Baratheon editionOld thread:>>219929404
>>219988828TAOOBA!
So what became of House Velaryon?
What is dead may never die
>>219988862Their valyrian stock was impeached
Cute and canon!
>>219988845THAT'S TAOOBA!
>>219988909What does the Drowned God actually look like? A Deep one? A normal dude? Something in between?
>>219988862a guy told them bastids could be anywhere, and they didn't listen to him
serious question: why do normies/redditors act like the greens are evil racist/sexist chuds?
tfw season 2 is delayed because of flooding and all we have is that dogshit HOTD.
>>219988862They got nerfed pretty hard after the Dance like with the High Towers. Cersei trusted a Velaryon bastard a shit ton of ships since he looked like Rhaegar who ran off with the fleet to become a pirate.
>>219988862In the books, they're still around. We met a Velaryon bastard in book 4.In show universe, we don't know. We saw one black girl at Baelor's funeral, so she might be a Velaryon.
>>219989411Hightowers didn't get nerfed at all, they're still rich and powerful.
>>219989427>We saw one black girl at Baelor's funeral, so she might be a Velaryon.That's Valarr's wife, Kiera of Tyrosh.
>>219988862They don't play a big role in the story, as with the Targs gone they don't have that much influence anymore. But they're still around, and Stannis' vassals.
>>219989514lmao
>>219989356Vaghar can't consent, she's senile and thinks Aemond is Visenya.
>>219989436They've done little but sit on their hands since the Dance. Didn't do jack during the Blackfyre rebellion, and in the current era have done still very little with it's lord hiding in his tower for more then a decade. The upcoming Battle of Blood will be the first time they've done anything of note in a very long time.
>>219989546Senile Vhagar is best Vhagar
>>219989570That's not being nerfed, that's being smart. They're as rich as the Lannisters and can field more swords than any non-Great House. The Blackfyre rebellion was for dumbasses. Nerfed is being like the Velaryons, going from a rich and wealthy house to being able to bring 3-4 galleys and a few hundred swords to war.
>>219989796It's been 170 years since the Dance. With all of their supposed power and wealth you'd assume they do something, anything with it.
>>219989919Presumably maintain their powerbase, develop it, apply soft power, etc. The current queen is half-Hightower, after all. You're thinking of power in a very Cersei-esque manner. By that logic, House Lannister must have been broke as fuck for the first 130 years of the Targaryen reign. Feudal politics isn't necessarily going around spamming money like Elon Musk or violently going full retard like Aerys II.
>>219989796>going from a rich and wealthy house to being able to bring 3-4 galleys and a few hundred swords to war.It's implied they were jewing Stannis not giving him everything they could.
>>219989514Why is she Zendaya-looking?
>>219990064I don't know, ask Ira.
>>219990055No it isn't, Monfryd Velaryon was eager for a fight and personally died for Stannis.
>>219989182Imagine this guy in pitch black on the ocean floor
>>219990108*Monford
>>219990136>imagine a weird turd on the ocean floorno wonder the ironbabbies always lose
>>219990108>"Stannis is too rigid, no one wants to serve him!">his men will charge across a bridge over a river of fire>attack an army 100,000-strong,>follow him along a freezing death march to Winterfell>Targaryen bannermen like Velaryons die for himIs GRRM writing Stannis wrong or is the point that his foes misread him and he actually IS flexible and pragmatic, while capable of inspiring loyalty?
>>219988113She literally says in Season 6 he made all the girls “play games”
>>219990462Stannis has some flaws (starting to huff his own farts thanks to Melisandre capitalizing off his middle kid issues) but is genuinely the best king material of the entire main series.The whole "rigid as iron, doesn't bend, just breaks" is stupid because he's very flexible. His rigidity appears when it comes to certain rules that might make lesser, vain and insincere, men hate him, but makes the honourable ones truly love him. It's a test, in a way - if Davos was unworthy he'd hate Stannis for cutting his fingers off, but since he is worthy he's his most loyal follower.Renly was copper, Robert was gold but Stannis is steel.Which is also why he's going to flub it and lose because GRRM hates having competent people and good endings.
>>219990136Why did Godwin turn into a mermaid?
