>>214797951
Love

>>214797951
Narcissistic schizos with a God complex rarely avoid self-destructing eventually

>tfw god can forgive every sin, murder, rape, theft etc, he can can forgive every sin except one: not believing he exists

why?

>>214797951
mental retardation

>>214797989
God wants a relationship with those that search for Him. If He appeared upon the earth in a pillar of fire and demanded all humanity worship Him that wouldn't be free will.

>>214797951
It is in the Jew's nature to do evil shit

>>214798036
>If He appeared upon the earth in a pillar of fire
But according to scripture and therefore doctrine he did do that in the past. So what changed?

>>214797951
To free man from his original sin so jews werent special anymore, just to spite them

>>214798036
I get the "free will" argument, he wants his believers to have a choice, but is there really a choice when the alternative is eternal damnation? The existence of hell sort of debunks the "free will" argument

>"you don't HAVE to believe I exist, it's your choice!"
>"but if you don't, you'll burn for eternity"

>>214797951
to be one with God. don't you know Christianity is all about that? you lose body attachment (he was actually smiling on the cross, but Mel knows nothing about that) and you live in this world without being of this world

>>214798075
and it came with terrible judgements and massive human loss each time. So God devised a final solution through Christ where He would not have to pour out wrath upon the earth constantly.

>>214797951
Because he loves you, anon.

>>214798103
hell isn't mean to be a threat. It's simply a reality of those who are cast out of God's presence.

>>214798178
it is a threat though. god has to punish sinners, so if you don't accept jesus's sacrifice, then you have to pay the price

you can give the "well hell is just separation from god" spiel but traditional church doctrine for the past 2000 years has been it's a place of conscience torment

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>>214798227
I mean it's just true. Also hell wasn't created for human souls. It was created for satan and the fallen angels which joined him in rebellion against heaven. A lot of people have a misconception about hell that satan is some kind of king there and his demons rule as overseers or something, when in fact they are the chief victims of hell and will suffer the most. A human soul is an eternal gift and if you do not join with God, then you will be cast off into the pit. Evil cannot exist in the presence of a Holy God. Therefore human beings cannot stand before God without accepting His substitution for their evil.

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>>214798036
Oh but to harden a pharaoh’s heart? What then huh huh huh huh huh

>>214797951
for (you)

>>214798337
as we see today. many hearts of stone that cannot be saved

>>214797951
For you and me

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>>214797951
he thought picrel would save him.
alas, he was forsakened.

>>214798178
And all of those who were unlucky to be born not-Christians, lol.
You people are so fucking retarded with your laughable cope.

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>>214798464
>but what about those who weren't born Christian and never hear about Jesus?!
hello r3ddit.
Their spirit will be judged and the worthy and will be granted access to Heaven or they will be cast into hell. Just like many Old Testament figures as example before the crucifixion of Christ

>>214798464
Wow, anon. You're so smart. Surely you're the first person to wrestle with such insight and, of not, have read extensively on the subject so as to present such a seemingly shallow observation as damning (no pun intended).

>>214798547
Ever notice how much diversity of thought there is in Christianity vs. fedora fundamentalism? Just point out he feels comfortable hyping Scientism without even knowing how to do basic calculus, lol.

>>214798572
And yet you can't answer that.
>>214798547
Funny, in another part its stated that only through Christ you go to heaven, so which one is it?
Also, why should someone that never heard the message be punished if he for example performed human sacrifice? What will happen with Papuan head hunters? Shouldn't your god tell them that what they do is bad?

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Why did he do it?

>>214797951
To save you, OP.

>>214798672
because there has never been and never will be a purer, more uncorrupt soul

>>214797951
For you.

>>214798650
Christianity is a laughably absurd religion and Christians can't answer the simplest questions. At this point you are one of the most annoying 4chan users, you stupid fucks. Making your moronic threads on every board.
Why do you think you belong here in the first place?

>>214798314
>fallen angels which joined him in rebellion against heaven.
Fanfiction. Not Biblical.

>>214798547
>spirit will be judged
>you literally sin even if you just think of sinning
Well, good luck then, lol.

>>214798670
The answer is that what you hold up as a damning insight is obviously just you parroting the shallow preachings of fellow midwits, anon. You've never thought to dive deeply into the subject because you're intellectually lazy and fail to question your beliefs. Fedoras project that behavior onto religious people while never having investigated anything that confronts their own prejudice.

>>214798036
He appeared to Paul on the road to Damascus. But me, I'm just supposed to trust the word of some fucking pedophile who only knows God from a 2000 year old book?
I'm not antichristian, but I need more to go on than just "trust me bro"

>>214798103
>burn for eternity
Where does it say that in the bible?
"Hell" as most people know it, is catholic fanfiction.
In the bible if you die and aren't saved you're just dead.

>>214798036
>>214798314
>>214798547
It's really too bad that God gifted me a soul which isn't convinced by the meager evidence of His existence and as a result I will suffer for all eternity. If I could, I would have chosen a soul which made me believe in His sacrifice but I didn't get that choice so now my free will is leading me to eternal damnation.

>>214798717
>r/atheism thinks he belongs here
Imagine still falling for the fedora fad in current year.

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atheists CANNOT refute this 60 second clip:
https://youtube.com/shorts/nARz673L7BQ?si=buu8cuS_OFYTI0e-

>>214798812
Not everyone has the same path in life, and if you really want to do your head in, meditate on the existential horror that is calvinist pre-destination.

>>214797960
fpbp

>>214798670
not that guy but ask chatgpt and he will give u many different answers in theology.
tl;dr

nobody can really know for sure

>>214798812
(You) problem combined with a skill issue you don't want to admit is a skill issue.

>>214798796
>no answer

>>214798809
no jesus literally talks about burning in the lake of fire

if god can do anything why couldn't he just forgive himself, why was human sacrifice necessary? sounds like a weirdo aztec thing. is god aztec?

>>214798670
>what about le cannibal savages
they'll be sent to hell

>>214798936
worse. he's jewish

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>>214798918
>t.

>>214798932
Not at all.

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>>214798914
>Skill issue
Being a braindead zoomer is not a skill. No one actually chooses what they believe.

