>>94409634
>brain-dead isekai shit
What games do this? Also, isekai isn't an artstyle.
>grey-and-brown mudcore
OSR games are specifically trying to be OLD SCHOOL, and the rest of it can be blamed on shit like Shadowdark and Mork Borg being so successful that they spawned imitators.

This is because mudcore is a contrarian reaction, the direct subversion and opposite of modern fantasy, not out of a love for traditional fantasy but out of a hatred for modern fantasy.
Because modern fantasy presents characters of all sorts of different races and backgrounds and capabilities, the subversion of it declares that limiting characters to straight white male human fighters with longswords and shields is the highest form of fantasy.
Because modern fantasy has diverse communities that allow characters of every race to mingle and have whatever creed they wish, the subversion of it declares that races should remain apart and that race should equal creed. In this highest form of fantasy, orcs are evil no matter what and killing them is good no matter what.
Because modern fantasy has magic as a common place and the fantastical can be found everywhere, the subversion of it declares that magic should be rare to the point where it is borderline inaccessible. In this highest form of fantasy, everything out of the ordinary is to be viewed with suspicion and shunned by the common man.
As a result, this subversion of modern fantasy ends up looking nothing like old school fantasy and becomes a weird extreme in its own right.

>>94409634
How did this topic impact the last gaming session you had?

>>94409764
Depends on the system.

>>94409634
Because those tend to be the only other versions of Medieval Fantasy that they know of.

>>94409713
"Mudcore" has existed since at least 1975 and was a big part of European style "low" fantasy. WHFRP.was pretty much built on it with basic careers such as Rat Catcher.

>>94409789
kek

>>94409851
Whfrp is such shit.

>>94409929
Yes, it is. The point is that it is old enough that it proves that Mudcore is hardly modern.

>>94409789
Well what did you play last time you played?

>>94410098
What do you play?

I never saw isekai presented as an alternative to modern western fantasy. Is this a thing?

They don't. Where do you even get these stupid ideas?

>>94410236
From the voices in OPs head.

File: IMG_2332.jpg (1.06 MB, 1706x2262)

1.06 MB JPG

>>94409634
Embrace whimsical fantasy.
You dont need to go wind in the willows.
Just embrace the fantastic, whimsical elements, you can keep the violence, it will serve as a great reminder that beauty needs to be protected.
Let magic be mystical and strange.
Sure fish can walk on land when it rains.
Yes the barbarian king sacrifices himself for his people every three years.
Yes if you cook birds in alchemical oil for three days you get a potion of levitation.
Yes men thet become wicked and abandon their convictions get turned into swine people until they atone.
I run my campsite as a mix of absurdism, whimsy and pseudo historical violence, and o play it all 100% straight.
So far I’ve been enjoying myself

>>94409713
Good post. As the other anon pointed out mudcore is older than the culture war but the new adoption of it clearly stems from that.
Mudcore was also really popular for a while, the whole „no fantasy races allowed ye olde England the king is evil and everyone wears black pants somehow „ fantasy that got popular somewhere between dragon age and game of thrones is a real thing.
Overly magical DEI fantasy is a pretty recent phenomenon stemming from Crittole and DnD5e

>>94409634
gonna be honest OP, i don't know a single real person who thinks that

>>94409634
Because the people who think about "woke" stuff in our hobbies are retarded culture warriors and not interested in the actual games.

>>94409634
I have a hard time understanding why people who aren't me think the way they do, especially those who can only think in extremes. As far as tabletop games go, however, I don't need to understand their ways of thinking, because I can just do whatever I want.

>>94409713
Good post but slightly wrong. Mudcore is old and people want to return to it, though the desire to return to it is out of hatred for modern fantasy rather than a love for.

>>94409634
Which people think that?

>>94409713
That is old school fantasy, retard.

>>94410125
What do you play?

>>94409634
The only answer to coffee & college D&D aesthetics is to return to Sword & Sorcery. Barely clad Chads & Stacys fighting subhuman apemen with swords & ray guns

>>94409789
>>94410098
>>94410125
>>94411772
great

>>94409713
Mudcore would have almost no magic and no fantasy races at all

>>94409634
Why not have a hedonistic japanese salaryman be isekai'd to somewhere like Xars Irkalla?

