It's called splat.

File: 1777326534870.jpg (202 KB, 1920x1080)

202 KB JPG

www.youtube.com/watch?v=ZHPB7UaGNBU
The best theme in VtM:B btw

>>98338580
There's a lot of ways to make a building seem haunted by my favorite and imo the appropriate way for WoD is just changelings having a laugh at normies rather than backed up trauma causing a Wraith or ghost to inhabit the place.

File: g.jpg (29 KB, 447x447)

29 KB JPG

BREADSLAVE HAS BEEN FOUND

>>98338645
There's also Requiem Obfuscate users turning a building into an Oubliette, and Nosferatu can double down on that with Nightmare.

Is there a review for V5? Are the Camarilla the bad guys? How does having one to five frenzy dice instead of a pool of vitae work out in practice?

How to have sex as a Wraith?

>>98338580
I am in fact going to make the next arc of the Princess chronicle I'm running a haunted house situation. As soon as I figure out how to deal with a glaring plot hole in the plot I've written.

>>98338904
Possess someone and try to pretend it doesn't count as rape while your specter shit talks you the whole time if I remember that one blurb correctly.

File: big titty chinese vampire.jpg (187 KB, 1197x2048)

187 KB JPG

>>98338308
would (You) anons have cared about WoD Asia if instead of kuei-jin(or whatever their called now) Qi ghost people Asia had its own Vampire bloodlines/clans?

>>98338911
Ah hell yeah, another Princess enjoyer. Just wrapped a mini-session with one of my players. Isore (Polish journo) and Sanae (Brujah Methusela) just did some detective work.

Sanae dressed in a kindergarten uniform outside the place where a girl was found raped and murdered last week. Israeli man Jeffery Goldberg showed up, touched her, and she popped like 3 combo disciplines to grow bone knuckles, do aggravated damage with punches, and have flaming fists. Then she punched his leg clean off.

Long story short, we got 500,000 yen and the police think feral hogs mauled him to death.

>>98338945
Based and oyveypilled.

>>98338839
>Is there a review for V5?
Its shit and its setting is shit and beneath notice.
>Are the Camarilla the bad guys?
Yes.
>How does having one to five frenzy dice instead of a pool of vitae work out in practice?
Nonsensically. A direct comparison is impossible because the base system is completely different.

V5 has no continuity of mechanics or setting with the other games, and anyone that claims otherwise is unironically retarded.

>>98338839
>Are the Camarilla the bad guys?
Now and always.

>>98338938
Assuming you mean oWoD, I certainly would have cared more if Kuei-Jin had been vampires or something related to the rest of the supernatural world instead of its own strangely geographically contained thing, yes.

Like you don't even have to reach; they could've just have been vampires with antediluvians that wandered east instead of west or south, or possibly something deeply tied into Wraith with its own celestial bureaucracy of the dead and have them be possessing things, etc.

As it is they are like a thing but not really a thing, and a thing that doesn't fit in with all the other things, while also almost exclusively being contained to China for some reason.

>>98338938
The whole reason I hate Kuei-Jin is they feel like they were written by some of the dumbest nigger weebs possible, like White Wolf picked their writers from the most annoying namefags of /a/. Kuei-Jin writing reminds me of this description of Katana from Baldur's Gate:
>The katana is a single-edged, slightly curved sword that ends with a chisel point. The katana is perhaps one of the finest swords ever made, the steps to its creation a long and secret process, that is more art form than anything else. This blade is an important facet of Kara-Tur culture. To touch or wield a samurai's katana is to insult the samurai and to incite his wrath. For a gaijin, or foreigner, to own such a blade is a rare occurrence. Either the gaijin is a greatly honored friend of an important minister, or the gaijin has murdered a samurai
Just the sight of it makes you cringe
I'd have liked them more if their writing felt more natural, like WoD Africa does

>>98339033
IIRC over in Requiem they do have Asian vampires but they're mostly members of the regular Clans. There is in fact a Clan originating from Asia very creatively named Jiang-Shi but as far as I remember they're nigh-identical to corebook vamp Clans. Don't remember what their Clan Disciplines were though.

>>98338938
my personal problem with the kuei jin isn't that they aren't cainites (although that would have been better than what we got) no my problem is that they are trying to wear several hats all of which are rather badly done and show the surface level of understanding of the material white wolf was working with. The kuei jin are:
>asian vampires who don't draw from any asian vampires for anything beside the names for some subgroups
>Cultivators who don't draw anything but the general idea and some ability names from Cultivation novel mythos
>seekers of buddhist enlightenment who's dhamars make no sense in getting to that goal at all
>while also being demons/ghosts of sinners from the 1000 hells and claim to be based on the ten thousand immortals (which are a persian thing while everything else about them is a badly done chinese japanese mix)
even werewolf is not that schizo and embarrassing

>>98339033
While that reads fairly cringe in a serious context, I think that it is not at all appropriate for the style of Kara-Tur, and it actually condenses relevant information competently - while more could be said or facets of ambiguity be included, the idea for the basic descriptions is to be short. I'd almost be surprised if this wasn't cut almost verbatim straight out of the original Oriental Adventures splat or the Kara-Tur splat, where establishing basic terminology such as gaijin and the like would be of relevance.

>>98339068
I think they should've been cainites that do not recognize themselves as cainites at all, like a major rift between them and the generally noddist west.

>>98339092
that's the same they did with the laibon so that would be the safe answer

although what the other anon mentioned in the previous thread should also be toned down the whole
>Blood and soil nationalism for the yellow vampires, and nobody else.

>>98339092
>the generally noddist west.
this i feel is a bit overblown and the community never having healed from TOJ

the largest sect in the west considers noddism illegal and the favorite "son" of the ventrue representative of the founders and inner circle had it as his main job to kill noddist and destroy noddist lore before the sect war turned hot during the og clan novels and needed his attention

most camarilla and anarch kindred will know next to nothing about noddism and will reject the term cainite because it identifies you as a sabbat who only still use the term mostly to be edgy. While the sabbat will tell you that it's #true but also that everything about noddism is elder propaganda

File: hank smoking.jpg (68 KB, 1000x750)

68 KB JPG

How would Hank Hill fare as a kindred?

File: Anda_v20,_p._416.jpg (88 KB, 374x844)

88 KB JPG

>>98338938
I don't hate the concept of Eastern Vampires, I just think it would have made more sense to have them be regular Kindred with their own bloodlines completely divorced from the Western secret societies
leave the Qi energy/Dharma/Enlightenment shit for the Mages

also having them somehow wipe out the Mongol Gangrel bloodline instead of them retreating back to the Steppes with the death of Kublai Khan is fucking bullshit and whomever wrote that has no idea how vast the Steppes are and how little sense chinese ghost demons infiltrating mongolian society to destroy them makes

File: even the chorus can be kino.png (566 KB, 1602x2141)

566 KB PNG

>>98339125
All of that which you say is true, but that's also why I said "generally noddist". There's a difference between being a firm believer in noddism as a kind of religious framework, and to simply live within the cultural context of noddism and its overlap with Semitic religions. Maybe I should have said "culturally noddist", I don't fucking know.

As an aside, I do agree that it's overblown, and that I'd liked to see more from other faiths and possibilities, rather than the Noddist creation myth having been treated as verified fact, which is a fundamentally boring way to handle things. Like outside of Noddism, how do Catholic (or even Christian in general) kindred explain their condition, if not as derived from Caine's punishment by G*d as espoused by Noddists? How do the Camarilla, within which the belief in Noddism and the Antediluvians is proscribed, argue meaningfully against it, to the point where Noddism can be considered outlier beliefs rather than the baseline within their particular cultural subset within the wider western philosemitic sphere of faith?

I think half the reason people take Noddism as the default now is because there's very few viable alternatives offered or presented as taken serious in-universe.

File: 435620.jpg (465 KB, 900x1169)

465 KB JPG

Anyone ever actually play KOTE Relentless Age? I see all kinds of hype about it and the lore is cool, but mechanically it looks nerfed to shit.
Especially for darma 6+, it doesn't seem like a 20th edition supplement so much as V5 for KOTE.

>>98339058
Requiem has the benefit of all of its clans not being utterly homogenous descendants of Caine too, they all have their own origins so one Clan being distinct doesn't actually set them apart that much.

>>98339534
>it doesn't seem like a 20th edition supplement so much as V5 for KOTE.
This is very accurate. The entire system relies on elder wan kuei having large dicepools and a wide assortment of discipline combos to be powerfoll which is V5's design philosophy exactly. Like V5, it Doesn't Fucking Work.

Your experience is using Relentless age as a lorebook and keep original KotE's mechanics. As clunky as they are, high darma hungry ghosts are actually terrifying in whitewolf's version. Relentless age kuei would have gotten curbstomped by the kindred long ago.

>>98338938
Yes, though I'll go one further and say you don't actually need new bloodlines/clans. Problem is the original 7 already cover a lot of the archetypal vampire roles. Does China lack domineering rulers, obsessive artists, lunatics, or savage wild men? No, not at all. While I think the execution of the book itself was kind of meh and fell into the common oWoD trap of creating a massive undead political bloc on American racial lines, Laibon/Kindred of the Ebony Kingdom had the right idea of the overwhelming majority being sub-saharan offshoots of the main clans. That's my rubric for Vampires. Same main clans that developed around very different cultures, as well as a few weird local bloodlines.

It'd be an absolute bitch to do in practice, but I've had on the backburner an idea to run a VtM game set in Chang'an, starting with the reclamation by the Qin back when they were still vassals of the Eastern Zhou, and ending with the fall of the Tang. So a true neonates to Elders game.

>>98338938
Honestly? Fuck that.
Not every vampire has to be a western bible-vampire. KotE was stupid and clunky, but the concept was cool and added more to WoD than "Just another bloodline". I genuinely think the laibon are a retarded concept that makes WoD shallower just by existing.
Dark Ages actually does this really well. There are a bunch of mystery monster that are Like vampires, but aren't cainites and that don't have a clear explination for where they came from.

>>98338662
I wonder how Garou react to being called bad boy or bad girl in the same manner a dog would be.

>>98338710
That's another good one.
>>98338904
>>98338936
Can't you morph your plasm (rather difficult as well if I remember) to develop the organs past your spectral body and clothes? It's ultimately a simulation so you're not having real sex. Iirc for Wraiths to feel anything of the living or moderately positive it's either possession or you're drinking Wraith juice served up in a manner not unlike turning other wraiths into bricks. Life really does suck when you are the economy in that way.

>>98339033
Isn't the Kara-Tur stuff parody rather than serious?

