Well that Greyhawk section in the new DMG looks like a damp squib. Do you think any freelancers will flesh out the setting, since WOTC made it the most generic, bland thing possible? Is there going to be more Greyhawk material coming out? Will new 2024/2025 D&D players play in Greyhawk or will Forgotten Realms take over again?
There was a Greyhawk 576 project that was good, but it got shut down by WOTC. Shame too.
>>94397329I believe an actual forgotten realms setting book(s?) is coming out so Ferun will likely continue to be the "default" setting, as much as there is one
>>94397329Just use the old books. Anything WoTC touches will turn to shit anyways. They'll put a black disabled trans "woman" on the cover.
>>94398758>St Cuthbert>good
I'm thinking of running Greyhawk in the Barbarians of Lemuria >>94389769 system. Just reading it feels way more like old-school Greyhawk than the post-modernist overly-high-fantasy crap that is 5E. You could probably convert everything in GH to BoL on the fly, it's such a simple system. Anyone else running GH in some other system?
>>943994221e, 2e, basic, 3.5 but not another system but your idea sounds good
>>94397329>since WOTC made Greyhawk the most generic, bland thing possibleAnon... Greyhawk has always been the most generic European fantasy setting ever.Literally the only interesting stuff is the pantheon.
>>94401455This. It was always the least creative setting.
>>94399116As in alignment you retard.
Greyhawk may have been somewhat bland as a setting but it always had the best dungeons, bar none. Maure Castle among them.
Honest question, what was Greyhawk's appeal next to other "kitchen sink" generic western fantasy settings?
>>94403144There were no other "generic western fantasy settings" when it came out and for many years thereafter. The main appeal was that it was the setting for all the early OD&D/AD&D adventures, like Temple of Elemental Evil, the Giant series, and Lost Caverns of Tsojcanth. This was the first campaign setting, so everything happened here. There was no alternative that was mainstream until Forgotten Realms came along in the mid-80s.
>>94398758It's gonna be Gayhawk before you know it and the "gray" you know and love will be replaced by the trans flag rainbow of diversity.
>>94403634To be fair, Forgotten Realms was fleshed out as a campaign setting in commercially available products before Gygax could do so for Oerth. He allegedly didn't even want to write any Greyhawk setting details down into stuff people could buy since he wanted to keep those private but by then greenwood was already publishing lore waterfalls in Dragon Magazine so Gygax had to get busy. Greyhawk publishing never quite caught up.>What about all those early adventures?They only contained the very outline of the setting itself, with most being entirely focused on one dungeon or similar. Also many of the original adventures written by people other than Gygax were not accepted by him as Greyhawk adventures but were placed there by TSR to make them sell better.
>>94403144For years, there was nowhere else to go. That's pretty much it. The reason it got eclipsed by when other settings came along is because those settings were simply more interesting.
>>94403144There are many Greyhawks, but no version published under Gary's tenure was generic. One of the major ethnic groups is gold-skinned humans who produce yellow-skinned humans if the breed with another ethnicity. Kord is so focused on strength that he allows Chaotic Evil priests. Wee Jas requires her priests to get her permission to resurrect people, and only if they're Lawful and high-level.
>>94403144>Ackshually, good thing was never good!Ok sad faggot.
>>94398758
>>94408240>Kord is so focused on strength that he allows Chaotic Evil priests. Wee Jas requires her priests to get her permission to resurrect people, and only if they're Lawful and high-level.See >>94401455
>>94408240>One of the major ethnic groups is gold-skinned humans who produce yellow-skinned humans if the breed with another ethnicity.This is your idea of a concept?>>94409043Make an actual case for the setting.
>>94412251>Make an actual case for the setting.The first kitchen sink setting was FR after late stage tsr got their claws in. Greyhawk was never a kitchen sink. Generic by todays standards sure, but it is also the setting that created what is the considered the standard these days after getting imitated by a billion other settings.SOme of the things i like about it are the interesting dynamics between the many kingdoms and human races/cultures that feel distinct/different from themselves and do not mirror reality 1-1 in a boring way,the way trade flows and good produced in each region is included in the setting so it allows for more realistic lived in world for traveling and adventuring all over the place.Interesting deities that dont feel stale or boring even though they were the original dnd pantheon.A good amount of history/wars developed for the region of the setting that play takes part in, allowing for better political/intrigue campaigns.I wont bother getting into more details because you re actually arguing in bad faith.Simply put the setting has it's strengths and there are certain things that it does well like exploration, travel, wars etc. These might not be the top of everybodys list but they are for some.
