>>98393724
That explains the necromancy but the rest is presumably all him.
>>98393905
Yeah but they weren't magnitudes stronger than that when they were 500 is the thing.

>>98393826
>Yeah but they weren't magnitudes stronger than that when they were 500 is the thing.
There is absolutely no way to know. Some are implied to have been true mages and/or sorcerers and all kinds of shit, nevermind being from ages of legend when people like Gilgamesh was around, or even far earlier. Every single antediluvian is implied to already have been special when they were embraced by Caine's children, who themselves are all implied to have been uniquely special, and let's not get started on fucking Lilith.

Giovanni, for all his powers and all his necromancy, was still a bog standard human when it comes down to it. He just lived a long time and was highly accomplished in his field.

>>98393913
>they weren't magnitudes stronger than that when they were 500 is the thing.
Funny thing, we actually already know how strong Anttedeluvians should be without a million XP: 2e had all the 10th dots for each discipline. They were not That impressive compared to 9th dot powers, just slightly stronger.
The only reason Antedeluvians are given statless god status is the same reason Ur-Shulgi and the one Methusela that killed Baba Yaga are, they're so fucking old their stat sheet would have thousands of pages of elder powers and combo disciplines. At that point it doesn't really matter what generation you are, a thinblood would also be a functional god.

Have I been usurped?

>>98393997
There are Tremere in the thread!

>Augie has insane, once in a thousand years stats.
>His goal is to... make all his descendants inbred and use them to destroy the shroud.

Never liked the Giovanni, honestly.

>>98393994
There seems to be a general philosophy that being lower gen gives you benefits beyond sheer mechanics. Virtually everybody below 6th gen breaks at least one rule. While it is possible they just bought a power that changes the rule, the approach does seem to be "they can do what they want" at a certain point.

>>98394007
It's called retard strength for a reason.

>>98394009
>There seems to be a general philosophy that being lower gen gives you benefits beyond sheer mechanics
Wasn't there a scene where Tremere didn't even need to use Thaumaturgy to roast the party to death in Transylvania Chronicles? That seems like a good example.

>>98394009
>While it is possible they just bought a power that changes the rule
I'd go with this. A 4th gen neonate isn't going to be breaking any rules of vampirism, and there are 5th dot powers and combos that do let you break rules. The only thing dpeciap about the methusela is how old they are

>>98394033
Yeah, I suppose "I'm so old I invented twenty different rule breaking powers" and "I'm so old the rules just don't apply to me " are interchangeable functions except that one of them can actually be used as a game piece afterwards.

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>>98394000
Im fine with that. I was getting a little burnt out on baking. I just want to know if this is a vacation or if the big wigs are trying to replace me. Either way, I sleep.

>>98394000
Good.

>>98394007
To be fair, he succeeded at one of his 2 goals.

>>98394033
Even the weird powers of elder blood are easily ecplained as discipline effects. There are multiple powers that alter how your blood affects someone else. Hell, Tremere's 10th dot ritual gives his blood the ability to spread TEMPORARY IMMUNITY TO SUNLIGHT, and that was a side effect of it's main function.

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>>98393826
>What era/period/decade would you prefer to run or play in?
Most of the games I've played in have used large time skips of years or decades in between major events. It's the thing that has always appealed to me about vampire: how your character reacts as time moves on and the world changes around them. I've always enjoyed the imagery of a scene like
>You're hunting in the Rack, and as you're about to make the final moves on your prey, you see someone across the bar whom you recognize.
>It's another vampire. 300 years ago, the two of had a bitter feud that you never resolved, but you hadn't seen or heard from him in all these centuries.
>The two of you meet each other's gaze. It's clear he recognizes you too. What do you do?
Does your character resume your feud with this other Lick? Do you you just ignore each other and go about your night? Do you actually try to reconnect with one of the only beings you can actually relate to, even if you were rivals in the past?

>>98394007
>>98394064
technically augustus and the other elders didn't want the degenerate inbreed part

that's the result of the giovanni celebrating the cappadocian genocide so hard for literal centuries

the premascine clan leadership has been trying to counteract that by outlawing sibling fucking and by adopting more and more families but their younger incest riddled idiot family members keep being degenerates, but because their own mythology is based on the fact that their familly is the best they can't bring themselves to put their foot down and take a hard hand in fixing the familly

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>>98394191
>outlawing sibling fucking

>>98393826
>TQ
Call me a megasperg, but I like running a wide variety of time periods. Helps our table feel like it has real history and continuity, and like an actual World of Darkness. Though we've been hitting the historical, mostly 1800s and early 1900s, so heavily right now that I really wouldn't mind something more modern. But I suspect that's a symptom of my table being largely disenchanted by and bitter towards the last 10 or so years of the world. By the same measure if I were to run something current year-y, I'd want to go for some deeper cuts, but that'd probably just cause arguments and lead to general bitterness. It is what it is, more period pieces for me.

I've toyed recently with Ancient to Imperial China, Mid-Imperial Russia, and Renaissance Central Europe as settings.

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>>98393994
There's also the fact that reasonably, a game and its rules and its sheets cannot reasonably account for all things that can happen within its universe. For every written and spelled-out ritual, there's potentially countless other rituals that can conceivably exist or that can or have been alluded to or implied, but that would serve no practical purpose being written out and demystified.

Insofar that the antedeluvians are real things, they are also unapproachable plot devices, and the fact that they were never statted even in 2e suggests that the writers realize(d) this and that they are far more than just 10 dots on a sheet, whether a power associated with that final dot is "just slightly stronger than 9th-dot powers".

>>98394009
I am of the opinion that every character should break at least one rule, at some point. And the older the character is, the more rules should be broken, because things rarely conform to rigid rulesets, especially in the greater narrative of all creation.

And the antedeluvians are, regardless of the reality of them and what mythologies are right and about when or where or what, very, very, very old.

>>98394000
>There are Tremere in the thread!
Picture related.

>TQ
Actually, there's a thing where the Technocratic Order have lost control over their propoganda machine and can no longer reliably invent new technology, so I was thinking of doing a literal "end of history" campaign with 2004 tech, starting from maybe the 1980s and jumping forward decades at a time to 20XX, but still with 2004 tech.

>>98393826
>What era/period/decade would you prefer to run or play in?
My table mostly sets their stuff in the 2010s but I don't remember why.

>>98394277
>but that would serve no practical purpose being written out and demystified.
Isn't that what the power creation rules are for?

>>98394277
Gee, Javier! How come your regent lets you have four maxillary canine teeth?

>>98393913
>Yeah but they weren't magnitudes stronger than that when they were 500 is the thing.
akshually most of them (or rather all of them but Set) where because they been antediluvian humans before embrace and that just gives you non disciplines powers as seen with japeth who was also born before the flood and who has random powers unrelated to his vampire powers that the st is allowed to make up on the spot

so they are all basically multisplat but with a second splat (pre flood mortal) that we all can't get and that was never stated out

>>98394241
Did you get to play in those settings?

Also relatable. The world going to shit is why we are here after all.

Hedgefag is such a piece of shit GOD I hate him

>>98394277
10 dots max has always been one of the weaknesses of storyteller. It forces everything to be depicted on this scale. Methuselah and Neonate. Dog and Dragon. The problem is that a raging elephant isn't 10 dots of strength compared to an expert athletes 4 dots. The scale of comparison is way off, but we would need to inflate dicepools into the hundreds to compensate.
And thus, we retvrn to Shadowrun whose dice mechanics were an inspiration for wod 1e afaik.

