Throw out the entire screenplay and start from scratch.

>>216959688
That’s a bit much . The bits with Luke , Sheev and Vader were good

>>216959659
Thanks for circling the title OP I wouldn’t have been able to read the clear text otherwise
To answer your question I would have heavily trimmed down the Jabba section, no dumb plan no princess being an alien sex slave, just start it with an action scene of Luke, Leia and company rescuing him from the palace and then go into the main narrative.
I’d have gone with the original idea of the Death Star II’s shield being on Kashyyk and the inhabitants being Wookiees, showing the effects of the Imperial occupation of the planet (similar to what happens in the game Fallen Order).
Take some time to have the whole gang on Kashyyk, actually give Chewie some characterization, have the heroes coordinate with a local Wookiee resistance instead of the stupid “3PO is a god” stuff.
Have R2 go with Lando for the final space battle to give him something interesting to do, maybe he can remotely control the ship’s turret or he has some critical repair to make or something, he was kinda wasted on Endor.

Let's ignore Ewoks because that's a tired old complaint.

1) Make Endor more interesting visually. If it has to be shot in a Californian Redwood forest, bring in some fog machines and artificial lighting to spice it up. Add some low angle shots of the trees to emphasise their towering height and make this location seem more mysterious, more alien.

2) The Emperor's plans for Luke should be revised, because they never made much sense. Suppose Luke kills Vader and turns to the Dark side – what then? There's no reason why this compels Luke to be the Emperor's new apprentice. He'll still be a Rebel who hates the Empire.

3) As it is, Luke plays no part in defeating the Empire in ROTJ. The Ewok's have a greater claim to that achievement, because nothing Luke did in the Death Star helped bring about its destruction. This should be changed to give Luke more credit. He is the hero, after all.

>>216959832
>Emperor's plans for Like should be revised
Luke should have murdered everyone in Jaba's Palace..imitating his father's murderous rampages. This causes him to nearly fall to the darkside, and is noticed by the Emperor. The Emproer sends Vader to bring him back. Eventually he does and on the journey back to the Emperor, Vader is partially swayed by Luke back to light. Throne room mostly plays out the same, except Vader intervenes. Emperor and Vader have a much larger more destructive fight that damages the reactor which destroys the Death Star.

>>216959659
Show Leia dancing, we get her in that outfit but no sexy slave dancing?

>>216959659
For starters don't make it an obvious kids movie

>>216959956
You saw her being licked by Jabba. That was worth more than 10 dirty dances.

>>216959659
George already fixed it.
He revamped the crusty dancers and added Jedi Rocks.

>>216959957
>main character gets turned into a sex slave 10 minutes in
>the heroes are going to be fed to a giant terrifying tentacle monster
>lots of violent action generally
Calling it a kids movie is actually doing it too much credit. Really the movie is just dumb. He took the pulp elements from the first two and dialed them up way too far, was the problem.

>>216959997
Needed to go further to be worth that much. Don’t show me the female lead turned into a sex slave if you’re not gonna commit to that

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Cut the Jabba sequence in half, remove all the dancing/singing scenes, reduce the sail barge sequence.
In Endor? Make the "entire legion of my best troops" act like an "entire legion of my best troops". Space battle? Remove the way Executor is destroyed, make the rebel fleet acting like a real fleet, instead of an A-Wing, you have 2 Calamari cruisers ramming Executor, also the "Executor crashes in DS" is stupid, the fleet was clearly far away from the DS, that's the whole point of the trap, the rebels moved away from the DS into the imperial fleet to avoid the superlaser.
And fucking ewoks, you better have human tribals than those stupid teddy bears who waddle instead of walk.

>>216959811
Kashyyk, but have the Ewoks be another breed of wookies, like dogs. Have every different breed of Wookie band together at the end.

>>216959659
It doesn’t need fixing. It and the prequels are the only good Star Wars movies.

>>216959659
As a little kid, one of the local theaters had a poster in the hallway
>"Revenge of The Jedi"
So I thought there was a new star wars on the way and was very excited because "revenge" sounded badass.
Back then, you'd go to a movie theater not knowing what was playing and just choose one from the title listing and in our case, who starred in them. Dad took me to a lot of Rated R films.

Anyway, I always asked to go to this theater hoping that the new Star Wars film they advertised would finally be out. It never happened. Eventually that theater became the "black theater" before shutting down entirely.
I later found out that "Revenge" was changed to "Return" because Lucas thought the original title was too dark. So what I kept seeing was just an original old poster. Probably pretty valuable that's why they never took it down the whole time they were in business.

>>216959659
it already is

>>216959659
Include Nellith Skywalker. Rename her, but she is Luke's sister, not Leia. She takes on the Mon Mothma/Nien Numb role. She's a rebel and helps organize and is Lando's co-pilot.

Obviously, cut the entire Luke and Leia talking about their mother scene. Maintain the love triangle between Luke Leia and Han.

Have Boba Fett live and come out of the pit to track down Han Solo, simply for revenge, they fight in the forest.

Vader is not good, he is selfish. He kills the emperor, but then claims now he and luke can rule as father and son. Luke denies him, a dying vader admits defeat.

