Renegade Ghoul Edition>Previous Thread>>96809390>Pastebinhttps://pastebin.com/WiCHizn0>Mediafirehttps://mediafire.com/folder/s9esc6u7ke8k5/CofD>Mega Ihttps://mega.nz/folder/ePQ1BKhJ#RCosRCh59Ki2Mpb1M9H3Uw>Mega II (also containing fanmade games)https://mega.nz/folder/ZbQ2zLJA#DOT-3df6rS2lLet4_RmqJQ>WoD5 Megahttps://mega.nz/folder/7rQQ1LbQ#16_AiXVGo0P3_rVOJuoZyA>STV content foldershttps://pastebin.com/9i9zhydQ>General Creation Kithttps://mega.nz/#F!FWJgBTbb!f7d5rARWHYzuI8-8aI-Bxw>Ideas: BJ Zanzibar's WoDhttp://167.99.155.149/>Anders Mage Pagehttp://mage.gearsonline.net/anders/>White Wolf Wiki:https://whitewolf.fandom.com/wiki/Main_Page>Thread QuestionHave you ever had a ghoul take on a prominent and or antagonist role in your chronicle?
Ghouls are just for sex.
I just watched the Howling and I have to say, what an absolutely retarded movie. The most dangerous werewolves were the ones with guns.
So are like all the Tzimisce fucked up (more so than the usual Cainite) by nature or is it purely by nurture and if you got someone freshly turned out of eastern Europe he could "grow up" to be sort of normal by vampire standards?
>>96818981I thought vampires weren't sexual unless you're a 14th or up generation thinblood?
>>96818988Depending on if they ever explored it fully. I'd wager a good part of it comes from trying to parse and process information they get when they're morphed via studying vicissitude. Baring that, probably nurture if it's 20th. Gotta learn how to be polite and courteous somehow.
>>96818988Vicissitude is an actual daemonic alien entity residing within them. The whole bloodline is fucked.
>>96818992It's a humanity issue not a generational one. Unless you wanna make a dhampir like some kind of chunni.
>>96818992That screencap is from Requiem I believe.
why did V5 "condense" all the disciplines anyways?
>>96818988Pushing the limits of their physical and mental self isn't necessarily a Tzimisce thing. It's specifically a Path of Metamorphosis thing. Tzim following another Path could be more "normal".
>>96819040to simplify things for new players and clear game of some "problematic" ideas
After a blood and drug fueled group hallucination where we heard the voices of the ancients and saw their machinations, our cotire is now conspiring to desert the camarilla and join the sword of caine. One of the members (me) happens to be a tremere and so I wanted to check, the antitribu are a bloodline, specifically the chiler of goratrix and his followers right? I won't get an unsightly brand on my forehead?
>>96819015They rectonned the aliens.
Anyone up for a woofs loli list? What about wizards and techies? I know barely anything about the two so I couldn’t do it well myself.
>>96819068yes we know V5 is dogshit and noncanon fanfiction
>>96819063Sabbat antitribu are not mechanically different from camarilla Tremere.Except, of course, for the odd Telyavelic Tremere. >I won't get an unsightly brand on my forehead?IIRC, you get the mark the first time you join the vaulderie.
>>96819015shut up 2e>>96819040'Efficient' design philosophy made to suck the soul out of anything.
>>96819015Elaborate
>>96819112Could have sworn it was retconned out long before V5.
>>96819127It's just bullshit made up to scary cammies. Go back to bed
>>96819112>there's someone willing to die on the demonic alien virius that spreads through body horror discipline hillkek
>>96819008Explored what fully?
>>96819164that shit was awesome, you just have no soul
>>96819173Why Fiends are so fucked up or posited a handful of explanations. Ala Ventrue are sniveling brats that throw tantrums cause that's the type they tend to embrace. Lasombra are thugs and capos because of their initiations, mostly. That sort of thing. Brujah are contrarians because of caine's curse and both OG brujah being contrarians themselves.Tzimisce picking a childe is basically luck of the draw unless you're the sire then you know why you picked your childe.
>>96819192Shit was stupid, stop larping as a grok that thinks anything old is automatically good.
>>96819222all the weird edgy shit in OWoD was why it was fun. The more they've shaved off the rough edges, no matter how "ew weird gross" it may seem in hindsight, the less of a soul the entire setting has. It becomes increasingly impossible to tell the difference between WoD and any other urban horror setting like Esoterrorists as time goes on.
>>96819015I thought it was from the underworld not outer space
>>96819236Deep umbra is outer space. You can access the deep umbra by not going to outer space however
>>96819224It wasn't edgy, it was straight up stupid. Not "oh man, this is so fucked up I hope they don't censor it in the future", but "that's fucking retarded and actively makes the whole clan less evil and scary and more stupid and lame".
>>96819192I liked Malkavia out of CofD, so I don't know if you're right or if I'm horny for the idea of a color out of space hacking vampires and using them as media to translate itself into the world.
>>96819224It's way more edgy that the tzimisce are actually that fucked up by themselves than just because they're under the control of a retarded alien.
>>96818987>The most dangerous werewolves were the ones with gunsGlass Walker supremacy, lol. Though I will use this opportunity to talk about a Fetish I made (with some input from the group) for my pack leader. She is a Glass Walker Ahroun with a cheerleader background, and recently has joined the Wise Guys camp. Her patron saint is known for an incident where he brandished a pistol to scare off bandits from his town. My PC isn't high enough rank to make a Fetish gun for her himself, but he was able to go on a road trip with her, uh, "uncle" and help out.SOSPIRATRICELevel 3, Gnosis 6An old Colt Navy revolver, previously belonging to a vampire-hunting priest. Now inhabited by the spirit of a storm petrel, found in a ruined Spanish mission on the California coast. The spirit desires that once each month, it be taken to a place by the sea or high above the surrounding land, there to feel the wind through the chambers of the gun.The Fetish is activated with a specific kind of flourish, maybe a spin of the chamber or of the gun itself. Each success on the activation roll prepares a charge of wind that lasts for the scene. Kelly may declare she is using one of the wind blasts when she fires the gun. With each blast, Kelly may knock a human-sized target back by several yards and force a knockdown check (default Dex + Athletics, Diff. 8) regardless of whether the bullet inflicts damage, OR fire at the ground (wall, ceiling) beneath her feet to make a reflexive jump with double distance.Additionally, while holding the gun, Kelly can sometimes feel a breeze that warns her of innocents in peril. In defense of those innocents, the spirit offers her a greater measure of power. The gun’s attacks deal Aggravated damage during this crisis.
>>96819061what was problematic about the old way any of the disciplines worked?
>>96819250Really? At some point I did want to ask what space was like in the WoD since the technocrats had a or a few branches who did stuff in space, and the ramifications of bringing vampires to other planets, things like that.
>>96819360Nothing, anon's confusing his pissing with his moaning. Paradox felt they were too spread outso int he name of being efficient they sucked the fun out of clans by condensing.
>>96819371WoD unironically does not extend past the solar system, going farther is breaching into new dimensions and universes. All of WoD takes place within Ravenloft.
>>96819371depends mage and werewolf have different outer spaces in mage space is the umbra and the VE are trying to fix that while in werewolf it's the space you and i know and there is just no gauntlet as for vampires there are some theories in and out of universe that as soon as vampires get away from earth the sunlight curse won't work anymore because of how the angels worded it, but nobody tried it so far
>>96819383they may as well condense the fucking clans... wait fuck
>>96819371Like the other anon said. It gets exponentially weirder and more alien the further you get away from earth. Void engineers, from the technocracy, tend to deal with it regularly.That said, you can accidentally enter Deep Umbra by just diving too deeply in the ocean, or getting too far away from civilization in the wilderness. It gets funny like that.Vampires would probably have a helluva time in space since their thing with the sun is metaphysical though they're probably okay on not needing to breath. Surviving what else is out is present in the Umbra is another matter.
>The more they've shaved off the rough edges, no matter how "ew weird gross" it may seem in hindsight, the less of a soul the entire setting hasFor me, it's two Uratha mating resulting in a horrible womb-burster monster fetus
>>96819437>and yet they just. can't. stop. doing it again and again
>>96819383>every vampire and their mother has like presence and gets to learn them passively by just taking blood from another vampireIt really was a bit crazy how they did it. There weren't even that many disciplines too
>>96819437Is this the forsaken?
>>96819069Is it even possible to have werewolf lolis? I thought that the first change comes with puberty
>>96819471yes, Uratha is WtF
You guys remember that space opera supplement for cofd, infinite macabre? Well in a theoretical scenario, tzimeze fleshcrafted spaceships, yea or nay? Yes they are old world not chronicles but fuck you I like them
>>96819484wtf is right
Which is your favorite Realm of Radiance game?
>>96819521masks the vampirate
>>96819069A large portion of Changelings count.
>>96819047I like the Path of the Tyrant (or Road of Kings in general) for Tzimisce as well.People feel too locked into a lot of stereotypes and finding new ways to enjoy your favorite clan is interesting.
Be a good person
>>96819535Oh right, it's not part of the main true but sure. We can include changelings too, though I know even less about them than woofs and wizards
>>96819495Other than propulsion, what would a vampire even need protection from? Sunlight? Do distant stars even count for the curse of Caine?
>>96819521Valiant: The Mask though it's closely tied with Magic: The Academy. Luv me my capekino and not-Harrypotter
>>96819643the Sun God floating around in the Umbra
>>96819495sounds like a good foe for a Void Engineer centered/adjacent chronicle.An Elder Fiend that took his Vicissitude studies to the stars and has a whole ecosystem of fleshcrafted horrors manning the inner workings
>>96819484Ironic that chronicles kept more of the silly edgy bits that made older editions fun while v5 sanitized everything
>>96819726The Slashers book alone is a lulzy cornucopia of edge.
>>96819015>The whole bloodline is fucked.Well yes but mainly because the Eldest is going to fleshcraft them all into its form kinda like that dude from Slither. I hope the Tremere remember which clan's blood they originally used to turn themselves into vampires.
>>96819199Iirc a good portion of tzimisce come from their revenant families.
>>96819812>vampire all the way downMakes sense
>>96819795 That's a major plotpoint in one of the gehenna scenarios
>>96819850I intentionally used that scenario just to fuck with that guy at my table.
>>96819795>>96819850Is there a way to free yourself from your bloodline curse? Caitiff looking like the best boys right about now (if they weren't bullied by their envious brothers).
>>96819887Being thin-blood. Legacy curse is right up there with vampirism. It ain't getting removed outside of plot device stuff.
>>96819521Personally a toss up between Fairie: The Journey or Cosmos: The DaringSure they get shit on for being the same thing just one being magic the other scifi but they have some unique charms.Fairie's quest system is nice and the land of the fae is such a cool conceptCosmos is just old Scifi pulp stories set out a a ttrpg and that's just fun
>>96818988"Normal" Tzimisce are cringe and I have never seen one that wasn't wish fulfillment or fetish bait.
>>96819850There's another where a conscious Malkav swallows all the minds of his clan and occupies the shells. Even Ravnos can push a self-destruct button inside his bloodline before he dies, nobody's safe.
would a salubri lose their unique powers if their 3rd eye got removed via vicissitude
>>96819925Wait how would a normal tzimisce be fetish bait? What kinda fetish would it be that you couldnt get from another concept?
>>96819906I was asking if there was a plot device that would free you from that specific aspect of your curse. I can imagine some kind of ritual or artifact that does the trick buried in a paragraph of a 200 page lore book no one likes.
>>96819925Anon, all vampires are fetish bait. Every single one.
>>96819973listen just because "someone out there has a fetish for it" is true, doesn't mean every splat is someone's fetish
>>96819954I assume only the disciplines that require their third eye would cease to function. So drawing someone's soul into your third eye wouldnt work but healing wounds by touching them would.
Say a mortal was getting fucked up by a werewolf or some other supernatural threat and didn't immediately die. If they screamed loud enough for something to give them the power to actually fight, what might metaphysically answer?
>>96820043My dick.
>>96820043either the messengers or they might awaken as a mage
>>96820016i thought any discipline use, regardless of level, makes use of the third eyebut also wild idea: what if a tzimisce were to pluck a salubri's third eye out and meld it in his own forehead...?
>>96820043Demons.
>>96820065Technically the third eye doesnt open until the third dot of Obeah or the 5th dot of Valeren
>>96820177it doesn't have any powers on its own? or any mystical properties a normal eye wouldn't have?
Don't forget about Space: the Future.>>96819695>not-Harrypotter"Harry Notter" was right there...
>>96820043I actually decided to ask AI for ha-has and it gave a decent answer, which is surprising. And in short, there is at least one thing from every splat that could potentially answer, and some of them are hilarious. The idea of a werewolf chimping out only for the person it's trying to kill to get invested with a spirit by Gaia with the express purpose of giving the woof a lesson in humility is hilarious.
>>96819918 I would play that.
>>96820200>Space: the Fututredoes anyone even play those Records of Radiance spinoffs? I swear to god people only like Cosmos: the Daring... it's so fucking tiring
>>96818988People focus on Path of Metamorphosis Tzim too much, a high humanity one can make himself(and others) look like the most attractive people on the world
>>96819954The third eye cannot be removed by vicissitude.Just like a Gangrel's mutations, or a Nosferatu's ugliness, those blood curses/weaknesses ALWAYS manifest back. Vissicitude can hide it for a little bit but when they Awaken the next night their body is sort of reset. Normal vampires will have fleshcrafting stay, because the blood isn't enforcing anything, a Salubri could get their face changed, & be fine, but the Third Eye will always re-manifest. Just like a Nosferatu could get their ugliness fixed only for it to settle back in by the next night, it could even be a new kind of ugly that's just as bad. And anyone who learns Obeah/Valoren gets a third eye too. Now a Tzim could pluck an eye out & if they had some way to keep it from ashing, they might get to mold it onto themselves, but it wouldn't come with any interest power or ability, a Cainite's power is in the blood not the flesh, the body might as well be a bag that holds the blood. The blood shapes the bag you understand? That's why you develop fangs & narcotic spit, the blood forces the Vessel to change.
