Fair Folk Edition>What is Exalted?An epic high-flying role-playing game about reborn god-heroes in a world that turned on them.Start here:http://theonyxpath.com/category/worlds/exalted/>That sounds cool, how can I get into it?Read the 3e core book (link below). For mechanics of the old edition, play this tutorial:http://mengtzu.github.io/exalted/sakuya.htmlIt’ll get you familiar with most of the mechanics.>Gosh that was fun. How do I find a group?Roll20 and the Game Finder General here on /tg/. good luck>Resources for Third Edition>3E Core and Splatshttps://www.mediafire.com/folder/b54o6teut3fx6/Exalted_3e>Errata for Third Editionhttps://docs.google.com/document/d/1n3ooTmopm3CBxW5jwPp1761xsaIccea-5XIhVM_PQEc/edit>Other Ex3 Resourceshttps://pastebin.com/fG1mLMdu (embed)>Resources for Older Editionshttps://pastebin.com/BXSGuFdQ (embed)>Current Quixalted Extended QE Version (Fanmade Supplement)https://files.catbox.moe/rjgmo5.pdf>Optional Quixalted Exaltshttps://www.mediafire.com/file/jg86yrewnhx2ov3/QE_Reject3eExaltHomebrew.pdf/file>Exalted Demake/Black Vault (Now with updates):https://pastebin.com/Tt1PjuYt (embed)https://pastebin.com/qHRW9N51 (embed)>collection of Exalted Hackshttps://pastebin.com/gtZnycJs (embed)>stuff that might be interestinghttps://forum.rpg.net/index.php?threads/the-exalted-thread-with-no-original-ideas.317216/Last thread: >>96636261Thread Questions:>How have the fair folk impacted your campaign, and what does one need to remember when using them?>If there are any major fair folk your characters have encountered, who are they and how did you come up with their specific details?>When it comes to the different editions, which take do you prefer on the fair folk and why, how do they differ? And what would you change about them if you could?>Has your character encountered the fae in their backstory? And what does one need to remember when creating a Fae-Blooded character, PC or otherwise?
My biggest issue with Fae is that they are hard to understand. Not just Shaping Combat frkn 1e and 2e, but in every edition it was somewhat unclear why you'd even want to include them in your game.So I read everything about them. There's a lot of mild divergence and convergence. I actually think 1e's FF categorisation and motives work really well, it's just Shaping Combat needs to not be 50 percent of their Charmset.When you actually look at what Raksha do, how they operate, what wonders are in Border/middlemarches, you can actually consider using them in your game and what unique thing they bring to the table.
>>96683469Because non-Sidereals forget the Sidereal but not the event. They would remember being raped, they just couldn't remember what the rapist looked like. Finally, it'd be pretty noticeable if there were a massive rape spree in Creation where the victims are unable to describe the perp properly and it would lead to a Celestial audit.
>>96684980Let's not forget the fact that mechanically, you can roll to remember the Sidereal if you have a major or defining intimacy for them. I'd imagine that many of the victims would have this, if not all.
>>96684980>Finally, it'd be pretty noticeable if there were a massive rape spree in Creation where the victims are unable to describe the perp properly and it would lead to a Celestial audit.Considering Havesh, it would be believed to be the work of the fay folk.
>>96684639Where do you look for ideas for Exigents? What Exigents have you created so far?
>>96684759They are too "complicated", to the point that the fanbase defaults to more simple takes such as wyld monsters or emotional vampires.
>>96684759>>96685834whenever the fanbase tries to explain Raksha these days, they just default to shoehorn in otherwise unapplicable media. raksha have some complexities, but it's nothing that couldn't genuinely be cleared up in two paragraphs.
>>96685896The base idea is relatively simple "chaotic beings that create guises to interact with to-them toxic reality", the problem is everything built on top.With the rules being obtuse and hard to find.
>>96685031That was what mortal or Dragon-Blooded investigators thought. There are, you know, records in heaven of every SA that ever occurred in Creation, investigators more familiar with a wider array of perpetrators, and there's a good chance that one of your bosses or their co-workers can tell exactly what you did and when.A Sidereal theoretically could end up doing that a bit, but would be called to account for inconsistencies sooner than later. Efficient Secretary Technique could make that happen much sooner.Most of them, though, probably don't have an inclination to do it.