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>>98394277
>javier
wasn't that guy lasombra? the one who teaches you oblivion as a non lasombra if you let him live

who was also a total junkie for junkie blood

trevor here is the main tremere npc from that game and also secretly sabbat

>>98394334
what are you talking about? monsters and animals are not limited to 10 dots we have dragons in the bygone bestiary with 13 dots in strenght so white wolf really considered them to really just be that strong. it's not a limit in the engine some spirits can throw 30 dice at once to snap at you it's really just the abstraction and ... kinda skill issue from the writers

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>>98394307
>Isn't that what the power creation rules are for?
There's always ways to create all kinds of stuff for your own game in addition to what already exists, yes. But that's for the practical use of facilitating gameplay.

If you're writing out specific rules for a narrative power/ritual/etc. for something done by a methuselah 1000 years ago that will never see actual immediate use in the game itself, you're autistic to the point of being clinically unwell.

>>98394339
>wasn't that guy lasombra?
Yeah, you're right. I was just hoping no-one would notice.

Those games were surprisingly fun for what they were, and managed to almost entirely dodge most of the paracuck setting garbage.

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how would you guys stat these?

pistol with sniper damage and higher strenght requirement?

>>98394373
are the smg stats not good for this sort of thing

>>98394353
Feels like a "wow so scary look at me breaking the 10 dot scale" sort of situation.
So a great dragon is as strong as 3 competent athletes. Impressive. Wow.

>>98394359
>Those games were surprisingly fun for what they were, and managed to almost entirely dodge most of the paracuck setting garbage.
yeah i think it's because the cast was fun i was also a big fan of the nosferatu primogen who was all business and had me gun down tremere with a ww2 stationary machine gun in the sewers or the giga chad ventrue prince with his "hobby" that he really likes if you are also into it and if you offer up your "sire" for it he pretty much adopts you on the spot and calls killing her "a bonding experience perhaps"

that new disco elysium style game is set in the same city and i wouldn't mind if we get some cameos from the game in addition to the old black dog book (which are already confirmed).. although i don't know how that works with the rights

>>98394383
Strip away any full.-auto option and they absolutely are.

>>98394330
>Did you get to play in those settings?
The ones I mentioned are ones I'm considering for future games. China is for VtM with some VtR grafted on. Russia is HtV. Specifically in the frontier and backwater, on a special mission from the Tsar. Haven't decided for the renaissance game, just have some occasional ideas for it.

Actual period piece games my group has had are, not in order of when they took place or even when we played them:
>HtV set in the lead up to and during WW2.
>My homebrewed nWoD Sorcerer template set in the high medieval, specifically 1187 and 1188. Was a travel game. Started in Genoa, ended in the Faroe Islands.
>HtV set in 1816 Louisville, Kentucky, during the famous "year without a summer".
>CtL set in 1891 London, currently ongoing.
>Upcoming VtM game set in 1920s Rochester, New York.

So what happens when the promise of 1528 runs out?

>>98394412
I unfortunately have no high hopes for that game and it managing to avoid the shittier aspects of the new setting.

I really wish they'd just make oWoD games instead, but I actually think that Paradox forbids it.

>>98394385
>So a great dragon is as strong as 3 competent athletes.
A.. are you genuinely retarded?

>>98394385
Every dot increase is supposed to be more dramatic than the last. It's why 1 dot is the human minimum, 2 is the human average and 5 is the human maximum. Yes, this doesn't reflect in the math but complaining about oWoD mechanics is kind of like moving to a big noisy city and complaining about the noise. Everyone knows oWoD mechanics suck, there's a reason why some people would rather play the game in fucking GURPS.

>>98394441
nobody but the camarilla inner circle knows

the younger giovanni killed everyone on their side who knew without asking them what even is in the promise (yes the giovanni are this stupid in v5)

>>98394455
GURPS is actually a phenomenal game if you've suffered through it long enough to become familiar, though. It has rules for any kind of game, a wide player base, and stockholm syndrome to keep you coming back for more.

>>98394454
It's a complaint about mechanics simulating a given reality.
>>98394455
I know and it just fucking sucks. It's what I originally said, this is a big weakness with how shit is designed. It maybe makes sense for more mystical things such as sorcery or disciplines, but fails incredibly hard at portraying things like strength to the point of being completely ridiculous.

>>98394465
So I've been told. I've also been told it's the devil by other people.
I've never been able to get my group to try and suffer through it to get said stockholm syndrome. Either way, it's funny that people would rather play a game with a bespoke ruleset built for the setting itself in a different generic system designed around flexibility.

>>98394466
WoD isn't trying to simulate reality; your entire premise is founded on a house of cards.

>>98394466
>this is a big weakness with how shit is designed.
There was an easy fix for this. Mummy 1e gave bonus rules for attributes above 5. Stuff like extra successes on the roll. If that was just made standard, 6-7 dots in something mundane like strength would actually feel superhuman.

>>98394441
it very likely won't run out. The recent rumors that it has a 500 year limit are just that rumors and it's implied that the cappadocians and dursin started them so that the rest of the hecata could scare the giovanni to attend the family re-union

>>98394482
Yes it is. WoD is a game that attempts to model a fictional reality. This fictional reality even completely intersects with our own. The mechanics are an attempt to portray the lore of the setting into a resolution system you can use to tell stories.
The way things are described in a story and the way the dice resolution system would actually resolve them diverge greatly, this reduces immersion and is a flaw of the system. This was my complaint.
Do you understand this or do I have to make a long-winded example to illustrate the point?
>>98394490
I guess you could do this. Or you could simply normalize going beyond 10 dots. The problem is the rest of the system is not designed for it, and it breaks apart.

>>98394473
Admittedly, I'm also a big fan of Shadowrun, and the only D&D I'll play is 3e, so mechanical complexity is almost a selling point to me by now.

>>98394441
Wops get got

where do you all recommend i look for a group for games that aren’t vampire the masquerade or werewolf the apocalypse? feels like a rarity that anyone advertises them in the places i usually look.

How often do you include Eclipses in your games?

>>98394497
That's fair. I can see the points in favor of both ends of the spectrum. Rules-lite games are easier to get into but if you play them for more than a single short campaign, you've completely figured it out and can start to see what it can't do well in pursuit of keeping the rules quick and easy to understand. Very crunchy games will be slow at first as everyone gets their hands around it, but once you have a handle on it, the depth is far greater.

I tend to prefer compromise, especially since sometimes I need to remind my players of shit they really should know by now. But gun to my head I'd rather take something crunchy than something unbearably rules lite.

>>98394521
there won't be any places where those aren't a rarity

those are very nichè games so nobody is hidding a forum where people love all the other gamelines more anon and if you want to play a nichè game you probably have to run it

>>98394526
I wonder if the tides will one day turn back towards the crunch-simulationist gamer. The current momentum seems to be overwhelmingly in favor of rules-lite systems with all old systems getting their shaving down, so to speak.

>>98394441
The Tremere get Necromancy.

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This is my average experience every time I visit here: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=atv8pf0jBNE .

>>98394277
Caleb is Tremere?

>>98394547
The Pyramid always wins!
Good luck other clans.

>>98394541
Crunch-simulationism will return to the forefront if/when the hobby becomes repellant to normies again. Right now if you're making an RPG, you have to cope with the fact that the majority of players are at least normie-adjacent and don't like leaving the 5e hole. The other two cohorts are theater kids and old guard autists. It's difficult to make a new crunchy and/or simulationist game that does the crunch better than the old crunchy systems these people have already spent the time getting to know every nook and cranny of and are emotionally attached to.

It's much easier to make something with barebones, narrativist mechanics, give it a kitschy setting and sell it to the theater kids. Some of the 5e forever normies might even buy it to try it for three sessions before going back to 5e.