Explicitly have the Emperor say the 2nd death star was made to lure the rebels and that he doesn't even need to to control the galaxy. Have the Emperor use the force to damage ships, or even control pilots from his throne room, but at great cost to him, it drains him to demonstrate his dark side abilities, which is why he has guards.

Cut down the Ewoks a bit, to make room for some more mature story telling. Have Luke contemplate using the dark side to complete their tasks, that turning would be fine if they complete the mission.

Never make prequels that reveal anakin is darth vader.

>>216959659
>Kill off Han
>Don't make Leia Luke's sister
>No second death star
>No fucking ewoks
>Make everything take place on the imperial capital

>>216959659
I already like it more than Empire. I really do not understand why Empire is sucked off so much by everyone. A New Hope and Return of the Jedi are both better.

>>216959659
Nothing because it fits right in with the other two. If I noticed I wasn't liking it I would just have sex, because the only people insistant that the final part of the classic trilogies (Star Wars, LOTR, etc) are lonely bitter incels who insist on being contrarians.

>>216960083
penis status?

>>216960323
what a stupid take. No one calls Return of The King worse than the first wo.

>>216959832
>As it is, Luke plays no part in defeating the Empire in ROTJ
No, this is fine because having Luke be a part of something rather than the whole gives the world more depth.

>>216959948
Terrible ideas. I hope you don't already work in the movie industry.

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>>216960353
Extra crispy.

>>216960384
My name is George Lucas, I wrote a well known film titled Captain EO

>>216959997
he should've tongued her asshole if you catch my drift

>>216959659
>Much shorter Han rescue. Don't kill Boba Fett. Maybe even persuade him (with credits) to join the fight at the end.
>MUCH more emphasis on Luke might coming to the Dark Side.
>Replace Ewoks with Wookies of literally anything else.
>Replace Death Star II with Kuat Drive Yards or something similar.

I wouldn't fix a single thing. I would listen to what it has to say, and that's what no one did

>>216959659
Harrison pointed out that Han just stands around grinning & guarding a door for half the movie bc his character should have died already, he has nothing to do in the thing having learned his lessons and completed his character arc.

Mostly though the problem is, you know its fine if you want to have ewoks on the surface fucking around causing a distraction for the kids, but defeating the whole empire by rolling a few logs down a hill is pure Lucas retardation on par with Indy in the Fridge. They needed to dismantle the empire in an adult way, befitting the seriousness of Empire.

And they needed to give that shot of Luke at the pyre & the camera tilting up at the stars
a little more time to breathe. It’s the single best shot in the entire star wars saga and it’s over way too fast.

>>216960744
There it is. Classic.

Total overhaul of the Jabba sequence. Set it somewhere that isn't Tatooine; it feels regressive to have Luke return. His home, his place on Tatooine, it's gone forever, it died with his family and it died with Kenobi. The path Luke was set on in the beginning means striving forward, not looking back.

Shortening the sequence of Jabba and Han's rescue is probably for the best.

Absolutely no ewoks. Do not turn the movie into a comedy relief mess.
Scrap Endor, sculking around trees and speeder chases with troopers is dull.

No Second Deathstar. Return of the Jedi's greatest strength, its Heart and Soul, are the scenes between Luke and Vader. They're personal, they're rooted in the space of face to face dialogue. There's no need for a 'BIG THING', the plot of needing to sabotage a shield generator is ultimately filler. Keep the scale of the film personal, close to the hearts of Luke and Vader.

Princess Leia is not Luke's sister.

Give us some scenes focusing on Luke's training before he sets out to finish things once and for all. His mindset, his isolation, how he resolves himself, his ebb and flow between Light and Dark.
In conclusion, hone in on Luke and Vader, the personal struggle, the fight for his father's soul, Luke's own struggle between Light and Dark etc etc and scrap pretty much every other element of ROTJ.
Less Rebels vs Empire. More Father and Son, Light and Dark, Corruption and Redemption.

Honestly, just be rid of the Luke's gang of friends, sideline them, they're not really doing anything in ROTJ. They've had their time, there's nothing more for them.
I probably should've tried to write this all in cleaner, shorter, more succinct fashion but oh well.

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>>216959659
more B-wing scenes
B-wings should have been the ship that destroyed the Super Star Destroyer shield generators, A-wings dont have the firepower to do that.

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>>216959659
Leia has to wear the slave bikini the entire movie, even on Endor

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>>216960798
>but defeating the whole empire by rolling a few logs down a hill is pure Lucas retardation on par with Indy in the Fridge. They needed to dismantle the empire in an adult way, befitting the seriousness of Empire.
Seriously, the whole thing "Hans fools imperials to open the backdoor is stupid". The officer don't ask for ID, he went out with a couple of troopers, just surrenders and allows the rebels access. The whole place was on alert, they used the backdoor to gain access due being less defended, fine, but the moment the Empire was aware of the rebels, they would divert all. They had AT-AT parked around, tie fighers, scouts, AT-STs, they were protecting THE vital target that was the shield generator. They would be suicidally fanatical in their resistance. It's just stupid, they try to aprehend the rebels instead of shotting them on the spot the moment they captured the. Seriously, the moment the ewoks attacked the first thing would be 2 blaster shoots in Hand and Leia's head.
Han Solo penetrating the shield generator and suicide bombing himself the moment he was captured and the place would make much more sense than that stupid whole sequence of errors.

