How lopsided is the officer to enlisted ratio on the enterprise that being a lieutenant JG on the Federation's flasghip as a middle aged man is considered to be an embarrassing failure of a wasted life?

>>215678585
This is a very right wing coded episode.

>>215678695
sure it is, chuddie

>>215678695
What that doing hard work is beneath him?

>>215678675
It is for Picard, probably not for the general public.

Picard is a nepo baby who owns vast vineyards, to make him put in any effort into getting ahead is outrageous to him

>>215678675
its not. picard is 58 when he becomes captain of the enterprise and is a career starfleet officer. if it takes you 40 years to reach the same rank graduates hit within a few years out of the academy, then yes
>embarrassing failure of a wasted life
just about nails it

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>>215678585
>Gets busted to science nerd.
>immediately wants to kill himself.

>>215678797
People live longer so its not as bad as you may think.

>Using Romulan labour as well

>>215678585
Working in Starfleet seems like a miserable thing for 99% of people. They don't even use money. There is no reason for them to work hard and follow a strict hierarchy and possibly die doing so. They really do it for free.

>You have multiple bosses and your performance reviews are conducted in the public bar with the Commander and the HR woman who he is maybe dicking
>The HR woman can read your emotions
>There is no internal logic to postings outside of medical, people will jump colours and posts at random

I would trigger a warp core breach in Minereplicator.

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>>215678939
Hologram pussy. Imagine the things you'd do.

>>215679384
Kek

>>215678797
>is captain of a much smaller ship first
>gets command of the fucking flagship as a mature, experienced captain
Fuck off Shelby

Don't they have like 25 year-old female captains on the new Star Trek shows? I dont know anything about the Navy but it would make me really nervous if I were serving on an aircraft carrier and the captain looked like a Starbucks barista.

>>215678939
You're not "working" so much as doing the job you enjoy and trained for, and enjoying the prestige of serving aboard a Federation ship and exploring the galaxy

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>>215679469
Sexist/ageist much?

>>215679493
Unless you’re Ben Sisko and get “promoted” to commander of some decrepit Cardassian station on the edge of nowhere

>>215679518
If you have a better solution to the negro problem I am listening?

>>215679567
I just think it’s funny is all. I’ve applied this lens to my most recent rewatch and it’s clear that he got sent to the bush leagues. The real question to me is: who did Miles drunkenly grope to get his shit reassigned?

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>Human beings were not meant to sit in astrometrics staring at computer screens all day, filling out useless forms and listening to eight different bosses drone on about mission logs

>>215679605
he was the only person sufficiently incompetent captured in the cardassian war

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>>215679621
A daring synthesis

>>215679518
From the onset this was supposed to be a routine mission. The Federation is frequently assigning a detachment to somewhat - underdeveloped - planets in order to prepare them for admission to the Federation. Basically Sisko's job was to help pick themselves up off the ground, dust them off, and make them look nice when the actual brass and diplomats come to inspect them.

Things did not go as planned.

Very quickly this commander was identified as a religious icon to the local populace, discovered the galaxy's only known stable wormhole, and fended off an unprecedented attack from the Cardassians.

Now, the latter two would perhaps warrant a change in leadership. A higher ranking, more experienced officer, specifically someone with experience with the Cardassians.

But let's not forget the mission: prepare Bajor for admission to the Federation. With its government still being very much "provisional" and the importance Bajorans place on their faith, it would not be the best diplomatic move to remove or replace someone they revere, no matter how low an opinion you have of the situation.

Secondly, Sisko dragging Gul Dukat's disabled ship from the wormhole is a very striking scene. It's humbling. It places the Cardassians at a psychological disadvantage, a disadvantage specifically linked to Sisko. Every time a Cardassian deals with Sisko, they're dealing with the guy that had to save their ass from the gods of the people they just recently stopped occupying.

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>>215679469
>Don't they have like 25 year-old female captains on the new Star Trek shows? I dont know anything about the Navy but it would make me really nervous if I were serving on an aircraft carrier and the captain looked like a Starbucks barista.

No that's generally how it works in all careers. Everyone operates some sort of fast-track programme that select for the people that can play the system and look good on paper which is why seniors have a certain look and behaviour in large organisations.

>>215679729
Sure thing Grok. Bajor joining the federation was a red herring, highly unlikely given the state of the Bajoran government at the time and the attitudes of Bajorans generally. They sent him on a fool’s errand to some backwater only to have it backfire due to deus ex wormhole. His scene with Picard in the pilot says it all

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>>215679621
In one of the Trek games you can go to the lowest deck of Voyager and meet a guy who's only responsibility is to lower the landing gear. If you read his log, you can see he's loosing his mind because he does nothing all day and nobody can tell him what his other duties are. Lucky NPC doesn't realise how good he has it, nobody knows / cares if he shows up to work, just gets to hang out on Voyager and watch the stars fly by all day, without the risk of being killed in an away mission.

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>>215678585
I used to think Barclay was the most literally me character but having your absolute worst nightmare being just living a normal wagie life actually made me realize I'm more Picardpilled.

>>215678585
>The episode with the /tv/ self-insert.
>A character who's literally me, finally!
>joker watching the world burn
>other joker dancing down stairs
>Thanos
yeahhhh...about that.

>>215678585
who cares about what job you have in a universe where nobody gets paid? No matter the mental gymnastics star trek does with this it still makes zero sense

>>215680012
It’s evidently prestige based, considering how thoroughly Riker and Troi shit on the lowly blue-suited Picard. Brave new world

>>215680052
I just wouldnt care. theres no reason to fly around in space in some pointless career if everything on earth is free

>>215680076
I agree the whole premise is fantasy, but that’s ok it’s a tv show. Personally I’d be fucking free whores on Risa because why wouldn’t I?

>>215678939
Theyre supposed to be "enlightened" working only for the sole purpose of strengthening the federation and humanity.

>>215678675
There's only 5 enlisted on all of the Enterprise.
Obrien
Four guys who work the matter reclaimator
Rest are either officers or civilians like the bartenders or school teachers

>>215680110
yeah thats a whole other thing. whats the motivation to be a prostitute on that planet when theres no money involved? Why not just be on vacation forever

>>215679605
Miles exists to suffer, it was pure destiny

>>215678939
It's a selection bias. Those in Star Fleet love that shit. Rest of humanity is off enslaving Orion Slave girls or getting eaten by Klingons or chilling back on Earth or its colonies.

>>215680076
And a holodeck, preferably what's probably a hacked illegal Quark model where 1984 doesn't register, track, process, advertisement-categorize, and jail you based on the preferences of the powerful.

