I don't get itIf the divine gate is able to make you a god somehow, and the tower people were the ones who created it, why did they not use it themselves? Why did they not give themselves godly powers to defend themselves against mesmer? There had to be atleast a few people that used it?Also, how did Marika kill all those people in the story trailer? With what army? This is before she even became a god. She had to kill a shit ton of people to reach the divine gate, to the point where the area is full of corpses.
At the end of the day, souls games lores is vague on purpose to keep people speculating for years. The hornsent worshipped the crucible, which marika drove out and replaced with the golden order. Yet the hornsent inquisition works for marika? Are they eternally cucked? Are they basically an entire race of Morgotts?
>>681458683They did use it and they created the Divine Beasts as well as summoned Metyr.
>>681458683Being a god in Elden Ring doesn't mean you are all powerful. Miquella barely does any of the heavy lifting in his fight. Marika gets taken out by the Elden Beast, which is also a god. And then of course the fact a Tarnished can kill gods in these games. The Elden Lords actually seem more powerful in combat.I get the feeling the Hornsent did have 'gods', like the Grandam is called an empyrean--evoking the same language the game uses in TLB. But it just wasn't enough once the crusade got going and Marika was able to usurp the Hornsent and their leader(s)
>>681459917The divine beasts who were killed by messmer, a demigod? They should be stronger. Also metyr was a meteor, she didn't enter via a gate
>>681460025Then how did Marika reach the divine gate in the first place? This was before the golden order was a thing, so before messmerWhere did her first army come from?
>>681460343I think the finger crater areas are the sites where the cosmic beings crashed on the planet.One of them is where Metyr landed.My speculation is that the other site is where Elden Beast landed. It's right next to Marika's village.
>>681458683>why did they not use it themselves?Only empyreans can use the divine gate to become full fledged gods.
Am I crazy to think that Rellana is a dumb charaxter?To me, her lore feels as though it was someone's edgy OC that you would find on DeviantArt or somethin."This is Rellana! She's the cool hidden twin sister of Rennala, and she dual weilds magic swords that are imbued with magic and fire. And, unlike her sister, she can cast TWO full moons, and instead of using forms of glinstone pebbles and comets, she only uses glintblade spells because she's SO COOL!"Maybe I'm just being a hater, but like, I really do not like her from a lore perspective. She's definitely really cool, aesthetically. I dig the silver and blue armour.Also, Ymir is supposed to be her magical superior and he isn’t even given a proper boss fight. What the hell.
>>681462458you keep posting this, why are you so obsessed with her?
Is this the lore thread?Seriously what are demi humans? What are their lore?There are the queens and chiefs and big ones and the various small ones and there is boc and there are mages and there are now sword mastersdemi human implies their part human, they are often seen living in caves and beaches, but they also seem to quarrel with knights for some reason.Are they original inhabitants of the lands between and descend from the crucible like the misbegottens and omens/hornsent?Why do they want to take over the forts? Do they have military strategy?It's a bit different with the demihumans and beastmen compared to misbegottens or omens/hornset.First of all omens are quite different from hornsent. Omens are in particular a curse that appears in humans. Hornsent are more like misbegottens who seems to come from a culture that is directly associated with the crucible. There are still seemingly humans that worship the crucible because of the crucible knights.demihumans and beastmen however seem to be more related to humans either because they are designed to imitate them or they are part human or somehow related. Beastmen are seemingly intentionally turned human possibly from breeding or experimentation. They are seemingly related to the dragons.But what the fuck are the demi humans?Do they all come from that one animal fucker that made the snakemen?
>>681458683>the seduction>the betrayal She probably usurped divinity at the right moment, before someone or something else could enter the gate.
>>681462787Bro, they're silly little monkey dudes for you to fight. You are giving this way more thought than the devs did.
>>681462923>demihumans prepare to cryI WILL KNOW THEIR SECRETS!!!
>>681462458She’s random and forced as fuck lmaoCould have done literally anything else
>>681458683They didn't know how or were fine stopping at the divine beast tier.
>>681460343Her home village is like half a mile from the tower town.>>681463136They wanted to explain 3 sisters rise.
>>681459721>At the end of the day, souls games lores is vague on purpose to keep people speculating for yearsNo, that's the thing. With Dark souls it's clear they never intended for it to go past the first game that's why every subsequent games lore elements feel tacked on zanzibart tier.With elden ring it's clear from the very start to make a huge substantial and rich world, they invested both time and money into fleshing out the world, there is very likely several design documents at some fromsoft drawer detailing entire history of lands between. That's why it's so frustrating to see them tell it so poorly.The "lore" actually exists for once but the "story" is shit
>>681458683We don't know if they created it or instead found it and built their capital around it. I assume that the pot shenanigans were an attempt to use it.
>>681463456I mean it sits at the top of their city not out in a field.
>>681460343It's implied she seduced a prominent hornsent, what with her being referred to as a betrayer and a strumpet by them.
>>681458683Marika become a god before Give birth to Mesmer. The trailer let you see her before mesmer. The hornsent people could do something very bad with her village. So she betrayed them suddenly when she became a gid. Even it's too late to save everyone in her village.
>>681463348>They wanted to explain 3 sisters riseInstead of two moons they should have done crescent moon, or half moon, etc, to denote the phases of the moon.
>>681463573The assumption beings that it's "their" city.
>>681463573I'm not convinced that they built the tower. It seems far older than the town itself.
>>681463431I'm fairly certain most of the DLC is donutsteel lore tacked onto GRRM's original history outline. Hence why so much of the DLC lore feels out of place and hard to fit in with the base game stuff.
>>681463431That’s because From and Miyazaki don’t actually take their lore seriously, and they wing everything. He has said before that he treats story second, even third, behind gameplay.
>>681463843This is indeed a DLC that has both Wolverine and Yoda joke characters in it.
>>681463843Why do discord sisters keep talking about the dev like they know him?
>>681463732>>681463812What was it Leda said about the Hornsent having conquest at their heart? Something like that.
>>681463939>Noooooooooo don't use the directors name aaaaaaaaaaaaaahWeird type of autism.
>>681463939They claim to hate this game but are neck deep in the cult of personality and are probably talking about him 24/7 on their discord like women.
>>681463835Rellana was probably written by George and this is just how Miyazaki interpreted the character.
>>681462787SOTE even has a new variation of Demi-human. They're big and strong looking. You'll see i think 2 of them on the way to Queen Marigga in that wooded area with the blue worm things.
>>681458683If I understand right, the Divine Gate can ascend you to godhood, but you need to fulfill certain conditions. One is throwing away your humanity. I dunno about this part, but you may or may not need human sacrifices. I don't think you do since Miquella didn't, but the hornsent thought you did, and they gathered up shamans, calling them "saints" for their sacrifice.At any rate, Marika was fucking seething at what the hornsent did to her people. Presumably, the hornsent were ready to use the gate for whatever purpose, but Marika somehow uses it first. The Gate, having received "payment" from the sacrifices, reduces all the bodies to ash, which is what we see during the final boss fight.Now she's a god and creates the Golden Order. The hornsent are mad that some shaman wench used the gate, and now that she's sending a crusade against them, they hate her even more. She sends Messmer to lead the crusade, and he burns the horned fuckers to the ground, though he doesn't finish the job. I'd assume the army's made from people of the Lands Between, because there are still Erdtree worshipers in the Shadow Realm.Maybe.
