Why can't God mess around with free will?
>>220102042Defeats the point of being human, apparently.
you can't have free will and gonads at the same time
apparently god CAN but of his own free will designed humans in such a way, despite being omniscient and knowing the consequences and all choices every single human will make even before they are born, decided that this is how things should be. every child rape, every senseless murder, every random act of violence, every misguided act of terrorism, every unfunny forced meme posted, was his choice. and if you don't bow to his infinite cruelty then you are destined for eternal pain and torture with no recourse of hope of escaping. how can anyone in their right mind submit themselves to such a megalomaniac control freak?
Free will being a human only thing is total bullshit
>>220102454i made my son but he has free will lol
>>220102042He wouldn't have as much fun if we just did what he wants to.>Violence etcViolence is cool just like Tarantino said. God just like to watch real life kino, but he's an Israelfag and breaks his rules hardening pharaoh's hearts for his favorite characters.
why didn't god make me a 6'2" Chadanswer that and stay fashionable
>>220102645we are all gods children, and I'm a 6'2" Chad, which means you are too in a way
If he's omnipotent and omniscient, why would he do that? He already knows what's going to happen
>>220102615>He wouldn't have as much funHe already knows everything that will ever happen, how is it even possible for him to have fun at all?
>>220102042if the future is already known (which it is), then its its literally impossible to for there to be free will lmao, EVEN if you said we can "choose' our decisions, we cant CHOOSE our options, its like saying you can row a canoe but you cant beat the current of the water, futile and trivial, and thats IF there is free will LOL
the biggest flaw of every religion is that they never accounted for the existence of autismos and the ability for freedom of speech to be so prevalent in the olden days they could just dispatch and make public examples of those who spoke out or broke religious laws, but now they can't do that, at least in western countries. with every single new development in science or understanding of things that were once considered unexplainable, the religious people always try to cope. it's like playing with a kid who constantly invents new super powers to thwart any attempt to beat them. and their ultimate cope is "faith". you can't argue with someone who hides behind their faith. we already know that anyone who refuses to engage honestly and argue in good faith and feigns ignorance is not worth having a discussion with and you can safely disregard anything they say or claim since they are cowards and disingenuouslogic > faith
>>220102042Because love requires free will. Without free will, we’d just be dolls in a dollhouse. We wouldn’t have choice. We’d essentially be pawns, which isn’t how an all loving being creates rational creatures.>>220102454Most of those things are the consequences of man’s use of free will. Also, God doesn’t send you to hell. It’s a state, not a place. When you die, the veil drops and you stand naked before omniscient being, pure reality itself. You’re either oriented to it via Christ, or you’re not. It’s eternal because time ceases to matter. Your time as a human has finished, and you see the light of God. For the damned, this is unbearable due to their own wretchedness. This would be the state of all humans if it weren’t for Christ bridging the gap and forgiving your sins, thus allowing you to experience the Beatific Vision.
>>220103058religion is bullshit but the supernatural isnt, if you really follow the trail of casuality you know that logic only works so far, whatver "created" or "curates" the unniverse is dervied from a supralogical substructure
>>220103641*tips christlarper fedora*
>>220103692Believing in Christ takes a literal leap of faith, but only the wilfully ignorant can deny God. You need an uncaused cause to explain reality. Physical material existence cannot bootstrap itself from a void. You need an eternal, uncaused being whose nature is to be, and thus it has no lack or privation, this makes it ontologically good. This was reached by several cultures centuries before Christ. The Greeks had the Monad, the Chinese had the Tao, which while slightly different meets the core points. The Hindus had the Brahman, the ultimate reality. >>220103700If you don’t want to talk properly that’s on you. Seems you’ve already made your mind up.
>>220103641Christ was a schizo scammer who knowingly lied to people about who he was Real convenient we know nothing about his years as a teen and young man
>>220102042Free will ruined my life
>>220103787*tips chrisplarper even harder*christ is king, my brother in christ, christ is king!
