How can you debate free will if you believe it doesn't exist at the end of the day?
>>217372013What does Ryback think about this?
>>217372013who has the energy to debate people at the end of the day. Maybe i'm getting old but i'm ready for bed at 9pm
>>217372039If you say out loud that "I think" or "I believe" or "I did", doesn't you saying that out loud cancel out determinism?If you have a feeling in your brain that you just did a choice, how can you not believe it was out of free will?
>>217372013Free will is true simply because quantum mechanics show the universe has randomness/indetermism in it so just that already allows it
>>217372460People are free to think that they have free will simply because human beings can't perceive or manage every single deciding factor at the same time, only guess, so that makes it seem like there are choices.I have thought about the point of "we need free will and responsibility to have a criminal justice system for example". People having the concept of free will doesn't cancel determinism.
>>217372460>spend all that time, money and effort to simply find out something the bible says is true.
>>217372528>People having the concept of free will doesn't cancel determinism.People having the concept of determinism doesn't cancel free will.
>>217372528>I have thought about the point of "we need free will and responsibility to have a criminal justice system for example"Why?You can have a justice system based on determinism. It works even better. You genetically test people to figure out who is most likely to commit crimes and then you humanely euthanise them before they can commit crime.
>>217372013admit that agers thing 2 idea is dope as fuck
Free will does not exist because the synapses that occur in your brain happen because your parents decided to fuck and have a kid. You had no say. Similarly, they had no say. If you take it far back enough, you get to the Big Bang. Was the Big Band random? Or was it deterministic? Either way, we had no choice or say in the matter (or anything else that followed).
>>217372013The idea that free will has anything to do with determinism is stupid. It doesn't matter if the future is predetermined; you still have free will, because free will is not a mechanism, but an attribute. All it means is that you are ultimately responsible for your decisions. Just because your shitty childhood might have molded you into being a criminal, for example, does not absolve you from your culpability in your own actions. All free will means is that, regardless of why you're making your choices, you are competent and can be held responsible for them.End of story. No quantum woo garbage necessary.
>>217372460how does randomness allow for free will?the randomness of quantum mechanics is not in our control.
>>217372968You were waiting your entire life to post that. You think you did it with your own free will, but it was actually predetermined.
>>217373076Okay, dude, true, but my point is that it's irrelevant. Free Will is defined by your responsibility for your own will, not by your literal ability to defy causality. The only reason you don't believe in free will is because you choose--stupidly--to define it incorrectly.
>>217372013SEVEN DIAMONDSFIVE AND TWO
>>217372822>>217372824The argument often presented is that a criminal should be let free because they didn't have free will, but the uno reverse card to that is that the court didn't have free will to let them go but were determined to put them in prison or execute them.
>>217372912I haven't seen Thing movies so I don't recall what his idea was, but I watched the new video about his ideas for Matrix sequels and I liked it.
>>217372997Randomness is a necessary trait for free will, a single atom for example may not be in control but humans could be
>>217372968People feel like they have free will because they can't determine even the rest of their own life choices accurately so the feeling of free will comes from not knowing all the almost endless factors. If people were able to know everything, then they could accurately tell where they are 5, 10 or 20 years from now on or they would know if they were to die early.
>>217372997Randomness allows for the so called ability "to do otherwise" to be a thing
>>217372013do people have different perspectives of free will? I always feel like its an argument with no resolution
>>217373335>>217373377How does randomness correlate with free will? My first thought is that a person (or their brain) randomly has some thought but did they choose that thought and the impulse to act on it?
>>217373378Yeah. Well, there's epistemological issues inherent with pretty much all philosophical topics, so these issues may really be inherently unsolvable. For me, any debate is really just about which perspective is most useful, in some utilitarian kind of sense.Free will just means "You are responsible for your choices," it does not mean "You are an acausal entity."I think that goes without saying, or else it's a worthless concept.Most people just choose to define the concept from a niche, retarded point of view. Why? Because they're filthy midwits. They want to feel smart, they don't actually want to genuinely take the topic seriously.
>>217373480Yes and no, some stuff we may choose on the go, some impulsively, some we may think about it, some we may no think about it at all, is a combination of those, there's no definite way to see it
>>217373545I used to think that no one chooses what thoughts they have (the extreme example always used: serial killers) but people could choose their actions.
>>217373378The vast majority of people have never really thought about it that deeply or read anything on it. Most will just say some generic shit like free will is that you can do whatever you want.I remember when Sam Harris was on Joe Rogan's podcast and spoke on free will and the comment section was just full of brainlets who couldn't even grasp what Sam was saying. It sort of shows how little people think about these sorts of concepts.Same with people talking about free market or socialism. And these two are even that philosophical yet require serious reading and knowledge to discuss at length. Morons just see the words free market or free will and just take them literally and fill in their blanks with whatever the fuck goes on in their minds.
>>217373711*aren't even
>>217373711People think in pretty practical terms as in>of course I had free will because I chose myself what to have for breakfast and no one held met a gunpoint or used hypnosis or mind control weapon or me
>>217372013Who really cares? Tell me who really cares. >Why are you posting if you don't careNo what I mean is, does it matter? If, and may Allah forgive me for saying this, if the Demiurge came down and said "Yes, you have free will," I'm still going to get up tomorrow and take a shit. I'm still going to shower, run some errands, chip away at some goals, etc. Likewise, if the Demiurge came down and said "No, you do not have free will," I'm till going to get up tomorrow and take a shit. I'm still going to shower, run some errands, chip away at some goals, etc. It's just a useless conversation to have.
>>217373926That's some stupid fucking shit you just said. I can tell you right now no one's going to stop any intellectual pursuits because of your retardation.
>>217373986So to the answer of >Who really cares?you really care, then? If so, why? This is your moment to grace the world with something valuable, if anonymously.
>>217373926You could say it's already predetermined whether we have free will or not.
>>217374044I suppose I could, or you could. That's that, huh?
>>217374015You're right anon. I was wrong. No one cares.
>>217374108Oh. So you don't care? That's odd that you chose to insult me then. I wonder if you were always going to insult me, if it was predetermined since time came into being, or if free will allowed you to choose to insult me.
>>217374094Yes.
