his grandsire and sire met grim fates, resulting in him being the only remaining qualified Tremere. His unfamiliarity with the Chantry's founding has resulted in multiple crises and entire sections of the massive chantry falling into disrepair. Most concerningly, so much blood and vitae has been shed on the concrete of the chantry that it has developed a rudimentary sentience.

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It appears my superiority has led to some controversy...

>>92562661
Vet them as though you were conducting a job interview. If they don't fuck up the application process, they get to the interview stage. I prefer to do it on a voice call because you get a better measure of the person that way. This usually takes 30-45 minutes. I ask them questions about their character concept and play preferences but I'm also observing their personality. If we don't seem compatible or they seem kind of pissy, even if their character pitch was impressive, I tell them thanks for the interest but the position's been filled. Even with all this I get incompatible players, usually one in every group. So I ran a succession of short chronicles/scenarios and kept the best from each until I had four people I liked and who like what I do, and now I have a group who will stick around for the long haul with me. It takes time but it ultimately worked for me. A questionnaire is an interesting idea, if you try it let us know how it worked out sometime.

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>>92562751
atleast white wolf didn't delete your entire faction for being too cool

>>92562825
That was retarded and should be ignored.

>>92562821
Some of your ideas had me going for questions to put on my form. There was a thread months ago on a dude complaining he did want "danger hair" people on their tables and someone gave a couple ideas on how filtering and he mentioned a bit of his own questionaire. Since then, I wanted to do the same, but was afraid people would see me as a dick (which is actually good because this is a filtering itself).

>So I ran a succession of short chronicles/scenarios and kept the best from each until I had four people I liked and who like what I do, and now I have a group who will stick around for the long haul with me
This is a great idea! Not only I can filter players, but I can do one-shots or 1-to-3 sessions adventures with a variety of themes and fast play. I've been only on long-term campaigns and I'm getting a bit tired of it.

>>92562680
I meant V20.

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>mfw just play Hunter the Vigil so all the Tremere shit flinging ITT doesn't matter, because who gives a fuck about wizard vampires or animal vampires or angry vampires when I'm going to burn their houses down anyway

>>92562974
I like Hunter and Vampire. Tell me about your Hunter game, anon.

>>92562940
So it does, thanks anon. I don't suppose this covers Strength higher than 5? I know stats can get out of hand pretty readily in v20.

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>>92562680

>>92563059
Thanks very much anon, you're a hero.

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>>92563026
it does go up to 15, but it, like the "can crush a human skull with one hand" thing makes me wonder what the writers think peak human strenght (aka 5) can do

>>92563026
Found another chart. >>92563059
>>92562974
We just have a whole lot of nothing else worth talking about. When people want game advice it goes nowhere so often you might as well talk to a robot.

>>92563059
>>92563074
The fact that neither of these take Athletics into account annoys the shit out of me.

>WoD tries to push Kitsune as these beautiful asian master of magic and manipulation. Tricksters and sorcerers. Agents of the Balance Wyrm. Aren't foxes pretty with their orange coats and cute faces?
>There are two of the bastards screaming their heads off over some random territory dispute every evening at 10:30 PM on the dot every single day so I can't sleep
>Probably have rabies
Fuck it, gonna make a western Kitsune antagonist for my group to murder with a nature all around annoying people! I don't care much for asian Kitsune but a hobo rumming through trash is a Bone Gnawer on steroids, time to cause some inter-Fera territory disputes, baby!

>>92563099
yeah it's a strenght only roll which is weird because it and carrying might be the only ones in the books that aren't related to powers

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How do rule a supernatural retainer? My group has acquired wounded werewolf who will become a servant to one of our characters but we only have 2xp points left at the moment.

>>92562443
Nooooo!!!!! What do you think a single shred of individual freedom means to my precious lore! What do you MEAN I have to roll to attempt things? THEO BELL HELP ME AAAAAAH

>>92562825
Goratrix is a dickless gay twink tho...