>>219990462>>219990984Stannis! Stannis! STANNIS!
Reminder that Catelyn is a retard who is responsible for every atrocity in the War of the Five Kings. If she had just left Tyrion alone, things would have been wholly different. And the worst part is she thinks she's justified in everything she does, even if her POV does some basic lip-service to "oh no am I doing the right thing". Great example is her and Robb's exchange on the way to the Red Wedding.>Rob tells Catelyn he wants to legitimize Jon because they literally have no other options if Robb dies.>Catelyn can't pull her head out of her ass and refuses to support Robb's choice because she legitimately believes Jon would murder Robb's children(?!?!)>Robb: "Who cares what you think? I'm the king." 'leaves'Actual quote from the book:"...all I have done is speak the truth. Are men so fragile they cannot bear to hear it?"God, she sucks.
>>219988828egg is icsh
>>219991095Everything would have been fine if Tyrion hadn't spotted her.
>>219990462Stannis continues to arc as the series went on.One part of why I think TWoW is taking so long is because burning Shireen was part of GRRM's original outline for Stannis at the beginning of ASoIaF but now that he's gardened him into an anti-hero he can't write it out without it becoming a regression of character.
>>219990462Stannis envies Robert's charisma; it's plainly a stronger ability than what Stannis has. But although Robert may have had a million friends, you could argue he never had a thousand diehard loyalists among them, which is what Stannis has. As Russell Crowe once said: "men must be governed;" Robert and Renly's style of ruling is too informal, Stannis is exactly the kind of person actual Medieval Barons would want as their King. But because southrons are such disgusting degenerates in Westeros they prefer a literal sodomite instead.
>>219988909I WILL KILL EVERYBODY WHO IS DEAD! EVERYONE WHO HAS DIED WILL BE KILLED!
how long til hotd?
>>219991095She's a, may the Old Gods and the New forgive me, a R*verlander, thus utterly ignorant of how civilized societies do things. She has no idea of political machinations of the South, she has no idea of loyalty bonds of the North, thus she percieves the whole world through the lens of shitty small house feuds like Blackwoods and Brackens.
>>219991361never. cancelled.
>>219991237i kind of think that stannis ending up the the throne is the only way grrm could really subvert expectationsgrrm kind of went and wrote the best non-pov character of the setting without seeming to intend to. i don't get why he couldn't stray from his outline. he did the same for other characters.
>>219991399gurm is a stupid hack plagiarizer.
>>219991399He'd probably hate the kind of message that sends.
>>219991458It could send different messages, depending on how he wrote it.
i liked that video where a guy says Stannis will become the night king o algo
>>219991458what message does it send?
>>219991095she captures Tyrion because she believes he's involved in Bran's assassination attempt, it's a bit reckless yeah but reasonable for a mother to respond that way. She has no reason to doubt Littlefinger's lie about the dagger>she legitimately believes Jon would murder Robb's children(?!?!)I kinda agree with you here, HOWEVER in this society things can take on a life of its own when it comes to oaths and political power. Jon being legitimized automatically puts a target on her children regardless if Jon would push his claim or not
>>219991299Seeing Stannis as king was the best part of Outlaw King.
>>219991515No!
>>219991095Catelyn is a strong woman who had to endure more emotional torture than any other character in the story; easily the best female POV and I'll never fully forgive Gurm for what he did to her, even though I'm sure her arc will have an actual conclusion, unlike in the show. >>219991237Stannis was always one of the most gray characters. I'd love to see a story where he was more of the good guy, but that was clearly never George's intention.
>>219991399George doesn't write to "subvert expectations." If he kills a character, it's because he believes it's good for the story. He's just really edgy like I was when I was a teen, so he loves wallowing in misery.
>>219991558>Catelyn is a strong womanidiot. catelyn is a tully woman.
Will they recast Alys Rivers actress?
>>219991515It's also got Maekar as Stannis' right hand man.
>>219991727damn that's kino
In the show when Jon and Dany first meet she brings up that the last King in the North knelt to the Targs.Missed opportunity for Jon to correct her that the last King in the North was Robb
>>219991515This. Is. Everything.Edit: thank you for the gold, kind stranger!Edit2: Ummm, so this is kind of blowing up. Please be nice in the replies, just because someone doesn't support Stannis does NOT mean you get to misgender them.