>>214798547
>Scholars, priests, philosophers and such have debated for thousands of years how some things go
>Catholic church changed the concept of limbo in the year 2007
>4chinner thinks he can call the shots and calls criticism as reddit
wew

>>214798956
so god's like... universally ugly and annoying?

>>214798982
Petty, neurotic, narcissistic. It's all in the Old Testament.

>>214798932
>you died at age 4 from a disease that malformed your body
>but you had all the chances, take responsibility
this is your brain on religion

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>>214798963
Trans.

>>214799024
wow i really learned something today from 4chan of all places

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>>214798926
correct
>Ye shall know them by their fruits. Do men gather grapes of thorns, or figs of thistles?
>Even so every good tree bringeth forth good fruit; but a corrupt tree bringeth forth evil fruit.
>A good tree cannot bring forth evil fruit, neither can a corrupt tree bring forth good fruit.
>Every tree that bringeth not forth good fruit is hewn down, and cast into the fire.
>Wherefore by their fruits ye shall know them.

Instant wisdom that cuts through all of modern deceit. In a land of intentional confusion. When you cannot discern who is a state actor, psyop, etc. Examine the product of what they create and you will know.

None of it matters. "By their fruits ye shall know them" and you immediately know who is evil.

>>214797951
I quit watching when they depicted Satan as an eyebrowless freak with a snake coming out of him. Way too corny.

Also, this movie violates the 2nd commandment, probably.

I'll just stick to reading the Bible. Catholics are weird. Mel's okay, though.

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ok to clear up some arguments

jesus never referred to god as yahweh (jewish god) in the second testament which was written in greek which was basically a telling of jesus's life and teachings

secondly jesus ministered that even if you didn't call him lord but still walked as he would (did the right thing) you'd make it into heaven

"last shall come first and first shall come last" type shit

so fret not young atheist that has done no harm you are still allowed into heaven

and even if you've been a little naughty you can always repent and be allowed into heaven as long as you weren't full of shit and did the same sin over and over again and tried to cheat god by repenting every time

it's pretty simple stuff

so love god
so love thy neighbour

and you'll be ok

>>214799217
>secondly jesus ministered that even if you didn't call him lord but still walked as he would (did the right thing) you'd make it into heaven

No

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>worlds highest IQ (276) is Christian
why is this always the case?
https://youtu.be/lA_uTAtluHM?si=hiHEbwCpxJhqiIOT

>>214799245
“Not every one that saith unto me, Lord, Lord, shall enter into the kingdom of heaven; but he that doeth the will of my Father which is in heaven.”
(Matthew 7:21, KJV)

>>214799250
>worlds highest IQ (276)
Wow! That person must have a lot of groundbreaking accomplishments. May I see them?

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>>214799387
>Wow! That person must have a lot of groundbreaking accomplishments. May I see them?

>>214799387
just look at all the books he has

>>214798803
>but I need more to go on than just "trust me bro"
Well that's all you or anyone else is going to get most of the time unless you expect God to personally appear to you. God himself is the big question. If you come down on believing in God then you just sort of accept the provided answers to the lesser questions. Like sure OK Mary was a virgin when she gave birth, whatever, there's no way for me to test or not test that but God is real and Christianity is correct so I'll accept their answer for that, is my position.

>>214799630
>unless you expect God to personally appear to you.
yes

If you were really smart you wouldn't give a shit about how smart or dumb people were that had a belief as long as it seemed true to you.

You pretty much cannot prove anything in this world anymore. I haven't been to space I don't know anybody that has. I've seen some blurry footage of the moon from the 60's but that's about it.

If a man walked up to the nearest hill and told you that the sphagetti monster existed after that hill would you believe him on his word? Or would you walk up that hill yourself even though you've got a busy day of shitposting and you'd be wheezing from the journey to see if it was true...

>>214798963
The fact you can't admit it as a skill issue is more important than it being a skill issue. That's what makes it a (You) problem.

>>214799687
see>>214799733

Also a lot of you don't realise you need to be possessed by the holy spirit when reading the word of god this will only happen during periods of your life where god feels you require it. If you don't need it, often the bible won't make sense to you or resonate with you. It's not because you lack anything or are a bad person it's just you don't need the word of god in that exact moment to help you.

>>214799755
Not sure what point you're trying to make. But yes, if someone told me some crazy shit like that, then I would have to see it for myself to believe it.

>>214799295
You still have to call him Lord, retard. You ALSO have to do the will of the Father. And the will of the Father is for you to love God and Christ, so he gets you both ways.

>>214799841
The point is pretty obvious it's pretty hard to prove anything now and even harder back in biblical times...

Do you believe in space? I'm not even a flat earther but I'm pretty sure I can count on my hand how many people have been to space. Do you believe their testimony and what NASA has produced as proof of space or do you need to go their yourself for it to be proof? Because it's pretty crazy story when you think about it.

>>214799910
Christ only talks about loving the father and loving thy neighbour he doesn't say you need to love him although he'd prefer you love him. Jesus never requires you to call him lord in fact he says the lords will be your servant's.

>>214799910
Recognition of divinity isn't just saying "I believe this specific thing so I get a golden ticket to heaven", brainlet.

>>214797951
Because eve ate the fruit and got us all in trouble

>>214800041
>strongly opinionated but doesn't even know there are two different creation stories that conflict with one another right at the beginning of Genesis

>>214797989
He forgives if you repent, if you didn't believe in God why would you think those things are wrong? It's easy to justify all those sins.

>>214799250
>posts bait making fun of Christians
>only the fedoras fall for it
Kek.

>>214799976
In a way you could say that I don't believe in space, because it has no effect on the way I live my life. On the other hand, I do believe in gravity for example, since I often make decisions based on the assumption that it is real. In the same way, if I had any proof of God whatsoever, even just a one-off mystical experience, it would radically change how I live my life

>>214797989
>>214800084
God sent Jesus to us to teach man how to behave hence the "what would jesus do" wristbands back in the day. So knowing you are doing the wrong thing and then repenting for it after you've done it and then sinning once again doesn't cut it neither does repenting on your death bed even though all your life you've known it was the wrong thing.

This is nonsense trying to play lawyer to God and will only secure your soul in hell.