>>96820332Trims make the best cockroaches. There are more than a couple of Tzim Disciplines that if used right, can make you all but unkillable.Add mass, shape mass into full sized bodies, use Body Impolitic to let them be extentions of yourself. Let one body puppet soak into the ground in some deep dark cave in Peru or some shit. Have a half dozen body puppets in a half dozen cities, spying in every sect if you want. Even if they destroy a puppet, you won't die.
>>96820378Do your detached limbs grow back if they are destroyed or do you have to make a other one
>>96820363very insightful, thank you anon
>>96819401Wrong. The Aetherial Realm is the Umbral reflection of outer space, which is physical. Both stretch on and on into interstellar space.>>96819437That was just copied from what happened with two Mokole having a kid in W:tA.>>96819481Tarjei Hardrule experienced his change at age 8 when his family was massacred. He's an outlier in a lot of ways, though. (see: Get of Fenris Revised). Not that you'd really experience much of a different time when any given Garou of any age shifts into Crinos, of course.
Mage: the Awakening seems overpowered to me. There was no need to make rules for Archmasters and Ascension, since the Chronicles of Darkness have a more "street-level" tone and the average player would be killed long before they reached that level of power.
>>96819918>Fairie's quest system is nice and the land of the fae is such a cool conceptWait a second, that does sound cool, maybe giving a big focus on quests would be a nice CtD story idea
>>96818867Bloodlines tourist here. I'm considering getting bunch of VtM with Dark Ages books irl because I digital just doesn't do it for me. I currently have V20 core book and 5 Dharma books right now. I see there are fuckton of them but don't know which ones are worth buying. Which books would you recommend to get?
>>96820388The separated body part ashes if destroyed. So the Discipline power for the most part let's you "chop off" a body part & let it roam around separate from you. So you can leave your eye somewhere & spy on people, or let your hand run off & be Thing from the Addams family, or smush your eye into the hand to have like a little familiar or whatever. Vissicitude let's you sculpt all kinds of crazy shit though so the sky is the limit if you are creative. Your animate parts even carry a little bit of Vitae (based on mass) so you can use Disiplines remotely through them. (Like say Dominate someone by hiding your eye somewhere they can find. If you wanted, you could just be a torso, & let your arms & legs run around by themselves, or if you're really creative, smush your brain & heart together in a flesh bag to put somewhere incredibly safe, & pilot your body like a puppet with none the wiser, this might lower your Vitae by like a point to justify your heart needing to hold something.Now, there isn't anything 100% concrete ruling wise for if a Tzim can add mass to themselves with normal base 1-3 dot Vissicitude. I would say most of the stories & meta suggest you can, but even so, there is a Disipline power that does let you for sure. This means you can raid a morgue or what have you & make an umbilical between you & a corpse pile. Declare the corpses Nas your limbs, fill them with Vitae (a normal human body can hold 10) & then sever the umbilical to have your own puppet. Fill back up with Vitae & repeat. You can mold the puppets into clones of you or keep them different so it's "disguised". Give the puppets fangs so they can feed themselves & now you have a perverbial army of yourself. Worst restriction is they only hold 10 Vitae in their bodies, which still isn't bad. But like I said, you can hind parts of yourself all over the place, make parts look like animals or other people etc. If your "core" gets destroyed you can regen from a limb/puppet too
>>96820519You can read every VTDA book here for free and then buy your favorites. If you really want recs, I suggest corebooks and roadbooks. The former is just good material to have and gives you the most amount of tools, the latter plays to VTDA's strength. Vampire, but having broken away entirely from the very 90s sensibilities. Even if you're tepid on the Road system itself, each road book has a lot of good stuff in it. Want the vampire noble guide? Road of Kings. Want to know how vampires cope their way into a deep and earnest faith? Road of Heaven. On the other hand, I think the premade adventures, city/regionbooks, and even Libellus Sanguinis (didn't have time for true clanbooks so everyone got lumped together) are honestly kinda weak. Lacking sects, VTDA has an unfortunate habit of over-relying on clans as stand-ins for ethnic groups, social movements, and historical events. Some people like that stuff but I find it boring and somewhat limiting.
Speaking of Bloodlines you have to give Paradox credit for being so fucking incompetent they didn't bother mandating any memberberries for Bloodlines 2 even though Arkham Harley who kicked off the entirety of nu-Harley's reign is literally Jeanette. All that potential squandered.
>>96820647See you say that and it's probably for the better. I stumbled across one reference that's tucked away.inb4 my res is ass
>>96820647Fuck's a memberberry?
Relative newfag here, been wanting to host a oWoD game set in my home state of Florida any good books that go somewhat in depth of what goes bump in the night in Florida? Ik Maimi has been mention quite a bit but its also a mess with having a Prince turned Baron and a Archbishop at the same time.
>>96820771Term for nostalgia bait, usually to boost sales. Often associated with term sour grapes. Originated from South Park.
What clan would make for the most interesting geneticist scientist in modern nights? Tremere, Tzimisce, and Toreador are a bit too obvious for me.
>>96820873Gangrel or Hecata. Maybe Ministry depending on the set up.
>>96820873Tremere and Nagaraja
>>96820775I think most references to Florida in oWoD are in C20.
>>96820873Nosferatu inspecting their curse on genetic level
>>96820873Salubri
>>96820873Ventrue running a genetics firm (he's not just a businessman, has a PHD and an MD). Lots of money to be made if the technology ever gets good enough, and Ventrue connections can get you all the grants you need to keep your operation in the green. On his own time he's looking into figuring out if his clan's blood requirement is purely psychosomatic or if there are any objective physical markers.
I thought anon was exxagarating how incompetent Seattle Camarilla is and wow, anon wasn't kidding.They are all retarded. I don't think they realize how fucked they would be if they were actually talking to a proper Elder like that.Especially that faggot Nos.
I haven't been keeping up. Does the game suck balls
>>96821225It's mixed. I've looked on reddit and a lot of VTM fans enjoy it for the worldbuilding, story and narrative. VTM:B fans dislike it because it's not a sequel, it's just a game in the same universe with a game's name they hold dear attached to it. Combat is more like dishonored which people will like or not but it does seem to have massively cut back on a lot of RPG elements.I think it's a case of what you make of it. I would wait for a sale though so they can fix some technical issues.
>>96821225Sucks. 4/10 overall. Some parts can make it to 6/10 but they are rare.
>>96819887Caitiff eventually morph and evolve into weirder shit, not even as a curse. Flesh of slime, insectoid limbs. They just usually don't live long enough to reach that stage.
>>96819952>Ravnos>deadPeople saw what it wanted them to see during that week. You think mere weapons can destroy a creature of that power? We are all living in its dream now.
>>96821358I dont believe you
>>96820414>The Aetherial Realm is the Umbral reflection of outer spaceThere's nothing out there, thus not physical. Going further means crossing into the next Umbra, the next world that was designed by a different God, which is just another shard of the Prime.
>>96821376Read their section in Outcasts: a Player's Guide to Pariah.
Are any of the WoD games outside of VTMB1+2 on steam worth playing?
>>96819990Would
>>96819040Most of them struggled to fill the 5 dot power requirements.
>>96821437Redemption, coteries and shadows of new york are fine. Besides that you need to take a look at mediocre and smaller scale games.
>>96821249>reddit likes itanybody who demands any form of standards from this IP has abandoned reddit ages ago. what's left would praise a dead rat in a box for it's world building and narrative
>>96821437Justice is if you have VR set.
>>96819887>Is there a way to free yourself from your bloodline curse?sure, it's called Golconda
>>96821039>Make only Noz a Faggot Jokes write themselves People are already saying it blows VTMB 1 because >Steamcharts
>>96821249The lore and story are written by someone who read the back of VTM5 and ran it through a gay jojo fanfic writer The fact you play as an elder runs so many red flagsYou know why one had you be newly embraced?Because you're a modern man not expected to know shitTossed in an unknown supernatural world nobody knows what the fuck is going onBut Elder?They are alien creatures that lose more and more humanity each decadeEven the ones sleeping 100 years would be truly foreign to the modern world and need ghouls in order to function They made you one for combat powers That's itNo storyNo intrigueJust bigger combat
>>96820915any specific books? I am skimming through the core rulebook and all I am seeing is mentions of Maimi being a Sabbat stronghold.
>>96821650>They made you one for combat powersAnd even that flops on its face because ghouls and thinbloods kick your ass. And the combat powers aren't even cool or fun.
I felt more power in Bloodlines 1 at the start, nevermind at the end game where I was mowing down Sabbat, Keuijin and SWAT Vampires of LaCroix.
>>96820441The primary appeal of Mage the Awakening is the power fantasy, the dream of becoming a reality-warper who can dominate anything else in the setting, that anything is possible for you if you play the game right and you're smart about everything you do. If you're looking for more personal drama, intrigue or horror, find another setting. Mage the Awakening is for making its players feel like they're powerful, smart and powerful because they're smart.
>>96821827If paradox made a game set in the first city the antediluvians would be struggling against thin-blooded time travelers.
>>96821965No wonder magefags are so insufferable.
>>96820696Remember that game you liked?Remember how different it was?
>>96821965That’s just the meme way of explaining it.In reality mages are just obsessive freaks who die earlier than most other splats. It’s no joke, the sheer amount of new mages that suffer fates worse than death due to their inability to not poke at something. The veteran mages also don’t give a fuck because to them this is a sort of culling to keep their numbers exceptional. “He died did he? He didn’t deserve to be a mage.”
>>96822773That's the lore. I'm talking about the gameplay experience of playing Mage the Awakening as a player.
>>96822836If your players aren’t obsessive nerds, or suicidally arrogant(hubristic) to the point of shame, then they don’t deserve to play Mage. They just don’t. Mages are nosey, not flexy.
Embarrassing.
>>96820771https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=OJoQJKTc3nM
>>96820465CtD already has a big focus on quests, tons of plothooks start with a character taking an oath or being given a geas to complete some mythic task. Despite what this thread would have you believe, Changeling is not a game about being killed by your 9 to 5 job.
>>96822773>“He died did he? He didn’t deserve to be a mage.”That's only Hermetics and maybe Akashics, there's plenty who don't act like that.
>>96822941They're talking about Awakening where all mage factions are basically Hermetics
>>96822953I'm retarded and somehow missed that, my bad.
>>96822939What's ironic is that Changelings are the only splat that actually keeps their 9-5. The only runner up are hunters, but most of them go off the deep-end and become homeless lunatics.
>>96822953>Awakening where all mage factions are basically HermeticsNot really, except for maybe the Mysterium.
>>96822915Grim.
>>96822975I’m living the van life and I am awakened, I am NOT homeless NOR am I a lunatic.
>>96822975I don't see why they'd have to, if anything I'd say Mages are more likely to keep their 9-5 since they're basically just humans+ (although it's a big +) while a Changeling can make their living in a freehold so long as they take a break every now and then to stave off Bedlam.>>96823018I'll be honest, I don't know the ins and outs of MtAw but I was under the impression that it doesn't really support alternate paradigms like Ascension does.
>>96822915...I get the plushie for the Ventrue big tits but who the fuck wants that faggot Nos's plushie?If there is any plushie I actually want of Nosferatu, it's Gary's.
>>96823018He meant in personality. Awakening mages are all assholes and they don’t even trust each other.
>>96822915After Mouthwashing plushies no vidya merch surprises me anymore.
>>96823134All mages are assholes in Ascension too.
>>96819495What kind of new life and civilizations would appear in a space opera of darkness?
>>96823113>I'll be honest, I don't know the ins and outs of MtAw but I was under the impression that it doesn't really support alternate paradigms like Ascension does.Yes and no. There's only one cosmology so no personal paradigms, but the road to enlightenment is filtered through your mindset as represented by your Path, and further refined through the tenets of the order you belong to.
>>96823118Ventrue plushie has very small tits, THOUGH.
>>96823196But like Awakening doesn't have mages who do magic by using kung fu or getting really high, does it?
>>96823301>But like Awakening doesn't have mages who do magic by using kung fu or getting really high, does it?If those are the Yantras you use to focus and power your spells, yes.
Everytime I think I figured it out it turns out I’ve been retarded the entire time.
>>96823528That's unreliable narrators for ya
Therese or Jeanette?
>>96820775>good books that go somewhat in depth of what goes bump in the night in Florida?Most likely your local newspaper! Tummy...
>>96823528know that feel, bro
>>96823665My brother in Caine, never stick your dick in crazy.
>>96823665jeanettei have dommy bitch fatigue actually wait i never liked that in the first place
>>96823301One of the Adamantine Arrow's Merits is literally "Martial Arts as a casting technique" that lets you use Athletics, Brawl, or Weaponry dots in your casting as a Yantra.
>>96823301>getting really highAlso, this is one of the common things Thyrsus do.
>>96823665>not Tourette the goatTherese if there's a gun to my head.
Going to be playing a game of Demon: The Fallen soon with a group of friends, how fucked am I?
>>96822915Can’t compare to the Great and Mighty Kevin or Big D plushies
>>96823665Can't I get VV instead?
>>96823528I feel you, last time we did that the stock market crashed
>>96823113I would assume Mages end up taking significant time off of work chasing around learning or some conspiracy rather than keep working, and besides at some point can't they just print money?
>>96823875Sure.It'll be $499,99 plus tip.
>>96823908>can't they just print money?Of course, if you're a memeber of the best faction
>>96823841Game's jank as hell, you're basically guaranteed to arrive at situations which the rulebook outright didn't consider or has contradictory info on.Also, be sure you're using the torment rules from the player's guide errata. In fact, be sure you're using the player's guide in the first place, it's basically mandatory.Game's blatantly broken, but very fun in my experience. What house are you gonna be playing?