>>219991911They kind of forgot about that.>>219991929Epic... epic for the win.
>>219991687Nice gen. Model?
>>219991687can you gen a grown up shireen?
>Take off that armor Maester Qyburn, you look ridiculous...
>>219992147this guy was cool in the andor show
>>219991513>She has no reason to doubt Littlefinger's lie about the daggerOh, how about don't trust the guy who tried to stick his tongue down your throat and did the same to your crazy sister, lost his fostering at The Eyrie by acting like a beta bitch and whom you haven't seen in decades?
FORM RANKS, YOU DOGS!R'HLLOR HUNGERS!
>>219992382yeah well that's the whole point of Littlefinger he's willing to manipulate everyone around him, it would be unreasonable for her not to believe he'd lie about something so serious because she still trusts him
>>219992625sans not*
>>219991558Catelyn coming back as a comical revenge zombie undermines the very human atrocity of the Red Wedding. Cutting Lady Stoneheart was the right move, especially because GRRM clearly has no idea what to do with LS or anyone in her orbit
>>219991095Her protests against legitimizing Jon aren't directed at Jon murdering Robb's kids it is that to make Jon heir he has to remove his status as a bastard which creates an entire new branch to the Stark tree that is specifically not of her bloodline.It's that Jon can be trusted to be good and honourable but by making him a true Stark it means everyone one of his disendants must be the same or it will cause issues with Robb's own children.Also she's one of the best POVs in the entire series because she is both relatable and not without flaws that cloud her choices so I think you are just a bit of a twat in your analysis.
>>219991381kek
>>219992488AAAAGGGHHHH
>>219988862cant wait for the movie
>>219993292DARK SISTAH
>>219992147same actor was so good in Wolf Hall. kino show
>>219992738The fact that she cares about another branch of the Stark family being created over it being annihilated entirely is just another point against her.
why does he love brown pussy so much?
>House of the Dragon season ends>must wait four years to view the next season
>>219988862I don't really understand why they made them all black, since the targs marry into them and they are all uh white.
>>219991399Most kino outcome by far is Stannis dying but from his efforts Shireen being crowned Queen Which is why it wont happen
>>219990462Stannis is a victim of unreliable narrators. A major thing is how they say he’s humorless and he’s constantly cracking witty jokes. Another is saying he’s not flexible and yet he often changes course and hears people out.
>>219993394we literally got a 20 minute flashback explaining that
>>219993394Stop bleaching, Ser!
>>219991727holy shit
>>219993447story would improve tenfold if George simply got rid of all his cringy anime MCs (Jon, Bran, Arya, Dany)
>>219991515>Stannis was in Outlaw kingWow I feel fucking blind, he looks so different with a beard
>>219993373i think you're forgetting just how unusual it is for Jon to be taken into the family being a "bastard"
>Joffrey "Baratheon" is bastard incest spawn>Myrcella "Baratheon" is a woman>Tommen "Baratheon" is bastard incest spawn>Stannis betrayed the realm by converting to heathen eastern religionI'm afraid it's Renly I Baratheon for me.
>>219993676Renly's entire existence is a threat to the social contract of the realmIf anyone can just show up and say, "I think I'm gonna be king because I feel more popular" then every generation is a civil war
>>219993394
>>219993723Robert already smashed the social contract when he rebelled and claimed the throne by force.
>>219993803Actually Aerys did that because he was executing nobility without trial or even reason
>>219993803>>219993839Actually Aegon I did that by creating the throne.
>>219993723That's what Stannis is doing too. There's no proof that Joffrey is a bastard.
>>219993588I'm an autistic Stannisfag chud who tends to like the more masculine characters, but I actually like Arya and even saw the appeal of Dany in the first book before she began boring me to tears. But Arya needs more character development that just being edgy to remain interesting, and Bran needs for literally anything to happen at all. Jon is the best of them, but I'm so-so on him being the protagonist of the finale.
>A Dream of Spring>Epilogue>POV: The Prince who was Promised>It's Rhaegar's pov of the Battle of the TridentHow would you react?