>>214799976
Not that anon, but i am an astronomy fag, but if you have really good eyes you can see the crescent of venus with the naked eye. With a good pair of binoculars you can see it even better. A cheap telescope will show you mars with decent enough resolution to see atmospheric haze and large surface features.
The camera on your phone is good enough to take pictures of jupiter and its moons, as well as saturn and its moons.
You're not going to get hubble quality images from your backyard obviously, but assuming you're night sky isn't ruined with light polution space is pretty accessible to an amateur.

>>214800149
Because no one replies to /qa/tranny posts except false flagging /qa/trannies.

>>214800183
Why'd you tag me, I don't disagree.
I'm asking that guy if he's an atheist nihilist, why would he oppose those sins.

>>214800152
>>214800185
I hear some shit that samsung phones wont let you take a clear image of the moon and ai kicks in and gives you a pre-rendered image or some shit.

but yeah a good pair of bino's wont do that to you for obvious reasons.

That's an aside to what about the fact that light doesn't bend around solar systems according to Newtonian physics and astronomers say it's because dark matter is interfering with the lights gravity.

So it disproves newtonian physics and don't bull shit me about relativity because they only just figured this shit out in the 70's...

People forget that all these scientific laws like gravity are just a thesis that works until proven false and this has occurred in science time and time again think spontaneous generation where 1800's people thought germs just spontaneously generated before they created the microscope.

>>214800301
I'm saying repenting but not actually changing your behaviour isn't really repenting it's just trying to trick god
>hey god I repent from stealing from the liquor store again
*steals again from the liquor store when anon runs out of liquor*

my point is you're still going to hell

>>214800280
>w-we didn't take the bait
Lol.

>>214800084
This falls apart the minute you remember that morality predates Christianity.

>>214800377
>repenting but not actually changing your behaviour
NTA. That's not repenting.

>>214800405
tell that to the baal worshipers and those that worship the fallen angels.

>>214800405
And comes back together once you realize that Christianity was and is a revolution in mortality.

>>214800080
Id like to hear more

>>214800427
sorry it's just people get this notion from a certain sect of people that they can trick god and Christianity is phoney because in the movies people repent on their death bed and make it into heaven even though they kept sinning their whole lives knowing they were sinning.

>>214797989
>>214800455
>yeah, it turns out no one had laws against theft before the first Church was built
>go figure

>>214797951
You ever get the feeling that the New Testament is sort of a low key threat?

Its like saying, we did this to Christ, and he was one of our own. What do you think we're going to do to you if you don't shut the fuck up?

>>214797970
Post nose

>>214797989
Belief in existence =/= faith in Christ as Lord

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>>214797951
To save goats from your sins.
Jesus loves goats.

>>214800492
>implying salvation is works based

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>>214800467
The Bible is a blended text and contains myth, poetry, history, and legal codes. The mythic parts frequently contract one another because ancients expressed themselves in an entirely different linguistic universe than we do today. If you're interested in going deeper into this check out The Great Code and Words With Power by Northrop Frye.

>>214797951
To pwn the libs

>>214800522
>turns out no one had laws against theft before
Cool strawman, brainlet.

>>214800084
>"you wouldn't think murder was wrong if you didn't believe in christian morals"

I think murder is wrong, but I see no problem with masturbating or having pre marital sex, both of which are serious sins. What now?

>>214800528
“Labour not for the meat which perisheth, but for that meat which endureth unto everlasting life…”

“…your labour is not in vain in the Lord.”

>>214800492
Yeah. Those people are midwit NPCs, anon.

>>214801005
meant for >>214800874

>>214797951
for us anon

>>214801009
i know but i'd like to reach them because they make up the bulk of humanity

>>214800528
it's the original threat by them
>you start questioning us you get merked
doesn't matter if your a good person or not we will still kill you

it happened pretty recently

>god cant see the goodness in humans
>jesus could see it so he died for our sins
this nigga thought he was smarter than god lmao

>>214801029
They intentionally make themselves unreachable. Pearls before swine. They have 0 humility and pride is the father of all sins.

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>>214797951

>>214801074
Thing is I used to be a staunch athiest growing up because I had bad Christian teachers that didn't adequately answer my questions. Now as a adult and possessed by the holy spirit I see things truly. I guess I just think more people can be shown the truth.

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i'm not a religious person. i just see that everything that talks shit about christianity is ugly and evil. why would i want to join them?

>>214801074
The smug, arrogant Christian turns more people away from Jesus than any fedora tipper

>>214801212
>The smug, arrogant Christian
name one

>>214801237
>>214801074

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>>214798314
God is really screwing up his whole plan by hiding like this.
I mean the whole Heaven and Hell thing would work so much better if we all knew it was legit.
Show me God and I'll cooperate like a son of a bitch.
I'll obey like a scared peasant in North Korea.
I don't want to be tortured forever. But at the moment it just looks like jewish tricks.

>>214801243
explain what you think smugness and arrogance means because my definitions don't apply to this post.

>>214801259
>My beliefs are pearls and if you don't buy them, you're swine.

>>214801284
where i come from that's called a metaphor, the point of which is not a quality judgement of either pearls or swines.

>>214801252
But then it wouldn't be FAITH. And faith(believing imaginary nonsense) is important because
>>214801284
Wait till they start quote the 14th Psalm at you, "seee, it says right in my magic book that if you don't believe it you stupid"

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For Moby Aids.

>>214801212
>focus on low-hanging fruit
>refuse to actually study religion
>pretend scientism is a mark of intelligence
>encourage supporters to react with ridicule and snark
Gee, I wonder why New Atheism went so wrong and its legacy is intellectually lazy fedora tippers.

>>214801284
>he thinks someone was calling him a pig
Fedoras can't into metaphor.

>>214798038
>Saving people
>Evil

>>214797951
Because if he couldn't become mortal and survive death, he wouldn't be God.

>>214801383
ironic coming from someone who literally thinks god died in human form and then came back to life and flew into the sky

>>214801388
Fedora anti-Semites seem to focus in on "Jews think they're better than everyone because they were chosen to exemplify God's earthly mandate" while not realizing the OT is story after story, poem after poem, history after history, about how they continuously fall short and often flat out fail to do so, lol.

>>214801468
That story contains metaphorical undertones by necessity, brainlet. Irony is trying to score a point by projecting your own literalism in response to the statement you can't into metaphor and, thereby, exposing you can't into metaphor. Lol.

