The thread dedicated to the original introductory Dungeons & Dragons box set and the rulebook by John Eric Holmes (which was also sold separately in bygone days).FAQ:Q: Is that dragon wearing a beehive hairdo?A: No, that's the dragon's neck!Q: I think I may have the dice from that box set! Can you describe them to me?A: Yes! The d4 is yellow, the d6 orange, the d8 green, the d12 blue, and d20 white. There is also pink d20, but that was sold separately with a white d20 for percentile dice!Q: Why is Holmes D&D so great?A: It is the shortest cut of the rules that TSR ever produced, and yet somehow Holmes managed to include all the good stuff! And the Tower of Zenopus sample adventure is a classic!Q: Sounds great! How to I get started?A: Just post in the thread! You don't even need to register!
does this have race as it's own class?
>>93148162
>>93148178The non-human races don't choose a class, so it can be regarded as race-as-class. The non-human races aren't presented as classes like in later basic rulebooks. But some Holmes box sets contain the B1 In Search of the Unknown module, in which all the races can optionally be thieves!
>>93148162>>93148187
>>93148162FAQ ADDENDUM:Q: Are you the same anon who made the B/X and the AD&D threads and shouldn't you be taking your meds?A: No, I did not create either of those threads! And although I have a mental disorder (autism), there's no medication for it!Q: What is the story behind the dagger rule?A: Because daggers strike twice per round, and two-handed swords every other round, they are 4 times as good as a two-handed sword! People have speculated that this was an error on the part of TSR editors, but the original Holmes manuscript has turned up, and Holmes may be partly to blame! See https://zenopusarchives.blogspot.com/2013/11/at-long-last.html
>>93148659>No, I did not create either of those threads!
>>93148761
>>93148778I'm flattered you think I created those fine threads!
>>93148162there's a brand new edition coming out soon. why are you clinging to this old outdated one?
>>93148162>Q: I think I may have the dice from that box set! Can you describe them to me?Jon Peterson wrote a great post about old school dice! https://playingattheworld.blogspot.com/2020/02/identifying-dice-of-1970s.html
>>93148873>outdatedBy what measure?
>>93149039games are designed better now, less number crunching and preparations needed.
>>93148873If the new edition has titty monsters maybe I'll upgrade but I'm not holding my breath!
>>93149111>less number crunching and preparations neededYou can generate a Holmes PC in less than 10 minutes. Which games do it faster?
>>93149159it takes like two minutes in 5e
>>93149111There's actually more number crunching in 5E, and you'd know that if you knew anything about what you are talking about.
>>93149787no way
>>93149787>Muh purity5e runs far smoother and can do osr with minimal changes, fuck off
>>93148873
>>93148659MORE FAQ:Q: Can I houserule Holmes?A: Yes! But always follow the house rules rule! Every house rule must be agreed upon before the campaign starts and all house rules must fit on a single page! And that's including the mandatory image of skull mountain!
>>93151561Man, we really don't see enough great stone skulls anymore.
>>93149761You sure? Ability scores, class, "ancestry", background, bonds, feats (the "optional" rule everyone uses), equipment, patron/gods, spells, and calculating all the fiddly bonuses derived from there . . . Seems like you're being a lying faggot.
>>93151561FAQ cont.Q: Can I use miniatures with Holmes?A: You bet! I'm a Heritage Dungeon Dwellers man myself! Not going to say I have them all painted! Minifigs, Grenadier, and Ral Partha are all great! If you use Reaper, I won't judge you!Q: What are you going to do about all the trolls?A: Trolls are the worst! I use fire on them! It's the best you can do!
>>93148873>there's a brand new edition coming out soon.For a second I thought there are a new holmes BD&D version coming out.Got all excited.It's June, you don't need a new D&D 5e book to play with weird and creepy snowflake characters, just go outside. :^)
>>93152393Another FAQ:Q: Is there a reading list for Holmes?A: Not officially, but Chris Holmes posted some titles from John Eric Holmes' library at http://www.holmeswest.com/john-eric-holmes.html He had Tolkien, Howard, and Lovecraft! No Vance or Moorcock because of moral ambiguity! So I burned my Vance books! Hahaha not really, but I did burn the Moorcock! Great question, keep them coming!
>>93148237> in which all the races can optionally be thievesAnd the pre-gens in B1 were raided by an untold number of geeks to name their first character.
