>delays attack just slightly more than you expect Why does every boss do this?
>>681363816just in case
>>681363816to punish panik rolling normie
>>681363816Making Dark Souls players uncomfortableSame with changing mimics to transport traps
Because Souls combat is too basic and not complex enough to create actually fresh and difficult encounters so FromSoft has to resort to cheap shit like that. They hit a limit on how much they can push the encounters while we are still playing the janky Demon Souls Guy.Why do you think skibidi fragments exist? They fucked by still keeping the old ass jRPG leveling system so they tried to force a progress reset on players so that everyone will die to everything in 1-2 hits, but ER is so fucking unbalanced and broken that people still found ways to exploit it in few days.
>>681363816Two for flinching bitch
>>681363816It's a cheap and easy way to make the game harder. Just like how most of the enemies pause to float on a cloud for an extra 15 frames whenever they leave the ground.
>>681363946it doesn't punish panic rolling tho. it only punishes not knowing how fuck long they're going to delay the attack. it's a cheap tactic. once you know though it has no effect.
>>681363973>caring about balance in a singleplayer game
>>681363816to allow you time to scoot around them
*hold block**pokey pokey*:-)
>>681363816so you can hit them first, instead of you always being a passive bitch and hitting second.
>>681365519Said by a faggot who will shit and piss himself and throw a baby tantrum over "not beating the game" the moment someone uses summons.
>>681364189>it doesn't punish panic rollingIt literally does, there's no way around that
>>681363816They don't want you to roll based on prediction or reflex anymore, they want you to memorize the boss's attack tempo. It's really stupid.
>>681363816Fromsoft has run out of ways to make Souls mechanics challenging.They really need to change it up for the next game.
Why don't you guys just try to learn the fights?Every other game is like this but for some reason elden ring is bad for not indulging in the same formula ad infinitum.....
>>681366217Don't care about the opinion of people who played on easy mode, sorry bud.
>>681363946Is panic rolling rolling on reflex instead of memorising the boss? Sounds like it punishes people who don't want to waste time watching the boss do his dance moves for 10, 20, 30+ minutes.I always just watch the boss for the first attempt knowing it will not be successful, I play around with dodging and I count the seconds they're idle for (usually one or two max). I look at the list of animations and if I wanted I could flow flowchart them like an autistic person. I would prefer to just reflexively play the game. Less time wasting.
>>681366335If you have problem with attack delays, then you probably should play on easy mode yourself.
>>681363946>watch the enemy closely while holding my guard up>hover my button over the roll button but still keeping my cool>their arm flinches>don't roll yet because it could be a trap>their arm moves again but this time its coming down>roll>get caught because the enemy did a twirl and THEN swung their blade 0.5 seconds laterThis isn't "panic rolling" I just got fucked because the enemy is a troll.
>>681363816so you shield block 80% of the attacks and roll the obvious ones.
>>681368163This. It punishes you for trying to play reactionary. They want you to basically memorize every move the boss has instead for some reason.
>>681363946that's mei'm the panik rolling normie
>>681366498That's the thing about Elden Ring, the fucking input delay is so bad you literally CANNOT use skillful reactions and reflexes to avoid damage, you HAVE to memorize obtuse attack timings and plan accordingly, and hope you guessed right.Or just use a greatshield lol
>>681363946It can punish my shield and die.
>>681363816Back in Dark Souls 1 the game didn't punish panic rolling. 2 and 3 started delaying the attacks just enough to hit as soon as you're getting out of a second roll. Elden Ring takes it too far to the point enemies will float in the air waiting for you to roll just to punish.
>>681363973>Because>*spurts out headcanon while sniffing his own ass and eating his how shit*typical anit-from troon. I don't even bother reading their stupid horseshit.
Shazamtrannies:>THESE BOSSES DON'T GIVE ME TIME TO ATTACKalso shazamtrannies:>UMMMM WHY IS THIS BOSS GIVING ME AN EXTRA HALF SECOND TO ATTACK BEFORE ROLLING!?!??!also shazamtrannies:>pic related
>>681371547Dark souls 1 is a fucking shit game. I tried to play it on PC with k/m. They ported this game to PC with no understanding of how 3rd person games work with k/m. They added the laziest mouse and keyboard supports and the camera are all fucked up.
>>681372351They ported it to PC because piss babies created petitions crying how unfair it was that it wasn't on their home computer. It was their first foray into porting a PC game you fucking retarded nigger.
If every attack came put exactly when you expected it what would be the point of the game
>>681371765>Shazamtrannies:>>THESE BOSSES DON'T GIVE ME TIME TO ATTACK>also shazamtrannies:>>UMMMM WHY IS THIS BOSS GIVING ME AN EXTRA HALF SECOND TO ATTACK BEFORE ROLLING!?!??!>also shazamtrannies:Both of those two approaches to bosses are bad, you retarded From spermslurper.
>>681363816>>681363946You would think so, but realistically it just punishes players for touching grass and expecting a normal movement, the tracking already made it bad enough (talking over 90deg sudden angle change).They already use combos, they should have just made it so it does 1-2 attacks you can panic roll, then one delayed slightly to catch you.Moreso it doesn't even really matter, what matters more is a fun boss rather than appealing to autists who have way too much free time to get really good. I say this as someone was basically that because I bashed out the series after having some free time after graduated. If I didn't do that I wouldn't have bothered with Elden Ring (or other entries but DS1 is much easier so maybe if my mate convinced me).>>681363973>Trying to balance DLC in an open world RPG is bad because.. uh.. the japanese?
>>681372589Whether it was their first or fifth port doesn't change the fact that the game is released 13 years ago and it's got one of the worst fucking keyboard mouse support ever seen and I'm not even talking about prepare to die which is an absolute trash fire, even remastered PC port is a steaming pile of shit. Even DS3 is shit when it comes to m/k gameplay because they've got no clue how 3rd person games work with k/m. It seems to be a repeating pattern. K/M doesn't need a "lock on" function for starters. They're clueless about it.
>>681366217I know this is a meme but unironically the amount of players who harass people saying X boss is easy, then you see their setup and its a meme build, it's god damn absurd. It's almost as bad as DS3 and STR builds>>681368163>>681368420Yup, I remember DS1 you could get bosses on your first try if you were good and prepared, DS3 kind of expected a second time because some BS happened you would only know by experiencing it before. ER basically expects you to see every move at least once simply because you need to witness the BS
>>681365701>>681364189>>681363816>>681368163You could just use a shield instead.
>>681366217You used to be able to beat bosses on the first try if you were good enough. In elden ring that is wuite literally impossible since you need to know the timings and can‘t fight on instinct and muscle memory. I beat kos maria and lawrence first try because I had played so much of the base game and had gotten good enough at the game
>>681373901You can absolutely beat them first try. Just because you couldn't do it doesn't make it impossible.
>>681373856>stop playing the way you were enjoying and witch to a shieldI think invalidating a whole style of gameplay is pretty bad design.
>>681363946why does everyone misuse this term? panic rolling is when you spam the roll button not just messing up a timing.the stagger after being hit is what punishes panic rolling since it means you have to time each roll perfectly.though it comes with the downside of being hit by a series of attacks for only messing up one of the timings.
>>681374017It's not invalidating rolls. It's having another option. Jumping is also very strong at avoiding attacks.
>>681363957>having one chest using the dark souls skin with the mimic chest chain near ruins of UnteI lmao'ed. Too bad it wasn't actually a mimic.
>>681363816This is a natural consequence of rolling being so spammable and having so many i-frames.
>>681363957Getting teleported to caelid early was kino.
REMINDER THAT HEAL FROM AFAR IS A BETTER TOOL TO HEAL YOURSELF AND ALLIES THAN ANYTHING ELSE IN THE GAME AND PVP FAGS ARE ALREADY CRYING TO GET IT REMOVED SO ISE IT BEFORE FROMSLOP SEVERELY NERF ITYOU CAN ALSO HEAL STATIC SUMMONS EASILY AND ETERNALLY LIKE THE GOLEM WITH ITUSE IT
>>681374005nta but you can't unless you're severely overleveled or using a cheese build/summon, that's literally how they're designed, so that streamers can put their stupid face on a thumbnail about how hard they're getting their ass kicked by this new dark souls hardcore gameobviously we're talking about the overtuned remembrance bosses, not counting actually fair bosses like midra
>>681374138>trying to play shield against messmer>Horrible experience >remove all armor>roll through everything and kill it first tryIt's the same game as before
>>681363946It doesn’t punish anything but the players agency to not be disappointed by this pile of crap. Nobody likes these shitty delays because they feel janky and they don’t flow well into attack strings.
>the boss isn't allowed to feint because......................
>>681363816Because the only guaranteed defensive options every player will have access to are rolling, positioning, jumping and sprinting. One of the most obvious ways to counter a dodge is to punish the recovery frames, and enemies can only do that by baiting you into dodging at the wrong time, having a lot of active frames to outlast your dodge or having multiple enemy attacks/projectiles on field to make positioning more important. And people cry and whine when they have to actually think about their combat options any more than "what the guide told me" so the last two are rejected, which is why barely anyone jumps properly and those that do think it's some sort of utterly genius inclusion only Fromsoft could pull off and not something that has been part of games for decades.
>>681373901I beat Putrescent Knight first try
>>681363816i think its generally a good thing and forces you to suppress your panic reflexes but they overdid it
>>681374387Because the player can't, if you could animation cancel then it'd be different story.
>>681374005You have reading comprehension issues.
>>681374473Let's give the bosses 12 estus flasks then and infinite respawns
>>681371765kill yourself unironically
>>681374581also bosses should be able to summon other bosses to help against players
>>681373901>You used to be able to beat bosses on the first try if you were good enough.If you can't do it, then by admission you're simply not good enough.A boss being able to be beaten on the first try is not a mark of quality, it only means it is limited in scope and not challenging the player's skills enough.No one should be wanting to fight a boss only once if it is enjoyable.The nature of the game's balance or lack thereof means there are too many ways anyone could fight a boss to make it doable first try, even without actually learning it.And the many other reasons why this is and always has been a vague and ignorant argument.
>>681374654This but unironically. You summon, they summon. It's the only way for summonfags to actually beat the game for once
>>681374581bosses already have massive health pools which is just lots of estus flasks without the hassle of a vulnerable animation and infinite respawns would mean not having to start the game again to replay a boss which would be a good thing.
>>681374581Literally nobody minded sekiro bosses having 2 or more lifebars because the fights were fun, they just fucked ER bosses up bad
>>681373901You can bully your way through most of the bosses with bleed. Also I have no idea why people stopped using Endure, it's saved my ass a ton of times.
>>681374881Because endure doesn't do MAX DEEPS DUDE
>>681374729>A boss being able to be beaten on the first try is not a mark of quality, it only means it is limited in scope and not challenging the player's skills enough.nta but if it can't be reasonably beaten the first try, then it is, literally, by definition, not a skill-based challenge.
>>681374654Well they're already doing that. What do you think the godskin fight in Farum Azula was?
>>681373254You act in response to the game. It would be an action game.