>>215678675
The point isn't that blue shirt Picard wasted his life it's that Captain Picard had tasted adventure in his "past life" but still remembered what it tasted like and knew he would never taste it again despite having a successful career as a science officer. The story is It's A Wonderful Life, but in space and without Christmas.

>>215680161
why/how are they bartenders in star trek? that entire job only exists to make tips and like everyone keeps saying theres no money in this future.

>>215679493
there are tens of thousands of people in starfleet who scrub exhaust manifolds all day. theyre not doing it because they love it. theyre doing it for money

>>215678585
Especially when that one Wesley episode shows how hard it is to even get in to Starfleet.

>>215680330
>theyre doing it for money
except they arent being paid because theres no actual economy. its all bullshit that comes close to ruining the whole show if you think about it too much.

>>215680364
I mean, there are systems of currency (latinum). You could go do stuff for profit. The UBI in the federation probsbly is like Ready Player One, it gives you basics but you don't get to afford fun stuff like go to Risa. Nobody said the federation is a space bus company, after all.

>>215680445
wrong. there is no "afford" in the federation. everything is free unless the government specifically mandates that you cant get it. Picard himself mentions this from time to time but nobody ever asks any follow-up questions because its ridiculous.

>>215680330
>there are tens of thousands of people in starfleet who scrub exhaust manifolds all day
Where are the robots?

>>215679921
>LCARS HUD
sovl

>>215679493
they're a cult

>>215680496
>Wrong
Well, except I'm not. Besides latinum, people are doing shifty shit all the time in the galaxy for money in Star Trek, like Picard's treasure hunter girlfriend. People are most assuredly operating in some monetary system(s).

>>215680549
outside of the federation, yes. like the ferengi. but if you are a citizen of the federation living in the federation theres no need for money

>>215678585
this might the most honest and blackpilled episode of a mainstream tv show for normies. It's surprisingly lacking the usual sentimentality of hollywood slop

>want to explore galaxy
>finally get into starfleet
>graduate with average grades
>get placed on a ship monitoring some bullshit that monitors itself
>don't even get to step off the ship 99% of the time
Are people really happy just being on the ship and knowing others are doing the actual exploring? What the fuck? Are we meant to believe that the passengers and crew do often get off the ship, but it's between adventures/episodes?

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>>215680542
>Always has been

>>215680629
Which loops me back to my original point. I didn't see a fucking interstellar Greyhound ferrying the UBI normies around the galaxy to adventure. Likely you just sat in your commie block housing manufacturing food based on a unit of matter that you have to parse out per cycle, so if you wanted to generate a lobster dinner every night it would run out quicker so you have to eat cheese sandwiches and cereal for it to last. You were likely assigned some fucking makework job by the government. No money means you can do gay snit like go to clubs or whatever but what's the fun in that, drinking synthohol and talking to your fellow prole about the same boring shit because you can't actually afford to do anything. You would need some form of wealth to get off-planet and to do something fun, or joining shit like starfleet or some shipping or mining company to make money and see the stats

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>>215679921
>nerds still make LCARS menus for their smart devices
>all the new sci fi slop has stupid impractical floaty hologram displays
God i hate modern media and the drones who gobble it up. All that marvel floaty glowing trash does not work outside a brain dead writers room.

>>215680717
the entire motivation for exploration historically has been to make money. to find new trade routes and to get new resources. the whole "lets explore empty space for the sake of science" thats at the core of star trek is complete fantasy, just in a futuristic setting.

>>215679503
>Italian is considerate enough to make sure he doesn’t accidentally serve pork to a Muslim since lots of African Muslims live in Italy
How is that racist? Imagine these Amerimutts saw real racism

>>215680772
why do you keep talking about buses? theres no reason for most people to fly around in space money or not. and even in your own scenario as long as youre fine living on earth you can in fact afford everything.

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>>215680717
They literally stop at star bases every few episodes to swap out crew. Obviously they have a core crew who signed on for the full tour of duty. Starfleet was primarily a military organization based off Roddenberry's experience in the air force and his personal ideals...dude was a decorated fighter pilot.

>>215680772
There's plenty interesting things to do on a single planet. Hell, there's plenty interesting things to do in your own four walls if you're willing to put some work into it. We see tons of artists and petty scientists in the series, researching some obscure topic that noone needed to care for.
>>215680717
>>215680796
Many people explored earth for the sake of itself. You think people climb mount everest for money? It's not for everyone, but starfleet isn't everyone. It's a tiny, tiny fraction of the population with tremendous chances to see the universe and hold responsibility. They wouldn't have problems finding volunteers in the current day either.

>>215680916
mountain climbing isnt exploring. its mainly done just to pat yourself on the back and say I climbed that. and yeah, all the people who spend millions to try and climb Everest and freeze to death are morons.

>>215680277
Seems like a good way to travel the galaxy for free. Quarrk also said Starfleet doesn't charge rent or electricity use either.

>>215680877
>>215680916
>get on ship
>stuck on ship
>go to star base
>get on new ship
So these crewmen never actually see the worlds that only five people get to interact with? I understand why people climb mountains. I wouldn't understand being the guy driving the car to take you to the mountain then staying inside the car and waiting for you come back down. I get that as a vocation because you need a job and driving people is a job, but not in an exploratory/fulfilling sense. These people on the Enterprise wake up go to their station, have a "drink" after work then go back to their rooms.

>>215680994
>These people on the Enterprise wake up go to their station, have a "drink" after work then go back to their rooms.
That's what I do and I'm not even in space.

>>215680969
why do so many people want to travel the galaxy? I guess thats my real question. couldnt be less interested personally

>>215678585
I don't understand this episode.
Being a belligerent asshole and getting stabbed in the heart makes you MORE of a risk taker?
You'd think it would be the other way around.

>>215680250
Why wouldn't he taste more adventure? Their ships encounter negative space wedgies every other week and as a science dude he could have distinguished himself there too if he wanted to.

>>215681010
Me too brother, but I also enjoy seeing outside a bit.

>>215680796
>entire motivation for exploration historically has been to make money
For jews. White people explore to prove themselves against nature and build something for themselves. It's why civilization collapsed. The death of exploration was the death of the white spirit.

>>215681144
nice fiction. people do things to make money, to bring more power to themselves or their clan/country. money is, has been and always will be the greatest motivator to human beings no matter how much you dont like it.

Remember that episode of Voyager where it was established that the Federation uses hologram slaves in mines?

>>215681144
the death of exploration is that we explored everywhere. only things left are the deep ocean and space; and those places are very expensive and dangerous to go.

>>215681269
Reasonable, if there's no evidence of actual consciousness. No consciousness, there's nothing there to feel bad and abused.

