>>97566247
Well this is awkward...

>>97566247
Spirit mentor because ghosts are cool

>Two threads
Rest in peace. Nice art though

>>97566923
I blame the dedicated bakeslave

>>97566944
I thought baking was supposed to be a collaborative effort? Though yes

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>>97566247
*sprays you with holy water laced with Wyrm silver and hot pepper flakes*
What other weapons should a beautiful and innocent Toreador carry on her curvy body to protect her from fellow Kindred, chud Garou, incel Mages, and rapist hunters?

>>97567026
The Toreador's role is to be a sex slave, there is no cure
>t. Changeling with Naming 5

asking again
isn't there really any source book for the camarilla for 2e? not the revised one

>>97567035
I don't have it but good luck searching

>>97567078
does one exist in the first place?

>>97567173
To the best of my knowledge, there's a scan on TTRPG drive through as part of a collection.
That and the share thread might have it, they have a separate folder from the one in the OP but I never looked for that version of the Cam book, so no idea if it is the version you are looking for.

>>97566944
I didn't bake this time though and now we see what happens

>>97567194
can you link to the version of TTRPG drive? at least if i know the cover/name of the book i know what i'm looking for instead of getting confused with the revised one constantly.

>>97566923
It's fine. This one has more posts so when we hit autosage, just migrate to the other one, provided it isn't deleted by jannies in the meantime.

God, I love it when Garou die. It's what they deserve for the horrible things they did to our ancestors. I want it to be bloody. I want it to be painful. I want them to be crying. It's what they deserve.

Post dead G*rou.

>>97567035
there is none this has a list of all the vtm books printed by white wolf
>https://whitewolf.fandom.com/wiki/Vampire:_The_Masquerade_books
only the sabbat got several books while the camarilla and the anarchs only got one guide (before v5)

>>97567356
oh well before v20 for some reasons the anarchs got a book in that. always forget about that one due to it being a whole lot of nothing before looking it up

What changes could have been made to nWoD, to make it half as popular as oWoD and prevent it from being axed in favour of a shit revival of oWoD?

>>97567356
bummer if true. the revised book assumes the gangrel already left the camarilla and that makes for an awkward reading especially if you like the clan. the tone also seems to be a bit off.

>>97567377
i don't think anything could have saved nwod/cofd or whatever you want to call it from paradox

paradox bought the ip for bloodlines and gave it to cocked up swedish larpers who wanted everyone to play (even at home) just like how they been playing vtm (even if it's not vtm) at their larp for 20 years sense be damned

so a time machine and a gun to kill the 3 og paradox white wolf hires is probably the only solution

>>97567332
>t. self-hating BSD

Would Protag of Bloodlines be allowed to be Prince? If he were to send proof of LaCroix's corruption and obsession with the sarcophagus to Justificars with Strauss vouching for him?
He's very capable, killed a high ranking hunter with very high true faith something like 7, survived an encounter with a Metis and killed a powerful Kuei-Jin, Ming is their equivalent of 7th generation right? IIRC the form she uses requires 6 dots. Also drove the Sabbat away from the city. He's technically 8th generation which isn't too high for prince with possibly very good persuasion skills
Yeah he's very young like a few months old but would he be allowed to be a Prince in this situation?

>>97567443
Only if one of the aristocratic clans I feel, otherwise it'd go to one of the other Ventrue

>>97567377
nothing because the same people who ruined owod like justin achilli also created nwod. it was doomed from the start.

>>97567407
BSDs are Garou too. They also deserve to die screaming.

>>97567404
So the sole advantage that oWoD has over nWoD is the existence of a cult classic video game? In which case, nWoD's only real mistake is to not have an atmospheric RPG based in VtR or something?

>>97567443
depends on if he has enough camarilla support being prince is after pretty much a popularity contest that you also have to surrive. which i guess depends on if there are enough camarilla even left in the city given that he has probably killed most of the sect in the city and has no contacts like strauss' unseen lord who is implied to ship in more camarilla afterwards to support him and strauss wants to be prince himself which also seems to be what his boss wants so they are unlikely to offer the same amount of help to another prince

becoming baron using a cult of personality based on personal accomplishments is more likely and also something that in anarch free states would get more immediate support

>>97567443
The shit you get up to in a typical bloodlines playthrough would result in the Camarilla being very concerned about you and they would probably assume you to be an Elder or Methuselah who pretended to be a fledgling for shits and giggles. While it's true some people are just more talented/put in more work/have better generation/all of the above than others, that level of a power increase just doesn't happen. Depending on how the PC plays it, the Camarilla might do anything between Red List them, make up a fake elder persona for them to rule the city with, or hire them on as an Archon.

>>97567470
Iterator-san... your animal torture pornography is not healthy for you

Guys don't take the edition war bait, please.

>>97567485
>bloodlines sequel where you're an archon or a justicar
That could be kino, but the canon ending is you being a free man iirc

>>97567377
There's still no proof of this supposed failure of nWod, aside from anecdotes from GenXers crying about how the 2000s wasn't like the good old days. That list some guy posted a few threads ago showed the opposite, "World of Darkness" was in second place well into 2006, then had a resurgence when Changeling came out, and only disappeared when White Wolf stopped doing physical books.

>>97567475
from the pov of paradox who are a video game company: yes 100% the entirety of their wod output only existed to promote vtmb2 in other words it's a afterthought through and through

there are more paradox employees working on the crusader king 3's wod mod than on v5 and the majority of them hate and ignore v5

>>97567500
If it was considered a valid money-maker, Paradox wouldn't have sidelined it in favour of a revival of oWoD. So why didn't Paradox consider it a valid money-maker and make a VtR version of Bloodlines?

>>97567499
Independent is the correct choice for a canon ending. Doesn't piss off anyone, doesn't restrict tables or writers on who they'd give LA to after the dust settles.

A game where you play as an Archon would be a fun way to do a high-power game without breaking from RPG conventions (going on various quests for people). Hell, there was an entire book, Archons and Templars, that was all about playing as them (and their Sabbat counterparts), because it's the easiest way to play high power level VTM without getting bogged down by constant politics and working through a dozen minions.

>>97567500
Wasn't CofD coming out when trpgs were falling out of favor in the market? It was just bad luck (on top of failed cross media projects)

>>97567489
Torture is a waste of time unless done for the purpose of extracting information. The Computer does not tolerate wasting time on e*motions. Progenitors on the other hand...

CofDfags sure are thin-skinned...

>>97567512
>all your employees hate V5
>somehow, shill more V5 instead of listening
Paradox moment

>>97567521
I think Paradox WoD is run by "true believers" in what they're doing. Like when they took over they released some documentary about bringing back true WoD, even though 20th Anniversary was already out at that point. And they tried to sabotage Vigil 2e even after it got a bump from Hololive, and even then it did better than HtR5. If they were only about money, they would have ran with it.

>>97567551
So the leadership of Paradox was so blinded by nostalgia and devotion to oWoD that they failed to realise the inherent and obvious superiority of nWoD and ruined the legacy of White Wolf forever by trying to revive oWoD instead of letting it die and devoting hundreds of millions of dollars to nWoD instead?

>>97567551
none of the creators of wod are implicated in paradox fiasco.

>>97567551
wod as of our last information, which to be fair was before the founding of the new new white wolf but that has done nothing so far, was still run by karim muammar who is one of the 3 og larpers who made V5 so yeah "true believers" is putting it lightly as this guy is the worst "play the game right" fag ever

>>97567224
The alt archive should be onthe share thread mega details should be on the OP there. Good luck.

This guy is just replying to himself in order to create some sort of argument. Fuck off schizophrenic larper.

>>97567570
They could have just continued the 20th Anniversary/Chronicles of Darkness formula while releasing video games on top of it, instead of trying to come up with some new vision.

>>97567550
that's because the video game people and the wod people are nearly completely disconnected from what the og w5 team told us the "brand editor" karim muammar is pretty much the sole paradox employee who interacts with the writing teams and he seems to be allowed to do as he pleases

because again we been (let's see what happens now that vtmb2 flopped hard) a afterthought for paradox

>>97567489
I'm glad you recognize those things are animals. No idea wtf an iterator is.

It's just what those disgusting creatures deserve for uncountable generations of murdering, torturing, raping, and eating innocent people.

>>97567605
No you see, we need to call it 5th edition and appeal to socially conscious tiefling players, that's what worked for WotC so it'll work for us, right?

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is this guy allowed to join the camarilla now?

>>97567605
Do you not think that the significant success of the 20th Anniversary edition, which can visibly be seen on DTRPG, is an indicator that WW/OPP should have gone further with oWoD even if it wasn't acquired by Paradox?

>>97567443
LaCroix himself was crazy young to be a prince so if whatever bizarre political situation that lets a mere ancilla be Prince of LA is still happening then yeah maybe a freakishly overpowered fledgling can have his day too.

I ask question.
Reply to myself.
Rinse and repeat the bait.

>>97567679
onyx path was making a 4th edition of vtm and was already allegedly pretty far into production when they been told that no paradox is going to make their own v5 (onyx path wasn't counting v20 as v4 but paradox is) and that their previous deal fell into the water
>https://theonyxpath.com/vampire-the-masquerade-4th-edition-announced-at-gen-con/

>>97567679
DTRPG top list is not an all-time bestseller list, when Curseborne came out, it was number 1 for a while.

>>97567697
to be fair their malkavian primogen was implied to be the only local in the court so i assume the rest of the primogen been in similair situations to lacroix where there weren't really asked if they wanted to go into hostile territory and support the man

>>97567723
So you are of the belief that nWoD 2e was and is more successful than oWoD 20th Anniversary?

>Asks question
>Reply to himself
The schizo running amok!