>>96823919IS THAT A-
>>96824030Stop noticing, citizen. Everything is as it's supposed to be.
>>96823849I actually have the kevin plushie because one of our players looks like the plushie minus the wizard hat. It has become a weekly ritual to move Kevin throughout the game room.
>>96823908Yeah, kind of.They can turn cum into pearls, lead into gold, candy into gemstones, etc.
>>96823919>reality deviant seeping outHitmark kill this fucker.
>>96823919Nice
>>96818988>>96819015>>96819127White Wolf thought the Necroscope references were to subtle so they decided to hammer it home even harder
So now that the Bloodlines is flopping what would that mean for the future of Vampire the Masquerade and the rest? Will it be the beginning of a long ice age for the tabletop games before somebody else buys the property rights?
>>96824198>Will it be the beginning of a long ice age for the tabletop games before somebody else buys the property rights?Probably.
>>96824198Just like the first game it'll signal the end of the current edition. Onyx path'll probably get it.
>>96819127The discipline has confusing origins.>It's a weird spirit disease from the far reaches of the Umbra that a 4th gen Tzim caught, brought back to reality and infected the rest of the clan with (Unlikely)>It's demon shit, because when is it NOT demon shit>Tzimisce was never "human" in the first place, it's just something he could always do>It's just advanced Protean, but in reverse. Instead of you turning into animals, you are turning yourself into Tzimisce when you use the power. Your choice.
>>96824226I'd say I'd offer Paradox $5 for the rights, but I genuinely sort of hate the World Of Darkness and I see no value in iterating or developing any of its properties. I only value the urban fantasy setting, and that's not part of the IP.
>>96821225My big issue is that the story looks good and clever on paper, especially if you aren't that familiar with the lore, but becomes really fucking dumb once you start thinking about it and applying WoD lore to it.Bloodlines 2 has this unfortunate Padora Box syndrome where a seemingly trivial lore inconsistency that sounds like a cool idea, suddenly cascades into a gaping plot hole and then you are catching yourself wondering "how in the fuck this story is even plausible in the first place?".And then there is a main villain and that shit's just fucking retarded.
>>96821225It's an overwhelming "mid"Not a complete and total disaster, mind you.
>>96824254>but I genuinely sort of hate the World Of Darkness and I see no value in iterating or developing any of its properties.Good for you. We are probably getting a few cheap games and then nothing for a long time.
>>96824352Unfortunately, I can't really hate something without also loving it. A painful dichotomy.I'd love for it to succeed, but I don't see the current way it's being handled doing so.
>>96824198>>96824235ideally paradox sells off the IP for a reasonable value but given how much they spent on Bloodlines 2 I'd expect them to just sit on the IP for a few years and pray for passive income or tabletop sales to recuperate
>>96824462>paradox sells off the IPto who?It's not like an independent WW would work any better than it currently does under paradox. I also doubt anyone in WW could do a management buyout of WW from Paradox.
>>96824462Don't they have a handful of v5 vamp books coming out in 26? Maybe they'll sell it by 2030
>>96824483They created a new "White Wolf" subsidiary specifically so when it goes to shit they aren't going to be left holding the bag.Best case scenario they give up and sell it all back to OPP for a pittance.
>>96824318Bloodlines 2's worst problems is because of Paradox's push to v5 it lives perpetually in the shadow of and is incoherent in relation to Bloodlines 1. Quite literally, as funny as it is, giving it the title bloodlines 2 probably did more damage to the game than gave it sales
>>96824483Onyx Path, Hasbro (unfortunately). Maybe Paizo (even more unlikely and unfortunately)
>>96824496They're also probably going to adapt mage v5 too
>>96823113>while a Changeling can make their living in a freeholdSomeone's gotta pay rent for the property the freehold is in. Plus, most nobles don't want the commoners hanging out and polluting the air they breathe with their presence.
>>96824528Where are all the old fans who became rich when we need them?
>>96824518I mean, you can technically work around it and pretend that status quo changed in a timeskip between two games, whatever.The issue is that the game stubbornly keeps referencing events from the past, including as far as 1940s... while still seemingly holding on to the V5 status quo. And that's how the clusterfuck happens.
>>96824584>anyone not in a company becoming rich enough to buy IP without also being a zogged puppetThere's no hope for that anon
>>96824598I suppose that's the price of normie game devs who work for cheap
>>96824634>normie game devs who work for cheapIt's just like having fairy adventures in CtL.https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=0_Xb7D3iZ98
>learn about the term "fishmalk">instantly lose respect for the writersSo you made a clan about crazy people and then write into your rulebooks that its not okay to be crazy... lmao, lol even, I can see why this shit isn't as big as it used to be now
>>96824688It's part of the flavorful side slamming into the "moody melodramatic LARP" side. You don't want your super serious meeting with the Prince interrupted by the Malkavian facefucking his marble bust of Leopold II using a potted plant as an improvised strap-on.
>>96824688That's V5 and Requiem crap for you. But 2e and early revised malks were absolutely insane.
>>96824734Every clan has their stereotype, thats why they are fun and great though? Would you make a special section about how the Brujah isn't allowed to start fights because they are hotheaded? How about making rules that the Toreador isn't allowed to flirt with the prince because they think that the prince has an exquisite jawline? And the Lasombra, are they not allowed to scheme and backstab the prince? Because that would be too cliché for a Lasombra to do! What about the Ventrue? Is he not allowed to throw a fit because someone spilled water on his suit?Its pointless intervention by the writers themselves. If they did not want to invite the madness into their setting, then they should not have designed and released Malkavian as a Clan to begin with. That the Malkavian *might* fuck up is what keeps you on your toes. Anything else is just playing to win.
>>96824688A PC being insane and a PC acting like a fucking retard are not the same thing. You'd have to be a retard to think they were.
>>96824198Official books will grind to a halt but the STV will keep on churning stuff out and visual novels will keep on coming out, even if there will be no more big budget video games. The passion of the fans cannot be quenched and Paradox can basically make passive income off of it, so why would they ever sell, unless they get an eight digit offer?
>>96824688fishmalk specifically refers to that kind of player who thinks the stop sign arugment from bloodlines is peak comedy and tries to make it their whole personality
>>96824688The original Dark Age art of "man affectionatley fondling a fish" made sense in the context, old manuscripts often depicted people (mis)handling fishes, it was a common animal/food source both monks and laypeople were well familiar with.Using fish as a weapon is where it got weird.
>>96824688>t.fishmalk proving the point
>>96824760If you really want Malks in Requiem there's the Malkovian Ventrue bloodline and the Malkavia metaphysical disease.
>>96824198They decided to portray the absolute most BORING parts of VTM and are then surprised that it flops? The MC is a flat one-dimensional non-rp elder that feels like a insert. The Malk they have in their skull is as entertaining to engage with as a wet noodle and constantly makes statements about obvious fucking shit that happens around you. He's not insane, crazy or mad. He just has visions every now and then. Probably the most boring rendition ever of a Malk.None of the clan contacts feel like someone from their clan. The Tremere sell their secrets to an errand elder because the "prince" said so. The Lasombra are puppies who want to deepthroat the new "prince". The Brujah are misunderstood kittens that never hurt nobody. The Toreador is actually no shit running around collecting garbage like a homeless trashman. The Ventrue contact is a piano player, a doormat after DECADES or even a century. No ambition whatsoever.I dont think the people who made this game has ever read a rulebook or even participated in a game before. I dont think they have ever played a real game when trying out the combat either.
>>96824767I'm going to be pedantic and say that no, the Lasombra aren't going to scheme and backstab the Prince because they're in the Sabbat, since we're talking about norms and defaults. They're going to try to scheme and frontstab the Prince. Also, being easily upset isn't even the Ventrue stereotype. The Ventrue stereotype is being an elitist control freak, which one can be if they're either well or poorly composed. LaCroix being the only Ventrue in Bloodlines did so much damage to how people see that clan it's unreal. To say something more substantive, this debate is fairly unnessecary. Malkavians should be nutty. There's a lot of ways to do nutty. If they're so nutty they're incapable of functioning in polite society, it's understandible why players and ST's would find it undermining their suspension of disbelief is said Malk was running around the Prince's court being a spaz but wasn't beheaded for it. So find a place where said absolute nonfunctional loon realistically fits and can survive. Best of both worlds, this applies to other clan stereotypes. If nobody fits the clan's mold, why have clans? If everyone fits the stereotype exactly, everything is boring. If a character reads like a parody of their own clan, just make sure you have a reasonable justification for it.
>>96824767The Brujah equivalent of a fishmalk is a Brujah who goes "I attack the NPC, here's my roll" whenever they meet someone new.The Toreador equivalent of a fishmalk is a Toreador who goes "I try to seduce the NPC, here's my roll" whenever they meet someone new.The Lasombra equivalent of a fishmalk is a Lasombra who tries to backstab everyone they meet without any need for any motivation.The Ventrue equivalent of a fishmalk is a Ventrue who demands the subservience of everyone they meet and who will seek to kill or dominate them if they refuse to submit.The above are all dumb caricatures of their respective clans that do nothing but disrupt the game for everyone else, and that's what the fishmalk is. It's a Malkavian who is played in a way that puts its derangement before everything else and will focus the spotlight on the derangement whenever they do anything. A fishmalk is nothing but its derangement and is boring and unpleasant to play with. A properly played Malkavian might fuck up, a fishmalk will always fuck up because the fishmalk doesn't give a shit about anything but being wacky and crazy.
>>96824810It doesn't belong in a rulebook. Making sure theme and expectations are in order is a storytellers job.>>96824857You can be wacky without fucking up, but the rule statements on fishmalk implies that there is no room for wacky at all. There even is a flaw in v20 on ticks and twitches for wackyness effect. You can be wack, without fucking up.
>>96824843> an errand elderI feel like these three words accurately sum up the entirety of VtM: B2's atrocious writing. An errand elder. Does it make the slightest fucking sense that an Elder, of all fucking vampires, is having to play nice with these absolute buffoons in Seattle? Everyone is retarded and Phyre keeps obliterating entire armies and yet nobody realizes this guy is clearly going to kill them too if they try to fuck with him? But no, the Prince is like "eh do some bitchmade errands for me or I won't help you." She is treating an ELDER like that? Even if she's older (she isn't) Elders don't just dick each other around, it's simply not done. Both sides of the talk are walking nuclear warheads and if they fight, odds are good they both die in the fallout.
Bloodlines 2 may be proof that, much like its titular monsters, Vampire The Masquerade is cursed by God.
>>96824893Yeah, it's weird how everybody treats "Phyre" as a if she were some dumb neonate.
>>96824846The average Malk isn't a fishmalk, is the issue. The Malkavian curse is that they are afflicted with incurable madness and burdened with terrible prophetic insights (same thing really), not that they're compelled to act like Looney Tunes characters. You can have a Malk who works as someone's hitman because he's meticulously clean and orderly out of an obsessive need to impose order on the chaos they see everywhere. Another Malk can be a charismatic cult leader whose vivid visions of the endtimes gives him the passion to sway those who hear him to his side. Yet another can be a Prince's advisor because he sometimes hears conversations that haven't been taken place and relays them to his Prince, though he suffers from memory lapses because he's never sure which point in the timeline he's in right now. The problem is That Guy who took one look at Clan Malkavian and decided to play one as a license to be disruptive retard. And the writers who enabled that perception until late Revised.
>>96824767>Its pointless intervention by the writers themselves.That's the thing: it wasn't written by the same people. The original writers for VtM left long ago, including Mark Hagen. The ones who handle the IP now are moral busybodies who despise the original game and what was about. They're "you're having fun the wrong way!" imbecile.For the original writers everything you said was fun. But it also had a lot to do with the 90s-00s zeitgeist of the time. Culture was more extreme and as a result original VtM was a unique product. Today's VtM is like a creation of the Technocracy or the corpotrash despicted in the original Werewolf. They're the fucking enemy and they haven't realized yet.
>>9682488624/7 fishmalk wackiness is still fucking tiresome to put up with. If a Malkavian player can't play a Malkavian without invoking their character's derangement every time they open their mouth, especially if it's just for comedy's sake, then they shouldn't play a Malkavian.
>>96824767If you wanna play someone that flat, who's gonna stop you? The ST? Just find a new group, should be easy right?
What really happened in the First City
>>96824953Its your job to tell them to calm the fuck down then. Roll initiative. Fuck em up then. Solve it IC or OOC. Doesn't matter. Don't put into a rulebook how you should RP and then get mad when people do it a little too spicy.>>96824965I'm not playing. Just reading and understanding more and more why its ONLY the old versions of VTM that see any form of respect.
>>96824967We do NOT talk about the First City.Or the Second City.Better not bring up Carthage either.
>>96824947I'm gonna make a character, call them "Fish" and have them say "Woo HA heehe SKABALABABABA ding dong!" at the end of every sentence just to spite people that police the level of wackiness allowed.
>>968249672nd and 3rd generation had a massive blood orgy. I'm talking wall to wall celebration that went on for so long that it flooded the world with blood when the gates fell.
>>96824967Me
>>96824967Never existed
>>96824978>Don't put into a rulebook how you should RP and then get mad when people do it a little too spicy.Nothing wrong with putting it in a book just to make it clear to new players that fishmalks are a bad idea and no group will tolerate your bullshit if you play one.>>96824991Cool, let us know how your games go and how long your groups tolerate your character for.
>>96824991Executed at the end of the first session for being a Masquerade risk. Thanks for playing, now fuck off.
>
>>96824948There yet remains people here that defend policing the fun in VTM. No fun allowed. Never. V5 was specifically designed to win. No rp allowed. Nothing. You roll dice and combat. Move into next room. Combat. Pointless dialogue. No character roleplay allowed. Pick A or B. Both leads to combat. Having fun now? No? Buy the DLC then where we police having fun even more.