>>220103787the thing is literally no logic is real, no morality is real either, its all relative, morality is derived from power structures, there are no "rules" to anything, just evolutions
>Don't worry guys, you totally have free will.>Sure, I, as the creator of the universe (and, by extension, you) preordained all your acts from the moment material existence first came into being, but your choices are still up to you>Stop thinking about it, your sins are you fault and you deserve to go to Hell>I am a kind and merciful God even though I knew when I created you that you would spend eternity tormented by demons in Hell and this could be remedied by simply not creating you>STOP ASKING QUESTIONSChristcucks are some of the most retarded people on planet earth
>>220102703nigger you and I are more akin to prometheus and bob
>>220102454>how can anyone in their right mind submit themselves to such a megalomaniac control freak?Because if this is what he does to us in the first life, we dread to imagine the horrors awaiting those who make his naughty list in the afterlife.
>>220103972God knows if you're going to do something bad, but he's not the one deciding that you do it. You are. If a dealer at a casino knows that you're about to lose a shitload of money on a bad gamble, obviously that doesn't mean he's the one to blame.
>>220105144He did decide that you do it, because he knew with his omniscience that you were going to make the choices you did and he chose to create you anyway. He's at least an accomplice in your sins.
>>220105240b-b-but le heckin' free will
>>220102042Supergod would punish him
>>220105240christians dont understand hypocrisy at all, god supposedly judges you on standards he doesnt even hold himself to, doesnt help anyone, doesnt prevent anyting, because muh power level, lmao christianity is literally the same as nihilism, its just the happy meal version, also if you know whatever single living thing is going to do to the minute granualar detail for all of infinity, while you yourself facilitate all circumstances, is psychopath tier pathology
>>220102042Wasn't saying "Yes" to all those prayers technically messing around with free will?
>>220103692>religion is bullshit but the supernatural isntits actually the opposite.the supernatural is bullshit, however, it is useful for society that people believe in it for some degree even though its not real.the vast majority of people should NEVER have been made aware of evolution, that we are nothing more than animals. you need to keep the vast majority of people ignorant because we as humans aren't capable of coping with that level of truth and maintaining civilization.
William James in his "types of faith" essay iirc, stated that god established that man must come to god through faith. God also gave man the gift of free will. if god then would do something to display his awesone power like messing around with free will. then that would be god contradicting himself.god can do everything except contradict himself.
>>220107534>the supernatural is bullshitthats like saying math is bullshit, its the basis of reality, that existence is based off of something beyond reason, nonsensical, scientism is a larp that can only go so far
>>220103787There's no way to know if the this universe is or was eternal. For all we know it always existed. We don't even know for certain if this is the only universe.The problem with the God created everything because he just always existed is the same as the Universe created itself because it always existed. It's literally the same argument. In the end, we as humans that are born, exist then die are incapable of not asking "but who created God/Universe?" To us, something that exists HAS to have been created by something. Where did reality come from? God created it. Where did God come from? Uhhh..
>>220105144But the dealer told me he loves me...plus he made me sit here and play the game in the first place. He even gave me the money to do it too.
>>220102490Jesus IS GOD
“Live a good life. If there are gods and they are just, then they will not care how devout you have been, but will welcome you based on the virtues you have lived by. If there are gods, but unjust, then you should not want to worship them. If there are no gods, then you will be gone, but will have lived a noble life that will live on in the memories of your loved ones.” - Marcus Aurelius
>>220106857No because he didn't filter the wishes at all. Like the people wishing to win the lotto all got approved so the real winnings per person was only a couple bucks. He gave everyone what they wanted regardless of what the consequences would be, which is what free will entails.
>>220102741Because the ending is worth it.
>Finally Hollywood acknowledges God exists>And God is a man>It's a Black man
>makes you 7 feet tall with a 4 inch dickEnjoy the free will, sucka!