>>214801594
You know as well as I do that most Christians take that account literally

>>214801613
So? If you think of them as below you why are you focusing on what you consider to be low hanging fruit? That says more about you than it does about them.

>>214801149
>Thing is I used to be a staunch athiest growing up
It's a phase a lot of people go through and the Nu Atheist movement monetized it. It was a fad but some people still buy into it because they think it signifies high IQ. The reality is it was a bad shortcut that retards intellectual growth and being an adult that professes he doesn't believe in Santa Claus is silly at face value.
>I guess I just think more people can be shown the truth.
I know this will trigger that fedora but the saying is "you can lead an ass to water but you can't make it drink".

>>214801691
I never said that but whatever. I just think anyone who believes in jewish fairy tales is a donkey brained retard (metaphorically of course, you dont literally have donkey brains youre just really fuckin stupid)

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I’m a Catholic but man do I love Rome. Even the Son of God had to remind everyone
>Render unto Caesar

>>214801835
>I never said that
It's implicit, anon. You're not that bright.
>I just think anyone
No one cares about what you "think", anon. It's obvious you don't.

>>214801856
Would Christianity have been as successful if there was no Western Rome inviting norther Europeans southwards (inadvertently through food and other resource availability) and swelling their ranks? What about if their was no Byzantine sheltering Christendom from Islamists? Obviously you BBC an just hand wave and say it would go according to God’s Will but it might have been a situation where Christians end up being the next Jews: minority population left surviving in the corners of civilization.

>>214801867
Im done casting pearls before donkey brains

>>214801935
Cool.

>>214801934
Would your mother be happier if your dad had pulled out? Lol.

>>214801934
Christ obviously knew what was going to happen with Rome. He had nothing but good things to say about them.
And the byzantines were only a portion of Christians. Maybe not even 10 percent of all in Europe.

>>214797951
>nooooo yeshua why have you forsaken me reeeees
>uhm ackshually jesus meant to die all according to keikaku
Jesus’ last words are one of the few things I take as historical fact because they should’ve retconned it out to suit their narrative.

He's a man of his word

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>>214801934
I think it would have. For a long time Christians were considered were persecuted unlike Jews, until hadrians extermination in year 70. The Roman empire did try and stop it and forced it underground, (that is were the fish symbol comes from, pic related) it took 300 years for Christianity to become the dominant faith. The benefit Rome provided is trade networks, allowing faster spread of the message. This wasnt just Roman networks either, the disciple Matthew followed the spice trade lanes and ended up in India. Byzantine sheltering of Christianity was actually rather poor. Most of north Africa fell to islam, Asia minor fell, Greece remained Christian long after the ere fell. With exception of Albania, (current, biggest scumbags on earth.) Europe became more Christian after the empire fell in spite of gothic conquest.

>>214797951
For (You). Unironically.

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>>214797951
He had the chutzpah to declare himself the son of G-d. Yeshua bar Pantera was an Amalekite by birth. His followers were poor and stupid. All of the Greeks that followed him were also poor and stupid. They had no money. They were impoverished. Needy. Beggars. They went without. They were in the red. They had empty pockets. They couldn't pay the rent (that's why Yosef let Miriam stay even though she was an adulteress). He terrorised a market because it reminded him of the abject poverty he grew up in. Maybe if he had 31 shekels Judas wouldn't have needed to turn him over. Who listens to a poor? If G-d loved him so much why didn't he make him rich?

>>214797989
More like why did God create an eternal hell in the first place
>Because of evil people and demons!
Who the fuck do you think manifested said evil?
This implies God creates some consciousnesses solely to suffer forever in a hell he created

>>214798314
Did God not know Satan and some angels would rebel?
Could he not have prevented it or convinced them otherwise with all his power?

>>214797989
It's not about God, it's about if you know you're forgiven or not. You can't know you're forgiven if you don't know you're forgiven or deny it (but really the denial is just funny thrashing because ha ha you're forgiven YOU'RE FORGIVEN HAHA JEW YOU'RE FORGIVEN!)

>>214798075
He wanted to show up and explain/actuate that salvation is freely available and not the domain of any 'chosen' people. That's all

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>>214797951

>>214802893
Yeah probably. Satan's an angel too which means he is a perfect spirit of some part of God's will, and incapable of change before or after the War in Heaven (and therefore was the same guy doing and thinking the same things when he was part of the celestial host), so yeah Lucifer's doing what he needs to do.

>>214799630
If God knows exactly what it would take for someone to sincerely believe in and love him, yet still refused to provide that to the individual, either through incompetence or maliciousness, what does that say about God?

>>214799032
That's obviously a biological woman

>>214802969
But as anon said >>214798739
The whole concept of Satan being a fallen angel who rebelled against heaven is non-canon. Never appears in the Bible.

So a non-christian who does nothing but good things in life will go to hell but a christian who was baptized but was a shitty human being goes to heaven?

>>214802866
>More like why did God create an eternal hell in the first place
Humans create their own hells, anon.

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>>214803023

>>214803023
Ah well I wouldn't know, I just try to find what may be lost hidden meaning in mythology and world-understanding

>>214803237
This was a hell realm long before humans and it will continue to be one long after we're all gone

>>214803480
Hell yes brother

>>214797951
He thought God was two weeks away from returning.

>>214803117
No. Of course not.
False christians are singled out as the worst of the worst.
Also catholic dogma has the harrowing of hell, which was jesus (in the three days he was dead) going to hell and pardoning the "noble savages" good and virtuous people who never heard the gospel.
In a practical sense it was a way to make greek philosophers and the like "kosher" its saying: sure they were pagans but it wasn't their fault.
But the whole missionary and evangelical doctrine of christianity is to spread the gospel to all corners of the earth.

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>>214802847
Every single sentence you wrote is disgusting slander and blasphemy. Just severe, severe misunderstandings. Stop regurgitating the Talmud for two seconds and do some independent research. Your own scriptures testify FOR Jesus. Isaiah 53. Your people have been wrong for millenia.

https://youtu.be/FhDy07nMcck

By the way the guy on the left in your pic is not a Christian, praying with people from other religions is considered apostasy. American Evangelical Protestantism, which he's probably a part of, is not true, only Orthodoxy is.