>>96824978>I'm mr.nogamesK
>>96824967Caine realized all his 'children' were fucking retarded monsters who thought killing people was cool and hip, devaluing his original sin. The 2nd and 3rd genny-jannies all ran and hid hoping that if they went to bed, daddy would stop beating them for being soullless abominations
>>96825017What are you even rambling about? Are you just a tourist from /v/ having a sperg-out?
>>96825007Nothing anon said would break the masquerade, if you're somewhere crowded like NYC you could find a dozen people like that just by taking the subway for an hour.
>>96824967Malkav had a melty so hard it became permanent
Fishmalk may be annoying but most terrifying malk is the one that seems perfectly reasonable and normal.
>>96824936>OG creators of vtmb couldn't release their game earlier than half life 2>shitty sales eclipsed by HL2, and endless bugs put the company into the ground>people later realized it's actually good and formed a community around it as it gained a cult following>other companies realized it could be good to capitalize on the success of the cult classic>IP ownership constantly keeps changing hands and nobody knows what to do with it>now it's in the hands of a company who absolutely does not give a single flying fuck other about the settingbloodlines may have been a good game but it left a real curse on the whole franchise
>>96825056Nobody said the Prince couldn't just cite a Masquerade risk to off you because you're just that annoying.
>>96825075Better solution than making hard rules. RP is about learning, not from a book, but RP.
>>96825007Nah, get fucked by a Clown.
>>96825040but saulot was a pretty nice guy
>>96825094>believing the biggest sinner of allLEL
>>96825092Based and coocoo crazy-pilled
>>96825051Seems so. Wouldn't surprise me if there's an increase during the next month.
>>96825017That's because V5 wasn't designed to have cool lore or fun mechanics. It was literally designed to be used as brochure for low-quality videogames. Yes, the same one that's currently flopping.
>>96825094yeah sureee the guy who got cursed into not being able to drink the blood of the unwilling was totally innocent
>>96825092Gets resisted and you're now missing your limbs.
>>96825111>>96825135you just had to get to know him man
>>96825140
>>96825140he was friends with SET to the point where they called each other brothers
>>96824760>>96824948Sounds like historical revisionism to me, I'm pretty sure most of these "no fun allowed" rules and sidebars come from Revised.
Is Dysplasia good for a street-level campaign or is that slightly too high?
>>96824843And to top this shit sundae you have a gay Nosferatu, that's busy doing absolutely anything EXCEPT HIS FUCKING JOB. Motherfucker, you let a batshit insane Tremere antitribu into the Prince's court without even doing a cursory background check on her, because "she's so nice". When Phyre points out there might be Sabbat involved, his response is literally "stop inventing problems".You are a fucking NOSFERATU, your only job is to be gather intel, have dirt on everybody and be 5 steps ahead of everyone.
>>96825140Anon, be honest. Did you and Saulot ever discuss things in a dark corner. Where it was just you and him?
>>96825060Man it must be wild to be a Malkavian with that Mytherceria power which allows you to become mortal for a day. Imagine you get a whole day of lucidity only to be confused because you have no idea what a vampire even is. Would you choose to remain as a mortal, spending blood to live out a life without the full picture of the truth, or would you choose insanity of a different kind?
>>96825178never just two of us, there was always at least one other guy, never quite got his name though, guess he wanted to stay unnamed
>>96825140So why did Caine curse him again?
>>96825207I suppose it's all about how shitty your malk -insanity is.
>>96825217Was he a dark-eyed, dusky beauty? Roguishly handsome, you could say? Did he speak often or was it just you and Saulot talking?
>>96825170They didn't even bother to design mechanics for feeding in non-public places. You HAVE to do it in public so that LE HECKIN' MASQUERADE is constantly about to be breached. Tiresome to instantly hear helicopters over your heard every time you feed.
>>96824843>The MC is a flat one-dimensional non-rp elder that feels like a insert.Thing is, our MC doesn't actually feel like an Elder.You don't have power fitting for an Elder.You don't behave like an Elder when you are the whipped errand boy to everyone.No one even pretends to respect you.All you fight are a bunch of Ghouls, Hunters, Thinbloods as elite enemies and a few Vampires as bosses. Let me remind you that Fledgling from OG Bloodlines started with killing Sabbat vampires...in the tutorial.
>>96825251>dude sabbat vampires. Sabbat.>shovelheads fresh and starvingDamn those big tough sabbat. Not like the biggest threat I the tutorial are the gang bangers.
>>96825241now that you mention it never quite got his features either
>>96825070didn't white wolf bankrupt themselves by WILLINGLY publishing video games for the IP and the MMO that got canned instead of whoring out the IP like other big names do? I know Wizards and Hasbro didn't publish shit they just whored out the IP until recently when they got greedy for the BG3 pie
>>96825280Mate...Ghouls and Thinbloods are so down in the totem pole of threat that frenzying Sabbat Shovel heads, by the very fact that they aren't Thinbloods, make them more dangerous.But no, we have Thinbloods as elite enemies.
>>96824991being a pet schizophrenic isn't impossible but you have to actually roleplay having delusional takes and phrasing not just stringing random words together. I would think something like how Bloodlines did it where you use metaphors for people or have a weird vernacular is perfectly fine. Malkavian's are kind of hard to write though as it turns out>Gideon is barely a Malkavian but we don't see him>Fabien just thinks he's a detective or something, not really very Malk-esque>Bloodlines only had 2 NPC Malks, one of which had two personalities and the other one had a steady progress into genuine psychosisI can't imagine making compelling derangements is easy to be fair. They hit it hard with Therese and Jeannette and the MC though
>>96825292The MMO was CCP doing rather than White Wolf, to my limited knowledge
>>96825280Eh, if we are talking power levels, the Fledgeling DOES solo a Tzimisce Archbishop. Twice. And the moves on to punching even bigger threats.While the biggest threat our oh-so-powerful Elder has to face is some mentally unstable Tremere girl that is maybe 4 times younger than him. And yet she's running circles around Phyre.
>>96825336I'm guessing Bloodlines 2 has no Crossover stuff like the original did,
>>96825331Eve Online's CCP bought White Wolf and put people from White Wolf in charge of the World of Darkness MMORPG. The MMORPG died in development hell due to mismanagement, likely by the people from White Wolf, and CCP sold White Wolf off to Paradox in disgust to clean their hands of the franchise, after wasting tens if not hundreds of millions of dollars on a game that never saw the light of day. More about it can be read in this article:https://www.theguardian.com/technology/2014/jun/05/world-of-darkness-the-inside-story-mmo-ccp-white-wolf>Most of the sources spoken to for this piece identified the same problematic CCP manager, who had little vision for what the finished game would look like.>“Not once could he answer any question about moment-to-moment gameplay or areas of focus,” says one source. “Instead, he preferred to deliver buzzword-laden rambles… It was not uncommon for him to communicate in onomatopoeia.>"I once saw him looking over the shoulder of a programmer at some bit of User Interface the poor guy had hacked together. He straightened up, put fingers to lips and said, ‘No, this isn't it at all. Make it more... psssshhhh’ He hissed on his fucking fingertips, like the air coming out of a bicycle tire, and then just walked away.”
>>96825336Ming Xiao's about the only bigger threat than the archbishop.>inb4 the sherriffAfrica Tzimisce is still a Tzimisce>>96825357Not with today's corps.
>>96825307Thinbloods could be more dangerous than sabbat shovelheads because they can strategize, can use modern gear, some can operate during daytime, and V5 Thinblood Alchemy is kinda busted,
>>96825288Was he always cloaked in shadow when you were off alone with Saulot? Do you remember if anyone else saw the guy with Saulot?
>>96825392Yes and... probably?
>>96825357Bloodline 2's spiciest lore moment is the hidden Tzimisce and being forced to turn the head of SI, even Swansong has a random werewolf in there, let alone other entities. I think they rationalize it away as saying that the Seattle court wiped out the wolf population, but tbf as well, Werewolf 5 makes the Garou seem like they basically lost already>all the leaders are fucking dead lmfao or aging and senile>Gaia is dead lol good luck retards>there's like, none of you>all your human friends are tulpas or dead btwWoofs arguably got the shittier end of the stick than Ancillae, low rank elders, or thinbloods having power in Vampire 5
>>96825374Why did White Wolf even need to sell? I thought VTM sold well. Was it just greed?
>>96825403Did anyone ever come up to you and Saulot when in the corner to talk, and acknowledge said shadowed man? For that matter, did Saulot ever acknowledge the man?
>>96825410could have had some wraith shit or something else, but WW/Paradox don't really care about any WoD line except VtM these days.
>>96825381i am sorry but most of them just have shotguns or sledgehammers and use at best alchemy just to copy the tier 2 potence or celerity ability (and they aren't good at using them compared to the full on kindred in this game) meaning the shovel head at the start of vtmb1 with protean 2 was also already on their level of highest used power and had a stronger templatelike yes you can make a thinblood stronger than a shovelhead, but they aren't doing that in this game
>>96824945>Updatethis dude is ugly
>>96825374Doing a fucking MMO was a bad idea anyway. Those days you could easily rank millions on good single-player RPGs. But corpotards will corpotard.
>>96825418sure, the two seemed pretty close actually
>>96825460Interesting, interesting. Any odd or out of place smells? Also for that matter, let's cross this one off; you are not of Malka's legacy, yes?
>>96825410There is a hidden Tzimisce?
>>96825415The aging of their player base with most of the Gen X punks and goths transforming into jaded ordinary adults with kids and jobs,the rise of high quality video games during the turn of the millennium wrecked TTRPG sales and Wizards of the Coast was monopolising the market with D&D 3.5 and its OGL. White Wolf gambled on a reboot with the new World of Darkness, which was later rebranded into the Chronicles of Darkness, but that gamble failed hard. The vast majority of the fans that they still had who hadn't aged out of playing TTRPGs dropped White Wolf for killing off the old World of Darkness. That's how White Wolf went from being the makers of the second biggest TTRPG franchise of all time to eating shit.
>>96825428Purely a symptom of Paradox and V5 making the lore mild and unconnected. V20 and older WoD editions make it seem like there's actually vampires and werewolves everywhere, even for the Hunter games, and v5 just goes like "everyone is dead, SI and Pentex or whatever rolled around". It wouldn't surprise me if in Mage 5 or if there's ever a Wraith 5 they remove all the other factions and just say that ghost slavery doesn't happen anymore because all the old wraiths got oblivioned or got the inner peace to move on, so it's more of mad max ghost wasteland but without the problematic slavery. I'd imagine it'd be some shit like>Local wraith settlements>a bunch of wildlands occupied by spectersAlso 9 arcanoi instead of 16
>>96825496The Tremere younger booknerd Safia is actually a simping Tzimisce who jumpstarted all the game's events trying to revive Gideon, who is also fucking Lou and performing daily mindwipes on Fabien. That's the most non-thinblood enemy in the game basically
>>96825505well, that's rather tragic. I do like WoD a lot more than DnD as a setting. The majority of DnD settings produced post 2E and frankly even Faerun are just fantasysloppa to feed players as they fellate their OC. Unfortunately neither Planescape nor Eberron survived the 5E scourge and the settings lost all their cool unique flavor and quirks
>>96825521She's not a Tzimisce, she's just a regular Tremere antitribu. Which opens a metric fuckton of questions and potential plot holes, but I'll just assume the Tremere really didn't like that one neonate and move on with my life.
>>96825506>all the old wraiths got oblivionedThat Family Reunion just had to be loud enough to wake Nana.I also fully expect Mage 5 to have some shit about how it's only the technocracy now and only the Syndicate cause they seem like the type to condense them down to the supernatural backing of Pentex
>>96825538No the original Safia got jigsawed and a Tzimisce imposter took her place
>>96825415>Why did White Wolf even need to sell? I thought VTM sold well.VTM was consistently in the green, but that doesn't mean everything was. Some people called VTM, WTA, and MTA "the big three" because all were fairly consistently well selling, though it's worth noting that VTM >>> the other two in terms of popularity. There was a similar large power gap between WTA and MTA and the other lines. Many of the other lines didn't sell very well and it took time, energy, and resources to print them. At the same time, they didn't want to be the scumbags who released a core book, it flopped, and then they just abandon it for good. The issue they ran into was that even VTM was selling less as time went on. Pay attention to how supplemental books changed over the course of 2e to Revised. Metaplot became more focused on (though Revised still had some good sourcebooks, see Midnight Siege) because metaplot whales always buy. But with the margins on their big earners decreasing and their new lines they hoped to branch out with being met with mixed responses at best, they eventually did Gehenna in an attempt to go out with a bang and start fresh. Honestly, by the time they did Gehenna and launched nWoD, they were in a bit of a damned if you do, damned if you don't scenario. The reason even consistent earners like VTM were selling less was because the RPG industry was in a slump. Ending WoD with an apocalypse and then pivoting to a half new, half reboot setting left a bad taste in a lot of people's mouths, regardless of the new line's merits. They got bought by CCP in 2006, two years after Bloodlines launched.
>>96825538I'd probably question if they even did the vaulderie, cause the Tremere just goes insane with sorcery and grief. Like normal Tremere. The poseur and maddog are hilariously blatant but don't seem that out of place until the poseur shines a light. Wouldn't put it past the Tzimisce to just lie to them since they're such convenient weapons
>>96825467Smells? Myrrh and sulfur.I am not of the Malkav's legacy.
>>96825505>White Wolf gambled on a reboot with the new World of Darkness, which was later rebranded into the Chronicles of Darkness, but that gamble failed hard.Paracucks revisionism is one hell of a drug.