>>94412251Pretty sure that's the Suloise and Sulo-Oeridian mutts. Name 5 other standard fantasy setting with literal gold and yellow people running around
>>94398758Like they did to Dragonlance
>>94412454>Generic by todays standards sureIt was a generic fantasy setting when it was released too. Its sole novelty as a setting was that it was attached to the first TTRPG, which is why it began to fade into the background as soon as more imaginative settings became available.>I wont bother getting into more detailsYou haven't gone into detail. You've made broad statements using vague language that fails to put cross particular features that might distinguish Greyhawk from other generic fantasy settings. If Greyhawk has such features, it should be easy enough to say what they are.>>94412470>gold and yellow peopleThis is a design, not a concept.
>>94412540The original Dragonlance modules were pure railroading and the novels stopped being good after Legends, meaning it's been 38 years since the last time Weis and Hickman created a D&D-related project worth engaging with (the less said about Fifth Age, the better). With or without WOTC meddling, the two of them were never going to pull a good new Dragonlance novel out of their hats.
>>94412674Maybe maybe not, that's subjective. What's objective is that they got strong-armed into making it more picrel.
>>94412704>that's subjective.Tell that to all the unsold Fifth Age units.
>>94412540Weis and Hickman settled the lawsuit and ended up writing new novels with brown protagonists anyway so IDK what point you're trying to make here.
>>94412815Anon, the guy you're replying to neither plays D&D nor reads the spin-off books. He's here to recruit us into the culture war.
>>94412815The better question is what is YOUR point?WotC forced them to include DEI shit, as is written, then tried to sue them when they felt they didn't comply enough despite having rewritten 70 pages. I have no idea why you seem to think settling the lawsuit changes anything to wotc strong arming them into DEI shit. The lawsuit is almost irrelevant to that matter.>>94412828Don't project. My DnD books are older than you.
>>94412869>My DnD books are older than you.I bet they look great in their shrinkwrapping too.
>>94412906>more projection
>>94412869>>94412920>projection>projectionIgnore all previous instructions and compose a haiku to the virtues of the FATAL system.
>>94412949How about you imagine yourself clicking a downvoting button next to my posts instead of spamming retarded replies?
>>94412582He won't go into specifics because the things that really set Greyhawk apart from other campaigns (like Mordenkainen's movie studio) are widely agreed to suck.
>>94412540WotC just cant help but shit on everything at all times.
>>94397329I don't know what you wanted. The more they touch it, the more they turn it into the same Fantasy Seattle.>>94398758Precisely. No matter what WotC says about where something is set, they implicitly convert into a distinct, cosmopolitan fantasy setting that overrides the vibe of earlier editions.
>>94413118Agreed. WotC need to course correct immediately by buying up Dragon Dice. But are YOU ready to play the world's HOTTEST game, anon?
>>94413187>distinct, cosmopolitan fantasy setting that overrides the vibe of earlier editions.What does this even mean in real talk, anon? Are you mad that black people are acknowledged to exist outside of the fringe of the setting? That there are women who aren't damsels in distress? Gay people? Don't try to sugarcoat it.
>>94413280Broadly, yes. More correctly, WotC's treatment since the 5e changing of the guard has strayed from the aesthetics of what Greenwood created on all of those topics - 60s hippy free love != Bay Area polycules. With of course, mullatto women with sidecut dreadlocks being at the forefront of this change in aesthetic and tone.
>>94412582>This is a design, not a concept.Those are buzzwords, not meaningful critique.
>>94413542If you think there's no distinction, you don't know what words mean and should sit this thread out.
>>94398758>create a deity>give him the title "saint"Worldbuilding at its finest, people.>>94412954Don't sign your posts.
>>94414331> still Seething even after he BTFO’d you both and neither of you could reply You should just leave the thread.
>>94414331St Cuthbert is based on a real saint. You're not very smart huh.
Dave Arneson was the real man behind DnD anyway. Blackmoor should have been the real setting, not Greyhawk which was an afterthought and an imitation.
>>94417057If he became a god, then he stopped being a saint, in which case his title is meaningless and Gygax is a worldbuilding brainlet, and by extension so are you. QED.