The funny part is both WoD fans and the relevant Paradox people both tell themselves the same lies that WoD is this big money maker. It never really has been, and them sidelining CofD without a single real comment isn't surprising either. The same company that botched trying to make money off an ip via video games would did at least have a potential to make some money and you're shocked when they end a twenty year old ip that would have easily carried on as a steady license stream just like OWoD was in non video game form? We're only about two years away from a solid decade of Paradox ineptitude and lost revenue reports so I guess the people who desperately need to believe OWoD is a real money maker that must stand on its own to succeed need more time to catch on.

And now is having a melty. Great.

>>97567735
I'm just saying we don't know the all-time numbers. But I do know that in the 2010s, there was a time when CofD was discussed a lot online, so it was obviously not unknown.
Personally, I think the current high sales numbers are due to Alfabusa and the Crusader Kings mod. In the 2010s and early 20s, I know CofD had stuff like Occultists Anonymous, which is probably why Awakening is the highest among the CofD games.

Now watch him ask another question and reply to himself again.

>>97567798
>there was a time when CofD was discussed a lot online
Outside of /tg/? This board isn't a microcosm of the larger tabletop community, it has its own very particular tastes.

>>97567783
Let's not pretend that nWoD was ever particularly successful or making bank either, just like the 20th Anniversary books, the vast majority of 2e books had to be crowdfunded.

>>97567831
NTA but I remember quite a few VtR RP communities online in the mid-late '00s, before the release of 20th Ani. Pretty much nothing about any of the other nWoD splats at all tho.

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I love how GURPS Mage plays loosely with the lore. Dante here is forced to do computer recovery duty lol.

>>97567870
>NTA but I remember quite a few VtR RP communities online in the mid-late '00s, before the release of 20th Ani. Pretty much nothing about any of the other nWoD splats at all tho.
Really? My recollection is basically zero interest in any of the core three nWoD splats, followed by a massive surge of interest in Changeling and Hunter that then led to the core three picking up steam as well.

>>97567475
>the sole advantage that oWoD has over nWoD is the existence of a cult classic video game?
No, it has the edge of being a very old and influential game that had facades to build ups it's influence.

>>97567831
I don't really much about other communities, but I think the fact that Beast became a huge controversy everywhere shows that people paid attention to it.
And I sometimes check actual plays on rpg.net, and I do remember seeing a bunch for Awakening.

>>97567902
Back then my experience was almost entirely focused around the MU*/IRC play side of things, so it might have been different in forum land, but yeah I remember nWoD groups being mostly VtM players that made the jump to Requiem but then never used anything else from the setting.

>>97567934
An entire RPG being written as obvious abuse apologia, whose lead writer is swiftly revealed to be a pedophile, was saucy enough that even people uninterested in nWoD were intrigued by the controversy.

I remember someone building out sorcery in exwod to its fullest extent, not just the remnants. Does anyone have that series of posts anywhere?

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How many ghouls and normalfag servants does the Camirilla have in the American military?

>>97567731
I thought Grouse was from England? Wasn't he called Lord Alistair Grouse?

>>97568010
None, the Second Inquisition purged them all.

>>97568010
Well, the Camarilla isn't really centralized like that. If we're counting individual Camarilla vampires though, probably a few hundred at most, and 10% or less would actually be ghouls (and the pure kine wouldn't know they work for a vampire). Because, especially the higher up the totem pole you are, the easier it actually becomes to notice that a motherfucker is not aging. Mortals can be compromised with the right bribe or blackmail, and that's before going into disciplines. IMO, Ghouls aren't a good choice for infiltration and the books sometimes over-state their effectiveness.

Now the number, both for mortal pawns and ghouls, would probably increase by an order of magnitude if you included military contractors, weapons suppliers, and intelligence agencies. Intelligence agencies should by all rights be crawling with mortal pawns and a few ghouls.

So this is his plan: shitting the thread with shitty edition wars and then starting to push for his shit. Predictable.

>>97568042
we don't know where grout is from but he been in america for roughly 80 years: they closed his insane asylum because he wouldn't adapt to practices that weren't from the 19th century, he was a contemporary to freud and he was embraced by one of his patients 50 years before one of his recordings

so he is the most "local" vampire you meet in vtmb beside possibly nines who was embraced 55 years ago in the area (we don't know how old the recording is)

>>97568063
Not likely. There's no magical way for the SI to actually purge out humans who are in service unless they suspect everyone and that tends to turn against any group that does that.

>>97568122
Have you read their book? Are you aware of half of the insane shit that the SI is capable of?

>>97568102
>>97568042
Grout isn't called "lord" anywhere, he is wealthy, but he also comes from a time when academics came almost exclusively from the upper class because they had the money to dedicate their lives to a potentially unprofitable thing.

Based on his recordings, he viewed Freud as the "new kid on the block", meaning he was probably embraced in the mid to late 1800s. With that timeframe, it's quite likely he could've been an old seed L.A. native, since it'd be after the gold rush. Nothing in his recordings indicates that he ever moved, only that the mansion was "constructed with defense in mind", meaning it was almost certainly after his embrace. But it could've been six months or 60 years, given that he was effectively Caitiff with no knowledge of Kindred society.

Which is actually the most impressive thing about Grout. He went an entire century (at least) before encountering another vampire besides his ill-fated sire. That + the mansion would make me wager he was an extreme homebody, only leaving to acquire new test subjects. Very fascinating character, so many questions left unanswered about him.

>>97568167
for being a malkavian caitiff he also had a impressive understanding of his nature. he figured out ghouls himself. what vitae could do at base and some of his ghouls i vaguely remember had the protean claw animation moveset

>>97568198
I'd wager he studied himself constantly for decades. He might've discovered ghouling after just feeding a subject his blood to see what'd happen.

Very fun character, I'm a big "Grout isn't dead" truther.

>>97568236
because his corpse being all wrong was it right?

i am not gonna set a game in LA ever but i think it would also be cooler if he surrived

>>97568198
>>97568236
Grout was also giga-IQ and until his wife's illness he didn't actually suffer from Malkavian schizokino diseases

>>97568258
The perfectly clean, laid out skeleton is a point in its favor, yes. Though VtMB is technically pretty unloreful in how it depicts vampires getting Final Death'd in general. but Bloodlines' Final Death animation is way cooler than the lore.

There's a lot of little clues. The big one that stood out to me even on a first playthrough was how bad Ming-Xiao's impersonation of Nines was. Not only does she say wildly out of character things like "pardon me", but she seems to be genuinely out of it for the first couple of lines of dialogue, not like she's fucking up the performance intentionally. The PC even notices Nines wasn't acting right (dialogue option to point it out in your report), but LaCroix (obviously) brushes it off. In addition, if Ming actually killed Grout, why are there no signs of her passing? You have to go through the entire trap and ghoul gauntlet, not a single one disabled, and only a handful of ghouls are already dead, framed as if they were killed by other ghouls in a maddened rage. Lastly, Grout's gift of foresight is concerningly good. He had a painting of himself made with the Griffith Park Werewolves and the fire that set them off. Even if he couldn't interpret that one too accurately, he sees the assassination attempt coming. Rather than flee, or do more to prevent it, he leaves for you perfectly arrayed records detailing his unlife and making it very obvious he suspects LaCroix is going to kill him, without making it too obvious. I think the one thing he didn't see coming was the Leopoldites coming to burn his house down.

So, my theory is essentially that he fried Ming Xiao's brain when she came to kill him, faked his own death, and left breadcrumbs to turn whoever came to report his death against LaCroix. I'd also guess he's the one sending you the chess-themed emails.

>>97568472
yeah this is cool enough to be true and gives some vampire shenanigans that are kinda lacking in the game otherwise

headcanon adopted

>>97568472
>>97568489
Bloodlines' Final Death was based off of Blade right? Anyway, I also love this headcanon. My first playthrough though I assumed that Grout just starved himself to death as he couldn't cope with losing his free senses. I'm not sure if we've ever had a documented intellectual like Grout losing himself and being aware of it, but I wouldn't be surprised if this made him moderately suicidal.

>>97568527
Vtm has that vampires burning to dust thing going but only for elders (hench the slang "you are ash" for you are dead)and the blade movies are heavily inspired by vtm, but the animation is a 1 to 1 to the movie

so it's probably a circle of inspiration thing

>>97568551
>human story telling is iterative
Says the man who's iterating on the iteration of the iteration (based loosely off of a Mesopotamian fable)

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how far do you need to go with your crimes against nature for the progenitors to kick you out and send a group of players after you?

asking for a npc antagonist

>>97568608
Any generic viral outbreak film or video game plot.

>>97568608
>>97568629
Am I hearing Albert Wesker from Resident Evil?

>>97568667
most progenitor villains pretty much end up as being resident evil characters just like most iteration x villains end up being metal gear characters

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Going to repost my question from yesterday because I got no good answer. My diablerist I_am_a_Shark has finally maxed willpower. Last game I just diablerized my second brujah but only got a single dot of dominate out of it. So now I want to diablerize even more.

My question is, now that I have maxed willpower, what should I spend my exp on? I just joined a sabbat pack led by Rasputin and that mad lad has koldunism maxed out in many paths, as well as some Thaumaturgy. Before today I wouldn’t consider blood sorcery for my savage shark, but it’s also the only disciplines that can’t be stolen/gained for free with diablerie. I’m also open to buy merits or other stuff. I can share the character sheet if you guys want.

>>97569098
You could always have an idealistic progenitor, hoping to advance manking in spite of Control's desires or the timetable. Hijacking union resources, corrupting other personel an stuff like that.