>>96825505>Gen X punks and goths transforming into jaded ordinary adults with kids and jobsCalling bullshit on this one. From 2000-2010 was a fucking golden age for vampire media. Underworld came and made millions stealing superficial elements from VtM. WW didn't die because there wasn't goth culture, they die because they were fucking retards that tried to "police" their audience and force them to like their mid angst reboot.
>>96825550No, she's *just* a Tremere. That supposed Safia's body you find is just some random vampire that Safia made look like her to throw off Phyre so she can continue developing her Machine for Pigs in peace. This is the whole "main theme" of the game, such is it is - that this sweet and nice girl got fucked over by circumstance, went insane out of love and became her own antithesis. I don't know why they specifically went with a Tremere, because that's just creating questions the devs never thought to answer, and why the vampire bodies no longer turn to ash because that opens an entire Masquerade-breaching can of worms but sure lets go whatever I am not angry holy fuck this is so stupid adaskjdal;fmaf,a m.,a a
>>96825541I'd expect it to be the case yes>>96825558That's pretty tragic, though I wonder why the other lines didn't sell as well as vampire. Was it just the larp scene? Frankly if they produced a sort of all in one WoD setting like DnD I'd think the urban fantasy approach would be enough to make it popular enough but I guess outside of DnD and Warhammer people don't really play much tabletop stuff
>>96825572Well anon, I'm sorry to say but I don't think that shadowed man was a kindred. On the upside...at least Tremere and his ratpack dealt with Saulot so you don't have to worry. Although you might want to look into warding your haven since we've been talking about this.
>>96825535If it helps, the failure of D&D 4e resulted in a TTRPG boom that White Wolf (well, Onyx Path at that point) took advantage of. They were able to refine the new World of Darkness and release some games which were actually hits, even if the earlier games of the new World of Darkness were a flop. Namely, Changeling the Lost and Hunter the Vigil.But all good things come to an end and D&D ended up monopolising TTRPGs again with 5e, especially when Wizards of the Coast bought out Critical Role and got them to play their game instead of Pathfinder.>>96825598It's the truth, nWoD ate shit and didn't see any critical success until CtL and HtV and arguably never saw commercial success ever.
>>96825613Oh damn, I guess she willingly just looked freaky then and isn't a Tzimisce. That's arguably even more retarded I would think but thank you for enlightening me. I figured Bloodlines 2 was just was just retarded but I didn't assume it would be this retarded. I think even in the V5 CYOA games vampires turn to ash when they die
>>96825374It was probably Mike Tinney, who was the President of WW during the merger who was given total control of the CCP North America studio.
>>96825613>>96825641>forgets why vampires turn to ashRead, both of you
>>96825637>It's the truth, nWoD ate shit and didn't see any critical success until CtL and HtV and arguably never saw commercial success ever.That's certainly an unverifiable claim, but its major retail points (DTRPG and Amazon) always seemed to have excellent sales standings, while all of the kickstarters went very well.
>>96825609Kids during that era were more interested in video games than tabletop and Gen X had aged out of having the free time to being able to regularly play tabletop games as a hobby. Even if they could enjoy vampire movies and vampire books, most of that generation had grown out of TTRPGs.Not saying that all of Gen X moved, but I don't think it's controversial to say that people grow out of gaming, especially when it's as time-intensive and effort-intensive as tabletop gaming.
>>96825628Yeah, you're probably right let's not worry about that anymore.
>>96824318>>96824598I'm not playing Bloodlines 2. Spoil me.
>>96825637Sure, its first few steps were a flop but it was a perfectly survivable situation. You're leaving out the part where it was shafted with purposeful bad marketing and had its legs broken before it could fully recover because the management decided to instead bank on WoD nostalgia to the exclusion of everything else.
>>96825695>while all of the kickstarters went very well.Requiring Kickstarter to get books out of the door at all isn't a good sign, in my opinion.
>>96825440>dudeAnon, I...
>>96824936Vampire is cursed because Tom Dowd sold out and betrayed Shadowrun.I spit on /wodg/. Ptooey!
All this talk of retarded companies makes me think maybe the woofs had the right idea
>>96825746Or it's a sign of aiming for the right target. Use them as an initial fund and get good calibration on the interest level, and so on.Most of the RPG industry can't afford to just expend the initial costs to go all-in on mass-market printing on their own like WotC or Paizo.
>>96825618Much as I want to blame everything on LARPers, it's because the different gamelines can have very different appeals, and not everyone wants certain things from their TTRPGs. As one player put it to me, "I signed up for vampires draining people from the shadows, manipulating politics, and searching for lost occult secrets. I didn't sign up for wizard psyops to determine the future of reality."Also, and this is not to diminish VtM's quality, but it hit at basically the perfect time. Vampire craze, goth subculture, a high demand for something gritty and urban. which is why I think that your OneWoD idea would backfire hard. The people who like it, love it, but I think they drastically over-estimate the potential appeal of other parts of the setting. IRL, I have never met someone who said they like all of WoD. >>96825695I don't know why we still have to have oWoD vs. nWoD fights in the age of Paradox's WoD5 faggotry, which is demonstrably the bane of both. nWoD/CofD did well enough so that every gameline got a second edition, even if they had to resort to kickstarter once the new IP holder started to give them the cold shoulder. nWoD's 1e had a lot of supplements, even for lines that did not receive as much acclaim as CtL or HtV. If a loss was being taken on every book, it would've fizzled out well before nWoD 2e.
>>96825770What would the woofs think of Uncle Ted?
>>96825701That still doesn't cover the fact that VtM became irrelevant in the cultural zeitgeist due to their sanitization, forced reboot and jumping the shark with late metaplot. Things way beyond market trends or generational mumbo jumbo.
>>96825770Quite. It's why we members of the technocracy (sans Syndicate) gotta tell the higher ups about the shit the Syndicate is pulling.
>>96825637Was CtL a big seller?Vigil still gets players today, but that's mostly due to Paradox fucking H5 so badly
>>96825772If a company can't afford initial costs without crowd-funding and needs to rely on crowd-funding for the majority of their products, I wouldn't consider that company commercially successful, but that's subjective.
Somehow the Malk talk reminded me of the long greentext about a VtM LARP some anon posted a few threads ago, where a dickass Malk ruined their friend circle because being a petty bitch was her mental disorder.
>>96825795That's why I listed multiple factors. Generational issues played a part but weren't the deciding factor.
>>96825798>but that's mostly due to Paradox fucking H5 so badlyAs a Vigil player, no. H5 would've had to have been the greatest game of the decade to make me jump ship, and building off of WoD5's bones (every upgrade WoD5 has over oWoD is something it took from nWoD/CofD, yes even the precious loresheets, they're just an expansion on the Mystery Cult type of merit), there was no chance of that. HtV already does what I want my monster hunting game to do. I'm not one of the lobotomites who only plays the most recent game because I have an unnatural urge to spend money.
>>96825794You can tell WoD isn't made by Americans purely because he isn't referenced, I think the woofs would have a very good opinion of his philosophy but his pipe bombs are most Garou going Crinos form at the single mother of 4 littering there is
>>96825798People who'd want H5 wanted Imbued. Why try to backport Vigil instead of iterating on the Imbued?
>>96825784It's because some dipshits have a pathological need to Edition War and are salty that WoD got retired from new production for "New thing that's different." Even though it happened more than 20 years ago and WoD was a functionally complete and finished game lineup they had nowhere else to go with.And realistically, COFD getting approvals cut off ha nothing to do with "poor sales." The exact opposite, in fact, it was cutting into WoD5 sales too much for Paradox's liking, especially when you look at how much they fucked up H5 and all of the online talk was basically "don't bother with it, play Vigil 2E instead."
So here's my issue with the lore of VtM. Caine and let's even say Lilith are vampiers, right? Let's say gen 0 or 1 or 2, whatever. Who are they feeding on? They need more and more potent vitae to sustain themselves. Humans don't cut it and seemingly never would have.
>>96825794The end of the Impergium and its consequences have been a disaster for the human race
>>96825859Once you're high enough you realize it was all a prank bro and you don't need to drink blood.
>>96825794That him getting caught due to his manifesto is a lesson, any kind of communications with the enemy is a mistake.
>>96825800That's certainly an opinion you have.It's not really backed by any real facts, and ignores that the TTRPG market just can't support more than a couple companies at WotC's scale, and that "success" can be measured at levels other than "get all the money ever capitalism" psychosis.
>>96825859Not everyone gets the Thirst of Ages. It is more likely the older you get, but it isn't a guarantee.
>>96825859something something higher gens only need to drink blood because of the impurities of their own, thus Caine doesn't actually need to feed since he's the OG
>>96825798>Was CtL a big seller?CtL is considered the best line of both WoD and CofD, with a 1E getting a huge number of supplement books when they were originally only planning to have the core splat.
>>96825859>who are they feeding onYour answer depends on when. Caine, and subsequently Lilith, are so primeval that they side-step that hunger restriction if it ever mattered in the modern age. Back during their time, the time of the first city, uh mortals. If mommy Lilith even needed that. It's also never really outright stated or confirmed but the way Caine is spoken about, makes his eating habits seem reptilian. So he probably goes years without eating even back then.
>>96825859You would think that with the myriad of ways the splatbook gives you to avoid needing the sippy Caine and super high level vamps that aren't chronically driven mad and cursed by the beast would be able to find a way to not need to do it
>>96825856When VTubers were doing a Hunter the Vigil game, the official Paradox account was in the chat recommending V5 to everyone. I'm pretty sure that was the reason they moved up H5 ahead of W5.Frankly, it feels "personal" to me, like Jason Carl or the Swedish larpers or whoever are still butthurt over OWoD ending, because I don't see how Vigil selling more would hurt them, if they own the license.
>>96825881I'm not ignoring that. I accept that most TTRPGs aren't commercially viable without crowd-funding, this is not an industry for anyone who wants to make lots of money. This is an industry for passion projects, not commercial success, and that's one of the two reasons why Onyx Path Publishing is still going, a small number of dedicated fans willing to throw heaps of money at a thing and extremely passionate writers willing to work for peanuts, or even gratis.
>>96825924 >Mori caused H5 One more reason to hate that bitch
>>96825936And Mori doesn't care, she been doing some Warhammer stuff these days
>>96825798Changeling the Lost was tied with Hunter the Vigil for the position of nWoD's most influential game. It resonated a lot with the zeitgeist at the time and was the first game that made people actually take the new World of Darkness seriously.>>96825901>CtL is considered the best line of both WoD and CofDSlow your horses, it absolutely doesn't beat out any of the WoD top three and it's nowhere near as popular in CofD 2e.
>>96825934>this is not an industry for anyone who wants to make lots of moneyI'm not sure about that one. I think it can be a cost effective method of attracting an initial fanbase you can springboard off of into the "real" industries.
>>96825924>because I don't see how Vigil selling more would hurt them, if they own the license.Yep, in practice they're getting paid regardless of which one sells better, but now instead they've forced the original creative studio/publisher that made WoD to begin with decide that they'd rather compete with a new IP in the same genre instead of deal with their licensor being so petty.It's likely the same reason they put a halt to production of 20th editions as well.They're still fine rubber stamping everything for Exalted, though.
>>96825936>>96825943?
>>96825951Nobody who'd play Vigil would want to play H5. People who'd play Hunter wouldn't play H5. Who, exactly, is that game meant for?
>>96825924Chronicles seems like a more grounded doomer gameline that has it's own appeal, it is pretty weird that Paradox tries to step on their own toes like that but I guess New Thing means more money since they don't actually care about brand quality
>>96825964idiots who consume
>>96825954>It resonated a lot with the zeitgeist at the timeHow so?
>>96825957>They're still fine rubber stamping everything for Exalted, though.Everything except the real H5 and Kuel-Jin, it seems.
anyone want to play vtm with me
>>96825859caine can just drink human blood that was his curse he is also mentioned in the gehenna book as being in topor often which prevents the thirst of ageslilith meanwhile isn't really a vampire she drains spiritual energy from her garden or some shit and uses "spheres of night" that work like demon lores that unique to her instead of disciplines
>>96825964Paradox stock holders and people who can't use a pdf
>>96825991Are you STing?
>>96826002no i never played vtm before
CtL would've been better as Alien: The Abduction for owod
>>96825969I think it's more that Paradox didn't really know what to do with it. Remember, their bread & butter is strategy sims like Stellaris and Crusader Kings, big baroque games where you're deciding the path of worlds and the lineage of dynasties, but not doing a lot of direct gameplay stuff. Neither TTRPGs, nor first-person video games, were things they were familiar with working with, and the buyout came with OPP still holding the perpetual licenses for WoD, nWoD, and Exalted.They thought that by riding the cult hit status of Bloodlines they could make it a lot more profitable than what they really got, and the 5E stuff's purpose was to create a baseline of "this is what our WoD is."
>>96825991I wish I had friends to play that I didn't have to ST for but it's very luck of the draw, unlike DnD. Everyone and their mother wants to play DnD. Anyway, can recommend you hit up roll20 or an official discord server to set up player games. I will warn you that online games are a bit inconsistent in quality but a hobby is a hobby>>96826002It's the ST curse for all of us lads
>>96825986>Everything except the real H5 and Kuel-Jin, it seems.Those aren't Exalted IP elements.
>>96826031>he doesn't know
>>96826022Despite being a strategy sim game company and getting what's essentially the holy GRAIL of alt history settings with plenty of room for strategy, Paradox has owned WW for like a decade and hasn't tried to make a single strategy game based off of it
>>96825958Some chuubas played Hunter game on camera, Paradox thought it's good marketing opportunity and pushed releave of H5 ahead of the shedule. H5 was seriously undercooked and anon things it's because of this re-scheduling and not because Paradox is a bunch of morons that would still release garbage even if they had more time to make it.