I never understood why /v/ is so mad about delayed attacks. It's not artificial difficulty in the sense that it's just more damage. It's not unfair in that it's too fast to react to. It's a reasonable progression of difficulty, a delayed feint of an attack and then then a following attack.Why is this bad boss design?
>>681363973>Why do you think skibidi fragments exist>underrage nigger thinks souls combat have no depth while his favorite game is the most pathetic shit game to ever grace this worldgod your dad hates you, you fucking retarded underachiever pathetic anime nigger.
>>681379662Because it's effectively luck if you get through it without memorising whether the boss delays the timing. If you roll without knowing if he delays the swipe you are gambling. It's RNG.
>>681379662The only way to win without having a cheese build or relying summons is to repeatedly die to the boss so you can remember its attack patterns.Boss fights in older games were tough but not memorization tests, it was about being just difficult enough for the player to have enough time to adapt on the fly and overcome the odds.This is just repetitive and annoying and it also hilariously devalues all the bosses that have a dramatic phase 2 cutscene, some epic fallen guy screaming "GRAAAAH I'VE NEVER BEEN THIS MAD BEFORE!" and ripping a limb off 7 times in a row is just comical.Funny, they go out of their way to give in-universe reasons for why the player can die and revive an infinite amount of times but they never explain how Messmer puts his eye back in his skull or how Godrick re-attached his arm when you re-enter the fog door to fight them again.
>>681373901>if you were good enoughYou said it yourself, you're not good enough. Elden Ring is way harder than any of their previous games IF you play a ""normal"" build. It's also one of the easiest if you abuse every single tool at your disposal. You can make this game as hard or as easy as you want.If with your current setup it's too hard, to the point you find it frustrating and you're not having fun... make it easier for yourself. You're basically doing a challenge run AND complaining about the difficulty at the same time, it doesn't make any sense.>>681374942Tetris is not a skill-based challenge because no one can beat it first try, gotcha.
>>681380206>they never explain how Messmer puts his eye back in his skull or how Godrick re-attached his arm when you re-enter the fog door to fight them again.Well they talk about grafting in the latter case but it's more a thing that happens without being explained. They just mention that it's a thing.Otherwise I agree
>>681380004How is it not the same mechanism as predicting and reacting to an attack? You react to the actual swing, not the boss reeling their arm backwards. If you have amazing reflexes then you absolutely can beat the boss on the first try.
>>681363816It's simple. From has taken the "prepare to die" meme seriously and is constantly in an arms race trying to outdo/out gotcha players who have been playing their games for a decade+. Since the Souls combat hasn't changed heavily at its core since DeS and isn't that intricate at all, especially on the defensive side by the player, the only way to really do this is to make the boss attack patterns more cryptic and memo+reaction heavy. To meet their "prepare to die" quota they have to add as many feints/roll catches/delays as possible so people on Twitter can post "this boss took me 86 tries to beat" which works as advertisement.
>>681374849What the fuck are you talking about, Sekiro mindbroke people to a level Elden Ring can't even hope to achieve, because the "cheats" are built-in in the game itself. If you're stuck in Elden Ring all you need to do is Google a decent build, summon a copy of yourself, and that's it: even my mom could beat the game this way.If you're stuck in Sekiro, you either git gud or uninstall.>>681380206>Boss fights in older games were toughNot even close to how hard Elden Ring is, if all you wanna use is R1 + Dodge like in the previous games.>but not memorization testsThey were, but patterns were way easier to memorize (they had way fewer moves) and react to (boss swings, you roll through swing, done).
>>681363816>Boss jumps 15 ft in the air>Expect him to come down in accordance with gravity>lol I'm gonna levitate for an entire second to catch you outBest game every, everyone.
>>681380853>You react to the actual swing, not the boss reeling their arm backwards.The "actual swing" comes and they do a little ballerina twirl and hit you 0.3 seconds later, catching you in your roll. lol
>>681374312It's like they've designed them to be as punishing as possible to your normal feel of rhythm and pattern recognition.
One of the biggest issues is the camera is abject trash for large bosses, but From's had this issue in their games before ER anyway.The extra particle and flashy attack/effect spam in ER just exacerbates this.
>>681382109>these bosses all get 30+ moves that can be seamlessly chained together and bait out attacks and be animation cancelled >oh, but you? YOU? you gotta commit to your swings, buddy. this ain’t devil may cry bucko, you swing a sword you put your whole life behind it. Once you’re locked into an attack there’s no getting out, this is the way the game is played better get used to it :^)Unironically what did they mean by this?
>>681380853If you have luck. If you time your rolls given the normal input delay and buffer you will be caught roughly half the time. That's chance.
>>681382773Honestly the only way to win on your first go is if you can somehow rewire your reflexes to respond half a second later than it wants to.But also sometimes half a second earlier, or a full second later, or right on the dot.
>>681382891You also just won't know if he can delay it until they do it. It's luck.
>>681374107yea that was a huge missed oppertunity
>>681379521you want a baby mode rhythm game?
>>681383127You mean like an action game, yeah.
>delay my attack as wellcheckmate, boss
>>681383207This would matter if your attack did 70% of their health. Maybe it did, who knows what cheese the posters here use.
>>681382340Would be kino if you could do a delayed roll or a fake attack into a roll but apparently From feels their formula is done. Then again if they implemented something like this their "hard" bosses would just have a required solution for every move resulting in even more mindless memorization.
>>681365701literally this. the game isn't meant to be beaten by being good, it's meant for you to die repeatedly to learn the boss moveset. it's fucking retarded
>>681383207Only works on human intelligence, not input responding AI.
>>681363946>give you the ability to parry attacks with shields>make most bosses move in unnatural ways that prevent you from getting executing a parry without memorizing attacksGood gameplay.
>>681373856You can’t because you will get stance broken or run out of stamina.
>>681380324I like this answer but the problem I have with the effects of it is that every boss ranges from cheap to utter BS. I completed the base game 100% with a normal build but honestly towards the end I got really sick of the BS that other games wouldn't have. By the end it basically was that if I got a whiff of ER's bullshit, I just used spirit ashes which trivialised the fight.Fighting is like a dance, the best ones are with rhythm and a fair amount of give and take, DS1 was like this, DS3 was also like this but more intense and towards having you on the backfoot, ER though is closer to a solo act where they can 2-3 shot you in a couple of seconds (2-3 is souls standard but typically the combos aren't long enough thats a problem), while you chip away at their health, then something happens where they suddenly go goblin mode and you die.In previous games it always felt like you achieved victory by beating the roadblock out of skill, with ER it just felt like I smashed my head against the wall enough time to get lucky with RNG, even when being a decent level (only time this wasn't the case was when I was wrangling up bosses and was overleveled). The former is fun, the latter is not.
>>681363816Power creep and arms race.If the boss would have an intuitive rythm to its attacks, most long time players would be able to dodge them easily.Fromsoft wants to avoid this outcome and that's the only reason these delayed attacks exist. The games always have been about trial and error and to enforce many errors and more trials they just have to jumple up the rythm everytime.The next game will have a new solution to trip people up who are used to Elden Ring and the game after that again will have to reply to that and so forth.It's a very meta thing which always takes me out of the game because the delays are so deliberately tuned to the time it takes you to roll it's just too convenient for the boss.
>>681363816>boss jumps >hovers in the air for half a second like he's on a string >mob runs at you for a grab attack>keeps running into you even after your models collide >every single mob delays every single attack so they all feel the same>immersion? nah prepare to die XdddVile goyslop.
>>681383681Even worse:>Give you deflect tear that boosts guard counters too>many bosses are too big and jumpy to be affected by the guard counter attackPutrecent knight is probably the worst offender, he's always somewhere else when I guard counter after perfectly deflecting his combo.
>>681380853>>681382773The latter comment is correct, the input reading in this game is very aggressive. I remember seeing earlier today someone even said they use incantations instead of flasks for healing, simply because the input reading means they will charge across the arena to hit you the moment you drink, whereas they think the incantations is a generic spell.
>>681363816because apparently theres no way to make a game difficult and fun at the same time
>>681365665You just made up a reply for the dude so you can feel like you won.
>>681363816It's so you they put you in a 50/50 scenario, where the only safe guaranteed way to get not hit is to roll away. Or if you think you can risk it can proc a bleed, stagger, parry then do that instead.
>>681384178Every ""discussion"" on 4chan ever.
>>681383913the next game the bosses will have AI to tell which moves you keep getting hit by, and just spam that until you "learn" it.
>>681383913Exactly the issue, like the game doesn't even need to do it, it's to please retards who care too much (aka marketing team's BS), really most people want a fun boss that feels like a fair fight, and some good lore/worldbuilding to spice it up. Instead it's a jumbled mess of a fight which goes on for too long (to gaslight you that a case of attrition is challenging gameplay, talking about the healths and damage outputs, for both sides), and genuinely feels like you just got lucky rather than proved your skill
>>681368163Holy fucking shit, THIS.It's even worse with some of the enemy designs that are just an incoherent mess of limbs in a wierd configuration covered by cloth physics like the grafted Scion or the Rot Lady boss. >>681366217>Why don't you guys just try to learn the fights?Bait webm aside, because my tolerance for frustration just isn't there anymore. I started playing these games when I was 17, I'm 30 now. My reaction times worsened, I have less free time and at the same time the bosses got faster and more complex. Something like Artorias isn't even close to Morgott in terms of moveset variety and speed. I'm just gonna summon my ashes and hide behind my greatshield to Spam AoWs/jumping heavies to posture break the bosses as often as possible.
>>681366498>panic rolling rolling on reflex instead of memorisingIf you dodged on reflex then you would be dodging when the attack is actually thrown and not on the telegraph. You aren't dodging on reflex when margit's cane is still high in the air not moving. You are dodging on your assumption of when the attack will be thrown.
>>681383681>not paying attention to what the boss does>expects to win by playing on autopilotErm literally get gud?
>>681380206>Funny, they go out of their way to give in-universe reasons for why the player can die and revive an infinite amount of times but they never explain how Messmer puts his eye back in his skull or how Godrick re-attached his arm when you re-enter the fog door to fight them again.We're reaching levels of nitpicking that shouldn't even be possible
>>681384603>If you dodged on reflex then you would be dodging when the attack is actually thrownThat's not quite honest because many bosses make movements that look like the attack is coming now. There's many movements/flinches that can only ever be identified as fakeouts after the fact. They're effectively feints but not as an actual mechanic in the combat system but more that the devs are feinting at the player.
An impact is created from force and force is created from momentum.Enemies and bosses in previous games hit for massive chunks of health but they always had to generate force first by creating momentum, usually in the form of a readable attack wind-up.Zombies and ghouls would have big wind-ups and be easily telegraphed because they're dull creatures without much intelligence, but then things get more tricky when you come across a much more sophisticated foe like a knight who's been trained on how to create force quick and effectively.They are more hard to read than the zombies but are still readable nonetheless because their bodies have to be bound down to physics.Now you get to Elden Ring and what do we get? Multiple bosses who just are just weightless gravity defying gear 5 luffy cartoon characters who create impact from an inequal amount of force and momentum. Because your intuition is based in reality and physics, these bosses that do no conform to physics at all become hilariously hard to read and you just gotta win by boosting your stats and numbers because skill is hardly the focus anymore at this point.
