>>97313986
>What do you want next?
Eldar Space Marines

>>97313986
>What do you want next?
A tactica journal themed around destroyers. Release plastic destroyer upgrade kit alongside it, and bring back the disintegrator pistols moritat.

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>>97313986
for the Skittari journal to be actually fucking good.

>>97314013
also this!

>>97313986
3.0 Bodt journal with the SA pov.

How are Solar Aux in the new edition?

>>97314100
Very good, lots of fun viable playstyles, cool mix and match customization between cohort doctrine and legiones auxilia, don't spam dracosans with demolishers or you'll be that guy. It's funny seeing everyone in my gaming group start a solar aux "allied" project for the new year (we all know it won't end as allies)

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>>97313986
I want more time to play games.
I also want a cute gf that will play Titanicus with me while wearing not very much but let's go with the realistic goal here.

>>97313986
>What do you want next?

More fast attack in plastic. Sabre Tanks, Land Speeders, Javelins, Outriders, and so on.

>>97313986
>TQ
Orfeo Cassandar with rules that let him credibly stalemate Kharn
Narik Dreygur
Cassian Dracos as a Leviathan-Cortus and Adherents

>>97314200
we already have a model for cassian dracos, no clue why people are asking for him when salamanders are missing all their real characters (Numeon and Forgefather T'kell who are missing rules and missing models)

>>97314215
Because no one cares about BL slop

>>97314215
>we already have

you maybe, but that model hasn't been on sale for like three years and fuck ordering a bone cancer delivery system from chinaman when we could have a glorious plastic Leviathan-Cortus boxnaut kit

>>97313986
>TQ
Kheron Ophion

>>97314013
they are going to mess up the design no thanks, prints already exist

>>97314117
demolishers are nerfed? not even that good compared to 1.0

>>97314236
What got you into the heresy hobby? For me it was BL slop.

>>97314507
GW removing the option to play a full bike army from w40k.

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I cancelled my order.

>>97314664
The important part is that you made the decision and acted on it. Inaction is the worse thing. I salut you anon.

Anons I got suprised by a friend today. All my officers are based on the 2d pretors. I know it is not everyones thing, but I like how big they are. But I also wanted some cataphract heroes, but besides the power armoured models, even regular ones , they look very small. And here comes the suprise, my friend somehow got the scans of DA pretors, buffed their size and printed out 5 for my birthday. Now I can make a dual claw one, a paladin of Hekatonistica, a herald and chaplain. Without them feeling off. I don't remember when was the last time, I was so happy. And it is not even the models, but the fact my friend thought about me, and did it all on his own, unasked. May you have as happy decade as I just had anons. .

>>97314716
wow, that's a good friend, I haven't gotten a present like that in 20 years in the hobby

>>97314664
I wish I'd ordered 2. But I just don't need 2 more leviathans

>>97314769
I don't have a Leviathan yet but I imagine it wouldn't be completely stupid to pair the Battleforce one with the Combat Force and mix the weapons or some shit, but then again I'm not sure if one would even want more than one Leviathan.

>>97314613
What 40k edition?

>>97314781
then your imagination is dogshit. It'd be absolutely completely stupid. Leviathans with melee weapons are F-tier. Leviathans with storm cannon and cyclonic melta lance are pretty much F-tier since storm does fuckall to everything and melta does nothing to anything beyond 8" and stationary (which is NEVER and NEVER for leviathan tank-hunting.) Ranged leviathan box comes with one single grav bombard and two shit guns.

You can't make two mediocre leviathans with only 1 single good arm. You can't even make ONE good ranged leviathan with that single arm. And even if you wanted to make an actual tank-hunter leviathan in a dreadnought drop pod to have a 10% chance of getting in melta range (a shit idea), it'd still need 2 melta arms since they're only S8 when deepstriking or moving and it's only Dmg6 on the miracle chance you roll a 3+ to hit and 6+ to wound and it pens. With just one melta arm and one arm which doesnt even scratch tanks it wouldn't even be capable of playing pretend.

wish me luck

>>97315014
Good luck my guy.

>>97314920
>storm does fuckall to everything

>>97314781
here's how much of a joke leviathan melta is. One melta arm vs smoked landraider, not even 1% chance of killing it (0.78%), average wounds 1.3 if you get within 8 inches, drops to zero percent flat chance from beyond 8". Even double cyclonic melta is harmless to 14, going to less than 4% chance of kill and doing two and a half avg wounds of 10.

So bump your expensive super slow super short range anti-tank cripple to fighting AV13 it must be good at that? Nope, 6 cyclonic melta at an inch away into a dracosan (Av13 7w) fails to take it down 65% of the time, average 5.5 of 7 wounds. If you only have 1 melta arm (your dumb purchase suggestion) that becomes 89% chance of failing to pop the medium tank and 2.7 average of its 7.

Okay, can one gun at least reliably pop AV12? You for some reason are teleported behind a sicaran's rear av12 and 6hp, with one cyclonic lance, and you've moved to get there. So long as he pops smoke, your 3 melta shots vs his rear armor succeeds 27% of the time, failing 3 of 4 tries.

A double-melta leviathan costs 260 points. Just pay 100 more for Kratos and get easily 4x the offense and defense.

The only place leviathan might have the slightest promise is taking grav+grav+phosphex for same 260 (which you can't as you don't own 2 gravs) and instead of needing 8" you only need 18" of a single infantry model to place all the pie plates (even if you place them 25" away behind a building on that unit.) For deathguard which makes it 22" threat range without losing dmg2 it's still less impressive only breaching on 6+ when saturnine with inversion-inversion is doing AP2 dmg3 pieplates on 2+s (5x more deadly pieplates), but the grav-grav-phosphex dread at least has pinning(2)+panic(3). Maybe there's some world knocking the primarch deathstar blob to initiative 1 is better than wiping most of the unit, but even if you did want to do that, two leviathans is pointless, slow, avoidable, harmless

>>97315019
>if I put a > in front of the truth maybe it will not be truth anymore

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>>97315014
damnit forgot pic
>>97315018
thanks

>>97314788
I started in 8th ed, at the very end of it. Build my army through out 9th ed. And had a full army a month before the 10th ed index for space marines dropped. Then when that happened, I found out I had no army as all bikers, biker characters, land speeders , attack bikes etc got removed from the sm codex for some reason. and it was impossible to build a "counts as" army with 3 chaplains and 3 units of outriders. So thinking that HH is more of an old player/eternal system, I moved to 3ed HH and build a WS jetbike focused army with javelin speeders in support, a unit of 10/2x5 outriders acting as my scouts and a unit of Golden Keshig to be my "hammer" unit. I finshed that 3 months before 3ed of HH dropped. Bought the last unit for my army in january with a combination of christmas money and yearly bonus.