>>92563146
>And all the bootlickers and fuccbois will look up from their blood orgies and shout, "save us!"
>And I'll look down and say, "Dragon's Breath round, 8d10 agg, 120' cone."

>>92563074
That does raise a few questions yeah. I'm looking specifically for Requiem, which (with Vigor) seems to max out around Strength 12/13 on your chart (Size 10, a Sports Car or a Moose).

>>92563171
healing your cut off dick is anima 3 and we know he had a sexual relationships with a woman after the creation of ceoris

>>92563143
Sucks to be you. That's what happend when you don't think about your group and only want to spend XP on yourself.

>>92563104
>There are two of the bastards screaming their heads off over some random territory dispute every evening at 10:30 PM on the dot every single day so I can't sleep
Based.

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>>92562974
I've pageflipped Vigil and it seems pretty cool to allow several tiers of play, but I just love what I've heard of the Imbued too much. Can anyone who's played Reckoning and/or Vigil tell me more about their tonal differences? Does reckoning get repetitive with the schizohobo hunter theme or what problems does it have?

>>92563195
They statted dragon's breath rounds?

>>92563104
that makes me wonder what a racoon shifter would be like

you think fera would complain that these guys are too weaverish already because they can pick up things?

>>92563268
if i remember correctly it's "just" ag damage from the gun like silver against shifters

Would it be easier to run Hunter (the Vigil) for a pair of new players, or to start w/ the basic CofD?
The players haven't played any WoD game before, and it'll be my time time GM'ing w/the Storyteller system. My main WoD experience is from having played a V20 campaign (Sabbat) for about half a year. So I'm not super confident w/the system yet.

>>92563293
Vigil would probably grab people more.

>>92563293
Most basic CofD games are basically diet Hunter, it's just the nature of the beast. Cut out the middle man and run some spooky stuff in your local city or area.
>>92563253
I've not played Reckoning, but Vigil is rather flexible in that it's not always "local hunters kneecap a vampire in a bowling alley". The tier system means you can play Delta Green, X Files or demon-busters and it all works relatively well.

>>92563293
Vigil is Supernatural
Reckoning is Buffy

>>92562737
I love the idea of an enormous extradimensional space that's become dangerous even for the ones who built it. Do you have plans to send your players into any of these disused areas?
Captcha: DHAM

>>92563226
Bitch, I am half the reason that we have Resources 5.
>>92563253
Long story short, Vigil is about mostly mortal hunters with Tier 3 allowing you to have sorcerer levels of power.
Reckoning is about playing Exalted Light with most of the interesting powers missing.

>>92563293
Just play Vigil.

>>92563451
NTA but you should look at Koldunic Sorcery to borrow from

What's a good way for me to roleplay as a Shadow Lord Ahroun with Manipulation as my dump stat?

>>92563966
abuse the fact that everyone thinks you are lying to catch them offguard by not lying

>>92563451
We actually did enter the Chantry on several occasions during the chronicle. In an early session, we had to clear out some Szlachta that had been lost in one of the sublevels since the big battle with the Sabbat. We also found that, in an attempt to unnaturally improve his generation, the Regent before Henderson had accidentally given himself the Methuselah's Thirst. For fear of all becoming meals of their Regent, the Tremere managed to lock him away in a derelict section of the Chantry, since the clan curse proved too much for them to outright kill him. He escaped that section eventually but couldn't find his way out of the chantry in its entirety and the whole thing went SCP: Containment Breach while he was trying to break out.

We didn't have a Tremere PC for most of this, but once we did towards the end of the Chronicle, the Chantry kept trying to get our Tremere to bite on a plothook about the Regent being blackmailed, however our Tremere was too much of a bootlick to even consider eavesdropping on his Regent.

>>92563966
Just say the truth.

>>92563966
Just ask, what would Scar from The Lion King do? & use that as your guiding light

>>92564029
this is appropriation of the simba cultural heritage!
you woofs wouldn't dare doing that if black tooth was still alive!

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At what point does Allies and Influence become a problem at the table?