>>681458683>why did they not use it themselves? Why did they not give themselves godly powers to defend themselves against mesmer?The tower people were part of the Golden Order before Marika betrayed them.>Also, how did Marika kill all those people in the story trailer? With what army?>This is before she even became a god. She had to kill a shit ton of people to reach the divine gate, to the point where the area is full of corpses.Those are her own people. She let them be killed to make the gate, in order to seduce whoever was actually supposed to go into the gate, in order to steal godhood in order to eventually enact her vengeance.
>>681458683Maybe they tried and the gods never answered. Maybe immense suffering is a prerequisite for contact. Maybe the gods are just racist towards hornsent.
>>681464048Marika made a deal with the fingers, we know that much.
>>681464136The golden order doesn't start for a looooooooong time after. The Giants war ending is when the GO starts.
Why do the Demi humans have an interest in the primeval current?
Nobody cares, really.
>>681464048The gate is literally made up of Hornsent corpses. They'd never do that to their own.
>>681464217>The Giants war ending is when the GO starts.No, the GO was founded whenever Marika had the GEQ killed and sealed DD. Which could have been as early as that scene in the trailer. It certainly wasn't just when she killed the giants, that was merely when the Erdtree became secure.
>>681464280The hornsent are a vile, evil race that will use their claims of superiority to commit unspeakable atrocities. They should not be dealt with logically.
>>681464025I think at best she was a name mentioned by him. Maybe he described her as a good fencer, since lady knights are something he's done a few times. But 'Relanna was a Carian Moon Knight and the best fencer and wielded a both moon and fire magic because she got awesome fire magic from her bf Messmer' is starting to sound off-kilter even for the Fatman.
>>681464351Age of the erdtree starts with giant war ending, death sealing is when GO starts.The hornsent stuff happens before both. Marika going back to purge them happens between those 2 eras listed at the start of my post.
>>681464529>Age of the erdtree starts with giant war ending, death sealing is when GO starts.It may be wrong to assume that the age of the Erdtree comes BEFORE the founding of the Golden Order.Also the purge of the Hornsent actually happens late in the timeline, because Messmer was around when Radahn was growing up and in fact was like a big brother to him. Plus the Carians were allied to the Golden Order and went with him to war. The purge could have been post-KotBK even.
>>681462458kek I thought the same thing, like seeing her character design in a Sonic OC templateI'm just waiting for Rellana's daughter, Ralli the Witch
>>681464725>It may be wrong to assume that the age of the Erdtree comes BEFORE the founding of the Golden Order.No it isn't. Erdtree is when they worshipped the tree itself before they switched over to the golden order it represented.Godfrey is the champion of the war of the giants.
I see alot of lore threads but i can never get one with a complete timeline that makes the story make sense.I have surface level understanding of the lore but I'll start off with what i think i know, anons correcting me can lead to a fuller picture.Shadow realm was part of the lands between (it adds up on the map, scadu atlus completes atlus plateau).Hornsent exist and make shamans their jar slaves because this brings them closer to sainthood (?)Marika asks for power to stop them, some aliens who fell in TLB probably in a meteor respond and make her a "god" with a heavy cost that probably involved discarding parts of her like miquella did, Then being reforged at the gates, I don't know how the ring itself comes into the picture.She Uses her god powers to pocket dimension the part of the map with the hornsent into a shadow realm.Has her son burn down the hornsent locked in that dimension.Now that part of the deal is fullfilled, she's a slave to the aliens greater will's, well, will. Probably why she can't contact messmer anymore.The greater will has her pick several elden lords through a process of selection to have several demigod offspring.Something causes her to rebel, probably a part of the deal with the Alien she's not ok with. Shatters the ring in defiance. Gets punished.Makes a process of selection of elden lord (you) Harder in hopes it results in someone strong enough to kill the alien .
>>681463687The two moons are probably based on Selena and Lilith from astrology, the "light" and "dark" moons.
>>681462787>Seriously what are demi humans? What are their lore?Presumably another race of beings that came from the crucible, same with the misbegotten, the omens, the bloodfiends, and the hornsent.Because of certain revelations in the DLC involving Marika and her ascension into godhood, the Golden Order that she founded heavily discriminates against crucible-born beings, leading to most of them regressing into savage creatures due to generations of heavy abuse.Alternatively, they could just be another race populating the world, with the moniker of demi-human given to them for their similarities with normal humans. The vulgar militia are seemingly non-humans too that exist in the world.
>>681464253They're primates, seems pretty straight forward. It's right there in the name. Primeval. Primates. My brain is huge.
>>681464529>>681464351Marika went after the Giants because their fire could burn the Erdtree. It seems more likely that she went after them after she had started the Erdtree, and while it's entirely possible she did it preemptively the Smithing Stones 8 the war against the Fire Giants happened at the birth of the Erdtree. The Erdtree and it's burials also replace the old fashioned death during Marika's reign, so one would assume that it's planting roughly coincides with the GEQ getting BTFO. So my assumption is GEQ BTFO > Erdtree planted > Giants Genocided
>>681464992None of this has anything to do with the conversation chatbot.
>>681464880TiMe Is CoNvOlUtEd
>>681464824>No it isn't. Erdtree is when they worshipped the tree itself before they switched over to the golden order it represented.Crucible worship is also ingrained in the early GO though, as in with Godfrey's Crucible knights, and in fact the Hornsent themselves.Regardless, the Erdtree already existed before the war with the giants. The end of that war doesn't signify the beginning of the GO, even if you say the Erdtree must have existed for the GO to exist, the end of the giant war marks nothing.
>>681464779>Ralli the WitchlolMore like Ralli the Bitch
>>681464992Age of Erdtree - tree growingGolden Order - death sealedGolden Order Fundamentalism - marika sealed in treeYou can place virtually all events into a timeline based on that small timeline. The particulars surrounding each event will be informed by some level of info informing you on when it happened.
>>681464880i think you got a good outline going so far
>>681465138>The end of that war doesn't signify the beginning of the GOI'm not the same anon this isn't something I claimed. >the end of the giant war marks nothing.>Hark, brave warriors. Hark, my lord Godfrey. We commend your deeds. Guidance hath delivered ye through each ordeal, to the place ye stand. Put the Giants to the sword, and confine the flame atop the mount. Let a new epoch begin. An epoch glistening with life. Brandish the Elden Ring, for the Age of the Erdtree!
>>681465029Be specific when talking about the Golden Order then. The GO is both Marika's configuration of the Elden Ring (after she removes the Rune of Death), a catch all term for Marika's empire, and a specific religious belief.
>>681465245I am. You are ranting about tangential info that doesn't apply.3 eras of the GO are >>681465153
>>681464779You know remember Lenne's Rise exists. You also remember that Japanese doesn't have a distinction between L and R, and so Lenne could also be written as Renne
>>681464880It's funny and sad that the main motivation for the tarnished is actually marika's cry for help.
>>681462458I agree but I also think all le ebic womyn in eldensoulsborne games are cringe
>>681464880Some minor shit>Marika likely isn't being controlled by the Greater Will, as it's fucked off a long time ago, according to Ymir(?). The Two Fingers no doubt communicated with it, but messages take THOUSANDS of years to travel back and forth, and it usually just makes its own judgments, not pass on the word of the Greater Will, going by the word of the Finger Reader at the Roundtable.>Because there's no communication, Marika picks her own Elden Lords. Godfrey won his by right, probably, but who the fuck knows why Marika chose Radagon, who was already married to Renalla, unless it was some power play over Caria or her lack of humanity just makes her do shit on her whims.