>>97569098
>iterator X metal gear character
Am I hearing a guy pretending to be a guy pretending to be another guy because he implanted the 2nd's guy's arm while also doing triple agent shenanigans but not actually for real because he's always been loyal to the same man that he was going against as a triple agent?

>>97569258
only way to confuse computer enough to free your fellow iterators from it and all of humanity from the false timetables it made your convention do

>>97569258
Average friday for your NWO greysuit

Hey remember that time when White Wolf decided to create a Primaris Mummy Template that was better than the old one with even fewer drawbacks? And then deploy it via metaplot? No? That's not surprising, nobody actually played Mummy.

>>97569743
>tons of mummy templates
>not a single mommy template

>>97569743
Mummy is kind of niche ngl

>>97567570
>>97567605
That's because Paradox' purchase of White Wolf was part of a bigger push to expand the company's portfolio beyond thegrand strategy games that are their main moneymakers. They were dipping their toes into a lot of different genres of games up until roughly 2023, but it failed so badly, it caused a major change in leadership that abandoned the whole project. Even the attempts they should have had a decent chance at succeeding fell through (like how Millennia's open beta caused 2K to rush Civ7 to not lose the 4X market but the former turned out to be just as big of a disappointment as the later and got abandoned early)

Bloodlines 2 was supposed to be their big entrance into RPGs, and if I had to guess, they wanted to keep it as much as in house as possible to show everyone they can do more than map painters. Hence why they hired Hardsuit Labs at first, because they're a small studio that could be brought into the larger Paradox Int. brand and keep the game's development "technically" in house. The way that ties into how WoD5 came out in general is that, rather than lean into OPP (an already established company in the TTRPG market) and all the old White Wolf writers in there, they brought in whichever high profile oWoD fans they could find in Sweden and gave them the mission to come up with a new edition that would mark it as their own product rather than merely piggybacking on old lore. Which is how Karim Muamar and the LARPers came into power for the direction of all WoD 5th edition books. And, after the Checheya incident, Paradox went overkill with old White Wolf to stop any further excessive bursts of edginess and outsourced the rest of the books going forward (especially the W5 ones) to Renegade Studios in an attempt to replicate their deal with HSL and BL2. And we all know how well that went

Tbh, I think the only reason why PDX hasn't just sold the IP is because nobody else wants to pay enough for it

>>97569997
>they brought in whichever high profile oWoD fans they could find in Sweden
kek

>>97569997
>pay enough
>after Paradox single-handedly cratered the IP
They should count themselves lucky there isn't actually any alternative for fans to latch onto like Pathfinder for DND

>>97567377
To me, it seemed to do as well as it could have. Maybe some of the art direction could have been better or the rules could have been organized more efficiently, but that's about it. I'm a fan.

>>97569743
>>97569870
>>97569909
My hottest WoD take is that splats were a mistake. Hunters Hunted and the first Mummy book were written before the idea of separate game lines became solid with the launch of Werewolf. In the case of the former, it's one of my favorite oWoD books out there period. While the first Mummy book was a little jank and didn't quite know what it wanted to be, it didn't give one the extreme whiplash you might get going from Vampire to Mage. VtM books included "Lupines" before Werewolf dropped though in my opinion quantum werewolves were always a bad bit of advice and worldbuilding. Why try to put the kibosh on rural VtM? . I think those early books are evidence one could've created a cohesive World of Darkness. But by the end you had the writers waffling between massive cross-splat metaplot rumbles, and actively trying to claim different splats existed in different "layers" of reality. Different splats created an unhappy in-between where things were too separate to bother with consistency, but too interconnected to be fully free to do their own things.

>>97567697
There have been younger Princes in canon that have ran cities for arguably longer than Lacroix did, not every Prince is an Elder of true capacity either

>>97567852

Let's not pretend ANY of them make money. They don't. TTrpgs not named D&D don't make money. Paradox just found a way to make them make even less money.

>>97568551
>and the blade movies are heavily inspired by vtm
Yeah the vampire government in Blade is basically just The Camarilla, but retarded.

>>97567500
>White Wolf stopped doing physical books
Do they still do print-on-demand? If so, I'd like a copy of Deviant: the Renegades.

>>97567891
There should be a G.U.R.P.S. translation guide.

>>97567966
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=5t25m-YaWI4

>>97567941
>MU*/IRC play side of things
I seem to recall that the World of Darkness was its own sub-genre of M.U.S.H./M.U.D. Are any still active?

>>97570486
There was a GURPS VtM book too. Had some wild lore like a vampire mercenary group called the Swamp Anarchs and a like 60 year dead Prince of New Orleans trying to demographically replace the entire city with his own childer.

>>97570373
>I think those early books are evidence one could've created a cohesive World of Darkness.
I agree and I've discussed this a bit in previous posts.

>>97567852
>the vast majority of 2e books had to be crowdfunded.
And well oversold in Kickstarter. Vigil 2E got over 400% of its goal. All that means is that they're getting pre-funded on dev and first-run printing costs. Same with how going all Print-On-Demand saved them from the risks of a potential failure in mass-market printing excessive copies.

But let's also not pretend here that the timing on Paradox killing new approvals does line up pretty well with Vigil 2E massively outshining H5.

Where the Glass Walker bitches at? AWOOOGA!!!

>>97570609
Breeding and then abusing their kinfolk secretaries

>>97570609
The pet-play surge in recent years must be heaven on earth for those degenerates.

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>>97567443
in one night you kill the most of the Sabbat driving them out of the city, most of the Kuei-jin driving them out of the city, and like 60 kindred that were bloodhunting you.

literally who tf would stop you from being Prince at this point? you probably killed like over half the supernatural population of LA on your own in a single night I think it's safe to say that if you call yourself the Prince of LA then you are the Prince of LA and no one will be disputing this for a long time.

How much do you think the brand is worth to Paradox? Do you think someone could negotiate it down to 50k?

>>97570984
Thanks to the VNs and the diehard WoD fans who love to make them, WoD remains a stable passive income generator for Paradox. You'd need to offer Paradox seven, probably eight digits to convince them to part with WoD.

Akashic bros, we are fucked.
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=R40IDdAkRZM&t=183s

>>97567484
IIRC Strauss doesn't actually want to be a Prince and he says this very bluntly in his dialogue, "I aspire not to such lowly heights" and he says he prefers to stay as an advisor rather. He does become Prince in his ending but I see that more of a case of him taking the mantle because no one else does
I can actually see him backing the main character if their relationship is good + he'd definitely believe he can manipulate the main character

>>97571250
At last, I truly understand the meaning of the word Dotard

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>>97571495

>>97571500
>danganronpa pink

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>>97571500

Who's the highest tier vampire still alive?

>>97571510
Cain?

>>97571510
well technically none of them because you know undeath and all that. if you mean active then caine and then all antes beside cappadocious, ravnos and perhaps ventrue

>>97571501
are old scars

With the Disparate Alliance I don't think they should get Advantage Spheres.
I'm not sure what to give them as a replacement though. Maybe each Crafts Advantage is in a smattering of Rote Keywords, idk.

>>97571724
Pillars and similar magic systems to show that they are (with the exception of the hollow ones) outdated hermits who didn't get to copy the hermetic's homework 600 years ago which would also explain why the goth kids who have spheres are somehow the leaders, but then again m20 worked towards making the crafts less unique by allowing all of them to use all spheres even when they previously couldn't

>>97571762
There's a way to make "The Crafts can use all the Spheres" work with "The Crafts each get a set of Rote Keywords as their Advantage.".
It's that they can only use Sphere Rotes which have their Advantage Keywords.
So they can use all the Sphere's but only in specific ways.

>>97571506
Is this a violation of the litany? That's a lot of normies

>>97571787
that sounds interesting, but i feel like that's more effort than the m20 team wanted to do for the crafts

any page related to new rules is a page that isn't used for goatboy schizo posting after all

>>97571798
>Litany
That shit is sooo outdated bro, get on with the times man

>>97571798
It was a different time; people saw a werewolf and didn't scream like a little girl.

>>97571798
not sure i would call the people who been high enough on caligula good guy list to be invited to the supernatural colosseum fights normies

>>97571826
>t. A schizophrenic's fur rug
>>97571847
>>97571858
Different times back then I suppose. What was Caligula anyway? His eccentricity seems a big changeling-esque

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>>97566247
that poor woman...

>>97571826
We appreciate your contribution the the Union's financial growth. Now face the wall, please.

>>97572027
>What was Caligula anyway? His eccentricity seems a big changeling-esque
i don't think we know. in owod we only know that nero was allegedly a earthbound thrall and that in changeling and greco roman stuff is a bit difficult to use because in one book the satyr claim to have made up that phanteon as a joke, otherwise i would have said poor sob who got enchanted by a true fae called diana

in nwod he was rumored to be one of the possible identities of the og ventrue (who are more insane than their owod counterpart), but i don't know if the roman setting of vtr did anything with that

>>97572173
Interesting, I guess eccentric, weird, and whacky shouldn't immediately lead to a changeling conclusion. I also kind of doubt any huge historical figures will be vampires like that, maybe vampire ghouls or something until later. Though personally, I'd be likely to use him as a Malk for oWoD at some point unless I set a game around that time period.

>>97572237
>I guess eccentric, weird, and whacky shouldn't immediately lead to a changeling conclusion
yeah pretty much every splat in owod has a at least one whacky insane trickers faction it's one of the archetypes white wolf thought was very important till they dropped most of the whimsical stuff in revised
>I also kind of doubt any huge historical figures will be vampires like that, maybe vampire ghouls or something until later
would be better if they aren't. sadly wod does break from that sometimes with how many important figures been mages and vampires, but with Caligula atleast owod instead made their own rip off with Camilla to use in stories which i vastly prefer as a method

>>97570498
Doing a quick glance, New Orleans by Night and Detroit by Night both seem to still have their servers up, at least.
I used to mostly play on Project Twilight MUSH but there doesn't seem to be any evidence online that it ever even existed at all now. Sad.