>>98339182
The Propane is one bad roll away from permanently ending him at any time.

>>98339182
"Damnit bobby i told im a god dang tzimicie. now i have to daysleep with 2 handful of texas soil in my bed."

Can Kinfolk with Gnosis use Rites?

From what I understand the Rites of the Changing Breeds come from an incredibly old pact their ancestors did with the spirits, and that's why normal mortals can't use Rites.

But Kinfolk have the same ancestors as their Garou and Fera counterparts, so... how does that work?

>>98339718
imagine hank having a panic attack because he tried grilling again and the the fire forced a rotschreck test

>>98339794
>Can Kinfolk with Gnosis use Rites?
This has been answered a million times: NO.
Performing rites as a non-fera requires making a pact with a spirit of at least Incarnae level, but preferably higher.
Kinfolk can make that pact themselves, as proven by skindancers and danislavs, but the latter's case proves that making a pact with an incarnae means only being anle to perform rites associated with them specifically(danislavs made pact with granfather thunder and thus can only use Shadowlord gifts and rites) while celestials and supernals can power Any ritrs(the pact with the wyrm made in the rite of sacred rebirth allows skindancers access to any rite)

No matter what though, even kinfolk with a pact are limited to gifts/rites of 3rd level at maximum, just like any fera learning out-of-breed gifts(except bastet and kitsune anyway, fucking cheaters).

>>98339412
>I think half the reason people take Noddism as the default now is because there's very few viable alternatives offered or presented as taken serious in-universe.

Very true. State of Grace had some interesting ideas for vampire religions, but future books didn't really do anything with them. I really like the idea it had about vampires and the clans each representing from, and embodying, a type of fear. The book mentioned it was popular in antiquity, before Abrahamism became widespread.

I think the assumption of a first vampire is reasonable based on how generations work, and the Antediluvians make sense even in a secular context, every clan needed to be founded by a vampire. But full Noddism? Bit of a stretch with the information most vampires, even knowledgeable ones, have.

>>98339182
>Dale turns his gun club into a hunter cell

DC Mummy anon here.

Looking through what notes I made I remember why I stopped working on them. I have the Mummy aligned Freemason Cult who made a mini Web of Faith in DC & they support a Mummy stuck in the Underworld.

Then theres the evil Earthbound Demon Cult who moved in ruined everything the Freemasons were doing. They're the Epstien level Eyes Wide Shut type of evil taking over politics.

My problem was that I wanted a third faction, opposed to the Mummy, & the Earthbound. I have enough small personalities & agendas within each of the current factions so that they dont feel too homogenous or monolithic, but i need at least a third party or ideally four, three "big" ones & a fourth small one that can hold their own but has a hard time of it. Like with kindred theres Camarilla, Sabbat, & Anarchs, with a bit of independents like the Gios. Any suggestions? Preferably without dipping into any splat/gambling that already has a ton of developed lore. I dont necessarily want to try to work say a Methusalah Ventrue into it cause then I would feel compelled to work that into the existing metaplot which would be a chore. Mummies & Demons dont have a ton of material so its easy to plug stuff in there

>>98339838
>Offers to power rites for Kinfolk
>Fomori are the only possessed that can buy powers with xp instead of taints or autonomy
>black spirals are the only garou tribe with a steadily growing population surplus
>Has a surefire method of getting to rank 6 and currently has the only method of getting ranks 7 and 8
The Wyrm really offers a fucking convincing benefits package doesn't it...

>>98339838
Become a sorcerer and enslave the spirits then. Long-term safety isn't guaranteed with this method though, especially when your family finds out.

>>98339794
They can. Though they might need Sorcery to make the proper contact/control of the Spirit since Spirits are racist against kinfolk

>>98339896
Since this takes place in America why not anarchist and outlaw Mummies? Ended up getting something of a regard for outlaws after playing RDR2

>>98339908
>Steadily growing population surplus
Maybe through other means but I doubt any non-Garou joins the BSD willingly. There's also the case that you're trading one flavor of being dominated by wolves for another.

>>98339921
In fact for an independent third faction, assuming it's in the modern day, the first attempt at reviving a president could have been Washington who became so distraught over the state of the government that he crashes out and goes on to found an independent party of Mummies devoted purely to resetting government. Could be interesting

File: hank-hill-vampire.jpg (6 KB, 180x135)

6 KB JPG

>>98339182
Which Clan makes the most sense?
Off the cuff id say Brujah simply because he is constantly getting pissed off over his principles & trying in vain to force them on others. But theres other aspects we could go too. A Ventrue who only feeds on propane grill users/beef eaters would be sort of meme level, a Toreador who loves propane flame & fixates on it, then you have ones that would be kind of funny as a hostile embrace. Like if some Assamite turned him because he thought he would be a good zealot warrior, but then Hank just told him to shove it he just wants to grill

>>98339791
He was born in New York

>>98339914
if that is the angle you are going for you should go full Skinner or Techno Sorcerer.

>>98339943
i think hank would gravitate towards dominate and presence so ventrue would fit well and his restriction would be regular blue collar people but no one that uses charcoal to grill. Brujah would probably be his best personality fit though.

>>98339986
>Hate your chud Garou family and think yourself superior to the judgement of spirits
>Become one of them via a forbidden rite that leaves you submissive to spirits anyway
Becoming one of those seems bad for your ego.

>>98339936
Thats pretty much the current Mummy in Chief. He is a Greek mummy who loved democracy & bonded to Washington. He struggles with his democratic ideals,allowing humanity to find their own way with gentile guidance his desire to just burn everything down & start over, or betraying his ideals & becoming a tyrant to force things back on track & with being disembodied since the Earthbound Cult stole his phylactery relic & put an Demon into it. The relic is appropriately named the "Heart of Democracy" & is the lynch pin for the existence of both the Mummy & the Demon. They also both feed of the Web of Faith.

The Demon is less fleshed out, but hes basically every baby eating politicians conspiracy theory turned up to eleven. I do need a good name for him, but thats not as important. All he wants to do is corrupt politicians, corrupt America, & bring everything to ruin. Almost every evil perpetrated by America as an entity can ultimately be source back to this motherfucker pulling strings. & many a Senator, Congressman & political aide & traded a part of their soul & pushed some evil policy for some material reward like longer life, victims for their fucked up tastes, money, or whatever.

One faction i kind of want to include but im kind of nebulous on what they would be doing & why, is Sorcerers. I kind of want to pool the less developed splats together & plop them in DC, I just dont know why a group of Sorcerers would do in DC or why they would bother duking it out with a mummy & earthbound cult.

>>98339995
I thing Potence + Presence because his first thought is usually to kick a dudes ass & lecture people

>>98339921
Can you go into more detail about what you mean by "Outlaw"?

>>98340011
nephandi and their sorcerer pawns would be crawling all over DC

>>98339914
>Become a sorcerer and enslave a celestisl to become you personal Rite-Battery
Based and Kino.

>>98339182
Hank- Brujah
Dale- Imbued Hermit or Defender
Boomhauer- Cult of Ecstasy Mage
Bill- Mind broken Ghoul
Bobby- Changeling idk what kith

>765 posts by page 10
We were so close to greatness. No free wyrm powers for Bakeslave. Do I at least get some sort of consolation prize? Pwitty pwease...
>HR will have some words about his behavior after the nightly orgy.
So should I wait until page 10 or page 9 to bake the new bread?
I think last night was a good time to wait until page 10 or else 200 some posts with the two Brujah fucking would have bloated this general.

>>98340149
765 is a good number, get like, three points for it I say.

I also say Page 9 under normal circumstances, but hold off until 10 if it looks like we're getting close to the record again.

>>98339412
>>98339848
Requiem had a whole shotgun blasts of possible backstories for vampiredom. The Lancea Et Sanctum for starters posited that Longinus was the first vampire in a similar fashion to Masquerade's Caine. In fact every single Clan in Requiem has multiple possible backstories. e.g. Clan Mekhet might have started with sorcerer-king of Egypt Akhenathen and his experiments into the secret of immortality. And of course, there's the coyly given implication mentioned in passsing in some books, that the vampire condition was the result of a Faustian vargain with the Striges at some point during the dawn of humanity.

>>98340207
i like how dracula 2000 had Judas as the first vampire. but cain and vampires being so closely related to murder and forceful taking of blood is just too perfect to not have them connected imo

>>98340149
HR has decided you will not be punished after James from Accounting's excellent performance. Do not mistake our mercy for leniency, no one wants to move after last night.
Yeah, if we had the thread at the usual 400 or so we would have likely seen a massive political argument in this new thread.

>>98340011
Maybe deep state sorcerers?

>>98340027
If I had to say I would guess more so open criminality and anarchist tendencies, robbing federal banks, prison breaks, drug dealings, human trafficking. Could maybe make it a faction or changelings that have turned to a life of high crime to get their glamour.

>>98340236
I like Caine since he was a farmer who killed his brother a shepherd, & was told by God that the earth would never give him succor again, & he would be forced to get good from others.

This goes so well with vampires preying on others & not being able to eat, & with Vampires treating humanity like a herd they must shepherd as a dark reflection of Abel. Murder. The Sun being representative of God's love & Caine rejecting it. Etc etc. So many great themes if you use Caine. You can get some themes using Judas or Longinus or whatever, but Cain(e) works too well in my opinion to do anything else outside of lip service

>>98340011
>One faction i kind of want to include but im kind of nebulous on what they would be doing & why, is Sorcerers.
Anon, DC should be crawling with technocratic extraordinary citizens(union term for Numina). Techno-Sorcerers, Psychics, pockets of Shih demonhunters brought through Demon Hunter X(Itself a technocracy extroardinary citizen directive), and even some Inquisitors(Technocracy itself has faith mages, they're just against faith-only healing and public miracles that could lead to sleepers hurting themselves trying to replicate).

>>98340207
I know. Requiem also has things that aren't quite Kindred but are still vampires. Fun distinction there, I'm toying with creating a few of my own.

Personally if you're going to attribute vampirism to any one origin point, it SHOULD be at the dawn of time. Whether it was a caveman striking a Faustian bargain with the danger owl, or the fourth person on earth deciding he really hated the fifth and getting a little froggy with a rock. Just so you can have the freedom to make your ancients as ancient as possible.

>>98340335
There'd probably be a lot of on-thr-ground fights between imbued and extraordinary citizens, the rampant gsng warfare there would be persect cover for human(imbued) vs human(numina) operations, with earthbound thralls, mummies, and ghouls all throwing wildcards into the pile.