>>220110128Ah yeah it’s gonna be so worth having child rapists. Nigga there is only the Devil, there is no God.
>>220110283Sounds like what the devil might say.
>>220107944The Bible is full of examples of God demonstrating his power. Youre both retarded.
>>220102042because shit happens and you have to blame someone but god, who knows everything that is, has been, and will be, decided that he doesn't know everything that will be after all.
>>220103641>Because love requires free willthat's a cope, parents put restrictions on infants so they don't kill themselves in spite of their free will to do so
>>220109865this quote lacks context that marcus aurelius was a devout pagan emperor
>>220103787>but only the wilfully ignorant can deny GodShow me the proof of his existence>But muh sacred book and...No proof ?
>>220105144>I love you>But I won't prevent you from doing mistake that could make your life miserableYeah so he don't love us
>>220102042He chooses not to, retard. You need to choose to redeem yourself.
>>220102042the concept of a god that makes people only to arbitrarily test whether they are good enough or not for eternal paradise or damnation by weighing a few decades worth of their time alive is incredibly fucked up.i'd never worship such a jealous asshole deity.
>>220111272>You need to choose to redeemDO NOT REDEEM
>>220111224If he prevented it then you wouldn't have free will.In the multiverse. You didn't fuck up but that's not the here and now is it
>>220110619>and you have to blame someone but godI choose to blame it on godhttps://www.youtube.com/watch?v=7YLNqYOVe7I
>>220102042you ever do something you know was wrong or a mistake and never correct it because then you would admit you fucked up so you just keep doubling down and doubling down. kinda like that
>>220109900unironically the smartest thing i've ever read on /tv/
If you have free will, how would you know? If you don't, would you care?
>>220102042Free-will is not what people think it is. It does not let you violate causality. Instead, Reality as a whole self-configures which means the universe has ultimate self-determinacy. Individual agents are "local telors" or agent-level participants.
>>220110791I think the plural makes it implicit.
>>220111348You absolutely would if you 100% knew he and the test was real, you might resent him inside your mind, but you would worship for the fear of judgement.
>>220103641>Because love requires free will.God can just make love no longer require free will. He can nullify all the consequences you described. He makes all the rules of how everything works, doesn't he?
>>220114827nah, satan sounds like a way cooler guy
If I made a robot and programmed it where I knew everything it was going to do, then the robot doesn't have free will. I believe in God but never understood the free will explanation.
>>220102645because he made me 6'3"
>>220102042Why is God depicted as one person, the Father as played by Morgan Freeman and not as a Trinity? The characters never show any reaction to the fact that their religion's theology has just been proven wrong.
>>220110687I'm a Christian btw*
>>220112828 Yeah except you're projecting human ego onto an omniscient being.Doubling down implies you didn’t know the outcome beforehand and you're too prideful to admit you screwed up. The whole premise of classical theism is that there was no “oops” moment to begin with. You can’t stubbornly persist in a mistake if all outcomes were already accounted for in the initial conditions.If anything, the “doubling down” is humans insisting their 80-year perspective trumps a supposed eternal one.Or it’s all random cosmic noise and we’re meat computers arguing on /tv/. Pick your poison.
>>220102454>and if you don't bow to his infinite cruelty then you are destined for eternal pain and torture with no recourse of hope of escaping.>how can anyone in their right mind submit themselves to such a megalomaniac control freak?you answered your own question. if I believed in god I would worship him but out of fear, not out of love
>>220102042God is omnipotent free will is freeGod has given free will to mankind
>>220102454I'm sorry that you were abused
>>220102490You didn't "make" anything anon. Your wife did the work. The only thing have done is ensure he is a Chud.
>>220120154say... say it isnt true
>>220102490you bore your son into the crushing world of western lawmakers is the reality
>>220102454>you have to be raped when you were 8 so that you can have the wisdom to turn to Christ later onChristians genuinely believe this
>>220103058this is what the Muslims do, every single work of Art must be in favour of Allah so that Muslims can say after the fact that all the greatest achievements of mankind are Muslim.