>>93154115>For a second I thought there are a new holmes BD&D version coming out.noit's outdated
>>93154115Wotc would never release a competent game fren>>93156080Kek
Here's another Holmes dungeon and part of the key!MAZE: Note that there are several secret doors in the maze. The minotaur knows them all, but he never leaves the maze. MINOTAUR STR 18 INT 5 DEX 10 HITS 5 AC bare flesh MV 8 spaces. Strikes w/ his 2-headed axe, doing 1d6 of damage each hit. The minotaur is a huge, bare chested, bull-headed man who roams the maze, looking for trouble. He usually kills or stuns his victims, robs them of any GP which he throws into the pool in room G and then roars in helpless frustration because he cannot speak.G: There is a round shallow pool in the center of the room with 50 GP in the water. Any character throwing a coin in the pool gets one (and only one) wish. The players must figure this out for themselves, w/o hints from the referee. If you take a coin out of the pool you negate that wish. The referee should be careful to take wishes quite literally. "Wish I may never die" = turned to stone. "wish I may have 10 wishes" = puts character in a closed time loop.
What caused this spergout making threads for every OSR game
>>93156852K: A large stone room. The walls are covered with murals and sculpture.The N wall is carved into an open-mouthed face. The mouth is a bottomless pit, 20' across, filled with up-rushing flames. It might be possible to jump across (a feat of STR) or swing across on a rope (a feat of DEX) taking 1 or 2 points of damage (referee's choice).M: The ugly statue is 10' high and has a single jeweled eye. If the eye is removed the statue comes to life and starts feeling for his eye and his enemies. Every hit of his hand does 1d6 of damage. As long as the statue is blind, however, every time he gets a hit the character gets a DEX throw to avoid it. STATUE: AC metal MOVE 6 spaces HITS 10. The eye can be pulled out (STR) or worked loose (DEX) or telekinesed out. If blind the statue will rush left, right, forward, or back in a random fashion. Roll a die: 1=forward, 2=back, 3=left, 4=right, 5=angle foward (to nearest character), 6=angle back (to nearest character). The jeweled eye is worth 10,000 GP.
>>93156988spergs overgatekeeping /osrg/
>>93154190FAQ cont:Q: Is Holmes OSR?A: Nowhere on box or rulebook is an OSR logo to be found! But it does clearly say that it is Dungeons & Dragons! Holmes is actually older than the OSR!Q: But how can Holmes be Dungeons & Dragons? Doesn't Hasbro own the trademark?A: The trademark used to be owned by a company called TSR! TSR was the first company to publish Dungeons & Dragon, and Holmes is the second edition of Dungeons & Dragons they published! But don't call it second edition because people will think you are talking about ADVANCED Dungeons & Dragons Second Edition!
>>93156988Spergs frustrated at people laughing at their bad homebrew in /osrg
>>93156988Some combination of the other two replies
>>93157661Sorry to hear it, and a word to the wise! If you are afraid of bad brews, don't go in the pool room!
>>93148162Is this the version that had the psychic rangers?
>>93158575Yes it does! Start with a fighting man (p. 6), equip him with long bow and arrows (p. 7) and a medallion of ESP (p. 37)!
>>93157200FAQ cont.Q: Isn't "fighting men" sexist?A: No! Female characters can still fight! I just call them fighting women! Holmes would have been okay with it! Gary too!
>>93156988Discussing it is forbidden. Look in the archives.>>93162354Oh thank God I thought I wasn't allowed to create female characters. Thank you, Anon!
>>93162354FAQ cont.:Q: Holmes D&D looks great! But what character sheets should I be using?A: Good question! The sheets with Roswell art on the cover (Rozzies) are best! The sheets with Caldwell art are the same on the inside but good luck finding a set! The sheets withTom Wham art (Whammies) have extra fields you don't need! Holmes doesn't have psionics! You can still use them though!
>>93164023FAQ correction:Q: Who is "Roswell"?A: I meant Roslof! Sorry!
Honestly probably the most helpful and informative thread I've read on /tg/. Thanks holmesanon!
Alright Holmesautist, sell me on the whole 1d6 damage/1 attack for PCs but multiple attacks/variable damage for monsters
>>93166049Thanks!>>93168711It's good for people new to the game! Holmes expected that players would come up with their own house rules. Look at what he wrote on p. 18.
The first edition of the Holmes rulebook referred to hobbits! All of the references were changed to halflings in the 2nd edition. But they missed a hobbit in the description of the cure light wounds spell on p. 17! There aren't any illos of hobbits or halflings in Holmes, so here's one from the DMG!
>>93149761*it takes like two minutes with prep time (character name picking is the most difficult part for me)fixed that for you, and have a go.
>>93148162Hi Holmesanon, would you be able to share any writings or resources which shed some light on Holmes' campaign (Under)world or playstyle? I know from "Mazes of Peril" that Holmes' dark elves aren't evil underworld drow, but just tan elves for example.
>>93176918I think this is his first submission to Alarums & Excursions! It's from the May 1976 issue!