>>98340335
>>98340279
How about a bunch of smug Techbro technosorcerer assholes who want to spy on everyone? Not sure what that would help them do exactly. Maybe work in some lite Roto Basilsk AI spirit worship? Im kinda like that

>>98340465
Anon, that's literally just Iteration X.

Shark here… game was canceled since ST wasn’t feeling well. Shame but that’s life.

>>98338580
Not in WoD. Though it did happened in a DnD 2e game when I was a teen. We also found a room where mutilated bodies were stored, and the rogue use the opportunity to grab severed dicks and slap the paladin’s face with them. They had quite a beef.

>>98338297
>even if I think his characters are insanely plot-armored special snowflakes.

I personally blame me not knowing quite accurately about the lore sometimes (like Red-Errand-Girl being more of a magical slave than a apprentice wizard in clan Tremere), or sometimes just not knowing what to do with them (like Shark devouring “dolls” and being pursued. His escape from captivity is pretty much me botching my writing roll). I think I tried making one or two vamps in schreck afterwards, but I wasn’t feeling it. Also tried the time travel thingy so I could both rp online and have what I say online interact with Shark ingame… but that also didn’t work out. After that, I haven’t felt that engaged in rp threads except when I was lemon wolf.

>>98340487
Right but I dont want Mages, Id rather do Sorcerers so these guys would be Great Value Iteration X, with ties to Iteration X

>>98340497
I'm not trying to make you feel self-conscious or anything, I know that you were fairly new, especially in /schreck/. Haven't been there myself in a long time, over a year. Just lost its luster for me.

As said I'm happy you're enjoying your game, and I'm glad that you're trying to improve your writing skills. We all make questionable OCs from time to time. Having fun is ultimately the important part. You'll never please everyone, nor should you. Your current game is honestly just way too out there for it to be my cup of tea, and that's ok. Keep posting about it as long as you want.

>>98340497
I had to stop posting in Schrekt cause it seemed like a bunch of people responding to themselves & not interacting with the others also only playing with themselves. Like a room full of people speaking their own fan fiction into the void, no one listening to each other. I mean, I really dont want to come across as an asshole, but I miss the people I used to post with & the culture that used to be there

>>98338580
Colonizing leech girls with my BGC.

>>98339714
I wouldn't call it parody, but it is very obviously intentionally stereotyped, and leaning into what people thought were cool at the time, rather than intending to be a serious representation of a historical not!-Japan. So there's a lot of tongue-in-cheek stuff, a lot of Bushido autism, etc.

It's not a flaw, but a feature.

>>98340655
>Your current game is honestly just way too out there for it to be my cup of tea, and that's ok. Keep posting about it as long as you want.

Funnily enough I think that’s the reason we lost our assamite after only one night with us. Sure we try to keep the game as historically accurate as possible but sometimes shit happens. Shit like Shark eating a train full of people after we did a firing squad on them… because we broke the masquerade so openly. Though the guy was also a dick and called our game absolute dogshit.

And keep the points to improve my writing style. I’ll never have the penmanship of Two-Dee but it never hurts to improve.

>>98340671
I missed them too. And I loved when everyone converged to Berlin into a singular arc with smaller ones around. Though I was the center of attention so I guess that I’m biased.

>>98340571
But the Technocracy aren't really "mages". Most of them, even the "awakened" ones, are completely unaware of True Magic, and think they are relying on engineering and pushing scientific borders.

>>98340655
>>98340671
Not Shark here though I larp as a Tzimisces occasionally but yeah I only joined somewhat recently and though I've checked out schrekt threads while lurking, I've never been a huge Vampire fan. I don't dislike current schrekt, I just have a hard time finding a reason to post in it.

>>98340732
Fair point, a bit of both then I suppose. It just neither seems to me to be so misinformed and lazy as to be kind of like KoTE but also not detailed and actually intended for players to think of in the setting. It's not part of the Sword Coast, after all.

>>98338308
Got a pic with the discipline and its dots rating?
You got me curious

>>98340763
further proof the world is ran by nephandi

>>98340801
Can we please not start irl political shit flinging, please. My eyes are still recovering from the last thread.

>>98340819
You started it (>>98340545), don't play victim now.

HEDGEFAG

>>98340671
>I mean, I really dont want to come across as an asshole, but I miss the people I used to post with & the culture that used to be there

Nah, you're fine. I was a member of the old guard and I just think it just ran out of stuff to talk about, which led to story posting beginning to dominate. But said story posting lacked hard mechanics behind any of it, so it was up to authorial whims. Combine that with differing personal views on the setting and I think it was kind of inevitable. The main reason I left was that most of the personalities I bounced off of well had left. That and honestly, I felt as if my attempts to give input and influence a story were generally being declined. That and I was tired of giving the same repeating advice and competing sales pitch to the umpteenth clueless fledgling abandoned by their sire. It became the zombie general I was worried it'd become. Nothing assholish about saying you stopped enjoying something and giving the reasons why. I don't bear any personal ill will towards the posters I didn't really vibe with.

I'm curious now, who were you?

>>98340734
>Though the guy was also a dick and called our game absolute dogshit.
Yeah, that guy's just a dick. Also, hilarious that a guy playing an Assamite is throwing shade, but that's my personal bias . I'd have just politely said it wasn't for me and wished you all well. I'm glad you want to improve, it's a good attitude to have.

>>98340835
You know what they say about Ass-Mite players.

>>98340851
>Everyone wants more brujah posting
Nobody wants more brujah posting.

I miss the woof rp and the Lupus posters but they've been afraid of the thread ever since Bakeslave became a willing Wyrm asset.

HEDGEFAG PLS

>>98340864
What is it? Did a new book come out or something i missed?

>>98340851
What if their frenzy prone nature wasn’t part of Caine’s curse upon the clan but rather self inflicted?

File: 026071251329.jpg (81 KB, 1080x228)

81 KB JPG

>>98340825
>You started it
No, Im bakeslave.
>>98340851
At the very least can it wait until after we hit bump limit?

Should we include Curseborne discussion in this thread? I liked the generals we got and it's kind of a shame they dried up.

>>98340891
I like this idea, though it seems like it was just the natural disposition of their founder which Caine made even worse, in keeping with the ironic karmic punishments that Caine had learned from God (though not taken to heart, funnily enough).
>>98340895
I can hold back, somewhat.

>>98340891
Depends on if you think Troile diablerized Illyes before or after Caine came back to brand the clans with their curses. If it was after, it's not Caine's fault directly. I like to imagine it's the curse of being the progeny of the first diablerist.

>>98340917
You'd have to specify Curseborne in discussion then and I'm not sure too many of us are interested in it

>>98340861
Oh we (well, at least me) are still around, it’s just that since discussion has centered mostly around homid politics there isn’t a lot to do besides look in horror and wonder if the Lodge of the Predator Kings were right all along

File: seperation.png (2.14 MB, 1502x968)

2.14 MB PNG

>>98340754
sure, but it's like a perfect capsule showing what was wrong with early vtm bloodlines disciplines
>signature power is a 6th dot ability
and
>very weak elder powers some of which are very similair to other already existing lower dot powers
but hey the second dot kinda gives you a blood rocket punch!

>>98340891
true brujah would say no, but the normal brujah clan curse is mentioned in the erciyes fragments when caine lists the clan curses

>>98338580
hey I think I know that guy

>>98339838
>Performing rites as a non-fera requires making a pact with a spirit of at least Incarnae level, but preferably higher.
I'm guessing that's something non-kin mortals can do too, yes?

>as proven by skindancers
So then skindancer is a pact between a spirit and... all of kinfolk as a whole? Since literally any kinfolk can do it afaik, unlike the grandfather thunder pact

File: The_Real_Prince_Says_So.png (1.96 MB, 1417x1417)

1.96 MB PNG

>>98338938
Kindred of the East had its problems, but I hate the idea of east Asian vampires being descended from the Biblical Caine more.

>>98339005
The best way I've thought to handle it is that the conditions that give rise to Kuei-Jin happen everywhere, it's just that there's no society set up to tame them so people just think they're animalistic zombies.

>>98339058
That's do to how Clans work in Requiem. they all started out as their own unique thing, but generations of drinking each others blood causes them to homogenize. It's why Hollow Mekhet are a thing. Unlike a lot of Clans which are implied/outright stated to be descended from the Strix (especially in 2e which gets too blatant about it), the Mekhet progenitor seemed to be a shadowy entity found in a cave made of bladed tentacles. Nosferatu might be descended from something referred to as worm gods. The 2e Jiang-Shi are descended from the ghost-vampire Jiang-Shi from the 1e Wicked Dead Night Horrors book.

>>98338071
>Corrupting mortals, fucking shit up, and being a mustache-twirling villain.
Then that's probably what we should be looking at when trying to narrow down the definition of a demon and the niche their abilities give them.

Being very good at that, but not as good (or incapable at all, depending) at the stuff the other splats are good at.

Idk, like instead of the broad array of mind control options of a vampire they have more focused ones like inducing Hate instead of any emotion? It's probably a bad example we may not want, but it should help get the point across and I'm not in the right headspace to come up with good examples right now

Also, this seems to reinforce the concept of demon as an Evil entity rather than the more generic daemon, although there's more than one possible reason why that would be the case.

>>98339926
while willingly part is indeed a bit questionable one book has a black spiral dancer mention how to recruit garou from most tribes

mostly by pointing out their hypocrisy and showing them how self destructive they are already (children of gaia, fianna) or getting rid of their tribe curses (silver fangs, silent striders) or just plain holding a carrot in front of them (red talons, shadowlords, get fenris)

>>98339534
I dislike the changes they made to Devil-Tigers and Scorpion-Eaters. I did like how the Ravnos Path of Paradox was a viable Dharma though.

>>98340917
Curseborne doesn't have enough meat on its bones yet to discuss at length currently.