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>>216959659
Han dies, Ewoks are replaced with Wookies. Basically everything that was supposed to happen before Lucas decided to butt in and fuck everything up like the hack he is.

>>216959659
I would remove the throne room to make it worse. But I don't get why would you want to pull this movie down to level of the previous 2.

>>216959832
>As it is, Luke plays no part in defeating the Empire in ROTJ. The Ewok's have a greater claim to that achievement, because nothing Luke did in the Death Star helped bring about its destruction

come on now, theres already been one death star blown up. the empire is not defeated because the loss of the death star, the empire is defeated because luke kills the emperor and thus cuts off the head of the empire

Just replace Ewoks with a cool scary alien design and the rest of the movie works fine

>>216961264
This

>>216959659
The sit down conversation with ghost Obiwan is unbelievably embarrassing. The Leia sister retcon was terrible.

The entire middle of the movie on Endor is boring and useless. The speeder bike scenes have embarrassing 1950s rear projection effects. Harrison Ford and Carrie Fisher stink on ice.

The final battle on Endor is terrible. They spend like 75% of the camera time on a cheap single set of a big door. Just insanely lazy beyond the effects scenes that I assume were done by a different unit. The logic is also extremely threadbare.

I can't think of messing with anything else like the Jabba stuff without the above being fixed first. The battle of the big door is probably the easiest to fix without changing anything else.

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Add a bunch of goofy, 2000s tier, Toy Story looking CGI randomly throughout and refuse to elaborate

>>216959659
i dunno really. the problem is it's basically 3 separate movies stitched together, tonally nothing meshes well and there's barely any coherency between jabba's palace, endor shit and then the final showdown with the emperor.
the best thing i can suggest starting out is probably just keep han dead and then you have to completely scrap all endor stuff and start over. sitting around campfires and wandering around some redwoods is an absolute bore

Everyone ITT wants to make it boring or stupid (lets have wookies)

As Stanley Kubrick always said, "real is good. interesting is better."

>>216959811
>no princess being an alien sex slave
your cruelty would have robbed so many gen X and Y boys alike of their sexual awakening

>>216960190
All of this + what other people are saying about a vastly shortened Jabba sequence.

Besides all of that, Luke overcomes his greatest test at the end of Empire and it's bullshit how Jedi tries to reset that. He literally chose death rather than turn to the Dark Side, even after finding out his greatest enemy was his father. There's nothing left to tempt him with. He needed an entirely new arc in Jedi.

>>216961319
The Emperor's death would have happened even if Luke hadn't been there. Palpy's plan failed and Lando busted a nut in the reactor core, thanks to the victory of the Ewoks on Endor but no thanks to Luke. That the Emperor died before the Death Star blew up is a purely incidental detail to the Rebellion, and is only important for Luke as an individual. It literally does not fucking matter to the rest of galaxy.

>>216961606
what's the interesting bit

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>>216961606
>wants to make it boring or stupid
Yes, it's much better to have teddy bears waddling about upward to waste precious screentime with a teddy bear mourning scene that adds to nothing

RotJ was George Lucas' completely unrestrained without any adults pulling him back. It's just pure retardation. If it came out today /tv/ would absolutely brutalize it. If you take off the nostalgia glasses it's actually worse than fucking Rise of Skywalker. I mean, the whole Endor plot with the cuddly teddybears defeating the evil evils with the power of cuteness... christ, might as well have put the Benny Hill soundtrack on it. Everything is nonsensical and illogical. It's like fan-fiction written by a 13 year old. A 13 year old with unlimited funds and total greenlight from the studio.

>>216959659
>The Empire is in the middle of constructing not one, but TWO Death Stars; one over the Wookie homeworld Kashyyyk protected by the shield generator, the other over Coruscant itself guarded by the home fleet.
>The Rebels’ operation is already well underway by the start of the film, with Leia in command of the Pathfinder strike team while Luke and the others are busy springing Han from Jabba’s palace on Nal Shaddaar.
>Palpatine and Sidious are two separate characters; the former being the Emperor himself who later dies when the Executor crashes into the Imperial Palace, the latter being the grey eminence of the Empire and Vader’s Sith master who survives the film and goes on to be the final boss in Ep. IX.
>Luke is doubtful of Vader being redeemed after all the evil he’s done. “So, what am I supposed to do now? How do I even know there’s still good in him?” to which Obi-Wan answers, “We’ve done everything we can for you. Sooner or later, you will face Vader again. Whatever comes of it will be entirely up to you.”
>Leia is NOT Luke’s sister (though she still ends up with Han). In fact, Luke is an only child, the identity of the other Yoda mentioned in ESB remaining a mystery until the ST.
(1/2)