Of course, that wasn't the point they were making.

>>215681300
>Holograms are enslaved in the mines
>Working rock with their holographic hands
>But allowed to enjoy holonovels every now and then
That part was weird as fuck.

>>215678585
Everyone is equal in star trek except the ones in charge

>>215681337
Yeah you'd think if you were gonna make a holo-emitter for projection holograms in a mine, then you could just program some automated mining machinery instead of schlubby bald dudes. But they had to do something with all those EMHs after replacing them with Andy Dicks.

>>215681391
>They had to do something with that infinitely copyable data

>>215681391
Well, it was SF hackery, where a purely informational entity which could (and was) cloned around ad infinitum, somehow was only on a per-instance basis. So all the outdated EMHs were entities that had to go somewhere. Might as well put

ahh, I can't even explain this shlock anymore. They wanted to do a tired slavery thing, which they had already done anyway with the holographic resistance force. Or was that later?

>>215678585
>Goes back in time
>fucks pussy
>becomes incel loser

What did trek mean by this?

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>>215680522
They get given cushy jobs. Deal with it future unpaid wagies

>>215681920
none of them get paid

>>215681938
We don’t have a word for it, that’s why I had to go with unpaid wagies. I thought we established they work for prestige

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>>215681820
Picard was the quintessential volcel. He could get sex whenever he wanted but remained married to his post. There's even an episode where his crew sent him to the whore planet for release. His First Officer had enough sex for them both (and then some).

>>215682000
prestige doesnt have the same value as money though, its not an equal trade off. prestige makes already high up people think better of you sure, but for the average person thats useless

>I heckin love our gay race space communism where there is no class and everyone is equal but I own a mansion and vineyards
>.......
>.......
>Wait! What! No you can't do this! I was going to be a Party Official or write queer feminist dance theory for the revolution!
>>DIG THE FUCKING SPACE HOLE

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>>215682180
But what if no money? Huh?
>man I sure am glad I worked so hard to get into Starfleet

>>215678675
If this was normal navy, he would be drummed out by the time he was 40. Not retired, kicked out.

>>215682111
im pretty sure he fucked that thief lady and the Q

>>215682247
Don’t they tend to use non-coms/civvies with military like titles for technical roles? Astrometrics would be like a long range radar operator or something

>>215682233
I bet that guy stole Gene's parking spot one time and that's why he got shafted.

>>215682233
Is that even legal? Child boob?

>>215682302
Apparently they ran out of male uniforms and played it off as "There are no gender lines in the future!"

>>215678585
I never liked this episode because it goes against a lot of what the federation and the futuristic setting are supposed to be about. Picard should have been above something so egotistical. He should have been willing to live a simple life, and only learn his lesson when a tragedy befalls his companions that he was capable of preventing, but denied due to his new rank.

>>215682111
Picard fucked a ton, he just wasn't as overtly horny as Riker and Crusher.

>>215680161
What's the deal with the enlisted crewmen anyway? Are they all from the cardie war? I don't think enlisting is an option unless there's an unexpected situation that needs a lot of bodies quicker than the academy can pump them out.

>>215681119
A science officer (especially one that rarely goes out of his comfort zone) is never going to experience what a captain does on a regular basis. Especially not what Picard experienced while a captain and especially not in his twilight years as a science officer. If he were younger he could work up to the rank of Captain and have those experiences again but he's an old man so there just isn't enough time left to do it even with the knowledge from his past life.

>>215682474
you know its canon that people "wash-out" of starfleet all the time, right? they stagnate and find something else, but with starfleet academy under their belts. picard is still serving on the flagship of the federation, he'll just never be able to jump to the command track, because of a long history of risk aversion.

furthermore, they show fucking troi of all people jumping to the command track, showing that it is possible, just picard will never be captain of the flagship of the federation again in that timeline, where he's an old man, who essentially wasted his life and abandoned friends.

>>215682573
its something that was forced on TOS because they didn't want to have female officers. so essentially not canon.

>>215682689
Troi taking her command exam also happens to be one of the worst episodes, but otherwise your point is valid imo

>>215678585
The ironic thing about this episode is that with a quality officer in astrophysics the Enterprise probably avoids 99% of the retarded space anomalies that fuck their shit up in the prime timeline. Picard is doing more for the ship than he ever did as Captain.

>>215680277
Hospitality is more than just working for tips
Free room and board, get to travel aboard the Federation flagship serving prune juice to the future Ambassador to the Klingon Empire, future Admirals and Captains all while seeing the galaxy.

>>215682790
Seems a lot more prestigious than scrubbing warp manifolds as an ensign, I tell you what

>>215682301
No.
You are expected to get promotion. If not by merit, then at least via regular seniority. You would need to be passed for promotion multiple times to get that old without having any fucking prospects of advancing your career.
And each time you get passed, there is a written report. The stack. Eventually it's clear as day you are unfit for any further use or work in the navy and politely told to take the hike, or else they are going to do it for you.

>>215682790
does that really sound appealing to anybody? you take a job so you get to stay on a space ship and serve drinks all while not actually gaining anything?

>>215682850
If you're a social extroverted type of person, sure.

>>215682850
I'm not a people person, so no, not something I'd like to do. But you probably only need 3-4 people for a crew of 2000. Hell, 4chan jannies do what they do for free and its much worse work.

>>215682899
waiting on people for no money sounds like absolute hell to me

>>215682846
Interesting. So there are radar operators with the rank of commander or captain? Do they take administrative positions? Genuinely curious

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>>215682760
> Troi taking her command exam also happens to be one of the worst episodes, but otherwise your point is valid imo
It was a crummy subplot but I can’t hate an episode where a crewmate befriends a child. Pen Pals is also a low rated episode but I find it charming as fuck.

>>215682846
This is only partially correct and a problem the military has run into for centuries. What do you do when you have someone who is very good at their low-level job? A great grenadier, engine mechanic, radar operator, cook, clerk, etcetera? If you promote them they usually go to a new position where their specialty is not important or entirely vacant. Just because you can cook well doesn't mean you can manage well.

So they came up with specialist ranks and paygrades. There are many lower ranked(admittedly usually NCOs and not officers) who get extra pay and have extra prestige but remain a lower rank-rank so they can keep doing the job they are good at without feeling shafted that they make less and have a lower rank than some other guy.

>>215683026
no. its up or out.

>>215683208
I think it’s a crummy episode overall but hate is a strong word. It’s poor imo but it’s not like I skip it. Data’s selective memory loss is too convenient
>language subroutines: intact
>personality subroutines: intact
>memories of scientific method: intact
>I guess I’m a rare snowman from the mountains or something, if you say so. Why not?

