>>93122951
Wake me up when we get an edition that isn't the dogshit of N4. N4 killed my local meta dead. Went from roughly 20 active players to 0 overnight.

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Reminder to ignore doom and bait posts.

Gonna try and make a scene happen locally. Currently I am working through assembling and painting Operation Crimson Stone, and I have some USAriadna stuff.

Those aside, any other recommended buys for some variety and ease of play? I don't mind owning chunks of multiple factions since it would be nice to just be able to reach into my bag and pull out an army for someone that wants to try. Already got one dude interested in Nomads.

>>93123445
Based bootlicker. Only positive and inclusive vibe, please, good sirs.

>>93123466
So you have
>Kosmo
>Corregidor
>USA
There's not a lot of variety there, though they're mostly good starter factions. I would pick a Heavy Infantry faction, maybe a Hacking faction, an alien faction, a shooting faction, and a melee faction. You can double up so you can probably get all of these with JSA plus OSS, or Svalarheima plus Onyx. O-12/Starmada always good as an all-rounder.

>>93123597
My plan was maybe to grab Yu-Jing for some bulky heavy armour stuff.

I actually do have the old icestorm forces from N3 lying around somewhere so that is a little PanO and more Nomads, though I don't think they're a sectorial.

From what you say it sounds like Yu-Jing, CA and O-12 may be good picks?

>>93123597
>>93123627
Forgot to add ideally I'd like to be able to just grab these as starter forces in Pack boxes, and ideally playable in CodeOne as a simplified intro to the game.

I do plan to graduate to N4 but probably not with someone who is essentially just demoing it.

>>93123627
Icestorm was the first two-player starter box from 2014, it still holds up great and the Nomad side is mostly more Corregidor. The PanO side is more complicated, though again I'd recommend Sval. The Fusiliers are in Sval, NCA, and Varuna, Orcs in this plus Acon. The Akali is only in Acon (which is OOP, not a great place to learn the game), the Father-Knight has been renamed to Knight of Justice to allow for female minis and is only in Sval and MO, and the Nisse is only in Sval. By going Sval you only have to discard/proxy the Akali. Sval is also the most modern PanO sectorial.

I personally think it's good to have a CA sectorial in there so there's an alien faction. Morats are the most up to date and simple to play, but Onyx is fine too. I'd lean towards sectorials for new players because it gives them a clear direction in which to collect, doesn't overwhelm them with hundreds of chaff/trap profiles, and gives them a distinct factional identity to get behind.

Yu Jing is difficult to play. White Banner is the most up to date, and as an added bonus if you have these guys AND Sval then you can also run White Company (NA2 army). It's good to have them in there since they're the archenemy, but if you're just looking for HI with a touch of melee then JSA or Morats might be better. Of course it's your collection, this is just my thoughts. O-12/Starmada never hurts.

>>93123636
I have no idea what goes on in CodeOne, it might be fine, personally I run intro games as follows:
>150pts, then graduating as competence allows
>prebuilt lists at first, then guide their construction
>prebuilt list (and your opposing list) have no complex rules or rare items like Wildparrots or Holomask), if you're taking Mimetism make sure he has MSV etc
>no Hacking
>no Fireteams
>no Command Tokens
>add Hacking or Fireteams as competence allows, in an order determined by their necessity to the faction (eg, Nomads would get Hacking first, JSA Fireteams first)

>>93123709
The latter is essentially what CodeOne is, generally smaller games with narrower list options. And many CO packs offer you a prebuilt list that averages 15 points or so (In CO they knock off a 0 on points).

For Yu-Jing I was just gonna go Invincible Army so a newer player can roll in with a bundle of mostly HI, O-12/Torchlight could also work. I'll probably pick up an alien force as well just so there's a wild card option.

Main goal really is just to have some variety options for low point beginner games. I got Ariadna so plenty of smoke and camo shenanigans already. Decent amount of nomads for some jack of all trades and some hacking focus.

All long term plans anyway, I'd like to get this stuff painted just to make it more appealing.

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>>93123739
Godspeed anon.

>>93123388
How? I assume it's bait, but just how?

>>93123766
Probably because he couldn't play his 50 people Highlander army anymore.

>>93123949
If his entire playgroup consistet of only people playing lists of 50 retards then that meta must have been a sight to behold. Imagine just putting a marut on suppressive or linking a kamau sniper

>>93123966
Imagine being able to do that with next to zero obstacles on the table without triggering 50 AROs all at once.

>>93123388
are you sure it was not Covid restrictions? The pandemic reduced community numbers in almost all tabletop games

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>>93123445

>He doesnt know about the shitfest that Warcrow is going to be and its consequences...

>>93124032
>covid excuse
>again
Corvus Belli. More like covided.com belly.

>>93124037
I have odd feeling as if whole Warcrow is being forced pet project of that girl showing promo videos about it. And I don't like game rules from what I see from said videos - everything sound forced, unnecessary complicated and the like. To compare with Infinity - sure, there are tons of abilities, skills and equipment that modify what you can and cannot do but in the end, it's still straightforward - spend order, do short skill + move skill, double move or full order which in most cases is just move + shoot, move + dodge, move+move, roll 20 side dices in normal or F2F, compare results, continue. Meanwhile Warcrow have its own dices, own symbols, triggers, morale, movement counting in some blocks (why not just use inches?), squads, etc, etc. I predict that lot of people will be confused as well.

>>93124222
It reminds me a lot of the Elder Scrolls wargame.

It was alright but juggling all these accessories and tokens and so on sucked.

>>93124222
>Warcrow is being forced pet project of that girl showing promo videos about it
Doubtful. She's new, so it's much more likely she was hired specifically to be the face of Warcrow.

>>93124149
N4 is shit. But launch timing was also horrid, in the apex of the global pandemic. Luckily, we'll get N5 next year

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Call me crazy but I think Infinity hasn't ever been in a healthier state about rules than with N4.

This game doesn't need a new edition, the game needs a huge profiles UPDATE.

Making Invincible become something more similar to Torchlight Brigade is not about rules is just adjusting their unit profiles.

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>>93124380
There is no need at all for another RuleBook with rules and the need to read rules again to notice a subtle tweak here or there...

CB just has to update the ARMY app and adjust profiles, that's it.