>>97315038
I feel your pain. GW deleted the entire Ravenwing army from 40k with zero warning.

>>97315048
well happens I guess. And it is a lesson I only had to learn twice. Now I mostly focus on trying to learn to paint to a level I could accept. And who knows maybe before I hit 60 aka in 5 editions a full bike army is going to be legal and fun to play.

are proteus speeders good at anti-tank?

for their points cost at least
you can slap something like 2 multimeltas and 2 HK missiles on each right?
or do they fit a better role?

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Did he copy redmakers or did this design already exist?

>>97315189
it already existed mr lawyer.

>>97315237
How can trademarks be a thing, if they are just described ideas, and we can't even agree on the most basic of those. Heck some GHC enjoyers can't even agree what ever H2O is real or not. IMO we should let people do what ever they can, and the person with the better print farm in Eastern Europe wins.

>>97314025
>Skitarii Journal
Do we know when it's coming? What the fuck do you even expect? It's going to be minimal content. Skitarii, secutarii, transport, drone.

>>97314215
I remember Xiaphas Jurr, who hosted Dracos on the last voyage of the Ebon Drake. But I don't know what did Master Chaplain Nomus Rhytan did other than order Jurr to go there, and that guy has rules. And a cool obsidian mallet.
Which is weird because obsidian is known for being sharp and extremely brittle, as it is technically glass

>>97314664
If the Emperor is alive and this is an age of enlightenment and rediscovery...why do imperials still have the gothic skull motif that only makes sense after ten thousand years of church law and stagnation?
What's the explanation for the vox being a skull?

>>97315099
Depends on the tank. Double melta speeders can OHKO most non AV14 bricks tanks with a deep strike, a couple of those and even superheavies/knights evaporate. But just straight up shooting them head on? Not really.

>>97315480
The imperium was always gothic. They already have servitors.

>>97315480
The imperium uses skulls because the emperor liked skulls. Because he is an orc.

>>97315652
>They already have servitors.
No, those are outsourced to the allied Mechanicum Autonomous Region. It is they who have always been a theocracy

>>97315021
>average 5.5

not a thinggggg

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reworked my list due to recommendations and advice from anons
please leave feedback

>Alpha Legion

High Command
>Praetor in cataphractii w/ thunder hammer, banestrike combi-bolter

Command
>Herald in cataphractii w/ thunder hammer (prime advantage: logistical benefit)
>Herald in cataphractii w/ thunder hammer

Logistical Benefit
>3x Proteus Land Speeders w/ multi-melta, 2x HK missiles each

Apex Detachment: Army Vanguard
Elites:
>5x Lernaen w/ conversion beam cannon, 1x thunder hammer, 4x banestrike combi-bolter (prime advantage: logistical benefit)
>5x Lernaen w/ conversion beam cannon, 1x thunder hammer, 4x banestrike combi-bolter
>5x Lernaen w/ heavy flamer, 1x thunder hammer, 4x banestrike combi-bolter

Logistical Benefit
>3x Proteus Land Speeders w/ Multi-melta, 2x HK missiles each

Armoured Fist
>3x Land Raider Carriers

Headhunter Leviathal
>2x 5 Effrit w/ meltabombs (prime advantage: combat veterans)

comes to 3000 exactly
thoughts?

>>97315890
not going to have much board presence, staying power, or killing power with that.

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considering ordering 40k ec to convert tormentors into nl inductii with fancy daggers, do you think there is a way to sell the flawless blades as a chunky duel oriented cmd squad? maybe i should order some jump packs and claim them as raptors? my intent is to do some somewhat heavy converting

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>>97315036
too tired to finish, was pretty inconclusive
i made a ton of easy to avoid errors but it was my first game in a year

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>>97315036
why is bobby G completely blue, top kek

>>97316235
he's supposed to be a statue

>>97316154
Flawless blades are fucking huge. They're taller than even the AoD sword praetor and they're absolute gigachads standing next to Mk6 which are only as tall as chest level.

Tormentors are a bit taller than Mk6 but not by much. They could work if you mix in some heresy bits and shave down the slaaneshi symbols.

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bonus, imperium state building

>>97315245
>some GHC enjoyers can't even agree what ever H2O is real or not
Water isn't real?
>>97315646
Reminder the question "good antitank" specifically refers to killing AV14, like those S10 lasers on Venators, Rapiers and so on.
Things that can kill AV12-13 is normal antitank. That is, highlighting that the word "good" does not mean "average"
AV10-11 doesn't even exist as frontal armour, and thus is not a consideration for antitank. Those are light enough to be hurt by heavy anti-infantry, like autocannons and thunder hammers

>>97316248
>They're taller than even the AoD sword praetor
fuck my life really??
maybe they were just particularly wealthy nostramans and were fed significantly more than the rest of the army so the disparity is actually just sovlful fluff...

>>97316282
Flawless blades are a head taller than primaris marines (which is quite a bit considering they have long mishapen slaaneshi heads). They're Shaquille O'Neal compared to normal heresy infantry.

>>97316082
well yeah, its an elite army of course it's not gonna have much board presence

>>97316298
guess i have no choice but to proxy them as saturnine:/ (idk we'll see i still haven't done any hard conversion in a minute but i like the models enough that if they just stay as is/for display it's fine)

>>97316318
okay but elite in what capacity? if it doesn't kill anything and dies quickly is it really elite?

An elite army sacrifices board presence for being really really good at taking and/or holding the parts of the board they can.

>>97315480
They used skulls because it was supposed to show human beauty in all forms

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Started work on my arch Mahos, I was going to leave the pistol on and fluff it as a disintigrator, but I like being able to demore him to regula magos if needed. So left that and a few other bits off

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>>97316264
Missing a jokaero climbing it.

>>97316414
Ook!

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>>97316298
I don't know. Guy on the right looks shorter, left guy looks larger. Though the back-mounted pipe organ and topknot sure helps. Is he a character?