>>681384025>try the deflect tear on radahn>some of his combos will randomly have a follow up, making guard counter a gambleI hate this shit
>>681369236>Input delaycheck your controller settings because I have none
>>681363816>>delays attack just slightly more than you expect>Why does every boss do this?because the gameplay is so shallow that this is the only way to increase difficulty at this point.
>>681384996What controller, settings, platform, etc. I'm not talking about release to roll or queued rolls either lol. I genuinely would like to see how this is fixed. Can't be fixed on Sony, I hope it can be fixed on PC.
>>681384897We were talking about delays and not feints, those are different things.
>>681384904I have a good example of this: Malenia has this one attack where she just rotates her wrist limply. Like she doesn't put any force behind the swing, she just wiggles her sword hand a little so that the blade moves and the damage at that point is so inflated it takes off like 400 points (most have 1000 at level 60 vig at this point in the game).It feels like the inverse of Borderlands bullet sponge enemies where you can headshot some goon with a high caliber sniper rifle but because he's level 27 and you're level 5 and visited a place you shouldn't be in, he just tanks 300 round to the face.
>>681384859It's not nitpicking. It's clear why this is kept in despite not making any contextual sense in this game series KNOWN for contextualizing everything, and its because the epic fights are crowd pleasers, it brings in the viewers in twitch streamers and youtube videos.They could do something to fix this but they won't because its what every idiot normalfag and lobotmized streamer gets hyped over.
>>681384996every single person who plays the game has input delay because of how they mapped the controls. putting sprint and rolling on the same button necessitated having roll be trigger on the RELEASE of the circle/B button instead of the press of the button (like every other input) which creates an unnatural lag. and for whatever reason the lag is worse in elden ring than it was in ds3.https://youtu.be/KL3t_3pWKY0?si=OIw5-aUVI3X4GZrS
>>681373901You didn't beat Kos because she wasn't an enemy.
I just started a new DLC character, there are many fun weapons I still want to try out. Then I reached Dancing Lion and quickly realized again, theres no point because the bosses wont allow me to use anything fun these weapons have to offer, all you ever have a chance for is pressing an r1 poke.So then I was like, fine Ill just try out the new weapons in pvp. But if you invade you go against 3 spergs spamming spells and WA's at you, and if you do 1v1 arena you only go against people abusing the most broken shit like swift slash backhand blades or insta bleed thorns. Im so done with this fucking game. Theres so much potential but theres just no possibility to enjoy it in any capacity
>>681385112A delay mid combo is effectively a feint.
>>681363946>enemy about to attack>roll>no! must delay attack just because retards believe reacting to movements is panik rolling!
>>681385348>So then I was like, fine Ill just try out the new weapons in pvp.Said noone ever.
>>681363946Baaaaaaaaased
>>681364189How about you patiently wait until their weapon is acrually coming gowards you?Too jittery? Reaction speed too slow?
>>681385391It's not, a feint a brusque movement that makes you feel like the ennemy is attacking which forces you to roll and get caught at the end by the real attack.A delayed attack is an attack with a long setup. In one case, you can get hit despite dodging on reflex, in the other you shouldn't get hit by dodging on reflex.
>>681385420smashing B is indeed panic rolling
>>681385241>every single personNot me, just remap sprint to another button on steam :^)
>>681385681you didn't beat the game
>>681382340this series has always been about fighting greater odds
>>681366217Chink spotted
>>681385668na its notyou also hold your arm up in the air when about to throw a punch like some shitty anime?
>>681385643I don't think you know what people mean when they refer to delayed attacks in souls games.Winding up a strike and then striking isn't a delayed attack in that sense. It's attacks that look like they should come out sooner or that are within a combo that features a certain rythm and is the only outlier to punish you for adapting to the combo's rythm.Bad (or rather purposefully deceitful) visual language is at the core of all of those because they want to trip you up into rolling too soon.
>>681383127what a retardimagine you played mario, and bowser fired a fire ball at you, and you jump up to avoid the fireball, but the fireball just stops below your character and waits mario to land and die on it, you would call this good design
>>681385830mindlessly hitting the roll without thought because the boss moved isn't panicking?
>>681386221Relax, anon. He just want to beat the argument, soon he will start summoning the The Elden Ring Community™ to reply to you.
>>681385752Not really, not a single From game before this was this much cancer.In most Souls games the bosses would have 3-4 attack strings and then it was your turn, there was rarely any "leave AOE after attack string so you still cant attack" bullshit either. In Bloodborne bosses were also fast, aggressive and had longer attack strings. But the players dodge was also alot faster, and it rewarded aggression from the player by allowing you to heal your damage back if you hit the boss. Not to mention that you had a ranged parry you could use on almost every boss.In Sekiro it was close to a 50/50, you attack the boss 3 times, he attacks 3 times, and so forth, you only had the unparryable attacks from the bosses you had to respect. Even Elden Ring was never like this, go replay the main game and youll see. Only the endgame had some bullshit to this capacity, with Malenia specifically, but also on Maliketh and Hoarax. But still, nothing to this degree. Nonono this DLC went to a whole new level of cancer and beyond. Think about it for a second, is there a single boss in the entire DLC that DOESNT leave an AOE on the ground after an attack string? The cheapest possible way you can think of to deny the player the opening he worked so hard for, and its on literally every single boss. Nah man it simply isnt fun, its like if you were to play a turnbased game and for every turn you do, you gotta watch the opponent do 10 turns before its your turn again. Who the fuck actually enjoys NOT playing the game? Youre just playing a roll simulator
because the gameplay hasn't evolved at all since DS 1 and its the only way to make it more difficulty.
>>681385241OH MY GOD I THOUGHT I WAS GOING INSANE. THE AMOUNT OF TIMES I WAS TRYING TO RUN AND LET GO OF THE CIRCLE BUTTON AND THEN UNINTENTIONALLY ROLLED.... FUCKING STUPID DESIGN
>>681386243>because the boss movedThat's not what panic rolling is.It's when you get hit adn then mash the dodge button to just get out of the combo asap.But if you're in neutral and the boss makes a movement you interpet as an attack then it's just you trying to dodge an attack. BUt semantics aside, no matter if you roll or not, you will need to see it multiple times to get the timing right in the future because the movement before the attack is deliberatetly not informative of when the actual attack comes out.
ER has dishonest boss design and I gladly put up a shield to ignore it.
>>681386471>uh actually panicking is only when the boss hits yousmashing roll when the boss hasn't even attacked is a literal panicyou aren't reacting to an attack, you're pre-rolling out of fear
>>681386445>But the players dodge was also alot fasterthe irony of this is bloodborne has less iframes and punishes you for fucking up a dodge with extra damagethis kinda just shows me people who shit on the DLC do it because it beat their ass and not because of actual flaws with the game
>>681387042Oh I thought we were having a conversation and not you just trying to pull a wierd gotcha on me by twisting my words.Nvm, you can have the win for that one. You are correct, we are all bad panic rollers and elden ring bosses are cool.
>>681385681You can't dodge whilst holding the "sprint button"
>>681387245>twisting my wordswhat the fuck are you even talking about
>>681387307Well you "quoted" me but didn't quote what I said.You just want to "win" this argument and you did it so what else do you want?
>>681363816I'm using lightning perfume bottle and rolling sparks. Did I beat the game?
>>681387449>Did I beat the game?how are we supposed to know if you killed the final boss?
>>681387227Im so sick and tired of the retarded argument that if design is bad and unfun, you should just get better at the game, as if that will magically turn it fun. >Eating shit isnt fun>Just get better at eating shit, it will be fun eventually
>>681387449If it don't use literal cheats, then you won. This isn't a game worth getting hung up on playing "correctly." You're supposed to abuse bullshit like the enemies do.
>can't predict timings anymore but I'm too slow to react
>>681387227Dashing around fast BB bosses with BB movement is funRolling around fast ER bosses with DeS ear rolls is not funCheesing the boss with summons and a big shield is a little more fun but not as much as BB.
>>681387385you're the only one bringing up "winning"
>>681373901>In elden ring that is wuite literally impossibleIt's extremely possible for a lot of bosses actually, but yeah that's definitely the intent.I'll never understand all these retards who cry about "beating the game fairly" with one breath, and then studying how to best cheese every boss attack with the next.
>>681363816Everyone who calls it “roll slop” outs themselves as a shitter who struggled with this.
>>681387532i have fun and i don't spend hours smashing my head into the wall
>>681363957So it's a humiliation ritual for Dark Souls players?
>>681387042giant retard
>>681387042massive genius
>>681387042A dodge is supposed to be done at the tail end of a move's start up frames, not during its active frames.
>>681387684Anon I really don't know what to tell you.Everyone knows what panic rolling means. Everyone knows that ER abuses delayed attacks and too many bosses have too many of them.You try to argue semantics that rolling too early to a delayed attack is panic rolling but it isn't, it just exploits our reactions and it enforces trial and error by making us ignore these reactions and just roll to a learned timing instead of reacting to the visual language of the attack.You just wanted to call everyone who falls for delayed attacks panic rollers to call them bad or something, idk. And I agree. We're all bad panic rollers, you are correct! Now tell me what else you want by replying to me. Attention? (You)s?If this convo brings nothing to you then don't reply. I am WFH and still have one more hour to kill until I can sign off and can go play metal gear solid 3 on my ps2 emulator so I am free to entertain you, just have to write a few mails at best.
>>681387449Depends on if you used the mimic tear or not.Its not Elden Ring unless you bro it up with your twin buddy.
>>681387713If you dont use a shield, you are rolling 95% of a bossfight. You dont get to use most of your weapons movesets, and most weapon arts are useless too.If its not rollslop, then what is it
>Put up Greatshield Not my problem
>>681388050Summonslop
>>681387246So? You can't dodge while holding the sprint button when it's the same button for both either. What I mean is that I have 0 input delay on dodges by setting B to quick press in controller settings
>>681387967jesus anon, no need to seethe this hardi just disagree on delayed attacks being bad, you see it once and now you know
>>681373901>You used to be able to beat bosses on the first try if you were good enough.nothing in Elden Ring playing solo took me as long as Gael or Isshin
>>681363973The fromdrones ineffectually seething at this proves how accurate it is
>>681388237Isshin was really hard the first time, but I enjoyed every second of learning the fight. It was fucking kino. Only 1 or 2 bosses in the ER DLC were enjoyable to learn for me, probably Rellana and Midra. The rest just felt annoying and tedious
>>681373901i literally first timed dancing lion and bayleyou guys just keep outing yourselves as bad
>>681388476I also did, I cheesed them. They were not difficult because of that.
>>681363973You really upset the naive fromdrones lmao, good work.
>>681388287>people disagree>heh fromdrones, am I right?kys
>>681388476Im calling bullshit, unless you were using a really broken ass build, like Perfumer or Greatshields, or some status effect build with Mimic Tear.Dancing Lion I could see, but Bayle? Not a chance in the world you first tried it without summons/broken build
>>681388173Suddenly it's just a different opinion. Why not immediately like that?What's with the greentext and combatative nature?Now don't act as if I'm the wierd one when you started to misquote me for le epic ownage first. I just leaned into it and now I'm at fault for giving you the epic btfo you wanted?See I'm now even typing a few more lines and words to seem even more unhinged so you can now be the detached cool anon while I'm the cringe schizo.