>>681460025>Being a god in Elden Ring doesn't mean you are all powerful. Miquella barely does any of the heavy lifting in his fight. Marika gets taken out by the Elden Beast, which is also a godMiquella/Marika are not genuine Gods like Elden Beast. they're cosplaying with his help.
>>681465648>but who the fuck knows why Marika chose RadagonHe is what she made in her mind as a perfect champion whereas she had to "mold" Horah into Godrey and you can tell he was always seething to let Godfrey back out of the lifestyle she molded him into.Radagon was just in that state always in her mind, he was her perfect champion idea and then the magic of the setting made him real and then she realized she didn't want that either since she could see the beast in him.
>>681464880>Greater Will sends the Finger Mother to the Lands Between on a comet and it spawns all life>Whether the Crucible existed before or after this is unclear>GW loses contact with the Finger Mother aat some point>New societies rise>One of these societies, the hornsent, oppresses a village of shamans and forces them into jars in what seems to be a series of divine experiments>Unclear exactly what transpires next, but Marika, one of the shamans, survives the experiments and makes a pact with... something, presumably the Finger Mother... at the divine gate and ascends to godhood>Again, it's vague what exactly happens, but Marika founds the Golden Order and sends her son Messmer on a crusade to purge the Shadow Lands of hornsent>The SLs are eventually sealed off with Messmer and his army inside>Centuries or millennia go by and Marika has her demigod children through Godfrey, Renalla, and RadagonThis part is extremely unclear and subject to much lorefagging, but it's generally agreed upon that Ranni broke the Elden Ring (a cosmic macguffin) by stealing a part of it called the "rune of Destined Death". It has something to do with the reincarnation process of the Golden Order, where people were buried at the foot of the Erdtree and reborn somehow.Godwyn is killed by assassins wielding weapons infused with the rune of Destined Death, Marika/Radagon disappears into the Erdtree to do something with the Elden Ring, and the Shattering begins. An unknown amount of time later, something (presumably the Finger Mother) revives certain individuals called Tarnished and sends them on a mission to repair the Elden Ring.
>>681465790You think the elden beast is an actual god and not just some magical space rock given form? wew lad.
Enir-illim is a tower of babel type building that the hornsent succeeded in building. They were supposed to use marikas people as sacrifices to make a god but marika instead was able to somehow trick them into making her the god.
>>681465875It's a God in this story.
>>681465981The story is about how none of these things are actually gods anon. You never made it past the surface level of the narrative.
>gween marigga :----DDDDDDD
>>681465864Ranni broke the Elden Ring? If I recall, she stole the Rune of Death from Maliketh, not from the Elden Ring directly, and used it to kill herself and Godwyn. Marika then goes to break the Elden Ring, which is what leads to the Shattering.
>>681464880>She Uses her god powers to pocket dimension the part of the map with the hornsent into a shadow realm.>Has her son burn down the hornsent locked in that dimension.>Now that part of the deal is fullfilled, she's a slave to the aliens greater will's, well, will. Probably why she can't contact messmer anymore.No, that's all bullshit. The Hornsent purge happened much later.In reality Marika stole Godhood and the Fingers, like always, pretended that it was divine mandate all along.>Something causes her to rebel, probably a part of the deal with the Alien she's not ok with.From the start she intended to shatter the Elden Ring.This is the real shit at the core of Marika. It's noted that Miquella realized "that his bloodline was tainted. His roots mired in madness."Madness in Elden Ring is characterized by despair, and a vengeance that lashes out at the whole world. For example when you summon Hornsent to kill Messmer, afterwards "his blade becomes lost to madness", and he directs his vengeance at everything. That is Marika. This was the prayer, wish, and confession referenced in the Golden Braid item - Marika wanted to destroy the Hornsent and burn down their world, just like they did to her. But then she stole Godhood, and created her own Order - And along with it created a family, and bore the adoration of the people she ruled.But in time her reign became a burden, and then a curse, her responsibilities weighing on her. When she finally sent Messmer to purge the Hornsent, she sealed him away there because she was afraid of what he represented, of an all-consuming revenge that leaves nothing but ash in it's wake. When Godwyn died, that was the last straw, and she went forward with shattering the Ring in order to destroy the world.Ever wonder why Godfrey stands defending the Erdtree, instead of entering himself to challenge Radagon? It's because Marika's will is for him to kill you, to stop anyone from becoming Elden Lord.Gideon was right.
>>681464880Random speculation on my part>Hornsent exist and make shamans their jar slaves because this brings them closer to sainthood (?)Possibly also to do with constructing Enir-Ilim and the divine gate, which are all made out of bodies>Marika asks for power to stop them, some aliens who fell in TLB probably in a meteor respond and make her a "god" with a heavy cost that probably involved discarding parts of her like miquella did, Then being reforged at the gates, I don't know how the ring itself comes into the picture.She possibly discarded Radagon into a separate being at this point (re-merge later), similar to Dickella and St. Trina>The greater will has her pick several elden lords through a process of selection to have several demigod offspring.GW fucked off a long time ago. It's the 2Finggas that are giving her orders. >Something causes her to rebel, probably a part of the deal with the Alien she's not ok with. Shatters the ring in defiance. Gets punished.Marika's rebellion happens after she declares her intention to search the depths of the golden order. Seems like in the process of investigating it and her godhood she learned the truth about the finggas and the GW>Makes a process of selection of elden lord (you) Harder in hopes it results in someone strong enough to kill the alien .You're a tool laying the ground work for Godfrey's return, hence why her Grace points towards you during the cutscene. You weren't meant to face the Elden Beast. You simply flip the script at the last moment and fucking him up, then her, and become Elden Lord yourself, replace her with her daughter, or just burn the whole thing to the ground.
>>681466116Yeah my bad. Ranni steals Destined Death and them Marika goes and breaks the Elden Ring.
>>681465864>>Greater Will sends the Finger Mother I thought it was elden beast lands there first then somehow births finger mother (item descriptions say metyr is the daughter of another cosmic being) then has her transmit the greater will.Making finger mother native to tlb
>>681466049>demi-hooman gween marigga
>>681466038uhh no you just don't really seem to grasp the extremely simple concept that if something is as a god, it's a god
>>681466214Nah Metyr is first, the other 11 meteors fall some time after.
Insider here.Miyazaki wrote the story based on GRRM writings.But he's doing it the same way when he's reading english books when he's a child.He don't understand most of it and is just piecing information together.Then he wrote the story again in his own words.That's why there's so many contradictions and inconsistency.
>>681466214It was the first shooting star to fall upon the lands between. The Elden Beast is also said to have come down on a comet so it must have come down some time after.
>>681466214>>681466324In theory Metyr could be a product of the Elden Beast. They do share some characteristics, particularly the small unblinking "eye" at the end of a long stalk, and their overall body shape. And if she was, she could still be called a daughter of the Greater Will.
>>681466514No she couldn't. She predates the elden beast.
Just so we're on the same page greater will is just elden beasts will right
>>681466367Insider here. Miyazaki and GRRM had coke fueled writing sessions where they'd get so high they could barely think and would fuck each other in ass.
