Manuals are mainly read by the people running the game, players are expected to skim through them and focus on certain stuff. So the tone set by the writer doesn't need to influence how it will be during play, it's mostly to convince you to run it. We all have preferences so there's no objective answer, it's always good to have variety, but some of these block me from even giving it a chance while others get me hyped. What do you prefer? This are some archetypes I've seen, feel free to add others>Technical>Chapter 1: This is a game to be played with this dice set. Damage is calculated this way. Chart 1A shows how carried weight affects damage in backstabs. Graphic 2B shows the angle of impact modifiers which can be calculated with the following formula CON+sin/carry weight...>Doesn't describe a setting or does it in blurbs that are meant to be ignored.>frustrated novelist>Chapter 1: Joe kept staring at his watch. The meeting was supposed to start soon but no one was there. Did he get there early? No way, he was never early, he was a late starter in life. It all started when his mother turned into a ghoul...>Classes are described before giving them mechanical aspects>Mechanics aren't described until chapter 5+>Conversational>Chapter 1: We all know what ttrpgs are, and if you don't don't worry. Good old Mike is here to explain it to you. If you're a cool cat or a know it all skip ahead, I'm not your boss. You are! Unless you're a player, then your DM is the boss, lol. We like having fun here, and with this game you will!>Setting is an absolute mess sprinkled everywhere>Creator/s spend more time guest DMing than making material>Lore obsessed>Chapter 1: This is the world of Rakinda, where Triggers travel each winter to Lokhendai to burn gifts and beg the gods for a long Summer. Only Parents know that there's a dark side to Summer.>Tiny typeface, to fit more text, over colored background>Will have a dozen add on books with no plot hooks
>>93895262>We all have preferences so there's no objective answerThen don't put "best" in your subject header, you crusty onahole.
>>93895262I like both technical manuals and lore manuals but separated.
>>93895262Read the Alien RPG manual. It's like what WoD rule books tried to be but the writers weren't quite organized and consistent enough to manage.
The book for 2e Dark Sun was fucking amazing. It did a good job by having a separate wanderers journal for more in depth lore, and I loved the writing.
Paranoia XP continues to have the best rulebook in history. Please do not look at this image unless your clearance is ULTRAVIOLET.
>>93895578The thing with 2e in general is that they went with really awful fonts. I guess it was the style at the time, but you can notice the difference even wit contemprary magazines aimed at a wider audience.
>>93895600I was surprised at how readable XP is even in crappy xeroxed copies. It doesn't tire the eyes, you can quickly identify the main info of every section and once you've read it you can land at a random page and know which section it is. Great manual.
>>93895480I really hate how WoD had page after page of creative writing completely divorced from how the game would work, but seeing some newer stuff I feel I was too harsh with them.
I can only say I hate any system with propietary dice.Just make it a table of results.
>>93897332Tight, another loser filtered.
>>93897332Genesys is factually the best TTRPG system.
The "-Without Number" books are probably the best ones I can think of. Little bit of meta-setting, character generation and rules, a shitload of GM tools, and a bunch of optional shit on top of that. I'm leafing through SWN right now for an upcoming game and it stills blows me away how much useful shit is in this book.
>>93895262>players are expected to skim through them and focus on certain stuff.fuck off and die in a fire shitical role.you don't want to learn how to play the game, fuck off and don't play. you giant retarded cunt.
>>93902326Don't assign opinions to a general description. It's the reality of things and manuals are writen with that consideration. Some of thm have a clear divide between them like Paranoia with above red sections or D&D with separate books. It's reality.
>>93902326>Okay, group, here is the game I want to run.>You're all required to read the entirety of the 300ish page manual from copyright to index, by next week.Nah, this is the death of games. If I'm pitching a game that I want to run, I'll have the rules down pat, and give everyone a pdf to skim, and we'll make characters together. I'll teach them the rules as we play. Ideally I'll run a one shot with pregens first. We're all adults with jobs and lives, I can't expect them to immediately have the same amount of hype I have for something. I think that attitude of "everyone *must* do their homework before we have any fun," is a big part of the reason why people get stuck in the the 5e rut.
>>93895262I think a good rulebook needs a mix of all of them. If your system has a core setting, then of course you'll want to dedicate some pages giving the gist of the setting at least, letting the GM know what kind of major settlements exist and helping them have a framework for adding their own, minor settlements or other unlisted major settlements (good to give them wiggle room after all), and to help players get in the right mindset for their characters. I think it's also good to put a bit of yourself in the "narration" for the rulebook; let the reader know a bit about you through how you describe or represent things.When it comes time to describe mechanics however, it's best to use clear, concise, easy to understand language that's straight to the point and that lets everyone know "this is how this works". You can, as you note in the "Frustrated novelist" theme, give a brief flavor blurb about the options before the mechanics, but the mechanics should be obvious and clear to the reader.There's also nothing wrong with the "Conversational" style for things like step-by-step character building or examples of actual play (i.e., those little blurbs a lot of books have in chapter 1 where we get a scenario of some fictional players and their GM running/playing the game) to help those who might struggle with the game or who might be new to TTRPGs.Basically, extremes are useless and as the author of a game with narrative elements you should be flexible and use all the tools at your disposal as needed rather than stubbornly putting all your eggs in one basket.