>>98341297
>Unlike a lot of Clans which are implied/outright stated to be descended from the Strix (especially in 2e which gets too blatant about it), the Mekhet progenitor seemed to be a shadowy entity found in a cave made of bladed tentacles
actually vtr2 also has the strix behind the creation of the mehket, not matter how little sense it makes. even featuring the strix rumored to have created them

Rose Bailey's fetish for the strix really is a detriment for that setting in one of her stv books she also states that all clans been created by the strix and that this is the one legend that is 100% true because screw vampires

which is a shame because 1e put forth some really cool alternative origins (which i personally also use). you already mentioned the shadow tenacle monster and the wormgod, but there is also
>nosferatu may not have a ancestor they may just have risen from their graves one night and are pretty much the nwod version of risen which is why they have a connection to the underworld
>mehket may or may not be created by sorcerer cult that fought against a wizard pharaoh or been created by that wizard pharaoh
>daeva might have been mesopotamian priests possessed by demons (En) who got saved by being turned into kindred

which is not even going into mythologies which also gives optional origins like the serpent from the garden of eden (which also gives vampires even more poison immunity if true), the actual god mythras, or each clan founder was a member of the Julio-Claudian dynasty

>>98338938
>Implied evil-aligned
>Titty mole
IM FUCKING COOOOOOOOMINGGGGG

File: necromorph-chan.png (1.95 MB, 1200x1697)

1.95 MB PNG

>>98340861
>a willing Wyrm asset
Only one of my personalities (Wyrmslave) wants to free the wyrm. Lucid Bakeslave wants to get this spirit out of me so I can go back to a normal life.
Also I am not immune to the delirium so just pop Crinos and I will scurry away.

I got the broad strokes of storytime figured out. I feel like he isnt suffering as much as he should so Im trying to add details. The humidity is really sapping my ambition so its probably not going to get posted today. I do appreciate constructive criticism so if anyone has suggestions on how I can improve my stories, I would appreciate the feedback. I also gotta find a better picture to represent bakeslave but I like the look on the necromorph's face.

File: gm.jpg (198 KB, 565x800)

198 KB JPG

>>98338938
I'm stuck with having to rewrite and worldbuild everything about vampires in East Asia whenever I play this game, and I hate it.

>YWN save your Hecata gf from her incestuous family whose parents are also her brother and sister

File: actually interesting mekh(...).png (49 KB, 247x338)

49 KB PNG

>>98341419
I actually like the idea of the Strix as an antagonist, but they really do have an outsized effect on the setting to its detriment. They should just be the progenitors of the Venture and Gangrel and have cut a deal with the Julii.

On a similar note, did Vlad the Impaler being raised by the Strix need to be spelled out in a Dark Eras chapter? What does spoon-feeding the most obvious and boring answer to a plot hook actually accomplish? Sure, it makes sense with all the information we have, but if you're going to answer a question like that, at least make the answer interesting so it can work as the foundation of a plot rather than pinning it on the spooky birds again.

>>98341464
>I actually like the idea of the Strix as an antagonist, but they really do have an outsized effect on the setting to its detriment. They should just be the progenitors of the Venture and Gangrel and have cut a deal with the Julii.

i personally like the idea of them being the creators of the julii (with gangrel and ventrue being mutant julii lines or ventrue being julii and gangrel hybrids) but having gotten confused because of the whole becoming kindred thing which makes them read all kindred as julii. And yeah they can be fun antagonists like they are fine the way they are presented in vtr 1e and requiem for rome and the idea of a aimless confused dark force is interesting, but they don't have the star power to carry everything Bailey wants them to be in 2e

>>98341080
Yeah first read seems like a very fun concept, but a second read after your comment tones down the hype. Shame that you need the 10th dot to pull off a DIO…

>>98341419
>strix behind the creation of the mehket,
Mekhetbros...

>>98339794
>>98339838
This depends on what edition and what supplements you use. Revised says something to the tune of "Kinfolk cannot into rites." W20 Kinfolk: Breed Apart lets them learn any Garou rite up to Lv2 and any Kinfolk rite. Some rites require Gnosis, some don't.

>>98341512
>second read after your comment tones down the hype. Shame that you need the 10th dot to pull off a DIO…
it's a okay starting point for homebrew i guess

also just make it the 5th dot power and move the 6th dot to 4th or 3th or something

Vicissitude 5 can after all do something very similair (and arguably better) with The Body Impolitic so it's not like it's too op

>>98341515
like i said the main writer behind vtr2e has the strix be the creator of all of vampire kind. The non kindred vampires also have all not be ported to 2e (even in the stv books) which may have to do with that agenda

although to be fair that might just be me being paranoid given that 2e didn't have as much night horror books

V20DA vs VtR1e vs VtR2e?

>>98340571
You could also make them drones.

>>98341576
V20DA > VtR2e > VtR1e

File: Human Spirits.png (56 KB, 526x407)

56 KB PNG

>>98341488
I just like the idea that the Julii existed before the Strix, but their Clan curse was they didn't have a Beast so drinking blood was a miserable experience for them. But yeah, I fully agree on the second point. They're too one dimensional to take center stage rather than being an element to shake things up. I also hate the idea of them being former human spirits because humans are hunters, but humans as animals aren't anywhere near that predatory. You'd think with how the Strix are, humans were apex predators who could barely tolerate each other rather than omnivorous social apes who evolved from a lineage of social apes stretching millions of years in the past. A theoretical human-spirit would be predatory in the way all spirits are, but Strix are pure predator untempered by more primate-like traits.

Honestly, a troop of psychotic shadow chimps hunting down prey in a coordinated fashion makes more sense than the Strix with that origin.

>>98339838
>even kinfolk with a pact are limited to gifts/rites of 3rd level at maximum
Wait a second, isn't the Rite of Sacred Rebirth level 5?
I'm pretty sure I remember it being a level 5 Rite, at least in W20. Something isn't right here.

>>98341591
> I also hate the idea of them being former human spirits because humans are hunters, but humans as animals aren't anywhere near that predatory. You'd think with how the Strix are, humans were apex predators who could barely tolerate each other rather than omnivorous social apes who evolved from a lineage of social apes stretching millions of years in the past. A theoretical human-spirit would be predatory in the way all spirits are, but Strix are pure predator untempered by more primate-like traits.

to quote Bailey's "VTR2e Hijack This - The Writers Guide to the Strix" the previously mentioned stv book where she also says that the strix created all of vampire. that was in her mind the point of the strix. not that they are former human spirits but that they nearly been the spirits of humanity but didn't fit because we aren't insect brained pure evil hedonists

>The Strix were our spirits. They could have been us, they very nearly were... but then we drove them back. They were burned by our cookfires, repulsed by our faiths, driven back when we ordered ourselves and learned to farm our blood and flesh instead of chasing it forever. They hate that. The lack of pursuit. The eating without the adrenaline. That so many of us spend every night warm. Most of all, they hate that we believe we have good inside us. That we have something better than them inside.
not saying this is a good idea. just putting out what the lead writer of the gameline's second edition wanted to do before paradox forced them into stv territory (still does not explain why they are birds though...)

to be honest i think this is whatever. i prefer them being anti vampire psychopomps or out of control spirits of athena/minerva or a kind of demon related to the inferno ones, but that's never going to come up because the strix let's not forget don't know their backstory, their purpose or anything really and that's the most unique part of them

Did we ever get any kind of info or hint on what the third Baali bloodline is like?

>>98341618
yes a bit. despite not having a single character. we are told that they are connected to or even are the avatars of the swarm sect and have created the Via Hyron path most baali followed which is why it's called the road of the hive

they been in heavy decline way before the dark ages even in comparision to the other baali lines but the Avatars of the Swarm tried to get in with cainite heresy and have no mention after that in the timeline

>>98341642
well technically the boy from the intro of the baali clan book might be a avatars of the swarm baali now that i think about it

>>98341576
In terms of pure mechanics? VtR2e>VtR1e>V20DA.

I really don't like the core mechanics of oWoD.

>>98341591
>>98341613
so what did cause them to be so out of sync with humanity because like that makes no sense?

in cofd there wasn't a big event that made humanity break out of nature like in owod with the weaver gifts or tower of babel so humans as far as i am aware are acting 100% like they are intended to do so why are their "spirits" fine tuned to a species of draugr (vtr's term to what vtm calls wights)?

>>98341706
there is no explaination beside what we both posted. the entire human spirit stuff is only from that one stv book which is meant to be the author pulling the curtain and showing all she has for the strix (at the time she kinda says that she might write another book about them someday that gives them subsplats because she loves those birds way too much in case you haven't noticed) so the fact that they are -allegedly- human spirits IS meant to be the super secret special reveal that is meant to have the strix finally and fully fall into place and make sense

but as you noticed it doesn't work and just brings out more questions

>>98339896
First time I hear about this so I'm probably missing important information, but I can brainstorm a couple of ideas in case anything sounds good


True Brujah historians, occultists, noddists, something like that. Or one or a few manipulating another vampire faction, since their numbers aren't generally large. Their interest in ancient knowledge could give opportunities for interaction with the mummy and the demon, either because their cults need some ancient knowledge the vampire has or the vampire wants some knowledge or historical artifact one of the others have: kind of awkward when a vampire shows up suddenly and decides the magical item you needed belongs in a museum, isn't it?

The Hedge Magic group of the Nebuu-Afef, the Order of the Golden Fly, has been rebuilding in DC. And its "patron" is going to have quite a bit to say about anyone trying to help a mummy...

Drones. I don't think there's much metaplot lore developed about Drones themselves? About other groups with weaverish leanings like the Technocrats sure, about the fomori of Pentex sure, but Drone-run operations?

I don't know enough about CtD to suggest something from there, but I don't think the Kiasyd bloodline has a ton of developed lore. And for all that the default disciplines for these fae vampires is Mytherceria+Dominate+Obtenebration, some have Necromancy instead of Dominate, which would give them possible ways to meddle with the Underworld in which the Mummy is stuck (plus of course whatever one makes out of Obtenebration)

I think at least one of the government agencies mentioned in Hunters Hunted 2 was based in DC too?

And a group of Marauders with a similar enough madness could also be a possibility

>>98341665
Do you mind elaborating a bit on this, what you like and what you dislike of the mechanics?

>>98339704
IRL, trained wolves never learn vocal commands well, though they're quite capable of learning hand signals.

>>98341706
>so what did cause them to be so out of sync with humanity because like that makes no sense?

This is straight-up speculation, but the most likely answer is something along the lines of "Stone Age Mages fucked around with primordial spirits and found out" because odds are the stryx are some kind of poetic punishment like the wolf spirits are to the Uratha; besides that, they could be...
>Chthonic creatures from an old and forgotten realm.
>The shadows cast by humanity enlightend by the divine fire, Azoth.
>Creatures born from a fae bargain with humanity.
>Time traveling demons created in the far future punishing humanity for a crime it didn't commit yet (Mummy is weird like that but I don't remember a lot of it)
>Fumes of the God Machine's boilers fed by human souls.

>>98341883
>>Fumes of the God Machine's boilers fed by human souls.
So THAT's what happened to my soul.
Weird.

>>98341816
>Do you mind elaborating a bit on this, what you like and what you dislike of the mechanics?
NtA but most people I have seen dislike how the combat needs 4 rolls for every interaction and the way XP works is just annoying as hell.