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How do I start playing Mage?
Is it okay to skip to the post-structuralists or should I start somewhere around the enlightenment? Any recommended reading material to wrap my head around semiotics and phenomenology?

>>98394521
There are several very active Discord servers for this sort of thing.

>>98394466
>It's a complaint about mechanics simulating a given reality.
You could've just said yes.

>>98394558
Accurate. oWoD lorefags will go on for 300 posts about the same arguments about furry terrorists and super-solipsists they've had for the last 50 threads.

>>98394521
Vigil's surprisingly popular, but only for home grown tables. No clue where to get a good online only game, if indeed such a thing exists.

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>>98394593
I'll tell you what /lit/ told me: start with the Greeks. And if you actually had read the Greeks, you would know to start with the Egyptians.

>>98394496
>Or you could simply normalize going beyond 10 dots.
Anon, that's already normal for non-vampires. Mages and Werewolves DGAF about the "10 dot limit" and casually surpass it all the fucking time.
Hell, anons a few threads ago were talking about how get of fenris thowing 80 dice of physicals is just a thing rank 5s do.
Stop treating vampire like it's the entirety of WoD.

>>98394593
Remember, Verbena is the best tradition.

>>98394631
>get of fenris thowing 80 dice of physicals is just a thing rank 5s do
What in the fuck?

>>98394644
>What in the fuck?
It's a reminder that fera Rank is not equivalent to vampire generation.

>>98394623
Thoth & Hermes is all you really need to be honest. Everything flows from there

>>98394547
This is the truth. Soon all will be Usurped by the Pyramid

>>98394691
>all will be Usurped by the Pyramid
Still vampires though. No matter how high the tremere climb, they will forever be seething about losing access to mortal magic.

>>98394547
I hope not they would destroy the shroud within a week

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>>98394750
>sex with hot ghosts
Thanks, Tremere!

>>98394558
>>98394608
it's even like humans like to invent stories to stave off the existential dread from the knowledge of their impending doom

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>new OP
You forgot someone.
Look at me, brother.

>>98394608
why don't these threads ever produce OC? you fucks have enough time to write it. go make some fansplats. i'm sure there's even a drawfag or two in here to illustrate a few pages

>>98394787
Bro if we're counting minor splats he's missing far better things that Gypsy: the Stealing.

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>>98393826
>What era/period/decade would you prefer to run or play in?
It depends heavily on what splat we're talking about. I have always been of the opinion that each mainline should be split up into a given period. None of them should be contemporary/modern.

But for Vampire, definitely centered around the 80's, spilling about ~20 years on either side, but mostly 80's and going into the 90's.

So looking at the 2nd Generation & the clans, I have questions.

Enoch was supposed to be the king of the First City until Caine came, but none of the "ruler" clans (Ventrue, Lasombra, etc) come from him, they come from Irad. You also have Cappas who in my opinion, are one of the most wise & scholarly clans coming from Irad too. When we look at the childre of Enoch we get Toreador & Malkav? Maybe Saulot. I get Zillah getting all the weirdos & monsters like Gangrel, Ravnos, Set. Zillah is sort of a diluted Lillith in being a hot chick with wild/gypsy vibes that Caine lusts after & forces to love him, so those Childre makes sense. But Irad & Enoch are all over the place.

Why not put all the ugly scholars together, Nossies, Cappas, Tzimisce, etc.

All they physical chads together
Ventrue, Toreador, Lasombra, etc.

All the wild gypsies/freaks together
Gangrel, Ravnos, Set, etc.

Assamites, Brujah & Malkavians could go different ways depending on which aspects you think resonate more to one side or the other. Brujah were originally scholarly, but now they are the punch clan. Assamites have noble goals & a sense of responsibly that lean towars Irad & strange magic like Enoch, but they also vibe with Zillah, Malks are insane prophets which could go with Enoch or Zillah.

Saulot is better off not accounted for either, since he would be the odd man out & some things hint that he was a 2nd Gen as well

Since the tremere were high level hermetic mages before they became vampires why haven't they just figured out how to copy every other vampire clans powers? Especially since its technically sorcerery and not true magic which is supposed to be way simpler.

>>98394806
Im working on some Mummy stuff & also werebunnies on a far back burner. I made a Caitiff discord not too long ago

>>98394825
maybe the vampirizitificationing process fucked with their Avatar and now they can't do the willwork

>>98394825
They largely have. Theres a lot of Paths & Rituals that make it so they dont need a full discipline to do something that discipline does. Its not always as good as that discipline in the long run but it works in a pinch. Also. The other Clans are LOATHE to give any kind of secrets to any other clan but especially the Tremere. The Tremere themselves dont give all their secrets to other members either. But if there are secrets to be known or powers to be mastered, you can bet there is at least one tremere who has it

>>98394806
They do. I made the VtM to VtR 2e fan conversion. A while back one Anon made a custom Caitiff clanbook he used AI images but forgive him, it was early into the gen AI boom. His more dire sin was making Joseph Pander Polish. . There's the guy working on his own custom-ish WoD setting. I also got my current character art from a drawfag here.

I don't give the lorefags shit for lorefagging. I give them shit for having the same conversation over and over again.

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Here's your Changeling: the Dreaming 5th Edition. Corporate says that A.I. is the latest design trend, so all you artsy types should love it.

>>98394825
Yeah that's what Tremere is lacking. They're too underpowered.
Why don't we just give them all disciplines?

>>98394806
>why don't these threads ever produce OC?
I've been trying, but I'm unmedicated.

>>98394819
we don't have much info about the second gens but it seems their embraces are all based on something the sire wants
enoch wanted a familly that's why the second gens and presumably his own childer are even a thing so embraces mostly out of a want of companionship

irad wanted to have a "king and philosopher bloodline" to hide the fact that he was a bit of a bloodthirsty brute

zillah probably just wanted to cheat on caine who ruffied her into marriage with vitae

that being said the vast majority of 3rd gens are given no clear sire like tzimisce's sire is said to be either irad or enoch in different books. Set is assumed to be Zillah's childe because he claims that he was in love with her but BJD ties him to Enoch instead. the gangrel books say that ennoia never talked about her sire and all that is written about her in the first city is speculation from other clans the only ones who are really nailed down are Absimiliard (who i wouldn't put into scholar because his clan are not really the nosferatu but the nictuku), ventru, cappadocian and lasombra

>>98394819
Personally, I think you're thinking of this too archetypally. The 2nd gen were still people and as a result, weren't necessarily going to embrace someone just because they fit their "gimmick". Only some clans, like the Ventrue, embrace on very specific criteria in terms of "role".

Perhaps Enoch was smitten by Arikel. Perhaps Irad viewed Cappadocius as that one autistic friend that you can talk about Star Wars lore about till 3AM. Besides which, who sired who is still largely speculation. Ventrue are, following discipline affinity theory, Irad's get. But they claim Enoch as their ancestor for more kingly legitimacy.

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Hermetic almost got culturally enriched.

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I'm burnt out on Vampire, my creative juices have stopped. What should I learn next? W20, Mage Revised, Wraith Revised, HtV2e, or CtL1e?

>>98394906
My dick.

>>98394906
If it's burnout that's the problem, I vote Vigil. It's very open so you can take it in many different directions. Burnt out on vampires? No problem, you can go an entire chronicle without touching anything even vamp-adjacent. You can be a group of locals stumbling ass-backwards into the paranormal, or high level agents of the United States (or any) government. You can be bagging supernaturals to be ground up into dick pills and ratchet body mods for a shady corporation who may be aliens , or tracking down your own ancient demonic ancestor to kill. You can want to kill, study, or sexually assault your query if you so choose. You can create monsters whole cloth to fit the story you want to tell.