>>96687155For extra fun, even if this hypothetical Sidereal super-rapist were skilled and lucky enough to keep his crimes a secret from everyone but himself, that'll just mean Nara-O will know of his escapades and might inform someone.
Should an enchanted talisman made with Thaumaturgy allow you to command mindless lesser undead such as Hungry Ghosts, or should it only be able to make them non-aggressive towards the bearer? The rules for Thaumaturgy are so barebones I can't say for sure the former would be too OP for what it's capable of doing.
>>96685806Patchwork Chosen of Murder and Medical Malice, Chosen Of Mochi, and Chosen of Lost Weapons. I usually do whatever comes naturally in my mind and figure out things from therehttps://docs.google.com/document/d/1cErQ7XAAuqoSjf9cm5Fng6oRv1YsMQRLkrEIhf6u1L0/edit?usp=sharinghttps://docs.google.com/document/d/109hMP7CMsBYfNtyiWhz0Upc5TiTZU-0BxPSBg9eIQIY/edit?usp=sharinghttps://docs.google.com/document/d/1kYibCWZLcTkSXxmmQp1EuilJlft_P5BwNt1ACNF6Ao0/edit?usp=sharing
>>96684639I just had a thought, could the Chaos gods in Warhammer be translated into Exalted as fair folk? What about greater Yozi souls? Also, in general, where do you look for ideas on Exalted campaigns, artifacts, characters, new demons, etc.?
Why are Hearteaters like this?
>>96687963Slaanesh could be a Neverborn all things considered.
>>96687963They would likely be yozi.Except Slaanesh she is too politically incorrect so she would be redconned from the setting.
>>96688245Onyx Path published a rape apology manifesto in the form of Beast, and tried to sneak in 1e!Raksi's depravations.Don't underestimate them.
>>96688627Oh sure but slaanesh literaly reinforces the tranny=bad narrativeThat's what would stop them.
Can an Eclipse stack the Ox-Body spirit charms on top of their own Solar ones?
>>96688719In theory no, since they're different versions of the same charm, but I've also been curious over whether Solars learning Hardened Devil Body with Primordial Principle Emulation/Eclipse anima can stack it with their own Solar OBT, since Hardened Devil Body doesn't clearly state that it's an equivalent.>Though the Yozis are beyond awareness of most damage, let alone threatened by it, their servants can only manage to embody a fraction of this durability. This Charm may be purchased a maximum number of times equal to the lesser of (Stamina or Resistance). Each purchase gives the Infernal three additional -2 health levels and one extra -4 level.
What counts as "actively concealed" for the limitations of Efficient Secretary Technique?Is it just stuff hidden by Charms or Sorcery? Is it broader? Would something like the existence of vampires in a mixed game not be applicable due to the Masquerade being an active attempt to conceal it, despite the the number of people in the know?
>>96689002>What counts as "actively concealed" for the limitations of Efficient Secretary Technique?>Is it just stuff hidden by Charms or Sorcery? Is it broader? Would something like the existence of vampires in a mixed game not be applicable due to the Masquerade being an active attempt to conceal it, despite the the number of people in the know?My understanding in ExVsWoD is that it's anything being concealed from someone (anyone) by every participant who knows it. The Masquerade is probably the most well-known thing in the World of Darkness which would trigger it, but Efficient Secretary Technique would still be a huge masquerade breach because while it wouldn't pull the whole masquerade, it could absolutely pull a lot of vampire sightings. The main issue is that it's accuracy depends on the sources it's pulling from. In the World of Darkness most of the people it'd get information from would be lone nutcases.Some things that it can't pull up: The position of bandit camps setting up an ambush, the fact that a guy's cheating even if everybody in town 'knows it', or what the (unidentified) disease effecting the village you just walked into is.In 2.5e it gets much more specifically put as 'anything known to at least 100 people', and the Demake has a bunch of examples of where it can and can't be used if you want something closer to ExWoD.
>>96689047>>96689002>My understanding in ExVsWoD is that it's anything being concealed from someone (anyone) by every participant who knows itSorry, I didn't mean 'Something hidden from anyone' I meant 'Something hidden from YOU by everyone who knows'. If there isn't anybody who would tell YOU if you asked then it's being hidden from you. If you're known to be in on the Masquerade already then you can pull good information on the Masquerade. The rule of thumb I use is 'is there anybody I could walk up to and ask about this'.