>>98341816
What I don't like about oWoD
>Not a big fan of the 1s subtracting from successes, and how botches in general work.
>The knowledges/skills/talents list is really bloated.
>Dex is the god stat of combat, and celerity, even with the attempts to rebalance it, is the god discipline of combat.
>Don't like rolled soak, leaves too much of your survivability up to chance. Plus rolling attack, then defense, then damage, then soak can slow things down.
>For vampire specifically, I don't like how discipline powers can vary wildly in efficacy, and especially how hit or miss elder powers are. Sometimes the thing everyone wants is locked behind 6+ dots, other times you'll have a 7+ dot power so specific it'll maybe come up once per game.

I know multiple people IRL that have said they hated how it plays. VtR1e is okay, but it largely just benefits from improved core rules. It was the first full nWoD line and it kinda shows in the core. Simultaneously played it too safe and not safe enough. Compared to 1e, the core rules of 2e were mostly an improvement but had a few downgrades in my opinion. Nothing crippling or hard to house rule around, but I view CofD in general as two steps forward, one step back.

But just looking at Vampire, 2e was nearly a strict upgrade. The base template has a lot more oomph to it (night vision, enhanced senses, and reduced sunlight damage), the Discipline powers (obscure gimmick disciplines notwithstanding) are very well balanced and every dot feels useful. Powers outside of the 1-5 are covered by Devotions, flexible combos of existing Disciplines. The only downside is, as other anons mentioned, the over-focus on the Strix instead of the many other antagonists, but 1e books are pretty easy to port over.

>>98339908
>Black Spiral Dancer ranks go up to 9
>regular woofs cap out at 6
Why does the Wyrm offer better shit than everyone else combined?

>>98341986
Normal dogs are masochists. Even Book of Hungry Names got that right.

>>98339908
>>98341986
the rank 6-9 thing is just an assumption on shaky ground borne from the fact that passing the levels of the spiral gives you more ranks and there's more than 6. It's never outright stated that there is more ranks than 6 tho.
Also Kitsune state they gain a tail for each rank, and that there's (a singular) 9 tails, so.. that is technically another such case where "maybe". No canon printed fera beyond rank 6 exists afaik.

File: 1000048621.jpg (496 KB, 1079x962)

496 KB JPG

>>98332424
>>98301860
>>98300997
>was able to achieve her goal of transcending vampirism.
>ran on a beach while the sun was coming up
>to emulate Lilith's exile
>regained her heartbeat, was able to eat and drink regular food (no nourishment), and was able to reproduce
Nice result after a long game. I never fuck with Sunlight so getting willingly exposed demonstrates commitment to her oath of learning through suffering
>side effect of my shenanigans was my packmates regaining the ability to reproduce
Imagine the pregnancy scares
>stick together "for the children"
>she was beginning to research into how the baali reembrace works so she could convert other vampires into "Liliums".
Fascinating. What would her Liliums have been like? Really goes well with the thematic aspect of the Dark Mother and giving birth to monsters. Though been able to get pregnant/give birth sounds like it could have send all sorts of Gehenna signs and be a bad omen on Aeria. Can't imagine the rest of the Sabbat would've been too happy to know it. Good use of Viscissitude to hide it
>What generation is Lily? By the end of the chronicle, Aeria managed to eat her way up to 8th
9th from an older sire that just woke up and needed a new link to the strange times of modernity, and appreciates her interest in observing change in nature and in life. Lily is still on Humanity but her sire thinks it's just a matter of time until she goes on to pursue Metamorphosis
Also how does she feel about the Tremere? Aeria is technically a Tremere Caitiff
>her blood refracted which is why my ST let her start with Vicissitude and Obeah.
Interesting spread, I imagine it led to all sorts of curious situations. Lily hasn't inherited her clan's vitriolic hate of Tremere, but has already torn apart one that tried to experiment with a "Fear Engine" within her home city. The Chantry hasn't figured out the culprit yet though
>They really would enjoy discussing biology and philosophy together.
They would! Yeah IRL is crazy

>>98338980
The W5 Rage meter looks really awkward because you can be at 2 Rage, be thrown into a fight, try to turn into Crinos form, and basically have a 25% chance to be locked into human form and lose all access to your Gifts, even ones that don't cost a check, until you next see your phase of the moon in the sky. But maybe in practical play this ends up being an edge case.
And the V5 hunger meter seems similarly worrisome. Especially because it's effectively one box shorter unless you're willing to kill someone.

>>98342005
It would make sense for ranks 7, 8 and 9 to be a thing, because woofs are the only splat that doesn’t have a demigod form in the vein of low gen elders and archmages. But you’re right that there’s nothing official about it, though it would be a cool idea for a STV book

>>98342005
IIRC even what rank 6 entailed was storyteller fiat for the most part, rules wise.

>>98342046
I wholeheartedly agree and I think about this sometimes. We've got 9 tail Kitsune, Immortal Bubasti Elders and the extra layers of the Labyrinth. We've got Ancestor Spirits. We've got a singular? mummy Garou. We've got shit like the first Metis, but even he hasn't the same sorts of stats/skills as a Methuselah or Antediluvian, making him look like a fucking cuck, despite his age.
My own take would be to elevate characters like the first Metis to Methuselah level with skills/attributes in the 5-10 range first of all. Gifts beyond level 6 are a bit tricky as level 6 gifts are already fucked. Far more fucked than a Level 6 discipline.
So for genuinely immortal and old as fuck Fera such as Kitsune/Bastet Sorcerers/Mokole/Whatever else, I'd genuinely just crank the gift list, crank the skills, crank the attributes, crank the backgrounds and only then would I go for gifts beyond rank 6.

File: 1783696715971279.jpg (75 KB, 667x840)

75 KB JPG

>you leave your haven
>look around
>see picture related
What do?

>>98341449
My brother. On the plus side, I've learned a lot about pre-imperial China and its mytho-history. Fascinating stuff, and like the Trojan war, probably rooted in real events but with thousands of years of telephone and self-aggrandizement. Not to mention modern academia has its own biases.

>>98342194
I thank whomever sent this bitch my way before using Protean 4 and giving here exactly what she is asking for only to die horribly because I was too horny to not see the most obvious lure in the history of the Canite race.

If you had to give each splat an "inventory power" how would you go about it?

>>98342222
Vampire pumpkin carts. It's folkloric!
They'd work like that one D&D magic item that's a castle you can keep in your pocket. But a pumpkin that turns into a cart where you can keep your stuff.

>>98342222
W20 has two versions of these, the level one fetish Magpie's Swag and level two Spider's Satchel. The first version can't carry complex "Weaver" items like guns.
Also, depending on how you read the Ritual of Pants, you can't make a backpack necessarily bigger on the inside, but when it melds into your transformed state anything inside melds with it

>>98342222
the old rift discipline seems like it could do heavy lifting for both versions of vampires, unseelie ctd fae and beast

just put that car into your personal nightmare dimension bro what could go wrong

What are some things you've offered a spirit, to agree to be permanently bound to a fetish?

File: 1779095984443942.jpg (571 KB, 2387x3176)

571 KB JPG

>>98342392
I offer them some good times.

>>98342450
I think this is something you can get away with sometimes, like promising a war spirit many opportunities to taste blood if it gets in the Glaive.
But it can't always be that easy, right?

>>98342514
how about Tyrfing's "you don't get to sheathed me again till you kill someone or you'll doom yourself"? as less easy version of that

>>98342392
a fine enough vessel that will make the other spirits jealous

>>98342392
Offered? Agreed? The ways of insipid and meek. Any spirit should know there is no greater honor than to be of service to Gaia. Even greater still to be in service to her most devoted soldiers. And those among Grandfather Thunder’s chosen know power when they see it, so any Spirit should be grateful we deem them worthy of aiding us in our fight against the Wyrm. We know how best utilize even the most unwilling Spirits for Gaia’s sake. Such is the way of the mighty and powerful. All for Gaia, of course.

>>98342392
It's continued (albeit reduced and subservient) existence. If that umbrood did not wish to be bound into my experimental talisman paperweight collection, it should have taken greater care not to expose it's true name to another willworker. I am merely using what another man had pre-negotiated two-thousand years ago.
>>98342637
I don't know what this has to do with the Anima Mundi or Dragons but so trve. These spirits ought be honored to serve the Order of Hermes.

File: IMG_2685.jpg (128 KB, 1280x572)

128 KB JPG

Is the Onceler a Pentex executive or a Syndicate Associate of the Special Projects Division?
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=BXlYuaycRbU
>Twink makes the Garou seethe and mald

Ideal breast size for kindred(female)?

>>98342740
Big enough to keep the stake from penetrating

File: ALRIGHT, LISTEN TO ME YOU(...).png (742 KB, 800x800)

742 KB PNG

>>98342776
>…I'm gonna build you a pair of runic mechanical boobs, and use surgical precision to sew them onto your chest, where your bosom ought to be, just so I can slap with with my iron fucking hand you twat!

Side question: would it take pure maxed Charisma, or do you need some additional (Prime+)Mind effect to deliver a speech like that, which reduces it's target to a metaphorical smear on the floor?

File: IMG_2654.png (555 KB, 633x835)

555 KB PNG

>The Backrooms falls under the Void Engineers’ purview
>You Awaken
>Instead of high-octane space battles, fighting ghosts, or exploring untapped and mythical biomes, you get to map out glorified office space

>>98341269
Yeah, he visited me once too...

>>98342915
>mission log day 27
>still haven't mapped out the liminal space known as "back rooms"
>found and killed the 15th unique reality deviant today
>and the 4rd etherite generator... we gave up trying to figure out what they even drain from this place
>had contact with a werewolf yesterday. subject was supringly not hostle. claimed to also be stuck in this place. we euthanized it
>lost agent johnson. didn't see him getting killed or anything he is just gone
>according to my log i already did a log for day 27 but that can't be true
>i want to go back to the pools

>>98342776
technically you should be able to enchant breast implants which would include the ritual that protects against stakes or all wood if you know a friendly mummy pun intended

>>98342950
What self-respecting Cainite allows itself to be indebted to someone who isn't even kind? Better to be staked.

>>98338938
>>98339092
>>98339700
>>98342195
Oh, and on the subject of "To be a Cainite or not to be a Cainite", I have a modest proposal:

The Caine story could believed by Kindred in areas where Abrahamic religious are prevalent.
HOWEVER!!!
A Flood Myth is found in maaaany more cultures across the world.
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of_flood_myths
Meaning, my headcanon or Vampire 666th Edition can still have Antediluvians even the Caine story is treated as a myth, unimportant, noncanonical, or it is disbelieved.
Or you could have an universal "Dark Father Myth" which identifies him as the Biblical Caine in this location and with somebody else in other areas.