>>97566247
From a clan perspective, what would be the more scandalous affair for a Ventrue to get caught with: a Brujah or a Lasombra?

>>97573884
Is this post V5 or pre V5?

>>97573884
Regardless of the partner's clan, the most shameful thing a Ventrue can do, relationship wise, is bottom.

Ventrue actively go out of their way to keep their personal lives private from their clanmates to prevent loss of dignitas over minor petty shit.

>>97573937
Post albeit I cherrypick events.
>>97574020
I kinda figured being the bottom was implied.

>>97572046
Poor woman? She brought it on herself.

>>97574098
>Post
Lasombra are Kosher, they're just violent Ventrue but not much more dignified.
>Pre
A filthy Brujah would be preferable to a getting caught up any Sabbat member, considering the likelihood you're going to get backstabbed or gaslit into becoming a Sabbat yourself.
>>97574020
All Ventrue are bottoms, except for Salubri. They just pretend to be tops

>>97573884
for the ventrue unless the lasombra is sabbat and the ventrue is camarilla. Neither really. ventrue don't really give a shit unless you mess with your prestige or the clan based operations in the city. there are npc ventrue who been with brujah and nobody gave a shit. most prominent example probably being the ventrue prince in the parlament of knives who been with the brujah baron for centuries and is considered a exemplar of his clan

anarch brujah might look down on another brujah who sleeps with a ventrue and make some comment about them being a lapdog, camarilla brujah wouldn't care and european brujah would wonder why you would even want them to care. Russian brujah however might react violently because they are the biggest shitheads in the clan, nearly wiped out the ventrue in their area and used to be convinced that they are the ubervampires above other clans and are still salty about being proven wrong

lasombra. For the Lasombra it would actually be better if it is a scandal in their clan because managing to pull off something outrageous is seen as a thing of great prestige in the clan, but if they are in the same sect and the age different isn't partically large in the ventrue's favor nobody is going to care

No answer to >>97569172 ?
I guess that I forgot to mention that we don’t buy backgrounds with exp, but we can get merits for their values x2.

>>97574406
>t. chud Garou (BSD)

>>97569172
>>97574843
Alright, it has been a while since I played WoD but let's see what you have. Post the character sheet so we can have a decent idea of what you want to do.

So fucking my Metis gf raw and cumming inside her isn’t breaking the Litany?
>Garou shall not mate with Garou
Technically it’s not mating since there is no chance of producing offspring.

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>>97575105
Here you go
https://files.catbox.moe/mfqr36.pdf

>>97575113
IIRC the Fianna still consider it a litany violation. Even the tribes that don't consider it a litany violation in the strict sense will look down on you for spending your time with a metis GF instead of impregnating kinfolk.

>>97575190
>Even the tribes that don't consider it a litany violation in the strict sense will look down on you for spending your time with a metis GF instead of impregnating kinfolk.
Children of Gaia are probably going to be a big exception to this, as are liberal members of various tribes who value love more highly than eugenics. There's also the ones who are very confident that the Apocalypse is nigh, who don't give much of a damn about trying to make more werewolves with Kinfolk because they're convinced that the world will end before any children that they might have would come of age.

Anybody got any good recent actual plays to recommend? i like to listen to them while painting.

>>97575265
https://whitewolf.fandom.com/wiki/Mummy:_The_Curse_Actual_Plays

>>97575265
Path of Night is my older go to but in terms of new stuff all i've found id recommend is the people behind Last Podcast on the Left started a campaign and having one of the actors from wolf of wall street play a total dirtbag nos' is worth a listen. LPNRPG: Bloodbath is a shitty name though but its good so far.

If you protean into say an octopus can you move on land, is there some gills rule, or ST's choice?

>>97575242
I'm still sure every tribe will clown on you for not making more warriors of Gaia, even the CoG despite being more understanding of your relationship. Sure, not every pack and not every individual member is going to get an anal fissure over choosing to bone a Metis but in general it'd still be like doing an interracial marriage more or less. Completely different social strata, even for the BSD.
>>97575313
It'd still feel like hell for you considering that those animals dry out kind of fast on land even if they don't need to breathe, so I don't think it's a good idea

The Complete Promethean: The Created Lore Primer
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=IjPchVlIwUE

>>97575156
Get more dots of Potence

>>97575242
Ever considered going off on your own? You can always offer your skills to some mage or something.

>>97575156
Get retainers (schoolgirls) since you are the ugliest of bastards.

>>97575408
Hehehe, I do intend to diablerize another Nosferatu named Hans. He has at least 4 dots of potence, so I probably would gain dots by eating him.

He’s the “hound” of the sheriff, but really he’s probably just a thug. Plus with the sheriff covering my ass because I’m his experiment, I might be safe eating him.

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https://www.tumblr.com/communities/changeling-the-dreaming

>>97575422
>getting forced into a Mage's servitude so that you can rawdog your werewolf girlfriend without consequences
Garou are worse than Catholics and Mormons

>>97575472
>her notepad of (bad) romantic poetry becomes her armor
Maybe nitpicky but I feel like this is missing the point of chimera. A chimerical item doesn't become something else, it Is something else, just on a different layer of reality. Think of it this way, a bicycle might be a horse or a teddy bear might be alive in the dreaming because that's how a child might interpret them in their fantasies, but someone probably wouldn't see a book as a suit of armour because there isn't much of a connection between those things.

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>>97575615
>a teddy bear might be alive in the dreaming

>>97575595
Being a mage's bitch will unironically be more fufilling than doing it for free for [insert tribe].

>>97575640
Only if you're the top

>>97567723
Yeah but metal rankings are.

>>97567852
>Let's not pretend that nWoD was ever particularly successful or making bank either
Market data isn't concrete in the TTRPG space but the ICv2 is the most reliable source for it and had nWoD as the best-seller behind D&D for a good while. It never hit the heights of WoD but it was a successful line. Unsuccessful products don't get 100 books made for them so that much should be obvious.

Tell me about Tzimisce gf

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>>97575889
Imagine some 8 legged spider demon chick who is probably mentally unstable, has an alien psychology, and may or may not turn you into a hellraiser character too.
>also

>>97575889
There is no point in doing with a vampire who isn't high humanity because that's a requirement for the blush of life.

>>97575444
Some dots in intimidation would make sense.

>>97575894
>Imagine some 8 legged spider demon chick who is probably mentally unstable
>who is probably mentally unstable
>probably
Anon, it's a tzimisce. You know exactly what you signed up for. This kind of coping is either beneath you or you don't deserve her.

>>97576202
Some Tziggers are stable

>>97575889
Would be ideal, people meme but Metamorphosis Tzimisces aren't the majority. A high Humanity Tzimisce, which is probably even rarer than Metamorphosis ones, is basically a better plastic surgeon than any human on Earth. Can change her body and your body to whatever you like

>>97575889
Girl is a former revenant and it feels like i am dating a dark age elder with how uneducated she is about technology... i also only started to date her at first because she is the obvious nepotism hire but turns out she is cute

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>>97575889
>"g"f

https://www.youtube.com/shorts/Brl3dA_UpYs

You've all been called out and before you whine about fifth edition, pretty much all of this applies to old WoD too.

>>97576253
no that's for horses not tzimisce

>>97577237
buy an ad

>>97575930
You don't need blush of life if you're not a coward

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>>97575889
Give us a smooch here anon

Working on an upcoming VtR campaign and I could use a hand on a background event that'll provide context for the game. I want Embracing to not work as intended in the town. I'm not sure if fresh Embraces awaken as Revenants instead of their regular clan, if everyone has some version of the Hollow Mekhet bane, or maybe the bodies simply don't wake up at all. Or a mystery fourth option, or all of the above.

There'll be Strix involved, so nothing is really off the table. The PCs will either be a rare few who survive the Embrace despite this affliction, or Kindred who have lost a potential childer to it. I'm currently undecided, and that's the best time to get as many options as possible and filter through them.

>>97577516
But does she love you?

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Does Cairo by Night have enough info to run a Dark Ages game in the city?

>>97578402
cairo by night is a modern nights scource book the things you can use from it are a handful of elder npcs (and a mummy), the location of two setite temples and bits from the history section at the start

certainly something build of from but not enough to run a game right out of the box

>>97577549
I'd lean the revenant angle. Creates a practical problem with experimenting to figure out what's causing most embraces to go wrong. Also creates a huge risk to the masquerade and a potential zombie-like threat.

>>97578402
I'm of the opinion you don't need a by Night book to run a game, and honestly too rigidly adhering to such books or any official lore on an area can be stifling.

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>>97566247

>>97578402
Veil of Night is your best bet for some DA info on Cairo.

>>97575889
She would consider you her property, ranging from a serf to a dog to a lampshade depending on her humanity.

Are there any thaumaturgical uses for the blood of a virgin who was embraced? Something unique to them so not just regular vitae. Some kind of ritual ideally, something the average clan mate wouldn't know about but you wouldn't need to be Tremere to do, an evil regent or something.

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>>97578783
>Are there any thaumaturgical uses for the blood of a virgin who was embraced?
Questions like these are yet another proof that Tzimisce are right, and tr*mere kikes need to be slaughtered like rabid animals whenever possible.

>>97578804
Justice for Saulot

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>>97578804
>and tr*mere kikes need to be slaughtered like rabid animals
If you coulda you woulda

I just found out about the Coil of Zirnitra and was massively disappointed it does not synergize with Auspex.