>>96689047>>96689061Interesting, thank you. Does that mean that the information you can pull from the charm could effectively change depending on the Resplendent Destiny that you are wearing, or if you use Ceasing to Exist Approach?
>>96689061>'is there anybody I could walk up to and ask about this'.This feels like it'd get weirder when you consider spirit courts and the likes, although I suppose the fact that the gods of the Forbidden Manse are tight-lipped by their very nature helps make it straightforward.
>>96689084>Interesting, thank you. Does that mean that the information you can pull from the charm could effectively change depending on the Resplendent Destiny that you are wearing, or if you use Ceasing to Exist Approach?Yes, and yes.>>96689092>This feels like it'd get weirder when you consider spirit courts and the likes, although I suppose the fact that the gods of the Forbidden Manse are tight-lipped by their very nature helps make it straightforward.Yes, more information would become available. Contacts/Connections would make the information change as well, but it doesn't really make sense if you're a member of the White Veil Society and the Efficient Secretary is just constantly insisting that you and all your friends don't exist, you know? Well, maybe for the White Veil Society it'd be fine because they're like that, but any other secret society or location would crop up problems like that too. Does the Efficient Secretary just refuse to acknowledge that Sidereals exist at all?As far as gods go most of them aren't really willing to talk about their domain (or especially the stuff they get up to with other gods) with random people off the street, but you could definitely get things like updates on the weather (from nature spirits, who're more than happy to grumble to anybody about their backbreaking work pushing clouds around), the shape of planned destiny (from your fellows), or history (because almost any god will talk you ass off about their glory days). Most spirit courts are very insular too.
>>96689131This cleared up a lot. Thank you again, anon.
>>96688627I still wonder what the FUCK they were trying to do with that "she eats YOUTHS ironically, as a TEST" bullshit.
>>96690452They wanted to be edgy but in a politically correct way, also known as "safe edgy". The result, as we all saw, was a confused, embarrassing mess that is blatantly, damningly cynical and artless in nature, on top of being laughably dumb.
>>96690466All of 3e has just been one long cavalcade of safe edgy, as well as people trying to pretend their anthropology degrees matter in today's economy. Though to be fair it kind of feels like across the entire TTRPG industry, people have just...kind of forgotten how to write compelling fantasy.It's so bad the last one with actual gritty lore in it I can find is fucking Kult, and that's because the entire selling point of that game is to make your skin crawl.
>>96690452Doesn't seem ironic to me. What gives you that impression?>>96690478>as well as people trying to pretend their anthropology degrees matter in today's economy.>>implying any degree has any value in today's job market
>>96690639>implying any degree has any value in today's job marketSome do, anon. Doctorates are still mostly good, only somewhat degraded - it hasn't been long enough yet for people to start and finish one with AI, after all. In some fields they're worth toilet paper but that's more because the fields are worth toilet paper to most people. Life sciences, engineering, psychology, education, and law are still valid. It's mostly humanities, business, communication, and so on that aren't respected whatsoever.
>>96690452>I still wonder what the FUCK they were trying to do with that "she eats YOUTHS ironically, as a TEST" bullshitFor some strange reason, they saw the baby eating as being essential to her character.So when the fanbase complained, they reworded it a bit, to have their cake and eat it.The ironic baby/youth eating is similar, they write Raksi as a Howardian depraved mad sorcerer queen, such as Nakari or Salome, but still want the fanbase to side with her.
>Eclipse caste.Reading their caste book, it becomes more apparent that they didn't know what to do with them.Just the recommendation media alone reveals it.>>96690478>All of 3e has just been one long cavalcade of safe edgy, as well as people trying to pretend their anthropology degrees matter in today's economy>the writes.>Studying humanities.They just heard some concept and try to haphazardly insert it in their writing, such as "food is a society foundation" and "culture heroes", it is noticeable that despite knowing those, they don't really understand what they entail.And the writing is more trope & fiction based than anything, they write based on pop-culture instead of ancient cultures.They used "the Bronze age" to describe the middle ages.
>>96684639Let’s talk about God-Blooded in general. Have you ever made or played as one, Exalted or otherwise? And what do you need to consider when doing so? Especially for the different types like Fae-Blooded and Demon-Blooded. And not to mention how the parents met…
>>96690749>For some strange reason, they saw the baby eating as being essential to her character.It is. Right here:>Raksi as a Howardian depraved mad sorcerer queen, such as Nakari or Salome>but still want the fanbase to side with herBingo. The nudevs don't understand that every organization has its rotten apples, and those rotten apples having positions of power, in addition to their personal puissance and competence, is the very reason the setting is in the shape it is. They don't call it the Age of Sorrows for no reason.