File: average Void Engineers ch(...).png (772 KB, 1013x677)

772 KB PNG

>>98342915
>there seems to be a mistake! I was supposed to explore outer space and witness the beauty of the galaxy!
>"GRAB THE FUCKING PLASMA RIFLE!"

>>98341883
We know based on one of their powers' description that they have home dimension of pure darkness, and vampires are able to stay there if a Strix opens a portal. We also know based on the Synthesis power's description that they can create new vampires from corpses, even if they never encountered a vampire before.
So I think the implication was that they're just natives of that realm (a Lower Depth according to mages), and they created all the clans with Synthesis.

>>98342671
SPD, a pentex executive wouldn't have any regrets and all those things he sold would be detrimental to you (besides the pollution required to make them)

>>98343062
I was thinking of having Caine be perhaps only one origin, similar to Requiem 1e. I'd go a step further and say that the third generation are all technically the first "true" vampires, and the legendary second generations are actually various entities or phenomenon that are directly responsible for creating vampires. Which would by extension mean Caine himself isn't a proper vampire, but IIRC the Book of Nod posits that he's actually a fallen Mage and never explicitly says that he died. I don't know if that's taking things too far, though.

File: 1754609622468057.jpg (366 KB, 640x853)

366 KB JPG

Do you run your V20 chronicles in modern day, modern time or in the 1990s? I'm a 29yo yuropoor zoomer so I need tips on making the 90s feel genuine for my first chronicle based around Chicago area.

>>98342392
I killed your champion whom you possessed after losing everything before that, get in the fucking object before I conceptually erase you with Spirit, Prime, and Correspondence.

File: 1509644278953.jpg (172 KB, 900x1200)

172 KB JPG

>>98342915
The only thing that makes the union and full of character is that exact contrast of will and wonder with deciding to use those to force mundanity

>>98342915
Welcome to the janny convention. Clean it up.

File: ultimate astronaut meme.jpg (125 KB, 843x474)

125 KB JPG

>>98342915
>high-octane space battles
WoD space fucking sucks though, you should be glad to have a boring dimension to explore
>Void Engineers Convention Revised
>Iterator stows away on Voidship bound to Mercury
>friendly Technocratic banter, typical "you don't understand the dangers of outer space" Voider talk while the Iterator autistically keeps asking "Autochthonia when?"
>fucking Threat Null shows up
>“I’m getting… why am I getting software upgrade notifications?” the Iterator asks, then her eyes widen as she tabs open the source code. I can see it all spooling past her astonished face. “It’s… it’s beautiful, Chris.”
>“Shut it down, Corporal!” I shout at her, grabbing at her arm and shaking her. “Cut your comms before they—”
>I grab the lip of Silver’s helmet and pull her face close to mine. “Jessica, cut off—”
>But her eyes are wild with excitement and she has a giddy, disbelieving smile on her face. “They came for me, Chris. They came for me—”
>She doesn’t say anything more, nor does she slide any farther into madness, because I put two bullets in her head
shooting your friends in the head, do you think those VE feel like space heroes yet?

>>98343424
If the rest of the Technocracy were reasonable enough that they could handle being told their mind procedures left them all with a backdoor then they wouldn't have to do that.

>>98343128
I usually run things in the 2020s but most of the time the period doesn't matter. If I ran other game lines like Werewolf or Vampire I might ask them to roll to see how well they cover their tracks.

>>98342328
What book was that from? I forget the title.
>>98342323
Being able to grab anything you can put inside a backpack out your fur coat seams pretty useful. The main question is if you can store things as easily.
>>98342273
Lol, what?

>>98342915
Nah, the backrooms are an overlap between the Labyrinth and the Digital Web. The only reason anybody gives a shit about it is how frequently fandoms get stuck there because there fuck all requirements to enter.

On a similar note, do any of the levels interest you as their own horizon realms? There's about a thousand of them but most of them sounds incredibly useless when other similar gimmicks are available.

>mfw still remember when the backrooms were just a subtly disturbing self-contained piece of short fiction, i.e. the original meaning of creepypasta
Social media and clickbait grifters ruin everything.

>>98342915
>conventionkeks when they can't dump 3 dots into spirit to step sideways

File: 1000036934.jpg (165 KB, 1214x666)

165 KB JPG

>>98343973
If I were the guy that posted the original bit I'd be at least mildly upset my shitposts on /x/ were now a full theatrical film without me seeing a cent

File: file.png (51 KB, 516x209)

51 KB PNG

>>98344273
>can't
lmaoing at the traditioncuck thinking he's safe not knowing they literally can

>>98344328
the premise of the backrooms doesn't work if technocrats can just leave at any time

>>98344522
Well, they can't just leave at any time. They're not just mages but cooler, they require technological explanations for everything they do. If they want to step sideways, they require some sort of hypertech that 'logically' explains why they're able to hop from one dimension to another, while some buttfuck evangelical Chorister can just say ten Hail Marys while spinning in a circle and when he stops spinning, he's suddenly in front Saint Peter at the pearly gates.

>>98341706
This is all speculation and hypothesising, but Spirits want to become more of what they embody. If they spread out and absorb essence from sources that don't match they become insane mutants (whose name escapes me). Maybe as Stone-Age hunter killers, the Strix truly were in their element. There isn't a strict timeline to my knowledge, but if Father Wolf was slain by the Forsaken around this time, you could allude to some correlation/causation there, with the Strix longing for the simpler Stone Age times as humanity advanced without them.

Kindred existing (from whatever source), and seeming to embody everything the Strix love, but hamstringing themselves with little baby feelings and angst, would really piss them off even more. The Strix were this close to having a ready source of Essence, and the Kindred fucked it.

>>98341464
I do like them, but I think the Strix are probably my least favourite of the in-house intended antagonists of the CofD lines (at least that I've read). Slashers #1 baby.

>>98344328
Wait till he finds out about the Dimension Bomb procedure

File: throwing dimensional grenade.png (345 KB, 397x1053)

345 KB PNG

stepping sideways?
>*throws grenade sideways*

>>98344675
This is why I never leave home without my trusty dedicated grenade bat

>>98344675
With enough succesess you could throw an ICBM at them

>>98344560
>and the Kindred fucked it.
I don't know what else you expected. That's kind of what they do.

>>98344683
This reminds me of the book (I think it was Compacts & Conspiracies) that mentions Taskforce Valkyrie has spirit briefcase nukes they sometimes lob into loci when they want to go full scorched earth.

File: King-of-the-Hill-053025-a(...).jpg (109 KB, 1500x1000)

109 KB JPG

>>98339182
I imagine Hank trying to adjust to his new unlife, trying to convince his boss to have him working at night and his friends to hang out later.
He'd really dislike that he has to feed on humans since he's quite averse to personal contact. I'm not sure if he'd chose to feed on his wife or friends(Bill would gladly offer his blood to him) or try to go for a wider selection. He'd also have to say goodbye to drinking beer and enjoying a well made propane cooked steak.
Dale would definitely get suspicious of him but think it's something completely different happening. He might become Imbued either way.

Also I feel like his dad has definitely come across the supernatural multiple times during the war and is at least knowledgable enough to being able to tell which clan a vampire's from from a glance.

>>98344955
I'm sure he would eventually figure out how to feed on animals.

>>98344955
There's a trick to making drinkable alcohol for kindred. A level one ritual, so he'd have to be taught how to do it. Would Hank be willing to learn how to make his own beer if he couldn't buy it anymore? It seems like the kind of thing he'd get way too into; Hank has a lot of special interests throughout the show, so long as he thinks they're appropriately manly.

>>98339182
>>98340054
>John Redcorn is a kinfolk
>his son becomes a garou on puberty

>>98340054
What about Cotton?

>>98343128
>Do you run your V20 chronicles in modern day, modern time or in the 1990s?
My Chronicle is planned for the 1980's. It's old enough to avoid a lot of "uhm ackshually" and set before the metaplot stuff got overly stupid, while also being the origin for a lot of VtM tropes in popular culture (Lost Boys, etc.)
>I'm a 29yo yuropoor zoomer so I need tips on making the 90s feel genuine for my first chronicle based around Chicago area.
I'm 40 (oh god) now, and even though I lived in and grew up in the 90's, the fact that I did only makes it harder to really pin things down beyond very superficial aesthetics, because when I think about any one thing, the details become overwhelming and a lot of "oh, and also...".

My best advice is to actually watch films and TV-shows from the era. Yes, this gives a flawed view, but ultimately what you actually want is not detailed fidelity, but to capture feelings and aesthetics and vibes, and those were created by pop culture that's largely represented in media; far moreso than today, I would say.

So start with Ghost, Prince of Thieves, Hot Shots!, and Cape Fear, and finish with The Matrix and The Mummy. Highlander is a must. Many big shows, too; Married with Children and Family Matters are classic 90's shows, even set in Chicago, albeit mostly based around home life.

Really, there's so much.

>>98345637
Test. Because 4chang said I was banned at first, but I cannot fathom why. I suspect trannyjanny got triggered by a nothingburger.

>>98343563
Backrooms are just parts of the Spiral Labyrinth the Weaver tried to board up

>>98344955
You'se a Kuei Jin, ain't cha Mr. Kahn?

Alright. Im sorry for not posting sooner, but I think I got caught in the crossfire of trannyjanny's wrath.

We've got the Mummy Shadow Government
We've got the Earthbound Deep State
We've got the Technobro Sorcerer Illuminati. Not sure why they would want a total surveillance state, but they are gonna be guys who worship an AI spirit & seek to gather everyone's personal data for arcane reasons.

DC itself is its own Necropolis. Most Wraith & such dont mess with it as the politics & shadow war is usually too much trouble.

What else should I be working on?

File: 1702698572791104.png (502 KB, 665x577)

502 KB PNG

>>98343062
This is somewhat how I want to treat the drowned legacies/an unknown methuselah in my chronicle, if it ever becomes relevant (the players may never interact with things).

Basically, they are implied to have fled the sinking of Atlantis, and taken refuge in the Americas, subjugating the natives and endowing them with civilization (i.e. layong the foundations the Mayans, Incans, and the Aztecs).

They believe(d) in the antediluvians, but to them the flood was the sinking of Atlantis, and they do not care about whatever "Caine" you're on about.

Whether "Atlantis" is the Atlantis of Plato or if it was the First Citynof Enoch or the Unnamed Second city is under all circumstances meant to be left unanswered and ambigious.