>>93124380
>>93124401
Agreed, the rules are nearly perfect. The last FAQ was ages ago because there are no outstanding issues. I keep hoping that they'll focus on bringing OOP factions (not incl Tohaa) back into production with simultaneous profile updates, that would get another bunch of factions sorted.

>>93124222
I don't mind special dice in a board game like Aristeia, where things are pretty limited. But just rubs me the wrong way in a wargame.

>>93124328
For people that thing N4 is shit, why do you think that?

I joined in N4, but have the pdfs of the older editions. There's some cool stuff there but it just seems a lot clunkier. Is it a core rules issue or more about the profiles that have been added to the game recently?

>>93124434
I genuinely think the best option for OOP is just to cycle sectorials every so often. A year or two with one, then swap it out for another.

That way even if something is OOP now, if we know it'll come later on that will actually do a lot to alleviate concerns of stuff being "gone forever".

>>93124524
NTA but I never heard criticism of N4 from N3 supporters different than "muh 15 troops limit". Spam lists were real problem and I'm honestly glad CB limited them, focusing on skirmish level this game is best for. The only problem is how they didn't properly updated sectorials that relied on larger than usual numbers but most of them are OOP anyway and thus pretty much abandoned. Another visible change is how HI and TAGs got their point costs lowered, sometimes greatly and thus make them actually viable - and which is another problem for somebody who focus on cheap masses of light infantry.

Only good thing from N3 are sclupts. Fuck, I would love to get my hands on N3 Regulars.

>>93124531
>just to cycle sectorials every so often.
When they first put FRRM OOP they claimed it was going to be cyclic and they'd be back after a while.

>>93124380
>This entire post
I could not agree more. The core rules are absolutely solid. the only issue with the game is the profiles or composition of SOME of the sectorial armies. not even all of them.

Torchlight Brigade is an overall solid looking army with no real "waste" in profile and it really put a spot on Military Orders and Invincible Army.

Hell, the flaws for a lot of the Sectorials are obvious and just need tweaking.

>>93124434
>I keep hoping that they'll focus on bringing OOP factions
this I can not get behind. I would like the older out of catalog armies to be just that and make different sectorials for Yu Jing, ALEPH, and Haqq. sometimes it is just better to leave the older armies as they are. I would LOVE for Aconcentimento to be rereleased. The Regulars are so good and unique but if they rereleased them, they might just change what makes the army charming. Same goes for Imperial Service. They already have a S5 HI and all the normal trimming for modern sectorials, the only issue is some of the profile need a little tweak here and there.

I think these changes to Imperial Service would move is from a bottom 4 army to middle of the pack and give the army new life:

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>>93124624

>Bao Troops
- UPDATE move from Light Infantry to Medium Infantry
- UPDATE add Forward Observer to Combi + Flash Pulse loadout
- UPDATE add Killer Hacker profile
*note:with ARM1 and BTS6, this is a true Medium Infantry and not a Light infantry profile
*note:Combi + Flash Pulse loadout is already paying for all the equipment and giving it Forward Observer adds a specialist option

>Celestial Guard
- NEW Engineer Profile (Boarding Shotgun;D-Charges)
- BALANCE remove restriction of Monitor needing to be in the same group as the Kuang Shi
*note: the sectorial will still only have access to Yudbots, so this engineer will still need to follow army philosophy and be up close to do things
*note:removing monitor requirement for Kuang Shi allows lists to be more flexible and can better balance Kuang Shi overall.

>Kuang Shi
- UPDATE reduce AVA from 8 to 4
*note: this allows the Celestial Guard Monitor restriction to no longer be needed and being capped at 15 order makes the AVA of 8 unnecessary

>Imperial Agents, Crane Rank (Xian He)
- UPDATE replace Spitfire, Nanopulser (+1B) loadouts with AP Spitfire, Nanopulser (+1B) weapons. no cost change
*note: this give allow the army to have anti-armor options and makes the Crane Rank a legitimate option against the Su-Jian

>Sun Tze (Heavy Infantry)
- UPDATE Boarding Shotgun loadouts gain TinBot: Firewall [-6] no points increase
*note: Sun Tze is one of the main characters for the sectorial and is completely outshined by the Hsien is all aspects except for defense. Adding the TinBot allows the be very aggressive and makes the first hacking attack against Sun Tze less of a threat and allows for better movement options when closer to the enemy

NEW PROFILE
>Artalis
*note: this give Imperial Service an NCO option to allow to greater list building. in addition, give the sectorial a mid-cost engineer and a doctor options.

>>93124380
yes. A HUGE profile update and another rules for fireteams and keywords and i will be happy

>>93124380
I think it feels really obvious when a profile is old or new. I would love if profile were a little less optimised or at least if the less optimised profiles didn't get punished in points cost quite so hard.

Like Khawarij are really cool and have interesting profiles, but they just aren't focused enough and pay through the nose for it compared to something really focused like Muhktars.

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>>93124760
I used to feel this way a lot untill earlier this year when I shifted to playing more 200 point games. that point ranges really opens up the opportuinity for "less optimized" profiles to shine. With OSSS, I would never take the Arjuna + Kiranbot. however, in a smaller game with less point, I take usually end up taking the Arjuna (either SMR or Boarding shot) + Kiranbot a lot. play some smaller games and you will be surprised at what profiles look good and which ones you end up playing.

>>93124799
That is a good point. I was playing some 150 pts recently (though someone here suggested 200 is the sweet spot).

And yeah sometimes you gotta get that specialist, or Lt or whatever in, and the usual pick at 300 pts just doesn't fit.

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>>93124836
yup. I find the 200 point games are the sweet spot for casual games. it makes creating a list really uncomfortable in a good way. picrel is a list I have taken while playing a 200 point game. Some of these profile I would NEVER take in a 300 point game but worked well in this point range

>>93124799
Agree with the 200pts games.
Haqqislam SHINES at that range.

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>>93125378
that game definitely plays the same but feels a lot different. it is good change of pace.

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>>93124624
>Torchlight Brigade is an overall solid looking army with no real "waste" in profile and it really put a spot on Military Orders and Invincible Army.

This shit and picrel makes me angry in a way words cannot describe.