>>97316437
avoid the M-word at all cost, got it

>>97316475
left is a noise marine which flawless blades are like another half step taller than, right is a tormentor/infractor and is just an ec themed extra good melee or ranged mook

>>97316475
>>97316502
(and the guy on the right is a smidge taller than mk6, not primaris)

>>97316502
This is getting out of control

>>97316550
it's my fault for even bringing 40k models up

>>97316475
He's not big enough, marines should really sell the superhuman dread part, GW should make the next csm minis 70mm tall. Only then they will be truescaled enough to last a couple of weeks before they are too small again.

>>97316578
Bro be playing 40k with Joytoy frfr
https://youtu.be/H4K_3uvN_5Y?si=eFguzBRjh6ZxLiek

>>97316360
well what would you recommend then?

>>97316268
>AV10-11 doesn't even exist as frontal armour
They deepstrike dumbass, you drop in 3" away from the rear armor

>>97316480
Got it captin

>>97316727
...why not 8"? Aren't they armed with multi meltas?

How come some specific sergeants have inferno pistols but never characters? Inferno pistols seem rarer than actually proscribed Disintegrator pistols

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>>97316943
Sucks to suck.

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. . .

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First Titanicus game of 2026. I lost 10-5 to Audax through secondary objectives. I finally remembered to tell my opponent about the dire wolve's special deployment and so Rock 'em Sock 'em got stuck trying to intercept one of the wolves. I should have charged and destroyed the building but it didn't occur to me to do that until it was too late.

>>97317087
They fucked up the shoulders on the boomer cata

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>>97317088
A lot of action happened in just two spots on the board. Here the Twin and Stripes did a pretty good job taking on three titans, but Stripes wasn't able to take the double inferno dog down by himself and the Twin had to chip in. It turned and wild fired its own titan by then it had also gotten a combat phase in against Stripes and soaked up enough damage.

>>97317088
FUCK YEAH AT FUCK YEAH AT FUCK YEAH AT FUCK YEAH AT FUCK YEAH AT FUCK YEAH AT FUCK YEAH AT

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>>97317106
Bossman gets brought down by three warhounds and a dire wolf in two turns. Rock 'em Sock 'em had gotten up to the second dire wolf but its machine spirit awakened and it got to walk away from the reaver titan so all I could do was fail around with the vulcan mega bolter, but on turn 4 I was able to score a kill that way. The Pale King failed two 2+ command checks on a d10 this game which meant I wasn't able to get orders in some critical turns, though it did do some good damage with its volcano cannons it missed too many shots to score any kills itself.
I rolled a lot of 1s this game but considering how last game went I couldn't complain.

>>97317087
>Nu-cata the same size as old cata
Lol. Lmao. even.

>>97317130
> Double volcano Warlord
Bold choice cotton

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>>97317130
My opponent is really getting the hand on positioning. He usually plays pretty conservatively, holding back in the early game and avoiding pushing his reactors too hard, which isn't what you'd expect from warhounds but it means he's got a lot of his firepower in just the right place and the titans are running cool enough to play with shieldbane and maximal fire.
The Twin there would kill itself with its own reactor overload turn 4 and cause a magazine detonation, which killed on the of warhounds it had been fighting as well. Rock 'em Sock 'em Reaver would also detonate a warhound's magazine which did quite a bit of damage to surrounding Audax titans, but not enough. I need to look up in the FAQ if magazine detonations bypass void shields or not.
Really good game. Pretty quick too. And now I get to go to a museum presentation on reindeer.

>>97317087
>just slightly taller
>chests are a lot smaller
>kit is just three Terminators now
>Power fists look like crap
>fewer weapon options
>unnecessary bolter redesign
>shoulder pads are in three pieces for some reason
>added hip plates
Grim. Dark, even.

>>97317215
>three
Six, they have six different sets of numbers

hmmmm maybe anon is right and I have too little board presence
what would work better than 2 units of 5 effrit with meltabombs?

something like 2 TSS with rotor cannons or volkite calivers or something?

>>97317302
then that way I have guys who can be a bit further back, have lots of more models, and arent neccessarily in a dangerous position due to infiltrating

>>97317302
board presence is not only ability to put things in places but also to be useful in those places. the key thing your AL list is missing is cheap line squads that you can put in corners/backline and forget about. A tactical squad on home point scoring VP+Line means you stay even with their scoring while your Lernaeans bully objectives.

>>97317215
No but you don't get it, it's new and taller which means better.

>>97317336
granted, a TSS would be scoring a lot less points, but would the firepower and range from something like calivers be a decent choice as an alternative?

as quite simply, tacticals are boring and I think my list is lacking a bit in the anti infantry department

>>97317358
Bro the height difference is so insignificant you almost need to whip out the callipers to notice it. The new cata are an absolute joke.

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is this nigga OOP already? out of stock on GW's website, no results on amazon, ebay listings are for "pro painted" or don't include all components.
I really only need his right arm and a hammer but the bits seller who's selling his bits is out of the arm. :(

>>97317302
>>97315890
I know Tacticals are no longer tax (except for one Troop Logistical Slot lol)...but no Tacticals at all? Who holds the backfield?
>>97317379
Oh shit bro's really going to steal DA volkite Inductii

>>97317379
Dreadnoughts can claim objectives. Would be scoring the same amount of VP as TSS. Slap a pair of gravis plasma cannons on it to solve your lack of infantry clearing firepower.

>>97317087
It's just me or the old Cataphractii misses the smaller shoulder pad? Btw adding a little bit of green stuff between the legs and torso just adds the missing height. I made my latest Catas in that way and imho looks much better. Absolutely no need for the new version which looks shitty and it's packed in a shitty box.

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>>97317087
Print your shit

>>97317495
Just print the fists.

>>97317495
Most likely explanation is that GW's stock ran out least played edition by the way and they haven't had the chance to do a new production run. Kratos tanks have also been out of stock for a month or two after the new edition launched.

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>>97317548
>Kratos tanks have also been out of stock for a month or two after the new edition launched.
buy nu-Epic tank squadron, slap on big oval base. "I'm playing legion 2 or 11. the primarch was a midget."

>>97317158
> Restraint with warhounds in Audax
Scary. Are you guys using the matched play guide or the open war cards?
> Mag detonation ignore voids?
It's treated like any normal shooting attack where you get voids (unless you are too close) and ion shields/construct shields.

>>97317138
Missing sucks but against a warhound just about any armor roll is a critical hit, so it's not so bad.
Of course the Pale King rolled a bunch of 1s that match but that's a separate issue.