>>681466656No.The final black pill is that there is no greater will to begin with. Everyone is making shit up
>>681466656No. During the beast's reign it wanted everyone to believe everything it was doing was part of the GW though.In its defense everyone says everything they do is what the GW wants so the beast isn't unique in that.
>>681466656The Elden Beast is an agent or a manifestation of the Greater Will. The Outer Gods have no true physical form.
>>681466810This isn't true since the beast fucked off long before it existed. It is just claiming it is the GW agent when it is its own agent.
>>681462787Demi humans are the missing link between beast men and non-numen humans.
>>681466616It's stated that Metyr arrived aboard the first shooting star to fall on the Lands Between. That doesn't mean that the Elden Beast arrived aboard a different comet, later.In fact pay attention to the wording of that description closely.>The mother of all Two Fingers and Fingercreepers was in turn a magnificently gleaming daughter of the Greater Will, and the first shooting star to fall upon the Lands Between.Now you can certainly read that to say that Metyr was a daughter of the Greater Will, and that she was the first star to fall on the Lands Between.BUT, you can ALSO read it to say that she was a daughter of the Greater Will, AND a daughter of the first star that fell upon the Lands Between. That is, she's a daughter of the Elden Beast.Complicating this is the fact that in Metyr's questline, he says that all living things are "children of the Greater Will". So in that context, saying that she's a daughter of the Greater Will actually means nothing more than if you were to say that Dung Eater is a son of the Greater Will. It may mean the same thing.This is the kind of linguistic fuckery lawyers and fantasy fiction authors base upon.
>>681466656The Greater Will is GRRM. He finished his final edition of the Elden Ring lore bible, gave it to Miyazaki, and then fucked off and let it all up to Miyazaki. In the same way the Greater Will created life, and then fucked off leaving everyone to their own devices.
>>681466943I assume that the Elden Beast and Metyr are like rogue agents or stray creations of the Golden Will. Just powerful beings sent to the Lands Between and then abandoned by their creator.
>>681467090>That doesn't mean that the Elden Beast arrived aboard a different comet, later.Yes it does. Metyr is first. That means any other meteor ayyy is after.Learn how words works.
>>681467090This level of semantics really requires the moonrunes version of the item.
>>681467198This desu. Does anyone have screencaps of the moonrune Metyr Remembrance?
Understanding nothing of the lore that the DLC attempted to explain to me can someone explain what in it said that gate was the key to Godhood, I swear I read most of the item descriptions too
>>681467193But I just explained how the words may mean just the opposite of what you think they mean.That is in fact how words work. If they worked any better than that, do you think the world would be so fucked up? No, it's a game of confusion and misdirection.
>>681467313The gate is made from melded together shamans and hornsent created it through their ancient rutuals. It was neant for them but marika somehow stole it and used it first then genocided them
>>681467280It says the same thing as the english one, just in japanese. >>681467358You are wrong. The meteors broke up in the primeval current when they left. The "oneness" they had was splintered before they reached the lands between and Metyr is the first one.
>>681467484>It says the same thing as the english one, just in japaneseA lot of things tend to get lost in translation.
Are we sure the gate was there to begin with and it wasn't made in a ritual like manner by Marika after the betrayal, hence why the whole thing looks bloody in the trailer?
Metyr us the daughter if something.If not elden beast, then what?>Inb4 greater willNo, greater will is a concept. If we're going to concede it has any physical manifestation then it would be elden beast, but metyr being elden beasts daughter doesn't add up on the timeline
>>681467574They do not. Only people not fluent in english think this.
>>681465875This. GW is the only God god. Elden Beast and Metyr and the other space rock creatures like Astel are more akin to angels the GW sent down to make laws and punish people before it fucked off for good.
>>681467484>It says the same thing as the english one, just in japaneseCan you link it?
>>681467667You can.
>>681467625>They do not. Only people not fluent in english think this.Good old Gwyn's Firstborn, famous for loosing the Annals of History.
>>681467625Jap:>The Royal Carian AcademyEnglish translation:>ahhh yes the Raya Lucarian Academy
>>681467280>>681467574>最初の流星であったpretty clear-cut from what i can see
>>681467729>>681467731>esls prove the pointjej
>>681467621She could still be elden beasts daughter but just landed first.Think radditz landing before vegeta and nappa
>>681467484>You are wrong. The meteors broke up in the primeval current when they left. The "oneness" they had was splintered before they reached the lands between and Metyr is the first one.You just made that up though.
>>681467429So does it auto-make you obtain the elden ring or just makes you the best candidate? Are all Empyreans supposed to use it?
>>681464907>vulgar militiathey're literally just guys under 5'9 and apparently every hated them so much for being short they formed their own band called the vulgar militiamenthe demi humans don't seem all that related to the crucible.
>>681467816No she couldn't. >>681467834No he didn't. >Legendary sorcery devised by Lusat, primeval sorcerers. >Fires twelve dark shooting stars that pursue the target. This sorcery can be cast while in motion. Charging increases potency.>When Lusat glimpsed into the primeval current, he beheld the final moments of a great star cluster, and upon seeing it, he too was broken.
>>681467797Link the whole text.
>>681467917>No she Couldn't 1. Why not2. Answer this >>681467621
>Metyr produces Fingers that are like angels of the greater will>The Elden Beast is the elden ring, the governance power of the Greater WillIt makes sense to me. Elden Beast is the system, Metyr is the chief of staff, fingers are the staff.
>>681466951wait so human evolution in elden ring is from wolves to beastmen to demi human to humans?I don't know if I believe that
>>681467912They're like 3 foot tall miniature humans, and not in the way that real life pygmies and dwarves are. Unless this is another case of From's humans having exaggeratedly strange proportions and the vulgar militia are just meant to be human manlets.
>>681467917>Legendary sorcery devised by Azur, primeval sorcerer.>Fires a tremendous comet in a torrent akin to the distant starry expanse, the place said to be the origin of glintstone.Hold to continue releasing the sorcery's power.>When Azur glimpsed into the primeval current, he saw darkness. He was left both bewitched and fearful of the abyss.>This legendary talisman is a treasure of Nokstella, the Eternal City.>Increases memory slots.>This talisman represents the lost black moon.The moon of Nokstella was the guide of countless stars.>>681467996>daughter of the Greater WillIt would say elden beast if she was the daughter of the elden beast.
>>681467917Where's the connection between that spell and Metyr/the Elden Beast? We're missing 10 other stars in that case, and even the description doesn't link the stars themselves to the star cluster breaking directly.
Oh I also want to ask where did the ants dropping Numen runes theory that Malika was an ant go
>>681468046He's talking out of his ass. Evolution probably doesn't exist in the world of Elden Ring. Sort of like real life heh.
>>681468137>>681467917>>681468132
>>681468046They're called "demi-human" and in at least one instance they have a Farum Azula beast man with them. They're monkey like but the stronger ones are more wolf like.They seem to be their own race, unlike Misbegotten which sound like unironic birth defects like omen.
>>681467731It's レアルカリア in Japanese, nothing "royal" about it. How do these Sen's Fortress-tier rumors even happen anymore when anyone can trivially switch the game language to check?
>>681468132>It would say elden beast if she was the daughter of the elden beast.It may say just that.Again the context here is how Ymir says everyone is a child of the Greater Will. That innately creates confusion regarding the nature of Metyr when described later.