>>94410745
This. At my table I have a guy who likes adaptations of pre-existing genres (western, noire, etc), a guy who likes anime-style larger than life settings, and a guy who likes realism and vastly prefers modern mundane settings. Found them in 3 different places and we play together and have a good time playing a variety of games. This entire problem seems conjured in online spaces where people live in bubbles.

Literally no one thinks like what OP is trying to shitpost about. This whole thread is an excuse to get people to argue about "woke" or "mudcore" or "osr" or any other shit.
This thread is shit. Anyone participating in this thread is shit.
I hope OP is raped by rabid hyenas.

>>94409644
Firstly, he didn't say art style he said aesthetic, which is a fairly all-encompassing term to describe the themes and motif of something.

Second, morkborg is not 'grey and brown mudcore'. It's completely shit, but at least be accurate about what kind of shit you call it.

>>94410507
this all works as long as you're genuine, the issue is that too many people have been poisoned by irony and meta jokes, they just can't help but go "Isn't that weird?!"
Yes it's weird, we know but we're fine with it because you're genuine in your approach
I wish people would stop the non-stop stream of irony and always making a ridicule out of anything experimental

>>94409634
Because it's what people offer when they talk about alternatives to Woke.

It makes sense since most people whining about Woke have no creativity and mostly just want to tear down things that other people enjoy.

>>94412684
It works fine if you aren't genuine as well. Just don't accept your sessions to be overly serious.

>>94410515
>Overly magical DEI fantasy is a pretty recent phenomenon stemming from Crittole and DnD5e
I remember people levelling the same criticisms at 3.5e and some earlier stuff (Planescape? Late 90s FR?) too, though in different words.

>>94409851
WHFRP still let you play as elves and dwarves and college wizards and the Old World is incredibly high fantasy as a setting, the average mudcore OSR fag would go into conniptions over Vampire Counts, Tomb Kings, Lizardmen, and dinosaur-riding Dark Elf cavalry being major factions

>>94411756
Gygax wrote Expeditions to Barrier Peaks in 1980. Mudcore shit is not remotely old-school, it's pure revisionist fake grog bullshit

>>94409634
You just wrote a whole bunch of bullshit buzzwords that don't fucking mean anything and you expect anyone to answer you?

>>94409634
Yes, it's called 'whatever you feel like playing with your friends'. You should try that!

File: 1656360955115.jpg (46 KB, 365x445)

46 KB JPG

>>94409713
>You hate fantasy because its about diversity!
>You hate fantasy because everyone gets to be special!
So this is what liberal brain rot does to a man.

>>94410507
That's the issue with modern fantasy. It has no whimiscal elements as its all stilted trying not to offend, bore people or be cringe. It has to have self awareness and make jokes about it destroying any whimsy at all.

>>94419424
At least with planescape that makes sense because it was basically a pit stop for interdimensional travelers. Today they are really stretching for how many freak shit races they can shove into a setting without answering questions about how it will impact the world itself.

I'm OK with trumblr fantasy as long as actual IRL politics are left out, and so far I have understood that liberals are simply incapable of achieving this.
I thought people above 80IQ were capable of simple abstraction and what-ifs but it looks like these guys are not. Why the fuck did you sign up for a fantasy game where the gods are real, and manifest with real consequences, specifically to make a cleric that doesn't give a shit about worship and fedora tips all the fucking way through the thankfully short lived campaign (cuz religion is fake gods arent real hehehe im very smart) WHY the FUCK do they do this? Why does "no politics" always mean the opposite because they evidently love to talk politics like nothing else. Why don't you say "we are going to suck off Stalin a lot" instead? Why say "no politics" when it's obviously not the truth, when you could say the truth instead? I am actually fine when they do the "this inclusive game is not for homophobes, nazis, racists, straight people, whites and all other bad things" it's actually honest and I will avoid the game, but why this "no politics" shit if you are actually eager to talk disgusting tranny politics from your dumb fuck sheltered commie kiddie angle all the time? It bothers me a little when you do the opposite of what you said you'd do and at the same time believe you're actually not doing anything wrong.
I cannot understand why do they have HAVE to turn medieval fantasy into 2024 America, when they could play Cyberpunk. Just play any modern setting? You can play a tranny in white wolf games, they even made that black gay muslim commie vampire to show you that you can make your dreams come true, why don't you fucking do that instead of plaguing my fucking fantasy games with your fucking gender shit? Imagine going to some farmer in year 1200 and bitching about your schizo gender shit that you only believe cause your brain has melted from tranny porn 24/7 you utter fucking mongoloid
why do they do this?