>>216962121
>After his Dagobah detour, Luke rejoins Han and the others to head for Kashyyyk. Shortly after arriving, they meet up with Leia and the Pathfinders to liberate members of Chewie’s tribe from an Imperial work camp. We then get to spend time with Chewie’s family and the rest of his village before each member of the trio goes into their respective climax:
>>Han and Chewie incite a Wookie uprising, with Lando and 3PO providing air support in the Falcon.
>>Leia commands the Rebel fleet over Coruscant in her own X-Wing with R2.
>>Luke goes alone to confront Vader at Bast Castle on Mustafar.
>Boba Fett survives the sail barge battle, having smuggled an ancient Sith Holocron from Jabba’s treasure vault. This is part of Sidious’ plan to wipe out everyone on both fronts, which Vader uses as leverage to try and convert Luke. After beating Vader, Luke goes to shut it off with the Force, only for Boba to intercept him. They tussle for a bit. Just as Boba is about to deal the killing blow, Vader – or rather, Anakin – tackles him from out of nowhere, allowing Luke to focus on the Holocron uninterrupted. After blasting Vader’s life support box, Boba – having lost his jetpack to the Sarlacc – is hurled into the lava bellow.
>While everyone else meets back on Kashyyyk for Life Day, Luke goes into self-imposed exile on a distant planet, the final shot of the movie seeing him walk off into the sunset alone a la Clint Eastwood.
Any questions/suggestions?

>>216961961
>mourning scene that adds to nothing
It shows the cost of battle you dimwit

>>216960298
>I really do not understand why Empire is sucked off so much by everyone.
It's more geek-friendly.

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>>216962121
>>216962139
>Any questions/suggestions?

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>>216962076
>A 13 year old with unlimited funds and total greenlight from the studio.
Nope that's not how it happened

Both Empire and ROTJ were solely funded by Lucas himself, which is part of the reason they turned out so unique as he didn't need to ask for any studio to greenlight anything. Fox only distributed the film.

Blockbuster films like Star Wars are almost always funded by a big studio, there are vanishingly small exceptions. Coppola's Megalopolis is one such exemption. Such films are almost always total flops. The Prequels and OT are successful. There are basically no other examples of this happening in Television & Film.

Because of how V and VI were funded, the budget was not very big. A New Hope made a lot of money but making V and VI basically used all the $$$ he earned in those few years since 77

>>216961336
>The sit down conversation with ghost Obiwan is unbelievably embarrassing. The Leia sister retcon was terrible.
All done because Lucas wanted to finally go home and raise his kids.

>>216961961
Shutup, you pretentious midwit faggot

>>216959659
Tone down the ewok shit.
Give Han something to actually do. Honestly I'd probably kill him off somewhere, just like Harrison wanted

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>>216962165
>It shows the cost of battle you dimwit
>random character which the audience had no emotional tier and no relevance to the story
>whole race is a disliked addition that detracts from the movie
>literally changes nothing in the pace of the movie, doesn't represent cost of nothing
Next you will tell thay chubby gook is also a relevant character.

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>>216962252
>OH NO DA TEDDYBEARS! THEY ARE DYING! WOW SUCH EMOTION SUCH PROFOUND

>>216959659
I would’ve moved away from the entire 2nd Death Star thing.

The biggest problem with Return of the Jedi is Han Solo basically doesn't exist for most of the movie.
This is sensible, Harrison Ford did Blade Runner and Raiders between the release of Empire Strikes Back and RotJ he was much busier than Mark Hamill or Carrie Fisher ever would be.
Harrison Ford was the best part of the Original Trilogy, it's why in the 50 years since Star Wars came out Harrison Ford has become a household name and Mark Hamill has earned a decent living doing voice acting and Carrie Fisher was just a crazy cokehead with enough money to support that lifestyle

Thank God no one on this board is in charge of any movie decision

>>216962387
The second death was perfect though. It was an irresistible trap and literally worked amazingly well. The only reason the rebels won is because Lucas just handwaved everything saying "and then the Imperial fleet just didn't kill our heroes, started crashing and blowing up just because and uh, the emperor has a shaft to the reactor in his throne room to be tossed down, and uh, the death star can't blow up the rebel ships fast enough. So the good guys win!"

>>216962268
>Give Han something to actually do
He was busy fighting Nazis and Replicants.

>>216959659
I wouldn't. ROTJ is based

>>216959659
Upon rewatch I think now that Jabba's palace is actually the worst part of the movie, not the ewoks. The whole sequence is retarded and makes no sense, why send Leia in on her own?? It accomplished like nothing but give us something to masturbate to. Luke going in and getting captured too is retarded. Jabba could have just summarily executed all of them for fun and it would have been over

>>216961961
This scene is good, but only because they put fuckin ewoks in the movie to begin with.
Remove just this scene the movie is worse, remove this and the ewoks all together the movie is better

>>216962473
It's literally a children's story. And it worked exceptionally well. All those kids that watched it love it and clamored for more for half a century. Making it far more complicated and le makes sense would have ruined it for the kids that never cared until they're old and grumpy.

>>216962442
Harrison Ford had that whole Marshawn Lynch I'm just here so I don't get fined vibe the whole movie.