>>220103787>Christ says he's going to come back>every person since then who has claimed to be Christ has been called a schizophrenicall this says to me is that Christians don't actually have faith in the resurrection
>>220102042the matter has a great resistance to become perfectits basic philosophy
>>220102454The problem of evil is still the easiest brainlet filter around. Congrats fag you failed
Free will doesn’t exist. If you went to a psychic and they did the thing where they just bullshit and tell you what you want to hear, that’s actually the best case scenario. Because if you encounter an actual psychic who can actually foresee things to come, then you’re faced with the reality of the inevitable. If what’s predicted is really terrible, you might do everything possible to avoid it only to make it happen. Let’s say they foresee events that will happen a decade into the future, you completely forget about being told what would happen, then you do it, and only later remember being told you would do it. There’s nothing you can do to prove you have free will yet there’s tons of evidence that says you don’t. You might think “I can do whatever I want in this moment. I can eat vanilla ice cream with ketchup and no one told me to do that!” If you did, it would be a shallow bid for control in response to the assertion you have none. Zoom out: all of your thoughts and feelings are the result of chemical reactions of neurons in your brain which are the result of years of social conditioning you aren’t even aware of. Do you really think you have free will? Or do you just need that to be the case?
>>220124179>Do you really think you have free will?yes, fate existing doesn't take away my choices
>>220124454It literally does. When a villain in a movie confronts the hero and says “This was destined to happen.” That’s clunky writing. It’s redundant. Because if destiny is real, then everything that happens was destined to happen. Every emotion you feel, every thought you think, every choice you make was predestined.
>>220124530then I'm predestined to believe I have free will, and you'll just have to cope and seethe about it because it's metaphysically impossible to convince me otherwise
>>220124530not really since destiny wouldn't have to reveal itself to you to be true, some weird alien called Xruglak could be controlling every aspect of human fate and know one would need to be aware of his actions for them to have happened. You would just be completely oblivious.
>>220110128Nothing ever ends.
>>220102069He still knows everything you’re going to do, and every choice that you’re ever going to make before you make them. He is the alpha and the omega, after all. Can that still be called free will?
>>220102069Just this.Can't have independent thought when his Will is all. Can't have people to teach if they are just his Will. Can't make decent people to be around if they are just his reflection.The purpose of humanity is be with Him, not to be Him.
>>220103641You’ve never been in love. If you had you’d know there is absolutely zero “freedom” involved. Your mind and body are hijacked and you dot even have the capacity to hope it all turns out well.
>>220102042Because it’s a convenient go-to response for when anyone asks why a supposedly benevolent, all-knowing, omnipresent, and eternally powerful God would allow someone like Albert Fish to kidnap, rape, torture, butcher, and devour countless children and then send taunting letters to the families of the victims instead of just stopping his heart before he even got started.
>>220117082I think it's kind of like the multiverse theory.God knows everything because he knows all possibilities but it's up to you to make the choice.Is this the universe where you chose virtue or deceit?
>>220110791That doesn't make his 'God'(s) any less validor the quote any less true
>>220117082The Jesus thing never made sense to me either. Why does he need a sacrifice in able to forgive the sins of mankind? He makes the rules, why all the pageantry? Is it a Marvel Beyonder kind of situation, where he’s giving himself handicaps in order to stave off boredom?
>>220102042What I do not like about this idea of God, at least in the film, is that God apparently has no quirks apart from dressing in white and pretending to be an old African man.You would expect an all-powerful being to have some weird interests.I think the best argument we have for God is that he genuinely gets a kick out of giving cancer to children.
>>220124562Believe what you want, that doesn’t make it true. The alchemists believed an element called phlogiston made fire burn despite no evidence of its existence