>>94412708
as an old man, the complaining goes back even further to BECMI. there's a disclaimer that slavery is bad and it got some flak (admittedly not a lot)

File: 1595839969157.png (189 KB, 480x360)

189 KB PNG

>>94420423
I can explain each point that has let you completely baffled. The reason why they can't leave out politics while saying don't add in politics is because they are so engrossed in their own ideology not as a platform but as human rights and what is good. It's not politics to them but the way things should just be like how water flows and the wind blows. And as the overton window constantly shifts ever more to the left more and more of the lefts political ramblings is normalized as being something that just should be a part of what makes a human nice and good.

As for why they refuse to let anything be associated with the gods like a cleric getting powers from something else is a few reasons. They think they are being subversive, they hate religion yet on some level they recognize that religion is associated with good, be it playing as a cleric or being subversive again and making the demons the good guys. The last option and the most likely of reasons is they just want total and complete freedom from roleplay consequences which we have seen in the last decade.

The reason why they add modern politics and thoughts is because that is all they ever know, and what they know is what is all the truth and goodness in the world. Everything that came beforehand is just evil corruption and badness to them. They are literally on a missionary campaign to enlighten the backwater masses to their own beliefs and truths. They have become exactly the kind of people they despised the most.

>>94412628
>Firstly, he didn't say art style he said aesthetic, which is a fairly all-encompassing term to describe the themes and motif of something.
Isekai is not an aesthetic, either, you dense faggot.

>>94420423
>why do they do this?
Because to people like this, "Politics" means any position that's not theirs, while their position, in their mind, is considered "Common sense"

>>94420423
because they aren't trying to emulate the medieval period, they just want to use a some medieval, renascence and early modern elements for aesthetics like the vast majority of the people who ever wrote "medieval" fantasy

I recognize this guy from another thread currently up.
I just wonder if he's also the guy that was shitting on these posts.

>>94421269
by this guy, I mean the op. whoop.

>>94419980
The answer to "how that impact the world" can be anything the authors want, including nothing

>>94411756
Mystara

>>94419424
3.5 wasn't DEI fantasy because they weren't trying to make every race have the same ethnicities as IRL humans, all in the same place and at the same ratios, or have a race be an carbon copy of an IRL minority stereotype

>>94419980
People have been trying to play dragons since the dawn of the game, and I'm sick of children like you pretending otherwise.

File: 1665510897494962.png (29 KB, 273x453)

29 KB PNG

>>94421281
>>94421319
way to miss the point

>>94421327
Your point has been carbon copied by other versions of yourself at me for over 20 years and I am so sick of you.

>>94421316
You say this, but the stormfags raged at Ember and Mialee back in the day too.

>>94422183
What a progressive stance to take.
I'm sure we'll need a lot of taxes to accomplish this.

>>94420807
>And as the overton window constantly shifts ever more to the left more and more
Problem (for them, anyways) is they overplayed their hand and now the Overton Window is steadily marching back to the right. They've even started to lose the corporate mandate of heaven, with tons of corpos dropping flags and pronouns from their various bios.

>>94411899
I prefer the more classical group of Chads fighting evil Wizards and Dragons to save Princesses

>>94422183
What a great idea. Halve america's population, watch the remaining intellectual heavy-weights flee a fascist regime, and then let the rest of the lobotomized population collapse in on itself as it turns into the new Russia. You are a genius anon. You have the makings of a future president.