>>96825981General urban fantasy was getting pretty popular at the time and Changeling the Lost covered that better than any other line. It was also around the time when therapeutic analysis of stuff was getting popular and Changeling the Lost was kind of built for that, with how the durance represents trauma, the Gentry represents an abuser and the Courts represent the stages of grief, sans acceptance. Lots of people were really into that aspect of CtL at the time, though people have come to see it as pretty trite these days.
>>96826036I know they tried to force a connection around the 1E of both gamelines, but that was dropped and officially made non-canon because it was stupid.
>>96826051>1E of both gamelinesHunter only has a 1e. It will always be canon. Stop coping.
>>96826039I honestly don't know why they didn't make a strategy game out of Phyre being an Elder.
>>96826057It was a barely canon suggestion even then, it was stupid and they decided to say it wasn't true.
>>96826062One of the more popular CK3 mods is the Vampire mod, surprised Paradox didn't sniff the money out
>>96826031What is exalted? I see it mentioned here and on /tg/ every now and then
>>96826022You say, but Crusader Kings basically turned into a character-driven management RPG during its post-release support. If anything, it would be a decent base for a Game where you are the prince of the city and have to deal with political shit.
>>96825838New generations will always draw themselves to edgy, rebellious stuff. But modern VTM is neither edgy nor rebellious.
>>96826046>with how the durance represents trauma, the Gentry represents an abuser and the Courts represent the stages of grief, sans acceptanceThat shit was always cringe as fuck, get out of here.
>>96826078Another line by White wolf where you get to play a godling and do shonen shit. It's a lot more high energy compared to WoD
>>96825712For me, it's the little things. Safia for instance - the writers wanted a nerd archetype, so their mind obviously went for a Tremere. Cool, but they didn't bother to realize that Tremere are a very specific clan with a very specific rules and people versed in lore will have questions.So, here are the questions - was the Pyramid not paying attention to Safia's shenanigans? How did they allow her to become antitribu and how did she survive for this long? How did she become involved in Sabbat to begin with, given that Tzimisce kill Tremere on sight? Why was everybody in the Seattle court so fucking trusting of Safia to the point of retardation, when the unwritten rule of VtM is to never trust a Tremere?The writers wanted a weepy story about at nice girl that went to the dark side out of love, but because they pick a very dumb clan for her and never really thought this through I now have a metric fuckton of questions that the devs weren't even prepared to answer.
>>96826078https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Exalted_(role-playing_game)Heavily asian-mythology flavored over-the-top system about a flat world floating on a sea of chaos where people who meet the criteria (like taking heroic actions when they should be an impossible feat) when a special third soul is available can bind it to you and make you one of the Exalts, and be a living God-king, Shapeshiter, manipulative Vizier, or be born as an elementally powered supersoldier.
>>96826096Did that happen through their deliberations or from extensive modding?
>>96826103That's an opinion you have.
>>96826046Did Promethean and Geist not get that much traction? They always seemed interesting.
>>96826102Generation is a factor not because of edginess, but because of tabletop gaming. The majority of Gen X who played tabletop games as teenagers no longer had the time or energy for it as adults and the new Millennial generation were ten times more interested in video games than tabletop games. By focusing so much on edge, you're misinterpreting my argument.
>>96826110Paradox game the successful ones at least find their niche after the game launches, since Paradox doesn't understand its audience or what they want, so they change it to suit player feedback in later DLC/patches.
>>96826110It came from a bug originally I think>>96826108>>96826104damn that sounds really cool. I can imagine that it's basically incompatible with WoD though
>>96826123Promethean, Demon, and Mummy are probably more in the "hardcore players" set of games because of their themes and concepts.
>>96826148Exhalted X WoD exists
>>96826157I thought that got curbstomped harder than y2k
>>96826148>I can imagine that it's basically incompatible with WoD thoughIt is, like I said, there was some early "what if we made it so that Exalted was the precursor world, like that abyssals became vampires, lunars became werewolves, solars became the imbued...etc." but ultimately it was just WW tossing the idea around then realizing that not only was it stupid, it conflicted with the lore of WoD really hard.
>>96826165maybe
>>96826150Damn understandable. I might be misremembering but I did like the slight connection between Mummy and Hunter in one of the Hunter conspiracies
>>96826157Yeah, but as a "what if" crossover, not the way they originally tried but dropped early on.
>>96826123Promethean got some interest for its weird premise but most people just agreed it didn't work as a group game and was best as a one-on-one game.Some people liked Geist, especially since it was surprisingly upbeat and uplifting in how it was written. But I think it just wasn't novel enough for most people, just a watered-down Wraith.
>>96826119Prove me wrong.
>>96825981I do seem to remember that in the late 2000s people often talked about how "actually, the original fairy tales were dark and brutal", Americans discovered Krampus, you had movies like Coraline in 2009, etc.
>>96826230Why should I "prove" that your opinion is just that, your opinion?
>>96826239Concession accepted.
>>96826254And here we have a great example of the Greater Internet Dickhead.
>>96826128Because that factor is weak. VtM could have lose market, but the outright killing of the IP was not due to something as unsubstantial as generational change. If anything VtM has a bigger generational pull than DnD.
>>96826268That's why I listed multiple factors. Generational issues played a part but weren't the deciding factor.
>Get to the part in Book of Hungry Names where Uncle Ted gets quoted almost verbatimWoah, that was unexpected. It's a bit too long to replay but I'm enjoying it more than Night Road
>>96826067>i-it was stupidNo, it was kino and you are a slave.
>>96826293Are you going to fuck the wolf girl?
>>96826046I'd also like to add that the era was just really big on evil, dark fairy tales and CtL does that shit so well. As for Hunter, human-centric urban fantasy was doing pretty well, you have shows like Supernatural leaving a huge cultural impact. >>96826194Geist is stupid cool and anyone who sees it as watered down anything is a dimwit. My only complaint is the powers can be kinda convoluted which makes it irksome to run.
>>96826331The wolf-girl isn't the one quoting uncle Ted surprisingly though pretty much all the fuckable characters are woofs the quote is from Giselle the mage, I'm actually fairly certain she's a character from Night Road also but I have no proof of this also I'm at the end of the game yet and I haven't gotten to smash a single character to maybe I fucked up
>>96826335It's been fifteen years so I don't recall the details, but I remember stories about how a sin-eater could be built to roll dozens of dice in combat right out of character creation, as long as it was on its home turf. Geist was pretty broken.
>>96826335perhaps with capeshit being so popular WW and Paradox should have produced a superhero ttrpg instead, though DnD is basically fantasy marvel now
>>96826350yeah the verbanna mage is from nightroad, she somehow always get's it in her head that she can push in the shit of other splats does very little research on said splats and then get's her shit beaten in
>>96826419I'm pretty sure the sun is setting on Capes right now at least in Film and TV comic books will always havea place for them as long as LCS exist
>>96826123Geist was my favorite game back then, but the second edition is atrocious.>>96826419They used to have Aberrant. They did nothing with it?
>>96826419They won't but Deviant is laying right there. That'd be pretty straight forward and could help give possible depth to Hunters.
>>96826447It was a fun setting with a retarded system(as always)
>>96826426Kek, I wonder how semi retarded she has to be to antagonize both vamps and woofs, also interesting to see that she escaped being the thrall of the Tremmie considering it's been 15 years in-game since Night Road
>>96826326
>>96826464That is my bad. I was thinking of the Beast splat for some reason. You're right that does look fun.
>>96826434The sun is setting on the capes indeed, but I don't expect it to go the way of the Dodo as long as disney has something to say about it>>96826426If anything she truly encapsulates the wizards bit about having no sense of right or wrong
>>96826478Yeah, no, pretty much everyone considers Beast to be the only genuinely bad and conceptually rotten game in CofD.
>>96826478It's part of the Trinity Continuum.Basically a Space Station explodes, radiation rains down, people are made supers.In White Wolf fashion you have bunch of conspiracies including drugging supers with anti fertility drugs, big corporations hiring supers, Cities sponsoring guardians, Super sports and all that kind of stuff.It's not very fresh nowadays where everyone wants to deconstruct super heroes, but back then it was fun. (And it's still better done than most.)
>>96826467she already escapes when the tremere fakes her death, but you only learn that if you ghoul and date her lab assistant the courier then chases her off by... well she mostly uses animal control magic and druid stuff so you do the same thing the tremere did and fight her in a steril enviourment and she falls for it again and then runs away
>>96826534Woah, damn Night Road has a lot of stuff I missed huh. Shame you can't do everything in a single playthrough but I suppose that's the appeal of the genre
>>96826534>and she falls for it againIt's amazing how stupid the Verbena are.
>>96826561What's the breakdown on the mage traditions and why her kind are retarded like that? She seems like one of those race separatists from all she says but also hilariously rather catholic for a "mage"
>>96826254Man's out here maximizing his autism. I imagine any group you play with just loves having you around.
>>96826583Sorry, ad hominem doesn't change the fact that Changeling the Lost is cringe.
>>96826581they are pagan druids who are meant to be all pagan mage but in practice the celtic ones are dominating the tradition (to the point where most norse mages went nazi nephanti just to get away from them)they are also heavy on alternative medicine and blood magic as medicine (they are the life sphere mages) and don't care that don't those don't work if you aren't a magehave pain obsessed lilith cultist blood mages in their rank (in their first tradition book they even been the majority)friends with werewolves despite the fact that they know that werewolves tried to kill humanitya group of them wants to nuke humanity back to the stone age for it's own good
>>96826581Verbena are basically an overlap between old school Druids, Pellars, Soothsayers and Wiccans.>also hilariously rather catholic for a "mage"Nobody's told you about the Celestial Chorus, huh? When a saint performs a miracle, that's still magic.
>>96826592Cringe is thinking anyone would give even a token fuck about your opinion. And I don't even like Changeling.
>>96826062Verbena, at their worst, hate civilization and wanna go back to the Neolithic era
>>96826603How does Mage magic mix with True Faith?
>>96826648Very well, in the Chorus' case. TF is quite common in their circles, though not ubiquitous, and they don't need it to perform miracles of The One.
>>96826648true faith can counterspell magic but if you are talking about mage who has both then the chorus book gives several options for that, but in the end it's up to the stit should however be mentioned that several demons and the like are mentioned to be weak against both true faith and chorus' "holy magic"
>>96826598>be so annoying you cause a portion of your faction to willingly become nephandiInterestingAnyway, she didn't really give friends with werewolf vibes but I suppose she was with the chud Fenris group. I suppose it makes sense they would be quoting uncle Ted>>96826603Interesting stuff and no I haven't really read or played mage yet
>>96826293Just finished this, genuinely very good read. I don't expect to replay it though since it's 20 hours though I'm rather curious how the game's dialogue changes when instead of being a charismatic reasonable wolf I become purposefully retarded and chudpilled. 20 hours is a long replay though
>>96826475>w-wrongkek the slave convulses
>>96824781>A PC being insane and a PC acting like a fucking retard are not the same thing.This is the key point that fishmalks miss. If you think mental illness is funny, you've never dealt with someone with mental illness. >>96825618>I wonder why the other lines didn't sell as well as vampire.Tree-hugging furries didn't have the same appeal, and a lot of people just couldn't wrap their heads are Mage's magic.
>>96826679I think the fishmalk the way Bloodlines does it is good. It's not quite "lolsorandumb" but it's still weird and non-standard in the way he talks. The lines are actually coherent in their own schizophrenic way
>>96826679Tree hugging furries kinda seems par for the course with the whole nature shit, but I guess it's to differentiate them from vampires being selfish in general. I suppose it just doesn't have the same appeal though true
>>96826707There's not no lolsorandom either. There's some in there, but it's not a one trick pony. The random dumb is funny in doses. The horrifying truth behind the schizo talk is spoopy in doses. It's great. I had no idea about VtM stuff when I first played Bloodlines and did a Malk playthrough first go. I was into it thoroughly, but only on a replay did the Malk dialog hit like it was really intended to. 9/10, really set a standard for "This is what an alternative presentation of the same story should be".
>>96826727it reminds me a bit of replaying Nier and you get to experience a different POV or see cutscenes you didn't before, though that's the intended way to play nier
>>96826665they are specifically friends with the part of the garou nation that wants to bring back the Impergium which they think will be fine as long as THEY get to keep their magicso most even garou even in owod think they are deranged and dangerous
Are Requiemfags just Twilight fans in disguise?
>>96826743kek, average "druid"
>>96826707The thing is, nothing in Bloodlines’ Malkavian dialogue is ransom, apart from the stop sign which is just plain funny and unexpected. It’s flowery, it’s pretentious, and it appears to be unrelated, but by the time you get to The Asylum and called Jeanette the white daughter of Janus and then deal with her final confrontation, you, the player, realize that you’ve been talking about past, present, and future events simultaneously. The game introduces and explores the Cobweb in a non-intrusive and organic way that you can easily understand.The problem with Malkavians at the table is that bad STs don’t pass notes to their Malks that give them prescient dialogue or ideas without also spoiling the plot of the story. I don’t blame Malkavians for being randumb, I blame STs for being bad at their jobs and not giving Malks a chance to shine as a ST would do for Nosferatu or Tzimisce.
>>96821965>Mage the Awakening is for making its players feel like they're powerful, smart and powerful because they're smart.https://youtu.be/5EPTqJjzsto
>>96826743>wants to bring back the ImpergiumI've FINALLY managed to talk my GM and group into giving WoD another try, and that's one of the major cruxes of the campaign he now has in mind.
>your wandering the moors of northern England >when suddenly you are attacked by->"ackshually there's no living wolf populations in that part of the world"Retards in this thread are like this.
>>96826899The Janus reference alone is probably more than most people are capable of doing, let alone modern game writers
>>96827013but Garou probably wouldn't show up without believable cover
>>96827050I bet game writers could absolutely pull off that kind of reference or sophistication. They're just not gonna do it for free, and the shithead beancounters aren't gonna pay for something as obviously pointless as "writing".