>>98394915
Little to learn.

>>98394901
Imagine being Awakened & still mugging people... they really dont change

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Please explain to me like if I was retarded how in the fuck Prime works.

>>98394906
We need more Mummy posters.

>>98394452
>I really wish they'd just make oWoD games instead, but I actually think that Paradox forbids it.
The Dark Pack agreement Paradox forces on people they allow to make their vidya is that you're only allowed to use oWoD stuff freely if the splat doesn't have a WoD5 edition. Earthblood, for example, was that last WtA game that doesn't have to address W5 since it was made before Karim's turd existed, and there was a Wraith VR game that similarly didn't have constraints because god knows there's never gonna be a Wraith5.

>>98394938
Read THE book about hypereconomics, chud.

>>98394929
an UN-awakened mugger
read nigga

Set is so evil and cool

>>98394938
Prime is basic the "Magic" sphere. All magic, ststic or dynamic, uses some form of primal energy/quintessence.
That's why it lets you enchant things, drain magic energy, dispell any magic effects, etc.
You can also make non-magic things stop existing or convert them into magic energy.

>>98394938
How much do you understand about Ontology?
I feel like Mage forces a monist view of Reality and prime is the one Substance that forms everything.

>>98394825
They try. There's actually a path that reproduces Obtenebration, but it's incomplete because they don't have any primary sources since even traitor Lasombra won't trade it to the Tremere.

>>98394954
Shit my bad

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if Correspondence 2 is enough to "pull small things from one place to another", why does it also require Matter to do the same to bullets?

>>98394970
>There's actually a path that reproduces Obtenebration
This gets even more hilarious when you realize Obtenebration is the mortal sorcery Path of Shadowcasting converted to discipline for. It's a long game of Telephone, and the tremere are just getting back to where they started.

>>98394981
I'm gonna sound like a broken record, but Brucato. At some point he nerfed Correspondence hard by requiring it to need the same amount of dots in the corresponding pattern sphere to work. So Cor2/Mat2 for bullets Cor5/Mat 5 to teleport a nuke.

>>98394981
>why does it also require Matter to do the same to bullets?
It doesn't, or at least Shouldn't. You can telekinetically control inanimate objects with Matter OR Correspondence. Requiring both is just Author fiat to nerf mages.

>>98394981
You can do it with correspondence 2, but you can also do with correspondence 2/matter 2.

>>98394981
Thats the problem with Spheres. When you isolate a concept, you then have to string all these little bullshit concepts together to make a coherent effect.

Correspondence alone actually does fuck all, because according to Sphere magic you gotta tie the Correspondence effect to another sphere to have the effect achor its function. Such as Matter to effect bullets, or Forces to effect gravity. A mage with 5 dots in it cant do shit if he doesnt have other Spheres, but then they just break that rule because otherwise why the fuck would you do that?

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Holy fuck you guys weren't kidding about M20 being inferior to MRevised. This feels like a game you can actually play instead of shifting through 30 pages of Satyros Brucato's gay schizophrenia to find one table. What other books should I get to get a fuller picture? While the revised corebook is severly lacking in technocracy content and shows its age with things like Dodge still being a skill, the rest is still more streamlined. M20 might be useful for lore, but I'd rather get the good books.

>>98394981
>>98394993
>>98394999
My interpretation has always been that Correspondence only means that you are able to create an effect through a sympathetic connection, it doesn't create the effect itself, so manipulating matters require the matter sphere the same way that viewing the past of a remote location would require Time together with Correspondence.

>>98394993
>cor 5/mat5 to teleport a nuke
huh? how is it different than teleporting just about any other object? Or creating a portal and throwing it through it, really.

>>98394981
But what about using spheres to ricochet bullets into enemies hiding around the corner? That should be coincidental as long as you don't have all your bullets hitting your target.

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>>98395013
because you need Matter 5 to interact with radioactive elements

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>>98395008
That interpretation directly conflicts with the example effects of what the sphere can do on it's own.

Just backport Awakening 2e's mechanics and call it a day.

>>98395020
I take this to mean you need matter 5 to make something inherently radioactive or not radioactive. I think this is best compared to throwing a fireball at somebody vs making them explode into a fireball.

>>98394927
My dick is more powerful than you.

>>98395031
You mean the game that was deliberately constructed wrong?

>>98395020
Anon, Sphere 5 Effects are for CREATING NEW THINGS. Not manipulating exidting things(sphere 3)

>>98395044
How? It seems more streamlined and coherent.

>>98395007
It's ridiculous how bloated M20 is. If you cut out all of Brucato's purple prose, the unnecessary exposition on niche rules that shouldn't be in the core book at all and the crafts (because let's face it they are side content. V20 did just fine by putting all the bloodlines in other books. Same for W20 with Fera), you can shave the book down to like 400 pages and have enough space in those to properly explain how the spheres work. Hilariously, Mage would have ended up the shortest 20th edition core book.

Meanwhile Revised/2nd ed. are streamlined in the best way possible. You know exactly what you're getting, everything is explained way better and any extraneous content is in expansion books. Brevity is the soul of wit.

>>98395020
What the fuck? Why is melting a steal beam a Mind effect at all?

>>98395051
Because the guy who wrote it deliberately overtuned it as a power fantasy so that it's trivially easy for Mages to get outsized benefits and ignore all restrictions by playing the game the way he wants them to.

>>98395058
because sometimes jet fuel just isn't enough

Broke: Brucato nerfs the game because he's a grognard sex pest with very specific opinions about what mage should be
Woke: Brucato nerfs the game because he believes magic is real and he's making it harder for real life nephandi to cast by manipulating the consensus

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>>98395058
There's an entire section of How Do you Do That about "psychic effects" that are literally just the same as other effects but with Mind or Spirit thrown in for no reason.

>>98395083
Why involve mind at all? Its just a Forces effect?

Fuck I hate Spheres

>>98395075
His efforts are in vain then, the IRL Nephandi already have the strongest magic around. The only people he's nerfing are the plebs.

Back in the previous thread multiple people complained the Invictus are boring, or at least lacking in flavor compared to the other Covenants. Wanna see what we can do to jazz them up so they're not just "We have Camarilla at home"?

>>98395058
The Mind is required to make the effect work in that specific way, with a thought, I don't think people appreciate how limited mages are by their Paradigms, mage is a game where the Fluff is the most important aspect.

>>98395092
>Why involve mind at all? Its just a Forces effect?
It woulfn't involve mind at all. HDYDT contradicts the core rules, the supplemental rules, and even itself at multiple points. It literally can't be used.

>>98395092
Because it uses the mind or something. Realistically effects like this should be just be Forces and/or Prime with psychic bullshit as the focus/instrument. Mind is entirely unnecessary unless you're using it actually affect minds. The exception would be using the Mind sphere itself to mind blast people doing bashing damage, but that requires Mind only, no Forces necessary.

>>98395112
>The Mind is required to make the effect work in that specific way, with a thought, I don't think people appreciate how limited mages are by their Paradigms
Anon. This was a rewrite added in 20th an nowhere else. This is purely what happens when brucato has unlimited creative contril, not something that was trues of the mage gameline.
Mage 20th is a worthless edition. Pyro kinesis is a forces effect with a psychic instrument, not forces + mind.

>>98395119
>>98395115

Exactly what i though. Otherwise everything would need Mind because youre thinking it into being.

>>98395112
No the fuck it doesnt. Paradigm means that I am psychic & must limit my magic through psychic explanation. However the Mind Sphere is about effecting/creating/manipulating Minds & the purview of the Mind. The steel beam is not a fucking brain.