>>681467917>>681468132How deep does the fucking rabbit hole go?!
>>681458683Because not anyone can use it. You need to have the right stuff under specific circumstances. Just think of the ridiculous 4D plan miquella had to do just to get it to work.
>>681468110when will manlets learn?
>>681468267>Zoomer>check anythingcome on man.
>>681468216You linked back to a post I was responding to and another one that doesn't answer the question. I see what you want to believe but not why I should believe it too.
>>681467797>>681467090It's the same. Really the Oxford comma should give away the fact that they are separate clauses. Daughter of the Greater Will. First meteor. >>681467806There's no need to upset.
>>681468336That is the unironic bottom of the rabbit hole. Deepest lore is everything is just astrophysics the people in the game don't understand so they fill it with what they think happens. AND the rocks in space are magic so it gets out of hand quickly.
>>681468267>レアルカリア "Real" is an archaic term for royal. The pronunciation is Rayalu Caria which the english translators spelled as Raya Lucaria. It could also be a reference to "Rayalu" which is an old Hindu term for king.
>>681468443Raya (queen) lu (joinder) Caria
>>681466616No she doesn't. The elden beast arriving is practically a version of the big bang. Before then there was nothing there and everything was contained in one great whole. Elden beast arriving shattered this and began the whole process. Realistically to view it after everything was formed the finger mother came after so she could be the communication relay between the newly formed place and the GW.
>>681468267The original japanese "魔術学院レアルカリア" should be translated to "Magic Academy of Real Caria" ("real" as Spanish, like Real Madrid), meaning "Royal Caria Academy" in English.Actually, the Japanese word for Real Madrid is "レアルマドリード". The "レアル" part is the same here.
>>681468443>"Real" is an archaic term for royal.No it's not. you're thinking regal
>>681468578>No she doesn't.>first meteor to land in the lands betweenStop replying with your headcanon please.
>>681468209I agree, evolution is not a well defined concept there and even if it is it's clearly not in the 4 billion years grandpa fish kind of evolution>>681468234>in at least one instance they have a Farum Azula beast man with them.really? I ne'er seen em togetherit's also worth noting they're a lot angrier at night>unlike Misbegotten which sound like unironic birth defects like omenoh shit are they like omen?wait that's actually pretty interesting I wonder how they're related to omens. I thought they were their own tribe like hornsent. I wonder how they got into the capital.
>>681466124Marika was literally pitting Godfrey against you in a last gambit to get the best of the battle royale. In his cutscene your respective graces point at eachother.
>>681468586Real is spanish for royal.
>>681468580>e original japanese "魔術学院レアルカリア" should be translated to "Magic Academy of Real Caria" ("real" as Spanish, like Real Madrid), meaning "Royal Caria Academy" in English.>Actually, the Japanese word for Real Madrid is "レアルマドリード". The "レアル" part is the same here.this is blatantly wrong, you don't just translate things to Ls because you feel like it, you don't just randomly put the game in spanish language because you feel like it.
>>681468267>nothing "royal" about it.The argument is that it's Real, as in the Spanish Royal, like Real Madrid (レアル・マドリード). Not 100% sure I buy it, but I could see GRRM deciding to call the Academy that.
>>681468419>It's the same.Can you post the whole thing? Commas are an easy author's trick to deceive the reader into certain lines of thought. For example if it was intended to be completely clear, it would have gone something like>Metyr was the first star to fall to the lands between, a gleaming daughter of the Greater Will and in turn the mother of all Two Fingers and Fingercreepers.In that case there can be no other interpretations. But in the version they chose, there are other ways to construe the meaning of the sentence.
So elden beast and finger mother both exist and serve some version of the greater will. What dies that mean exactly? I think finger mother knows she's abandonned and just retransmits old stuff?What about elden beast? What was his master plan?Are you hey at odds with each other or working together?
>>681468646yeah, spanish, not archaic. the game isn't randomly slipping into spanishyou're not winning an argument, but since you need a father's guidance, let's be clear about something. if you win an argument by intellectual dishonesty, you really lost.
>>681467917>>681468132So the dark moon is what we would call nemesis the primeval current is the oort cloud and when it zoomed thru space it passed through that cloud and broke up a big magic meteor into smaller chunks and the followed it to the lands between and made landfall?Am I getting that right?
>>681468443>>681468580Wrong, because Caria is カーリア. What's even the point in going to such lengths to make shit up?
>>681468676>Not 100% sure I buy it, but I could see GRRM deciding to call the Academy that.GRRM had no hand in writing specifics like that in this game. It has been stated and restated that the things taken from him were basically the names of the main "God" characters.Lol.
>>681468628Misbegotten are crucible touched people. Hornsent are less crucible touched people, far far less.Omen are some sort of curse implied to be a result of the Hornsent and Formless Mother, who is very present in the realm of shadow.
>>681468728Yessir
>>681468770>レアルカリアI want you to sound this word out the way a japanese person would.
>>681468638Why would Godfrey's Grace point at (you) instead of into the tree? He could have already entered and become Elden Lord again.
>>681468708The game randomly slips into latin, french, and japanese. Why is "real" used in this context this suddenly a stretch for you?
>>681468771He probably did name all the main places though. As in if he created Rennala he must have also created the place she ruled, at least in terms of it's name and basic concept.
>>681468958Because there's no "real". you don't translate japanese like that. the japanese reading sounds like "raya rukaria"
>>681468895Because Marika is a bitch and wants you to kill eachother so the strongest one can enter the tree for the best chance to kill god.
>>681468995>He probably did name all the main places though.I doubt it as statements to the contrary have been made.>As in if he created Rennala he must have also created the place she ruled, at least in terms of it's name and basic concept.Uh, no? Anything and everything could have been changed. Again, basically the only things they took from his writing were names. This has been stated directly by game producers.Do you understand that his involvement was an advertisement? He didn't actually write anything? People don't seem clear on this
>>681469018He is probably someone that thinks he knows more japanese than he does.He does these shit tests like this all the time and gets blown out.
>>681468885There's no ambiguity to it. If it were supposed to be レアルカーリア then it would be. All instances of Caria are spelled カーリア while all instances of Raya Lucaria are レアルカリア. They're different words.
>>681468682Anon posted the picture here >>681467797If you mean the English,>Remembrance of Metyr, the Mother of Fingers, hewn into the Scadutree. The power of its namesake can be unlocked by the Finger Reader. Alternatively, it can be used to gain a great bounty of runes. The mother of all Two Fingers and Fingercreepers was in turn a magnificently gleaming daughter of the Greater Will, and the first shooting star to fall upon the Lands Between.Regardless, any time we go full semantics of item descriptions, it's imperative we double check against the Japanese version because there have been plenty of fuck ups in the past. Gwyn's Firstborn is always my go to example, because there was a bunch of lore theories about what exactly the Annals of History were and why it was so important. And then it was revealed that it was mistranslated, and it should have said the Firstborn was lost to the annals of history (a correct translation of the original Japanese).Elden Ring is particularly tricky, because all the plot, dialogue script and item description would be written in Japanese by Miyzaki and his team, but the original background lore was written in English by GRRM. And of course they only do an English recording for the dialogue, Japanese players get JP subs (which I assume are just the original script, the same way Sekiro's subs are the English script and not an exact translation of the JP dialogue). Long story short, there's a lot of room for fuck ups.