>>97317750
Open war cards. They're the best.

>>97317087
I see what's wrong now. The brestplate doesn't hand over the waist anymore. It just sits on top of the belt and takes away the sense of mass. Even tartaros has a bit belly to show it's got bulk.

>>97317087
I wish the new termies' chest didn't angle that far in. Old termies got no neck, but the new ones have no chest. Too bad, because I think that gorget looks nice

>>97316994
He looks so cute with his little hammer! [Gets melta blasted at i11 with the Pistol Gimmick]

>>97317951
with the what?

>>97317793
I love them but I find I forget some of the effects unless I theme the board or something.

>>97316943
>>97317961
SA have a gimmick where they shoot a pistol during the Focus phase of the duel (where you roll off to see who goes first), in exchange for not rolling any Focus at all. And this guy has an inferno melta pistol. It's literally an Indiana Jones moment.
I think that gimmick should be available to all.

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>>97318010
But that is Perturabo's thing :^)

>>97317977
We don't use those because they're just a big pain but the deployments and objectives are top tier

>>97317503
I cant fit 2 dreadnoughts in my list currently, i'd need to take another HQ (saboteur isnt a bad shout if I can afford him!)

>>97318027
no, Perturabo's thing is standing back and letting his minions shoot you, it's not an Indiana Jones thing, it's more of a Dietrich thing

>>97316994
>Parry this, you filthy casual

>>97317524
lol fathammer looks so dumb

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my second mastodon

>>97318773
Cool

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>>97318773

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>>97318773
Almost got me

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>>97318908
i tried lol

>>97318922
https://m.youtube.com/watch?v=N4Db0oYKXvw

>>97318922
Does the matty get a pintle option?

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>>97318027
>>97318224
Perturabo's is such a colossally worse gimmick because it's Snapshots from a unit that is both nearby yet also unengaged yet also has good non-blast guns. So, a Land Raider that specifically has a Multi-melta, that's your only hope for a nearby unengaged unit with good non-blast guns.
This compounded by the fact that an inferno pistol is that good a weapon: it will shoot full BS, so that already makes it twice as good. Deals D3, meaning it's 6 times as good already. A Land Raider needs half a dozen Lascannons to equal a single inferno pistol, because it will have moved. So, Perty's wagon better have a Multi-melta.
Non-AP2 non-Big D guns need not apply.

>>97318985
Kratos melta blast gun

>>97318985
>Whole unit snap shots vs a single BS 4 inferno pistol
Never go to Vegas anon.

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>>97318940
party mastodon best mastodon

>>97318985
1. I'd allow Masters of the Legion use their respective legion's Primarch Gambit. Mostly because many people don't use primarchs. No way Vulkan happened to be at every battle, but almost every battle did have a Praetor or Delegatus around
2. I like that SA's pistol gimmick, I wish everyone had access to it, but...
2.1. ...If characters had access to inferno pistols, then all duelists would simply get one.

>>97315099
speeders aren't good at anything this edition unfortunately. They can't actually crack tanks because their meltas were turned into toys and the tanks can just stick rear end to terrain or board edge then 100% of speeders are worthless, they can't beat up infantry, they can't score objectives since they're cavalry, they can't even use cover saves having a building stop a lascannon shot.

If they had firing protocols(3) so they could all fire the terrible multimelta + 2 mediocre hunter-killer missiles at the same time, they'd be barely tolerable, but instead the one lucky chance they get behind a tank who forgets to simply ass-to-wall, they arent allowed to fire their 2nd missile to actually take the tank out. And no speeder will ever survive to a 2nd turn behind the enemy tank inside the enemy army.

The white scars unique speeder is given FP(3) but they intentionally only allowed it to have non-antitank gun + 2 missiles so it's just as useless for tank-killing as shooting 2 guns. And costs 115 instead of the 80 of a melta-2hunter normal speeder.

>>97319011
>regenerating salamander saturnine
i can only get so erect

>>97318991
hitting on 5+ butchers its output, 0.666 hits, 0.555 wounds, 50% chance enemy saves it using 4++ so 28% chance to do any damage at all, 3/4th the time you used a gambit to deal 0 damage to the enemy and have perturabo get murdered. It's fucking garbage.

Perturabo essentially doesn't have any gambit at all. Of course, he loses to every single primarch in melee already so I guess it doesn't change a ton.

>>97318991
If there's a melee happening that close to the Kratos, with the Primarch of all people, then yeah I guess.
And not just the Kratos' main gun. All 6 of them lmao.

>>97319052
Just dont roll a 4

>>97317590

But Anon, we already have a legion of Smurfs.

>>97316384

Yeeesss.... but you have to admit that usually when they do that it's with the flesh still on.

>>97315480
something something memento mori maybe ?

>>97319018
Anti-grav no longer stop models from getting a cover save, retard. At least know the rules of the game when you're shitposting.

>>97319168
"Models with the Cavalry Type may not make use of any Cover Save granted by Terrain Features or Areas of Terrain" retardo child

>>97318985
Wait, aren't inferno pistols D2? Still, they don't need to give up their attacks like Perturabo does lmao
>>97319023
Regenerating 2W in a erage isn't as scary as Fulgrim's, Angron's, Mortarion's, Horus', Lorgar's or Alpharius' gimmicks, anon. Unironically I no longer wish to unlock the Primarch gimmicks for wider use, as it'd only benefit the loyalists

>>97319052
>Perturabo essentially doesn't have any gambit at all
Anon, only he and Magnus among traitors have any gambits at all. All other traitor primarchs simply use whatever gambit their legion has. They have rules for duels, but not gambits themselves

>>97319011
putting primarch gambit on Master of the Legion
SSS: IH
SS: NL
S: SW, UM, Sallies, IW
A: DA, IF
B: WS, BA, TS
F: RG
Doesn't even get a gambit: EC, WE, DG, SoH, WB, AL
A random IH praetor jumping to T8 and becoming 100% immune to infinity chainsword swings would be a bit stupid. Also funny, any random NL character would have better futuresight than Konrad Curze, as they're WIP9 and he's WIP8.

Definitely not allowing it as house-rule, would be rather game-breaking and unfair overall, not an improvement on the game. You'd need to write 18 actually fair gambits for it to serve any purpose, but there are already 18 legion gambits.