>>96691214>every organization has its rotten applesWho even is a purely bad guy in 3e anymore? It's basically just the Neverborn and characters that've been essentially brainwashed by them like the Dowager, spectres, and hungry ghosts, right?By the way, why the fuck did the people who claim to like 1e presentation of Abyssals take the 2e character assassination and decide the solution was to make her even more clearly evil (post-brainwashing) rather than revert it to 1e where she was one of the most reasonable to work for, what with her forsaking the end of the world agenda to attempt to go renegade out from under the Neverborn? It seems like a departure from their stated goals re: chivalry of death and lieges worth the name and so on.
>>96691931NTA, but I haven't read much from 1e so you'll have to fill me in on what 1e Dowager was like.
>>96691951So you know how in 2e she's just endlessly pulling monsters from the Well of Udr? Well, in 1e she... isn't. You know how in 2e she wonders if there might be other universes in the depths of the Well, but the Neverborn tell her that no, there aren't, and that in fact she is searching for the Anti-Creation that instantly obliterates all life? Well, in 1e... the Neverborn don't do that, and she isn't searching for the end of everything. In 2e she's convinced that there is no escape from the Neverborn and has become the perfect adherent of their cause and in 1e she isn't and has not.I'm going to use the words character assassination again because 2e's writeup very much feels like they've looked through every important point that made her character approachable in 1e and inverted it to be worse and more awful. As in, they've gone through one by one copying paragraphs but adding riders like 'but actually the Neverborn say no and she knows they're right, so she knows what she has to do; destroy the world' or slipping in a 'except her goals don't make sense and are unachievable because she's crazy'.
>>96691931>Who even is a purely bad guy in 3e anymore? It's basically just the Neverborn and characters that've been essentially brainwashed by them like the Dowager, spectres, and hungry ghosts, right?Arguably the same characters, they are somehow more self-serving and less self-aware than before.People complained about the fake edge, but didn't notice the fake morality ambiguousness.
>>96692178>she is looking for salvation>she is certainly mistaken.She still is hopelessly bound.
>>96690749> but still want the fanbase to side with her.Doesn't seem like that to me. The tone seems to consistently and intentionally portray her as an unstable nutcase. I feel like this is another one of those "it was revealed to me in a dream" moment this thread has where some people hallucinate things that aren't really there in 3e simply because they don't really read it.
>>96692218>She still is hopelessly bound.Yeah, but they say the same thing about Abyssals.
>>96692287>. I feel like this is another one of those "it was revealed to me in a dream" moment this thread has where some people hallucinate things that aren't really there in 3e simply because they don't really read it.In this case, it is well documented that SLS simps for her.They even threw Ma-Ha-Suchi under the bus to prop Raksi up.
>>96692330>They even threw Ma-Ha-Suchi under the bus to prop Raksi up.Man, don't even get me started on Ma-Ha-Suchi. From walking cautionary tale and prime example of how low an Exalt (and more relevantly a Lunar) can sink when they allow their grudges drive them mad because they can't let go of what they lost and move on, instead endlessly stewing in their own bitterness as it drives them to ever-blacker depths of evil, to... fucking Asgore from Undertale.
>>96692497I think it was a case of convergent evolution, 3e!Ma-Ha-Suchi is basically a canceled celebrity.Which makes things somehow worse.
>>966921782e did an incredible amount of damage to the Exalted line didn't it. Just dang. Mind you Exalted being just another setting with a multiverse is also really fucking lame.One day we're going to have an RPG that isn't set in some weird multiverse and I'm going to be so happy.
>>96693209The existence of other universes was mentioned in 1e as seen here >>96692178It is just WW lack of self control, they railed against stuff and setting assumptions that they themselves wrote in.A notorious example is the rule against time travel, they keep trying to create openings in it.