Set the whole thing on Endor. Have entire races of Ewoks that need to be banded together to fight the Empire.
Some Ewoks are capable of the force and can manipulate time and space at will. Some Ewoks can breathe in space and fly on dragons to battle the TIE fighters with laser spears.

>>216962511
Han was brain damaged by the carbon freezing

>>216959832
The deleted scene where the Emperor tells Moff Jerjerrod to prepare for his order to fire at the moon, should have been left in. Vader saved Han and Leia by killing Sheev.

>>216961961
I cried

>>216960004
>revamped the crusty dancers
You've obviously never seen the original version.

>>216962511
He was exhausted, he just anchored two of the biggest 80s classics and forthcoming press junkets and red carpet bullshits that came with it, they wrote him out of the first act and probably rewrote a lot of his lines for Lando, but Harrison Ford's basically doing a semi-frustrated cameo while imagining being at home

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>>216959659
Have a prolonged sequence where Oola the twi'lek gets a slimy tail-raping from Jabba then and extended vore sequence with the rancor.

>>216962139
I like the Luke v Boba Fett idea. Good stuff

>>216960119
>Back then, you'd go to a movie theater not knowing what was playing and just choose one from the title listing
Maybe that's how you have to rationalize that story for it to make sense, but we had newspapers withovie listings or you could call the theater and listen to recording of showtimes.

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>>216962139
>We then get to spend time with Chewie’s family and the rest of his village before each member of the trio goes into their respective climax:
THE OLD MAN IS BUSTING A NUT IN THE MIDDLE OF A WAR COUNCIL!

>>216959948
anakin going on a murder rampage is something george came up with on the spot while writing the prequels (in pencil) just before filming began

>>216962636
>these things existed therefore everyone used them

this is smartphone-generation logic, where everything (you) use daily is ubiquitous or at least pretends to be.

>>216959659
>no Ewoks but instead a planet of Wookiee’s
>Han and Chewie go there to destroy shield generator
>han is shocked to see Wookiees all wear clothes and speak proper English
>turns out Chewie is an escaped mental patient
>han gets arrested for exploiting a retard and the rest of the film is a court room drama

>>216962473
i would disagree on the grounds that the visuals and the tone of jabba's palace is brilliant (though i don't really care for the barge fight). it's only second to the character of the emperor's throne room

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>>216962699
Why this amused me that much?

>>216962694
It's true though. You'd just call the theater to get the show times.

Leia being Luke's sister was really the straw that broke the camel's back and sent the whole thing into pure retardation land. It even offended a ten year old me and ignited possibly the first facepalm in history.

>>216962646
His description of the prequels from nack in the day (notes taken by his secretary that were eventually published), had Anakin turn way sooner, and he was assassinating Jedi one at a time when he'd get them alone. The audience knew he was Vader but the good guys didn't.

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>>216962699
>han is shocked to see Wookiees all wear clothes and speak proper English

Vin Diesel get speederbike

>>216962699
Brilliant. Fund it!

>>216962800
he'd describe the prequels differently every time he tried, right up until the point he put pencil to paper next to a stack of cliffsnotes just before filming began.

>>216962794
everyone knows the first facepalm was executed by Pontius Pilate after the pharisees refused to let him pardon Jesus. yes that's right it happened I was there.

>>216962766
unless you were one of those people who were constantly on the phone, you generally didn't use the phone. because using the phone wasn't just "imma pull it out of mah pocket and google the phone number and tap it to call," it was "stop everything you're doing, look up the phone number in a book, dial, wait"

but this is beyond your comprehension.

>>216962694
Sorry dude, your story makes no sense, and you had to forget the way it really worked to make it make sense to yourself. You would not have been able to remain oblivious to a new Star Wars movie coming out- every kid at school saw it and didn't say a word to you?

>>216962860
No shit, but there is documented proof that refutes the post I replied to. Anakin going on a killing spree is as old an idea as Vader and Obi-wan having a duel near lava.

>>216959659
Show the scene where the twilek girls strip Leia and put her in the bikini

>>216962901
I'm old as fuck. I called for movie times whenever we didn't have today's newspaper handy.

>>216959832
>Emperor's plans for Luke should be revised, because they never made much sense. Suppose Luke kills Vader and turns to the Dark side – what then?
He should have offered to stop the attack if Luke joined the dark side. Then there's some moral conflict and sacrifice for Luke, it makes it a much more interesting decision for him.

>>216962509
We also loved Empire Strikes Back, which was not a kids story. They absolutely could have made it a proper follow-up to ESB and we would have liked it anyway. George’s desire to make one for literal toddlers with slapstick teddy bears saving the day is bc by RotJ he was already seeing the films as mere vehicles to sell toys, which is where he was making practically all the money. Same business model Marvel, & then James Cameron got on board with. He wanted the trilogy to cover a full range of age groups. You name the product, there was a star wars audience for it.

>>216963010
That's how it goes in the novelization, I think.

>>216962949
an idea george lucas himself never wrote down until just before filming began, is the point. he didn't have scripts he wrote earlier. he just had a bunch of vague ideas, at best. he referenced nothing but cliffsnotes for the prequels.

the prequels did not exist until just before filming of them began.