>>93897332Every system with proprietary dice is doomed to fail, because by their nature it's harder to get those dice than a standard set of polyhedrals. And in 10 years, when the next generation of players begin to archive their own collections of old scans and PDFs, no one will bother playing these systems.Think I'm wrong? Then why is the DC Universe game never spoken of, despite the popularity of DC comics? Think it might, just might, be something to do with the fact that set of 5 proprietary "Hero Dice" will set you back at least $75 USD, assuming that you can find them?
>>93902326>NOOOOOO you can't play my game without reading this entire 240 page main rulebook including rules and sections that don't apply to your character!!>There will be a test on Tuesday before character sheet submission and this WILL count towards your final grades!!>Why the fuck should I, the person whose sole job is to be arbiter of the rules and describe background and worldbuilding as needed, do my fucking job?This is why no one will play with you. You think larping as a university lecturer is entertainment and hate fun. You probably hate Critical Role because it's popular, too, you fucking hipster.
>>93902326No, he's right about that. Players are NEVER expected to know the rules of an RPG, that is explicitly the GM's job. Players interact with the game by using natural language, through the interface that is GM. It may actually be harmful to the game if they know how the rules work (they'll start trying to override the GM's calls).
>>93908761No. A player with no understanding of the rules will have a terrible time. They will not understand what's possible/expected in the world and will behave in an outlandish fashion that only makes sense in the (incorrect) version of the world they built in their head. It would be like a person going through life without understand gravity or hunger or something.>ok i throw a fireball>this is twilight2k there's no magic>ok i launch a grenade from my ppk>ppks don't have gl attachmentsetc.
>>93907886Propietary dice could also be replaced by a really short table 1=X 2=Y and so on. It's like a fourth of a page or less.
If OSE included examples of play, it would be perfect. Lore can live in modules and supps.
>>93903445>>93904147>>93907902>>93908761fuckoff. you are what is wrong with tabletops. you ignorant morons. the DM runs the game. the DM hasn't got the job of TEACHING YOU how to fucking play it.
>>93907902actually i hate them because they're drama faggots invading a hobby they mocked and insulted and bullied all the people participating in UNTIL it got 'trendy' and now those faggots pretend they ALWAYS played. the fucking fakes.
>>93909177Spoken like someone who's clearly never DM'd
>>93909206You're not a DM. you're clearly a babysitter for retards.
>>93909185your personal experience isn't universal, retard. Did that even happen or is it a narrative you built on your head? Imagine being bullyed by theatre kids, what a loser.
>>93909225right. so you don't live on earth. great. gotcha. nice admission that you live in total retard land of delusion.
>>93909241>drama faggots invading a hobby they mocked and insulted and bulliedbeing macked and bullied by drama faggots isn't a universal experience on earth. It only happened to you. Theatre kids are usually the ones getting bullied.
>>93909264i never said it WORKED, just that they TRIED.and YOU reveal yourself as not EVER having BEEN a DnD kid growing up. or you would KNOW about the divide between the NERDS and the GEEKS.which makes you one of the johnny come lately fuckwits shitting up the hobby.no wonder you put LEARNING TO PLAY THE GAME in the TOO HARD basket and demand the fucking DM puppet your retarded ass through campaigns.
>>93909206I've been forever DM for years, and I'll tell you this guy is right. I've had a new, inexperienced player recently, and I'm playing in the game said new player is currently DMing which has another new, inexperienced player in it. Things work better if most people at the table are familiar with the rules. The DM isn't an infallible font of knowledge and is also focused on running the game, which will invariably include arbitrating some action by a player while another player has a question. Players who are familiar with the rules can help players who aren't, and they can catch mistakes you make. And you will make mistakes, because that's just life.In contrast, in my first campaign I had a player who hadn't read the rules. He made a dogshit character that frustrated him to no end, because his gimmick choices made him weak, and he asked if he could charge when he couldn't several times, growing visibly frustrated by inevitable "no".
>>93909631The point never was >players shouldn't read the manuallike the schizo said, the point was>manuals are writen with the one running it in mindPeple who don't intend to ever GM that game will skip around a lot and will ignore whole sections because they don't relate to what you're gonna play. If anything reading the author's fanfiction and lore could clash with what the GM is making, so it's not even universally improving players.