>>96827013Oi m8 that's black shuck innit?
>>96827091White Shuck but that's besides the point.
>>96827079Some of these guys... I don't know. The old guy Mitsoda, and Avallone, yeah I could see that. but modern writers like in TCR or most game companies I don't expect much sophistication like that in favor of modern culture references, overt politics, and>do a barb
>>96827110I guess I mean there's not some cosmic alignment that made a couple of good writers a while ago and now there's just no good writers to be found. There were good writers when there was a lower barrier to entry and people were flush enough to throw things at the wall to see what stuck. Plenty of pure trash got made in the 80s and 90s too. Money just selects for the people that can write well enough to "get the job done", something that'll be reliable and make some money, not something interesting or different. If it's interesting or different, people might not like it and it might not make money. Can't fucking do that.
>>96824734Malks are supposed to be like Drusilla, Casandra or any other insane oracle, not lolsrandom. A vampire wouldn't wouldn't break decorum like that, decorum, the Masquerade, hospitality, feudal bonds, etc are what makes vampire society run. It's no different than saying the Brujah wanting to arm wrestle the Prince or some other dumb shit
>>96824507Black Dog is real lol
>>96827221>erm crazy people should just be slightly quirky and not crazy
>>96827221>any other insane oracleFuck off with this stupid Revised bullshit.
>>96826464What happened to Chris-Chan in the center there and why is that black bosslady holding him?
>>96827236He's seeing his own future.More specifically, the part where he fucks his mother.
just realized>Matilda mid transformation didn't immediately kill the two boneheads next to herWay too much self-control for a red talon I think
>>96827230Insanity is not lolsrandom behavior. Speaking in riddles, having weird tics, that's fine, but any god damn Malk that can't keep his shit in his pants would never be introduced. Their Sire would have gutted them to not risk the embarrassment & perceived weakness it would bring. Sure, one or two might slip through the cracks, but that would be more acceptable by the Sabbat, than the Cam>>96827234Fuck off secondary
>>96827279Instead of the wiki, try reading any of the fucking books.
>>96827280I've read every book. As they came out. I know you just bought your V5 corebook & it's still in it's wrap you fucking faggot.
>>96827274I thought the popular consensus was that she isnt actually a red talon but has their mark on her because a red talon owns her or some shit.
>>96827279>Insanity is not lolsrandom behavior.Have you met crazy people IRL ya sheltered faggot?>Sure, one or two might slip through the cracksSo insanity IS lolsrandom behavior but only when (You) like it?
>>96827292>appeal to seniorityOk boomer
>>96827292>i've sucked every cock>before they came out>and none of them were ever wrappedYes we know
>>96827279true schizoid Malks are implied to be kinda rare with how Jack says that you have it kind of bad. Even if we assume someone like Therese is a fucked nutcase because she has the split personality, both personalities are entirely lucid and capable of effective communication. Groust which we unfortunately don't get to meet is also incredibly stable until the voices drive him to madness, not schizobabble, but genuine self-obsessed arguing. Pure random insanity and strings of words probably aren't a part of the curse at all
>>96827297That'd be my idea too, but then again the red talon sign is bordering on a basic battle scar anyway
>>96827298nta but I have met some relatively unwell people and the self-arguments and unwanted opinions are generally a cross between coherent and pointed, have yet to meet anyone so unwell as to say things that aren't at least connected together
>>96827328Rare that they're claimed or identified. There are more gnawed catatonics, ignorant caitiff, and fledgling suicides than anybody wants to think about.
Thoughts on Truja?
>>96827308>>96827302Worthless retorts. Post actionable fucking responses you drooling drivel dipshits>>96827298I'm just conceding that I can potentially happen but isn't common. Nothing is absolute. It still stands that a Sire wouldn't want a Childre that would planter-fuck a marble bust in front of the Prince, they would be more discerning.>>96827328That's what I'm saying. Having weird hang ups/compulsions for malk behavior is mostly fine, like OCD turned up to 11 or speaking in riddles or iambic pentameter, palindromes or whatever, & its not all schizo all the time though, Malks try to hide the crazy because it's a weakness, just like Ganrel feel shame about their animal mutations, & Nossies hide their faces & smells. Showing off your weakness infront of other Kindred is bad. Bottle that shit up. So yeah when the Malk uses Auspex they might giggle & say your aura tastes like strawberries or something like that, but that isn't disruptive
>>96827451>so tilted that he starts forgetting punctuation and spelling while pretending he's a serious debater'fraid that's a KWAB
>>96827401For people that like brujah but wanna be even more special. Admittedly I do like how they're not just woof vamps but then they had to get up their own ass about being the one true brujah
>>96827401I like it, Brujah are perpetual commies that can't get shit done, so it makes sense that they stole their power. I wish Trujah were a bit different though. Instead of nerds I think strategists/assassins would have been fitting. Brujah rush in Trujah watch & wait, but they're both killing
>>96827462These threads used to have class.
>>96827474My bad
>>96827401Movement cope about only failing because they lost their way and imagining principles to return to. Brujah sired once, there was no other line.
>>96827401Mid.
So I started watching/listening to this series and I have to ask, what the fuck is "Kitten" supposed to be wearing?>big D: over the top, flamboyant and a bit crazy, ok>marcus: nerd in oversized spare clothes like he's from the breakfast club, ok>wall: autistic construction man, ok>kitten: fat, cat ears, goggles, skirt, what the fuckI get some of the elements are supposed to be inherited from their 40k versions which kind of explains the custodes skirt, but what the fuck. Every time I see the design I get some sort of brainfart trying to comprehend it.
>>96827616>wallSorry, Door*.
>>96827632Wall is his evil twin who betrayed their family
>>96827616His name is kitten, therefore they gave him cat ears. Since the character is always masked in TTS they decided to keep him masked in this one
>>96827401Fun. Having usurpations that happened any time other than the late middle ages make the Tremere and Giovanni feel less artificial. Being unnaturally cold vs. Brujah being too hot blooded is a nice touch. I understand that temporis is a bridge too far for some people and they can attract bad playera but the good outweighs the bad. Plus the cold rationality helps the "warrior philosopher" characterization.
>>96827659But what the fuck is he wearing. You can't say "oh his nickname was kitten so we gave him cat ears", you give a nickname like that wears cat ears, and you have to explain why he wears cat ears. Everyone else has accents from their original character but they make sense - big D isn't called big E, he wears yellow because he's a show off and not just because the Emperor liked gold. Marcus is the new Magnus and is a nerd so he dresses like a nerd.Not fucking literal brain dead "durr kitten give him kitten ears". Why the fuck is he going around in a ski mask and cat ears, he's the normal one scholar one. Character design needs to make sense, and his design is nonsensical eye vomit. At least his gun spear makes some sense rather than being just a reference, it's his improvised weapon.
>>96827616>>96827696A hoodie? A zip-up sweater?
>>96827696>You can't say "oh his nickname was kitten so we gave him cat earsTurns out, yes, yes you can. So they did. That's it.
>>96827701And a ski mask? Goggles? Oven mitts? What is the internal, in-universe reason? They could at least say something like: >he's been cursed by some asshole mage to always feel cold and the cat ears are something his weeb ex sewed onto his hoodieHe's the "normal" one but his design is near reddit-tier eyesore while the lolrandumb D gets a tight flamboyant design. I don't know why that fucking design makes me angry but it fucking does. It looks like fucking trash and is nonsensical.
>>96827721You can shove your thumb up your ass and some people will, doesn't mean you should and you're not retarded if you did it anyway.
>>96827731Anon you recognize the potential for gag gifts. Unclench your jaw
>>96827616I have no idea. I just hope the autistic sperg-out about Kuei-jin was meant as a joke. I mean, sure, Kindred Of The East might not be the most true to form thing regarding Eastern myth, but what the fuck do they think VtM itself is? True world history? And okay, so instead of having a unique set of creatures flavored after Eastern Myth, you just have all vampires born from a figure ripped from the Old Testament that is an equal or greater nightmare of kitbashed concepts.
>>96826107Are you forgetting that the pyramid basically doesn’t exist in v5 anymore?
>>96827745It's a fucking eyesore, it had to be said. >>96827752Big D isn't a reliable source of information. Unless the writers REALLY don't like the Kuei-jin or find them "offensive". Although who the fuck knows considering how FUCKING OFFENSIVE to my eyes kitten is.
>>96827765I don't think that secondary knew there were version differences. The game doesn't really go out of it's way to say it's v5.
>>96827765>>96827776Don't the Tremere still roughly follow the traditions of the Pyramid? just more so at a localized level instead of a general level since all the elders are getting munched
>>96818867so since WOD doesn't have to mach our timeline i've got an idea where robert thorne won the 2016 election instead of donald trump, and some other shenagigans that makes the world way worse https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=0ovLsFhd-EM2016 republican primaries happen one of the leading candidates is robert thorne a wealthy poltician coming from pentex money who accuses his opposition mainly trump hilary and bernie of being pedophiles defamation lawsuits ensue a few weeks after his entrance his presidential rally is hit by an incendiary gas bomb from an anti pentex terror cell, this leaves around 90 people dead and injured and marks the deadliest attack on a political rally in american history TV screens show the charred bodies of those at the rally robert thorne survives with the body below his neck around his chest scarred, despite that he recovers and continues in the presidential race and wins in a landslide the US also enters a heightened state of security that they have not seen since 911, the second inquisition flush with goverment funding has a field day a canadian eco terror cell is found to be responsible by the FBI upon being elected into office robert thorne continues to further fund the second inquisition the US launch their anti terror operations on canadian soil in early 2017 doland trump runs into monetary trouble due to accusations robert throrne threw around and a huge lawsuit ensues during that lawsuit donald and melina trump are found dead in their tower with baron trump and the members of the trump security detail being the only witnesses all security footage of the room where it happened was found to be deleted US federal investigators rule suicide despite that several of his family members contest that claim but run into legal trouble and are found to be guilty of various things >continued
>>96827616He should have dressed like a banana. Like a little Big D but with more practicality & normality. Like a gimmick yellow jacket with a banana hood, a cat tshirt & jeans
>>96827796ok but how are you going to run a game for that?
>>96821384Mage players know nothing of the W:tA Umbra.
Speaking of HtP, how did she go from an ugly frog goblin to an absolute semen demon by just putting on some fancy clothes, a skirt and some heels?
>>96827794One faction does, one of the Camarilla aligned houses and led by Schrekt. House Goratrix supposedly became Camarilla aligned as well. The Tremere Gilf is of that faction but there's all of two tremere in Seattle, gamewise, and they're not looked at kindly.
>>96827816She’s a 33 year-old Christmas cake, it would be unusual for her to not be a semen demon when wearing business-casual clothing.
>>96827816Amazing what hygiene and some deliberate personal grooming can do.
What's the best chronicle to run out of the box? Premade adventure basically. Mostly I just want to read it and see how they set it up.
>>96827741Good point, thumb barely reaches a prostate if at all, definitely need something like a middle finger to really work it.
>>96827833>House Goratrix supposedly became Camarilla aligned as wellCan confirm. at least if you take v5's lore seriously. If it werent for the Blood Sigils book i would have assumed they split the clan into 3 sub factions (Schrekt as camarilla, Carna as anarch, and Goratrix as sabbat) but according to BS theyre all camarilla aligned (with Carna playing "footsie with the anarchs" to quote the book)
>>96827874Charnel Houses of Europe.
>>96827876They got Ipsissimus for local and city-tier anarch bullshit too.
>>96827886Oy vey
>>96827837>Amazing what hygiene and some deliberate personal grooming can do.Seems like they're might be a lesson for some 4channers to learn.
>>96821965 >>96822836Sure, but the Exarchs and the Seers are always watching. And that's before you consider hunters, mummies, demons, and of course Paradox.
>>96827796also something that didn't fit within the original post but within the 2016 primaries it was found that the source of the gas explosion that scarred robert throne and wounded and killed near one hundred others was a concealed gas pipeline a few months later around the middle of the 2017 jeffry epstien is found dead along with an underaged woman on the streets of california along with his wife gislane maxwell this is ruled as murder by the authorities the phrase online becomes donald trump didn't kill himself in late 2018 conjoined boars are found to be incredibly common and scarily functional a massive zombie deer outbreak occurs wildlife populations explode eco protests occur over pesticides but are harshly suppressed by the government the us president robert thorne accuses the eco protestors of being satanists and terrorists funded by reminants of the stasi in late 2019 another assasination attempt on robert thrones life happens but is thrwarted while he is at a conference in turkey he accuses the Iranians of being responsible and starts war with iran weeks afterwards around christmas the influaidsia pandemic hits the globe iran is accused of engineering it, but a lot of people suspect other state actors the 2020 election is postponed due to pandemic scare and matters of national securitythe plague spreads rapidly but has no cure and permanently infects a victim lingering in their system and leaving them contagious not sure what is on the timetable past 2020 but these are just public events and gehenna and the eventual apocalypse brought about by the wrym could await but they would take time >>96827809weirdly it's probably going to be a mixed mage and hunter game though vampires might be allowed pentex will be a major focus, along with second inquisition shenagians, thinking of dallas and rural lousiana as the main locations kinda had some ideas of an apocaplitpic post vampire disclosure wod timeline similar to daybreakers
>>96827901Fuck
>>96823841You're in for a Hell of a time.
>>96827796yeah but how do you square that with the it's always sunny in philadelphia cameo with drumpf fucking his daughter?
>>96824226I would love to play Skeleton: the Rattling. Skeletons are my favorite mythical creature.
>>96827752>>96827768Plenty of people don't like KotE for non-sjw reasons. I saw next to no defense of it until V5 retconned them.
>>96827984You must have a gigantic ass to fit that huge lie you just pulled out of it.
>>96828016I dunno why this statement pisses so many people off. KotE has gotten a lot of shit before and I never noticed anyone defend it until Paradox soft-retconned them.