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Threadly reminder there is no evidence for rabbi yeshua

There are ZERO firsthand accounts of this man

The closest thing we have are the gospels which are anonymous, in third person and written up to 90 years later. Names like Matthew, Mark, Luke, etc. were all just added later for credibility.

>>214804300
I can testify

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>>214804300
nice historical standard you've got there

>>214804595
You're arguing the quantity of it's reproductions as validity of the original source material?

>>214804595
The more copies there are the more realer it is

>>214802990
It's free will. He's not going to make it that easy. There will be enough there to start down the path and once you do at some point God will likely reach out to you.

>>214804300
>no evidence
>just these various direct accounts of him and even more indirect accounts

>>214804734
What if it's not a challenge but a simple message about knowing you are saved, and the rest is just the appropriate existential exploration of what it means to be alive and know that or not

Consider the impasse of a one-god universe. He is all-knowing and all-powerful. He can't go anywhere since He is already everywhere, He can't do anything since the act of doing presupposes opposition. His universe is irrevocably thermodynamic, having no friction by definition.
So he has to create friction. (War, fear, sickness, death) To keep his dying show on the road. Sooner or later
>Look, boss, we don't have enough energy left
To fry an elderly woman in a fleabag hotel bar"
>Well, we'll have to start faking it"
Joe looks after him sourly and mixes a bicarbonate of soda
>Sure, start faking it, sure, and leave the details to Joe
Now look, from a real disaster, you get a pig event. Sacrifice, heroism, grief, separation, fear, and violent death. And remember, one violent death yields more energy than a cancer ward. So, from an energy surplus, you can underwrite the next one. So, from an energy surplus, you can underwrite the next one. But the first one is a fake, you can't underwrite a shit house!
Try to explain to God Almighty where his one-god universe is going. Asshole doesn't know what buttons to push or what happens when you push them! Man and ship, goddammit, every man for himself!
Recollect Pope John XXIII saying
>Like a little soldier, I stand at
Attention in the presence of my captain
The old army game from here to eternity
Get there firstest with the brownest nose

>>214804734
>There will be enough to start down the path
I'm still waiting. A simple "hello" would suffice.

>>214797960
based

>>214804866
Not to play God's advocate here but where exactly are you not getting 'hellos' from creation itself, considering we are talking about The Creator?

>>214804595
>durr more copies = more realer
Also it doesn't really matter if any of those other people actually existed or were stand-ins for some other author.
But the entire Christian faith is predicated on Jesus being a real guy.

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>>214804767
gospels are not direct accounts. they are not written in first person.

cope

>>214804734
free will is unbiblical and a nonsensical cope to explain a failed contradictory deity

>>214804930
>But the entire Christian faith is predicated on Jesus being a real guy.
I'm going to get a little goofy here but really all that needs to happen is for the narrative/mythology/cosmology to work for people. They'll have limited explanations when asked if Christ was historically real, but when you meet a guy who quit alcohol after almost dying and killing others in a car crash he caused, he'll tell you he's personally met the guy

>>214804926
I mean having an interaction with an undeniably conscious entity. Like Moses supposedly talking face to face with God on mount sinai. Sure nature is incredible, but i dont get the sense that it has a purpose, a plan, or a will.

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Do you know how I know the gospels aren't real?
Because there's fucking magic in it.
It's like reading a history book and suddenly it says, "And then Abraham Lincoln transformed into a dragon." That's all the proof you need that the source is bullshit.

Disagree? Show me proof of magic before talking to me about your book. You're putting the cart before the horse.

>>214797951
For you.

>>214805177
Yeah you're not going to get something nearly as fleshy as that, when people say they've met Jesus it's more of a psychological phenomenon and a personal intimacy with the cosmological character. At the end of the day the message is you're fine, it's a gospel of grace. Just know you're forgiven by the highest orders in the universe, really.

>>214804941
>they are not written in first person.
That doesn't mean they aren't direct accounts.

>free will is unbiblical and a nonsensical cope to explain a failed contradictory deity
The bible makes no sense whatsoever if we don't have will to choose and act. It is full of stories about that. Abraham, Job, etc. Jesus constantly talking about how people choose to behave.

>>214805184
Okay so what are you, some type of reprobate fundamentalist? Can't even hear 'you're forgiven' without becoming a person who demands belief in divine pillars of fire? Synthesize yourself instead of living in schism, please

>>214805184
That has nothing to do with magic you actual retard. Holy shit why is everyone on this board outright theologically and metaphysically retarded? Why must you people well poison and gaslight to fit your narrative?

>>214805261
They are not. They are anonymous. And written in third person.

You don't even know who wrote them

>>214804300
Are you that retard who copes by claiming Josephus and Tacitus was faked?

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>>214805261
The jewish god wants you to bear the responsibility while he has all the authority

It is cosmic narcissist abuse

You don't know your own theology. Even salvation is not your choice

>>214805400
So was Tacitus nicknamed after being a tacit guy or were we like 'Man, you're being Tacit right now' when we saw a guy who reminded us of him

>>214805400
Not firsthand witnesses. All they did was write about the beliefs of christians. Which only proves that christians existed.
It's like saying, "I went to a church and there were people who believed in Jesus. Therefore Jesus is real."

>>214805425
>God comes down and says 'hey if you're listening, i don't blame you for any of this and i've got you saved'
WHY IS HE PUNISHING MEEEE!?!?!?

>>214805330
>you don't get the deep theological meaning of cutting baby dicks
"Theology" is a total load. It is made up bullshit, anybody can make up "theology" and be right because it isn't real

>>214805490
Who is he saving me from?

Go on tell me

where do i start with christianity

>>214805425
So you're a shill. You don't actually have conversations. You just repeat talking points.
Lots of these 'christianity is le jewish' shills out there.

>>214805462
>all these people converted out of nowhere..l. just because ok?
The cope levels is off the charts for you. Most things don't spread out of thin air and become the entire bedrock to Western Morality and law. c'mon now. You can bitch and moan about the tenants of Christianity but dying on this hill He was made up just makes you look like an autistic retard with a chip on your shoulder because mommy made you go to sunday school.

>>214805556
Go to an Orthodox Church service.

>>214805513
>anybody can make up "theology" and be right because it isn't real
Do you people even read what you type.