>>93909905and then, because they didn't LAERN TO FUCKING PLAY, something will come up IN play, and what SHOULD have taken 30 goddam seconds for the player to figure out their action/task, becomes 15 minutes of bogged down play that BORES the people who DID learn to play, while retard mc fuck face looks up the section he SKIPPED to find out what his abilities and or powers or spells even ARE / DO!and it happens again. and again and again.IF everyone listened to YO. that would be EVERY fucking players turn.having 5 people take ONE turn would take over a goddam HOUR. during which boredom would have resulted in shenanigans jokes talking and fuckery so no one remembers whats even going ONYOU are why players SUCK and games DIE.IF ou cannot turn up ready to play, knowing HOW to play, you should have "I hate you all and want you to suffer" carved into your fucking forehead so that EVERYONE ELSE knows you are there to RUIN IT FOR EVERYONE ELSE
>>93909959It's a fucking game you sperg, and nobody is going to remember 100+ pages of fucking rules unless they literally have a photographic memory which is unreasonable to expect of the 99% of the population who don't have one.Even I as a GM don't remember all the rules all the time, because unlike (you) I don't exclusively run/play D&Dogshit, I actually run/play like 5 different systems and so I'm not just keeping up with one ruleset, I have to keep up with multiple rulesets, and that's a real pain in the ass I wouldn't wish on my worst enemies.There's nothing wrong with having people know how to play their characters and the GM knowing how his NPCs work and the basics of the general rules, because it's a GROUP ACTIVITY, so between the GM and his 3-5 players you ought to have a collective knowledge of the rules just by volume of information, so if one guy doesn't know the rules then someone else can chime in who knows that rule, and nobody does then it's the GM's job to make a ruling on the spot and say "fuck it we can look it up later" to keep the game going.RAWtists like (you) are a cancer on the hobby and are certified playerleeches.
>>93910148YOU kill games, YOU are why everyone is fucking around and hasn't got a clue what is 'happening' in the game.you're just a fucking cancer on gaming.
>>93909959just chose your players and stop going back to HS to get bullied by theatre kids. Not even theatre kids like them, you're the first time I've seen someone feeling victimized by them.If you at least wanted to pretend this was thread related and not some bizarre trauma you could say manuals should be writen to include the player and give examples.
>>93910202wrong. wrong and more wrong. strawman harder faggot. take even MORE refuge in absurdity.YOU not knowing how to fucking play the game fucking shits up the game for everyone else you lazy, stupid fucking dumbshit. YOU are the fuckwit taking 20 goddam minutes to have ONE turn while everyone else is forced to wait on your selfish retardation.YOU are the EPITOME of sub 90 IQ.just fucking admit you won't learn to play games because reading is too hard for you and your just too fucking STUPID to play, but you INSIST on being included because you're from the fucking participation trophy generation you totally useless crotchgoblin.
>>93910234>YOU not knowing how to fucking play the game fucking shits up the game for everyone else you lazy, stupid fucking dumbshit. YOU are the fuckwit taking 20 goddam minutes to have ONE turn while everyone else is forced to wait on your selfish retardation.I'm the one reading manuals and seeing that they are aimed at the dude running it. How would I know that if I was the one not reading them? Why would I be talking about how manuals are writen?You can't accuse people of strawmaning and projecting and then use all caps YOU to describe something unrelated to the thread.
>>93910330your complete ANTIPATHY to learning to play the fucking game reveals you are NOT OP, you faggot pretender, and are just another of these new breed of idiots that think tabletop is an improv session.
>>93910369is a faggot pretener someone who pretends to be a fag but is actually straight?where is this antipathy expressed itt?
>>93910369>SHOUT SHOUT SHOUT SHOUTkekTell us moar about your no-gaems fun with all of your friends, senpai.
>>93900291>>93900541Hello saar>>93907886This guy plays games.>Verification not required.
>>93895262didn't read, clicked for the picture
>>93909044This says more about the crayon eaters in your group and how you are delivering information than how the world works.
>>93909177>Why no, I haven't actually ever played games, how could you tell?
>>93895262>All those retarded assumptions>All those stupid ideas
>>93911695>recognized himself in the descriptionEvery.Time.
>>93911695it was meant more as a joke, I know I'm not properly representing any style. I didn't expect people to feel personally attacked.
>>93912686Nonetheless, you described very recognizable motifs that definitely exist in the genre. I've seen all four multiple times, as have we all.TTRPGs started out Technical, and that stayed with us for many years.Then the Storyteller System gave us the Frustrated Novelist style of the 1990's, and so many games now have to have pages and pages of fiction.The Conversational and Lore styles evolved in the new millennium as gamers became publishers.There were precursors of the other styles in the Technical era, of course; but they were outliers and didn't take off.All in all, nice summary.
>>93912558Every Etime?
>>93913671electronic time
>>93910173>YOU kill games,I Run and play more games right now than you've had hot dinners you sperglord.>YOU are why everyone is fucking around and hasn't got a clue what is 'happening' in the game.Projection methinks, because the people at my tables know what's going on.>you're just a fucking cancer on gaming.The fact you didn't specify tabletop gaming means that you're a /v/ermin who has crawled to /tg/ to stir shit rather than a /tg/entleman who plays and thus actually knows a thing or two about how Traditional Games are played. Go back to your shithole.
>>93897332You were so close to being able to make your own table, bro. Only had one job, to learn to google...
>>93897332>>93914526