>>94423755
>libtards
>intellectual heavyweights
Lol

>>94423980
Compared to you, maybe, since you plainly have zero reading comprehension. The people fleeing are people who weren't killed. So by definition, not the libtards. You're a fucking idiot. Do I need to give you a step by step plan?

>>94423998
Yes because killing millions happens magically overnight suddenly with no warning whatsoever. Weird flex to admit you're actually dumber than I gave you credit for but go off kween.

>>94424009
>oh yes I'm just going to make up crap about people magically evaporating overnight
Come on, stop digging yourself a deeper hole. Need I call strawman? Just shut your farting asshole closed before I tear it any wider.

>>94409634
Generally OP. Yes, people get upset when people enjoy things that they don't enjoy. Somehow this causes them to overcompensate with their own games. Part of the reason for this is because these people that get angry are convention goers. These kinds of things effect what shows up there and "ruins the convention" for them. So they then feel the need to stand out in opposition to it, in the hope that they'll change the current and see more of what they like. That's more or less impossible however.

>>94410507
Everyone knows that this is the upcoming rebound from mudcore.

>>94422037
what stormfags thinks is irrelevant for the argument

>>94411756
>That is old school fantasy, retard.

What exactly is mudcore about Oz?

>>94424401
Great Depression Metaphor

>>94423628
In Canada they are doubling down on this shit.

>>94409634
Because people who think "woke" fantasy exists and is bad, are generally not creative sort and thus just go for the second rate shit. No really, look at the people in question, they are the reason why /tg/ can suck at times

>>94424718
The first Oz book was published 29 years before the Great Depression. Are you saying Frank Baum was a time traveler or something?

>>94424088
Nah hyper high fantasy in the 5e style already is the rebound from the Mudcore fad that came with GoT

>>94424348
Not that guy, but...I mean, the tide is turning. As the endgame for the woke movement was a candy-colored gay parade of mystery-meat mongrel, I feel that we have no reason to be magnamious in victory.
If we're back from the brink, I want my ideological enemies crushed. Yes, it's spite, but I think revenge is well-warranted at this point.
Forget the compromise of "Maybe just like ONE gay guy and strong black woman as part of the signature characters". No, now I want the signature party to consist entirely of white people, with a heroic male human fighter swinging a sword at orcs.
Oh yeah, maybe two women: A demure Cleric with tits as big as her head, and a blonde, blue-eyed elf as the hero's trophy fuck.
Now the other side has been defeated, I intend to really put the boot in. Really twist the knife, because it's our turn to punish them now.

>>94429903
Basically this

>>94429903
>>94430059
Don't be stupid, you didn't win anything.
The ones who won this fight were the anime fans.

File: 1725969106125665.gif (2.75 MB, 374x210)

2.75 MB GIF

Read stuff only from back in the day, watch films from the 60-80's era and play games that represent you yourself. A Caucasian Male who deserves an old school fantasyland with no verisimilitude-destroying DEI elements. Your ancestors did not fight for you to abandon eternal aryan archetypes like Aragorn and Conan.
>>94429903
Nice powerfantasy. I concur.

>>94429903
You know
I never could put it in words like that, but yeah, I want this too.
I don't just want pushback. I want revenge.

>>94429903
I was with you until the coomshit, you people hate liberals but never fail to act like the push for sluts and porn were not entirely part of the narrative that was shoved down everyone's throat since the 60s. It really convinced me that everyone in America is a liberal. It seems like all your struggle is to keep the status quo but without niggers in porn. Can't you see a continuity? Fuck if you're a millennial I can't believe you could not connect the dots. Sluts and porn were fed to you the same was as "the cool gays" like Queen or whatever the fuck and then devolved into what you have today. You are actually a tranny liberal like everyone else in Amercan, you're just a little behind.

>>94429903
You're a retard who will never accomplish any of this. Your revenge fantasies are moronic.

The reason you constantly lose the culture wars is that people like you are fundamentally, basically, uncreative. Almost all art is produced by liberals and thus will always represent liberal values. Keep dreaming of some stupid world where Seattle libs in an increasingly non-white country start producing your stupid jerkoff fantasies, because that's all it is: a dream.