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>>93122951
So what's the verdict on the return of the giant bugman? Anyone get decent use out of it? Way back during the Wotan campaign I got to try something similar with Geckos thanks to their Zero-G terrain skill and no one enjoys 3STR ARM6 to just show up in the midfield to blindside them.
Is the reinforcement version even worthwhile compared to the regular explosion drop version? Inb4
>Reinforcement
Humor me.

>>93129434
I tried hard but couldn't get it to work. The killer is the Combi Rifle. 16" range just isn't enough for a 70+pt S7 piece. You Combat Jump in and immediately get Hacked or shot at in ARO coz of your fat base and short range, or you fail your Combat Jump and have to walk in from the board edge which takes ages coz you still need to get within 16" and can't really fire back at AROs before then. In some matchups it would work but my meta has a strong focus on Hacking and is good with defence due to very good alpha strike proponents.

>>93129517
I get the logic of the combi. You are dropping right on top of dudes to get use out of the explosion. Getting out to 24" would have been perfect but anything worthwhile like a MK12/spitfire doesn't have a +3 within 8" which is where it theoretically is going to do most of its initial work when it shows up. I guess they could have given it an X-visor to negate the -3 range band but that would have probably added a ton of points to it. I remember in N3 the 360 visor added 20 points to Maggy while being negligible on something like an MI because equipment pricing scaled upwards.

Definitely a piece that wants the EVO drone to help drop and then fairy dust, because yeah, you are generally in hacker central.

>70+pt S7 piece
Did they adjust its cost after release?

>>93130131
I never aimed to use the explosion since it's so weak and has only a few inches of range. Far better to place your massive points sink well.

>>93130362
Fair, I had forgotten it was only DAM12 kek. I assume it ideally would work as a LI cheerleader mulcher of a link teams to crack their bonuses and then finish off the rest with its actual weapons.
They should have either added a +2DAM to the explosion and called it a day or given the stupid thing an AP redfury.

>>93130131
you cant give him +3 PH to land with the EVO, because its using a fixed value of 14

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bumping with the best S5 heavy infantry

>>93132346
That would be the Silverstar Prime.

>>93124037
I know, I just like to see things crash and burn.

>>93132451
Lol nope. For similar price MO have Sepulchre knight with vastly superior equipment and skills.

>>93132346
Agreed.

>>93132346
i hope the new JSA mechazoid tag thing will be something like that

>>93134078
>i hope the new JSA mechazoid tag thing will be something like that
what?

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>>93133424
>>93132346
I own and play with both these and I will agree with the Speulchre is better but ONLY because of the Sepulchre AP HMG NCO profile. While the Su Jian's two loadouts are actually usable when you do the head-to-head comparison

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>>93134208
let's discuss this. what are the top 3 and bottom 3 S5 profiles?

>>93134181
There is a new JSA model coming soon.

>>93134308
Yan Huo definitely deserve high rank solely because it's no fuss, pure firepower platform.

>>93134308
Su Jian
Sepulchre
Prime
Azrail
Yan Huo
Kaitok
Boyg
Kiel-Saan
Al Fasid

I don't know if I've even seen the others. It's hard to rank though, the Kaitok Feuerbach is one of the best active AND reactive pieces in the game when linked for example.

>>93134181
https://moe-games.com/mechazoid-sokorentai/

>>93134078
the price is the same than the Tikbalang, so probably not

>>93134308
looking at this just makes me more upset at how shit Invincible Army is.

I think this is the first time I have EVER seen the Haetae profile. Can you just shot the Heavy Rocket Launcher normally or can it only be used as a guided attack?

>>93134374
It can be used both ways.

>>93134419
bayum. 37 points for a ARM5 BTS6 BS14 HRL that can be used for a guided attack if needed is a bargain.

>>93134374
Is it one of the Reinforcements profiles?

>>93134374
It's a Reinforcement unit, Korean.

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>>93134516
>>93134504
it seems it is usable in White Banner as a non-reinforcement with the rest of the Daebak units

>>93134482
Yeah, I'm not a WB player, but from the outside looking in it seems pretty great. Let's you threaten guided attacks while not using a troop slot on a purely guided unit. Okay, it's not firing proper missiles, but HRL hits aren't anything to underestimate either.

>>93130610
Lol seriously?
Do you have a page in the rulebook for that? My small group has been playing wrong for awhile then.
[Attribute]=N is such a rarity. Mono has an ARM=0 against its 12DAM. Would this fall under the same idea? Or are we fucking up with that too and not supposed to add the MA DAM modifier on top of it?

>>93135045
>Or are we fucking up with that too and not supposed to add the MA DAM modifier on top of it?
CB are retards.
The full rule says
"Damage MOD: A MOD to the PH Attribute of the user to determine the Damage of a successful CC Attack."
Mono doesn't use your PH to determine damage. It's fixed at 12. But in the app it just says DAM +x

>>93134308
>Taskmasters are so stealthy they don't even show up on lists of all S5

>>93135191
>Shinobu is more dangerous with a butter knife than a lightsaber if your ARM is less than 3
I don't think I like it but I get it. Thanks. So this isn't really comparable to the PH=14 of Caskuda then. Right?

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Warcroow preorder up on Warsenal. They have also said they'll make terrain sets for WC in addition to Infinity.

>>93135322
Ha, my bad, I will update it when I get back home

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>>93135454
I like the big titty plague doctor but the negro niflgaardians do nothing for me. They're competent sculpts but it just doesn't click. CB really should have tapped back into the artists that leaned into anime. Record of Lodoss and Dunbine could have been great wells to draw from for stylistic inspiration.

>>93135460
Same with these. Yeah, okay, WoW/40k orks. Whatever.

>>93135553
My Space Umbrella Corp clean up men are hugely underrated. The haris with two crack heads is really fun and versatile.
I still can't find a reason to use the HMG though.