>>97578804
>Criticize Tremere for being amoral occultists using virgin blood
>Posts a guy who turns hobos into geodudes for fun
do fiends really?

>Constantly going to new and exciting places
>Bang beautiful women every night of the week
>Risk it all in life and death situations daily, and always come out unscathed
>All other Kithains think I’m mysterious and exotic, and all want to get to know me
I luv me freedom. I luv me stories. Simple as.
I’m glad I’m Eshumaxxing. Autumn People could NEVER.

>>97578804
>Amoral monster calling other amoral monsters worse than they are
Never stops being funny

>>97579127
Tremere are everything the Sabbat want, the Tzimisce are just mad it wasn't them that ate an Antedeluvian

>>97579206
I thought most lasombra and tzimisce genuinely think they diablerized their ante.

>>97579239
>Gigatzigga that created a discipline that makes a person biologically indestructable got destroyed
I dont think that even the most megalomaniacal fiends believe this shit.

>>97579254
you overestimate the mental stats of the average fiend then because they do. alot. the entire clan thinks that lambach is a schizo who went insane when he started saying otherwise and don't even care to investigate it.
this to be fair somewhat enforced by the fact that the eldest sometimes just kills them if they do so much as voice suspicion that he is alive that he is alive (be a good lad) but still it means that every tzimisce in the sabbat who is still alive either thinks he is dead or is a direct pawn of the eldest too scared to say anything or lambach who get's special treatment because he is a favorite

the old clan in the true black hand think that he is probably alive but they don't know for sure. They however wrongly assume that they are safe from him just because they don't have vicissitude so they aren't that much smarter

>>97579254
of course they do! it's their claim to superiority over the non sabbat clan antitribu in their sect

>>97579015
Self-awareness isn't the Tzimisce strong suit.

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https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=vN6gmfuJ02s
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=efl_CH_z8Es

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A rat done bit my sister Nell
With whitey on the moon
Her face and arms began to swell
And whitey's on the moon
I can't pay no doctor bills
But whitey's on the moon
Ten years from now I'll be payin' still
While whitey's on the moon
The man just upped my rent last night
Cause whitey's on the moon
No hot water, no toilets, no lights
But whitey's on the moon
I wonder why he's upping me?
Cause whitey's on the moon?
Well I was already giving him fifty a week
With whitey on the moon
Taxes taking my whole damn check
Junkies making me a nervous wreck
The price of food is going up
And as if all that shit wasn't enough:
A rat done bit my sister Nell
With whitey on the moon
Her face and arm began to swell
And whitey's on the moon
Was all that money I made last year
For whitey on the moon?
How come I ain't got no money here?
Hmm! Whitey's on the moon
Y'know I just 'bout had my fill
Of whitey on the moon
I think I'll send these doctor bills
Airmail special
To whitey on the moon

>>97579702
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=jj0ChLVTpaA&list=RDjj0ChLVTpaA&start_radio=1

Except for the feeling of playing a newbie, is there any reason not to spend 8 freebies on arete 3 at chargen for mage? The price is kinda high, especially when comparing to the freebie-vs-exp cost of the other stuff.

I don’t want to think of myself as min maxing, but I find it hard to build a mage character without raising arete to 3, and having an avatar at 5 (since you can’t raise it without a merit).

>>97579463
It's about moral relativism. Tremmy's do it for the love of the game because they're amoral psychopaths, Tzimisce-chads do it because they love their fellow Kindred and wish to see them uplifted. So what if a few undesirables get turned into meatball abominations?

>>97579993
Other than missing out on other cool character-gen features and backgrounds? Not really, go ahead. Everything has a trade-off, and like you said you won't get the newbie mage experience but of course that's not a requirement

>>97579993
>Except for the feeling of playing a newbie, is there any reason not to spend 8 freebies on arete 3 at chargen for mage?
No there isn't. WoD character creation is made to as front loaded as possible in order to veto problem characters rather than having to deal with them later on when they become a problem by pushing X/Y/Z threshold.

>>97580298
If a character ever becomes a problem character why not just make them hilariously unlucky? Or coax your players into accepting more flaws or something of that nature. Frontloading your dude just seems like a recipe to make a game harder to enjoy if you don't plan it out

>>97578783
>Are there any thaumaturgical uses for the blood of a virgin who was embraced?
Not really, you can write a ritual that uses it as an ingredient but there's no canon ritual that uses it.
Not sure if that's because it weirded out a test group or it was just outside the writers fetish list.
You can always write something tied to the virgin Greek deities but I am completely creativity bankrupt at the moment.

>>97580318
>If a character ever becomes a problem character why not just make them hilariously unlucky?
That's already a flaw you can take. If you want character progression to not be complete ass just use the freebie cost rather than the XP one, that way awarding a point still feel like meaningful progress.

>>97580257
>Tzimisce-chads do it because they love their fellow Kindred and wish to see them uplifted
Literally impossible for ANY Metamorphosit Tzigger.
Love and, consequently, empathy and compassion are level one SIN for those guys.

>>97579993
That's a very common reaction. Mage is absolutely playable with an Arete less than 3 and with an Avatar less than 5, but it requires clever mixing of sphere and exploiting the character's environment and tools. Magic needs to be strategically cast in the right places and the right times, or it has a high chance of failing. If the newbie mage is being hounded by a couple of gangsters, he can't just lob fireballs at them until they're toast, he needs to lure them to a Node so that he can successfully chain together Life and Forces to make them flammable so that when one of them lights a cigarette, he bursts into flames.

But if you're playing Mage to play an actual mage who does cool shit, rather than a trickster who needs to do a lot of micromanagement to achieve anything meaningful with their feeble cantrips, then just go Arete 3 and Avatar 5 from the get-go. Maybe have a talk with the rest of your group to see if you can convince your ST to let you all start with Arete 3 and Avatar 5, without having to spend anything on them. If everyone wants a high-power character, the ST should just run a high-power chronicle. It's better than everyone spending almost all of their freebie and background points on Arete 3 and Avatar 5, leaving them with almost no points to spend on making their characters actually unique.

>>97580337
OP here and I was thinking along those lines
It’s especially daunting when it effectively reduces your freebies pool by up to 8. Half of it gone before even taking any flaws. It’s jarring compared to the other splats.

The closest equivalent would be vampires and generations, but they can always spend up to 5 points at chargen to raise it. Or commit diablerie in game if they can get away with it. Their case isn’t as detrimental as mages.

>>97580337
That's fair, I just think it's also fair to karmically cuck players for doing things you really don't want them doing. Not to some ludicrous degree like making their balls explode for breathing but in an example of a powergamer or the one Tremere trying to farm XP out of the prison you can just add some inconvenient flaws. Not like you can ever really get so overly OP in a normal game anyway without turning your brain a bit off (as the ST). Should fairly also be up to the players to not optimize the fun out of their game

>>97579127
That's just how all v*mpires are. If only the sun could shine for 24 hours a day...

>>97580349
Love can be Love in a more abstract concept instead of an emotional one

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Hey, everyone. I'm new to the Annals Of Insufficient Light. Which game would you recommend?

>Vampire: the Apocalypse
>Mummy: the Primordial
>Deviant: the Masquerade
>Wraith: the Sin-Eaters
>Beast: the Requiem
>Promethean: the Renegades
>Hunter: the Oblivion
>Werewolf: the Lost
>Mage: the Vigil
>Changeling: the Reckoning
>Demon: the Forsaken
>Geist: the Resurrection

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>>97580552
Demon: the Forsaken has the cutest girls

>>97580552
Every game I run is Vampire The Apocalypse because I love it when the Tzimisce and Tremere players get turned into The Thing against their will.

>>97580552
Mummy the Primordial is pretty neat because it is the one Hellhound game where they had the balls to give random generation tables as to which rules of magic are true. Mage the Vigil tried to do the same but had to truncate way too much in order to keep the thing.

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>>97578804
>Clan of autistic control freaks that utilize fleshcrafted slave soldiers calling out anyone about being morally shady
ahaha, AHAHAHAHAHAHAHA

>>97580456
>Should fairly also be up to the players to not optimize the fun out of their game
There's a point where solving the puzzle becomes way too easy to be enjoyable.

>>97579097
>Autumn People could NEVER
Fucking shizo, take your meds already, we're sick of listening to your shizofrenic stories.

>>97580575
She would get impaled by a Volgirre Toreador LARPing as an angel
>>97580641
And she would get eaten and shat out by a feral Gangrel too retarded to be mindcontrolled

As Cain intended

>>97580632
The Old School Renaissance and its consequences...

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>>97580552
Why don't people ever talk about Morpheus? I know it came kinda late but I really liked how it reimagined a lot of Changeling: The Reckoning's concepts.

>>97580660
I know what you are.

>>97580763
That so?

>>97580739
People hate reimaginings. Such is life.

>>97580707
>Implying Volgirre will do anything relevant and productive
>Implying venturds, tziggers and/or lascumbras would let anyone else get their hands on makima

The World of Darkness supports caster supremacy because it never even bothered to make a Fighter or Rogue game.

so if a vampire without a reflection puts on glasses... then his eyes and head don't get reflected in the glasses. so he could see behind himself without anyone knowing?

does that work

>>97580739
>>97580786
Orpheus is a pretty good re-imagining I find. The problem is more that IMO (like with a lot of later WoD) ultimately you're forced to play a wage-slave. Orpheus isn't cucked to death, but the setting could use a bit more agency on the player's side for doing shenanigans. Like learning to Astral Project, or something like that. Could be a kino Persona-lite, under better management

>>97580951
>Never bothered to make a Fighter or a Rogue game
>Hunter's Hunted is basically everyone is a Rogue subclass
>Vampire the Masquerade is one in which everyone is forced to opt into Charisma (magic-optional)
>Every single combination of Werewolf is meant to be a fighter
I'll give you that nearly every other splat is basically just some off-caster or full caster.