>>681380206>Funny, they go out of their way to give in-universe reasons for why the player can die and revive an infinite amount of times but they never explain how Messmer puts his eye back in his skull or how Godrick re-attached his arm when you re-enter the fog door to fight them again.this shit extends to how you use items and they're gone permanently until you find/craft/buy more, essentially making them only useful if you succeed, and if you need them and fail too much, you're fucked
>>681363973Pretty much. They focus so much on cheaping the fight out with the boss doing three somersaults or twisting in uncanny angles and sliding on the ground like they're on rollerskates, you can hold a shield up and suddenly their fights break apart because they're thinking about muh rollcatching too hard. No, just tank and chug and suddenly every boss is a fucking dummy.It's no wonder fromfags hunt shield users like the inquisition, ER shields exposes the barebones bossfights too much.
>>681388237Isshin isn't difficult
>>681388640>still no argumentsYou just keep proving them more and more correct
Real talk tho, is there a worst community in gaming than the Souls community. I truly dont think there is. All you guys ever aim to do is bring down other peoples achievements, to make your own achievements seem worth more. Its so cringy, go touch grace
>>681388641Greatshields being considered broken is just another of the game's flaws imo. Using a big plank somehow makes the difference between learning a boss' patters for an hour or two or beating him on your first or second try but it really shouldn't.
>>681388641i wore leather armor and used occult raptor talons
>>681363816Being able to do a boss no-hit should be a hard challenge, not the default way of beating a boss.
>>681388880The entire gun community on /k/99% don't own guns lmao
>>681363816Half the difficulty in these shitty fights comes from the godawful camera. And you can't stay locked off because it zooms the camera back in and now all you can see is their crotch.
>>681388714>misquotei quoted a point that i disagreed withyou're deranged
>>681388880>Real talk tho, is there a worst community in gaming than the Souls community.you say that and you have never played any competitive game lmao
>>681388874Plenty of arguments to that post, yet you didnt respond to them, curious.
>>681388791>>681388897Its true, but that is more so due to the incapability of Fromsoft to do any proper balancing, or even playtesting every weapon/WA/spell.With some builds the game is the hardest fucking game in the world, and with some builds its piss easy.I hope they abandon the Souls formula and make more games like Sekiro, where everybody was on an equal playing field and the only way to beat the game was to actually git gud
>>681388915Bleed eh
>The rollslopper when somebody uses shields to skip their anime bullshit
>>681363973>Because Souls combat is too basic and not complex enough to create actually fresh and difficult encountersIs that why people are whining about the DLC being overtuned? Oh wait, that's what retards like you always do with these games since DS1.>Why do you think skibidi fragments exist?To avoid disrupting progression between the DLC content and the rest of the game so you can jump between the two without invalidating the main game content too much, dipshit.It doesn't take a PhD to understand it.>but ER is so fucking unbalanced and broken ARPGs aren't about """"""balance"""""", retard, barely any game out there is balanced, it's impossible to balance a game with levels, customization and nonlinear progression, fucking Armored Core has never been balanced either despite lacking character levels because that's how all games with customization end up being.Remember to do your summer homeworks instead of wasting all your free time on 4chan.
>>681389045Reply with one right now then. Just copy and paste it, since they clearly exist
>>681388147>has to use outside software to make the game easieryou didn't beat the game
>>681388897Greatshields are the direct consequence of getting killed in two hit. Don’t blame the player, blame the game.
>>681389016Well thats the problem isnt it, Souls games are mostly a single player game, but the community acts as if they are constantly competing with each other.You dont hear the BG3 community cry about what builds people use to beat the game. Nor do they say "IF YOU DIDNT PLAY ON PERMADEATH YOU DIDNT BEAT THE GAME".
>>681388953>Use the same camera and lock on since DeS>ER comes out>Fill the game with gigantic spastic bosses>Put the lock on reticle on the shittiest places possibleIts all so tiresome.
The DLC is fine once you realize it's created specifically to punish aggression. Just play the opposite of how you'd play Bloodnorne and you'll be fine.
>>681389103he bled like twice in the fight
>>681389219No thanks, if the game forces me to play defensively 95% of the fight, its simply boring, and I will just use cheesy builds and Ashes to get past them
>>681387492I did. Now playing NG++ with it again.>>681387589>>681388030I'm abusing the ground bug. No summons.
>>681389259No doubt
>>681389141>high damage numbers proves that Souls combat is still fresh and complexI’m sure that made sense in your shriveled, fromdrone brain lol
>>681389202Its so retarded, I also think the anti-from troons spam the "you didnt beat it" meme to fan the flames.
>Many consider Sekiro and Bloodborne the best Fromsoft games>Coincedentally also the 2 games that went away from the Souls combat the mostMmmm makes you wonder
>>681389394What high damage numbers? You can beat the DLC at RL1, retard, you only need to actually learn how to play the game, something you'll never be able to do.Make sure you do your homework or you're gonna be held back one more year and mommy will cut your internet off.
>>681389562You can't say that. You can't just go and say something like that. you're obviously talking about ER.1. ER a hard game.2. You suck.3. Those games suck.4. Discord tranny.
>THE BOSSES ARE BULLSHIT>nooooo, you can't beat him like that
>>681389562>>Many consider Sekiro and Bloodborne the best Fromsoft gamesIs that why they sold like absolute shit?
>>681389145>changing keybinds is cheatingdo consolebabs really
>>681389767I agree Minecraft is better than ER
>>681389562I liked ER, but yeah I hope their next game has more focus like BB and Sekiro.
>>681389771>changing keybindsyou're changing the behavior of your button and giving yourself precious extra milliseconds that you wouldn't get from normally hitting the button quickly
>>681389771>What is ironySeek help.
>>681389562many also consider DS2 or DS3 to be the bestit's an irrelevant statement
>>681389941I actually changed my dedicated roll button to play a macro on button press. The macro goes: B downDelay 30msB releaseAnd then I just have to fight the input buffer.
>>681389767>Is that why they sold like absolute shit?>Dark Souls 1 = 10 million sales>Dark Souls 3 = 10 million sales>Sekiro = 10 million sales>Bloodborne = 7.5 million sales but PS exclusiveYou should do research before you make up bullshit.
>>681389153I don't judge anyone who uses a greatshield, I used one myself to kill prime radahn.>>681389350>I did.then you beat the game>>681389059I hope they stay faithful to the souls formula but abandon the hyperfocus on challenging bosses and spectacle instead. The new side dungeons are a great example of proper gauntlets that just test your stamina and attentiveness in a different way. I want regular enemy encounters to matter again (right now they only do when they give the ""regular"" enemy a boss tier moveset, DMG and HP) and for Fromsoft to give us many tools to creatively tackle them. I want more environmental hazards, traps and gimmick bosses. More focus on elemental strengths and weaknesses. E.g. Putting the new DLC buffed lightning grease on a boss weak to lightning should matter way more than it does.
>>681390046so you used third party software to bypass the game's shitty implementation of rollingyou didn't beat the game :^)
>>681389702Those are all very good points. I concede my good sir.
>>681390232No please fuck... I don't want to go back to fighting the roll button
Just let your Mimicbro tank?
>>681390116The diffulty difference between regular enemies and bosses in ER has a very simple explanation. You cannot use Ashes in exploration, and bosses are balanced around using Ashes. So regular enemies are balanced around the player being solo and bosses are balanced around using Ashes, if you do both solo you will see a huge difficulty difference
>>681389601No shit you can beat it, retard. It’s an iframe spam game. People complain because when they get hit, it does so much damage. That’s what overtuned means. Fromfags are genuinely retarded
I beat this guy last night, who the hell was he?
>>681389562sekiro is the best because they fixed parrying and rolling and then they unfixed it in elden ring
>>681390509Zanzibart.
>>681390509kino fight watching Ongbal beat him is something else though kek
>>681363973>janky Demon Souls Guy.I miss playing as slower knight against slower enemies so fucking much it‘s unreal
>>681390598Well where's my Myrmidon of Loss then?
>>681389141>Is that why people are whining about the DLC being overtuned? Oh wait, that's what retards like you always do with these games since DS1.Your brain is completely fried, along with the rest of those fucking imbeciles who replied to that post and didn't have the faintest idea what that anon was actually saying. You people are so unbelievably stupid and act so smug about it, it hurts to watch.
>>681390773That's miquella. He fucks asses.
>>681390791>image0 int means you're paralyzed, this should really go back to saying 2 int
>>681366217>Every other gameI don‘t remember any kh superboss having animation pauses, wait for your input to punish you. Ds3 did this quite a few times with lothric and dancer
>>681390791>didn't have the faintest idea what that anon was actually sayingWell for one Souls games never used a JRPG leveling system. Those use randomized stat increases where different party members have differently weighted chances.So I really don't know what he was talking about there with the skibidi fragments.
>>681372589It was literally the reason why pc gaming became so much popular lol
>>681389562>Many consider Sekiro and Bloodborne the best Fromsoft gamesMany consider Skyrim the best TES game, it doesn't mean shit.
>>681366498Panic rolling is an uninformed roll. It can be reactionary but generally it's a term for a player buying time and safety because they're unfamiliar with the boss moveset.
>>681373901I beat Messmer, the frenzy dude, Romina and the skeleton on a slime horse first try
>>681391483You summoned
>>681363816because otherwise you were complaining how it's just roll spamwell now you can't spam like a brainless retard but actually watch what's happening
>>681391293I see, so in order to roll properly you need to memorise the moves of the boss. Say perhaps they have 20 moves and a few loops. Maybe 5 variably delayed moves. The player should learn that before confidently rolling.
>>681391571Delayed attacks aren't variable
>>681391545you can still spam and hope you randomly get it right, this is how I beat the game, some bosses just took many tries
>>681391571Ideally yes, if only because you're wasting stamina by rolling when you don't need to. And of course you invite leaving yourself open if you don't have a light roll and roll at the wrong time.
>>681374881The average player can't into defensive strats besides the bullgoat fingerprient blood antspur rapier build they've seen online.I went in at lvl130 with a STR/FTH build wearing the crucible armor with Ordovi's GS, support talismans and using defensive incants. No damage buffs/talismans/consumables except golden vow.I beat most minor bosses on the first try and most major bosses within 5 tries, except Radhan. Unsurprisingly not getting 2 shot and having poise trivialise most bosses and lets you learn them easily.
>>681363816Pre-DS3 feels like Fromsoft respected the player's time and effort. Everything is calculated, fair and rewarding.Post-DS3 feels like Fromsoft doing everything in their power to outsmart the player, giving them no breathing room to act. Almost like it's an act of hatred towards their fans.
>>681386243>reacting to animations>mindlessly hitting roll
>>681392324Based take.I went through half the dlc with shit gear and build because I didn't want to go get dragoncrest and other shit with a new character, and also wanted to try all the new weapons.But it was just too frustrating. Going in with a proper build made me one or two shot all the bosses I was struggling with.