>>93135592
>Record of Lodoss
Oh shit. Haven't thought of that in a while. Good taste

Tell me more about the Taskmaster. I don't have a Bakunin player in my group and I like the look of the model

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>>93135667
Cons right off the bat: no mim or MSV, not a F2F fire superiority unit.
He's a swiss army knife and has that generalist points cost. Back in N3 he was solidly a defensive Lt option with the koalas and ARM5. N4 you can go giga nigga aggressive. Koalas are no longer just ARO mines with legs, you can actively use them; a slightly different flavor of mine fork to give your opponent usually.
The weapons across all of the profiles lean heavily towards clearing the usual midfield units so no real HI/TAG solutions, basically bully everything smaller than yourself.
Decent at fisticuffs at 21CC and MA1 with a DA machete, like a MO knight really; good vs non-CC units and making other CC units second guess at attempting engagement.
>Stealth
Stealth is one of the biggest selling points because of how hacking heavy N4 has shifted the overall meta.and he wants to be in the midfield to murder squishies. He does not give a shit about your repeater net. If you want to spend orders on hacking him he has BTS6 and the redfury profile has a tinbot. Good luck, I hope you're a mirror match or one of the synthetic great satans because you're playing hacking against Nomads.
>Haris option in Bakunin
This morphs the TMs playstyle a bit. He has stealth while Morlocks do not which means your fleshy koalas will trigger way more flak(might be a good thing and what you're aiming for). However you get B+1, smoke, more CC competence and fun metachemistry! You can play this like a slower Uberfall which shores up the TM's lack of BS MODs; just knife the ODD bugger with your shanghaied drug addled deputies under the cover of smoke grenades.
Biggest con's you're going to run across are that he has to compete with Riot Grrls and doesn't really have a way to deal with high ARM. But again, the haris shores that up a bit where the Morlocks can fill in. Seriously, EM CC is disgusting.
IMO N4 really benefited the Taskmaster. Instead of a turtle you have a dynamite black-ops sheriff.

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>>93136087
>Too many characters for a 4chin post
The TM is a unit that requires context. Just looking at him he's not really all that impressive outside the koala gear and stealth. He's no Swiss Guard or Oniwaban.
When viewed in Bakunin you can see he has nearly a tool to kill every power piece he has to compete with during list creation.
I like the Taskmasters, they're a flavorful and fun unit to field.

>>93135045
yes, MONO works that way. Or Martial arts+D-Charges.

I cant find RN if Combat jump with fixed values works the same way, but i suppose it makes sense? IDK bro

>>93135454
>>93135460
I like the sculpts but I can't stand the paintjobs, sure it's miles better than anything I can do but I find it stylistically ugly.

>>93135045
Yes, you can add the hacker mod to the roll, because is still a PH roll, you only substitute your PH value in your statline for another.

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>>93135460
These look great, but they're also blatantly Warcraft

>>93136720
In these oarts we call them "references", bigot!

>>93135460
Sex with the hag

why did they never make any extra USARF devildog models? The americans in general seem to be the most anti wolf compared to everyone else on dawn

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>>93136087
>>93136180
thanks for the insight on the Taskmaster. I always liked the model but never liked Bakunin. pleety cool. updated S5 image

>>93136851
they are also any Camo when you look at them. just tough fucking dudes with Continuous Damage weapons

>>93132346
>Literally the only good yj profile
HI faction my ass.

>>93136794
Freak

>>93137771
Yeah, bet she's a real freak in the bed

>>93135454
Whenever someone posts these it just makes me ask "who are these for?". Do they really think there's some large group of people out there just waiting for another fantasy skirmish game who will only accept one with the ugly and tasteless Dragon Age aesthetic?

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>>93135454

>>93137466
The image is missing Gamma for O12 and Daiyokai dengekitai for NA2 JSA.

>>93135454
>>93135460
They're really trying to be the next GW, considering how derivative these are.

>>93139993
>I want to play the orc faction, but I don't like orcs.
Why are people like this?

>>93141169
But the whole point is that Orcs AREN'T in the Varank faction.

>>93135454
>>93135460
All siocast btw. I expect them to look all horrible in reality.

I just picked up the ITS 15 pack with the plastic Aggy and Lasiq. Wow that Unicool plastic stuff is actually really nice. Can CB please change over to that instead of siocast?

>>93141514
That's unfortunate. If they were metal I'd maybe consider buying the plague doctor girl off ebay or when the box inevitably gets clearance'd by stores.

>>93141620
are you willing to another price increase? Unicool is not cheap

Top 10 at Salt Lake Showdown

Varuna
Dashat
Tohaa
Onyx
OSS
Varuna
Qapu
Onyx
OSS
Bakunin

Missions were: Supremacy
Capture and Protect
Biotechvore
Firefight
ResOps

>>93142045
Wasn't actually that big a tournament, only 42 players. The 6th place Varuna lists were odd, one was a 5-man Orc core (incl Patsy), the other was Maximus and Bipandra. The top Onyx player took a Sphinx list. Dahshat list was standard, must have just played well. No idea about how QK got there.

>>93142058

42 is big. I saw Satellite tournaments with less players

>>93142074
We had an inaugural tournament in the middle of nowhere in Australia with that many players just two weeks ago. I suppose seeings as apparently that's a pretty sizable tournament I'll post the top factions:
>Combined Army
>Kosmoflot
>OSS
>Combined Army
>Bakunin
>Bakunin
>TAK
>OSS
>Torchlight
>Steel Phalanx
>Torchlight
I played a few of these guys. Their lists were fairly predictable, top CA ran a Raicho, top OSS ran an Asura and no TAG.

Missions were
>Power Pack
>Acquisition
>Evacuation
>Frontline
>Supplies

>>93142033
Is it though?
Eldfall uses Unicool and doesn't seem any more expensive per mini than Infinity.

It seems like a great material though. Combines all the good points of metal and plastic into one. Few gates per piece, few pieces per model, sands well.

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>>93142152
you cant really compare sculpt quality...

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>>93142200
Weird, that is an Eldfall mini but the ones I saw were more like this.

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Built the Unicool Aggy (sans hammer for now) and Lasiq. Pretty happy with the material.

>>93142760
Looks pretty good.

>>93142760
Those look nice but I honestly can not fucking stand the look of Agamemnon. it looks like a skinny girl with Lymphedema in the legs.

>>93142823
Yeah I don't actually like Aggy's design much, but at least on the technical level the mini looks fine.

>>93136720
I wish they licensed Warcraft instead of using their own (generic) setting.

>>93141688
If they cant make a tag without fails .just imagine 16 figures + the 6 from the pack , expect a lot of siocrap

>>93145372
small figures could be less prone to miscasts. We'll see

How good are CB when it comes to replacing missing parts?