>>92564326
like all backgrounds depends on the scale on the story and what the st wants to handle

i know this sounds like a non answer, but there are like stuff like elder backgrounds to mess with global industries, spells for syndicate mages with 8 in ressource and such

>>92564361
Yeah, I was talking about at what point it just becomes a universal solution. like a Glass Walker at the start of the game getting Resources 7 with their totems.

>>92564389
and my answer is it depends on the scale
getting rid of that vampire bar with Resources 5? easy
getting rid of pentex with ressource 8? still not gonna happen

if your players get more powerful you need to increase the scale of people they can interact with regardless of it is soft or hard power

if your pack become able to walk over smaller pentex subsidiaries because of money, big pentex main will take notice and becomes the enemy and then suddently Resources 7 is not a universal solution, but something you need to counteract whatever resources pentex gave the guy they put in charge of getting rid of you

of course if you don't want your story to escalate to that point you should restrict backgrounds like you would other powers you don't want to have in the game

Where do you guys set your games? I'm thinking of running a game set in my home city.

>>92564636
So far all my campaigns have been in America (homeland obviously), most recent campaign has been set in just. "The West," of America (basically everything West of the Dakotas)

>>92564636
1-Home city
2-London/Paris (can get awkward because you may have a fucking player who knows more about the city than you and insists on being a dick-I'm talking about, T)
3-Thinking about Milan if I get to run a new Vampire game.

>>92564636
Depends, I make up my own towns a lot because I don't want caught up in pre-existing bullshit. A sleepy town in the Pacific Northwest is fine, I don't need to pick a real one, none of my players have ever been near the pacific northwest. Other times I want it to be my own hometown so we can make jokes about real people & places & we all know it like the back of our hands. Some times I pick New York or Chicago, etc. cause I'm going for a theme. If I'm just trying to make something that's not too familiar & not too foreign I usually just pick Columbus since we all live in Ohio, & we know the city but not enough that I can't make shit up & fill in the blanks. Plus Columbus is a cool place in general.

>>92564636
i so far only used large cities i been to for more than a day so my home city obviously, oslo, sydney, london and saint petersburg

>>92564636
I try to set my games in south america to contrast with the rest of my group. Sometimes I can't be bothered to translate shit and just set it wherever the story I'm ripping off is set.

>>92564636
I set them in the US but not my home city because I don't want to deal with it. I'd leave if I could.

>>92564636
I choose a random largish city in the USA or Canada or the Anglosphere with little-no lore about it.

>>92564636
>chicago (vtm)
>imaginary county in auvergne-rhone-alpes, in France (wta, as player)
>same place as above, but in dark ages (wta)
>imaginary city around new orleans (ctl)
>previous games in Stockholm and Berlin (both vtm)

>>92564687
This guy still bothering you? Just throw the "WoD isn't the 1:1 to real world, it's written in the book" card. This way you shut him up.
Also, I thought you had a convo with him to stop being a prick.

>>92563253
Reckoning is about a single supernaturally aided but barebones organisation comprised of 7 different approaches (and power sets) to the question “how do we deal with monsters?”
Vigil is about the clusterfuck you get when you’ve got groups of people from a couple of guys who get together every Friday for some beers and discussing what kind of aliens sent the monsters to a megacorp that cuts up said monsters and implants their parts into their operatives while making bank off their research & development, all go out monster hunting with vastly different preconceived notions on the nature of monsters and what to do with them

>>92564636
Liberty City, it means I don't have to do as much research or worry about players who are anal retentive about random trivia factoids they've remembered.

>>92564326
Never. If your player leans too heavily on his Allies, just have them make equal demands of him. That can be a good way to get stories going, and if every time he uses his Allies it costs him something dear to him, he'll think twice before bringing them in on a problem. Allies aren't slaves -- they are characters with their own plans. Run them accordingly.

Influence is pretty well defined with specific things it does at each level, so it shouldn't be an issue. If there is a level you think would cause problems, just say no if a player wants to buy it.

>>92564845
Where do you live?