>>215683026
You can't man that post for your entire career. The point is that eventually, you make it up. You would need to fuck up HARD to be held on a low position without advancing any further.

>>215683305
>t. clueless civilian
You still promote them via seniority. So your great individual now can provide that expertise to the whole team, so they can train next good ones. They are also kept long enough on each rank, because for NCO, you have limited prospects of advancing anyway, and you will get retired by the time you are old, since no use for an old grunt with pretense of authority.
Specialist ranks are completely different thing covering for different shit - you START as one.
It's like you literally have not even the faintest clue on how this shit works.

>>215682850
People do that on cruise ships now

>>215683338
I had the same problem with it: he dismisses that teacher who espouses the Four Element theory, but if his memory is really gone, he shouldn't know anything about atomic theory and what the teacher is saying should sound perfectly plausible to him. Data just fast-forwards a few centuries in his understanding for no reason but plot convenience.

>>215680994
I guess it didnt happen on tng very much but i feel like TOS had shore leave all the time

>>215683424
except you get paid to be there

>>215683512
Shore leave episodes aren't the most interesting anyway. Crewmembers can probably take shore leaves sporadically depending on their line of work

>>215682850
>do a basic servicejob in exchange for seeing the wonders of the universe, meeting new people everyday, staying in a luxurious cabin and enjoying the amenities all for free
How hellish

>>215683413
So just out of curiosity, what rank should a specialist in charge of the radar room on a flagship or aircraft carrier or the equivalent hold in your experience? The episode makes more sense to me if Picard should somehow be in charge of astrometrics at his age, regardless of his rank outside of astrometrics or whatever

>>215683657
I dont want to meet new people everyday, and all of your amenities are already free on earth without having to do menial service to get

>>215683208
I love this episode. I even get a kick out of the "Bridge Officer's Exam" being an elaborate setup to use Geordie as a punching bag for 1,000th time.

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>>215680277
>why be a bartender in space
>>215680166
>Why be a slut in space
>>215680836
>>215681055
>Why travel the Galaxy

What the fuck are these posts, is staying in your room doing fucking nothing except gluing a food replicator to your mouth all you want in the future/your life?

>>215682846
This if funny because in my experience the only truly capable people in the Navy with seniority were warrant officers. All the commissioned people in command were moron NPCs. Not surprised that just a few years after I got out ships started running into shit.

>>215678711
>star fleet is a meritocracy
>the borg are what happens when real communism is finally achieved.

>>215682689
The premise of the episode is based on the slippery slope fallacy though. "Don't get into a barfight with random hustlers" and "protect your friend from getting stabbed" leads to "never take risks"? Retarded.

>he's an old man, who essentially wasted his life and abandoned friends.
His "friend" was a moron who wanted to start a fight with armed guys and got angry at Picard for protecting him. Associating with someone like that would do far more damage to your career than sitting on your ass for 20 years.

>>215683760
The episode makes more sense if you read as Q just fucking with Picard. There are just too many leaps in logic from Picard's changed actions to the results to make sense any other way.

>>215684906
I always did interpret it as Q fuckery, or perhaps the deathbed delusions of a dying man, too many mixed messages
>don’t protect people from their own stupidity, this will make you a better commander

>>215678585
How did getting stabbed in the heart make him a more ambitious person? What's the connection with being stabbed and being successful?
I feel like the episode failed to flesh this connection out.

>>215685194
They talked about it a bit more in a prior episode: he thought he was going to die and in the moment, he realised it wasn't as scary as he thought, so that made him a lot less fearful. Debatable if that's a realistic reaction, but that's the idea.

>>215684906
the episode starts with picard's artificial heart failing because, decades ago, he risked his life to stand with his friends, and Q offering him the ability to recant that. Which means in that timeline, with no foresight, picard abandoned his friends to avoid risk. Thus establishing his well-being is more important than his friends, which establishes risk aversion and leads him to be a 60 year old junior grade lieutenant because he always took the safe route.

and remember, its hard canon that every human in the 23rd and 24th century are the results of genetic engineering, are objectively superior in every way, shape, and form, to 20th century humans. So while picard would've been a badass astrometrics officer, he goes to riker, who doesn't know him at all, seeking a recommendation for officer track.

the key point being that riker does not know this man at all, but picard assumes he does, because captain picard has been stuffed into a life he never lived, and thus doesn't know who his friends are, if he has any at all.

>>215684544
I dont want to go to space, especially when Im not getting paid to be there. why is that hard to comprehend? and also you think the choices that exist in life are go to outer space or do literally nothing ever. theres nothing inbetween those two options?

>>215684906
reminder: "slippery slope" is a "fallacy" because it assumes things will progress without any action from anyone. its "wrong" because every time someone claims its happening, the progression has been the result of huge amounts of effort from huge amounts of people.

>>215678585
The real head scratcher is that being the man who is capable of captaining the flagship was insufficient skill and experience for accomplishing the schooling that would lead to that fate. Picard, with all his qualifications and years of experience, deemed worthy to lead the flagship, completely failed to recreate that when given a chance to repeat his youth.
Does that make him a weaker and worse man than his younger self?

>>215678797
On the flagship of a multi-planetary, multi species empire (sorry, "federation") that includes literal superhumans?
The only reason it's a failure is because he knows for a fact that his actual ceiling is far higher.

>>215685395
probably because the whole of human history has been defined by people who's core need was to go above and beyond for literally any reason, and you are expressing a desire to be a genetic and historical dead end that ceases to exist, having accomplished literally nothing that anyone would care about or remember.

which is fine. you won't pass on your genes. you'll be the nothing you always wanted to be.

>>215685436
I dont think about my life in terms of where I fit in some long line of supposed human excellence. and all of this is a moot point anyways because you cant go into space like it exists in star trek anyways. so youre stuck here just like me.

>>215685482
thankfully not everyone shares your attitude

have fun dying on this shitball, contributing nothing to humanity's future.

>>215678711
Lol nice rebuttal, mongoloid.

>>215685482
He is agreeing with you and you are getting offended by this. If that doesn't communicate that you're lying to yourself, nothing ever will.

>>215685533
have fun pretending some hippie boomers space paradise isnt just a goofy tv show

>>215685568
take comfort in the fact you will die in the next world war, and no one will care

>>215685562
No, because hes acting all high and mighty and entitled because he thinks him aspiring to be a bartender in space makes him better then me. when in reality hes just a fat manchild that hates the real world.

>>215685581
Oh, and you wont die in that? Why because of your main character syndrome?