Now, if I created a spell that melted whatever another person concentrated on, THAT would take Forces+Mind

>>98395092
it requires prime as well, so im guessing its to enchant someone with a pseudo numina of pyrokinesis

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>>98394951
Good idea.
>>98394958
But isnt pretty much everything magic? So its the
>see how much you can bullshit your ST
sphere?
>>98394961
>How much do you understand about Ontology?
I dont know much about birds.

>>98395177
>So its the
>>see how much you can bullshit your ST
>sphere?
That's every sphere anon. That's the Mage gameline in a nutshell.
It's even gamefied in the paradox mechanics.

>>98395176
Prime is for creating new fire where there was none before. It's not needed if you're controlling an existing flame.

>>98395053
>V20 did just fine by putting all the bloodlines in other books.

V20 has all the bloodlines and their disciplines in an appendix at the end of the corebook

Then it had a separate supplement just for the Bloodlines mirroring the 13-in-1 clanbook

>>98395189
I fucking love this game.

>>98394948
Where the fuck is my Mummy Action RPG

>>98395177
no, that would be Spirit

>>98395228
I want a Mummy game where you make a bunch of hard choices & whatnot then theres a big turning point where you die & get dragged before the Judges & you have to justify everything youve done so far & you either get striped of some of your power (your decisions previously had given you a big boost) or you gain more Balance & head into the rest of the game with enhanced abilities

Who is the most wanked antedeluvian? And who do you belive the writers have a vendetta against?

>>98395282
>Who is the most wanked antedeluvian?
Tzimisce.

>And who do you belive the writers have a vendetta against?
Augustus Giovanni.

>>98395282
>Who is the most wanked antedeluvian?
tzimisce or saulot most of the metaplot seems to just be the fight between the two
> And who do you belive the writers have a vendetta against?
cappadocious is the only ante who is 100% confirmed dead after the week of nightmares and he wasn't even the target of the spirit nukes

he also got reduced to a specter and not even a onceborn a specter

>>98395042
Dick seller, I am going into battle, and I require your strongest dicks.

>>98395317
I'm sorry, but there's a shortage of dicks right now.
Best I can do is a big clit.

So when are they releasing more malkav lore?

>>98395191
its redundant for a mage, but these seem to line up with the spheres required to enchant anyone with the ability

>>98395345
V6

>>98395282
Tzimisce is (literally) stronger than God and can't actually lose. One of the Gehenna scenarios has Jehovah curse the world with a withering that destroys all magic and wonder and turns everyone into mortals, except Tzimisce who casually dodges it and comes back to eat the entire planet uncontested.

>>98394939
While I might be open to eyeing up the corebooks in order to have more material for an Egypt game since I love Setites, I don't think I'd want to actually play a mummy.
>>98394925
Alrighty, might be interesting to check out as my first CofD book, and the Slasher chronicle already comes pre-packaged into the book. Just need to throw Bubba with a Chainsaw in there. Maybe I'll go full BPRD with it. I recall an anon posting about his hunters facing a minor spirit of car crashes that possessed cars and that sounded pretty fun.

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>>98395382
V5 and 5th edition dies next week at gencon.

That or they just double down on the retardedness once again with M5 or fully turning us into dnd5e.

>>98395301
>Fight between a terminal schizophrenic and a literal unthinking fleshblob
This is like if Sentry fought The Thing

>>98395058
>>98395070
>>98395083
>>98395092
Everyone knows Jet Fuel can't melt steel beams so you have to cast a sort of mass minor hypnosis on the human subconscious/the earth so that you can enable that to happen
>t. Nasu

But that's meta commentary from after 9/11, funny how that ends up.

>>98394007
Wasn’t his clan one of the necromancer groups Voormas cursed with the obsession with tearing down the Shroud to advance his “kill death itself” project?

>>98395432
That's not Nasu babble at all, though. No effort.

That said, steel beams that are exposed to jet fuel temperatures don't turn into a puddle, but they do turn into laffy taffy, which logically means that you can turn any kind of metal structure into edible candy by heating it up.

>>98394808
I'm just surprised OP included Street Fighter of all things and even Leviathan. Thought Siren the Drowning and Alien the Stranded were ok too.

>>98395435
no that's cut content the best you have is that he poisoned some unnamed death cults but that's only in his ToJ scenario

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Real Mages don't need anything more than Matter 1 to cook.

>>98395432
no in the nasuverse you need to hypnotise yourself to cast a spell that allows jet fuel to melt steel beams

unless you are chunni enough to just force the image with 100% certainty into your mind with willpower

Thinking about it, wouldn't it be really easy to make a post-2000's classic world of darkness setting by just porting from pre-grand-order fate and tsukihime lore? They were direct rips of classic world of darkness, so it's just coming back full circle.

>>98395290
The wop isnt an ante
>>98395282
Eldest for sure. Saulot a close second. They're also very closely linked too.

I like to think that Saulot created three clans to pursue Golconda/evolution of the Kindred condition with the three different resonances as a guide, Baali is Wyrm, Tremere is Wyvr, Salubri is Wyld. All three search for exaltation, one through the profane, one through academic/magic, & the last through altruism. The Eldest pursues evolution through a dark anathema of Primordialism he is the "antiGaia". This is all headcanon though.

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>>98395053
>It's ridiculous how bloated M20 is
>you can shave the book down to like 400 pages
No kidding. I'm thinking of sitting down one evening with a pdf editor to remove all pages that aren't mechanics and add the sphere costs for Reviseds. Frankenstein my own M20 edition. I don't mind the Crafts being there but someone really needed to rein in that hippie fuck and tell him that we need less pages of father's thrusting cock and masturbating Hermione

>>98395482
This guy accomplishes his best magic with his charisma anyway

>>98395488
>in the nasuverse you need to hypnotise yourself to cast a spell that allows jet fuel to melt steel beams
Only if you're a pleb stuck on magecraft(AKA: a sorcerer). WoD True Magick and Masu True Magic are literally the same thing.

>>98395053
>>98395503
>Masturbating Hermione
I know the page you're talking about, but what the fuck is wrong with that guy

>>98395385
What scenario was that?

>>98395415
The Thing would get bodied, hes just a rock dude [spoilers] I know youre talking about John Carpenter's The Thing, but if youre gonna mix media you should be more specific [/spoilers]

>>98395521
nightshade i believe that anon is talking about where in one of the optional epilogues they reveal that the eldest tanked gabriel ending the curse of caine and killing all cainites who are older than a century

in crucible of gods however the eldest get's smited by god when saulot sacrifices himself

so perhabs the eldest is on the level where god needs to aim for him specifically

>>98395509
Well True Magic still has rules, it's not creation and change from nothing. It's a sort of supernatural distortion that breaches through the world lines though, effectively letting you pay off the ginormous mana cost needed to actually do WoD-esque magic.

Aoko herself aside, because she's a plucky 0 int grug with a personality perfect for the 5th magic (aka the irresponsible loan), every True Magic feat seen can be recreated with magecraft but it's turbo unreliable and takes some shit like 100 dead people to cast, like the HF wishes or Zelretch's dimensional bullshit.

>>98395509
Not really. Nasu True Magic is something very specific. Like the Second Magic is the Operation of Parallel Worlds, right? So as a True Magic, you definitely and absolutely have the right to actuate that, regardless of outside factors, you will always win when it comes to counterspelling or the like, and all True Magics can make you immortal, but if you want to do anything that doesn't directly involve Parallel Worlds, you have to learn normal magic with its various limitations, albeit with the caveat that somebody who can realize a True Magic is exceptionally well suited to performing things like curses and magecraft. Think of it normal magic is getting in a boat and swimming across the ocean, and True Magic is boring a hole to the center of the Earth. Way more powerful and impressive, but not actually that flexible, since boring a hole through the Earth to travel from England to Spain is pretty bothersome when you can just buy a plane ticket.