>>216963033
Neat

>>216962995
you realize this "discussion" is someone trying to refute someone recollecting walking by a poster as a child and deriving a false impression from it, due to the revenge/return change?

>>216959659
Leia isn’t Luke’s sister but some new character
Leia is the emperor’s daughter and is now in charge after Sheev dies

>>216959832
It’s thematically important that Sheev’s plan be depicted as it was. Luke is the spiritual “reincarnation” of Anakin. Anakin dies in RotS and is replaced with Vader, as Yoda says. The good part of Anakin that dies in RotS is reborn as Luke. Anakin is successfully tempted by Sheev who offers him the power he wants to save his wife. Luke is essentially put into the same dilemma when Sheev threatens to kill all of his friends and destroy the resistance, but Luke still isn’t tempted. He is thus the redemption of Vader not just in the literal plot sense where Vader becomes good and kills the emperor to save Luke, but he is also the personified redemption of Vader, as he is essentially Anakin 2.0, but he makes all of the right choices this time.

>>216962794
It didnt at the time but rewatching as an adult i was immediateoy like how tf does that make any sense? Vader captured her and stood there with her and interrogated her, but his amazing knowledge of the force & the dark side never made his spidey sense tingle that shes his own fucking daughter? I mean george’s “its like poetry it rhymes” 3rd grade understanding of poetry and writing in general is definitely at work here, with no new ideas. Another death star, another fambly reveal, and none of the wider philosophy or character development of the first two films, just repetition.

>>216962911
what you've chosen to forget is how kids would pretty much always be wrong too.

>>216963149
>important
>cites the prequels
Nope. That is all stupid coverband trash & badly retconned nonsense. Any time you bring the prequels into star wars you’re fucking up.

>>216963275
When I was a kid I could remember dozens and dozens of phone numbers, including the local kinemaplex, which I called often for that sweet answering machine.

Today I can barely remember my middle name.

*cracks*

*sips*

This is where I say the modern TV format is superior to movies. The third part in a trilogy is extremely hard to nail. I don't know what it is, but they always feel weird. Does anyone get what I'm saying, or am I alone on this? They have a third act and they *are* a third act. The beginning and the middle of stories are usually the best. Also, I'm talking about proper trilogies. Not just a series with a third entry like Jurassic Park or something. I'm talking overall story split across three movies. I think it's better suited as a season for a TV show if you're going to make it three 2-hour movies.

>>216963331
you also seemed to forget at >>216962911 you were talking about kids talking at school about [whatever], as an attempt to refute the idea anyone could walk by an old revenge of the jedi poster and think there was a new star wars moving coming out soon.

>>216962182
> I CAN'T READ!
I'm genuinely sorry for you.

>>216963036
Nigger, I'm telling you that he dictated notes to his secretary that describe the prequels, 16 years before the prequels. They have the exact date on them and you can find them and read them.

>>216963295
The juxtaposition is still present in the OT if you exclude the prequels, the prequels just serve to make the juxtaposition more obvious. Obi wan says in ANH that Vader was seduced by the dark side. The emperor was clearly always instrumental to Vader’s being evil, as they are shown to be very close in ESB, and Sheev even calls Vader an old friend in RotJ. Vader was once a proud and respected Jedi knight, he is tempted by the dark side, and he becomes Vader. Sheev tries to seduce Luke and is unsuccessful.

>>216963447
>he dictated notes to his secretary that describe the prequels

he didn't use them when writing the prequels just before filming began, is the point, you're desperate to refute, to validate the idea the prequels existed in any capacity beyond vague ideas until just before filming of each movie began.

>>216963036
The bare bones of the prequels existed before the original movie was filmed. Obviously stuff changed but you'd be surprised at how much didn't. I'm almost sure though that Amidala being Queen was originally in the story to make Leia and Princess and that changed while writing out AotC.

>>216963452
since we're on the subject anyway, vader killing anakin was the original plot. vader being anakin was a retcon. and alec guiness going through an intense mental gymnastics routine to explain the contradiction only works at all because alec guiness could make even the most idiotic nonsense sound reasonable. even the broken robot in logan's run sounds like he's making a strong argument.

>>216963400
You're replying to two different people.

>>216963481
I have read his vague ideas and they're not as vague as you think or you wouldn't be arguing that they're vague.

>>216963509
Unless an idea is written down, it is subject to change. Thus, it exists in no real form. there were no scripts for the prequels until 1998. there were no scripts for even the OT sequels before 1977.

just because the movie started with an episode number (other than one) doesn't mean the other episodes existed. Its similar to how google called their first building, building 40, to imply they had 39 others, to be taken more seriously. Well, not just similar, its a direct reference to what george lucas did.