>>94431153
The culture war is over, and you lost.
You have lost forever and for all time.

>>94431158
>um, one election went our way so we won the culture war
Cope harder. Name a single noteworthy work of art produced in the last twenty years that is in line with your values. Oh, right, you can't, because again, you people don't produce art. The scientific reason is that openness to experience has a strong correlation with both artistic creativity and liberalism. The practical reason is that when you imagine your victory, it's just "the thing you produced, but only white people and hot chicks". Mentally deficient.

>>94431177
The Lord of the Rings Trilogy.

I’m a liberal, and I like big busty clerics and blue-eyed elves I can bust in too.

>>94424859
>Canada
You mean North India

>>94431177
>Stellar Blade
>Black Myth: Wukong
>Elden Ring
>AC6
Damn, its almost like only GOOD art is produced by rightoids and all leftoids can create is propagandistic flopslop abd rely wholly on rightist-created franchises to inject their messaging through like the parasites they are

>>94431177
NTA and I know this is a bait post but in case it's not, there's no scientific bullshit behind the lack of conservatives in media; it's just that in order to make money in any entertainment industry you gotta be a bit of a whore, you know? it's simple survivorship bias
>if you want this job you gotta suck my cock
someone with any moral values says "no I won't" and that person doesn't get published, the person who says "okay I will suck your cock yum yum" will get published
the whole Hollywood industry runs like this, the music industry runs like this, every single person in entertainment is a whore first, that's the main barrier, compliance has always been the main barrier before talent/creativity and of course a person who does not have strong moral fiber will do better in this context, why would you not prefer that? People who are compliant will do anything you tell them to.
Same with selling directly to the public, except you're sucking everyone's collective cock directly by pandering as hard as possible
I find it really ironic that people claim we're in a somehow creative era when 95% of what gets made is just "fan" porn of 1 or 2 FOTM IPs that are themselves incredibly incestuous and stinking of committee design. We're in an era that is dominated by ultra liberal values and also as creatively bankrupt as it gets. Most of what is getting made right now is forgotten a week after it peak. Most of what "creatives" make is porn, now I know you love porn just like everyone else but if you think porn is creative you have brain rot.

>>94431341
Two of those were made by east asians disconnected from western politics, both left and write, and one of the people writing Elden Ring was GRR Martin, who is a Liberal
Also Stellar Blade indulges on what the right calls "gooner degeneracy"

>rightist-created franchises
most franchises were created by pre-woke liberals

>>94431480
>disconnected from western politics
Oh please, western politics tried to suppress their creative vision and kneel on their necks by trying to bully them into hiring Sweet Baby Inc, you're being disingenuous here and you know it.
>Also Stellar Blade indulges on what the right calls "gooner degeneracy"
It has strong males and hot chicks. Thpse were your parameters.
>pre-woke liberals
I could address how wrong you are since many foundational pop culture pieces were created by conservative traditionalists such as DnD, LotR, and all of Disney, but instead I'll just acceot your concession that it's the modern right - i.e. antiwoke libertarians - that are the creatives and not leftists as you keep trying to claim.

>>94431480
>one of the people writing Elden Ring was GRR Martin
this shit with saying a famous writer is part of the writing team is just a marketing stunt, I'd be surprised if he wrote a single line of text
but you are right, the elephant in the room is that there is no "conservative" or "right wing" way to do entertainment, at least not mass entertainment media that is mass-produced. The very existence of consumer entertainment slop is in antithesis with conservatism, so when American conservatives bemoan liberal politics in media and identify with conservatives, they're kind of retarded. What they are is liberals who love the liberal slop but want the flavor from 10 years ago which is kind of moronic because at this point they're not the target audience anymore. We don't even have a direct offer/demand for digitalized good so all this shit is virtually free and when hundreds of millions go into free stuff it's for a good reason (e.g. propaganda)
Basically Americans are all spineless dimwits

>>94431341
>>Stellar Blade
you should have said Neir automata if you're listing a game that's sexy and good.