This is how you beat the gameget the most poise damaging weapon you can find and the strongest AoW for itget min stats for it then pump VIT and END then any leftover into whatever gives your weapon scalingRadahn runefast rollUse your near infinite stamina to roll spam every attack, massive health pool will prevent oneshot if you fuck up1 punish AoW when its your turn and repeat until boss staggers, keep repeating until it dies
>>681389141>ARPGs aren't about """"""balance""""""So why does Fromsoft keep nerfing powerful weapons/spells/summons?
>>681392845Similarly, if you rush skibidi fragments you can revert to the good old 51 poise buff stacking CR2 spam that deal 20% of their HP per attack so you can just bruteforce it with flasks. Who needs to learn bosses when they die in 10 seconds?
>>681393095PvPfags mostly, and somethimes they just hate fun.
>>681393156But if you rush skibidis you break quests.You need to at least kill divine beast and rellana I'm pretty sure.
>>681393260But they introduced a PvP exclusive balance system last year and just nerfed PvE shit in the patch leading up to SotE
>>681392813you can only use this excuse if it's a first time seeing ityou fail to adapt
>>681363816to make you and the other discordtrannies cry
>>681393412there's a way to skip Rellana
>>681363973>tranime avatardiscordtrannies aren’t even trying to hide anymore
>>681393412You can reach like lvl12 without killing anyone. >speak to all NPCs to start quests>take the tunnel to the lower part and loop around>shadow keep church district (rune shatters)>speak to all NPCs again>drain water and enter storeroom>drop down to the main section>wala you have access to the whole mapYou can then loot all the free skibidis, kill pot dudes, kills overworld hippos.>>681393562PvP gets to have different damage numbers, but moveset speed, fp cost, stamina cost, etc, are still shared with PvE.
>>681391957An infamous example: Margit can switch up the attack speed on his overhead. Lots of funny videos with that one.Maybe (You) should try getting good and learning the boss (rote memorization)
>>681393827stop pretending you belong here
>>681393915>tranime discordnigger crying againeverytiem
>>681392134Rare to see such a blithely idiotic post.
>>681393672>>681393885Well TIL I guess.I thought you had to kill the lion for ansbach and rellana for leda to move on.
>>681363816I'm replaying the base game and the delayed attacks are worse than I remember. Incredibly annoying and ridiculous as well
>>681393885>>take the tunnel to the lower part and loop aroundCan you elaborate? Not sure which tunnel you mean here. You mean something like this?
>>681373901Yeah, most of the bosses have a bullshit global 1shot combo they always do at 20% health. It's the literal definition of artificial difficulty.
>>681394147You people are perpetually unhappy
>>681365701You could still roll on reflex (sometimes) if there wasn't a retarded delay between the button press and the actual roll>>681373856>You could just use a shield instead.Just throw build variety out the window and annoy everyone into using a shield, huh? Stellar design from Fromsoft.
>>681393885So why'd they nerf Mimic?
>>681374312>Nobody likes these shitty delays because they feel janky and they don’t flow well into attack strings.It's also annoying to have to wait for them to finish. It's not like you can attack or anything.
>>681363816Because they are trying to make it as painfully obvious as possible that you are meant to summon or use ashes in this game. This is not a souls game. You can't just roll your way through everything. That's why enemies input read, that's why a few of them can combo for so long, why they have fakeouts. It's why some of them it feels almost impossible to do damage without trading with the boss. It's elden ring, not dark souls 4
>>681379662>I never understood why /v/ is so mad about delayed attacks.Because they're dumb.>Why is this bad boss design?Because it's dumb.
>>681379662because its not fun
>>681394391Red path to skip Rellana and reach Scadu Altus + church districtBlue path to access lower Rauh and Cerulean coastGreen path to access archdragon & Charo's (this has ancient dragon man as a boss but he doesn't matter)
>>681363816>delayed attacks I refuse to play Fromslop for this one reason alone. It fundamentally breaks the philosophy of action games, which is to test your reflexes on telegraphed attacks. The fact that Fromslop enemies all have so many obscure feints forces you to play by trial-and-error and memorisation rather than reflex, incentivising defensive play over offensive play. This is more cancerous for action games than recharging health is for fps games.
>>681380853>You react to the actual swing, not the boss reeling their arm backwards.Delaying before "the actual swing" means it's essentially cutting the attack animation in half and leaving you with less telegraphing. On some attacks you just don't have time to react, especially with the stupid roll delay and general sluggishness. It becomes more about memorizing the timing.
>>681395210Do you believe boxing matches should have both guys just punch nonstop?
>>681395027Okay, then I understand. I found that spirit spring that gets you behind the Fort of Reprimand way after the fact so I never made the connection that you could use it to skip Castle Ensis.From Scadu Altus, I know how to get everywhere else.
>>681395313This doesnt work because if a boxer purposely delays his punch to catch the other offguard he's just gona get punched for free and he wont be able to poise thorugh and oneshot the other
>>681363816to punish rolling. you're supposed to play like ds1, using a shield and strafing to the right.
>>681394564Seriously, why avoid pointless rolls? That's what you thought the question was?
>>681373901>You used to be able to beat bosses on the first try if you were good enough.Can you provide a good argument for why you SHOULD be able to beat an enemy you've never met before on the first try? You don't know his moves. You don't know his affinities. You don't know how many phases he has. Why should you be able to beat him? >Circle around boss with shield raised>Wait for boss to swing and miss>Punish with 2 slashesDo you just want to go back to that?>>681394471Name one boss that has a global 1-shot that isn't massively telegraphed. You can't.
>>681395210we're 8 games in, if you want to play a slow game, play DaS1.
When Radahn does the combo where the sword swing catches you if you try to roll the light explosion, which hit are you supposed to tank?
>>681395779I rolled in DS1
>roll on button release instead of pressretards will defend this
>>681396019I don't wanna accidentally roll when I'm trying to sprint. So yeah it's fine
>>681385564My reaction speed is average and I had no problem in Sekiro. Elden Ring is a sluggish mess. They absolutely want you to memorize and not react.
>>681363816the entire game is designed to be beatable in the gear you begin the game with.you know that starter armor set and weapon? yeah.so if the game gives you tools that>increase damage>increase potency>increase poise>deceases damage taken from physical / elemental types>status effects on enemies (bleed, scarlet rot, sleep)and you don't use them?its like playing SMT with no buffs or debuffs.simply, one must master how to bend the game over your ass. and this isn't even mentioning the various summons (which you shouldn't use) that will play the game for you (and I don't just mean that slime of yourself).No one adapts. They die and complain without trying to figure out why.Why do you think most players dropped SMT Nocturne as soon as they reached Matador?Or a more meme example, the moment they rushed the first dungeon in Persona 4 and Yukiko fucking rekt them and they dropped the game?
>>681385752>this series has always been about fighting greater oddsYeah but the design used to be better.
>>681396008You're dodging it wrong, you can perfectly avoid all the light laser followups.His only real rollcatch in the left-right-crosschop combo.
>>681396142why wouldnt you just have roll and run on different buttons retardespecially when it came out on pc and has rebindable keys, there's absolutely no excuse for forcing roll on release.
>>681363816Artificial learning.
>>681364189the very first boss punishes panic rolling
>>681396329>especially when it came out on pcAnon's playing souls games on mouse and keyboard!
>>681396212people died at Yukiko? P4 is so easy I don't think I had trouble the entire game
>>681363946This, the only people who complain about muh delays are panic rolling shitters, lmao
If you beat Radahn without summoning and before the nerfs, you are the 1%. A god gamer.
>>681396461>keeps proving hes retardedthere is no standard controller for pc users and they could potentially be using any kind of controller with any number of buttons. why should they be beholden to the limited standards of console plebeians like you?
>>681396142What if they were different buttons
>>681363816specifically meant to punish veterans and people that've grown wise to their bullshit just to make sure they're still getting hit with a 'gotcha' every now and then so the game remains """""hard"""""not a big fan of devs getting a bit too meta and starting to actively fight with the playerbase in this game of "I know you know" chicken where difficulty becomes synonymous with pulling one over on someone with a nonsensical mechanic/hitbox/delay because it stretches suspension of disbelief and lets you start to recognize "wow the dev is trying too hard to be an asshole and make sure I get hit here"
>>681390872how hung is Miquella
>>681396531P4 is notorious where the first dungeon is overtuned. the rest are easier.if you try just rush it and skip everything, youll get rekt by yukiko for being underleveled.Original P3, every dungeon is like that. Basically a stat/gear check.Yes, P4 is easy but most players choke on Yukiko at least once.
>>681396584if you had less than 1 or more than 15 skadoo upgrades then the nerfs didnt change anything. so the nerfs didn't affect radahn for anyone that actually played the entire DLC.
>>681363973you're right and getting called out for it for some reasonscooby snacks are such a lazy bandaid "fix" but hey, the game has to be hard because "DARK SOULS PREPARE TO DIE A BUNCH GAME SO HARD" right?
>>681396813fine anon.if you completed the entire DLC before the "tuning" patch that made the game easier overall, you're a god gamer.
>>681396638But they aren't and I've never had any issues with the souls games controls. From has had the same controls in all their games even pre-souls. SO I doubt they are gonna change what works anytime soon
I have less of an issue with delayed attacks than I have with bosses that have intricate long attack strings. Messmer's second phase combos sure look cool but, when it's all denied with a single press of the circle button at the right time, what is even the point? I would rather not watch the AI have fun doing multiple double inverted flipped upside-down summersaults just so I can sneak a single R1 when the fucker is done spazzing out. And of course, it doesn't help that my attacks are lame "realistic" sword pokes while the AI gets the cool combos. In the DLC From definitely tried to give the player more complex looking attacks with weapons like Leda's Sword or the martial arts, but when the fights are still balanced around your main method of punishing bosses still being roll + R1, the complexity of your moves doesn't fucking matter.AC6 also had some of this nonsense that rubs me the wrong way, very unlike past AC games. But in 6 you can still just hose down Allmind Iguazu with bullets while he's doing his anime bullshit.
>>681396893But unless you are at scadoo 20 you actually don't do more dmg or less dmg than you could've before if you had just gotten more fragments.
>>681396625>there is no standard controller for pc usersEveryone uses a controller with either the standard Xbox or PlayStation layout. >why should they be beholden to the limited standards of consoleBecause it accommodates everyone except shitters like you who are incapable of pressing and releasing a button quickly. Or are you disabled or something?
>>681363816margit and i hate him for it
>>681396681Very.
>>681396998they did change it for sekiro because they know it feels like shit and arbitrarily increases your reaction time.
>>681397139>this wasn't our endingI feel robbed
>>681397037ER is like playing reverse Devil May Crythe boss gets all the cool stylish combos and you get to poke him once very 30 seconds if you are lucky
>>681397057Is that why I went to bed thinking the DLC mobs were actually dangerous, but woke up and starting 2-shotting them?
>>681397082it doesn't matter how fast you release it. it still takes objectively takes longer. your reaction time is arbitrarily being increased no matter how hard you try to cope. you are literally using retarded controls. stay mad faggot.