>>215685591
anon, you clearly hate "the real world" as much as anyone who aspires to anything more than just wageslaving forever, but you think accepting this hatred and enduring it is "growing up," was the point you missed.

>>215683657
>die in some freak accident involving alien anomalies

>>215685194
Maybe it taught him that life is fragile and ephemeral. That he had to value his life and therefore pushed himself harder to do more with his life

>>215685866
Everyone serving on the flagship of the Federation is aware of the potential danger

>>215685395
You are struggling to grasp this concept. I don't think anyone here can help you more than reflecting on it yourself will.
I have a friend who has devolved to the point where he can no longer judge anything beyond how it could affect him personally. It's sad and it becomes kind of a cancer that eats away at relationships.

>>215686769
I've just never given a shit about star trek, its not my thing

>>215685194
like has been stated nth times, he stood up for his friends, took the ultimate risks, and found the consequences weren't much

>>215686788
lol

>>215678585
>>NO Q HOW DARE YOU MAKE ME A WAGIE
>WTF was Picards problem

Q gave Picard a chance to avoid having a knife plunged into his heart when he confronted some Nausicaans as a teenager in Star Fleet Academy... only to find out that it lead Picard down a road of being a slave wagie instead of a captain. It was also the episode that revealed that Picard had an artificial heart to begin with. Which begs the question... why weren't they able to just replicate Picard a new heart? Why was it a mechanical one? Why didn't Picards' mechanical heart give him a boost in strength and endurance? Did they ever bring up the heart thing ever again? I don't think they did.

>>215687007
>Which begs the question... why weren't they able to just replicate Picard a new heart? Why was it a mechanical one? Why didn't Picards' mechanical heart give him a boost in strength and endurance? Did they ever bring up the heart thing ever again? I don't think they did.

You'd think surgery in the 24th century would be as easy as using the replicator to create a perfect 1:1 copy if Picards heart, and a transplant would involve just telephoning it into his body with nano-machines connecting everything together. With no incisions necessary.

>>215678742
Nta but the message is that you have to get involved in some shit early in life even if that results in some negative consequences, not live like an overly safe generic liberal type who wants to regulate everything to the point where no one can ever get harmed.

>>215687137
or he could have easily also died like so many redshirts on star trek. theres no real message other then random luck of the draw

>>215679518
He was a commander at wolf 359. He didn't get promoted, he got assigned to a strategically important station with a potential federation ally they were trying to bring into the fold.
Honestly the part that always bothered me is that I figured a job administrating a space station was a job for an Admiral, and only having a captain if it was really backwater.

>>215679802
I don't know if we should be training it

>>215680783
Fun fact, Gene had it written into the original deal for star trek that if someone out there invented a real version of star trek technology, they were free to use the fictional name.

>>215678939
>Working in Starfleet seems like a miserable thing for 99% of people.

We don't get to see anything even close to that, and people like O'Brien are extreme outliers. Faggots like Eddington are just cuntrarians not satisfied with their incredibly rich lot in life because there's some people who are just complete Karens who are never satisfied with anything.

>They don't even use money.

What would you need it for? If you're a Federation citizen you don't need it for rent, food, clothing, utilities, medical care, dental care, insurance, or any of the financial concerns a first worlder has today.

If you wanted to eat A5 wagyu and lobster every day, you can. Holodecks so you can spend all day diddling different kinds of exotic space pussy. The video games probably suck, but there's probably thousands if not millions of autists who spend their lives making retro games playable on Federation technology.

>They really do it for free.

Sure, but these are the kind of people who get to play around with advanced technology. Even if you're stuck on the Cerritos from Lower Decks you're having adventures, seeing new and exciting things, and doing work that you genuinely find fulfilling. And if you wanted to leave, the door was open. Nobody was going to stop you from resigning your commission.

>>215679802
>Bajor joining the federation was a red herring
It was a foregone conclusion. The federation wanted bajor if for no other reason than it hems in the cardassians even more. The first and second season is heavy with bajoran politics and rooting out corruption and bad actors and showing that the federation were friends to bajor.
In the coup plot at the end of season 1 they didn't give a shit that he was the emmisary.
Having the wormhole show up just escalated the focus.

>>215687241
He did get his heart stabbed. So he basically did die, and would have stayed dead if not for scifi medicine. Still it's mostly saying it's worth it to take risks which Picard and all protagonist captains do more than the standard starfleet top brass. It's always the protagonist captain going against protocol to do some cool shit. It would be a boring show if the captain just rigidly followed all the written rules.

>>215678675
you regularly see enlisted crewmen in the original series but not in TNG. The only time I can think of one getting a major speaking part is in the episode The Drumhead.

>>215679384
in that scene he insists they do a performance review of him right then and there in the bar, over their objections that it would be improper.

You guys ever think about what you would do if you were in the Star Trek universe?
I want to say that I'd sign up to Starfleet to see the galaxy, but realistically I'd probably just waste my life away in a holo deck.

>>215687498
>but not in TNG
Sure you do, they're running around in the background all the time. They're usually not important characters because if they get a speaking role then you know the person who is going to get killed by a space anomaly, alien virus, mishap on an away mission, etc.
TNG also had a bigger primary cast than TOS that was really just kirk, spock, mccoy. Sulu, Uhura, later Checkov were just there to do their job and deliver a line. Scotty had a bit more business to do, but mostly he just stayed on the ship or killed hookers.
TNG has Picard, Worf, Data, and Riker who all do a lot of protagonist work, with geordi getting a few, and they do change up who is working together on what so you have more interpersonal dynamic.
The galaxy class is also such a bigger and more advanced ship in a bigger starfleet, so theres naturally going to be more insulation between the captain of a flag ship and in the TNG era than the TOS.
Also picard knows he's a dick, which is why he tells riker in episode one that he is to help him present himself as likable. He knows his crew, but he's not the guy rubbing elbows with them, he worries about his senior officers and direct subordinates.

>>215679921
I'd agree, if he wasn't on Voyager. Otherwise it's a sweet gig - he could spend all day watching the equivalent of YouTube on a PADD at your station and get all your meals for free.

But on Voyager? I mean, that dude's probably no Eternal Ensign like Kim but his prospects for advancement are slim, and he'd have to deal with Neelix. If I were on Voyager I'm sure I would've either killed Neelix myself or egged Suder on to do it.

>>215680783
There used to an app for android that looked likeba tricorder, but ofcourse it got taken down. It was funny walking around the warehouse i was working at, scanning for the wifi signal.

>>215680076
Sure, but there's people out there who don't want to be an Eternal NEET. There's people out there whose dream is to see the stars, explore, build new robotic slave races, be the first to bang new xeno pussy, etc.