It does make me kind of wish we got a Sorcerer game before Mage, if only because I like "magic" to be a bit more rules heavy as opposed to free form stuff. Nothing like how extensively rules oriented DnD is, but I guess around a common framework. True Magic is fine the way it is though

>>97581203
Does that make Mummy a game about clerics?

>>97580257
>Tzimisce-chads do it because they love their fellow Kindred

Man why are Tzimisce fans of all people unable to admit their favorite clan are evil shitheads. That's like, the whole point. Why whitewash the flesh freaks? That just makes them lamer.

>>97581286
Mummy I think is a game more about playing a very loose understanding definition of a Warlock than a Cleric
>Power based on willingness and effectiveness upholding a compact rather than Faith
>Received from a deal with stronger non-God entities
Cleric might be a stronger association with Demon

>>97581298
The road to hell is paved with good intentions this is more a post about Kindred supremacy than about not being evil shitheads

>>97581132
yes it does. it's magic not gonna explain shit. after all even items you pick up lose their reflection the moment you do

>>97581286
only if you go by vtm instead of actual mummy lore. the revised blood magic book describe anku as ritual magic that calls upon the egyptian gods even going so far as to mention that setites can't use spells that call upon isis while other vampires which yes makes the setites the worst setite sorcerers and then says that hekau and ankhu are based on the same system and could be adapted to each other

but then in actual mummy books that stuff is only in some celestial heaku and only if you squint

The discussion about FSN from last thread inspired me. What do you think of the concept?

>The name is Ashley Kyteler
>Inspired by Rin Tohsaka
>Lives alone in a dilapidated manor
>Parents died doing missions for the Traditions/Order of Hermes
>Chronically Late, 1 point flaw
>Deep Sleeper, 1 point flaw
>Lazy, 1 point flaw
>Defensive, 1 point flaw
>Child (16 yo), 1 point flaw
>Possessive, 2 points flaw
>Wonder (Grimoire, Spheres) level 5, x3

Ashley comes from a long lineage of Mages and Sorcerers. When she was 8 years old her father left the family manor on a mission for the Order of Hermes. He never came back. At 10 her mother too was tasked with a dangerous mission and never made it back home. Afterwards she was taken into custody by associates of her father. They were unscrupulous men who pilfered the family fortune while “managing” her finances. They almost emptied the Kyteler’s legacy, leaving only the mansion and the land it resides on, along with enough money for her to survive each month and go to school. The only thing that they couldn’t steal from her was the family’s magic crest which was implanted in her and hidden away with wards. Well, what was left of it. Her father couldn’t integrate the full crest at once before leaving, only a third of it. Her mother also had a fraction of it when she left.

After the tragedy of her parents passing she became kind of a shut in, lazing around in her ruined house practicing her magecraft and losing the notion of time while sleeping at any hour. She is quite possessive of what few things remain hers, and has become quite antagonistic towards adults. Especially those from the Nine Traditions, like her father’s associates, and will blame her misfortune as well as her ineptitudes solely on them.

>>97581372
Based, should give her Enemy 2/3 to as well to really capture the Rin experience (Kirei, the Matou though more on her side. Kirei alone should be worth two points as a hyperviolent Chorister-turned Nephandus). It's neat though, can make her one of those gem girls.

>>97581372
that's pretty funny to me because i am currently playing a mage called Rapheal Kyteler and we also mentioned that in our game the kyteler familly are a familly of mages and sorcerers akin to a hermetic version of the pallottino familiy
>https://whitewolf.fandom.com/wiki/Pallottino
and i am one of the fate fags from last thread too

>>97581410
>>97581372
>anon posting from an alternate route
Is this Stay Night vs. Prototype posting?

I met a girl playing a playbypost VTM game on discord. she sent me nudes after we talked for a bit. Never thought I'd meet someone through this game

>>97581410
Funny enough, the Kyteler idea came from a Fate game that was cancelled. Two technically. First one as a player and the second as a ST using the Anima Beyond Fantasy system. My servant would have been Sir Marrok, the werewolf knight of the Round Table.

>>97581399
I’m interested. It’s also what I implied with the father’s associates. It wouldn’t be that far fetched that they took the family crest out of the father’s corpse if they had the opportunity to have their hands on it.

>>97581473
I had thought the Wonder you had was basically the Magic Crest. Iirc Rin got to inherit it completely, Kirei wasn't a good adoptive Father to Rin but he didn't deny her her birthright entirely pretty much so he could emotionally torture her

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Good evening, Kindred

I am a newbie ST (for V5..) and I have been planning this game for some of my friends who are RPG vets but new to VtM and I wanted to get feedback on if my idea is sound:

I was thinking of having the player coterie be relatively fresh vampires who are being tasked with a relatively benign task for them to prove their worth to the Prince. This task is to retrieve some shipped gift for the Prince from Asia, but it turns out the gift itself was trapped as its some malevolent heart of an elder Lasombra (so it causes a bunch of wacky Abyss shenanigans), but I plan on it being stolen from the coterie by some local vampires that are trying to fuck with the Prince, who turn out to be infernalists or some other occult guys

I've gotten pretty deep into writing this plot but part of me is worried if it really matches the kind of vibe Vampire goes for, as I really want to introduce my players "properly"

I also am not sure if having them be fledgling vampires ruins some of the fun of character creation, do you guys have any advice?

>>97581414
>Is this Stay Night vs. Prototype posting?
Actually yes! Rapheal's families magic was based on on the magic of the Reiroukan familiy just upscaled to fit into a mage game because the familiy has a pretty dark tone going on so i thought it was fitting with the kyteler surename and the two known members of that family are misaya aka proto rin! and her unnamed father.

So the thing i am working with right now is a ex miscellanea mage with: norse rune magic (already went through the entire thing from dead magic and hanged myself for rotes), empowered animal familiars (easy just life), Blackmagic/Witchcraft (stole some verbana blood magic rotes and said it was familly magic.. the merit still costed me the same as the dual tradition merit), ""Alchemy"" as it's done by Paracelsus von Hohenheim who is their caster class servant in fragments which is pretty much the same gem magic rin does in stay night (which i pretty much just translated as forces and prime with gems as foci) and transmutation (matter obviously) and fate style homonculi (which is just high life)

the only thing missing is necromancy because i just don't want to spend the exp on it right now and because the Reiroukan familiy necromancy is mentioned once and not described in great detail it's just called "general necromancy" misaya's profile and never shows up in silver fragment and boundary fields because i just don't need them another player has alarms and chantry stuff covered

now the game just needs to come back from hiatus ... next month... hopefully

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Do Vamps have the most range of the supernatural threats? It seems like a vamp neonate is going to get absolutely destroyed by a garou cliath or mage apprentice (or even initiate), while the upper end of vampires, like Cain and his primogens, fuck up their archmage and wolf equivalents.

>>97581524
How does one go about building Silver in WoD?

>>97581504
Well, my character is inspired by Rin. Not a 1:1 copy. Also I wanted to give myself the quest (and reward) of acquiring the missing level 5 grimoires for each sphere.

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>>97581529
Silent Strider ahroun (she's a bounty hunter) who uses guns and has an alcohol addiction. It's pretty easy considering Deadlock's lore is similar to WoD.

>>97575156
you have a Nos with two dots in presence.....who the fuck does that work? I've never heard of a Nos with presence

>>97581524
Caine and the Antediluvians aren't threats, they're plot devices, unless you're playing ToJ. That being said, the Technocracy was able to annihilate an Antediluvian with one of their contingency plans. Techies trump pretty much every other entity in the setting except for Caine and God, as God made the entire setting just to serve as Caine's punishment.

>>97581563
WoD needs a government agency full of Astral Projecting Assassins with Niquil powers. Fuck I love Haze

>>97581563
>It's pretty easy considering Deadlock's lore is similar to WoD.

WoD fans are the "guy who has only ever seen The Boss Baby" of Urban Fantasy fans. Deadlock and WoD are only similar in that they're part of the same genre. Deadlock had its masquerade snapped in half fifty years before the game takes place, monsters are part of everyday life, there's an entirely different plane of reality with devil people and it's a third world shithole, hence why so many of them immigrated to America. Vampires are considered a "protected species" and have special rights. There's no consensusfagging, magic is magic and magitech is so common you've got !not Lockheed-Martin making soul-powered weapons.

>>97581577
nta, but only presence 3 rolls
>Appearance + Empathy
beside that presence the discipline is completely detached from the appearance stat

presence 2 also frightens people so it's very on brand for nosferatu to have

>>97581524
Garou have a high floor but low ceiling. In comparison, god might just be a mage with 10 dots in everything.

>>97581577
Got it via diablerie

>>97581512
This is a neat write up thank you, kind of based.
>Norse Rune Magic
>Empowered Familiars
>Witchcraft
I know this one It's Touko . I kind of like the idea though, hope you get your game going soon. If I ever get to play Mage I would like to convince the ST to let me make a Servant or something personally.
>>97581551
Fair, yeah. I like the idea either way, but I'm hopelessly addicted to shilling the Enemy flaw.

>>97581600
Perhaps the 10th sphere is also necessary to become god, if it exists.

>>97581600
... Yahweh is just a bronze age priest with maxed out Prime. Look at his story and tell me it doesn't sounds like a Mage throwing a hissy fit.