>>97319214
regenerating 2W per turn would be absolutely game-breaking on Saturnine Praetor. Half the reason it's such an unfair gambit is that it's +2 wounds gained and +2 initiative gained every time its used. +2 initiative is already gambit-worthy in itself, it's basically 2 free gambits in one. GW gave it a "the enemy still scores 2 wounds of combat resolution even if you heal 2" but GW forgot to give it any initiative penalties for the wounds received. Instead, being slowed by wounds is just current wounds characteristic lower than base wounds.

>>97319236
* sally one moved to SSS tier actually, since it's Master of Legion. At first I'd moved it down because I was considering if sergeants and optae basic characters could use the gambits. But if it's just for Masters of the Legion, then the heal is up there with IH Toughness8.

>>97318985
>>97319052
jesus fucking christ anon would you please cunting learn the difference between stats and probability you absolute cock mongler

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>>97319236
Ferrus' gimmick could easily become "gains +1T" instead of setting it to 8. But yah there's the problem of needing to write half a dozen gambits for the traitor primarchs.
And then there's Dorn's gimmick. He didn't endure what others didn't. That was Mortarion. Dorn was adopted by a king in a palace. He didn't even have cold.
Say, wouldn't Russ' gimmick be at least SS? Even if it happens only once per game, that's almost always going first. And yet you out Magnus' gimmick drastically lower, even though it is a bigger bonus that happens more often and isn't single use nor force you to always use it until you can't.
I don't think I take you seriously
>any random NL character would have better futuresight than Konrad Curze, as they're WIP9 and he's WIP8.
True...but they don't have the stats Curze has

>>97319386
you children that don't understand math never have any actual numbers disproving a single thing because it's literally correct thus impossible for you to make an argument

>>97319386
Everyone cares about average damage, nobody cares about the probability of 3 dice being all consecutive sixes

>>97319417
"gains +1 toughness" instantly negated by Finishing Blow being +1 strength AND +1 Damage per blow.

The entire primarch gambit system wasn't half-assed it's like one-sixteenth-assed. It's not even the beginnings of a system, it contributes absolutely nothing to one.

>>97319417
Are you straight up retarded?
A TS Praetor and a Non-TS Praetor fight. Magnus gambit is +1 initiative, because the TS only has 1 higher willpower than a regular praetor does.
Leman Russ gambit is +5 initiative, 5 times the bonus.
You literally have brain damage if you think the +1 initiative bonus is better than +5 initiative bonus.

>>97319435
>>97319417
Whoops Magnus' isn't Focus + WP, it's Focus + WP - enemy WP. So, +1 most of the time LMAO.
Yeah some gimmicks are basic.
>>97319260
It also says no positive modifiers. I mean you still don't receive the -2i from being wounded, which is like a bonus without it explicitly counting as one. But no Bonus to Focus also means no Outside Support focus, which in Praetorian Command squads can be +2–3
Also no bonuses for Light type, Combat Shield or Duelist Edge...but literally no one is ever taking that kinda of things
>>97319455
I might be, considering it's taking me like 15 straight minutes to write a post going back and forth 3 books in a phone lmao

How could one go about making an Excindio?

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>>97319510

>>97319570
Good suggestion

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>>97319510

>>97319591
Excellent suggestion

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>>97319510

>>97317495
Any cheap listing for them on ebay goes quick, probably because people want the weapons

>>97319733
Wonderous

>>97315480
I don't mind it but I kinda wish they would have given 30k a more unique aesthetic to better differentiate it from 40k. At any rate its too late to change it now.

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>>97319850
"Legion" aesthetic was right there. Legions as different as UM and WE could pull it off

>>97319422
anon there's literally no such thing as non-integer Damage in this game, it's spelled out in the fucking rulebook, grow up

>>97319426
except that's stats and not probability

if you think playing roulette 38 times mean you're guaranteed a win, you're a fucking moron

probabilities do not stack they multiply, if you can't understand that, you don't understand probability or statistics

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>>97320113
Only retards talk about certainties in a dice game. Averages are informative of what a roll will look like. If you roll better, you had a good one, and if you roll lower, you did worse than you expected.
But you have an educated guess, you know what to expect.
And if the average roll says it's a bad idea, then you should try doing something else.
Do I expect 50 heads after flipping a coin a hundred times? Damn right I do. I am aware getting 100 consecutive tails is a possibility...but there's a pretty good chance to get something close to 50 heads. If I need 50 heads, you bet I'll send at least 100 coins to get them

All probability in this game is 50/50. Either it works or it doesn't.

Gib 30k razorbacks

>>97320242
truth nuke

>>97317548
it's a really cool model and was golden daemon bait, has nothing to do with the edition

>>97320272
Define what a Razorback is

>>97320113
here we see a retard with not a single fold on his brain. A concept like 2.5 average damage (equally likely to be 2 wounds suffered or 3 wounds suffered) makes his pea-sized brain explode into the white noise static sound and his retard eyes glaze over, replaying tiktok brainrot memes and 4chan catchphrases in the hollow empty cavity that lies between his ears

>>97320305
An infantry fighting vehicle

>>97320301
Pull the other one, our store had kratoses lining the 30k shelf for years, I was probably the first guy who'd bought one (well, 2) during second. They all got snatched up before 3rd even officially released and the first few weeks after the painting channel was full of everyone painting one alongside their saturnine centurion conversions.

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>>97320341
BEHOLD, a razorback!

>>97320379
infantry fighting vehicles can take more than one occupant, pedantic midwit retard.

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Knights are hit on their rear armor in melee because they're vehicles and don't have a rule that specifies that they are exempt from that rule, right?

>>97320442
Correct.

damon prytanis is my favourite 30k character because his shoots black people (MLK and Vulkan)

>>97320520
Who?

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>>97320341
>Carries infantry into battle and provides direct fire support
>It's often armed with a cannon at least 20 mm caliber, and sometimes an antitank missile
Alright. Rhino with Heavy Bolter and HK missile it is.
Incidentally, did Rhinos have firing ports in 1.0? Did you guys ever use them?

>>97320684
>did Rhinos have firing ports in 1.0? Did you guys ever use them?
they did but the only time I ever saw anyone use them was the tsons waacfags shooting psychic powers out of them

>>97320684
No one ever used them, because no one used rhinos, it was too easy to pop them. Same for every vehicle that didn't have an invuln save or flare shield.

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>>97320743
I'd love to see candy red marines firing spells out of chopped up m16s

>>97320684
>>97320758
People have always used rhinos for cheap mobile terrain and blocking.