>>215680717
The enterprise in TNG was essentially the humans(who dominated the fed) big dicking the other civs and nothing to do with actual exploration.
Smaller non-federation vessels with crews <20 were the ones doing the real exploration which is why they usually got wrecked.

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>>215687608
>You guys ever think about what you would do if you were in the Star Trek universe?
Go to the pakled homeworld where I can finally become the smartest man in the world.

>>215680772
Faggots like you are free to leave. You can go colonize a planet next to a hostile galactic power who won't give a shit about or even recognize your rights or personhood, like the Cardies or the Dominion, and meet the same end as the Fagquis as you deserve.

>>215681447
"Starfleet creates a slave race" is a recurring theme. It's a shame that even in the turbo communist space future, Gene was the only one who could conceive of the Federation without a slave underlcass of some sort.

>>215687748
>get scammed because they're that illogical you can't predict what they'll do
why don't you find the nearest ethnically enriched area and become the smartest man in the hood?

>>215687744
>The enterprise in TNG was essentially the humans
Starfleet WAS Earth's fleet that they dedicated almost entirely to doing federation business.
Other federation members had their own fleets that helped out the federation and their home worlds.
Starfleet was just considered special because they're the protagonists of a tv show made by humans for humans, and because humans were the ones who managed to keep the federation together because they could act as intermediaries, and because the academy tended to produce a lot of top tier officers, and build really good ships.
The vulcan fleet does plenty of business in the background of TNG and DS9. Plenty of telarite freighters around.

>>215687846
Nigga I'm from Detroit.

>>215678675
i know what im about to say has nothing to do with anything but if in real life the government made it a rule that in ANY heirarchy (whether corporation or government or etc) one person in the heirarchy can only govern a maximum of 4 people below them, there would be much more opportunity in the world for people to climb these various heirarchies. instead we often have 1 person governing 20-50-100 people under them, meaning you only have a 1-5% chance of being next in line to be the bossman. at least with a max of 4 you have a 25% chance of being the next bossman in the heirarchy.

>>215687856
its established multiple times in canon that the federation is essentially just aliens utterly perplexed and fascinated by the human ability to mirror their sentiments and behaviors while at the same time act in ways they'd never expect or even consider, always for the greater good. a few civilizations are appalled by this, hence the conflicts.

>>215687856
true but my point about the enterprise stands, it was to send a message to other civs that the federation was that powerful they could send a super-powered cruise ship including families with kids all over the quadrant without serious fear of attack.

i hate how pointless real life is. if only we had a strong heirarchy like in Star Trek or Starship Troopers where you are guaranteed to know your place in society instead of being an aimless person with no purpose. ... like me

>>215687007
>Why didn't Picards' mechanical heart give him a boost in strength and endurance?

Probably for the same reason they didn't figure out how to make supermen without all of the negative traits Khan had - humans in the Star Trek future are dead set against artificially improving the species. So when they made Picard's mechanical heart they made one that approximated the performance of the Mark I H-Sap heart.

>>215688053
you're contradicting yourself a bit. if they didn't fear attack they'd just send a completely unarmed scout ship, filled with families. instead they send a weapon capable of stellar destruction and lead with "we come in peace." ya know, that thing about how only something capable of great destruction can be called peaceful. something that isn't capable of great destruction is just harmless.

>>215687608
Same here. I'm not Starfleet material. I'd spend my life playing out all of the Vulcan Love Slave holonovels.

>>215680076
Being a NEET is unfulfilling. People, men especially, need to do or build something. If you're rich, properly socialized, disciplined and well educated, that something is going to be something big, like exploring new star systems, meeting new life forms, etc.
IRL these people are just CEOs and shit. None of those people NEED to work, they can all afford to retire and bang bar whores for the rest of their days, but instead they run companies and set goals for themselves.

>>215688084
they establish in in the fourth star trek movie that the 24th century people are still heavily augmented compared to 20th century people. just not so much that they're driven insane, like khan and his groupies.

>>215688208
I don't know how you feel about ENT but Brent Spiner's character believed he had the problem fixed, and Phlox's species is apparently so advanced in genetics that a space vet like Phlox could come up for a cure for a genetic dead end on his lunch break, so I think it's still a matter of choice rather than capability.

Bashir managed to unfuck one of his fellow illegal supermen in his downtime on DS9 if you don't accept ENT. If you let him at it and his ethics didn't get in the way he could probably figure out a way to make humans supermen again. He probably could've cracked white addiction if he wasn't stranded on a planet without real facilities.

>>215688612
i'm mostly just talking about scotty, who'd never seen a qwerty computer before, or that OS, hacks out a functional synthesization model for transparent aluminum in about 10 seconds.

>>215678585
do you think Picard ever got his head massaged by alien prostitues on Risa?

>>215688688
>i'm mostly just talking about scotty, who'd never seen a qwerty computer before, or that OS, hacks out a functional synthesization model for transparent aluminum in about 10 seconds.

Admiral Kirk did have a Commodore Pet in his quarters in Wrath of Khan. It's not like the TOS series was oblivious to 'ancient' earth technologies. Scotty was only mistaken that the computer didn't have voice recognition. Once the polymer guy explained the keyboard, Scotty seemed to understand what it was and could navigate through the UI with just a keyboard. he was using an Apple Macintosh.

>>215688754
>TOS series crew

Fixed for clarity reasons.

>>215688754
downplaying that is like saying you'd be able to muscle memory your way around an apple II gs to generate 3d models because you had about 4 hours of experience on one when you were 6

>Junior grade lieutenant Picard

He being a science man, he would probably very good at his job. Command probably not, but highly specialized consultant type of personnel- probably
People seems to forget the proper rank at his level you should be just lieutenant. The whole Junior grade seems to be just adding another kick to the premise of the ep

The issue is he being a captain, going back to being a purely science officer clearly is not cut it

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>>215688790
>downplaying that is like saying you'd be able to muscle memory your way around an apple II gs to generate 3d models because you had about 4 hours of experience on one when you were 6

It's not really like the Apple Macintosh Plus was a complicated UI to use to begin with. I remember using one of these machines in second grade, and could understand how it worked without teachers telling me anything. yeah, Star Trek IV faked a few things, but the machine could do autocad like wire frame 3D. Scoot was a senior Starfleet computer engineer. When they filmed the movie, transparent aluminum was just science fiction. But it is a real thing that exists now.

>>215689191
again, you're acting like you could walk up to a late 80s early 90s computer you had hours of experience with in your childhood, and get it to display a functional pentium MMX 200 processor diagram... in about ten seconds.