>>97581618
> hope you get your game going soon
it was already going... but on monday 15 minutes before our session our st got a call from work (we all work at the same tech company) and he and another co worker have been putting out fires at a customer all week so we don't even have a next session planned yet we just know that next week is probably off the table too

>I know this one
well nasu has just been kinda recycling ideas for nearly 30 years at this point even going so far as to use notes for fate go story arcs (lostbelt 6 has the red sky, the 6 sisters, statment that a-ray can be used as a another word for true ancestors like beings)

>>97581637
Well, Mahoyo was allegedly his first of the big nasuverse stories though it was never finished. I just wish he wasn't such a lazy fuck that never finishes anything since it's his best work

>>97581638
i don't think the guy who is finishing fate since 2011 is going to finish anything in his lifetime

and it's not like he is unique in that how many spinoffs did typemoon print that been on a unoffical hiatus for years? and we also haven't seen any of th 3 games (one of which will allegedly not be fate and one will again allegedly be a new ip) they claim to be working on in their in house studio that they started in... 2019 wow that's 7 years ago... hit shops yet with only a remake of extra even being offically announced at all. And no word of the second half of the Tsukihime remake either
the entire company structure must be a hot mess to rival white wolf at it's worst

>>97581674
Well part of the problem is that
>Nasu insists on writing for things that catch his interests
>Expanding the lore bible
>and drawing a rough outline of what the outlook of main TM works are supposed to look like
Apparently Witch on the Holy Night used a particular CG method that took extra time to bake, while Tsuki didn't but was still slow because of refining concepts and the new graphics. I remember getting exited for the new Tsukihime in college and it still took forever to come out. It's a shame his work is so interesting and enjoyable, his work ethic is GRRM tier

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>>97567443
this question has many layers to it, first off we would need to know more about suckhead(that's what Bloodlines' protag is nicknamed, it's his email). I'm going to assume that your question refers specifically to LA during the events of Bloodlines.

for example, if he is a Tremere? no shot. the House of Tremere takes their pecking order very seriously and Strauss has a centuries of seniority over suckhead.
if Suckhead is a Nosferatu? who knows, I don't think Gary would want the job, I am also not sure that the Nosferatu would support the endeavor, since the Anarchs would either have to be appeased or driven out, and I'm not certain that Gary would want to fight the Anarchs.
having a Gangrel take princehood from LaCroix could also be seen as an issue by both the Gangrel clan and the Camarilla, given that the clan became independent 1999.
as for the Ventrue, we don't see a council of theirs during Bloodlines, not even if you choose Ventrue as a clan. it might not have been established yet, given that the Camarilla has just moved back in or it may be that LaCroix is blackballing you and behind him there is someone else pulling the strings and even if you end up taking over, you may just replace him as a puppet.
I'm not even going to get into Malkavians, Malkavian princes are rare as is, for obvious reasons.
don't think that being a member of any of the other clans would bring any issues by itself, but frankly becoming Prince of LA would be difficult for anyone, the Camarilla has tried thrice and failed.

if your question is about Suckhead becoming a Prince or Baron in general, sure. technically any vampire can declare any village, town, city etc. as their domain and say that they're in charge now. if they do that in any city that is already ruled by powerful vampires though, they'll most likely just end up as drained ashes. Suckhead could easily claim his territory anywhere that's uncontested.

>>97581508
Yeah, that sounds like a plausible and very “lore beginner”-friendly chronicle.

>fledgling vampires ruins some of the fun of character creation, do you guys have any advice?
You can always introduce NPCs to help the coterie whenever they get stuck.

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My group is about to start a campaign, and I was thinking of playing a character from the Toreador clan, a thanatopractor by profession (focused on the beauty of death and somewhat obsessed with the aesthetics of reconstructing and applying make-up to corpses). but my GM has told me that it might make more sense to make him a Giovanni (necromancy?). The thing is, I don't know anything about the latter, and I'm not sure I'm convinced by the family connection (and I don't know if it's a mafia) thing. What's your opinion on the clans?
What personality traits and mannerisms should I keep in mind when playing Giovanni?

>>97582354
You got better taste than your GM. A Toreador thanatopractor is actually a fresh idea. GM just sees dead body and goes "hurr durr, Giovanni". I'd say stick to the original Toreador concept, that's way more interesting.

Now I'm strongly biased but I really do not care for the Giovanni. They're jacks of all trades in the worst way, almost anything they can do can be done in a more interesting manner by another clan, their "it's all one weirdly diverse but also chronically inbred family" shtick fairly limiting, and their plot armor is so thick it makes the Tremere look like punching bags by comparison. Playing a Giovanni also comes with a lot more baggage than playing a Toreador would. You're expected to be loyal to your family above everything else, you're not officially in any sect, which means while the Cam or Sabbat won't necessarily kill you on sight, they also won't trust you though it's fairly common for noob STs to do this thing where they make the local Prince a gibbering retard that lets every independent clan run around their domain like they're a normal Cam clan while receiving nothing but fair-weather "fealty" in return. So practically that isn't always a problem. and nobody will look into it too much if you get dusted.

Despite my strong negative feelings towards them, I'd encourage you to read their Clanbook/s and draw your own conclusions about them. Just taking our words for it might not translate to your table and how it sees them.

>>97582354
Yeah, the toreafag concept is just better than giovanni. Put your little foot down and go be happy fag instead of a motherfucker.
You don't really need necro for your concept.

>>97582354
Here's some inspiration for you, bro:
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Anatoly_Moskvin

Will Tziggers ever recover from being utterly and completely monstermogged by a fat, baby crazy woman and a dickless fag? Virsitania and Goratrix were vampires for less than a century and were making fucked up horrors on par with, if not surpassing, shit the Tzimisce had taken millennia to create.

No wonder they're still assmad about the Tremere lol.

>>97582373
>>97582397
>>97582403
Thank you for your opinions and advice, all of which are welcome. In the previous campaign, I played as a novice Nosferatu, so this is quite a big change.
I will read both Clanbooks.

>>97581586
I don’t think that’s very fair. Deadlock has more than passing similarities to World
of Darkness and I would put money down that some of the devs at the very least played Bloodlines (the original) and would even put (less) money down on at least one of them having actually played the tabletop growing up. Potentially currently. It’s a very reaching 90s and early 2000s tabletop rpg that used to be the #2, and is a general love letter to the general grungy, dark, gritty world of fiction in its various forms flirting with the supernatural. Venator alone feels like he was pulled directly out of a Hunter game. It is a chicken and egg thing of course, there’s every bit as likely a chance the world of Deadlock was inspired by the things which inspired World of Darkness.

>>97579097
I always wondered what kith I would be irl and determined I must be either a satyr or abpooka. Satyr because I sleep around and pooka because I lie about everything nonstop. Then I realized that really I'm just a shitty person.

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>>97582530
>pooka

>>97582494
Yeah WoD fans are not beating the allegations. I beg of you, consume more urban fantasy. WoD inspired a bunch of stuff, WoD was also inspired BY a shitload of stuff. VtM took a fuckload from Anne Rice's vampire books. Tzimisce had most of their stuff lifted from Necroscope. This is normal, human storytelling is iterative, and the good ideas tend to stick around as genre conventions.

By the time we reach Deadlock there's so many degrees of separation. It has more in common with Hellboy/BPRD than WoD, by a significant margin. If your best argument is "hey their catholic monster hunter could be in WoD, which also has catholic monster hunters", that's not a sign of being similar or even inspired per se, it's a sign of sharing a genre.

If you're taking this as a put-down of WoD as a setting or its impact on the genre, that's not what I'm saying. I'm saying that WoD fans have a tendency to see any and all urban fantasy as WoD derivative, when that isn't true. The genre predates it, and it hasn't been the genre trendsetter for two decades. As someone who enjoys the whole of the genre, I find it annoying, and I LIKE WOD. Like when people call Blade (the movie) VtM derivative because it has a !not Camarilla, but ignore the part where most vampires reproduce like a separate species and look down on vampires who were born human and got turned.

>>97582558
Did you just not read my post or something

>>97582564
You didn't read mine if you think it's unfair to say "not everything urban fantasy is WoD". Maybe you didn't get the boss baby joke, that meme is pretty old now. My point is that it has some very basic similarities that are the result of sharing a genre. And that calling them similar settings is either ignorant or deluded.

Like bro, what's your point? Genuinely. Gimmie them more than passing similarities besides "they both have catholic monster hunters". That's as similar as saying two fantasy settings have elves. I already detailed why Deadlock is very different from WoD as an urban fantasy setting. Shattered Masquerade, not an apocalypse, supernatural integration into daily life, very different set-up of other planes. It's got more different than it has in common.

>>97582578
No I got your joke, grandpa, I just want you to point out the part where I said WoD is the sole inspiration for Deadlock. All I said was that it has more than just a minor set of similarities to Deadlock and I would bet that at least someone at Valve has been exposed to the setting.

What is YOUR point? Your response had nothing to do with anything I said. You were still just responding to the original guy you Boss Babied, and I don’t know if you’ve picked up on it but I’m not him, I’m a second anon.

>>97582554
Go shoot a dog about it.

>>97582596
>All I said was that it has more than just a minor set of similarities

Yeah and that's what I'm rejecting, dumbass. Go on, give me something more than "catholic monster hunters". Maybe "they have vampires"? For settings in the same genre, they're very different.

>>97582609
I really wouldn’t have made the comparison a few months ago, but Rem, Venator, and especially Silver feel straight out of a WoD splat with the latest patch. I think vampires have been too iterated on to really make comparisons there, plus we simply don’t have a lot of lore about them in setting or how they work. But with Silver, there are not many settings where a werewolf works that way. In that the werewolf can transform at will and retain their sanity and focus. Off the top of my head I can only really think of Twilight and that one vampires vs werewolves setting that was very clearly actually just world of darkness and bordering on IP infringement. Could be wrong though! But usually lycanthrope was a curse and uncontrollable until WoD came around with WtA. And Rem is just actually a WoD Spirit. I wouldn’t include him if not for Venator and Silver making me think someone at valve dug out old character sheets in particular though.