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dreadnoughts should be forced to have a melee weapon and a gun, no exceptions
yes, even the deredeo

>>97319417
Curzes future sight being a gambit is fucking retarded why not just keep it a psychic power like in 2.0

>>97321037
it being a psychic power was retarded. It's something that happens to him 100,000+ times, seeing the future shouldn't make him suffer perils of the warp and get stunned or automatically lose wounds. It's also nowhere near as unreliable, he'd have died a thousand times over if there was a 50-50 chance he'll get swung at and his power suddenly not work while Lion, Sanguinius, Guilliman or Vulkan are swinging at him.

>>97320761

Isn't that kind of what the Aetherfire guns are?

>>97320976
Limiting options is dumb. You'd make a great GW employee

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Why are these niggers and all cerastus knight model variants in LI/AT so expensive?

>>97321388
because piggies will pay

>>97321388
Because GW

>>97320976
The castraferrum-mortis has existed for longer than you have.

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jesus fucking christ who approved of this

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Finished up a World Eaters loyalist.

>>97319003
What unit would you run? A melta squad?

>>97319510
Dunewalker's lower half and small knight's top half?

>>97321515
i've seen that guy before...

>>97320426
With handles on the back two dudes on the top chessis and two dudes in th fist you would have as many combat infantry on the contemptor as you would on a T-50.

>>97321580
Melta squad, tyrant siege terminators, saturnine terminators with twin heavy disintegrators, siege tartaros, land speeders... there's plenty of good choices to use for Perturabo's gambit. Pretty much any unit with a high volume of fire will do, hitting on a 5+ isn't much of an issue when you're rolling lots of dice and only have to kill a single character.

>>97321425
What's the problem exactly?

>>97321805
130pts for the best points/damage ratio of tank killing ?

>>97321821
Wouldn't say they best, it's still BS 3 after all. It needs to remain stationary and hit with both shots to kill even a single Rhino.

>>97321854
it's very cheap and quite tough at front av14

>>97321866
Yeah it isn't bad, but for the same points you can get a rapier section that will actually have enough shots to kill a tank in one turn. Even though they'll most likely die shortly afterwards, lol.

Indomitus are overall much worse than Tartaros/Cata, right? I don't see any redeeming features, even though I have over 30 models in nuscale and wanted to convert some.
Indomitus Red Butchers, yay or nay? Old resin is too small now.

>>97322245
Indomitus are discount cataphractii. 5+ Invulnerable save but each model is 4 points cheaper. They're arguably better, no need for a 4+ invulnerable when your job is to bully scoring units off an objective with Vanguard 3.

Red butchers wear cataphractii terminator armour. Pr*maris indomitus isn't HH appropriate anyway.

>>97322319
Printing it is then. I'll be damned if I use lanklets or midgets.

>>97322319
>Pr*maris indomitus
That's not a thing.

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>>97322335
Whatever you say, Chief.

Is there still a Black library mega floating around?

The gimp is at it again

>>97322245
Just buy tortugabay terminators

>>97322437
Why? I have a printer right here.

>>97321515
paint the trim too on his leg and torso and the studs on the pad pls looks half finished

>>97322438
Well don't do indomitus because it's illegal loadout since they come with catapractii

>>97322450
I was gonna do Indomitus bodies and Cata arms scaled to them. Oh well, I guess I'll pront the bodies too.

>>97320976
>new dreadnought comes out
>zero melee option
>half the guns are brand new, all of them are weird/esoteric
Why?

are lernaens any decent for being a retinue for a praetor?

I feel like some other unit would be better as AL can steal them, and vanguard 3 or something would be a bit better than line 1 for the retinue role

>>97322508
We 40k now.

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>>97322460
>Indomitus bodies and Cata arms
How about Cataphractii bodies with Indo arms?

>>97322521
>finally get plastic HH
>at what price

Hey lads i have some old resin mkII assault marines, was wondering how they look next to the new ones if anyone has both

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>>97322539

>>97322514
Line 1 is what makes them better than most units as a bodyguard. Your opponent can't just react off the objective to deny them the points. Which means they are less likely to use their reaction to avoid combat with them.

>>97322382
Nope. All the megas got repeatedly nuked on sight, some corporate dicksuckers kept reporting them.

>>97322508
The leviathan already existed, which is better suited for melee anyway.

Lore about saturnine tech is that it incorporates bigger reactors with higher energy output, which allows the use of more rare and exotic (and more devastating) weaponry. Also it isn't Martian origin tech, just like disintergrator weapons.

>order some proonts
>order takes two weeks
>just arrives
>several pieces missing, but dupes of other things
Eurgh.

What does /hhg/ think of the Liber Panoptica?

>>97322319
>Indomitus are discount cataphractii
Mega ass boo at this reasoning, even if the rules do make it true. It's the same kind of reasoning that gave us Third Line.
I just wish each had a role: if Cataphractii is the heavy termie suit Saturnine is the "no, YOU move" suit and Tartaros the nimble one, Indomitus could be the normal suit.
Instead, it is the crappy but cheap suit. I'm just saying, it could've been M7" instead of M6"? Still heavy so it can't pursuit.

>>97322508
>>new dreadnought comes out
>>zero melee option
Just give them time. They won't be able to resist

>>97323110
>Cataphractii is the heavy termie suit and Tartaros the nimble one, Indomitus could be the normal suit.
That's what we had in 1.0 and Indomitus was the worst, because it didn't offer the durability of Cata nor the ability to Sweep of Tartar. I say make them all the same, like power armour.

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which legion would have a fuckton of nullifiers and destroyers for the sole purpose of, obviously, destroying daemons? note that I don't care about the lack of rules for nulls as all I wish to do is fantasize n shit. and I just reminded myself of 40k exorcists. cool guys.