>>214805525
Just the idea you're alone, because you're not, and you should know that. I'm not a fire and brimstone guy myself, seems like a ploy
>>214805513
The efficacy of Theology is based on its practical applications. Often rare and lost within structure, but you can learn love for your surroundings through Shintoism and so forth.

>>214805556
Read the bible. Don't watch some youtube video or listen to some talking head. Start with John or Luke if you don't have the patience for starting at Genesis.

>>214805556
Take what you're feeling now and put little reminders of it around your house, using whatever language makes sense to you, and try to remember what resonates with you about Christianity when you feel as though you are in crisis. Use it to enjoy good times a little more, maybe.

>>214805570
>religion was successful, therefore it's true
Are you aware that other religions exist?
Just look at Scientology and Mormonism if you want to see how new religions can pop up out of nowhere and succeed even when they're obviously made up.

>>214805525
Yourself. One way to look at Hell, aside from the demons and the torture, is that the souls there are the farthest away from God and that they're so darkened that God's love and light causes suffering. Not because God's Love is a punishment but because you've disfigured your soul so bad that the Good hurts you. You don't want to be a demon, do you?

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I love Jesus, and I don't care how MAD it makes you dorks.

>>214805738
Who sends people to hell?

Go on answer

Also hell is"distance from god" evangelical gaslight

The bible literally says jewgod intentionally created it to torture people

>>214804767
Based on a specific selection of stories about him that a council decided to include in the book a century after his death.
And there were a whole fuck of a lot of them that they didn't include, and some of those varied wildly. At least one said Jesus was a woman, and at least one other said he was gay.
You know there was a very early sect of Jesus worship that ate semen? They believed everything white to be the essence of purity.

It's probably just a coincidence that many of those stories that were included in the Bible share a lot of similar elements to religions that had already existed in Rome when Jesus was around.

All that being said, I think it is safe to say there was probably a real guy that kicked the snowball rolling at some point, even if the chances are low that ball at the bottom of the hill was anything like the original.

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>>214805556
Start by making friends at a local church. Then your social life will be dependent on your faith and you'll be able to gaslight yourself into believing it to maintain your friendships.
Don't bother reading the bible, nobody does. Doesn't matter what's in there anyways.

I don't want to go to church, I don't want to interact with normies. Can I still be a Christian?

>>214805561
>no argument

I accept your defeat. Also why are you ashamed you worship Jews lol

>>214805820
Hell isn't real. Don't hamper your spirit just on behalf of some Catholics or Evangelist cults with low spiritual literacy

>>214805881
Why would you want to be one?

>>214804621
>>214804732
>>214804930
You guys are retarded. He's pointing out there's more evidence for a historical Jesus than there is for many other historical figures you take for granted. For example, almost all of what we know about Alexander the Great comes from sources written half a millennia after he died.

>>214805837
> At least one said Jesus was a woman, and at least one other said he was gay.
>You know there was a very early sect of Jesus worship that ate semen?
Which by the way, is the best reason for why a group would get together and nail down a collection of stories that told the messages they wanted to say in one book.
They saw a movement gaining a lot of momentum, and saw the opportunity to wrangle it and direct it before it dispersed in every direction.

>>214805881
The modern Christian revival is happening in the hearts and minds of young people. None of them actually go to church because the churches are all fucked.

>>214805911
Ah so it's more about the unbroken chain of testifications, than it is their quantity. I would still say though that this chain is by definition still made of reproductions, and the passing on of testifications does not actually prove the truth of anyone in that chain

>>214805837
>Based on a specific selection of stories about him that a council decided to include in the book a century after his death.
>And there were a whole fuck of a lot of them that they didn't include, and some of those varied wildly. At least one said Jesus was a woman, and at least one other said he was gay.
>You know there was a very early sect of Jesus worship that ate semen? They believed everything white to be the essence of purity.
I don't know what podcast you heard this on but it isn't true at all. Name these sects.

>>214805911
That chart is bullshit btw

The other items have much more earlier copies than centuries

Also more copies doesn't mean the original is the truth

It has more copies because Rome adopted it as the state religion and punishable by death or exile if you don't worship the jew

People weren't enlightened to the Roman version of Christianity they were forced at the end of the sword

>>214805820
Don't you think your actions and choices matter? I don't even know what your point is. Are you shirking responsibility and trying to put it all on God? It's neither here nor there, there's grace and mercy, and there's your input, your faith and works, but it's a personal mystery for everyone. If you think Hell is your pre-determined final destination and you hear that like a broken record in your mind, maybe you should look into that. If you're feeling judged because you've done something you feel guilty of, that's another conversation.

What I tried to quote to the best of my memory was an Orthodox explanation I read somewhere.

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>>214805750
It's funny to me how God had to do a convoluted blood sacrifice to himself before he could forgive people for crimes they didn't commit.
But then he just forgives everything without exception. No matter how many toddler murders you did.

>>214806036
He's talking about the Council of Nicaea and their declaration of Arianism and Modalism as heresies

>>214805971
The group that created the version of your Christianity has no relation to the initial members (Constantine, council of nicea)

It could all be bullshit for all you know. They would suppress authentic ones and preserve the one useful to them (give Cesar into Cesar). Also Constantine rejected Christianity his entire life despite christianizing Rome lol. He only converted on his deathbed (so they say)

>>214806069
Can your gods will be thwarted yes or no?

>>214806125
> He only converted on his deathbed (so they say)
I thought he stared into the sun for too long before a battle and came back feeling forgiven for his war crimes?

>>214806096
Neither of which have anything to do with Jesus being trans or eating semen

>>214806084
keep getting your theology from south park bro :thumbsup:

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>>214806006
>historiographically ignorant
Your opinion is invalid.
>>214806040
>t-that chart is bullshit
Cool cope but that doesn't change the fact you were blind to an argument that was made because of personal prejudice and ignorance, anon.

Man, the fact fedoras never match the strength of their opinion to the level of knowledge they possess is one of them most damning things about them. It's fucking crazy that the Nu Atheists encouraged that behavior and you guys bought into it without realizing the LARP.

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>>214805556
read the gospels in a translation that makes sense to you and then consider praying this prayer daily for the next three months or so. that would be a start.