>>681469018Yeah no shit there's no "real". Japanese doesn't have "L"s in it's vocabulary. The intent is still pretty clear.
>>681458683Who said they didn'tmarika kills something and takes its great rune before transcendingdidn't Previews listed the Hornsent Grandam as an Empyrean
>>681469080>He didn't actually write anything
>>681469131>but the original background lore was written in English by GRRM.which has, once again, nothing at all to do with the final producthe did not deliver a book here- he gave them a couple of pageshis involvement was an advertisement. he cannot produce written text despite it being his job.
>>681469131You never need the japanese for the english. Ever. Every time someone implies you do that person ends up gaslighting like we are seeing right now.The english translation is accurate, it only confuses people not fluent in english. Talking about the japanese is always gaslighting and designed to eat up post count wasting posts not advancing discussion. It is literal mudposting clogging the thread with useless or downright wrong information.
>>681467917>>681468132>>681468728>The circular design at the top represents the Greater Will and its lightless abyss, imparting increased intelligence and arcane to the wearer.If the Greater Will is the lightless abyss, doesn't that mean it's the primeval current and in turn the dark moon, which itself is represented by a black hole in Ranni's ending? Is this not why Thops Barrier works on all sorceries AND incantations, because they're all just the same power?Is there anything that ISN'T actually the Greater Will? How many layers of puppeteering are we on exactly?
>>681469080>I doubt it as statements to the contrary have been made.What specifically says he didn't write the names for any places?
>>681468995>if he created Rennala he must have also created the place she ruled, at least in terms of it's name and basic conceptThis. What were probably seeing here is a threefold translation error from GRMM's writing to Japanese to english again. This would honestly explain a lot.
>>681469131>If you mean the English,I meant the Japanese's full text. Reprinting the moonrunes themselves into an online keyboard is a pain in the ass.
>>681469290>Aseo wears tree surcoat Based
>>681469367LMFAO>This.Logically invalid supposition so no, not "this"GRRM'S LORE DOES NOT HAVE ANYTHING TO DO WITH THE STORY IN THE FINAL GAME.
>>681469237NTA but the english translation removes a lot of context/emotional nuance from what was said in the original in many cases.
>>681469290I would say equating the GW with the black hole is a pretty good comparison. >lightless abyssthat is a compact way of saying that even light can't escape the gravity of a black hole. That would mean that the GW returns in ranni's ending though.>>681469501No it doesn't.
>>681468689Bump, i want to get this.
>>681469520>>lightless abyss>that is a compact way of saying that even light can't escape the gravity of a black hole.No it's not. It simply says lightless abyss.You niggas need to understand when you are "Deducing" and when you are "Supposing"
>>681469531There's nothing to "get". These games do not have explicable lore from start to finish and trying to conjure it up results in what you see people doing now, making shit up to appease themselves.here's my headcanon: fingers do something to intelligent life on the planet to make them ready to receive magic. there ya go.
>>681469290>Is this not why Thops Barrier works on all sorceries AND incantationsYeah. All the magic in the setting is sourced from the same prima facia glintstone that powers all the magic. Read up on all the glintstone stuff you can find it'll point you to people using their own mind or will to create magic using the glintstone as a focus. The meteors that crashed down are gigantic rocks of that glintstone instead of small fist sized chunks. >>681469597A black hole is a lightless abyss.
>>681469654No it's not. black holes have a ring of light around them. But that's not the point. you are supposing something saying a lightless abyss means it's a black hole. that doesn't say or mean that. It simply says lightless abyss.Stop SUPPOSING.
>>681469476Look, in addition to the names he also wrote a bunch of the pre-shattering backstory and how characters relate to each other. He didn't just send in a single page with like 30 G R M names on it and From made everything from that.It's everything post-shattering that's all From, which is why the timeline immediately turns into absolute vagueness at that point. As in it seems that the shattering war was both a thousand years ago and last week at the same time.
>>681469597>another esl or middle school intelligence anonlol
>>681469290the GW is just an antropomorphized concept. It's space.A daughter of the GW is something that comes from the GW, comes from space. This goes for how other Outer Gods work, too.
>>681462817Sounds like she seduced a hornsent and maybe that's why messmer is a snakeman
>>681469759>Look, in addition to the names he also wrote a bunch of the pre-shattering backstory and how characters relate to each other.Which was discarded, and only the names were used.
>>681469709>you are supposing something saying a lightless abyss means it's a black hole.Checks out. >>681469829Bingo.
>>681469829>the GW is just an antropomorphized concept. It's space.Not true whatsoever. Is an outer god and appears to be one related to order in some way, or is at least at odds with chaos.
>>681469709>No it's not. black holes have a ring of light around them.Uh yeah that sounds about right.
>>681469709Lightless (black) abyss (hole)How smoothbrained are you?>>681469932You don't know what outer god means>inner order>outer order>golden order totality
>>681469859Give me your sources.
You don't even know what the elden beast or finger mother are or what their end goals and you pretend to know what their head honcho is.If anyone in ER lived to see a physical form of GW they wouldn't stay sane enough to tell the tale.Other than the fact that it's not from the TLB, We know exactly nothing about it.
>>681469520>No it doesn't.Yes it does, mongoloid. A subpar translation completely changes the dynamic of the DLC's final boss. You better be thankful for this autism:English translation:>Remembrance of Radahn, consort of Miquella, hewn into the Scadutree.>In their childhood, Miquella saw in Radahn a lord. His strength, and his kindness, that stood in stark contrast with their afflicted selves.>And so Miquella made his heartfelt wish. That Radahn would one day be his king consort.Original Japanese translation ( direct translation into english obviously):>A memory of Radahn, Miquella’s king, hewn into the Scadutree.>When very young, Miquella saw in Radahn a king: saw strength - so unlike their frail selves - and, too, saw kindness.>And so, Miquella’s innocent request: “Be my king, please”(“Elden Lord”/“Lord” is always “King” (王) in the Japanese text, and I’m mostly using “King” in this post: “lord” has awkward implications.)Breaking it down:>影樹に刻まれた ミケラの王、ラダーンの追憶A memory of Radahn, Miquella’s king, hewn into the Scadutree.“Miquella’s king”. Miquella always phrases Radahn’s role this way: “my king,” “my promised king,” etc. In-setting, the characters probably do read this as a subordinate role - hence the translation “consort” - but in modern Japanese, the expected meaning is the same as in English: “the king whom Miquella serves.”The translators kept using “consort” to make absolutely certain everyone knows they’re married, but it was overkill to use it every time: there’s a reason Radahn’s being referred to this way. Go back and count how many times Godfrey or Radagon is referred to as “Marika’s lord.”The term for “Remembrance” is “tsuioku” (追憶), “a memory”. This is explicitly Miquella’s memory. The description of Radahn as “kind” isn’t coming from the omniscient narrator: it’s what toddler-Miquella saw, firmly in the past tense.Cont.
