I still don't understand how the Nazis lost to a bunch of poor Russian alcoholics
>>215069919>Smaller economy and industry than the USSR>Less manpower >Less resources >Logistical issues and overstretched>Cities being bombed into rubble by the UK and US
grab hoi4 on steam
simply underestimated themthought that because he could steamroll every other european power quickly that russia would topple just as easily >We only have to kick in the door and the whole rotten structure will come crashing downoperation barbarossa was a huge initial success but once the german war marchine overstretched itself they were in big trouble, the whole campaign depended on a quick and decisive victory, as soon as they got bogged down they were fucked
the west kept bombing their factories and supplying the russians, and now we've been stuck with russia exporting death and torture for almost 100 years
>>215069919Can Steiner's attack still save them?
>>215070220mein fuhrer.....steiner....
>>215069919>We can't have a war on two fronts>Opens up a second front
>>215070022Already have itHitler: The Rise of Evil is good for playing on my second monitor when I'm securing Europa
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=A_3R-Rkn_98
>Oh 5 million Russians died in one year?>Just conscript another 20 million slavs from wherever to the front>*wins*
>>215069919the russians were given copious amounts of supplies from the british and later the americans look when the first shipments of the british lendlease arrived to the ussr, it's right around the time they started pushing the germans back in earnest there is no greater ally to a communist than a capitalist
>>215070218As opposed to the Germans making a magical kingdom of peace and brotherhood in Reichskommissariat Ukraine and Moskowien if they had won
>The difficulty in understanding the Russian is that we do not take cognizance of the fact that he is not a European, but an Asiatic, and therefore thinks deviously. We can no more understand a Russian than a Chinaman or a Japanese, and from what I have seen of them, I have no particular desire to understand them, except to ascertain how much lead or iron it takes to kill them. In addition to his other Asiatic characteristics, the Russian has no regard for human life and is an all out son of a bitch, barbarian, and chronic drunk.
>>215069919They lost to Americans. The only thing Russians did was "discover" the death camps.
>>215070218Russia's been doing that to it's neighbors for a lot longer than 100 years m8
>>215070658Everyone has been doing it since forever.
>>215070641>americans fight children, old men, and fodder conscripts not fit to fight the real war on the eastern front>they act like they fought the greatest soldiers of the germany armyi sometimes wonder how the americans would've fared if they ever fought germany when they weren't already on the brink of defeat, both times they were effectively mop up for an already beaten enemy
>>215070685Consider how BTFO they got by a relatively small counteroffensive in late 44. Americans would've gotten pulverized if not for the Russians and their willingness to die by the millions.
>>215069919Well, in many ways the Germans were amazingly lucky when fighting France. Back then, people thought in terms of WW1 with France, arch enemy of Germany, fighting for many, many years. In a similar vein, they thought the Soviets were just Tsarist Russia 0.2, and didn't grasp what an industrial juggernaut it had become and the tight grip of Stalin vs the inept Nicky.
It wasn't just Russians though. A huge part of the Russian army consisted of other Soviet states, with Ukranians making up a significant portion of the red army.Shitler fucked up alienating these Russian vassal states with genocides.
>>215070792Operation Barbarossa would have never happened without Hitler genocidal intention.
>>215070826An Operation Barbarossa aimed to sever the snake's head in Moscow would have won them the war. Instead muh lebensraum muh Napoopan rout clouded Nazi judgment too hard.
>>215070685If America put their full weight against them and didn't have a Pacific theater to worry about, it'd be a relatively easy victory. The Nazi's had impressive blitzes but weren't that impressive or disciplined on a whole. That being said, the Americans would have got their shit kicked in by the Reichsheer in WW1. That probably is the most disciplined and impressive army in modern history and the US was nowhere near that level at that time.
>>215069919Same way the Union won the civil war. Through sheer numbers of replaceable cannon fodder.
>>215070851True. The whole Lebensraum shit was stupid as fuck and cost them everything.
>>215070851Pretty sure the Russians didnt care if Moscow got sacked, their plan was to just keep drawing them further in further in until they out numbered them and stretched their supply lines too thin
>>215070868I have my doubts. While the industrial capacity of the US was overwhelming, you have to remember they had to transport all the men and material from across an ocean. I don't think the Americans would have been able to defeat the Wehrmacht on their own without having a base of operations on the British Islands and the Germans being forced to concentrate their forces on the East.
>>215070868given that the states have never really had the stomach for high casualties, if they had entered the war at the start they likely would've pulled out in 1915/6 since the war was still anyone's game at that point and they weren't gaining enough ground to justify the losses
>>215070943A Soviet Union severed from Moscow would have likely disintegrated the Union and isolated Russia. This is what Stalin truly feared with Moscow's fall.
The Russians without the additional resources of Lend-Lease probably would have still won against the Germans but it would have occurred MUCH later. Perhaps 1948? If at all.What people don't realize is that the Pacific supply route for the USSR for Lend-Lease was completely untouched by the war. The Japanese had a non-aggression pact with the Russians and they stuck to it. They didn't even attack American shipping to their north that was carrying supplies.Without Lend-Lease, there would be no Russian trucks, a shortage of boots and a shortage of food.Post war accounts by Kruschev were that Russia couldn't have won without American supplies.
>>215070333What's wrong with having ambition?
Hitler and his top commanders were idiots
>>215071061The Japs were completely useless to Nazi ambitions. The worst alliance in human history.
>>215070960Not only that but a large portion of the population were 1st generation German immigrants and were relatively pro-german when the war started. There was a lot less ideological backed good v evil propaganda which would make it even harder to justify massive losses on a foreign continent
>>215071090Like all spergs he craved repetition. In this instance the repetition of Germany's defeat in the first war.
>>215069919>I still don't understand how the Nazis lost to a bunch of poor Russian alcoholicsit was tooo cold
>>215071014Stalin was ready to fuck off to the Ural's if Moscow fell. It was already pre-planned.Even if the Germans had captured Leningrad, Moscow and Stalingrad, they still had to clear out the Caucauses and get the oil flowing in order to conduct maneuver warfare. Keep in mind the Soviets would have sabotaged all of the oil rigs and refineries.So the Soviets may have been weakened but they still have the bulk of their factories in the Urals, still getting supplied via the Pacific route by the Americans. They spam attacks towards Rostov in attritional warfare until the Germans can't take it anymore.
>>215071207Even if they managed to reach the Caucasuses, it wouldn’t automatically mean they’d have access to the oil. The Soviets would probably deconstruct or destroy the oil fields which could take months or years to repair and then the logistics of transporting it back to Germany or wherever would be extremely challenging.
>attack Russia>Russians throw waves of soldiers after you>you eventually run out of soldiers>they don't
>>215070006>economy>the USSRyou crippled retard
>>215070609yes
>>215070685It would be the likes of Kasserine pass on steroids