>>219994044There's all the proof possible short of a DNA test which is obviously impossibleNo one doubts their illegitimacy
>>219994213Would you mind sharing what that proof is?
>>219994240
>>219994207Robert's Rebellion was a great background mystery for the first book, but it feels so far in the past and so divorced from the events we've been reading about that it feels strange to even bring it up at this point.
>>219994240Based on Roberts bastards and historical examples of baratheon/lannister children, the chance of Robert siring 3 blonde children with cersei sits at about .125%, furthermore, Jon Arryn died under suspicious circumstances just as he was investigating into this
>>219994240there is none that you will be satisfied with but idk maybe the fact that last two hands got fucking murdered for it once they found out and people already whispered about cersei and jaime fucking each other
>>219994704>>219994774Wow that's really impressive evidence, I'm convinced
I would bet George doesn't think of King Bran as some unambiguously positive development as the show seems to portray it. More likely it leads to another brutally effective medieval police state under Bloodraven 2.0 which keeps the peace for a time but doesn't solve the flaws innate to human nature. It would be quite a betrayal of what George seems to be going for if the whole point of the books is just that merging with the Helios AI is the right call.
>>219994923>t. Tywin
SANTA FE - George Raymond Richard Martin, American author best-known for the “A Song of Ice and Fire”, peacefully passed gas this evening at his New Mexico home surrounded by friends and family. He is 77.
>>219995703>surrounded by friends and familyI am fucking disgusted that he involves them in his scatological antics. Lord only knows what his wife has been exposed to.
One thing the show actually got right was calling itself "Game of Thrones" because what everyone really wanted was more intrigue and less war.
>>219996085true we're all desensitized to the name now but i do remember the title itself was intriguing at the time
>>219991101luke is icsh
>>219996085actually everyone wants more cgi dragon battles
>>219996085>really wanted was more intrigue and less waronly females and queers want that
>>219996807>fucking boyshot
>>219996679Well, speaking just about the show, it couldn't even afford to properly portray the war anyway.
>>219988828Why tho?
>>219996850is he the icsh poster
>>219989182>What does the Drowned God actually look like?
>>219990108I remember Davos thinking Monford wasn't really being that direct with how he feels. When Stannis and mellie are burning the statues Davos fixates on him knowing he's not saying how he feels about it all.
>>219991515
>>219991513>Jon being legitimized automatically puts a target on her children regardless if Jon would push his claim or notIf legitimized, Jon Snow would take precedence over Bran and Rickon (being older) and Sansa and Arya (being older and a male).But Catelyn essentially has no more children, as Bran and Rickon are dead, Arya is probably dead and Sansa ends up married to a Lannister demon monkey.
>>219992147>>219992194>>219993352He also played Chief Superintendent Reginald Bright for nine seasons on the Brit detective tv series "Endeavour", which is really good but as it's not capeshit or tits & dragons, /tv/ has never watched it.
>>219993723>>219993723This. Renly outright campaigns on saying that he should be succesor just because he wants to rule. No one should follow him. Every lord from the highest paramount to the lowliest landed knight would be terrified by the idea of destabilising the system like that. All of them have siblings and cousins, and their children will have too. Renly needs a legal or ideological justification for his claim. Which he has, as anon has pointed out: Cercei's children are bastards born of incest, and Stannis has become an enemy of the faith. On those grounds Renly has a great claim. Grrm cares nothing for law and religion, so he missed his own setup lol.
>>219993661>i think you're forgetting just how unusual it is for Jon to be taken into the family being a "bastard"But it's not that unusual, there's Larence Snow in the North, who is suggested as an heir to the Hornwood lands and there's Aurane Waters, who is the bastard half-brother of Monford Velaryon whom he serves beside at the Battle of the Blackwater.
>>219999916Renly felt too guilty about being a faggot to use that justification
>>220000029i want to fugg renly please let me fugg renly please
>>219994240The proof would be capturing King's Landing and getting the Westeros to kneel to you. Proof resides where people believe it resides.That being said anything (not even just Jaime) about Cersei fucking around is already putting huge shadow on the kids parentage and with how she's doing so far I wouldn't be surprised if eventually Cersei just randomly admits to it as a part of a mental breakdown ending with her drinking wildfire or something.
papa bear
>>219993676The rightful king is Jon Targaryen and his heir is Daenerys.