>>214805911
And I'm pointing out that it doesn't matter whether Alexander the Great existed. The important part is that the Macedonians conquered the Mediterranean. Whether it was him or some other list of kings and generals doesn't really matter.

>>214806222
it is because the other figures are inflated they were definitely earlier than the chart states

Also more copies doesn't mean it's true jewsheep

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>>214806084
>t.

>>214806147
u gonna reply to anything I wrote or just throw short phrases at me while I write paragraphs

I already answered your question pretty much

>>214805556
Throw it in the trash and don't waste your life worshiping Jewish faitytales and a holy book that contains errors

>>214806249
>it doesn't matter whether Alexander the Great existed
>t. some random retard on 4chan who has never read a history book and had to look up what "historiography" means
Lol

>>214806284
Yes or no

It's a simple question

>>214806163
Not trans, biological woman. As funny as it is to think that one was true, it was more likely a group of way too early feminists riding high on hopium.
But that's the whole point. Jesus was a game of telephone interpreted by everyone who heard about him as their own people's hero.

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>>214806006
Maybe it just tells you that many great men grappled with what that figure represented.
>Behold, I stand at the door, and knock: if any man hear my voice, and open the door, I will come in to him, and will sup with him, and he with me.

>>214806259
>completely ignorant of the historiography as it relates to ancient history
>seethes about it
Lol.

>>214806170
>>214806283
You guys are really butthurt about South Park right now huh?
It was just a humorous image to go with the phrase "toddler murder". That episode had nothing to do with theology.

>>214805639
Don't start at Genesis, that's counterproductive. I started at Genesis and by the time I got to Joshua I had even less faith than when I started.

>>214806324
He answered your question by pointing out the fact you think you box in omnipotence, while conveying what can only be described as a stunning ignorance of your own limitations, is retard-tier.

Do you understand now? Yes or no?

>>214806374
Woah, look at all those people who talked to a christian once.
It's gotta be true if 9 people are aware of christian beliefs.

>>214806222
>historiographically ignorant
What is the historiography? If you notice I never disagreed with the existence of Jesus btw I'm just really asking

>>214806404
Pretty sure they're making fun of you for following fedora stereotypes, anon.

>>214806374
Seems like it

>>214806481
>What is the historiography?
Look up academic consensus on a "historical Jesus", don't worry about the consensus for now, and then read about how historians came to their conclusions.

I'm not going to spoon feed you midwit.

>>214805881
Just don't forget to apologize to God at some point for spending your God given time and erections on /tv/.

>>214806324
I've played this game with you before. Your syllogisms go something like

>If God's will can be thwarted than he's not God
>If God's will cannot be thwarted then there's no free will
Which you obviously deny apriori.

If your mom's will for you not to smoke weed can be thwarted is she really your mom? God is not a legalistic machine.

If you believe you have no free will then you have no reason to argue, because I don't have free will either according to your worldview. We're all "programmed" in our own way. When everything is predetermined, there is no meaning to anything including this conversation. Therefore, smoke weed

>>214806379
Ok bro are you ready to concede that the Quran is even more true by your metrics? It has only a 20 year span from the life of mohamed and has thousands of copies as well

Lmao let's see you cope out of this one

Also the charts is using bullshit figures but Christ cultists like you aren't known to fact check

>>214806531
>I'm not going to spoon feed you midwit.
Listen buddy I've got my own knowledge of the historiography of Jesus, and I've already been googling it during this conversation - I wanted to talk to you because you're an actual person who can give me more than what I've already looked at online. I'm on board here, it just sounded like you had something important to say so I asked you to say it. Okay?

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>>214806570
Still can't answer.

Why are christians so afraid of a yes or no question

>>214806641
You never answered my question if whether or not you wanted to be a demon. Do you want to be a demon? It's a yes or no question.

>>214806666
I accept your defeat

>>214806641
Nta but yeah seems to me that you can thwart God's will by ignoring His message that you are saved.

>>214806666
>Do you want to be a demon?
Is this an offer, Satan?

>>214806598
>still doesn't understand the argument that was made
Holy shit you're a next level retard, bro.

>>214806741
I accept your defeat

How come your proud histriography method doesn't apply to the Quran lmao

>>214806678
He won though.

>>214805233
That makes it sound like it's all in your head. And that's nice, I'm glad it gives you some inner peace.

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>>214806714
Then god is not omnipotent and is not sovereign

>>214806768
Cope

>666
People who worship a Jew desert entity who demands genital mutilation and genocide and threatens torture calling people evil lmao

>>214806780
Isn't it? Try it sometime, you're good regardless.

>>214806766
>I accept your defeat
I accept you're retarded, lol
>How come your proud histriography method doesn't apply to the Quran
Who said it didn't? Muhammed is a historical figure as was Jesus.

Also, it's "historiography", dumb-dumb.

>>214806792
Something like that. Either way if you find solace in cosmic forgiveness of the human condition, protest against fundamentalism is no reason to deny it

>>214806818
>c-cope
Want to announce victory again and pretend we aren't laughing at you? Lol.

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>>214806857
>Logic experiment proves jewgod is a fraud
>Worship and beg for forgiveness though

Holy shit you are retarded

>>214806839
So are you ready to convert to Islam now

It has more evidence than your Jesus

Go on historiography man

>>214806896
I didn't say you had to worship or beg for anything. I didn't even say I was a Christian. I'm just talking about the essence of feeling forgiven by the universe

>>214806871
>we
Lol where is this we. Christian trying to make some kind of false consensus as usual. You still haven't answered a yes or no question.

I accept your defeat :)

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Confession - I say 'Lord give me strength' occasionally under stress, and the people close to me think I'm giving some Christian devotional, when in reality I'm quoting a line from a lolicon JRPG I memorized after farming heal actions to boost Flonne's character level

>>214806147
>>214805820
This you? The black leftist feminist? https://youtu.be/blNvE504OLQ

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>>214806916
>So are you ready to convert to Islam now
Nope but one of my best friends is Muslim. I know you don't read but pic-related is a pretty good conversion memoir if anyone else is interested.
>It has more evidence than your Jesus
Lol, it's pretty funny you're still filtered by that guy's argument.
>Go on historiography man
You're misusing that term, retard.

Holy shit you're dumb. Go call your parents and apologize.