>>93146992
Extremely good, they send a replacement often within a few minutes of email receipt with no questions asked usually.

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>>93140915
Thanks anon

I want to talk about eh Boyg. what is it supposed to be? the original model is the Missile Launcher, and it has +1B but that profile has a massive gap between 8-16 inches.

This makes it look like the MK12 loadout is better. It covers all bands up to 24 inches, Has Dodge +3 and +1" to cover the gap over 24 inches, with ECM:Hacker -3. is this the better of the two loadouts?

tl;dr what the fuck is the Boyg's role?

>>93147780
IMO the ML is unusable, the range bands and +1B mean that he's a DZ active gun like a TAG but since you have to dedicate an expensive fireteam to get him to 4B it's hard to justify.

The Mk12 is great, you get 5B in a link and it's also the most sturdy non-TAG piece in Sval. It's basically a 1 less damage HRMC in active, attached to an S5 light TAG (and gets 2B in reactive which is better than a TAG), and it can drag around Specialists incl very good Engineers/Paramedics (Blade/Karhu) in a link to keep him standing and do objectives.

The reason you don't see him is because there are better options for much cheaper in Sval. Hawkins gets the same range bands but access to AP/DA, and also comes with extremely good melee, is a Specialist himself, just as sturdy (though no ECM Hacker he has Stealth) and is 11pts cheaper.

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>>93147826
Oh, so the +1B does make the reaction shot B2? I thought that was only for the active as I was under the assumption only the fireteam bonus works in ARO.

> Hawkins gets the same range bands but access to AP/DA, and also comes with extremely good melee, is a Specialist himself, just as sturdy (though no ECM Hacker he has Stealth) and is 11pts cheaper.

Huh, I never thought of him. that makes me sad, I like the look of the Boyg. I also wish they made the MK12 model too.

>>93147944
>Oh, so the +1B does make the reaction shot B2? I thought that was only for the active as I was under the assumption only the fireteam bonus works in ARO.
Your understanding is correct, I was referring to the fireteam bonus (though there are a few TAGs which can form a Haris, they are scarcely any heavier than the Boyg).

>Huh, I never thought of him.
Most people overlook him for some reason, maybe because he's in a MO pack and it's a shitty pack at that. I personally always take him in Sval because there is a lack of weapons for the 24" rangeband and, like I said, he's better than the Boyg.

>I also wish they made the MK12 model too.
Me too. He is truly Svalarheiman looking and actually embodies the look of Heavy Infantry. I duno, maybe other people have different opinions, I do sometimes see the Mk12 taken but I just can't personally justify it.

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>>93147970
you seem to know your stuff about Svalarheima. Since I have you, is picrel the best list for just the action pack? I have the action pack and Liang Kai. I could use my remotes from my yu jing army to proxy the remotes.

>>93148084
I'm no Sval veteran but I've played a few games and know it, NCA, and Varuna pretty well. I'd take the KHD Nokken for a marker state, you have 5pts spare anyway. I'd also take the Orc HMG (and a Fusilier Hacker since you have so many remotes, or at least a Paramedic for a Specialist) because you don't have any guns greater than 24" range and as a PanO faction you need to leverage big guns with high BS to clear a way to advance up the table (since you don't have smoke or camo). You probably also want the Varg to be a FO since you don't have any Specialists other than the Hackable KoJ, fragile Nokk, and basically useless Infirmarer.

Generally, I'm not really sure how to use the action pack. I'd never take the Boyg outside of a Haris but the only Action Pack legal Boyg Haris has the Knight of Justice and Infirmarer which is just garbage. I don't like Nokken or Locusts much as expensive forward dep/infiltrating non-Camo models. Varg are severely overcosted too. You'd never take an Infirmarer in a real game, they're a 25pt Combi Rifle WIP13 Doctor (compare to, say, 15pt Ghulam WIp14 Doctor+3 with a template weapon). Some people take Orcs but IMO they're also overcosted and don't do anything better than the Boyg/Hawkins/Hospitallers/KoJs. Really, from the action pack, I don't use anything in Sval except the Fusiliers, occasionally the Knight of Justice (again, hard to justify compared to Hawkins, and Nokken in meme camo lists with Uma. Sorry I can't be much more help.

>>93142058
Top Onyx was Azoka I don't think he was running Sphinx. One of Honumon's lists did though.

>>93147053
>with no questions asked usually
And no confirmation, you never know if they got the email but an envelope with the missing bits arrives 9 days later.

Kind of hard to keep playing Infinity with the knowledge in the back of my head that big profile update/rebalance is doomed to always remain hypothetical, doubly so now that they will busy themselves with warcrow. Like, maybe if it's successful enough to at least partially sustain them they could abandon fotm-based balancing of Infinity as of date, maybe then things could improve? But that's two big ifs.

>>93147053
Does it matter that I got the stuff from my local store rather than their webstore?

>>93151989
Warcrow is handled by a different team, they hired a bunch of people just to run it.

>>93152010
No, as long as you have the product codes (and often even if you don't) they'll send you a replacement.

>>93151989
I would find it hard to keep playing Infinity if the made more than minor, occasional tweaks. A faction rework and FAQ once a year is plenty for me. If i wanted annual changes in design philosophy and weekly balance patches I'd play a video game.

>>93152321
The hired people were only lore writers. The rest are the Incompetent Team. They said they were 13 years developing this game. Biggest lie ever. 5 years, max. Rules are weak and less than a year before launch, they did demos with WIP rules. I talked to some testers at a certain event and they said the rules the team were using to demo the game at that event were at least 2 versions outdated.

And you pretend to launch a totally new competitive wargame with only 2 factions? (3 if you bought the PVE kickstarter, with already year and a half of delay in delivery) BULLSHIT

>>93156101
I assume they're going to add a third faction box within a couple of months of the starter. Infinity only had PanO, Yu Jing, and Ariadna for like 4 months at the start.

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>>93156294
>Infinity only had PanO, Yu Jing, and Ariadna for like 4 months at the start.
dems waz da dayz

>>93155381
>If i wanted annual changes in design philosophy and weekly balance patches I'd play a video game.
This. Quarterly updates should stay in 40k and Killteam, I don't want them in my comfy game about space ninjas.