>>96693236>A notorious example is the rule against time travel, they keep trying to create openings in it.nah isok Yozi can do it they're above and not bound by the gods' self imposed morality
>>96691931>chivalry of deathI fucking cringe every time I hear that phrase.Abyssals literaly and knowingly sell their souls when offered the black exaltation they know they are the bad guys
>>96693236It's honestly pretty weird. The Time Travel thing is a perfect example, what with 2e adding time travel to Malfeas for... well, no good reason. Or that one primordial who if they wake up it's game over. So many stupid things in this setting that just make the whole of it worse.Mortals just dying in Malfeas making adventures in it 1000x harder, making the Yozi into easily understood human neets, sneaking in as many "free revive" and "Make copy of target" spells you can possible jam in there... Eh. By trying to make the setting have everything they just make the whole thing so much smaller. We already have DnD, there is no reason to flat out steal and copy from it.
>>96693348
>>96693309funny thing is I don't think there is a single version of exalted where the abyssals actually sell their soul. The actually canon is they are offered the choice when they are about to die and saying no kills them. Regret is a big thing about abyssals along with redemption. At least in 2e.Infernals in 2e might be closer, people who could have been solars but instead lost and are bitter about it. Even still they have an unbound demon right in front of them trying to convince them to become one or else they'll be ate so... Heck they're even willing to torture you if they think you'll make a good infernal.
>>96693348>Or that one primordial who if they wake up it's game over.Literally a pegana reference>making the Yozi into easily understood human neetsNGL I don't think thats bad because they are the guys that built the world it makes perfect sense they would fill the world with things that please them and once they got bored they went to heaven to play Xbox all day.leave being alien to the unshaped the yozi wanted confort and freedom.
>>96693379The focus on high essence stuff in exalted 2e was weird and confusing. I still don't get making essence something you can increase in character gen, such a weird design choice. Then they double down on it basically being your character level with all coolest NPC's being essence 10. It was so odd.I'm exaggerating a bit but honestly not by that much.
>>96693381If I remember correctly Abyssals know they are making a deal with terrible beings who want to destroy the world.
>>96693414It is a thing since 1e Vampire the masquerade days.In WW games, the power/level stat is harder to increase in game than in play.And by the way that the charms are tied to the essence rating, it would be harder to a PC get the latter charms in play or play a sorcerer from chargen (you need essence 3 for terrestrial)
>>96693448That doesn't seem right. from what I remember a human who is about to die gets an offer from the Neverborn. If they accept they become an Abyssal. If they don't they die. I think the offer is "Help me destroy Creation and I'll let you live".Point is they still have their soul and if they say no they die. They're aware that having to destroy creation is part of the deal though, so not exactly good guys. They're just people who will literally die if they pick the other option. I don't think they're even given awareness as to what the Neverborn and Deathlords are till like... later.Infernals are the same way. If they say no demons eat them. Solars don't even get the choice from what I understand, it just HAPPENS. I could be wrong about that however.
>>96693448>>96693507
>>96693521Ahh the Deathlords are the ones who talk them into it. that makes more sense, seeing as how the Neverborn can't really talk. Abyssals slowly realizing just exactly what it was they made a deal with seems to be a big deal for them. Not much a choice though, seeing as how they'll literally die. Good way to get around the morality of it all, if a bit basic.
>>96693507>Point is they still have their soul and if they say no they die. They're aware that having to destroy creation is part of the deal though, so not exactly good guys. They're just people who will literally die if they pick the other option. I don't think they're even given awareness as to what the Neverborn and Deathlords are till like... later.To wit.
>>96693507>Help me destroy Creation and I'll let you livebro>>96693521see they are knowingly making a deal with the devil selling their souls(name and destiny) to be forced to bring death werever they go.
>>96693521
>>96693583Hang on bro, lemme shack you in the gut and leave you bleeding out in an alley. When you're lying in a pool of your own blood struggling to breathe, watching your guts leaking out of you and seeing your vision growing dark at the edges let's see how selfless and noble you are for the sake of the rest of the world.Idiot.
>>96693602*shank
>>96693583They will literally die if they say no and are being offered literal superpowers from beings that are hyper charismatic. It's less a choice and more something you'd have to be pretty dumb to say no too. Unless dying sounds fun or something.Pretty sure that's the point even. How do you get around the morality of saying you're going to destroy the world? oh. you''ll literally die if you say no. there you go, easy. That and the whole "not knowing what you're dealing with".funny thing is from what I remember solars don't really have a choice. Could be wrong about that though, but it's amusing to think that infernals and abyssals can say no but solars can't.