>>92564636
Western USA (Rockies or west of that) is my preference. Familiar with the culture and can limit the influence of Elders/power level of my VTM games and can point to the lore for backup. Also I prefer Anarch games generally, though some players wig out or turn into That Guy if you don't give them some kind of bullshit gamified hierarchy to play in.

so how dead are cappadocians meant to look? the art seems all over the place

>>92565403
I put it to age, remaining humanity, and some luck. Where other kindred start looking more strung out or Haqimites get darker, Caps look more and more like those guys do in torpor.

>>92565261
Miami. I like cities but Miami sucks it's like the worst parts of every other city with skyhigh prices. Maybe I've just been here for too long.

>>92565403
depends on age

>This condition becomes more pronounced as the Necromancer ages, with the eldest Cappadocians appearing as mummified corpses.

this is from dav20, but every dark age corebook has says along these lines

I want to run a changeling game set in a highschool with all the stupid melodramatic highschool shit. The King & Queen of the courts are decided by Homecoming Queen/King, Prom Queen/King etc at school dances. But what should the thematic summer court event be?

>>92565579
>summer
Bro, forget summer, think about spring.

>>92559667
Harder to set up to utilize as a PC. It's a power in an NPC book for a reason.

>>92565609
Prom is in May

Question about movement in CofD
It says in your turn you cand move your speed and take an action. Does that mean it has be this wai (move > action > end turn) or you can break you movement (move > action > move > end turn) up to your total speed?

>>92565881
Anon, what he’s trying to say is that while Summer is the correct season for when prom happens, Spring is more appropriate for the ethos of prom (getting away from your worries about the True Fae by drinking and fucking and driving fast cars)

>>92565579
I mean, you could go the whole hog and dispense with the Seasonal Courts entirely and have some kind of "School Courts" instead. You could even get really cheesy with it - Popular Court, Nerd Court, Goth Court, etc, each reigning for a year and choosing who takes power at Prom.

>>92566185
My group does (move > action > move > end turn)

>>92566362
I was hoping for this 'cause it feels more dynamic and also makes super speed cooler

>>92566191
May is spring. Prom is spring. I need an event for Summer, I'm not moving prom to summer

>>92566461
Games/sports, specially the more violent ones.

>>92566185
Like 90% of fucking CofD and WoD rules, I'm not sure it's stated clearly anywhere. But Move>Act>Move is objectively superior and should be houseruled into most systems regardless.

>>92566754
The wording is "A character can move his Speed in a single turn and still take an instant action" which is kinda vague I think. The mounted combat merit seems to go agains the idea of, move attack move, but there have been inconsistencies about mechanics before, like the burst fire rules

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How do think a vampire magical material would work?

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>Add Buns to my game through a pet shop used as an animal blood farm deep in a city
>Owners are Cammies and players are Anarchs
>In Anarch fashion destroyed an important resource that helped everyone for no good reason
>Now there are 300+ rabbits on the loose
>Nosfratu turns them into his pets
>Spy rabbits everywhere
>Nosefratu starts wearing a bunny mask to over his face
>Gangrel wants to become a Bunpire by drinking a hord of rabbits (Dont know what to give him besides better jumping, speed, and agility at the cost of claws and strength)
>Tzimisce wants to turn them into a swarm of sharp tooth land piranhas
>Already THE BUN BALL TAKES SHAPE

All this from a side quest that was set to be a simple food store before going into the sewers for our next game

>>92564636
I'm running a game in the SF Bay Area. Lots of stuff to pick and choose from to work with here from the old SF by Night books, to Kindred The Embraced, to Vampire Oscar Wilde and his vampire club boat.
If I can give some advice, look at whatever geographic barriers exist like rivers or freeways and use those to deliniate rival territories. It'll make keeping track of what is where much easier on you.
Feel free to steal from whatever books you like, throw out what doesn't work (I have 0 Kuei Jinn in my chronicle because I dislike that splat), and use whatever local landmarks or folklore you think would be fun for an Elysium or as an errand for your coterie to investigate.

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>>92567075
>Nosferatu, Gangrel, Tzimisce.
Is your coterie just Monster Mash?