....semoc eH
>>219998696Huh?>Velaryon will threaten to take his levies home unless we strike at once. >... and Lord Velaryon was watching the king rather than the conflagration.>... all but Velaryon, who said that steel would decide the matter, not words on parchment. He seems pretty direct. He wants action, not stalling. And he dies for Stannis.
>>220001816!on ,on ,oN
>>219993394Totally understandable Something about Dornish girls is intoxicating
>>219993394its the ultimate form of chaddism
>>219993436Asoiaf has this magical strong seed that disregard dominant and recessive genes. Theres no mutt or hapa. It's either one parent or the other. Thats why that cunt rhaneyra had sons that arent niggers and all have black hairs/eyes because she's a whore and fucking strong.T. Ser criston
>>219992695Red Wedding was inhuman atrocity, that's the point. It reverbates through time and gives every other POV visions of it before it even happens it's so bad.
>>219991929Get Renly's cock out yo bussy playa
>>219993759Are you a knight?>flashbacks of arlan shruggingYes
>>219993803That contact needed to go ever since Aerys executed Brandon's retainers. And Robert has some degree of Targaryen ancestry so he's not illegitimate.
>>219989382>mfw
>>219988862They made pirate goat Auranne who pulled off the most devious heist in Westerosi history.
Just a test, I want to know who got the gets>>220000000>>219999999
Wow they both suck
>>220003667Live HotD auntie reaction when their civil war show has civil wars instead of insipid and overwrought lesbian character drama.
>>219994027Actually it's the children of the forest. Without his dragon dreams of them fucking up westeros/world of necrophilia, he wouldn't even bother escaping valyria while it nuked itself.
>>219991042Death is associated with water. Deathblight is a sort of sickness and so is associated with stagnant water. Tibia Mariners show that dead souls need to travel down some equivalent of the River Styx to reach the afterlife.All rivers flow to the sea, just all living things move towards their fated death.
>>220003839>Tibia MarinersGods what a stupid name
>>219993436I think it's OKAY as a decisioni'm going to play devil's advocate and say that it actually kinda works.>It makes easier for the audience to grasp who is a Velaryon and who is a Targ, like, "oh the ocean people are all black">It gives more credence to the average nobleman that Nyra's kids are bastards, because everyone can look these kids are definitely not her husband's, and how people denying it are doing out of obligation instead of genuine ignorance
>>219998653Cthulhu is fat not muscular
Good morrow sers
>>220000225>she actually turns into a dragon maester forgot to poison the wildfire
>>219994240A Feast for Crows, Cersei V.>b-b-but
So why did Bran the Builder or whoever leave humans north of the wall?
>>220004665How far north is he supposed to build? Do you know far north the Thenns live? At any rate he'll reach the Land of Always Winter and there's no point building a wall at that point because you're already in Other territory
Prince of the leaking clitty.
>>220004881>How far north is he supposed to build?Just bring the proto-wildlings (who presumably had little difference between the rest of the North's First Men at the time) south.
Reminder that Dunk met 4-year old Walder Frey and kid Tywin during his lifetime
Coldhands is a secret Targaryen, he is Daemon . It is known
>>220005450No place left
>>220005641Turns out Walder's a perv ever since he found his older sister getting pounded by one of the Frey's kitchen boys.Dunk should've offered Bloodraven to cut both his and his father's heads off when he began executing traitors.
>>220005804The bedding ceremony shit really says a lot about GRRM.
>>220005804Why did Ambrose Butterwell with his gorgeous new castle and countless head of cattle marry a disgraced proto-Amerei?
>>220005993Peake presumably ordered him to in order to get Frey support in the Riverlands for the rebellion, the real question is why he listens to Peake.
>>220005880Says alot about ANDALS, more like
>>220005880Targs don't do that shit right? Can't imagine Naerys or Helaena going through it.
>>220006537Fuck, looks like I was wrong:>singers like to claim that both Aemon and Naerys wept during the ceremony, but the truth is different: Aemon is known to have quarreled with Aegon during the feast, and Naerys wept during the bedding, not the actual wedding
>>220005880That shit actually happened IRL (but not as extreme because everything in Westeros is shittier than the actual Middle Ages).