>>681470063>You don't even know what the elden beast or finger mother areMeteors >>681470064lol
>finally beat the DLC>decide to explore the map>go somewhere randomly>find a freaking invisible bridge by luckAnd this is why From is in its own class
>>681469237Every time I see this I assume it's some loretists salty because they don't understand any moonspeak, and have to tap out. >Talking about the japanese is always gaslighting and designed to eat up post count wasting posts not advancing discussion.The moonrunes only ever come up when people start constructing their arguments based on specific interpretations of words. Double checking that against the original Japanese typically clears up ambiguity. It also helps check for mistakes. It can only be beneficial if done in good faith, and the only reason people would be upset about this is because their arguments get demolished by something they don't understand. But if they were arguing in good faith in the first place, the would happily accept the dismissal of their argument in favor of truth.That, or bringing up moonrunes is designed to troll loretists. Which is always hilarious. Easy to figure out too, if you know even a bit of moonspeak.
>>681470064>>681469520>幼き日、ミケラはラダーンに王を見たWhen very young, Miquella saw in Radahn a king:>脆弱な自分たちにはない、強さをsaw strength - so unlike their frail selves ->そして優しさをand, too, saw kindness.That’s not a complete or grammatical sentence, and the linebreaks create the cadence of someone struggling to find words. It feels like the thought got constructed backwards, potentially because Miquella could remember the word “king,” but had trouble with “strength” and “kindness”.(Which makes sense both thematically and in terms of how hard those words are to say: kindness = “yasashisa”, strength = “tsuyosa”, king = “oh”.)>だからミケラは純真に願ったAnd so, Miquella’s innocent request:>私の王に、なってください“Be my king, please”The “innocently” is “junshin ni” (純真に), which carries a strong implication of naivety that “heartfelt” does not.The comma in the middle of the quote isn’t grammatical, but rather an indicator of hesitation. Miquella said this aloud to Radahn while too young to understand what it meant. Maybe even what “king” meant, aside from “dad”.And it’s not phrased as a question; given Miquella’s status as an Empyrean, it could even be interpreted as an order. And if this happened in front of witnesses, and if Radahn - possibly already an ambitious adult - said “sure, when you’re grown up”…?tl;dr Miquella did nothing wrong and you are an even bigger faggot than he is
>>681470176Thats also why it always fails. Anons do a good job implying only esls don't get the english. >>681470235lol
>>681470098>>681470243>lolI accept you concession.
>>681470292You do you bad faith poster.
>>681470064The issue here is that consort isn't necessarily a sexual relationship like people have taken it to be.Let me put it another way. If we were to say that Radahn is Miquella's "king", would that not also imply that Miquella is the "queen"? That's a can of worms all on it's own. Never mind GEQ implications.To your talk about the subordinate role, the term "king whom Miquella serves" is also strange, because we assume the God to hold the dominant role in the relationship, not a subservient one.
>>681470064>“Elden Lord”/“Lord” is always “King” (王) in the Japanese text,This is interesting because Morgott's dialogue original had him proclaim himself as King Morgott, Elden Lord, but as was change to King Morgott, last of all kings for the final version. So I wonder if Miyazaki still considers there to be a distinction between to the two, despite using 王 for all the text.
Metyr makes sense enough to me.She's an alien who was abandoned in the TLB and is just coping in any way she can, convincing herself she's actually getting messages from her mom who totally didn't forget about her there. A victim of circumstances more than anything.It's elden beast and how he fits into the picture is what I don't get it, what's his fucking problem
>>681470847Same type of ayyy being as Metyr but made to be a being of Order incarnate. Since it is pure Order it acts like it with an iron grip and will not relinquish its position willingly. In it's mind it is doing the right thing because it is Order and Order is good so it is good. It can't comprehend that people don't want to live in it's version of autistic Order and can't understand why people keep questioning its faith or the rules within that faith. They should want it because Order is good and it is Order.
>>681470847>what's his fucking problemHe lives inside Marika and he doesn't want us putting our dick in his house.
>>681471050Elden Beast gives no fucks. The Dragons ordered it too.
>>681467621>>681469829>>681469867>>681469976>hurr durr greater will is a concept kek all these loretards>elden stars>elden remembrance>remembrance of natural born>remembrance of mother of fingers>nox monk set
Is anyone else pissed off that fingercreepers got lumped into the fingers proper? I always thought they were a grafting/magic appropriation homunculus. They have fingernails but none of the other fingers proper do. Where tf do they get the their rings? I've warmed up to the whole Radahn thing but the fingercreeper reveal pisses me the fuck off
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=sMBzBmC6Pskwhere are the good funny fan animations of elden ring
>>681471293No argument. Anons' argument can't really be argued with. The ayyys are meteors, the GW is a black hole. You are arguing from the POV of a person in universe that doesn't know what we the players in the real world know. It is very easy to see that all these concepts are just taken from celestial phenomena they don't understand.But we, in the real world, do understand. The parallels to things in our reality are everywhere like the anons have shown. Anon could have left his lore entries about the spells and left it there, but he linked a specific comet we know about in our world that does the same exact thing as the dark moon travelling thru the primeval current.It is what is really going on behind the scenes. The rocks are fucking magic anon.
>>681471406No it tracks with what the base game already shows.>3 fingers made by an entire race kvetching in unison creating it>Ymir is just 1 guy trying to do the same so his fingers come out like animals by comparisonIt tracks.
>>681458683Anon, the Tower is literally two giant fingers that connect directly with the greater will. That is why Miquella gets Holy attunement
>>681471476>the fucking LautranteI miss that nigga. He was more right than he ever could have known.
>>681471406It's interesting enough. I always assumed they were an Astrologer/Carian thing given that they show up in places associated with these groups (Mountaintops, Carian Manor, Liurnia Divine Tower, and outside the Volcano Manor (Rykard being a Carian)). But now with the Metyr thing, it seems more likely they are either servants of the Fingers, or a byproduct of their influence. The infestation of fingers at Carian Manor and the Liurnia Divine Tower becomes a symbol of the grip that the Fingers have over Ranni.
>>681469831Nah, Messmer is cursed like Miquella and Malenia. As a matter of fact, going off of naming conventions, Messmer is Marika and Radagon's first child.Marika's betrayal can either be that she somehow rose to a position where she was not meant to be jarred and then turned on the Hornsent, or her rebelling against the Hornsent is considered a betrayal because she overthrew the order of that society. Like how a US citizen who felt oppressed by the US would be considered a traitor if they revolted. Marika was born into a role and defied it. The "Seduction" bit can be seen as literal or that by convincing people to take her side she "seduced" them. The Monologue is from the perspective of a butthurt hornsent.
>>681471513>has a daughter>has feelings (ire invoked)>is at least a lord with Elden Beast as its vassal>sends meteors on its own volition>muh headcanon with no sourcesI accept your concession
What’s the lore behind the lampreys?
>>681472029>The "Seduction" bit can be seen as literal or that by convincing people to take her side she "seduced" them. The Monologue is from the perspective of a butthurt hornsent.No, she literally fucked her way to the top. The Ranah Dancer's outfit, if altered, is almost 1-1 to Marika's robes.
>>681462458There's a third sister we never seeIt's called the three sisters for a reason
>>681465864Its unclear if Marika was ever Jarred. It would explain her and Radagon being the same person, but Miquella and Trina are the same person and they were never jarred.Ranni did not shatter the ring, Marika did. Ranni mindbroke Marika by killing Godwyn which caused the shattering.Marika's story seems to be a doomed woman trying to escape her fate as sacrifice and failing miserably. She lost her village and loved ones, then had it all happen again with her children being mostly mutant freaks and the Golden Boy getting soul fucked.
>>681472301Probably a result of humans getting really really into the Fingers.