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>>93151989
>Kind of hard to keep playing Infinity with the knowledge in the back of my head that big profile update/rebalance is doomed to always remain hypothetical, doubly so now that they will busy themselves with warcrow. Like, maybe if it's successful enough to at least partially sustain them they could abandon fotm-based balancing of Infinity as of date, maybe then things could improve? But that's two big ifs.

>How quickly they forget

This game was killed, and the fucking errata every three months were stopped and people started actually playing the game again at my local store more than when they were "Balancing" the game.

just leave it like this >>93155381

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Just got into the game and it's my first time working on metal miniatures, it gets easier right? right?

>>93156671
yeah, it does.

>>93156671
I've never found them any harder than plastic really. IMO it's all upsides except you have to use super glue instead of plastic glue.

>>93156709
I'm assembling a kuroshi rider at the moment and this bike is a nightmare to get to fit propperly and I can see theres going to be a lot of milliput in my future.

>>93156732
Oh yeah that's another downside of metal, that longer pieces bend rather than snap. My Kuroshi Rider's scythe is jagged as fuck. In terms of construction though, I never really had any problems, but I've been working with it for a while so I'm pretty used to it. If pieces don't fit perfectly it's usually just a little notch you need to scrape away.

>>93156101
>And you pretend to launch a totally new competitive wargame with only 2 factions?
Are you actually retarded?

>>93156709
My problem with metal figures is that you need a seperate primer for them, you can use more agressive ones but "weaker" primers don't stick like on plastic.

>>93160012
No idea what you're on about, I use Vallejo spray primer on both materials and it works perfectly every time.

>>93130131
>but anything worthwhile like a MK12/spitfire doesn't have a +3 within 8" which is where it theoretically is going to do most of its initial work
That thing has double Chain Rifle, which covers more than 8".

>>93159642
please elaborate

>>93156101
>competetive wargame

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>>93156101
The people behidn Warcrow is the people behind Aristeia & Defiance.
The people behind N4 is the peoole who made Code One & TagRaid.

Gutier Lusquinos, is the actual Infinity mastermind adn he has nothing to do with warcrow.

>>93160549
who talked about Gutier?

I know the A! team is behind warcrow. I still name them Incompetent team.

I was extremely dissapointed with Defiance. I bought it for the game, not the figures. Not a single mission without erratas.

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>>93160662
>"who talked about Gutier?"
>"I still name them Incompetent team."

It is difficult to communicate with you, Anon. Are you ok? Is ther any med you need? Can we help you?

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>>93160549
Alberto Abal did do rules work on N1/N2 Infinity as well as all the non-TR board games (not sure about REM Racers as I don't own that one).
Other trivia: Bostria did some game design work in Campaign: Paradiso, and the Uprising/Third Offensive/Daedalus' Fall trilogy's mechanics were done by Gutier alone, which may explain a great many things.

Some uncharitable persons may say they need to get Dave Rosillo back, since he was involved in both core N3 and (at least core) Aristeia.

>>93160739
How should CB fix Yadu? Their models are far to good to be sidelined like this.
I'm thinking trade in Number 2 and Veteran for a cost reduction?

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>>93161332
>How should CB fix Yadu? Their models are far to good to be sidelined like this.

In OSS you use them in an Asura Haris or play 200-point games and they really shine. or think of them as Unhackable HI and run them as solo pieces. all the profiles are useful. People are too hung up on using them as a Core, but you don't see many 5-man HI core fireteams running around.

>I'm thinking trade in Number 2 and Veteran for a cost reduction?
>This opinion
Literally removing some of the best parts of the unit for use in OSSS.

i consider starting infinity as a friend of mine did and i want to play with him. However i really do not like generic human models, i tend to avoid them in other settings when possible.
Is there any faction that uses mostly few big modesl?
i read taht knightly orders and morat are more elite but the former still focussing on human infantry?

>>93160847
Saved, thanks anon.

>>93164507
If you dislike humans there are only a few factions. I would not recommend Tohaa or Spiral Corps since these are out of production and the mechanics are ridiculous. This leaves only the Combined Army and it's sectorials. Morats is the Heavy Infantry one so it's models are the largest. Shasvastii is the subterfuge one so they're the leanest. Onyx has a nice mix.

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>>93164507
>i really do not like generic human models, i tend to avoid them in other settings when possible.
>i read taht knightly orders and morat are more elite but the former still focussing on human infantry?

You have only two Choices. Morat Aggression Force or Onyx Contact Force

Morat are tough dudes with a District 9 aesthetic
Onyx are Robots and an assortment of Aliens and TAGs (Big Aliens/Robots)

I personally like the Onyx look and feel, even knowing that Morats are a WAY better army

>>93161750
>Literally removing some of the best parts of the unit for use in OSSS.
How often do you find the veteran useful? I mean they are MI so they already can't be hacked. And with the Shukra I find LoL is not really a problem. Unless you are running into a lot of Jammers or EMarat corner guards.

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>The Military Orders best units all have names that begin with the letter "T"

>>93164689
>>93165329
thanks for the input, currently checking out Morat.
I really dig the TAG of the Tunguska too, however its usually not smart to pick a faction based on one model you like.
I also consider just going with plain PanO and focus on TAGs and heavy infantry, assuming thats legal and neither completely useless nor rude cheese.
Are TAGs, no matter how many a faction offers, only ever periphal/ one ore two models in your army at best? Or is it viable to make them the focus of ones army?

>>93166839
Svalarheima and Military Orders are the PanO HI factions. Apart from Morats, the other HI factions are most of Yu Jing particularly Invincible Army, JSA, and Torchlight. You can also make an argument maybe for Tunguska and Steel Phalanx, especially if you're more focused on model heaviness rather than actual in-game classification. Steel Phalanx and Morats are very strong, Sval, MO and IA are weak, and JSA and TLB are middling, though TLB is new and it's still hard to tell, and with Infinity the player matters way more than the faction.