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>>215686769
Not my problem

>>215687378
I disagree, it was a position where he was likely to fail at his stated mission of helping Bajor join the federation but it didn’t matter because nobody really gave a fuck about Bajor before the wormhole. Terok Nor was not a luxury state of the art station, it was a not a plum assignment. Also he never made captain until the Defiant showed up.

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>Q shows McCoy what his life would have been like if he had spent his youth being a groovy cat

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>>215678585
He was mostly incompetent.

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I always wondered why anyone would be a waiter or some shit like that for $0 on the Enterprise lol

>>215684740
>>star fleet is a meritocracy
Didn't watch the show award.

>>215678939
>Working in Starfleet seems like a miserable thing for 99% of people. They don't even use money. There is no reason for them to work hard and follow a strict hierarchy and possibly die doing so. They really do it for free.
Most people live a paradise life sucking and fucking on planets like Risa.
Or they pursue weird mega projects that interest them, with Starfleet acting as jannies ferrying them around or cleaning up shit or whatever.

It's only the extremely tiny anal retentive types that do Starfleet.

>>215679421
You don't need to work to get hologram pussy, and if you're really interested in hologram pussy you can go to the hologram pussy institute like Barkley did in Voyager

>>215687007
>It was also the episode that revealed that Picard had an artificial heart to begin with
It came up before that when he took a road trip with Wesley.

>>215690179
That's a weird take; how is Picard responsible for what Q did to him and them?

>no no you see Picard wasn't perfect
Okay? No one is? This is a complete out of context problem for them and your specific judgement of competency is backseat quarterbacking retardation.

>>215690228
It is a meritocracy. But the borg aren't communist, they're a de-personalizing hegemonic swarm

>>215690369
Meritocracy by its own definition cannot exist. The person who defined it did so with that in mind.
It's a euphemism for aristocracy or bureaucracy.

>>215690218
Maybe it's like those people who want to see the world so they signed up to work on a cruise ship. It's not that they want the money, they just want a spot on a ship that's exploring the galaxy.

>>215678585
>NOOO IM SERVING AS AN OFFICER ON THE MOST PRESTIGIOUS SHIP IN THE GALAXY EXPLORING UNKNOWN FRONTIERS AND MAKING A NAME FOR MYSELF YOU HAVE TO HELP ME

>>215679493
Commie logic that collapses under 2 seconds of scrutiny. Maybe 5% of people at most ever get to work their "dream job." The rest end up where they do as a result of circumstance and necessity. No one's dream in life is to be a garbageman, yet where would society be without them?

>>215690667
The concept of people working for the common good is just impossible for you to grasp eh?

>>215691594
who decides who does what for the common good?

>>215691758
Q obviously

>>215678585
When did you first realize that Star Trek is a Brave New World dystopia?

>>215691758
You do

>>215682989
imagine how your mother feels

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>>215690218
>I always wondered why anyone would be a waiter or some shit like that for $0 on the Enterprise lol

The Enterprise D was massive compared to other ships that came before it. But you only ever saw a small handful of crew members do any work. What the fuck did the rest of the crew do during their tonier aboard the D? Why did the other 950 or so people do aboard the Enterprise D, anyway?

>>215684544
you’re on 4chan dude what did you expect

>>215693204
A man

>>215684544
Nobody sane would leave the comfort of their own home to work for fucking nothing. Absolutely nobody. You're the weird one for thinking otherwise.

>>215685194
>What's the connection with being stabbed and being successful?
There is no connection. Realistically, getting almost killed trying to stand up for someone would lead to you taking fewer risks and being more willing to abandon others in need.
But it's pre-DS9 Star Trek, so the most optimistic (and unrealistic) view is taken as the correct one.

>>215685436
>the whole of human history has been defined by people who's core need was to go above and beyond for literally any reason
Human history has mostly been defined by 99.99% of humans doing exactly not that and being concerned with fucking surviving and providing for their loved ones. What you're describing is an extremely recent trend.

>>215685533
>have fun dying on this shitball, contributing nothing to humanity's future.
I will, along with most of humanity, since we don't have delusions of grandeur and accept that life sucks and then we die. You however will die sad because despite all your bluster you'll accomplish exactly nothing worth remembering.

>>215693269
Lol

Am not gonna show you humanity anon, just remember you claimed hummies had no noble or high aspirations

>>215688111
CEO types need to work. They need to satisfy their egos/exercise power over others/one-up their abusive fathers/afford yet more frivolous gifts for their nagging wives

It's fucked up how not a single person in this thread understands the point of this episode. God damn this board really is full of fucking retards.

>>215687007
>It was also the episode that revealed that Picard had an artificial heart
It first came up in a season 2 episde, Samaritan Snare. Pulaski had to be called in to do the emergency surgery on picard but he didn't want any of the crew to know about it

>>215680705
This is why TNG still holds up

>>215682111
Picard got laid more than Kirk did, he was just subtle about it.

>>215694114
lol Picard wishes he got laid exactly twice, Vash and that piano lady, and I suppose the immortal lady from insurrection if your counting the movies

>>215693906
>Pulaski had to be called in to do the emergency surgery on picard but he didn't want any of the crew to know about it.
Picard is the reason I keep a distance from my subordinates at work. I am nowhere near as important as a Starship Captain but its a good lesson to learn regardless.
Familiarity breeds contempt

>>215678585
>WHAT DO YOU MEAN I GOT TO DO LAB REPORTS, I HAVE ROMULAN POW WORKING ON MY VINEYARD Q!!! THIS IS BELOW ME !!!

>>215693285
See >>215685619

>>215687990
That's an interesting theory. Counterpoint you are a communist scumbag and deserve the rope. Vertical hierarchies are the entire point for having more than 6 men alive at any time in space.

>>215680772
Lmao here we go again
The Federation is paradise, what part of paradise do you not understand?

>>215695473
>perhaps maybe we should limit the amount of power people have and promote social mobility
>y-you're c-communist

>>215678585
It's a wonderful life - the MC is ready to jump off a bridge

ST:TNG - the MC is removed from the Bridge.

quick question from a movie Star Trek fan (the new movies), is Star Trek Strange new worlds the good modern series or is it another ?
i know there's a good one but i'm not sure of its name.

>>215680772
>I didn't see a fucking interstellar Greyhound ferrying the UBI normies around the galaxy

the enterprise's original five year mission was pretty much exactly that. a loop around federation space, picking up and dropping people/cargo off as ordered. now map that out to hundreds, if not thousands of similar missions.

>>215695627
everything after enterprise is "star trek" only in name.

>>215685415
Bro it's like a Challenger having a stroke and then being stuck in Diamond
Too real

>>215695661
okay but what's the best modern "not Star Trek" series then ?