This is unrelated but I’m just going to put Haze in one of my Chronicles at some point, and Yamato is just an eastern Mage martial artist so that’s another yoink for me. Anyways I think you’re still old man yelling at cloud here. But that’s an old joke you may not get it that meme is pretty old now though.

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>>97582617
Underworld, couldn’t think of it off the top of my head. Pretty sure white wolf even sued because it was so blatant.

>>97582617
These people won't even accept my Wyld West and RDR2 comparison, you're fighting a losing battle.

>>97582617
Eh, Silver's the closest in similarity not engaging in any spiritual fuckery. She drinks, shoots a gun, and occasionally wolfs out. Her Lycanthropy, while semi-controlled, doesn't follow WtA's five forms at all. We don't see a "purely human" Silver at all, she goes from wolfgirl to hybrid werewolf and then back. Calling that "straight out of a WoD splat" is the kind of latching on to a single similarity and claiming it's the same thing that's the problem here. I can certainly agree that WoD popularized the idea of controlled lycanthropes, but I still wouldn't call Silver straight out of WoD. Rem doesn't scream spirit to me in the least, he's a little question mark and from what little we've seen of Deadlock's other planes, it's not very WoDlike. As for Venator, the dude is way more Alexander Anderson + the dad from Boondock Saints than someone's old Leopoldite. In fact, Venator's liberal views on the supernatural would have him killed as a Sanbenito by the Society of Leopold.

From where I'm standing, it really looks like there's a lot of squinting involved. I'd still call them very different settings. You're talking in vibes, I'm talking in hard setting fixtures. And hey, you wanna take inspiration for your table, god bless. I'm not gonna badwrongfun you. I've done similar things at mine. But similar settings they are not.

Also, the Underworld lawsuit was so frivolous I'm shocked they even got an out-of-court "shut up and stop wasting our time" settlement. Putting aside this argument, genuinely look into that lawsuit, it was absurd. By the same logic Anne Rice should've taken WW to court.

>>97582425
They didn't. And the only reason they are still breathing (its a figure of speech, fuck off) is that venturds decided to aid the kikes.

>>97582617
>>97582647
>two guys agree on 95% of things, disagree about the remaining 5%, get assmad and start insulting each other.

Typical /tg/.

>>97582647
>it’s not a 1-1
Yeah that’s how taking inspiration works. Still passes the sniff test. Silver isn’t literally a WoD wolf but you could literally take her and throw her into WoD and the only thing that changes is she loses the ears sometimes. More than a few Garou have zero shits to give about Spirit stuff and just want to fight and fuck. You seem to be confusing “hmm I get pretty similar vibes and themes” as a claim of THIS IS WORLD OF DARKNESS and nah that’s not what’s being said here. Also I don’t know how you don’t get the Spirit connection. Rem has one braincell, he’s a higher order Spirit for sure, but he is pretty much seemingly incapable of thinking outside his purview. And Haze somehow made him real, so Mage bullshit probably. Also, yes Venator definitely would be a heretic, but so would half the Society of Leopold in actual WoD. Plus he’s partaking in an occult ritual, like Haze, he definitely seems to be one of the most flexible of his organization who cares more about the end result than the path you take to get there. Just like a lot of WoD inquisitors.

>alexander anderson
>hellsing
Anon I don’t know how to tell you this but that entire series was just Hirano’s take on the world of darkness IP kind of like how Japan saw d&d and wizardry and made dragon quest.

>>97582662
After like 5000 years of having vicissitude, the Tzimisce invented... gluing 50 lobotomized people together. And only 7th gen and up could do it.

In a single century, at most, of being vampires at all, the Tremere (mostly just two of them) invented:
>Gargoyles (the primary put vampires in a blender kind)
>Chitterers, a creation that looks like two dogs' hindquarters smashed together, with over a hundred malformed rooster heads that babble nonsense, which slowly drives the listener mad as they start making sense.
>Iecur, a vampire gelatinous ooze.
>Reapers, giant flying monster beetles that turn into magical reagents when they die.
>A procedure to create a lobotomized, obedient version of an existing vampire.
>Some freaky ass thing I forget the name of that could spew its brain fluid on someone to establish a long range sympathetic bond.

Tziggers got monstermogged HARD. They were upstaged by a bunch of thieving little wizards, who got away with it, got to become a real clan... and the best part? The Tziggers couldn't stop the guy who came up with the entire "turn us into vampires" plan and some of those aforementioned monsters, from joining the Sabbat when he decided he wanted to. And they're still mad about it to this very night. "Ooh, those Tremere were so mean, they turned us into gargoyles WAAAAH". Tzimisce can dish it out, but boy, can they not take it.

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>>97582673
Hey I haven’t insulted him I do not deserve this criticism

>>97582558
You cannot tell me Drifter's specific brand of Vampirism is not at least somewhat inspired by Hobo Gangrels. WoD is fairly popular, not everything is inspired by it but it wouldn't surprise me

>>97582717
that's bs, no way you didn't mean the grandpa comments as insults.

>>97582727
If that’s an insult I don’t know what to say, I would call that playful banter because he actually tried to imply that I might not get the boss baby joke because it’s just so oooold. I certainly didn’t say it with malice, and offense was not the point, rather to highlight what a ridiculous idea the boss baby joke somehow going over my head would be considering that joke isn’t even six years old yet. Which I further reinforced with the yelling at cloud call out. You see this is called not having a stick up my ass, you should try it 4chan is more fun when you don’t get mad at casual light hearted banter and think that’s equivalent to calling someone a dumbass

>>97582744
you writing a whole paragraph in response to that makes you seem incredibly assmad dude.

>>97582715
You forgot Blood Brothers

>>97582762
Correction, I am procrastinating because I don’t want to go to bed and I am bored and talking about WoD is fun. I am getting ready to run a new chronicle and every thread is at least one more idea to jot down to try and slot into my game.

>>97582770
that might be your intention but it's not how it comes across.

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>>97582771
You’re welcome to read into things however you’d like, it doesn’t matter, because the important part is that work is going to be a two Monster affair in five hours and I have three more annotations in my notebook

>two anons have a discussion
>YOU'RE ARGUING WHY ARE YOU SO FUCKING MAD BRO WHY CAN'T YOU JUST STOP FUCKING SEETHING SO MUCH
You guys really need some better ravaging material

>>97582805
Get new material.

>>97582813
Why are you so upset? You wouldn’t have replied if you weren’t absolutely seething.

I miss my wife

>>97582722
What I find kinda funny kinda annoying about this is that I'm the one who brought up Venator a few threads back after one of my old players sent a pic of him to me, saying he reminded me of the leopold guys I included in an old hunter game. After I looked into him I only half agree, Venator is way too moderate for the SoL. I also discussed Drifter in the same thread, mentioned that he's probably the character with the easiest WoD conversion, but even then, what little we see about Deadlock vampires shows they function very, very differently from VtM. I like urban fantasy and modern horror as a genre, more than just WoD. It often seems like WoD fans are ignorant of many works before and after WoD, and as a result are overzealous in their comparisons.

>>97582789
I was gonna properly respond but if you're just doing this to keep a plate spinning for its own sake, I don't see the point. I'll leave it at "we have very different definitions of the word similar."

>>97582765
No, I must be fair. Blood Brothers were way later and were a Tremere-Tzimisce joint operation.

A reminder to start migrating to the other thread, it's still up.
>>97566232
>>97566232
>>97566232

Don't need to rush as we're only on page 3, but there's no reason to waste an extant thread.

I’m a CofDfan and my entire personality is pretension and feeling superior to people who are primarily WoD fans.

Here's a thought exercise. If you were to port the Hunter factions to the OG WoD how would you fit them into the setting?

>>97582975
The projection is real.

>>97583133
Isn't it time for your daily seething over CofD being dead because Paradox doesn't want competition for its fifth edition of WoD?

>>97583153
Nah, I'm good. Say hi to Rudi for me, by the way.

>>97582715
Tremere were kind of cheating because they had an understanding of what literal wizardry was, unlike everyone else that thought there were rules to that shit

>>97582850
True. I think by nature of interest and how niche the genre is anyone making a work of urban fantasy with occult and conspiracy themes is going to look into WoD as one of the few fully realized inspirations for a setting. Sure it won't be 1-1 in a decent work, but it's certainly one of the biggest outside of Japanese works like Fate or books, and certainly there are even less works of urban fantasy that are all encompassing for monsters, play styles, and themes than WoD. That's just the reality of it, but I don't disagree that the comparisons are a bit over-zealous. Venator does strike me like a Leopoldite, Geist kind of has the Geist gimmick, it's how it is. I wouldn't be surprised if Venator's aesthetic is borrowed from Bach as well as Blade, but looking at every dude geared up in a trench coat for an inspiration without any dev confirmations is insane behavior. Just my two cents, I don't mind anons drawing comparisons even the very extreme ones. Granted though, I think we should look at movies and literature more than just WoD. Victor can be said to be "inspired by Promethean" but much more likely Frankenstein proper I think. I also very much enjoy the soft-futurism of Deadlock, you don't see that in WoD without going into Technocracy shit. Bebop is based, Seven is based, McGinnis is a morally bankrupt schizoid but she's based too.

>>97583168
What do you anons think Mage 5's Rudi is going to be?

>>97582715
Tziggers can do most of those too

>>97583133
Watching WoD fans turn into a seething ball of reactionaries has been wild.

>>97582425
>a dickless fag?
Didnt Sascha Vykos cut his dick off and throw it at Hardestadt?