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>>97322514
Yes they are, because they fill the hard target niche: for doing what a Deathball usually does, it's probably Companions or Justaerin (idk about Firedrakes or Huscarls when those exist). Morlocks also get it done, swapping barely any power for more versatility. Command Termies also compete because they have Legion Standards and most others don't. Lerneans don't have that.
What Lerneans have that others don't is Hatred against T6+ targets like Saturnines and Dreadnoughts. People also seem to swear by their conversion beamer, for whatever its single S8 D2 shot will do vs tanks, or its AP3 will do vs termies. But it hits big targets hard that other termies wouldn't hit as hard without losing 1A to a chainfist.
>>97322558
>Your opponent can't just react off the objective to deny them the points
Your opponent simply doesn't need to react off the objective. Congrats, anon: your 350 pts unit will finally get to meet that 100 pts Troop in combat! :D
And, if that objective is VP1, they'll score 4 VP across two turns! Unlike a Vanguard 3, which would score 4VP that same turn, provided the for doesn't react as he should, ofc.
Luckily every squad Repositions, every tank pops Smoke, every HSS Returns Fire and Intercepts. We went from 4 guaranteed reactions down to conditional 3-4, yet reactions are apparently more present than ever lmao

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>>97323221
>which legion would
I think that's going to be a warband-chapter level thing, anon. And yet, I'd think units most versed in the ethereal (TS, BA, WS, WB), or with well-developed Destroyer corps (DA, DG, UM), or with vast reserves of terminator armour (IW, DG, ???) would stand a better chance of coming up with Nullifier squads.
And yet look at the crew of the Ebon Drake, so versed in technosorcery and brimming with Purificator Adherents or whatever those special Salamander vets are called. So, it's whoever you want them to be, anon.
It always is.

>>97323305
sallies already had a cult thing going on, it was just a matter of time

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>>97323169
>Indomitus didn't offer the durability of Cata nor the ability to Sweep of Tartar
Oh, it could sweep, anon. The restriction against sweeping was on Cataphractii armour itself, not on the heavy type.
We just didn't tell you, as a prank. Like Juneteenth all over again.
But, now Indomitus can't sweep indeed. So, congrats? We all now got the awful thing you thought you had?

>>97323366
>doesn't read the post he's replying to
>accuses poster of not reading
Ironic.jpg

>>97323408
Huh 1.0. You're right, I tend to miss irrelevant info. Gimme M7 Heavy Indomitus at the regular price: 150 pts with power weapons, not power fists x.x

i've seen the new cata from up close, it's such a flat downgrade, i'm surprised they failed that bad

>>97323478
You’re surprised that a new GW kit is a direct downgrade to the old one? That happens at least like 33% of the time now. Thought everyone was used to it by now.

>>97323484
it usually has its ups and down but this is straight up evil; the 3 sprues don't have a single sharp edge

>>97323492
also, a very visible lack of details of any sort, the entire miniature feels like they gave the job to the local unpaid intern

>>97323492
:^)

>>97323264
yeah I suppose that makes sense

line 1 is less likely to make someone move off the obj (in fact more likely to jump on it) and thus allow them to be in the place they want to be, which is melee

wheras with a vanguard unit your opponent would move off the obj, they score nothing and get shot to shit because they're now in the open and not in melee

>>97323478
All the new plastic marine infantry have been objective downgrades.
GW is trying to kill real marines out of spite, because people didn't embrace pr*marines as much as GW wanted them to.

>>97324012
I think it's more in response to recasters and 3d printers. Make it so it's harder to use 3rd party stuff so you have to use GW stuff.

But they keep making everything feel worse while trying to improve it. Which makes the initial problem worse, so they double down to try and fix it.

Who knows what they are thinking at this point. Probably something along the lines of them not making enough money.

>>97324071
recast will have a field day with this kit, almost all of the parts are in triplicate at least

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started working on this already, probably shouldve asked for opinions before

>2965 pts

>Imperial Fists

Primary Detatchment

High Command
>Praetor in Tartaros, Thunderhammer, Vigil Storm Shield

Command
>Centurion, Power Sword, Vigil Storm Shield, Melta Bombs, Paragon of Battle

Transport
> 2x Rhinos, Dozer Blade, Combi-Bolter, one with heavy flamer, one with havoc launcher

Aux Detatchment: Armored Fist
>2x Landraider Carrier, heavy flamer

Apex Detatchment: Army Vanguard
>Veteran Breacher Squad,10 man, Vexilla, Nuncio, 7x Power axe, 2x Melta, 1x Solarite (prime: logistical benefit)
>Veteran Breacher Squad,10 man, Vexilla, Nuncio, 7x Power axe, 2x Lascutter, 1x Solarite

Logistical Benefit
>Tartaros Command Squad, 5 man, 4x Vigil Storm Shield, 4x power fist, Legion Standard, 1x Solarite

Aux Detatchment: Siege Gauntlet
>Breacher Siege Squad, 10 man, Nuncio, Vexilla, 2x Graviton gun, 1x Melta bombs, 1x Chainsword (prime: logistical benefit)
>Breacher Siege Squad, 10 man, Nuncio, Vexilla, 2x Graviton gun, 1x Melta bombs, 1x Chainaxe
>3x Rapier Laser Destroyer Battery
>Cataphractii Squad, 5 man, 4x Dual Lightning Claws, Chainfist, Heavy flamer, Grenade Harness

Logistical benefit: War Engine
>Contemptor Dreadnought, Kheres assault cannon, Gravis powerfist, Heavy flamer

Thoughts? Tried to go for a fluffier list than something thats good. The Veteran Breachers are supposed to be an analogue for Warders.

>>97324012
Correct.
>>97324071
3d printers and third party gets more customers because of shitty GW design, it bites them in the ass.

playing a 3k game using militia as my primary in 1.5 hours, wish me luck

>>97323221
Daemons are witch fuckery so Death Guard.

>>97324726
traitor or loyalist?

>>97324726
>militia as my primar
Based. Moral victory by default.

Does the NL advanced reaction happen before or after volley fire?

>>97324231
Scoring doko? But it does look very soulful, a very aggressive "tanky" force thats all about driving up into the face of the enemy and sticking your dick on the table.

>>97324726
Good luck with the killing!

>>97325051
i guess my plan for obj control was to park the basic breachers on an obj and let them get comfortable while everyone else goes and has fun.

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Working on another krytos warlord. Gonna do some weird shit to this one.

Also it's 3D printed.

>>97325546
>Gonna do some weird shit to this one.
Kinky.

I just realised the version of the calendar used by the Imperium must have a year zero, 000.M1, as that is the only way the year Horus became Warmaster can be accurately rendered as 000.M31 like it is in every rulebook I've read.

>>97321821
>>97321425
those arent even slightly impressive stats.
Rapier laser BS4 FP2 S10 AP2 Dmg2 HeavyD Armourbane 65 points
Tardlaser BS3 same exact damage stats but Overload 1-in-6 chance it just blows itself up. And because BS3 if anyone ever slaps it with suppress it's trash that hits on 6+ not 5+ and it loses all use instantly. Costs exact 130 points like two rapiers that inflict 2.7x more damage and zero self-damage.