>>98395301
>cappadocious is the only ante who is 100% confirmed dead after the week of nightmares and he wasn't even the target of the spirit nukes
Isn't Ventrue 100% dead too?

>>98395514
>>98395503
Fucking what?

>>98395540
eeeh ventrue being dead was meant to be a lie there are several hints ranging from him having embraced people after his death to him having mentioned alexander the great in his writing that he is faking it, but the writers who set that up and the writers of ToJ gehenna been two different teams so they didn't get those hints

Achilli has admited that this is a continuity error caused by white wolf rushing the teams

>>98395540
According to the Ventrue, yes, the Ventrue founder was ambushed and killed by some irrelevant random whose name nobody knows just outside the walls of the city when nobody was around to watch.

>>98395541
the short stories in the m20 corebook are not safe for work because goatboy is a sexpest who only hasn't been canceled yet because wicca groupies and goats don't accurse you of shit

>>98395540
The guy/foid had 10 in fortitude, dominate and presence. It's up to you if you believe he/she died without anyone even seeing it

>>98395567
He died. I saw it.

>TQ
We usually like to do between the 50s-00s. Surveillance tech isnt as oppressive and we are familiar enough with the era that we can comfortably play. Our main issue is getting set up with a certain locale/NPCs and then having to acclimate to what has changed during the time skip. Usually we try to keep the chronicle to a decade or two.

>>98395536
>>98395537
I mean technically almost anything in wod can be replicated with linear magic included restraining incarna

I find it funny that true magic in nasuverse basically has the same paradox backlash unless a mage is hiding in their own reality marble (aka chantry) except paradox being mediated by both the consensus and gaia (although paradox spirits might technically be part of the gaian hierarchy). Another one for one parallel is in his angel notes where there are 6 sisters in parallel with the true 5 magics in his setting and the last being the hypothetical sixth magic literally named judgement that nasu keeps teasing that will solve the setting or supposedly bring happiness, which is basically just the 10th sphere. Also in that setting gaia asks the planetary incarna to summon themselves on earth kill off humanity after she dies.

>>98395533
>nightshade
As I recall it's vicissitude that survives as a (somewhat controllable) disease causing mutations, not necessarily the Eldest himself.
Ennoia suvives somehow though, she's just that good.

>>98395527
Fair point on that, just a shit post to cope with depression.
>>98395537
This is the sort of explanation Touko would give to you as cope for why she lost to her sister, well done. Except she would never admit admit that Aoko is well-suited to anything but mana beams.

In a way it's kind of like True Magic does ONE thing generally exceptionally well in producing infinite mana for the user and one specific thing which is what the magic is actually for, like interfering in parallel worlds, materializing souls before they reincarnate, transferring energy between two points in time, etc. Some of the background lore seems to imply that before Magecraft spawned from Solomon (via usage of True Magic), Mages could just straight up do True Magic because of the greater mysticism of the age.

In an alternate universe MtA and Fate swap, such that one of the biggest japanese franchises of all time is about the Traditions and the Technocracy fighting the ''Holy Grail War'' over the consensus but more anime, while ''Mage'' is an incoherent mess that's basically the KotE mixed with the Nasuverse if written by Brucato and Achilli.

>>98393826
i like 1837 to 2012

start of the victorian era to the end of the maya calendar which also where i think modern tech becomes too annoying to deal with

>>98395602
>while ''Mage'' is an incoherent mess
don't need an alternate universe for that

>>98395589
>True Magic has the same paradox backlash
It's more like the road to True Magic (except if you're destined for it or have the exact genes to awaken the path) is heavily enforced by supernatural forces and supernatural hitmen so that some once in a lifetime 300 IQ psychopath like Kiritsugu's dad or Araya (from KnK) can't brute force their way into another magic before humanity is ready. True Magic itself isn't really policed.

I do agree with the rest, strangely WoD-esque though for Notes case I think it's more of a coincidence. It was one of Nasu's first works.

>>98395597
Before the invention of magecraft, no normal humans could do magic. It was only possible if you had divine ancestry.

>>98395602
>KotE mixed with Nasuverse if written by Brucato and Achilli
Holy, forget Saber sexo. It'd be the most degenerate thing ever.

>>98395611
>True Magic itself isn't really policed.
We only see three true magic users with one being turned into a legendary fetish, the other one living outside of time like a time 5 user and aoko who gets backlash in the form of physical pressure and also death threats from a paradox spirit each time she uses the 5th magic.

>>98395537
>Not really. Nasu True Magic is something very specific
Anon, each true magic in nasuverse is a mage sphere. The first true magic is prime, the second is dimensional science, the third is classic spirit, 4th is correspondence, 5th is entropy, and 6th is telos from time of judgement.

>>98395602
>In an alternate universe MtA and Fate swap, such that one of the biggest japanese franchises of all time is about the Traditions and the Technocracy fighting the ''Holy Grail War'' over the consensus but more anime,
Anon, the holy grail war is regarded as a backwater ritual made by has-been and never-will-be mage families. The "Trafitions" in the fate verse is the Clocktower, the "Technocracy" is Atlas, and the "Association of Crafts" is the Wandering Sea.
The rip-off was very blatent in early nasu.

>>98395638
Aoko gets backlash because she was only playing around. It's not until the very end of a Witch on the Holy Night, after she's been hit with that backlash multiple times, does she actually step up and become a proper Magician. She never displays any kind of backlash in any other appearance, later in the timeline.

>ToJ talk
What's the worst scenario from your favorite splat?

>>98393994
>They were not That impressive compared to 9th dot powers, just slightly stronger.
Being able to get a worldwide map of who works for who with zero cost and time investment is pretty strong in my eyes.

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>>98395556
>According to the Ventrue Founder, yes, the Ventrue founder was ambushed and killed by some irrelevant random whose name nobody knows just outside the walls of the city when nobody was around to watch. The he went on to embrace multiple 4th gens and at some point creating and ruling the camarilla to this day.
FIFY.

>>98395679
I haven't actually played a Gehenna game but I think Nightshade seems awfully railroad-y. Like, it seems like a wild goosechase as things happen around you and then Saulot saves the world.

>>98395679
fair and foul hand down the entire scenario hangs on the twist of the ante coterie but that's common knowledge these days and lilit's antes... don't really do much

you also only have 3 major choices in this and in two of them the right answer is to just see something really fucked up and evil (lilith's sewer monsters, lasombra) and just leave and if you do anything else by raw you are fucking doomed

>>98395638
Aoko's backlash is more like a message imbued into the 5th magic to use it responsibly, but like this anon >>98395665 says, she internalizes it as her own fear of the future and just completely ignores it afterwards when she decides "Yeah fuck it, heat death is happening with or without me"

Unironically, it was Aoko's more timid and attached to life nature that made her grandpa choose her as his heir, and Aoko basically turned into an irresponsible Stacey partly because Grandpa didn't actually teach her well and Touko's repeated assassination attempts (not over the true magic btw, she was just mad about being snubbed by her Grandfather for being a fucking psychopath)