>>98345705
>Basically, they are implied to have fled the sinking of Atlantis, and taken refuge in the Americas, subjugating the natives and endowing them with civilization (i.e. layong the foundations the Mayans, Incans, and the Aztecs).
Does this Methuselah have anything to do with the Tlacique and Pisanob (Potchli)?

>>98341986
>Why does the Wyrm offer better shit than everyone else combined?
Because infernalism has to have the best stuff to be tempting
>>98342046
>>98342005
>No canon printed fera beyond rank 6 exists afaik.
There are canon Fetishes of ranks 7 and 8 though, which confirms those ranks do actually exist.

What's the point of the game having rules for technocrat variant spheres when they basically do the exact same thing as regular spheres, barring syndicate mages being able to suck up quintessence from businesses? I don't mind different groups understanding the same spheres differently under different names, I like that a lot actually, I just feel like you can just have the few thing variant spheres do differently just be technocratic rotes. It just needlessly complicates everything.

>>98345646
Truly one must accept the punishment with the rewards when it comes to Brujah-posting

>>98345815
The problem with Mage in my opinion is that Spheres are retarded. Foundations & Pillars are much more elegant, & if you want to wright Magic as a reality war youve GOT to get more weird with your rules & mechanics. If I believe the world runs on Looney Tunes logic, I should be working with rules on timing the gags right & genre conventions. Me painting an X on the floor isnt an expression of Correspondence or Forces, its gonna rely on expectation & humor. If I think the world runs on tech knowledge we can substitute physics, but if I think the world is a simulation video game then I need rules for No Clipping. In the same mindset, a Mage who clips through the polygons of the floor, would not exactly be in the same place when a Mage who uses elemental earth magic tries to tunnel after him

>>98345811
I'd assume any Garou above rank 7 would have to be basically an 80 year old cripple

>>98345916
Not really. Age has littld to nothing to do with rank. Higher rank garou are more likely to be older since they'll have had more time to gain renown, but it's also possible to have cliath in his 80's working for a rank 6 legend that's only recently turned 25.

>>98345916
Nah, Garou can live up to 120 so that's the equivalent of a 56 year old still gang banging.

>>98345910
The thing to remember with mage is that the Sphere sysyem isn't the actual rules, it's an in-universe meta-paradigm the order of hermes developed for translating ideas between multiple mage paradigms.
There are actual modern mages that still use foundation and pillars, they're just more likely to get hit by paradox in modern times since they aren't abusing a backdoor metaphysics hack in the technocratic paradigm(which only exists because the order of reason used the same meta-paradigm as the order of hermes).

>>98345661
That sounds like an interesting prospect.

>>98345940
>>98345961
My line of thinking was between the feats required and the overall violence of the life, rank 6s already have more than a couple of scars so rank 7s and above, if they exist, must have quite a lot more, since the ranks are at least somewhat exponential in terms of requirements.

>Once past the Horizon, most Engineers find it necessary to use sealed suits or ships to breathe and avoid explosive decompression, even if Tradition mages do not. When different travellers meet, the result is often incongruities, as when an armored and suited space marine crosses the "cold and lifeless" surface of Europa, only to find a naked Dreamspeaker sitting by a fire.
VEbros....

File: amobius.png (215 KB, 767x581)

215 KB PNG

>>98345910
it just werks with 3 spheres per resonance tying into the triat, 1 seat for each major paradigm giving a specialty sphere and the 10th sphere correlating to wholeness and rebirth in numerology

>>98346061
>Think you're going to find an alien
>It's actually just a naked gooner astral projecting after he took a tab of LSD
How do you even recover from this?

>>98346065
I don't know about you anon, but having to awkwardly cram multiple spheres into 2 corners while the rest have 1 sphere each may be a sign the paradigm is just factually wrong.

I support the Kuei-Jin because sorcerous vampire martial artists from Grorious Nippon are cool.

>>98346109
Facts. Their system is clunky as hell, but it's clear there was actual autistic love put into it.
It's leagues better than the "streamlined" normie slop of nu-wolf

>>98343127
Something I've thought about, is a campaign involving a protracted battle against some sort of colony of monsters, and as the fight goes on, successive generations of monster become more and more vampiric. That idea is based on the lore you're talking about

>>98346065
See how the little circle is so lopsided? Thats how you know its stupid. Pillars & Foundation is kino.

>>98345966
But Spheres are how you interact with magic. Paradigm just becomes set dressing, it doesnt actually effect anything, you just swap "wand" for "amulet" or "gizmo" or "computer program". Its bad design to represent actual paradigm differences. One could easily create "Modern" Pillars & Foundations for the Technocracy. The great thing about Pillars is they only need to make sense to the function of the Foundation. Like if your Foundation is Nature & your Pillars are the Seasons, you use Summer heat to create fire, meanwhile the Technocrat is using Metaphysics to vibrate molecules to create fire. Except the Nature guy can also use Summer to excite emotions of rage, while the Technocrat would need to use a different Pillar like "Psionics" or something. Pillars allow for different thinking, flexible thought & thematic sympathy. Spheres have no such flexibility. Everything is Sphere + Sphere, now justify how your paradigm makes it happen. Meanwhile Pillars are "My pillar gives me purview over this & that so I manipulate it to be so.

>>98346069
Shotgun applied directly to the forehead of the gooner

>>98345592
a Wraith and he meets the fitty men he killed.

>>98346061
Obvious EDE influence, better to put him down.

>>98345374
he could just drink from someone that has drank beer. you can get the full effects of any drug someone has taken if you feed off them, even drugs that dont enter the blood stream or low concentrations because its a mystical thing.

>>98346134
>But Spheres are how you interact with magic.
And they are a paradigm. Sphere's also aren't the only way paradigms determine mechanics, another example is instruments.
The number of instruments you use and how they function is entirely up to paradigm. A dream speaker could require hours long drum sessions as their instrument, while a verbena could use the act of inflicting violence in a round as hers. A hermetic could have thousands of instruments specific to every rote he knows, while a son of ether might have a small handful of drugs, mental exercises, and psychic amplifiers.
Paradigm also informs resonance and what resonances your mage will benefit from(as long as you aren't using the retarded Mage 20 resonance rules anyway).

If you want to use pillars though, then just use a pillar mage in modern times. They get double paradox because the technocracy screwed them, but their magic still works in modern times.

>>98344275
my first introduction to WoD was someone saying its basically what if everything on /x/ was true. so i can se the backrooms working quite well. creepypastas might also make for good horror inspirations

File: angle.jpg (51 KB, 396x524)

51 KB JPG

>>98343062
Yeah that works for me. Flood myths are really common, you can have non-Abrahamic religion influenced cultures have their own "version" of how shit went down in the dawn of time without being completely right or wrong.

Also, this discussion has me pondering something. How blasphemous are you anons willing to go at your table? Are you willing to imply or even plainly state that IRL religions are wrong, not only in the details, but in their foundations? Do you go soft on any in particular or do you try to keep it equal?

>>98345811
>There are canon Fetishes of ranks 7 and 8 though, which confirms those ranks do actually exist.
Really? What do they do?

>>98346190
>Sphere's also aren't the only way paradigms determine mechanics
Anon, most people don't actually read the mage rules very closely and most groups tend to run there characters on "purple paradigm with flavor text" as a result.

>>98346198
Two of the three belonged to the croatan(fuckers were appearantly OP), One permanently increased any caern's rank by one and made it not just immunr to wyrm taint, but Impossible for anything tainted by the wyrm to even enter so long as the fetish was there. The other was a weapon that destroyed everything in (number of successes) miles with massive earthquakes one use.

The third was an artifact of the First Moot that allowed the user to command any garou, black spirals included.

>>98346136
A shotgun? In space?

>>98346199
to be fair doing anything else is incredibly hard and also feels kind of bad and arbitrary in actual gameplay. There's a reason it's so common, and that's because actually engaging with it otherwise has so many complications.

>>98346265
its literally just chaos magick larp, the rules are to supplement that and make sure no jackass trys to kill God (too early). be an autistic about some pagan religion made up or otherwise and you are doing it right, like explain in detail how your instruments and foci work and why the do what they do or actually bring props.

>>98343544
In Balkan vampire lore pumpkins and watermelons could be turned, after which they'd become animate and crave blood.
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Vampire_pumpkins_and_watermelons

>>98346198
Level 9 makes Anime real.

>>98346289
This isn't the problem. I was talking specifically about paradigms interacting with mechanics. The problem is deciding for example, that a dreamspeaker needs to drum for an hour to call a spirit, whilst a verbena can do it with one slit of her wrist. Or that a hermetic needs to draw one thousand geometric circles to ever throw a fireball, whilst a son of ether can have a fireballer-3000 that is always coincidental.
There is basically 0 guidelines on this shit so one player can quickly feel completely shafted.

>>98346300
Anon, it's World of Darkness. Anime is already real there.
Level 9 just makes you into an incarnae, both the labrynth and kirsune function that way.

>>98342016
>Imagine the pregnancy scares
My friends all made murderhobos so it was never really a problem for them. They gleefully abandoned the human condition and only tolerated me due to the vinculum.
>What would her Liliums have been like?
Ideally they would have been "true dhampirs" instead of the vampire born revenants VtM has. The problem was if she embraced someone then they would still be a cainite with a chance to obtain her gifts (ST would roll 1 dice each for eating/drinking, heartbeat, and reproduction. If a roll came up less than 7 then they didnt inherit the trait) while children she gave birth to were "true dhampirs" with the ability to go out in the sun albeit disciplines were unusable in the daylight. I regretfully had to resign myself to making childer the kine way.
>all sorts of Gehenna signs and be a bad omen on Aeria. Can't imagine the rest of the Sabbat would've been too happy to know it. Good use of Viscissitude to hide it
100%. The only people she could trust were other bahari. My table told me out of character that if they ever found the child they would eat it without hesitation. Had the sabbat caught wind of her shenanigans she would have been labeled an infernalist and hunted down with extreme prejudice.
>Lily is still on Humanity but her sire thinks it's just a matter of time until she goes on to pursue Metamorphosis
Personally the main issue Ive had with the path of metamorphosis is the fact it punishes you for collaborating with others. Too individualistic for my tastes.
>The Chantry hasn't figured out the culprit yet though
Good... good...

Sorry for the late response, I went to go see Jackass with my friends last night and havent had a chance to really reply until now.