It's not hard to kill, 13 side 10 rear and 6 HP breakpoint so 1 single lucky melta hit one-shots it.

If it has to move, it's putting out an average around 1 wound per turn onto av14 and never inflicts statuses. If it gets shot in the side it goes down instantly unlike an actual good tank like kratos which does 10x more effective damage while being 10x tankier and BS4.

Tankiness in 3rd is about being 14/14/14 so you're immune to flankers and deepstrikers and melee units entirely, and big enough HP pool it's not worth even attempting to focus fire your unit down or try to get lucky (non-armorbane weapons won't scratch kratos at all, and armorbane weapons do literally nothing to reduce kratos effectiveness if they only knock half his HP down while being unable to inflict statuses, only to have a techpriest walk up to kratos and heal it back up), and being such a powerful shooter that it's worth burning 1 reaction each turn to Smokescreen (not a BS3 piece of shit with 2 total ineffective dmg2 shots)

And offensively it's a complete joke, it doesn't scratch big tanks, it can't status them, it can't hurt troops, it can't hurt terminators. It's a one-trick pony that does that trick very poorly. It'd already be just 'okay' if it was 130 points with overload1 bs4 or bs3 with no overload. Having both 1/3rd the shooting of laser rapiers while also teamkilling itself constantly makes it a joke.

>>97325929
It's so funny to see melta either is a useless toy gun or one-tapping tanks depending on what you're trying to argue about.

>>97325929
another thing having one powerful tank can do unlike the shitty BS3 tank destroyers, slap on a Return Fire decurion. Now every single time the destroyer attempts to inflict its 1 wound on kratos, kratos spends 1 reaction and instantly turns it into a crater.

>>97326007
against 14/14/14 with smokescreen and 10+ wounds and a techpriest, melta is a useless toy gun with like 1% chance of a kill.

If some retard like you brings a 13/10 armor tank with 6 wounds, not worthy of smokescreen reactions and no techpriests, then the tank is so shitty that melta actually gets kills.

It's not a double standard, they're two entirely different statlines, yah fucking 50 IQ potato.

>>97326050
>10+ wounds
What a surprise, you're just another tourist.

I hate how Saturnine are a move toward the 40k trend of units having entirely unique weapons no one else uses and they themselves can't use the weapons the rest of the army uses.

Saturnine should be able to take any two weapons from the Heavy Weapons list

>>97326064
filtered by auto retard detection

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>>97326007
>S8 Melta
Zzz
>S9 Melta
O.O

>>97326114
both are bad statistically unless someone brings really crap vehicles. Multimelta was substantially nerfed losing the reroll for having 2 barrels and losing the 2d6 penetration at same time.
It only got buffed against idiots who actually think a 6w 10 rear tank is "tanky", because against those it's sort of a buff not having to roll on a chart to make the vehicle blow up.

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>>97326065
I thought it was going to be combi-bolter + blade, and then you could swap out for an assault cannon or other heavy weapon, plus a carapace gun. Guess not.
But those comically large hammers are retarded (and those axes are insulting)

>>97326158
>6w

Which legion was the most xenophobic?
I don't mean which one killed the most aliens but which one actually hated nonhumans the most, like how the Death Guard was famous for hating witches.

>>97326369
Word Bearers I think. Stuff about the purity of the human form and all that. It's a hard call though, it would be easier to list the legions which are more accepting of xenos.

>>97326369
Salamanders.

>>97326065
yeah I also hate the aspect of unique weapons because one thing I loved about HH1, and HH2, was how practical the weapons options were for everyone. however I'm still mixed on unique characters having unique weapons because originally 90% of the time it was just "master crafted". but I'm nogames and I doubt that unique characters having buffed (melee) weapons ever presented a problem.
>>97326172
out of all design bullshit choices for saturnine I find the lack of carapace weapon just sad. since GW wanted so bad to nostalgiabait with old goofy designs it's just baffling how GW decided to remove the carapace weapon. and yeah, melee weapons are just anime/WOW tier bullshit.

>>97326861
Scoria's melee weapon definitely was a huge problem in 1.0

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>>97326411
>it would be easier to list the legions which are more accepting of xenos.
do tell

>>97326861
Saturnine terminators never had carapace weapons, you fucking tourist. It always was power fist and a big bolter weapon.

>>97326896
>muh metal
art is cooler, therefore canon

>>97326878
>Alpha Legion actively work(ed) together with xenos and utilise a lot of xenos tech
>Thousand Sons tolerated some xenos to acquire knowledge from them
>Sanguinius had a pleasant chat with The Silent King that one time

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>>97326899
There's only instance of terminators with carapace weapons in artwork, and it is a recent piece of artwork from a HH short story. Not even officially confirmed to be saturnine terminators. It would be the opposite of nostalgia bait

>>97325847
Untrue, 000.M31 is just the year 31,000n which is possible in our calendar which doesn't have a year 0

>>97326967
Yes, exactly. 000.M31 would be 31,000, the last year of the 31st Millennium, but GW treats it as the year 30,000. 001.M31 is what follows 000.M31 rather than 001.M32.

>>97326986
I did make a mistake in my original reply. M31 (31st millennia) is the year 30,000-30,999 for the same reason we're in the 21st century despite it being 2026. The first millennia didn't have that number in front despite being the first millennia, same with century. SO 000.M31 would be 30,000. Did I make any sense at all or do I sound crazy?

>>97327006 (me)
I think I confused myself...

>>97327006
2,000 was the last year of the Second Millennium according to the calendar was use in real life, similarly the year 1900 was actually the last year of the 19th century despite it often not being considered as such.

>>97327024
Yeah I realized my error after sending the post, hmph... GW must've forgotten how our calendar works for their fake one

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>>97326928
>There's only instance of terminators with carapace weapons in artwork
fair enough, I forgot about that pic, and a few other. but I still hate the lack of carapace weapon that even indomitus have in form of cyclone launcher.
>and it is a recent piece of artwork from a HH short story
I could swear that I saw it in visions which is 20 years old, but the harder I search the more I realize that my life is a lie.

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>>97325546
What are you gonna do?

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How is the augur command and control squad? Seems like a fun, fluffy little pseudo-support squad that isn't terrible for the points.