>>214807062
Jfc have some patience with the bastard, if you can't move him at least make it a testament for your own faith

>>214807032
>Yes I want to declare victory while pretending you guys aren't laughing at me
Lol. Called it.

>>214807063
I accept your defeat

Thanks for declaring Quran is the one true faith by your method

>>214807088
It's only you

Also you still haven't answered yes or no :)

>>214807107
>I accept your defeat
Cool. Now accept you're a faggot and you'll come out even.

Hey why come people only respond to hostile posts instead of forthcoming ones?

>>214807140
Nah

Thanks for declaring Islam is the truth and that Jesus is inferior :)

>>214806739
That reminds me a little of those anti-D&D tracts about kids mind controlling their parents with spells they learned in a role playing game.
Like, you want a kid to avoid something, so you tell them it will literally give them real magic powers?

>>214807125
>It's only you
We both know a lot of people have made fun of you for being a retard throughout your life. If you want to pretend it's just one person on the internet as a cope be my guest.
>Also you still haven't answered yes or no
That was the other anon. I'm the one who pointed out he did answer your question and you were too dumb to get it.

Lao Tzu says
>A leader is best
>When people barely know he exists
>Of a good leader, who talks little,
>When his work is done, his aim fulfilled,
>They will say, “We did this ourselves.
I keep this poem close in moments like this

>>214807210
>we we we
>string of malicious words
You sound insecure and not very Christ like

Still not seeing yes or no :)

>>214807185
>Thanks for declaring Islam is the truth
I know you're used to having people put things in your mouth, you take after your mother, but don't put words in mine, fag. Lol.

>>214807082
I don't care, I'm posting a good debate on the topic of free will and determinism for others who are interested. If he's going to slander Christianity with the heresy that
>Even salvation is not your choice
then that must be corrected in full. In short, IIRC, the theology is that God's foreknowledge does not negate your free will to make a choice.

My personal understanding is that our personal will and God's will need not be in opposition, they can be synergistic. God's mind can surely fit you in his plan somewhere.

This reminds me of underdeveloped pagan thought, or the islamic dawah script where the Trinity couldn't possibly be true because they will all fight for more power. Stupid.

>>214807243
According to your historiography method

Quran is superior to the new testament

I know you already know and trying to deflect this I'm just posting to rub it in lol

Cope and seethe

>>214807237
Yes, you're low IQ. No, that doesn't make it ok to be a faggot.

>>214807251
You are supposed to be a transcendental problem-solver with your Christ-knowledge, beating people up in the mud like this is not a proper testament

>>214807302
I accept your defeat

>>214797951
Let me get this straight.
So He created a fallible, imperfect man, then He put a curse on mankind because they failed a shit test. Then, thousands of years later, He decided to do without all of at but instead of doing it in just an instant as He can, he decided to follow a convoluted plan in which He incarnated as a man, got Himself killed and then He would resurrect himself? But then again the curse is not entirely lifted because man can and will still sin and go to hell and there’s still death and evil and such, but there’s nothing to worry about because He’s coming back in a couple of millennia to finish the work that He left half-done?
Is God autistic? Or just a cuck?

>>214807285
Didn't read. Good luck on breaking your mom's cocksucking records. I hear she's in the lot lizard HOF.

>>214807339
yeah cuz of free will or something

>>214807345
I accept your defeat :)

You have done the work of Allah

>>214807329
Cool. Now accept you'll never have a girlfriend, lol.

>>214798036
Why does God care so much about what some inferior, created beings think of him? Is he a 15yo girl?

>>214807383
I accept your defeat :)

The rabbi you worship didn't have a girlfriend. He's gonna burn you in hell for being a fornicator bro

HEY LISTEN RETARDS IF YOU NEED ME TO SPEAK YOUR FUCKING PROFANE LANGUAGE IN ORDER FOR YOU TO HEAR ME, THEN LET ME TELL YOU WHY DON'T BOTH OF YOU RETARDS QUIT PRETENDING YOU'RE SEEKING ANY SPIRITUAL RESOLUTION AND QUIT ACTING LIKE SHIT-FLINGING NIGGERS REGARDING YOUR OWN FUCKING EXISTENCE AND YOUR CONTEXT IN IT?!?!?! COMPRENDE!?!

>>214807310
I appreciate the appreciation, I just don't have patience for spammers. I extended enough good faith in the beginning with my first posts, only to be hit with the usual roster of, possibly, JIDF phrases. This was a short one sided conversation and that's got nothing to do with me.

>>214807426
I accept your defeat.
I win.
Closing the thread
You have my permission to take the last word.
:)

>>214807386
I guess because he wants us to act a certain way, which I would GLADLY do if he just came down and told me himself. Instead he appoints some faggot pedophile to represent him and I'm just supposed to accept their interpretation of a 2000+ year old book

>>214807443
It can be fun to use your performance against the spammer to testify for believers and even skeptics who are looking for better behavior from gospel-preachers

>>214807458
I accept your defeat :)

Copies me because he is in shambles. Sad!

>>214807235
Eastern Philosophy really spoke to me a lot more than Western religion did. It's weird that Eastern religion is so individualistic yet their cultural so communal and Western is the opposite.

Thread summary:

Quran is more historically attested to than Jesus

Free will is debunked and a poor excuse for the nonsensical nature of christianity

Christ cultista got clowned on

>>214807345
>>214807363
>>214807376
I'm not following this discussion but these are awful posts and under any circumstances a complete waste of everyone's time. If you are this mad and want a fight, go get in an actual IRL fight. This is literally the gayest, most pathetic way to exercise your masculine belligerence.

god is dead

>>214807471
>>214807471
Okay, but look at the blasphemy in this thread. This is nothing to be nice about. I just posted a link to a debate that will elevate the understanding of anyone who watches it, far beyond any blasphemy bumper sticker baitposts.

>>214807512
You're yourself but farm rice. That's your job. I always liked that about Confucius, Laotzi, and Legalism

>>214807535
i'm having fun tho, i'm not mad

>>214807563
>This is nothing to be nice about. I just posted a link to a debate that will elevate the understanding of anyone who watches it, far beyond any blasphemy bumper sticker baitpost
You went haywire making unchristian statements and getting mad people didn't understand the your delivery of the gospel. It's not only ungraceful but its fuel for people who continue to deny what's being said