>Are TAGs, no matter how many a faction offers, only ever periphal/ one ore two models in your army at best? Or is it viable to make them the focus of ones army?
If you have a TAG it's usually the focus of your army, especially if it's a main battle TAG (S7, ARM 7+, AP or MULTI HMG or HRMC, 65+pts usually) because you've invested so much in it that you have to build the rest of your list around it (Engineers to repair it, Hackers to repossess it, warbands to protect it, etc), but it's pretty much impossible to have more than 1 MBT in a non-meme list, though you occasionally see 2-Jotun or 2-Maghariba lists run for lolz. Lighter TAGs are cheaper and require less of a bespoke gameplan and list, and sometimes you see two run reasonably well, but it's rarely seen at the top end. S5 HI are pretty closer to being lighter TAGs in some factions and this still applies, you rarely see more than 1 S5+ model in a top tier list for most factions.

>>93166839
If you want more info on the armies and profiles, you can read up on them here
>https://human-sphere.com/Main_Factions

>>93167316
>Sval, MO and IA are weak

Harder to play but not weak. Experienced players on tournaments prove your point wrong.

>>93168964
>the player matters way more than the faction
Literally in the same sentence. Also, find me a major tournament (40+ players at least) where IA won.

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>>93168964
It's always the army, never the player.

Yeah rrriiiiiight,....

>>93169065
IA iDK, but torchlight did, and its basically the same army.

If USA players upload the list to the OTM, it will be far easier to check...

>>93170137
Lol Torchlight and IA are not the same army at all.

>>93170176
yeah, correct, Torchlight is what IA should been

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>just pick up army bas d on what you think looks cool!
>picked up PanO
>everyone keep telling you it's shit
>half of local players are either using CA or Ariadna

At least painting is fun. No point in trying to play.

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>>93169532
skill issue
https://www.goonhammer.com/secure-the-high-value-players-interviews-with-the-top-five-players-from-the-australian-infinity-nationals-2023/

trying to compile the top lists for this year but having difficulties getting the list infomation. However, I can confim Vanilla Yu Jing took 2nd place

>>93170323
>half of local players are either using CA or Ariadna
>still haven't figured out how to tech against an army when "half" the players use the same two armies

>>93170351
I don't know how to "tech" or what it means when I only played two demo games (O-12 vs Shasvasti operation pack, played as O-12) and one "real" 150p (PanO vs CA, vanilla). All lost, by the way.

>>93170323
PanO is fine. They do get dunked on a bit for being the "default blue" army. And for having WIP 12 everywhere.

The main problem with PanO is sometimes their gameplan can boil down to apply gun. And if that doesn't work, apply more gun. And if that doesn't work, you lose.

If you're a new player playing against even vaguely experienced players (like players with more than 10 games under their belt), and they don't pull their punches you're going to get wrecked. Also you only played 2 games. If the other players will tell you how they beat you it will help you get better a lot faster. But for me a game where experienced players can consistently wreck new players is a good thing.

>>93170608
Tfw I picked up panO and YJ based on rule of cool, and then found out they play pretty much the same, but YJ is generally slightly better at melee and wip and shoots worse. And then you realize nomads are better than everyone at everything

>>93170323
>No point in trying to play.
Unfortunately true. I'm a bit better off in my local scene because it's mostly people who get to play once every week or two, but all discussion I see online (outside of here) is competitive scene bullshit.
>LOOK AT MY ARIADNA LIST AND RATE IT (UKR Haris w/Varangian Guard or Volkolaks, 2bears, Uxia, etc) x9999

Fluff question.

I thought the basic premise of the game was that ALEPH controlled, or tried to, the other factions so they could only do ninja spec ops small scale operations to fight shadow wars, and that's what the skirmish game represents. But now i started reading Uprising and there's hundreds of thousands of soldiers per side on every front, multiple divisions get deployed and regiments annihilated. And on top of that, ALEPH doesn't do shit, PanO leads the international reaction and the others help, and YJ openly fights with several of them as well.

>>93170918
Aleph tries to coordinate a united human front against the alien invasion. So she tries to foster collaboration and avoid outright confrontation, while factions try to fuck one another. It's not a direct control although Aleph does basically sustain a lot of the Human Sphere commercial/economic infrastructure and movement across the various systems.

To draw a parallel with our world:
>the normal situation is like our current world or late Cold War. Aleph is basically the UN, trying to coordinate all the various nations against Covid/climate change, with varying degrees of success
>Uprising is basically the Ukrainian war, with one faction involved directly and the others either supporting Ukraine/Japan (enemy of my enemy...) or helping Russia/Yu Jing. In this context PanO is the US/EU
In general Uprising-level conflicts are pretty rare, just like in our world.

>>93171036
>>93170918
Iirc PanO does not directly go to war with Yu Jing during Uprising, but they provide weapons and a blockade/closed air space.

>>93171036
That makes more sense, even if that still puts the supposedly full scale invasion of the CA at odds with the scale of the usual engagements, but that's still fluff I have to read about. CA was bottlenecked but by what I gathered they finally smashed through later. All in all I'm liking the way fluff is told, lots of scenario ideas and hints for games or RPG sessions.
>>93171047
The Iron Wall was supposed to be just a blocade but there was an instance where air superiority fighters from YJ and PanO clashed. Plus the usual "neutral" factions butting in to stir shit up.

As a whole how "yourdudes" friendly is Infinity
Do you prefer to stick to the studio schemes when painting your models or just do your own thing?

>>93171118
>hints for games or RPG sessions.
Makes sense given that Infinity was originally just the homebrew RPG of one of the CB guys.

>>93171137
So it started as an RPG? I didn't know that, I thought they had the wargame first and then make the RPG later. That explains the sheer amount of fluff in the RPG books and stuff like the Dire Foes boxes.
>>93171133
Talking of Uprising, there's several schemes suggested for the JSA, so I think there's some leeway at least.

>>93171133
Do your own thing. It's a smaller universe than say Btech or 40k so I guess in that sense there's less room for "your guys", but no-one will care. IIRC almost everyone in Infinity has some degree of mimetic (though not strong enough to count in the rules) uniform anyway, so you can justify almost any colour scheme you want.

>>93171118
>even if that still puts the supposedly full scale invasion of the CA at odds with the scale of the usual engagements
The CA invasion even if bottlenecked is still very much higher in intensity compared to the usual inter-human conflicts. It's pretty much the exception.

>>93171156
>So it started as an RPG?
It started as a homebrew pen-and-paper RPG between a few Spanish guys, then became a wargame, and then also a proper RPG with rulebooks and everything.

>>93171214
That's pretty awesome in a way.