>>92567075
If the Gangrel manages to eat enough of those Nossiebuns within a single night then give a point of Animalism extra, because drinking 300 rabbits in a single night is a challenging feat

>>92565708
You really think so? I figured you use mesmerize to restrain them then you force away their memories

If I was to rewrite Mage the Ascension to how I think people would have perceived it would be when Magi for the Storyteller System was advertised in the back of VtM 1E.

It would be much more Hermatic and linked to Ars Magica. But no doubt they would have lots of traditions from elsewhere.
It would work much like Thaumaturgy, but spending Will or a mystic Quintessence of sorts to power spells.
The traditions had their mostly lost Hermetic Words and the Technocracy had their hideous mechanical Spheres.
Punk Magi combined the two to get the minimum requirements for their rote spells, risking Paradox for failure, spontaneous or obvious casting.

>>92567704
Yes
> A goblin, a feral matted dog and a snail man find camaraderie in killing and pillaging
The group came together after each getting masquerade breaches, and being sent to the same executioner
>>92567782
I'll do 100-150
Don't want it to be impossible

>>92563312
>>92563399
>>92563427
>>92563639
Thanks! Vigil it is. One of my players already likes Supernatural, so that helps.
Just gotta keep it balanced for 2 players for now, since that's all I'll have for a while.

>>92563966
You're a dumb grunt that's getting manipulated by an elder in your tribe. Take the mentor background and roleplay out slowly sussing out that you're just being used. Rage accordingly.

Anyone seen Abigail? It's extremely cheesy, with B movie performances, but all the vampire stuff is fun, and the effects have decent budget. The whole thing felt set up like a Hunter the Vigil game.

>>92568005
Holy fuck dude, stop doing this to everyone who engages your bullshit. You asked for an opinion, you got an opinion, you don't need to reply with an "oh? really? are you sure?" you fucking faggot

>>92567704
No, they're a Gargoyle in the making

Saw some people threads ago commenting on "Marcos Luna of Tremere Clan" as a OC someone tried to sneak in WW Wikia, but found nothing of him in any other website.

Did anyone find anything?

>>92569272
I wasn't even the original person who asked. I was just curious why it was less practical

>>92568519
>snail man
I'm interested

>>92563268
I know 2nd edition had them.

>>92570118
are non camarilla members protected by the montmartre pact? asking for a friend

>>92570818
>are non camarilla members protected by the montmartre pact? asking for a friend
In principle, yes
But if no one (in the Camarilla) is going to miss them, and the Gargoyle doesn't remember...

>>92570818
This >>92571200

Do it against Sabbat or particularly annoying Anarchs, and keep the Gargoyle hidden and the Prince won't mind, he'll probably thank you in secret.

The only issue is Nosferatu and Nosferatu Antitribu are remarkably tight, so you might piss off all the Nosferatu by doing this.

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>>92570251
Unfortunately, no one archived this contribution to the majesty of Clan Trenere.

>>92571230
>keep the Gargoyle hidden
But certainly you're only sheltering a free Gargoyle that had struggled to survive and abide the masquerade before arriving at your chantry steps. He can bodyguard you in public.

>>92568519
>A snail man
Please tell me the Tzimisce is not a fan of Junji Ito.

>>92571390
if the fucker is from a stv book do we at least know which one?

>>92571230
shit, nosferatu are sadly quite powerful in my city of residence and tzimisce are as far as i know non existent so i would have to use them for materials

>>92571390
Oh no... is that AI generated art too? You gotta be shitting me.

I mean I use AI art for NPCs and stuff in my games, but that's not something I'm putting up on the damn wiki. And it doesn't even look like it's in the WoD art style.

And are those fairy wings behind him what the fuck, I thought his ass was an Abomination not a fuckin' Maeghar.

>>92571612
>Please tell me the Tzimisce is not a fan of Junji Ito
Specifically Uzumaki

>>92571519
Depends on how likely the Gangrel and Nossies are to believe you, and if the Prince is fine with them being upset v.s. the benefits you'll offer him. Plus. if someone above the Prince figures out you broke the Montmartre Pact, everyone is in trouble.