>>681397037>roll + R1Half the openings are long enough for a colossal charged R2 or using an ash.The other half can fit a tap R2 or a couple R1.
>>681363973>tranny image>shit opinionsit really is every time huh?
>>681396998The delay is worse in Elden Ring and it the enemies are faster and more spastic to boot.They forgot the limitations of their engine when designing the enemy encounters in Elden Ring. They used to understand it. Now they're too arrogant to work within it and too lazy to fix it. There are games that do fast-paced combat well and Elden Ring, with its janky, aging Souls engine, is not one of them.
>>681397396I think the real trannies are the ones who enjoy the tranny game lusting for cock. See >>681397235>>681397139
>>681374037That’s rollspam. Panic rolling (often accompanied by subsequent rollspam) is reactively rolling at any movement the enemy does.
>>681397445I'm lusting over a cute ending though.
>>681397335>your reaction time is arbitrarily being increased no matter how hard you try to copeI'm coping with it just fine because my reaction time is decent. The added delay of having to release the button means nothing to me. It doesn't matter to normal people.Video games shouldn't pander to handicapped people, anon.
My friend posted that he beat the game and this was his final setup. How good at the game is he?
>>681396681>>681397139>>681397235Dumb fucking faggots.
>>681397550the best...
>>681397334I mean think what you will, but unless you were at the exact scadoo range that had the biggest gap it was a 20% increase at most. And like I said at every range you had a percentage that you could've reached by just getting more fragments. At the end of it a all it was only a 5% buff
>>681397550Is your friend fat?
>>681397550>Greatshield pokingNot very
>>681397540>well i can still beat the game so its fine!keep proving you're retarded, faggot. did anyone say they were having a hard time with the game? no, they didn't, and you're making that shit up because you're a fucking retard. roll on release just doesn't feel as good and makes the game feel less responsive and fun to play. you would understand that if you weren't retarded enough to think this game is actually hard.
>>681397614>>681397445not liking cute femboy cock makes you even gayer, sorry to tell you anon.
>>681397550not good but he did beat it
>>681397550>greatshield poke fagyea didn't beat :^)
>>681397550I mean he beat the game but not really.But also the fact he is just using a 1 to 1 meta build means he looked up a guide. So he might as well not have beaten it and just watched a youtube video.
>>681397540>i can eat the shit just fine!!
>>681397550i kneel
I just bought Elden Ring, I've killed Margit, Black Knife Assassin, Godrick, Tree sentinel and BeastmanI found Godrick the hardest so far but still killed him in under 10 attempts, using the jelly fish summonIs a guard counter build viable? I find it really satisfying and with the healing thing from the assassin boss it feels quite nice, I don't have to heal muc
>>681397665Thanks for this table anon, I haven't played the DLC yet and I want to see if I can try it as it was at launch. Did they only change the scadu scaling or did they nerf the enemies themselves too?
THE OVERALL PLAYERBASE GOT GUD OVER THE YEARS SO THE ONLY WAY TO INCREASE DIFFICULTY IS THROUGH MORE CHEESY MEANS LIKE THIS THAT GO AGAINST ALL THE TRAINING SOULS GAMES GAVE USSOULSLIKES ARE LITERAL AN ARMS RACE OF DIFFICULTY BETWEEN THE PLAYERS AND DEVELOPERS
>>681397923Just changed the scadoo frag scaling is all
>>681397665I think I was actually at around 14/15, so I ended up "benefiting" maximally from it. Was kind of annoyed that they nerfed the difficulty when I started steamrolling stuff.Overall I don't think the balance of the DLC was stellar.
i wish all from games were like this>almost everything is perfectly animated>even the most sudden of delayed attacks have a very solid tell, and even someone that never saw them before can deflect them if they get past a 200ms~ single-ish stimuli reactionunfortunately it seems every game ripping off sekiro fails at that. other than maybe lies of p, i heard that one supposedly does a very great job but i havent played it
>>681397550Certified game completer
>>681397962*literally
>>681397916Guard counter is hit or miss. It's fantastic against some bosses but unusables on others.
>>681397842>I mean he beat the game but not reallyeither he did or he didn'tif you got the achievement (without third party software), you did it
>>681397963Great, thanks
>>681398082Yeah it really wasn't helpful against Godfrey but against tree sentinel it felt unfair
>>681397691>>681397858Okay. From has heard your complaints and will now move the roll button to its own unique button because it cannot be roll on release anymore.Which button do they choose, and what other functions do they have to move to accommodate that change?You won't answer because 5 minutes of thought will show you that it's not possible on a standard controller.
>>681398014I'd agree if they didn't have the big kanji to warn you about special attacks.
>>681397916Guard counter is amazing against the vast majority of mobs and some bosses, but unusable against other bosses.
>>681398098If you looked up a guide you didn't beat the game. You watched a video or read a book. No you can't change my mind. This isn't just souls games either, this applies to all games. Either you play it and beat it yourself, or you are just copying someone elses playthrough and you didn't beat it.
>>681398153*godrick
>>681366217>Every other game is like thisfactually wrong you fucking retard. No game does this
>>681397550>Verdigris shieldholy fucking based
You were taught about roll spamming with the first major boss of the main game. It's not the game's fault you've sucked for years.
>>681398159move sprint to hold left stick
>>681396253the series would get old so fast if we were still fighting dark souls 1 bosses
>>681398184thats completely besides the point/quality i was refering to, thoughif you wanna talk things like that, then yeah i think sekiro partly sabotages its animation quality that allows you to time stuff perfectly, because of how much you can spam the parry button and still not take damage despite mis-timing several times in a row. It often makes people spam it a lot instead of getting used to waiting for the right moment when they see a huge windup
>>681398159NTA and in fact the original guy who said rolling on B was fine.But couldn't from make sprint clicking in a thumb stick (L3/R3)? Pretty sure From doesn't use them for anything. It might not feel good and probably lead to more broken controllers, but it's possible.
>>681374729>No one should be wanting to fight a boss only once if it is enjoyable. You are mentally retarded
>>681396584I did that and I'm not a god gamer, just a suck up who gave up 2 precious hours to miyazaki that I shouldn't have, fuck him and his game
>>681398231>all of those doctors didn't actually do complicated medical procedures, they read how to do it and just copied it>all of those forklift operators didn't actually lift crates, they watched some videos on how to operate it and copied it
>>681363816I want to keep playing the DLC but I still haven't finished the main story and am worried I'll end up over leveled>just don't level upMy autism forces me to spend my souls on something. I have enough smithing stones.
They ported the DS3 roll that is way too strong defensively, so in order for the game to be challenging it instead has to rely on memorizing mix ups, ie whether rollspam is required or punished by each particular combo.I think the roll takes slightly more stamina than in ds3 itself, but it's still way too powerful to balance a good challenge around.
>>681398521Correct
>>681398596you physically can't be overleveled for the DLC
>>681398159Run can be one of the shoulder buttons so I don't have to change my grip every time I want to run, steer, and move the camera at the same timeIt's not my fault From made a game with messy as shit controls. Just move the ash of war button or something.
>>681398353>the series would get old so fast if we were still fighting dark souls 1 bossesThey can improve on them without shit design
>>681398596You will never be overleveld, also you should keep leveling it's the point of an RPG. Only super autistic PVP fags think you should stop leveling at arbitrary levels.I have my character on ng++++ at lvl 300. It's great being able to do multiple things and I hate using larvals to respec everytime I want to use a different weapon.
>>681398886you being bad doesn't make it shit
>>681398394>But couldn't from make sprint clicking in a thumb stick (L3/R3)L3 is crouch, R3 is lock onI don't think we really need crouch though
>>681398812>just move the button to something>doesn't provide an actual solutionThis is why you don't work on games
>swing>oops I'm one-handing let's fix that>B + R1>the attack animation wasn't done so it registers as another R1 instead of two-handingI hate this
Do levels make any difference in the DLC? Can I just rush to Mogh if I make a new character?
>>681398980I think the only time I used crouch int he entire game was the new madness zone to be sneaky. I forgot it was even there
>>681398938>you being bad doesn't make it shitMy level of skill has no bearing on how shit it is
>>681398980Crouch-sprinting is way better than slowly walking whenever you want to get a backstab on an unaware enemy, and that happens often enough to warrant it.
>>681399108>b + r1Well thats not the right button is why you fucked up, you use Y + bumps to switch power stances.
>>681399145then come up with a valid complaint that isn't>waaah, they attack too much and i can't handle it :(
>>681363973Just read first few replies. Actual fucking children seething someone insulted their perfect HARDCORE GAME. Fucking insane.
>>681397674He's chubby
>>681396647It's so tiresome watching demon/dark souls boss videos and just seeing a normal wind up and attack. It literally does feel like they took what was supposed to be normal boss animations, made the wind up 200% slower and then made the attack 800% faster with repeating animations so you don't dodge out of the first one that you're supposed to, and if you somehow magically do, you get a ground explosive as one last fuck you
>>681398787you can there's just another system on top of it
>>681398787I mean the for the main game
>>681398930>300 at NG+4lol try 333 at base difficulty
>>681398014Been playing Lies of P recently, not far into the game, but I feel the start ups for enemy attacks are sometimes a lot faster / a lot less obvious than in Sekiro, and failing a perfect block or blocking normally still damages you. Maybe once I get more used to it, I'll like it more, but Sekiro still feels better to me.
>>681397842what if he was just that smart and handsome and a gamer
>>681389141>To avoid disrupting progression between the DLC content and the rest of the game so you can jump between the two without invalidating the main game content too much, dipshit.Oh so like how you can invalidate the base game just by exploring too much because it's so easy to get overleveled?Fromtards are the most braindead fanbase in this entire industry.
>>681399367no, having your damage stats at level 80 doesn't make you delete them in a few hits
>>681380853are you really that dense? Can you not imagine think or envision in how many ways is this wrong and unnatural? It defies logic you piece of shit. laws of physics and momentum. Imagine if car was going at you 200 mph then suddenly stopping 5 feets away for 2 whole seconds before perfectly tracking you trying to get away from it. You can argue many points in favor of ER but if you defend this you are mentally retarded
>>681399028Sekiro had combat arts be L1 + R1 but that'd interfere with spear pokingHonestly just select ashes of war like a spell or something, or move it to L3 and remove crouch, or make it triangle + R2There are tons of viable solutions, the Souls control scheme could be greatly improved in generalDecoupling run and dodge would be a massive improvement, and it'd be worth moving things around a bit
>>681393562There is no point arguing with them anon. Fromdrones suffer from permament brain damage.
>>681399494it still makes you do more damage than having them at 20
>>681399202yeah my bad I do it right on muscle memory but couldn't remember which button it actually was
>>681399481this faggot is somehow horrendous at videogames despite being PAID TO PLA Y THEM
>>681399108>I hate thisIt's fucking shit, the buffering is so damn inconsistent and jankySame thing happens if you try to two-hand in mid roll
>>681396647Agreed, I talked about this with my friend, some of the reads that these bosses do are so insane at this point that it definitely streches my suspension of disbelief. Also, the rolling has been getting comical since DS3, in DS1 and 2 you would roll 1 or 2 times then maybe run a bit, distance yourself, block an attack with your shield, but now you just like a clown, this could be solved with BBs sidestep but they rather make it an Ash of War instead of putting it as a base mechanic.