Figure I'll write a bit about the Mage game I'm running
>PC 1 is a Ecstatic magician's assistant being chased by a loan shark
>PC 2 is a Verbena risk analyst who used to work in a chemical processing plant owned by Pentex and nearly got disposed of by a fomori
>pair of them met up in a shitty backwater with the both of them running from their problems
>accidentally stumbling into a necromancer who hired the mob to lift an amulet for a ritual and then sends his zombies to dispose of them
>they meet up in a trailer park after a botched roll caused them to have a fender bender before realizing they're both mages
>both of them visibly relieved that they arent schizophrenic and that this is more than mere delusion
>Verbena breaks in because he wants a fake id from a small time hood who makes fake ids
along with some questions for him given disappearances about local kids
>Ecstatic was trying to hide from the loans shark in the trailer park not realizing that the guy the Verbena was trying to find was part of this
>they find a tar man type zombie eating the guy
>neither of them are statted for combat so I made the zombie weak
>they beat the fuck out of him thanks to the Ecstatic throwing a knife (i let them substitute performance given its reasonable a magician's assistant could be trained to throw a knife)
>managed to land a lucky hit on the zombie's eye letting it flail around blindly and only managing to barf on them with corrosive goop that did superficial burns
>yoinked the id press the guy was using and searched his room only to find out he was working with the loan shark via his cell phone contacts and the plans
>Ecstatic realizes she was this close to ending up dead if the zombie hadn't got to him
>pair of them realize that they're both involved in this and need to work together
>retire for the night
been running the game for a few sessions, fun stuff, I need to think bigger ideas cuz theyre about take down the necromancer and they're onto the big city

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Had no idea malks could access the web via the madness network.

>>98395770
They can also use it to see the future and resurrect. They can also use it to dodge retcons, which is why Malks aren't in V5.

>>98395778
>Malks aren't in V5
What?

Do werewolves (both Apocalypse and Forsaken) still have superhuman hearing and smell while in human form?

>>98395770
>They say they don't need a computer to be on the Web.
Fookin' phoneposters.

>>98395770
madness network in general seems to be in that area metaphysically: malkavians are the most common drone vampires and in one clan book a malkavian goes on about a rant how mages should be wrong in a very weaver way

so the malkavian maddness network is probably somewhere between the digital web which after all bothers on the weaver's domain and the dreaming

>>98395679
It’s a tie between Last Battleground (too vanilla and feels a bit too much like Mass Effect 3 with the whole “go everywhere in the Umbra to gather allies for the final battle”) and the Glass Walker version of A Tribe Falls (seriously, it felt like it was written by a red talon)

>>98395778
Forget blood magic, Malkavian madness is fucking overpowered.

>>98395778
don't forget it can also infect mortals and even warp reality in a silent hill like way if malkav is awake

and that's not even getting into the nonsense that was the Eater who might be the most powerful vampire in the entire setting and he is only a 4th gen, guy can eat true names, ideas and even the word form the page of the og malkavian clan book talking about it

>>98395817
>the Eater
Who is also most likely a complete lie given this is Clanbook: Malkavian we're talking about.

>>98395778
don't forget you can also teleport with it

>>98395744
Very neat, maybe tie in the Pentex stuff now that they're aware of all the crazy shit going on. Probably should have them get picked up by a more knowledgeable mage though.

>>98395787
I think there's a stat that does that, generally only a bit though, just like they have superior healing while still in the human form just not wolverine-esque regeneration.

>>98395787
Yes but it's slower.

>>98395877
Hearing and smell are slower? What?

>>98395920
They see faster though.

>>98395848
already done, they found ties to the chemical processing plant and pentex before. the necromancer is tied to pentex thanks to the verebena's boss having him as a mentor (he's a dogshit and unawakened
they've been through a few sessions now, theyre closing in on the necromancer thanks to raiding the boss' summer home and finding the location of the necromancer's house.
The necromancer caught up with them but the ecstatic realizing that there'd be more combat put some xp into guns and blew off one of his fingers and got the fuck out of dodge.

>>98395877
>>98395920
>>98395925
A changeling is using Chronos right now, I can almost see it.

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>>98395340
Do we have Hyena fera? I want a big futa furry mommy
>>98395590
>Ennoia suvives somehow though, she's just that good.
I can live with that. If anyone could make it it's the ante of the survivalist clan, and I can live with my headcanon being the Eldest itself is Viscissitude like how Assaku fans have it, I don't mind it having a mind of its own but it being an alien/umbral parasite is retarded. Or like anon
>>98395533 says the Eldest needs a specific "fuck that thing in particular".

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>>98395992
yeah, Ajaba and Kucha Ekundu along with garou breeds roam africa

>>98395533
>>98395590
>>98395992
Oh actually I misremembered. Nightshade is as you say, the Eldest is implied to survive in an epilogue.
I was thinking of The Crucible of God. That's where vicissitude remains without the Eldest and Ennoia survives, even though God himself steps in directly.

would elder scrolls Tonal Architecture be a okay mage paradigm?
>https://elderscrolls.fandom.com/wiki/Tonal_Architecture
and if so for what faction? sound based etherite?

>>98395692
Plot twist, he was actually killed for real, but an unique combo of levels 10 fortitude + dominate let's him rule his clan from beyond the grave, to the point he can embrace new 4th gens through them.

>>98396046
Things don't really get any more Etheric than Dwemer steampunk. Tonal Architecture could be his way of manipulating Ether waves.

>>98396097
Dominate 10's canon elder power is "This entire character-sheet is now added to mine", so killing ventrue would have been a slight inconvenience to him at best.

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>goddammit moon chaser, you just got cured and the first thing on your mind is raiding the sept's pantry?

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>>98395940
Then do something about those little bastarda

>>98396133
Imaginal Mantra + Faerie Kin my beloved
Go, creatures, and have raunchy fae sex with that Technocrat's prized systems AI

when was the v6 playtest again?

>>98396207
V6? What is this? The D&D port?

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>>98396202
Iteration X will never let that happen... even if it means being in debt to the NWO. Send Him in.

>>98396207
July 30 - August 2
>https://www.gencon.com/event_finder?search=%22Not+in+Our+Domain%21%22
>https://www.gencon.com/events/317875
>>98396260
no white wolf is also playtesting their next version of vtm (they haven't called it v6 yet but have put on the website that it's not v5 and a playtest) at gencon

>>98396279
Oh, I wasn't aware v5 was such a mess, to the point they are already doing a v6.

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>skipped m5 for v6

>>98396301
They dodged a bullet, see werewolf v5 or Wraith

>>98396301
>Corporate refuses to enshitten mage
And they say the Union never did anything good.

>>98396306
mummy when?

>>98396300
the new white wolf team did a presentation about themselves during which they said how they want to return to legacy in lore, tone, metaplot style, artstyle and page layout
https://docs.google.com/document/d/1J2faRdc-EAWmQdyz4E7DAS9yWXNR7-9TL48-LIdYAfI/edit?tab=t.0
and one of the writers said on discord that they don't like hunger dice and that in his opinion they barely work for vampire and just don't work for the rest of the splats

from the gencon event it seems they are starting their metaplot with the elders comming home after the beckoning
>The Masquerade is changing. Old powers are moving. Familiar conflicts are surfacing. Sit down, sharpen your fangs, and find out what these changes mean for you. Then tell us directly.
>The monsters are back. The nights are shifting, alliances may fracture, and the World of Darkness is at a turning point that

>>98396300
what do you mean already? v5 is over 8 years old it's the longest vtm edition we ever had not counting the time the setting was fully and utterly dead

>>98396367
Modern TTRPG game design doesn't believe in editions after how dramatically D&D 4e and 5.5 and Pathfinder 2e backfired. Putting out a new edition is seen as a gigantic risk these days.

>>98396367
Only 3 gamelines gained their v5

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>>98396367
>v5 is over 8 years old

>>98396300
>>98396353
>They genuinely got soulbombed by a Nip's COVER ART for V5 and immediately changed course
Based?
>>98396306
Orpheus is genuinely Not That Bad

>>98396367
time hasn't been real since 2016

We need a Mummy20, Curse of Ra upon those who say nay!