>>92571617
See if you can't find an Antitribu that has pissed off the rest of the clan. They're rare but do happen. Failing that, you could try to make one of the largely forgotten Dark Ages Gargoyles that fell to the wayside. There was one kind of Gargoyle you could make with a single vampire of any clan, it was basically like a lobotomized vampire, so pick a physical oriented Clan like Brujah and go wild.

>>92571390
>abominations named fucking lord luna
>elf ears and fae wings
i take it clan trenere are maeghar, tremere, abominations

just needs to be a fomori too

>>92571698
>just needs to be a fomori too
That's what's Spirit Thaum is for.

>>92571617
From the talk history page, the 'author' claims its this one.
https://www.storytellersvault.com/product/272824/War-For-Sao-Paulo--Cainites-And-Other-Sinners

>>92563143
you can use it for the rest of the story but once it's over you lose access to it

>>92571390
My God this is even better than what I was imagining.

>>92571617
>STV book
This one is gonna be difficult to find out, then. We gotta lots of STV books in /stvdrop
Maybe I'll open one by one and ctrl+f Marcos Luna.

>>92571642
>>92571698
>inb4 Fianna Tremere Abomination with Kinain Merit

>>92570818
all vampires are part of the camarilla wether they like it or not

>>92571744
>war for são paulo
My God I have this book.
It's same book who has a Viking Get of Fenris Kinfolk Setite HAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHA
And I personaly know these people and the LARP event and community that originated this book. Let me get this book real quick!

>>92571775
shut up

>>92571744
just checked the book is in the stv mega, but luna is only used twice for lunatics and once for a garou theurge

>>92571678
>There was one kind of Gargoyle you could make with a single vampire
Simulacra. They're supposed to be spies but I think it's a spite move because they don't have the brains to pass for themselves when they're sent back to their packs and sires. Plus they're bullied by the rest of the Gargoyle pen.

>>92571789
Anarchs and Sabbat are just rebellious Camarilla

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>>92571775
>>92571827
stop right there, cammy scum!

>>92571744
How are you having access to the history page of a deleted article?

>>92571827
Its weird how hard the setting falls apart unless everyone behaves a certain way. I know that's mostly Exalted speaking louder than it should, but the hidden world has grown kind of stale.

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>>92571786
>>92571793
It is what the author claims. Checked for myself too. Not there, but there does seem some similarities to Zacimba Gaba, an earlier version perhaps?

>>92571941
https://whitewolf.fandom.com/wiki/Marcos_Luna_(Lord_Luna)

Click the 'search the related logs' link. On the bottom. Then by clicking the creator's name we can view the contributions history where one can see the specific posts.

>>92572023
so it's either only in the pr version or the guy lied to try and have his oc added to the wiki

How big of a deal is it for a high status vampire demand a low status vampire to teach them their disciplines?

>>92572329
big like lose all status level big because it goes against the entire boon based society of the camarilla

what the i assume to be a elder would actually try to do is either offer a boon for training and then secretly create a situation where the younger vampire would have to use it without it being much of a bother to him or do it the other way around and create a series of events that would leave the vampire with the discipline he wants to own him a major boon (and possibly be blood bond) and then use that boon for training

>>92572438
>big like lose all status level big because it goes against the entire boon based society of the camarilla
>boon
Oh yeah that was a thing, funny how forgettable those tend to be.

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>>92569074
I did watch it. Had some weird jumps like:
>YOU BITCH LITTLE GIRL WHO THE FUCK IS YOUR FATHER
>My papa is... *sniff* *sobs* Vladden Von Zackula
>AH SHIT WE ARE FUCKED!

But overall it was an incredibly fun vampire flick, in fact, I was watching it from a VtM perspective and just imagined from the beginning that it was all a hunt game for the girl. Then when that other dude got turned into a vampire and started beating the living shit out of everybody I basedfaced irl.

Also, it did remind me a bit of Near Dark for some reason.