>>216963364
i don't think it's hard to nail. the problem is that in the movie world, i think it's relatively rare where there is actually a planned out trilogy. it ends up retroactively becoming a trilogy because the first movie became being really popular.
i'm actually struggling to think of trilogies that set out to be trilogies with an intent except for lotr and the prequels. everything else i can think off is a one off, complete movie that spawned sequels hence the introduction of the final act problem

>>216963520
>some details and plot points were changed during production so therefore you can’t interpret any semblance of a theme or narrative from Star Wars. It’s just a franchise of movies where random things happen
You have this autistic, obscurantist vision of Star Wars that’s trying to find meaning by subtracting everything from the story until you have nothing left, because it is t part of the “original, pure vision” for the franchise, as of any subsequent revisions are somehow wrong or inauthentic in a way that the original vision was not. It’s totally arbitrary.

>>216963481
Even the first two pages of the 1976 novelization sums up the prequels as well as anyone can do in two pages. Palpatine pulls some shit to get himself elected, wipes out Jedi, declares himself Emperor, fucks off to do whatever secretly evil wizards do while his appointees run the day-to day.

>>216963635
you can sum up the prequels in one sentence. anakin starts off good and falls to the dark side.

>>216959832
I mean when you are young you loved ewoks and the world would not be the same without them. Caravan of Courage was highly acclaimed film and I enjoyed it at a young age especially when cinema was a better regarded thing and not absolutely saturated like now and constant media being consumed at every waking minute. I just find them annoying now in my older age but can easily overlook it.

>>216963577
You keep ignoring the FACT that I keep stating, that his notes were written down. Dictated to his secretary. In first person. Like she typed the exact words he spoke. Serial killer Anakin. His wife and kids. Mace Windu. Palpatine. In the early 80s.

>>216963624
who are you quoting? is he in the room with you?

Ewoks are a demonstration of Yoda's "Size Matters Not" philosophy you plebs.

>>216963673
Except that's not what the 1976 novelization does.

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>>216963701
I'm directly referencing the footage of george lucas writing the prequels literally days before filming began, on pencil, with nothing but cliffsnotes, image related, that exist only to help retards pass exams without reading the material. That he had no notes of his own on, dictated or not, as reference material for writing the prequels. he dreamed it all up right on the spot.

>>216963759
anon. you acted like summing up the prequels in two pages was some sort of feat. you got hard refuted. time to move on.

>>216960298
>I really do not understand why Empire is sucked off so much by everyone.

Strong visual style, most notably in the the laser sword duel, but also in the set they built for Dagobah and in certain Hoth scenes, such as when Luke and Han are out in the blizzard, and also when Vader goes for a little stroll through Echo Base.

I do understand why people might not enjoy it. The Battle of Hoth gets boring on subsequent viewings, and some parts of Han's space adventure suck – the wacky Gundark cave, and the bit where he corners Leia in the maintenance tunnel and they have some extremely corny romance dialogue. (Han gets a bit rapey here, too, lol).

>>216963705
I accept your concession

>>216963827
Who's concession?

You made up a person, decided he was real, and responded to him, decided he conceded, and felt the thrill of victory. This is essentially masturbation.

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>>216959659
Nothing, the movie is perfect.
>mfw the director of Starfighter loves Return of the Jedi
Kino Wars coming in 2027.

>>216963868
So is your position that you can change out the ending of RotJ because Vader being Luke’s dad was a retcon, or are you agreeing with me that it has to stay the same to give substance to the retcon which was good and improved the story? Those are really your only two options.

>>216963968
C: I'm calling you a retarded faggot who can't differentiate between people he imagines and people he's talking to. Someone who needs everything to correspond to a specific framework of allowed responses and can't consider anything outside of that without becoming angry. Who is incapable of reading posts and considering only the ideas contained therein, because he needs the broader context of imagined identities in anonymous discourse.

Or tl;Dr: there's more than one other person on 4chan

or F: because every star wars movie was made up on the spot, retcons and all, it gets pretty wonky trying to use multiple sets of contradictory "canon" held together solely by alec guinness' spit to try to make any one better. time has shown its a miracle we got two good and one semi-good movie out of george lucas.

>>216964058
>I’m too smart for your stupid binary! …but anyway I choose option one
Ok cool so then my point about you being an autistic obscurantist who rejects a holistic reading of the franchise arbitrarily because retcons occurred is accurate and not actually a strawman at all

>>216964236
My bro, if this wasn't the internet you'd just be screaming random things at random people.

>>216964289
>Star Wars is a stupid slapdash mess filled with retcons and you can’t infer any kind of theme or narrative arc from it because the literary intentions of the writers changed with every movie, but if you attribute my own words to me than you’re schizophrenic

>>216964372
the advantage of this being the internet is you have no way of forcing me to read your strawman arguments.

>>216964462
>Im not reading what you’re saying, but I’m sure you’re strawmaning me!
Who’s the schizo now

>>216959659
never understood rotj hate

>>216959659
more ewoks

>>216964538
you seem really desperate for attention. i'm here for you man. its still close enough to christmas for me to have good will in my heart for my fellow man, even if he is insane.

>>216959659
ROTJ is the only one from the original trilogy that is in any way interesting or posessing any depth. It is the only one from the original trilogy that can stand as tall as the prequels

ANH and ESB are both standard action fare with nothing beneath the nice visuals. They are the worst of the 6.