>>215695709
they're all complete disasters.

>>215695627
the last good modern series was voyager

>>215695753
thanks for the non-answer

>>215695833
1995 is not modern, it was 30 years ago...

>>215695890
more modern than tos which started in 66

>>215695890
the answer is even compared to jjtrek, which was dogshit, the "modern" series are worse.

>>215693287
Please be historically illiterate somewhere else you clown. Next you're gonna spout nonsense like the great man theory.

>>215695390
For what purpose? So I can tell you you're delusional again? Growing up literally means accepting that you're not gonna make a big change in human history. That's not something I think, it's not an opinion, it's a simple fact. You can rail against it all your life and then die as unhappy as you lived, or you can grow up and take comfort in the simple things and your family and die content.

>>215696248
The simple fact is you're lying to yourself.

>>215696281
And you are projecting a bit too hard. Die unhappy if that's your dream.

>>215696299
>n-no y-you

>>215693030
Hologooning and cleaning up after the hologooning of their superiors

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>>215693383
This, it’s a trap for pathological narcissists. My net worth was higher than the CEOs at the last company I worked for despite his much longer career and much higher salary. The reason? He spent all his money on status items so he could appear wealthy while I drove a fifteen year old Honda Civic so as to not appear wealthy. He’s still working and I’m now retired

>>215678585
This episode showed that Picard is brainlet. He had a full life of adventure and the battle scars to show for it, there is nothing he has to prove to anyone. He could go pussyloser route never got into harms way work one day as scientist officer retire to his huge mansion and winery and fuck femboys or whatever he likes (women are clearly not his thing). If I was on his place I will say thank you Q every time I nut just to annoy him.

>>215687990
>meaning you only have a 1-5% chance of being next in line to be the bossman.
>>215695473
>you are a communist scumbag
1-5% chance to be bossman is pretty high compared to the reality of horizontal movement. If you don't start as a bossman, you're never going to be bossman but you might get to be bossman's lacky through dead man's boots.
I'd also call mobility capitalist, which is why I wouldn't call climbing a company capitalist - no-one's falling and you yourself didn't capitalise, you were selected and through social reasoning.

>>215682609
>is never going to experience what a captain does on a regular basis.
It's weird how the most adventured man aboard the Enterprise D was the man who barked out orders from inside a steel box, and not, say, the away team, or literally anyone anytime they took shore leave which was how half of Picard's adventures began.
Well, weird if it wasn't a fun show that has no reason to be criticised.

>>215690667
>Maybe 5% of people at most ever get to work their "dream job."
>What is job mobility and the freedom to pursue any hobby or job position so long as you're trained in it?
It's not like you have to worry about food or housing either.

>>215690363
>how is Picard responsible for what Q did to him and them?
Just as stated in the post... by running his ignorant, arrogant mouth.

>>215683413
>It's like you literally have not even the faintest clue on how this shit works.
Do they give promotions for passive aggressive snark? Cause you qualify.

I've read a wiki article and I still do not understand the non commissioned officer thing.

And I mean ours, not the space one

Although the space one is even more confusing

Why wouldn't anyone like Obrian just take the test or whatever, makes no sense

>>215697603
it exists because television executives in the 60s didn't like the idea of female officers. that's why it doesn't make any sense.

>>215693030
Someone has to talk to the dolphins, feed the dolphins and train the dolphins in the Cetacean Ops

>>215678939
I’ve determined that the Federation does have money.
They don’t have capital, as small scale capital is trivial to obtain and large scale capital is a matter of government policy and public infrastructure.
They don’t have cash as daily operating expenses and the cost of consumer items are also completely trivial.

However they almost certainly have money which would be comparable to what we think of as middle class wealth, savings, 401k.
Money that gets spent if you are buying a home or opening a business. Or want to take a luxury cruise to the far side of the galaxy.

The way this works is if you want to open a restaurant for instance, the government supplies food resources and also pays you per customer served according to a city’s budgeted food requirements. Replicated food is trivial in cost but even novelty farmer items would be very cheap.

The dark side of this system would be that where you really make money is out in the colonies where things are less utopian.
The idea that there are no businessmen in the future is a Picardian delusion about society on Earth. In fact, Earth society benefits from outsourcing entrepreneurial activities to the expanding federation border.

>>215697665
>the colonies where things are less utopian
you mean the places they set up with industrial replicators and nearly infinite energy at their disposal?

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>>215678585
TFW not getting stabbed turned him into the TNG version of Arnold Rimmer.
Meanwhile, I've NEETed for 20 years.

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>>215690486
>a real borg collective has never been tried!
You faggots always think you have a monopoly on how language is defined. Reading tens of thousands of pages of marxist gibberish philosophy doesn't make you an expert on anything. It may as well be warhammer 40k lore.

>>215697603
>I've read a wiki article and I still do not understand the non commissioned officer thing.
>And I mean ours, not the space one
Grunts and leaders, basically. The difference usually being a university degree for the officers, and specialist training for the grunts.
>Although the space one is even more confusing
Three grades of Crewman, three grades of Petty Officer, three grades of Chief Petty Officer. All rank below an Ensign.
O'Brien was an E-7 CPO in TNG, and became an E-8 SCPO, who happened to be what was basically the chief engineer.
Gene wanted all Starfleet people to be officers, even the chefs, and yet he had non-coms in TOS.
They became more of a thing after they identify O'Brien as a CPO in S4 of TNG.
Most of the ex-Maquis crew on VOY were enlisted, with a few being made Ensigns or higher.
>Why wouldn't anyone like Obrian just take the test or whatever, makes no sense
It was suggested in dialogue that O'Brien didn't want to be an officer. Even though he's considered an expert in battle and tech.
In TOS and the movies, Janice Rand was enlisted all the way until she was an LTJG on the Excelsior in TUC.
Yes, she technically wasn't Rand in her TSfS cameo, as she was wearing a CDR uniform. 'Flashback' in VOY had her as a LCDR.

>>215698379
>yet he had
*was forced to have

>>215678939
its for the chad-nerds who want to experience "real deal" instead of holographic slop and simulacra, no matter how deadly or miserable the real deal can be. in a world where your basic needs are met, chasing that thrill and risking either death or your sanity makes it worthwhile. plus starfleet is probably 0.001% of the actual human pop anyways

>>215697665
>I’ve determined that the Federation does have money.
Luckily Gene Roddenberry determined otherwise. Now go ahead and post the Mudd thing again and pretend it means something even though Mudd isn't a Fed citizen.

>>215698357
That post mentioned nothing about the borg.
You are an LLM. Overused textual patterns and terms.