>>98396401
skill issue. wod went in the same timeframe from it's first book to revised and was already prepping from the endtimes

>>98396367
>>98396407
DnD 5E has been ongoing for over a decade, the time of editions is over save for the game being revolutionized by 3rd party media (BG3, CP 77)

>>98396423
> being revolutionized by 3rd party media (BG3, CP 77)
we kinda got the trash version of that vtmb2 was so bad paradox lost all faith in v5

>>98396511
very impressive considering how little vtmb2 had to do with the actual tabletop setting.

>>98396525
only impressive thing about the game

>>98396525
v5 only existed to be a advertisement for vtmb2 so now that the game is trashed we are soon to be (hopefully) free

>>98396562
considering how they lost more money on that game than they purchased the IP for, I wonder if they are looking to offload world of darkness at this point.

>>98396511
>>98396525
Indeed, game so bad Paradox nearly killed the IP and all of their aspirations for making non-spreadsheet games. Seems they're going over to just publishing non-spreadsheets full time now.

I know TCR deserves it for unironically being tasteless, but I can't feeling bad for the group of them stuck working on making Bloodlines 2 half-playable.

>>98396594
>Paradox lost 60x more on Bloodlines 2 than they spent to get the IP in the first place
Holy, Nuclear.

>>98396409
>Orpheus is genuinely Not That Bad
Anon, there's a post orpheus releasr of wraith. Wraith 20th.
It's to wraith what w5 is to werewolf.

>>98396414
>time hasn't been real since 2016
I'm half convinced the world actually ended in 2012 and we're all in pergatory

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>>98396353
Interesting. I'm cautiously optimistic.
My best case dream scenario is DAV20 with a few stolen ideas from Requiem like Touchstones, extended low-level abilities where one discipline may have 3 different 3 dot abilities and you only need one to buy the 4th or you could buy many, returning unique disciplines instead of merging everything together, and other gamelines like HtR and DtF getting their compilation editions with good editing. Hope 5th taught them a lesson about trying to do Rudi-tier Chechnya genocide gay nonsense to try to appeal to tiktok generation purple haired mtfs . Though I doubt they'll walk back the worst lore offenders like the Hecata or tribes being renamed/Metis being erased because muh cultural offenses.
>>98396511
>>98396606
>>98396434
I can't believe this whole mess was just because the IP videogames are cursed. Should've kept Mitsoda despite him being a pervert. I wonder if the HSL version was just THAT unfinished.

>>98396434
Gurps is still on its 4th edition. Since 2004.

>>98396645
>I wonder if the HSL version was just THAT unfinished.
we seen some levels from the Hard suit labs version and they are in the game near 1 to 1

the question is more what the chinese room been doing all the time given that they had to patch in stuff like weapon and firearm use months after launch

>>98396610
I'd figure Wraith would get the Demon and Mummy treatment, seeing as how it has no players.
>>98396645
Funnily something similar happened to 40K because Space Marine and Space Marine 2 specifically was just that good. I wouldn't even say the IP video games are cursed, we just had ONE bad game, a retarded policy for the MMO, and one middling game (Earthblood, unironically). Every other game worth mentioning in terms of the IP's popularity and overall metacognition has been relatively great
>Redemption
>Bloodlines
>Wraith VR
>Vamp VR
>4 rather good text games, 2 kind of mediocre ones, and then a bunch of nonsense that isn't in the discussion
The couple of games coming like the Disco-like, Deathwise, and Furry Twin-stick shooter, have much better presentation and signs of quality than Bloodlines 2.

>>98396673
>GURPS
Next you'll tell me about FATAL
>>98396704
iirc TCR got tasked with a complete story rewrite and molding the game around what Paradox wanted, as well as probably the hub and gameplay level connections. The few things that have been said about the HSL is that it was more a bunch of unconnected levels

>>98396718
Since you brought it up could you roll a a few d100s.

Rolled 51, 17, 43, 92, 54, 82, 51, 26, 21, 92 = 529 (10d100)

>>98396798
Sure why not, tell me my fate.

>>98396814
Roll for anal circumference

>>98396814
Let my old laptop boot up to see what Nephilim quirks your next characters will be cursed with.

>>98396823
To do that you need to roll 80 physical sub abilities to define your physicality.

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>>98396832
>Missed the Joke

>>98396353
I'm not holding my breath and neither have you. They haven't actually announced a new edition, meaning they're likely still trying to sell Paradox on it. More importantly I don't trust anyone involved and bet all a new edition will actually do it further balkanize the fanbase and extend Paradox's failed custodianship by another half decade.

>>98396353
>outst*r
>h*bby von wokestein
>some brazilian commie probably
oof

>>98396814
>(51) The Anakim may cast Bestow Virus 1/day. Ignore reuirements.

>(17) The Anakim's eyes are black & have no whites, decrease Facial Charisma by 2d10, since the feature is obviously inhuman. It is impossible to observe where the character is looking at.

>(43) The Anakim may cast Force Missile 1/day. Ignore reuirements.

>(92) The Anakim heals twice as fast.

>(54) The Anakim has a hatred for Ogres.

>(82) The Anakim has demonic Wisdom, gain 1d20 for each sun abilities *ROLLED SEPARATELY*

>(26) The Anakin has anger issues.

>(21) The Anakin is white as hell, reduce facial charisma by 1d10.

Rolled 3 (1d10)

>>98396823
I assume D10s are used, why not.
>>98396827
What do you mean next?
>>98396926
Sheeeit, it's not looking so good. I'm just an angry, ugly schizo Wolverine.

>>98393826
Who are the "John X" of each splat?

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*solos your entire setting*

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>Batman but he's a Toreador with Malk traits
Thoughts?

>>98396986
>Sheeeit, it's not looking so good. I'm just an angry, ugly schizo Wolverine.
Hey you can give people actual aids once per day so you will take down people even if they kill you.

>>98397016
Batman is a Nossie

>>98397022
But he actually fuck bitches, and bitches willingly fall for him?

>>98397029
He has Resources 10.

>>98397016
Any version of batman with actual splat powers is cringe. Batman is the icon of Human accomplishment standing next to the most roided up heroes in fiction.

>>98397041
And no would buy that shit in WoD because he reads like an Akashic, the most mediocre tradition.

>>98397050
Anon, he has Resources 9-10 and an entire military production facility.
He's more heavily armed than many small nations.

>>98397059
I'd say that Bruce Wayne has resources 8, Tony Stark 9, and Lex Luthor 10.

>>98397059
Doesn't he also have an exo-suit in his batsuitand regularly abuse Venom steroids in newer comics(since they started leaning on sci-fi)?

>>98397041
>tibetian martial arts
he's actually an akashaic mage

>>98397041
Truth, but if someone is gonna assign him a clan its gonna be the obsessive info gathers who live in spooky caves & have Potence & Obfuscate & a tie to things like bats

>>98397029
Bitches fucking him has little to do with his character

>>98397078
Anon, non-mages can learn Do.
Batman might be a Shih demonhunter though. He does canonically use Chi arts though.

bruce is just the one guy who is allowed to use either the combat or streetfighter book while everyone else runs on corebook rules and his player keeps talking about how op normal humans can be

>>98397138
>just the one guy who is allowed to use either the combat or streetfighter book while everyone else runs on corebook rules
Don't even need to do that. If you have everone on the WoD: Combat system, he'd be the only guy who put point into all of brawl, melee, martial arts, and bought Do ontop for a full 8 combat maneuvers per dot.