>>681397842Some might argue that you're "cheating yourself" but you're not cheating in the game at all. Don't feel bad for needing a hint in the right direction just because some games lack intuitive design decisions
>>681399578that doesn't mean you can overlevel, it's literally designed for high stats
how are you supposed to deal with third phase implosion? tried running away but range is huge>no 4th phase where it's just limping without attacking
>>681399248You wouldn't accept any argument, you are emotionally invested in defending Elden Ring and Fromsoft from any criticismYou are pathetic and not worth engaging with
>>681396212This anon gets it, ER is designed in a way to force you to engage with its system or eat shit (and not I'm talking about summons). This is why there's a grace in front of the bosses and why you can freely change the infusion on your weapon.
>>681371547This, rolling in Des and DaS were the finger print shield strats of its time.
>>681399735>how to deal bloodhound step
This thread is the proof that there is really no reasoning with Fromdrones. They suffer from permanent retardation.
>>681399765>no argumentdon't be surprised this is how people respond if your only argument is it's too hard for you personally
I hope in the future Souls game they make it so that bosses either have endless wombo combos, or that they can easily close the distance with you, not that every boss can instantly jump on you and start a wombo combo.
>>681399481Holy shit I thought I was overleveled at 180
Why are the base keybinds of keyboard and mouse so fucking shit for this game? They have been making games for PC for years and they still can't figure stuff out, making people roll with Shift, really?
>>681363816The delay on the attack is the lesser issueThe real problem is the instant execution after the delay>long charge up, .02 second reactionIts dishonest design
>>681399868compared to other games it's fine, at least we're not blizzdrones, like that would be really low.
>>681363946panic rolling is the only effective way to dodge Radahn in phase 2 though.
>>681399735the explosion is big yes but it also shoots lasers, that's what gets you. Run away from the explosion then dodge sideways .
>>681363816I never complained about Elden ring bosses input reading or delaying attacks. Only thing I was surprised about was the rolling being worse than in DS3. You can beat every single boss in Demons souls, dark souls 1-3, elden ring by just using a melee weapon and learning the boss. I thought people played these games for the enjoyment of improving slowly to overcome the obstacle. The formula has not changed. Radahn took me 97 tries, Malenia took me 108 originally, now I can kill her in a few tries because I know the boss fight. I feel like the shield users who "give up" are just older players that want the Demons Souls formula back with 3000 HP gimmick bosses. If you spend 100 dollars on a game, why do you just want to walk through it as fast as possible?
>>681398339>move sprint to hold left stickThat's crouch. Where are you moving crouch to?>Right thumb stickLock on. Where are you moving it?>>681398812>Run can be one of the shoulder buttons so I don't have to change my grip every time I want to run, steer, and move the camera at the same timeAll of the shoulder buttons already have vital functions, like attacking/blocking or casting spells/ashes of war>>681399527>Sekiro had combat arts be L1 + R1So your answer to changing rolling from trigger on release is to make it its own unique button, unusable for anything else, and have some other function be moved to pressing L1 + R1 simultaneously, which is way more annoying and prone to delay/misfire than trigger on release?None of these are acceptable solutions. You would all fuck up the control scheme and lose players if you were in charge of these decisions.
If you leveled at all, you gave up.
>>681399912I never made the argument that it's too hard for me, that's just you making up shit that I haven't said, and it's my cue to call you a disingenuous faggot who can just keep yapping ineffectively without my engagement
>>681399989phase 2 has the same timings as phase 1, the fucking lights just make it hard to see, + the laser followup
>>681400242so your argument is just "they're bad because they're bad"?you've never given any reason
>>681399996>The formula has not changed. Radahn took me 97 tries, Malenia took me 108 originally, now I can kill her in a few tries because I know the boss fight.it's literally weak willpower, people nowadays aren't used to sit through something. Same for sports, you don't get anywhere without putting time in it. They want instant gratification, and all the nu-video games teaches this retarded zoomer generation that.>why do you just want to walk through it as fast as possible?nobody knows, it's not like you get a game like this every day. Next From Software title will be years away.
>>681363973
>>681399932they know realistically no one is going to play with kb+m unless they are masochistic and at that point they would enjoy the shitty keybinds
You cannot use gear I do not approve of, you just wanted an easy win.
>>681399481Literally how. I do a fuck ton of coop and helping people and still couldn't fathom getting this high. Was he just straight up farming souls to overlvl for hours on end?
>Elden Ring's release buck broke /v/ with Margit>Now the dlc bosses repeat itCan't wait for From's next Souls game to filter /v/ again, it's always fun getting a board wide reminder of how DOGSHIT /v/ is at video games.
>>681400242>y-yapping get a load of this twitter nigger tranny tourist shitter lmao
>>681399996>I thought people played these games for the enjoyment of improving slowly to overcome the obstacle.Yeah but the fights became more annoying and filled with stupid bullshit, the controls/camera haven't improved to match, and you have to do it over a much larger spread of content and get your enthusiasm drained by a bloated world with million copy paste dungeons and bosses along the way.There's such a thing as too big, even for a full price game. Especially when a lot of the enemy design is, as some people here have said, dishonest.
>>681363946You don't need to make misleading animations to punish "panic rolling" because people who panic roll aren't trying to read animations in the first placeIf your animation has to be deliberately misleading with off-beat timing then you're explicitly punishing people who were trying to watch the animation and properly respond to itDoing this on every attack is just a cheap way of forcing retries on the boss until you memorise a timing that doesn't make sense visually
>>681400475I don't know but at this point just cheatengine, it's as pathetic but less time consuming
>>681400604>tranime avatar retardevery. single. time.
I remember back when everyone wanted Dark Souls combat in every game due to how realistic and grounded it was.Look at the games now.
They really put all their effort in the bosses because goddamn the DLC has a really shitty enemy variety
>>681400249It's stupid as hell because the fight gets way easier when you realize that you need to fight phase 2 like you do phase 1 except rolling in the direaction where the light pillars won't hit your, but the constant staggers and chip damage from the light pillars are designed to make you panic roll and die. Which wouldn't be so bad if I could see what the boss without Miquella waving a fucking flashlight in my face after every swing.
>>681400705>made up trannyschizo babblelook at these trannies now
>>681399996The point isn't to beat your head against the wall until you learn every single combo, that was never what people wanted out of these bosses. They wanted them to be fun and engaging, the challenge just made it better in the end because you were fighting at the boss' level. The problem is that these fights are BORING. I did radahn solo with a colossal and it was so fucking dull compared to any boss from sekiro or even DS3. Yeah gael didn't take me 50 tries like radahn but he was more fun to fight because I could just initiate my attacks without being punished and there were a lot of punish windows in that fight. With radahn it just feels like a shitty endurance round with a robot, you always have to to wait for his combos and never commit to an attack unless it's after a combo, and dodge 10 times in a row or wait for his magic meteors to land to get a chance to attack after 20 seconds. It's not engaging because you're barely in that fight. I'm not even gonna comment on the travesty of a camera and the visual clutter that's obscuring his attacks a lot of the time.If you just like the spectacle you might as well use an ash summon, if you like watching bosses have fun while you're whacking them with a stick once every half a minute idk what to tell you, our tastes are just different, but people's complaints have nothing to do with the size of the challenge, just the way that challenge is executed
>>681400249>the fucking lights just make it hard to seeGetting flashbanged throughout the entirety of phase 2 is some bullshit. Realising Radahn was just doing the same patterns as before is how I beat him.The fight is essentially the Lothric Princes anime adaptation.
>>681380324>You're basically doing a challenge run AND complaining about the difficulty at the same time, it doesn't make any senseGameplay is more than just a difficulty setting.You have massively underestimated how many people ENJOY playing a normal souls character who fights bosses 1on1 with a sword instead of summoning multiple spirits and then nuking them with magic. This series became succesful while it was a slow and careful medieval knight game, not a magical anime third person coop shooter.
>>681400159>All of the shoulder buttons already have vital functions, like attacking/blocking or casting spells/ashes of warDodging is more vital than ashes.>So your answer to changing rolling from trigger on release is to make it its own unique button, unusable for anything elseWhy does it need to be used for something else? Is the jump button used for anything else?> and have some other function be moved to pressing L1 + R1 simultaneously, which is way more annoying and prone to delay/misfire than trigger on release?I was saying that L1 + R1 wouldn't work because it prevents you from shield-poking, but it's not a bad combination in itself. It's more useful to have a dodge that works properly than a one-button ashes of war.>None of these are acceptable solutions.They are. You're just predisposed to reject them because you're invested in pretending the controls are perfect as they are. In fact, they're already incredibly unwieldy.
>>681400605>>681400475your brain as a mmo player
>>681400517but anon, margit delay is such bullshit because my monkey brain can't resist insta rolling the second i see any movement
>>681397550>the default sword-and-board run that people have been swearing up and down is the """"right"""" way to play for years suddenly doesn't count because it shits on the final bossif this doesn't count then fully upgrading heavy armor and facetanking in DS1 doesn't count either
>delay attacks that tracks on the first hit despite strafing.
>>681400306>you've never given any reasonAnd I'm not going to waste my time explaining, because you're a dishonest faggot who will meet any reasoned argument with "lol you're just bad". I know how this goes.>>681400520Any more seethewords you want to get off your chest?
>>681400971And the games aren't made for that anymore. It's not designed for you to beat your head against bosses with no adaptation but rolling better.
>>681401225>he admits he has no genuine reasongot it
>>681400307>it's literally weak willpower, people nowadays aren't used to sit through something. Same for sports, you don't get anywhere without putting time in it. They want instant gratification, and all the nu-video games teaches this retarded zoomer generation that.Being annoyed with a game for wasting your time with stupid trial and error memorization bullshit isn't being weak willed or wanting instant gratification. It's just not wanting your time wasted by shit design choices.
>>681401243>why is everyone unhappy with the direction the games are going in?
>>681401193true, it's not possible to move where you're aiming during a wind up in real life
>>681401225>y-y-yappin LMAO TWITTERNIGGERTRANNY
>>681401386you're playing video games spreg, you can't waste your time more.
>>681401386>trial and error memorization bullshitanon, you had six games to master this gameplay without needing to rely on trial and error
>>681401404Correct ER sucks
>>681401263There are plenty of reasons throughout the thread and you're ignoring them on purpose. Go and apply to be a leftist or something, your appalling dishonesty means you'll fit right in.
>>681399662his main priority is being a seething spineless faggot for attention, playing games is just a means to achieving that.
>>681399996>learning the boss.>Why do you just want to walk through it as fast as possibleYeah I also wasted my life memorising the boss moves. I had fun when I wasn't fighting (dying in test fights) bosses. Very tedious to memorise.
>>681401568ok discordtranny, you suck at the game
>>681401460>you're playing video games spreg, you can't waste your time more.Some games waste more time than others.>>681401558>anon, you had six games to master this gameplay without needing to rely on trial and errorMy mastery of the gameplay isn't a problem. Those games were designed better.