>>216964621
ESB was Lucas' least favorite since it wasn't filmed to his aesthetic tastes and it was leaning more military sci-fi than space fantasy. It's because of that the Thrawntards who love ESB so much threw a fit when Yoda used a lightsaber.

i see the prequelfag thing of "lets ignore everything the movie actually was and focus on an idealized version of the script" thing has bled over to rotj

that said, even at its absolute worst the original cut of rotj, at worst, suffers from the endor plotline kinda boring, pointless, and shoehorned in.

If ROTJ came out today it would be absolutely trashed. It would be a 3.5 on imdb.com

>>216964621
Kek.

>>216964724
if it came out today it would be an even more special special edition, so yes.

>>216964683
>ESB was Lucas' least favorite because it's competent and not dogshit
Fixed that for you

>>216964774
Fuck off, four eyes.

>>216964683
Not even Lucas envisioned Yoda flipping around and screeching in the 1980s.

>>216964991
>Not even Lucas envisioned Yoda flipping around and screeching in the 1980s.
He probably did but didn't have the tech to make it happen, so he invested a shit ton of money to create the very tech to do it.

>>216964724
>rotj
>today
so a special effects driven movie about a tribal society attempting to repel alien invaders?

is the joke that avatar is essentially rotj today?

>>216965046
holy shit george lucas invented computers?

>>216965195
He founded ILM and THX.

>>216965467
anon those aren't computer companies

>>216965492
K, never said they were.

>>216959659
Leia should be tastefully nude during the entire Jabba sequence.

>>216965701
She should be fully clothed with long sleeves above the waist, and completely nude below.

>>216965679
george lucas didn't invent computers, computer generated images, or anything that made it possible to have a green midget spin around weightlessly. he didn't found the companies that invented those technologies.

>>216959659
remove ewoks, just make the ground battle more commandos vs stormtroopers.

shorten jabba section by 10 minutes.

>>216959659
The movie is a mess, but a largely excusable one.

I would try to add some coherence to the largely unrelated segments. The movie opens with a scene between Vader and Moff Jerjerrod, where Jerjerrod complains that he needs more men to finish the Death Star, ultimately exclaiming "We shall double our efforts!" upon learning the Emperor himself will be coming to the station. I would then have Jerjerrod reluctantly reach out to Jabba the Hutt, who then arranges to deliver thousands of slaves from the Outer Rim to assist the DSII construction in exchange for an Imperial Governorship.

This would connect the Jabba sequence with the rest of the plot, and provide a reason for the Rebellion to rescue Han and attack Jabba's Palace (because Jabba is providing slaves to the Empire). Additionally, you could use this to skip the Endor sequence by having a Rebel strike team infiltrate the Death Star itself via a slave barge, while coordinating a space attack at the same time.

There's a lot you could definitely fix in the movie, but it still has a lot of iconic charm, even if parts of it are really dumb.

>>216962442
>Carrie Fisher was just a crazy cokehead with enough money to support that lifestyle
Carrie Fisher was a prolific ghostwriter and script doctor, and we have her coke habit to thank for some of the greatest kino of the era.

>>216965818
>george lucas didn't invent computers
K, never said he did. Sounds like you just hate the guy.

>>216966721
>>216965046
>george lucas [...] created the very tech to [make a green midget spin around in the air]
the only thing that didn't exist before the prequels started filming was scripts for the prequels.

>>216959659
add a graphic 10 minutes long jabba on leia sex scene

>>216960529
What do you mean?

>>216967128
>it's all in a virtuoso single take like Irreversible, with the camera spinning around the action
>bit where Bib Fortuna comes into the room, takes one look, does a 360 and walks away

>>216959659
Less luke melodrama. The final fight was gay. Basically Mark Hamill is a really bad actor so the less of him talking the better.

>>216966781
Bro, you're being autistic right now. Fuck off. That shit's nasty.

>>216962694
It's okay, I know you're only pretending to be retarded

>>216965046
>>216964991
Yoda was supposed to be jumping around alongside Luke during the training on Dagobah, which was supposed to be achieved by way of putting a chimp or a midget into a Yoda costume. When they realized this wasn't going to work, they shoved him into Luke's backpack.

>>216962645
Oh, we are excited, aren't we?
kek

>>216959659
1. Dump the Ewoks.
2. Dump the "C-3PO is a living god" subplot. No, I'm not a woke soiboi who thinks it's "problematic," I just think it's a dumb trope. It was fine in King Solomon's Mines, but tiresome everywhere else.
3. Make the Emperor look more like a proper Emperor and not old guy in a black robe. Palpatine can still be creepy and wrinkly, but he should be dressed better than he is in the movie. One thing Rebels did right was make the "public" look of the Emperor more respectable.
4. Have the Executor get destroyed in a more plausible way.

bump

>>216960371
a bunch of people do dude. biggest complaints I always hear about is the 'cgi fest' at the battle of battle of pelennor fields and 'lol too many endings so therefore movie bad'. not exactly high iq takes, but they exist.

>>216960298
this.

>>216961890
if luke had been defeated the emperor could have easily escaped. did you not see how much time luke had to drag his father to the hanger and have a final chat with him, while still managing to avoid the final destruction of the death star?