>>96693600
>>96693602>>96693614I didn't say it wasn't a choice made under duress.It is purposefuly unfair to them to push as many as possible to agree but agree they did they took on the curse that is the abyssal exaltation knowing they will help murder the world.And yeah Solars don't get a choice nor most other exaltations because they come with no strings attached unlike Abyssals and Infernals whose patrons want them to destroy the world.
It's less than Solars "don't get" a choice and more than the choice(s) they made is what made them a Solar in the first place.
>>96693521oh missed a part
>>96693690In the CB nights, the exaltations were more twists of fate.They were mostly exalted after a failure or in grave risk of life.
>>96693719
Not Exalted and not a 1:1 but this is similar to how the average Abyssal Exaltation plays out. For Dusk Castes at least.
>>96693690Abyssals are Solar candidates but they died without being exalted by him
Has anyone actually played a Raksha PC? Not a Faeblooded, but an actual Raksha.
>>96684639What is supposed to come out next for Exalted, and what are you most excited for? For me it’s Infernals, followed closely by the new Exalt types.
>>96694059>For me it’s InfernalsI'm sorry for what you are about to experience.
>>96694059I'm a punk rocker yes I am...I am also looking forward to the Infernals. I rather like all the little lore changes 3e has done so far and I don't expect to dislike this one. I have it on good authority that their isn't going to be fetish wear though and I'm very sad to see spandex go the way of the exalted dodo. BDSM nun is peak exalted and i refuse to think otherwise.
>>96694469Actual punk or safe edgy punk?
With Protomen Act III out (partly), how would you do a game inspired by them?https://theprotomen.bandcamp.com/album/act-iii-this-city-made-us
>>96694193What do you mean?>>96694469She’s probably my favorite 2e Infernal, yeah. Hopefully she gets a writeup in 3e.
>>96694529>What do you mean?3e Infernal are now all whitewashed into being Rebels. Expect a lot of self-insert woke projection and politically correct venting from writers being poured into new Infernal lore.Personally i preferred original preview of Infernals being Sultans of Hell. Solars at the height of thier depravity and selfishness and loving it.
>>96694510fuck what a blast from the past. beards going nowhere.
>>96694644What about Demake's Rockstars of Hell?
>>96694644>3e Infernal are now all whitewashed into being Rebels. Expect a lot of self-insert woke projection and politically correct venting from writers being poured into new Infernal lore.The weird part is how they outright combat evil, not in universe perspective, but out of it.
>>96695092>not in universe perspectiveLol they do tho?He'll go take a look at essence you get rewarded for killing evil tyrants.You don't get rewarded as heavily for being actually evil.
>>96695135Like I mentioned, they are rewarded to be good out of universe, like a paladin from D&D.
>>96695175It's not out of universe it's a mechanic that represents things that happen in universe.
>>96694644You're not wrong about the self insert woke projection, but I feel that if you make Infernals into Solars at the height of their depravity makes you ask "What's so bad about the Solars, then, if the worst ones are all taken away?"Here's to hoping that Crab Mummy makes it into Ex3.
>>96695249NTA but that makes no sense.Infernals would be evil solar reflections similar to Abyssals but from a different angle.They are not the evil Solars they are what Solar were at their worst and can be once again.Like how Abyssals are nihilism Infernals would be hubris.
>>96695282Maybe, but I still think that takes away from both Solars, Abyssals, and Infernals. They need to lean harder into being theoir own distinct things.
>>96695249It is one reason for why the Solaroids aren't good splat foils to Solars.The writers are writing the splats as characters instead of classes or castes; which may explain Exigents.Abyssals whitewash their future.While Infernals whitewash the past.And 3e!Infernals replace them as "good guys with bad reputation".
>>96695287>They need to lean harder into being theoir own distinct things.Why?They are all Solars.They reflect each other:>The passinate hero>The nihilist hero>The fallen hero
>>96695345I just feel that Solars are easily able to be all three and the Abyssals and Infernals should lean harder into being more of Death and of Hell instead.
>>96695345Not really, it was vanilla Solars who committed those atrocities during the first age.
>>96695369Yeah they all have different powers accentuating their themes Abyssals having powers that bring death to all they don't grow things they destroy.While Infernals likewise corrupt creation.>>96695380They did just like how Solars also murder.So Abyssals and Infernals are exaggerated caricatures of those extremes.