>>681401662The strange reflexive ER defenders are probably on a discord, and are thus trannies like their tranny game.
>>681363973Instead of speeding up the combat, from should have went the opposite direction. Make a roll take half your stamina. Make it impossible to wear heavy armor and still midroll. Make attacking slower and take more stamina.
>>681401581most of the complaints can be waved away as a skill issue such as>too fast>delays>too much AoE>rolls not good enough
>>681401601>le tediousdiscordtroons you gotta spice up your vocabulary or just admit you’re shit at the game
>>681401662Bizarrely, I beat it according to the game.
>still no boss rush mode0/10 dlc
>>681401710>trust me i'm not bad! it's the game that's bad!>why?>IT JUST IS
>>681401710>Some games waste more time than others.nope, video games as a whole are a waste of time.
>>681401051>Is the jump button used for anything else?Have you even played the fucking game? Why are there so many people giving opinions on mechanics and lore of Elden Ring, but they say things that nobody who's actually played it would say?>It's more useful to have a dodge that works properly than a one-button ashes of war.Your solution is to move ashes of war to some button combo input? You think that's better than roll on release? I mean if you actually believe that then fine, but I doubt 99% of people would agree with you.>None of these are acceptable solutions.>They are. You're just predisposed to reject them because you're invested in pretending the controls are perfect as they are.Not an argument. I laid out my arguments clearly. All those buttons are used for other purposes and moving them doesn't solve the problem of sometimes clunky controls.Make an argument or fuck off.
>>681363816Am I the only one not suffering this? Like the only boss I saw doing this was Margrit but the rest feel just fine.
>>681401712>n-no uAHAHAHAHAHAHHAHHAHAHAHAHAHHAHAHAHAHAHAHHAHAHAHAHAHAH
>>681401738>most of the complaints can be waved away as a skill issueRevealing that you're incapable of looking at something in terms of actual design or quality, all you can do is call people's skill into question. You are a massive faggot and should be ashamed to speak.
>>681401809now beat it without crying to your discordsissies
>>681401842Plenty of discussion throughout the thread. Learn to read before opening your mouth.
I beat the game.
I don't get the obsession with playing "fair" in these games when the bosses are cheating out the ass compared to your moveset.
>>681401957>shittertranny copemany such cases
>>681401957there literally isn't a single post that talks about boss design, it all just amounts to being too hardyou can direct me to the posts if you want to prove me wrong
>>681401885I completely agree.
>>681402031Based I also beat the game with my Carian Thrusting Shield
>>681401738people's inability to understand the difference between good boss design and From chucking any old shit in because scrubs will defend it unconditionally can be waved away as a skill issue
>>681401865What else is the jump button used for, then?
>>681402030Yeah you and the discordtrannies have been spamming the same shit arguments for why you’re shit at the game is everyone’s fault besides yourselves
>>681402143and yet no one can come up with real reasons why it's bad
>>681402143>t. tranny who is shit at the game
Beat it with Giant Hunt and two-hand blocking.
>>681402143because it always boils down to>i die>its bad design>i beat the boss>its good design
>>681402284ermm it was le tedious and le not difficult but also to difficult and to cheap and ummm….skibbidi zanzibarto?
>>681402284great job failing to read the thread retard
>>681402092Faggot, learn to actually read and you'll see that most criticisms make no mention of difficulty, and many explicitly call out design or speak of tedium and annoyance.Making assumptions about skill is just the retarded lens you and other Fromdrone is looking through, and which you are incapable of seeing beyond.I can't believe you are this stupid.
>>681402391This. The positive reception to absolute nothingburger boss fights like Romina proves it.
>>681396019And it's not even just that. Try recording the game with input overlay. Even after releasing the sprint your character won't still roll. And the first frames don't give invul.
Reminder that we've had these threads for Bloodborne, Dark Souls 3, Sekiro and base Elden Ring
>>681402435We all read your posts about how you got filtered but can’t admit it sis
>>681402284Every time someone says why it's bad you just retreat to "lol git gud".
>>681402435>>681402479>>681402567>y-you didn't read the thread!>unable to post any of these posts with so called valid complaintslol
>>681397962ITS ALMOST LIKE SOULS COMBAT IS INHERENTLY FLAWED IF THE ONLY WAY TO COMBAT ROLLING IS THROUGH DELAY ATTACKSFOCUS ON MORE UNIQUE EXPERIENCES INSTEAD OF BOILING DOWN THE GAME TO PRESS I-FRAME BUTTON CORRECTLY
>>681402391I beat the boss and it's bad design.What's your next cope?
>>681402567Because you can’t explain why It’s bad and need to admit you aren’t good at the game, it’s time to accept it
>>681402391Radahn was superb design, I blocked all his bullshit and won on the second try. Another masterpiece by From.
>>681402528based I was correct in those threads too
>>681402621You're either incapable of reading, or incapable of honesty. Which is it, Fromdrone?
>>681402668you suck st the game and are still ass blasted lmao
>>681402762>still coping with "you didn't read the thread"it's not hard to click a post number
>>681402528We really haven't.
>>681402675The problem is, you can't comprehend why it's bad. You are actually incapable. Any rationality is lost on you. You will only ever deflect, like the massive faggot you are.
>>681402621 (You)>>681402567 (You)>>681402552 (You)>>681402675 (You)post you're own gameplay, you won't
>>681402883>pretending this is the first time /v/ has gotten super filteredlol
>>681402835Tedious = badThere, I explained it for you.
>>681402898sorry I don’t speak autistic tranny shitter who sucks at games
>>681402632WHAT WOULD BE A MORE UNIQUE EXPERIENCE THEN?
>>681402998why is it tedious?
>>681391515No, I'm just not a shitter
>>681402921I don't need to prove a thing to morons, so no I won't
>>681402935You think it's a get good thread but the non shit posts (the longer ones people aren't making as they literally take a shit) are quite different. A lot of players are giving interesting new criticisms.
>>681402998>le heckin tedious is le baderinohello trannycord copetard
>>681403041Because it's full of dumb unintuitive traps that prioritize memorization, sluggish controls and jank over skill.
>>681403129>i got filtered so now the ritual whining threads are valid
>>681403041Because it keep losing!!!
>>681363816>Why does every boss do this?to throw pattern player shitters like you off
>game expects you to do near perfectly input sequential rolls>roll is still bound to the same button as sprint
>>681403214>prioritize memorizationand then you proceed to out yourself as a shitter who can't play through instinct
>>681401865So hey, mister "Make an argument or fuck off", what else is that jump button used for?Could it be you ran headfirst into the wall of your own stupidity? Could it be you revealed that your entire 'argument' is nothing more than emotionally charged irrationality?
>>681403218There's not really any reason for you to post on/v/.
>>681403129also I’m trans btw
>>681403083I accept your concoction
>>681403326I told you you'd deflect with "git gud".Did you "instinctively" avoid waterfowl dance the first time you encountered it? That's impressive.
>>681403360And I'm complaining about a trans rights game? Unlikely.
>>681403325>retarded tranny babbling shit >expects you to agree with it
>>681363973The fact that there are so many replies from From fanboys seething at this post with no arguments and only ad hominems tells you it's 100% correct.
>>681403429i saw it and then learned i can just run away for the first two waveswow, so hard, such crippling memorization
>>681403431>n-no uit just keeps happening lmao
>>681402159>What else is the jump button used for, then?>>681403331>what else is that jump button used for?Anons, these are the people you're arguing with about video game mechanics. These are the people who have the audacity to think their opinions on video games matter. They literally don't know what the fuck they're talking about.
>>681403574You read a guide and summoned Mimic Tear.
>>681403653Glad you can't answer.
>>681403693You play Elden Ring on mouse and keyboard, don't you?
>>681403653Then you should have no trouble answering:What else is the jump button used for?
>>681403686>sar redeem the discord
>>681403585I'm the same anon, stop posting.
>>681403686>n-no, it's not possible to beat bosses without a fuck ton of helpjust doubling down on being a shitter, i seewas it that hard to learn running in and out is more effective than trying to roll everything for her?
>>681403779*also I’m trans btw
>>681403826Imagine admitting you can't flawlessly dodge waterfowl dance and need to run away from it. You have a long way to go before you can consider yourself good at the game.
>>681403868I want to read posts talking about games, stop posting.
>>681403496>>681403360my personal theory is that hiro hid the unique posters amount we could previously check in a thread to make it easier to for companies/marketers to shill products, but as a consequence it’s now incredibly easy to hack together a reply bot that posts the same responses to posts with certain keywordsrollsrollingtranniesbad designdiscord
>>681403952giving up, i see
>>681363973yep, for some reason soulsborne games have attracted midwits who pride themselves on beating these games and fromsoft's response is to keep upping the ante without improving the combat itself, they just keep piling on gimmicksthis is why their games still have terrible input buffering and input delay and they don't care
>>681403967>>681404010total discordtranny shitter tourist meltdown
>>681404013No, I'm just choosing not to engage with your argument and asserting without evidence that you suck at the game like you Fromshitters always do.
>>681404021so it's okay to shit on the journalist for being bad at the start of cuphead but doing the same thing for piss easy souls games is now supposed to be a prideful thing?
>>681403693>>681403763Oh wow, actually I'm >>681403653 mistaken. You're talking about the jump button apropos of nothing and I assumed you meant rolling. I don't think jump has a second function, but the rolling button does, and that's why it's trigger on release instead of trigger on press. Why is the jump button being unique even relevant? How is it an argument? It's not. You can switch the roll to being its own unique button, but that doesn't fix the issue of now needing another button input for jumping.
>>681404021thank you for upvoting my post sis, makes it look like we aren’t just shit at the game and coping
>>681404010The problem originated with the marketing team. All the souls games required death to learn gauntlets. But then PTDE arrived and the deaths were both fetishised and misunderstood. On the one hand they became the point of the games. On the other hand they became marketable.With the current playerbase they really can't proceed any further with the series.
>>681404158you literally admitted you need to spend countless attempts memorizing the fight before you can beat itthese fights aren't hard, if you played through every other souls game before this you SHOULD be able to beat the DLC bosses in a couple attempts at most
>>681404158>no I’m just coping we know sis…we know
>>681404346>says increasingly brainrotted discordtranny for the millionth time todayget new material
>>681404192>Why is the jump button being unique even relevant? How is it an argument? It's not.You said>So your answer to changing rolling from trigger on release is to make it its own unique button, unusable for anything elseto which I replied that the jump button isn't used for anything else and there isn't a problem with that.A dedicated roll button would be great. It'd eliminate the dumb delay and the general input fuckery the game engages in on occasion. There's room for it in the bloated control scheme, I think you're just emotionally invested in denying that.
>>681363816>Why does every boss do this?If you beat every boss first try the game would be about 10 hrs long.
>>681404348>you literally admitted you need to spend countless attempts memorizing the fight I did no such thing. I said the design is trending towards memorization rather than skill now, which is evident from the way the developers try to fuck you up with unintuitive attacks, weird timings and bad visual readability. It's tedious and dishonest.
le tedious and le dishonest the final whimper of cope from the discordtranny shitter
>>681404921anyone who played through the souls games doesn't have this issuethis is a you problem