>>93170561
>Lose two matches of a game you've never played before.
>"Grah my faction sucks there's no reason to ever try again."
Bro are you okay? That's a really short timeframe to just completely drop a game. And it's a competitive game too; I'd be really surprised if you pulled a win out of your ass the first time your hands touched the dice.

>>93171118
>that still puts the supposedly full scale invasion of the CA at odds with the scale of the usual engagements
Yeah and people were PISSED that the lore revolved around ever-increasing CA incursions into the human sphere in their deniable ops cyberpunk skirmish game for so many years. There was a lot of griping about CB losing their grip on the tone of Infinity as more and more things focused on big open battles.

Thankfully they've calmed things back down with the latest lore update, so it's back to a cold war between bickering factions, wearing a friendly face in public dealings while sending hit squads to delete a rival's R&D outpost or bury a spy.

>>93170918
>>93171036
You guys are confusing ALEPH and O-12. O-12 is the Space UN who do all the people-wrangling, ALEPH is the AI that keeps the network running, hunts AI, has fits about the EI, and tries to sneak spook ops past its O-12 handlers.

>>93173596
I just said I don't know what this "tech" means because my experience with actual gameplay is very limited. And I'm being told that faction I picked is shit and will always lose.

>>93174040
One would think that it would be easy for ALEPH to just blackmail anyone that doesn't behave with the threat of cutting them off the grid. That can't be a punch you can easily roll with for anyone not a Nomad.

>>93170918
Your statements aren't mutually exclusive. When we play, we are recreating the ninja spec ops. That doesn't mean that no larger conflicts ever break out in the wider setting. Maybe if Infinity goes on long enough and gets big enough we'll get our own 6mm game for the Uprising, a Horus Heresy game for the NeoColonial Wars, and a space game for the Acheron Blockade. Oh wait...

>>93174096
Take one list with an Aquila and no Hacking for Ariadna, for example, since the Aquila can auto discover Camo and you can't Hack almost any Ariadna pieces since they're too low tech.

>>93174096
I'm not the Anon who accused you of lacking "tech." I don't know exactly what he means by that either, beyond some vague "lmao git gud" sentiment. I'm saying that declaring that you'll never bother playing Infinity again after your second game is really strange. Like, did you honestly expect that you'll trounce experienced players right out of the gate?

And /tg/ should never be trusted on faction powerscaling. According to this general Nomads are unkillable godkings, which is something that has never been reflected in any tournament results (and, anecdotally, isn't true in my local scene either).

>>93174040
O-12 is an appendance of Aleph.

>>93174869
Autodiscover is great, but i can easely gun down your Aquila by brute force, but if you use a Swiss Guard, i'm fucked

>>93175422
No is not. O-12 created Aleph

Okay, so vs Ariadna there is no point in bringing hacking to the table for obvious reasons while having good anti-camo option is required but what about playing vs CA? Shasvasti is similar camp heavy.

>>93178432
Last tournie I ran a no hacking list and used for both Shas and Ariadna. Shas is garbage though, hardly worth a tech, and they have a lot of mim so arguably spotlight is useful. Also hacking isn't totally useless if you bring a GML. CA vanilla and other sectorials is very different, some very good hackers there.

I noticed that one of my country shops still have PanO N1/N2 and MO old (with magister knight) starter packs. Are these worth getting?

>>93178867
Eh they are quite old and a bit out of scale now... unless you don't mind that or really like the minis I wouldn't buy them but that's just me.

>>93170323
As everywhere online there are a lot of memes about PanO being useless, primarily because their specialsts have WIP12 (-1 compared to basically everyone else), but they are the absolute peak of gunfighting in the entire game (+1 BS compared to similar profiles in other armies).

Many players have been on the receiving end of Core linked Fusilier ML ARO, Haris linked Karhu Feuerbach (8 Saves with AP kthxbye), or any of their plentiful and strong TAGs.

Enjoy painting, play some games to learn how the game works, and always ask your opponents for feedback. Most people will be happy to do a debriefing and tell you stuff you might have missed, or could have done better.

Do you play Vanilla or a sectorial? What models do you have? Which model is your favorite? We can try to help you build a list.

>>93175213
In fairness, Nomads did win Interplanetario and there are several high-profile players that primarily run either vNomads or Bakunin. Nomads are a really good faction with a lot of tools and silver bullets, but they can be unpicked, if you know which parts are weak.
They are just less straightforward than Unga Bunga Monkeys

>>93174096
Not that Anon, but "tech" usually means adapting your list and play to be strong against the opponent(s) and challenges you expect to face.
For example:
vs Ariadna: What do you do against a Bearpode with Immunity(Total)?
vs PanO: How will you break a TAG (do you have high burst AP weapons, hacking or E/M ccws?)
vs YuJing: Do you have some midfield defense to hold off a SuJian running into your DZ? Maybe some repeaters and hackers?
vs Aleph: What do you do vs Mimetism(-6) models like Phoenix? Do you have Spotlight/GML package or a MSV2 linked ARO piece?
vs CA: Can you deal with the Avatar? (Or can you circumvent it and attack the weaker models to siphon its order pool)

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>>93178946
I got some advices last time but sadly had little time to do actual painting since then. Out of models, I have Kaldstrom minis, two MO packs ("new" and old 300p one), Teutons, Trinitarians, two S3 remotes, Hawkins, Curator, Mobility Joan (that makes two with one from 300p pack), YJ/Ariadna/Aleph/Nomads models I simply found good looking and LOTS of primed but unpainted models, including Montesa and Armbots (but since they are not painted, they are not usable yet).

>>93179019
>including Montesa and Armbots (but since they are not painted, they are not usable yet)
My group at least doesn't care so much about painted or not.

I do feel bad for making them fight my AMM (Actual Metallic Metal) Steel Phalanx so many times though.

So, TAGs, what do we think?

>>93186172
cool, but not very useful in the actual hacking meta

>>93188425
Hot take: if CB didn't love nomads so much, they'd let firewall mods stack, and for both attack and save rolls.

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>>93189519

>>93186172
I kinda dislike cheap TAGs as a concept but also I kinda like them. I'm torn.

>>93186172
Way better than they used to be.

>>93189519
You mean like a tinbot and fairy dust stacking? You want to give Riots and Brigadas -9 firewalls?