>>98346306
>There is basically 0 guidelines on this shit so one player can quickly feel completely shafted.
The original way they tried to semi-balance it in 1e and 2e was giving the more shafted tradition paradigms benefits only their tradition had. Hermetics could make themselves pretty much immune to enemy correspondance mage, akashiks had a super martial art that let the soak and deal lethal damage, the Chorus had True Faith, and dreamspeakers could take totems and make paradox-free fetishes.
20th completely dropped all of that thpugh.

I need hedge musk…..
Please……..

>>98346335
akashics are like the least cucked of all paradigms, they just go BREATHE IN BREATHE OUT. DRAGON EMPEROR BALL BUSTER! and then they explode you. I don't even know how all those other ones rank and I doubt they're like, truly an attempt at balancing the paradigms so much as they are trying to make them unique. Which frankly, I'd just keep for 20th? Yeah true faith is way more common in the choristers, totem in the dreamspeakers, the hermetics have some funky rituals you only get to access at chargen because of how comparatively institutional they are. I think Do is still in 20th, too?

>>98346335
>Hermetics could make themselves pretty much immune to enemy correspondance mage, akashiks had a super martial art that let the soak and deal lethal damage, the Chorus had True Faith, and dreamspeakers could take totems and make paradox-free fetishes.
You could also gain all those benefits at the same time by buying 2 merits and a background at character gen.

>>98346352
>akashics are like the least cucked of all paradigms
akashics in old editions needed to meditate for chi and couldn't do any magic if they didn't so if you suprised a akashics who didn't had enough chi at that moment he "only" had super martial arts without direct magic

>>98346194
For me, my own personal idea of Christianity is Truth & anything else is just lies or misinterpretation.

Like Cain(e) & Abel are Truth. Stuff like Gilgamesh & Enkidu & several other myths are an aberration/derivitive of them. I also play up Serpents & Infernalism connections. If it slithers, its somehow tied back to Lucifer &/or Lillith, who are the World of Darkness' worst power couple, because I love Chaoskampf themes.

>>98346247
Electronic firing metalstorm variant

>>98346290
Neat.

>>98346190

You are missing my point. Drumming for an hour or whatever doesnt matter. Its set dressing. You can replace a drum solo with chanting the names of the saints, or any other bullshit. The game mechanics say that your spell is x Forces & x Correspondance, no matter if you wave a wand, slit a wrist, or do beat poetry. Its fucking stupid. Everyone plays by the same mechanics but wear different clothes. Pillars shakes things up. Pillars group your spells & abilities in different ways. It creates different ways of approaching your magic & makes you think differently about how the mechanics operate.

And I do run Pillars in modern times & I dont run them with stupid fucking handicaps because why the fuck would I?

>>98346190
not him but
>hours long drum sessions as their instrument
not ritual? I'm still pretty new to this and got a shit-ass memory
like, couldn't he in-the-moment still strike the drum with a paraddidle or some shit with his hand or whatever he needed with the intent of exploding some tzimisce eating babies in front of him to explode?

>>98346432
yeah you could do that or just say you did the drum session before and prepared the spell like a d&d wizard

nta but speaking of. how hard would it be to port pillars and foundations into the cofd dice engine?

from what i can see it shouldn't all that hard right? dark age mage uses foundation + highest pillar, like the arete + highest sphere optional rule from mage as standard and we have a offical mage to mage and back conversion guide

or am i missing something?

>>98346414
>You are missing my point.
No anon, you are the one missing the point. Paradigm is supposed to determine if you can use your instruments in specific situations. The reason the drum shit matters isn't the drums, it's the fact the dreamspeakers fast-casts at +1 difficulty because his instruments are impossible to use that way. The hermetic is stuck with a shit ton of instruments even at high arete when the etherite has already dropped all of his. Paradigm also determines which resonances will give you a +1 or -1 to difficulty, this shit accumulates.

The overall mechanical effect is that paradigm makes it so that the same spell will be difficulty 4 for one mage and difficulty 10 for another depending on the situation.

>>98346440
>am i missing something?
You're also missing the foundation capstones. Depending on how many pillars a practice has, they get bonus abilities at certain dots of foundation.(like hermetics getting to spend 2 willpower a turn insyead of 1)
Paradigms with only 4 or 5 pillars have a capstone at foundation 5
While paradohms with more pillats(and thus higher xp requirements) have capstone at 4 and 5 dots of foundation.

>>98346441
>the hermetic is stuck with a shit ton of instruments
huh? he has just as many as a dreamspeaker. Not every circle is an unique instrument. They are all under the group of hermetic pentacles or whatever you want to call it.
But I agree about the broader point with how drums suck and the best instrument is willworking/mental exertion.

To truly balance this we'd have to make a huge fucking system for picking your instruments and linking them to rotes and we are already scaring off the normies with mage.

>>98346461
>we are already scaring off the normies with mage.
Anon I already play mage, you don't have to keep selling me on it.

>>98339908
>The Wyrm really offers a fucking convincing benefits package doesn't it...
Which infernal power grants the best job benefits package?

Everybody be thinking they’re gangsta until the Akashic pulls out the
>Omae Wa Mou Shindeiru rote

>>98346458
looking at them most of them read like just merit like effects that also shouldn't be too hard to port

thanks for the answer by the way

Got I love CTL. It's so fun

>>98339908
How can Gaia even compete? Except for the lack of rape.

>>98346504
>Except for the lack of rape.
...Have you read the kinfolk books anon?
The rape is very much mandatory in with many of gaia's finest.

>>98346441
Jesus Fuck dude.

This is you missing the fucking point. Right here. You are thinking that the ritual of casting the spell matters. It doesnt. It is fucking irrelevant to what I am talking about.

ALL MAGIC IN MAGE IS MEASURED AS THE SAME COMBINATION OF SPHERES WITH VERY LITTLE DEVIATION. Mechanically ALL MAGES use the same magic system with all the same parts.

Pillars shuffle everything up. Like in my previous example a mage using Summer can effect emotions (in mage this would be Mind) as well as summoning fire (in mage this would be Forces) but they limit themselves to fiery emotions & fire elemental damage while only buying one pillar. Meanwhile, a mage using a different Foundation would have to buy separate pillars for each effect, but would have a broader range of elemental damage & mental effects.

I do not care what pantomime bullshit the different modern mages need need to do to justify their Spirit ** Prime *** spell. Im arguing against Spheres not paradigms

>>98341309
>Idk, like instead of the broad array of mind control options of a vampire they have more focused ones like inducing Hate instead of any emotion? It's probably a bad example we may not want, but it should help get the point across and I'm not in the right headspace to come up with good examples right now
Maybe other than direct possession, they don't have mind control powers. That being said, they probably DO know your greatest fears and desires, so they can use that as leverage against you or to make illusions have more of an impact.

File: ChangelingTheDreaming.jpg (75 KB, 466x659)

75 KB JPG

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=0ekRPx90A9I

Yeah, just because someone does not look like me
Doesn't mean they are a clone or a sheep
Maybe they like their job and they're living their dream
And they love their friends and their family
Yeah, some people thrive between nine and five
And feel like they're choking if their neck's not tied
And some people feel as if they're gonna die if
Their seams aren't straight and their shoes not tied

>>98346532
NTA, but you haven't made a single coherent point.
You first said pillars are better than spheres and wish modern mages could use pillars. An anon told you there are still pillar mages in modern times and that there are already rules for playing one.
You went off about how paradigms don't have mechanical effects and an anon pointed out that if paradigms aren't mechanically relevant in your games, then you've been playing the game wrong by overlooking the instrument and resonance rules.
Now you're throwing a tantrum about how everyone is missing your point, while completely missing the fact you're the only one here who hasn't understood the conversation.

>>98346504
>How can Gaia even compete?
They don't vompete. Gaia is losing. It's in the game's title anon, Werewolf: the APOCALYPSE.

>>98346557
>It's in the game's title anon, Werewolf: the APOCALYPSE.
What is being revealed though?

Got I hate CTL. It's so gay

>>98346483
>Which infernal power grants the best job benefits package?
Probably high umbral demons, since you can make as many pacts as you want so long as you never make a soul pact.
Earthbound are the next best, so long as you never deal with the same one 3 times.
Dark Ages Devils are the 3rd, since you can become a demon lord yourself.
The Wyrm mostly give benefots to fera and kinfolk. Fomori benefits are available to both.
Yama Kings have a hard limit on how much you can get.
Oblivion get's you nothing you can't steal yourself.
Fallen are the worst since you get enslaved for crumbs

Are true fae evil or just autistic?

>>98346584
Neither, they're ultimately solipsistic retards who also happen to be godlike in power.

>>98345698
That's already quite a lot! Just work on making it work.

>>98346597
So autistic?

My toreador art hoe just got a gig with a mage, but she's kinda scared this is a trap. What do?

>>98346582
>Yama Kings have a hard limit on how much you can get.
Not if you sell them other peoples souls. The tricky part then becomes getting the souls at that point.
Generally, only vampires and human sorcerers have powers that let them claim ownership of human souls. So if you're not one of those, you're out of luck.

In theory, you could befriend a True Fae if their narrative theme is more benign than not, it would just be tedious to navigate their whims, and taxing on one’s patience. Also very dangerous.

Again, very much like Roger the Alien.

>>98346606
Blood bond the fucker

I would really rather not befriend the Cat in the Hat.

>>98346609
>and human sorcerers
Humanity remains undefeated on the "Destroying Humanity" leaderboard.

>>98346562
The extreme fraudulence of spirits and Gaia at large, I suppose.

In theory, you could befriend an Archmage if their hubris didn’t involve you in its orbit. You just have to hope your entire life isn’t just some small little ingredient in their cosmic experimenting.

>>98346516
The kinfolk book makes it clear it's a big honor and that, except for the older Garou who larp like it's the middle ages, no one's going around raping the kinfolk. Except for the Shadow Lords I suppose.

>>98346604
Yes.

Question: why is being a sorcerer considered "bad" in wod?

File: images.jpg (34 KB, 272x367)

34 KB JPG

When you were partying, I studied the blade. When you were having premarital sex, I mastered the blockchain. While you wasted your days at the gym in pursuit of vanity, I cultivated inner strength. And now that the world is on fire and the barbarians are at the gate you have the audacity to come to me for help.

>>98346604
If you had superpowers you would act like true fae yes.
>>98346632
This is only for Hermetics, Akashics will treat you like a side character in DBZ who gets murdered by space mecha Hitler for the main character to have a power up instead.

>>98346630
We're Trying Okay! There's 8 billion of the fuckers and a few thousand of Us! IT'S NOT FUCKING FAIR!

>>98346632
Just be the Archmage's Fatty Wang