>>220006164>the real question is why he listens to Peake.Ambrose Butterwell was weak and cowardly and his son-in-law Tommard Heddle strong armed him into obeying.
How did weak men come to rule dorne isn’t the game of thrones super cutthroat?
>>219996634season 1 bran is icsh
>>220003500okay yeah I know there was epic foreshadowing in the visions or whatever but bringing Catelyn back to life is still fucking gay
>>220006164>Peake presumably ordered him to in order to get Frey support in the Riverlands for the rebellionGuess the dead Frey we saw in Dunk was a loyalist after all.
>>220008412Cutthroat, yes but that still respect the line of succession. Without that it'd be constant civil war over claimants. Dorne's weird where the female line has a strong a claim as the male line such causes issues. The books portray it better in the books then the show where the Sand Snakes just decided to kill all the men they could get there hands on.
>>220008412Close ties to the Targs made the Martells soft and complacent.
>>220008412Dorne has men of action like Oberyn and Darkstar (if you count failing to kill little girls as action) It's just that the ruling line of house Martell is headed by a dysgenic toad who has convinced himself that his wistful daydreaming about a restoration and various harebrained schemes that would put the most romantic blackfyre sympathizer to shame are in fact super genius master plans.
>>220009474Doran Martell is GRRM's self insert. A sad, bitter, immobile husk of a man whose plans and dreams rotted around him like the blood oranges.
>>220009690Who spends his free time watching naked children swim in pools, it is truly GRRM
Yes, but how did the Andal invasion changed the art movement in Westeros?
>the creepy old guy working as a goon in the red keep dungeons is Corlys Velaryon's last known heirKarma!
fookin stewpid dunk
There are three extraordinarily based schools of military strategy in Westeros, which one is the best?>Tywin Lannister schoolJust order Gregor Clegane to rape everything in sight, sit back and hope for the best.>Balon Greyjoy schoolNever fight if there is a reasonable chance of winning. Declare war on the whole world for fun. Attack other independence movements the second they start giving your main enemy too much trouble.>Mace Tyrell schoolWhen war comes, immediately gather 40k men for a big picnic outside Storm's End. Never be too quick to get into battle. Escape every apocalyptic war with your army completely intact, like Walder Frey but way cooler.
been rewatching the series on 4k blu ray...season 3 onward looks sublime but I lament that seasons 1 and 2 are forever stuck in shitty upscaled 1080p because of the cheap digital cameras they used on those seasons. Makes me wonder how the show might have looked if they filmed on 35mm like they intended with the original pilot
>>219999973>But it's not that unusualyes it is, people are tolerant of bastards as long as they are kept out of sight. Ned taking him in is a huge slight towards Catelyn having to see him every day growing up with her children, it's a testament to Ned's pimp hand that she put up with it all those years him being legitimized would be too much
>>220010993You have to be very hiqh IQ to grasp the intricacies of Balon's crab bucket warfare.
Maybe Balon is a retard because they always drown their King first and they lose too many brain cells
I don’t think they should have done the Artsan Whitebeard rigamarole but her dismissing Jorah is awful on the show compared to the books. She’s such a bitch about it.
>>220011739He's a slaver. Keeping him around would be hypocritical.
mama bear
poppa
>>220011739It's crazy too because Jorah is so much more of a gentleman in the show. Book Jorah is a pretty gruff fellow, but Dany seems more affectionate to him than the show's beta Jorah. Perhaps there's a lesson to be learned there.
>>220011966>1966>year my grandfather was born>>220011992>1992>year my father was borni wonder if this post will be the year i was born
>>220012044i wonder if that will be the year i will die
>>220010993for me it's the dani school of military thought>run around with a mercenary army and cause confusion by invading neutral parties because you are personally offended by their customs, then just leave and refuse to elaborate
>>220010993Realistically i’d be the Robb school>throw it all away for a night of southron strange
>>220012479realistically you would be hiding under your bed quivering
Valarr Velaryon of Valyria
>>220012705nah i'm a badass