>>96828022The problem with them wasn’t that they were included and that’s it, it was that they were included but had hardly any explanation about what the fuck they are beyond ghost people taking over corpses and had some nonspecific grand scheme. Removing them is an admission of the writers being retarded instead of developing them into something that legitimately threatens Cainites.
>>96828022>I dunno why this statement pisses so many people off.Because oWoD purism is a reactionary position created in response to how shit WoD5 is.
I don't like KotE because I want yakuza ventrue
>>96828058Brujah or Lasombra work better. Maybe militant Toreador too
>>96828058Based.>>96828061Nah organized crime Ventrue is a classic dating back to the earliest books.
>>96828046I disagree. I think the Kuei-Jin fail at concept. They're essentially a different splat forcibly grafted onto VTM. They exist only in one part of the world up until very recently and their existence either excludes the existence of or forces a perpetual war with of Cainites in the same region. Their existence limits what you can do with a plot of Vampire in exchange for something a table may not enjoy. Your solution to make them a more fleshed out antagonist faction is a potential solution, but I don't think it's a good one. See how much people bitch about the focus Strix get in Requiem. I imagine fleshing out them as the inherent nemesis of the Cainite would produce similar groans from many people, exacerbated by them being such a particular phenomenon tied to a particular place.
>>96828061>LasombraI only feel this one because they're closer to Portugal and the Nanban trade. Ventrue are fine.
>>96828077I have to get ready for work so I can’t continue the discussion, but I want you to know that I appreciate you using reason and comparisons to explain your perspective instead of just being a cum-guzzling fagtron.
>>96828077Counterpoint: Everything that isn't a werewolf in WtA.
>>96828077Man the strix are a neat idea, if a little heavy handed. I wish they'd get brought over for abyss/oblivion shenanigans.
>>96827984I soured on it because it literally has pulled from D&D's Deities and Demigods Tou Mu and made up for the D&D book archery demon. So, were the "D&D is an occult instruction book!" people right in the WoD? Because if so, that's really stupid.(But if you get rid of those it's basically just edgelord undead cultivators from hell, which is workable.)>>96827236>black bosslady...Anon, that's Randel "the Fireman" Portman. He's a middle-aged white dude who was, prior to erupting... a fireman. The black dudes on the cover are either wearing a devil mask or fighting that oversized claw guy with the comically small head.
>>96825505But the Chronicles of Darkness were great. Most of the lines satisfied my consistency autism.
>>96828091No problem at all. I'm always happy to have an amicable disagreement. >>96828097Could you elaborate on what you mean by that? Werewolf is a very different game from Vampire.>>96828101I don't disagree that Strix have a lot of neat things about them. However, I think there is merit to the people who groan about them being shoved into this position as the Ur-Predator of vampires. As one of many potential antagonists in a roster, something Requiem has in spades, they're fine. But people were annoyed when they got shoved to the forefront and routinely characterized as the "bigger fish" in Blood and Smoke. Hence my use of them for the comparison to Kuei-Jin. For what it's worth though, I did repurpose them as a strain of Abyss Creature in my table's VtM-VtR hybrid. But autistic mashup settings don't have much of a place in discussing canon.
>>96828077>This concept was not fully explained!>I know! the solution is to remove it!Either Requiemtard or V5cuck, call it.
>>96828109You're welcome to believe that, but it's not exactly a secret that the World of Darkness reboot that led to what would become the Chronicles of Darkness wasn't a hit with everyone. There's a reason why the franchise went from rivalling D&D in terms of popularity to requiring Kickstarter to afford to make core books, let alone supplementary material.
>>96828136NTA but Werewolf has a large number of Fera, other werecreatures that often have some very quirky departures from the mechanics and themes of typical W:tA games. Hungry Dead aren't much different conceptually, using a thing like a blood pool but in an entirely different way and having a drastically different origin (and anything that kicks Noddism off its high horse is automatically a thumbs up).
>>96825784>I didn't sign up for wizard psyops to determine the future of realityBut I did!
>>96828146That's somewhat disingenuous framing. By the time Gehenna rolled out in the early 2000s, WoD was well past its peak as D&D's runner-up. The way you put it makes it seem that everything was smooth sailing until the White Wolf decided to shoot themselves in the head for no reason. And all that is secondary to the implication that popularity = quality.
>>96828146>There's a reason why the franchise went from rivalling D&D in terms of popularity to requiring Kickstarter to afford to make core books, let alone supplementary material.Mainly because they weren't backed by a giant corporation like CCP with deep pockets anymore, but keep believing that nonsense if it helps you sleep at night.
>>96828136I love the Strix conceptually
>>96828159Do I need to repeat every prior point that I've made in every post? >>96825505 makes it clear that there were multiple points of failure that led to White Wolf's downfall. Their botching of the reboot was just one of the many. I thought that I wouldn't have to say it again when that point's already been made. It's like talking with goldfish.
>>96828159>WoD was well past its peak as D&D's runner-up.Requiemfag COPE. oWoD was the second most popular TRPG in the market. But Requiem destroyed the popularity of the brand over the years.
>>96825907Wasn't Caine a vegan? That was the whole reason that God snubbed him.
>>96828185No, it was for animal husbandry. Sabbat spread fantasy that it was about something else but it was Caine's animal husbandry that led to him getting cursed
>>96825954>the first game that made people actually take the new World of Darkness seriouslyElaborate on this. Also, wasn't Promethean: the Created the most critically acclaimed, despite not being a bestseller?
>>96828154Ah I see. Honestly? I wouldn't mind if Vampire had its own equivalent to Fera. It seems a lot of people have a sort of one or the other vendetta about oWoD and nWoD in this thread, but as someone who appreciates aspects of both, I have to give Requiem credit as they essentially did take the "Vampire Fera" approach instead. The issue is that KotE is one of a kind and is heavily geolocked, making it stick out a lot more than WtA's Fera. Fera exist everywhere, and their existence does not prevent Garou, the focus of the gameline from existing anywhere. At the same time, you can theoretically run a WtA game without ever using the Fera once. What I'm trying to say is that they're versatile and unobtrusive. Whereas the Kuei-Jin are the only one of their kind, either don't exist at all or are the only game in town depending on where you are, and in the areas where both are present, it's constant conflict and turf wars. That's why you don't see similar flamewars about the existence of Fera. They're far better integrated.
>>96825991No. Run Wraith: the Oblivion instead.
>>96828178I'm not even the guy you were arguing with prior.
>>96826007https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=T6JFTmQCFHg
In Mage, would enough people thinking this house is on fire cause the house to actually become on fire?https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=GGkzfZLqkiE
>>96828241Yes, might not be an instant inferno but it'd catch fire.
>>96828241No, unless it's in some marauder bubble. If everyone in the world thought you fucked goats, it wouldn't magically make you into bestiality. Consensus is for broader stuff than that.
>>96828218will you play with me if i learn to ST it
>>96828241Not directly, but it would become more likely for the electronics to start an accidental fire, particularly if vandalized by parties who believed themselves to be fighting a fire, and then it would be recorded as a funny coincidence by anybody that ever happened to notice.
>>96826335My issue with Geist: the Sin-Eater is that there is no sin-eating in it.
Posting this here because I don't want to ruin the mood of the /schreck/ thread.I want to finish the storyline I've been doing over there but I'm losing passion for it. Idk. It doesn't grip me like it did during the first run or the early second run. Is the idea behind the thread just out of energy or? It seems most of the fun recurring posters are gone now.
>>96828297I've been posting there but took a pase to mock Shitlines 2 and Paradox on Reddit and /v/. I should return soon and we can have fun.
>>96828206At the time, Vampire the Requiem was commonly seen as the soulless husk of Vampire the Masquerade, similar to how people look at V5 today. Werewolf the Forsaken and especially Mage the Awakening had similarly negative reactions. I remember the Atlantis shitstorms.Promethean has always been a game that people loved to read and ponder about, but that people anecdotally never actually played due to being too intimidated by how lofty and deep it was.Changeling the Lost was the first time that a new World of Darkness game was well-received and treated like a game people actually wanted to play, rather than an art-piece to admire from a distance like Promethean.I don't have hard numbers with me, but likely neither do you. This is all anecdotal experience tied to the communities that we play in. If your community was all over Promethean like flies over shit and playing it non-stop, good for you, but that's not what I've observed regarding Promethean.
>>96828178Or you're just fabricating a fake claim. There was no "downfall," they got bought by CCP.Then 6 years later got spun off as an independent company that didn't own the IPs they'd created anymore, and Kickstarter happened to be a great way to get the initial work of paying writers done without needing to go into the red with no clue if they'd make it back in sales, while DTRPG basically costs nothing to them to sell books on, since production costs and printer/distributor profit cuts there are taken right out of the purchaser's transaction.You're trying to create a new narrative out of thin air.
>>96828297i wish i had the creativity to roleplay something there but i feel like i have no personality
>>96828348>>96828348>>96828348
>>96828352>>96828352>argument starting OPFuck you.
>560 postsimpressive
>>96827765Yes, but we are talking about the events that take place well before the fall of the Pyramid. Safia's been on a Sabbat koodaid for almost a century apparently.Also, we have a Tremere primogen in thd city that really doesn't seem to care what this relatively young Cainite is doing.
>>96828297>Crimson>Triclops>Phrenolopher>LadyBlueBlood>Fancy FeastSo many good posters left.
>>96828376>Tremere>primogen>in SeattleLel, Lou did one thing right and kept from them a court position
>>96827752>what the fuck do they think VtM itself is? True world history?He doesn't know...
>>96828384Crimson Pinstripes here, Im sorry my friend but I just don't have the time to post on schreck anymore. I barely post of /tg/ as it is.
>>96828146>wasn't a hit with everyoneSure, but I didn't even get into the World of Darkness until Mage: the Awakening came out. Then, over the years, I was able to obtain most of the mainline games for both the Old World and the Chronicles/New World.
>>96828281Yes. But I want to be as angsty as possible.
>>96828297I want a place for all the losers to hang out (wraiths, mummies, changelings, demons, Prometheans, and sin-eaters).
>>96828459sorry i actually havent ever played a single wod game beforewraith is cool and i like angst but also i dont think i can express it
>>96828325>I remember the Atlantis shitstorms.I know what you mean, but it has never appeared in any of my games, despite not hating it.
>>96828325>If your community was all over Promethean like flies over shit and playing it non-stop, good for you, but that's not what I've observed regarding Promethean.Nah, I was referring to Promethean: the Created as an "art piece", as you said. I saw a lot of good press for it. In my area, Vampire: the Masquerade was the only one to gain traction, save for the local mixed-line L.A.R.P.
>>96828469That's a given. You will learn.
>>96828495>Anecdotes are data!
>>96828500i doubt it :(
>>96828297The funposters who left actually engaged with other people's prompts and stories, had a variety of beliefs and personalities, and could bounce off each other pretty well. The war over who got to influence that one Tzimisce Autark was fun. LadyBlueBlood's recurring role as the one who would baby the random abandoned fledglings and explain how to join the Camarilla without being beheaded was soul, even if at a certain point the number of dumpster babies crossed the suspension of disbelief event horizon. But now the problem is that now most of the recurring posters are the same flavor of "I'm a cool dude who knows Mage lore and will never ever lose or get my teeth kicked in. Let me tell you about The Week of Nightmares bro..." Which doesn't give anyone else something worth engaging in. That or perhaps people have been burnt on nonreactive stories and thus don't WANT to engage with the new ones because... A lot of the fun stories in Schreck 1.0 and 2.0 overstayed their welcome. The aforementioned Tzimisce Autark had several good places to end his story (him blowing himself up to kill the Sabbat at the very end of Schreck 1.0 was peak) but instead it kept dragging and now it'll never be finished. Sarkourgos rising from the dead after other posters tried to give input into the story that would result in his final death, only to wish everyone merry Christmas at the end ruined an otherwise great story about a powerful and hubristic Tzimisce Elder. Also, things got a little vitriolic at the end. Maybe I am misattributing, but some of the spoiler text in the very last Schreck 2.0 thread (the one that lasted a whole month before it hit autosage) seemed genuinely bitter.
>>96828173I love the Strix as presented in the OG Requiem for Rome chronicle.2e putting them front and center as a "big antagonist" for the game as a whole ruins them by over-exposure for me.
>>96830156I just really like the whole "Abyss entity that could be the progenitor/parallel evolution of the Beast who prey on vampires & cause them to have mistrust & in fighting between themselves & stuff."
>>96827895But Ipsissimus is just briefly described in Anarch V5 and Blood Sigils has no update on it. The book they should've give us more detail on it simply fails to its most basic task.
>>96828182If they continued the Dark Ages line while doing nWoD, things would go fine, but nooooo... That's why we can't have nice things.
>>96828077See I disagree with this take too, I think it's their execution that's the issue. Ignoring the orientalism or any other criticism that counts as woke, there's plenty to be annoyed about between the writing (this group of kuei-jin are just like these cainites BUT BETTER) and then the convoluted nature of several of their powers, but the concept of the Kuei-Jin is awesome, imo. Ghosts who escaped hell, who have to consume the life of other in order to keep existing, who's main goal is now how to return to a perfected heavenly state is an interesting idea - the issue is that its not necessarily VTM. I think if you cleaned up the "all of asia is china/japan" aspects of the lore, you'd have a neat gambling for an urban fantasy game set somewhere in SEA - but you don't have to, and maybe shouldn't, put them up against the Cainites as their one big dust-up conflict.
For all the high praise towards CTL I think ultimately this game was released during a moment in time were TTRPS in general were not really in vouge and that's the reason why is not that big of a name. In general I think Vampire wasted a lot of the potential opened by the resurgence of the hobbie, and that's baffling for an IP with a good brand recognition as this.. A shame for the corps I guess.