>>93148900I used to buy lots of old dice on ebay! I would pay $1 or even $2 per die (not counting d6s with pips)! As long as I could see some Holmes dice in there, because that meant the rest of the dice were probably old too! That was 5 years ago! You can't get old dice for those prices now!
What are the key differences between Holmes and moldvay/cook? Why would one play one over the other?
>>93177099Thanks, Holmesanon! By chance, would you know where I can get my hands on back issue pdfs of Alarums and Excursions? Also found this little gem on the Zenopus Archives blog, thought to share: https://zenopusarchives.blogspot.com/2011/10/holmes-on-holmes-basic.html>>93177099Holmes Basic was the first real attempt at a beginners guide to ODND for a broader audience, and was a standalone compilation of rules from the LBBs and first two supplements (without need for Chainmail). Mechanically, it was closer to ODND, than Moldvay, B/X, though it still remains its own thing, because of some Holmesian idiosyncracies like a 5-way alignment system, ability for 1st level magic users to scribe scrolls, initiative based on dexterity, race as class but possibility of being anything at DM's discretion, etc.Some of the more glaring mechanical differences from Moldvay, B/X include Holmes going only up to 3rd level (though fan supplements extrapolating beyond 3rd exist), Holmes not porting over variable weapon damage from Greyhwak supplement (all weapons did d6, perhaps as an intentional point of rules sinplification), Holmes keeping only one attack per round for fighting men as per ODND, and not having much in the way of bonuses from attribute scores, besides faster experience gain.Moldvay, B/X introduced some innovations like splitting race and class, meaningful bonuses for every stat, and critical hits and failures on 20s and 1s. In practice, Holmes and B/X could probably be used interchangeably to run old shool games/modules. Despite having some anachronisms, Holmes is a sleek chassis based closely on ODND, which could be easily hacked and homebrewed. Why some might prefer Holmes might also just really boil down to clarity and approachability, and the included beginner dungeon (much has been written in praise of it).
>>93178665Second reply meant for >>93177719!
>>93178665>B/X introduced some innovations like splitting race and class??? Isn't B/X the first to have explicit race-as-class, rather than the de facto one of the little brown books and Holmes Basic?
>>93179908Derp, I think you're righ, it was probably the other way around with demihumans being given limited class options in ODND/Holmes and race as class being baked in with B/X. Might have recalled incorrectly based on BFRPG.
>>93178665> back issue pdfs of Alarums and Excursions?Lee Gold might still be selling them! Her contact info is at https://conchord.org/xeno/leegold.html If you write to her, remember who you are talking to! Use your best High Gygaxian!
>>93178665>Holmes Basic wasCouldn't have said it better myself! I like the monsters in Holmes! Could just be nostalgia though!
>>93148162Should red dragons really have black bat wings? Just asking!
>>93177635This lot sold yesterday at $13.50 per non-pip die! I wasn't the buyer!
>>93185379and to imagine I threw my old white and pink d20s away once they were so worn out they stopped reliably stopping on their faces.
What does /holmes/ think of Blueholme and associated adventures?
I made a recombined thread for all TSR-era editions (like /osrg/ but without the FOE screaming). Please hop over there if you are interested.>>93187986>>93187986>>93187986
>>93188034>like /osrg/ but without the FOE screamingThe purity spiral continues you retard.
>>93189724Touted once again! It's happening more and more oft.
>>93190595But does touting something oft make it true?
>>93190616Yep,it is key:>Repetition is important, because the Big Lie works through indoctrination. The Big Lie then becomes its own evidence base – if it is repeated enough, people believe it, and the very repetition almost tautologically becomes the support for the Lie. ... Hear something enough it becomes truth. People assume there is an evidence base when the lie is big (it's like a blind spot). ... [People also fail to realize] that there are people in our midst that lack empathy, have no care for the common good, are grandiose, arrogant, and willing to exploit and manipulate people for solely their own egocentric needs. ... [Instead] a sort of halo effect imbues leaders with presumed expertise and power – when that is not at all the case (most if not all megalomaniacal leaders, despots, tyrants, oligarchs share narcissism/psychopathy as a trait).
>>93148778What system is this from?
>>93194858Steve Jackson's Sorcery!
>>93195482Thanks anon
>>93185402Hahaha me too! I got myself some Gamescience dice but I didn't keep those either! So fast forward to 2019 and I bought an OCE white box set for $395! All because it came with pic related!
>>93201171I met Lou Zocchi at a convention once. He always had (has?) a booth with crazy amounts of dice and a treatise on them for sale, IIRC.
>>93201470And who knows if we'll ever be able to catch him at a convention again. The internet says he was at Origins in 2021. I think Gamescience stopped producing dice circa 2015, but they are still selling off old inventory.