>>681472240>metaphor>it is said>unclear relationship>unclear intent
>>681472474>Miquella and Trina are the same person and they were never jarred.The Erdtree - IE the method of birth for all people in the Lands Between - Is like one gigantic jar.
>>681472474>Ranni mindbroke Marika by killing GodwynI still don't buy this. There's too much stuff about Marika's association with the Black Knives, seeking a godslaying weapon, and her betrayal of Malekith for me to believe the 'she was a good girl didindu nuffin' line.
>>681469969Ia Ia?
>>681472634See >>681466124She wanted it from the start but grew torn about it.
>>681472658Lightless Abyss.
>>681469709Black holes do not radiate light, but they may emit some radiation.Accretion disk is just accretion disk, tidal forces compress external matter that falls into it.Without it you wouldn't notice any black hole because they bend space by nature.
>>681465864>Greater Will sends the Finger Mother to the Lands Between on a comet and it spawns all lifeholy kek >hyetta dialog>generally agreed upon that Ranni broke the Elden Ringhow the fuck do you even make this statement ROFL. Marika established the Golden Order without the Rune of Death. This granted them immortality >An unknown amount of time later, something (presumably the Finger Mother) revives certain individuals called Tarnished and sends them on a mission to repair the Elden Ring.Marika removes the grace of Godfrey and his people, send them to the Badlands, so they could live and die, become stronger, return to complete her plan of killing Elden Beast
What’s the lore behind bloodfiends?
>>681472550>headcanon with no sources keep trying, lil bud. You'll get it someday
>>681472832Hornsent genocided them to the point that their species collectively broke and started worshipping the Formless Mother.
>>681472832People cursed by the formless Mother, with an older curse than the Omen. As you can see they exhibit many traits of omen such as black skin and ogre like bodies.
>>681472446Black clothing? Really?Marika's dress is very different is design, and jewelry.
Ashen remains in which spirits yet dwell. Use to summon the spirits of three man-flies. Two of the man-flies attack foes from the air, while the third spits poison from the rear. Afflicted hornsent eventually metamorphosed into a fly-like form. It was believed that the moment the transformation took place, they were relieved from their suffering.A talisman depicting a soul taken by sickness. When certain ailments are triggered, this talisman grants resistance to the same ailment. When the weak were infected with the dreaded fly sickness, they perished well before the metamorphosis could take hold. Oddly, those who cared for the infected and made certain they were given a proper burial were never afflicted themselves.A species of fungus known for its deathly sweet stench. Material used for crafting items. Found by hunting man-flies. Cultivated using the flesh and blood of man-flies, it can serve as pot innards.
>>681472832>Long ago, a subjugated tribe discovered a twisted deity amongst the ravages of war, and they were transformed into bloodfiends. The mother of truth was their savior.
>>681473016Tanith fucked her way to the top too.
>>681473016Hers is more extravagant, but it's the same in essence. It's the kind of thing you might see an NPC actually wear vs wear in concept art.Anyway the connection is obvious. She seduced her way to the top. The Hornsent's hood even notes that they practice asceticism and are very vulnerable to "temptations" while absorbed in divine ritual (aka torturing shaman women).
>>681472832Are they related to omens?
>>681473076I don't get it.
>>681473220No shit. People have been pointing out the Omen are Formless Mother releated since well before the expansion. But an autistic dedicated few commited to the idea that Omen are crucible touched beings wrongfully considered a curse got bolstered by the expansion dealing with the crucible touched hornsent and the comparisons drawn between them.The bloodfiends being invented shows From Software clearly wants you to connect the dots.
>>681466124>Ever wonder why Godfrey stands defending the Erdtree, instead of entering himself to challenge Radagon? It's because Marika's will is for him to kill you, to stop anyone from becoming Elden Lord.>Gideon was right.Yeah, no. Marika has a plan for both Godfrey and (You). She wants to start the Age of Fracture and either may be able to grant her wish.
>>681462458everything can sound dumb when you say it in a dumb way
It still puzzles me how Godwyn, a domesticator of Dragons can be backstabbed and get ganked by a group of lanklets.I mean, didn't he have his own detail guarding him?
>>681473364They have literally nothing to with omens. Bloodfiends were created by the formless mother. Omens are people born with a curse from the crucible.
>>681473613Knigga, how many times did you die to Black Knives? Now try fighting 5 of them at once. In fact you can probably give it ago in the Sealed Town of Shit by aggroing the 3 that lurk and try fighting them. Godwyn never stood a fucking chance.
What’s the lore behind Death Knights?
>>681473364>The bloodfiends being invented shows From Software clearly wants you to connect the dots.Or they reused an asset.
so, who's the canon prettiest woman in the Lands Between based on the lore? I'm gunning for Rennala, all her kids are beautiful.
>>681473719They have different models from omens though. They look nothing alike besides being fat and black.
>>681459721>At the end of the day, souls games lores is vague on purpose to keep people speculating for years.the "lore" is just flavor textit's not meant to be "speculated" or decipheredloretards need to kys
>>681471585I'm not fully brushed up on the birth of the three fingers, is there a QRD? Also by Ymir's fingers do you mean that little guy he holds in his lap? I quit playing today needing to beat Metyr so if that stuff is clearer after fighting him, just ignore me.>>681471774That last detail is pretty interesting.No one's brought up that the finger's design is clearly connected to mushrooms, which funnily enough are hypothesizes to have arrived on Earth via panspermia, I wonder what parallels could be derived from that to clear things up better
What’s the lore behind the Aging Untouchables?
>>681473701How the fuck are lorelets not freaking out that there are MORE of those weird mermaid corpse things outside of the lands between?
>>681473962The lore is Miyazaki wanted to do a forced stealth section and they couldn't just have you outrun them with Torrent so they came up with le ebin 2spooky4me so you're forced to traverse the abyss woods on foot.
>>681473962probably popped out of these guys and they just started eating each others' leftover eyeballs
>>681473425I believe that's wishful thinking. What she wants as an end-goal is almost completely ambiguous. But the example of the Hornsent and the lines about Marika being tainted by madness cut to the core of her character. We can see with the Shaman that her origins come from despair and revenge, which leads me to believe she actually wants to destroy everything.All the theories that infer she only wanted freedom seem to be arguing from a position that assumes the Fingers had a level of control over her that, frankly, there is no evidence they actually possessed.For example, why send Godfrey away? Why were her children used as sacrifices instead of brought into her plots? Why would the Fingers allow her to destroy the Hornsent, when they worshipped the Greater Will?I don't buy it. She has agency, and not everything was a 100% calculated plan for freedom.
>>681473613They probably seduced him first.
>>681474176Do you make youtube vids perchance?
What’s the lore behind the black phantom enemies all over the dlc? Are they hornsent?
>>681470132TELL ME WHERE THIS IS RIGHT NOW
>>681474393It's near Divine Beast 2: Deathblight Edition.
>>681474393RauhThe highest part of this buildingYou can access the bridge from where those red locust who swim in scarlet rot are
What’s the lore behind the inquisitors?
>>681474605>>681474460hmm. yes. i understand.
>>681474640They tortured frenzy niggasThey put Marika's people in jarsThey subjugated blood fiends
>>681474331Suppressing Pillar for dead soulsSealing Tree for Divine TowerScadutree for the whole shadowed realm.
>>681473719Different models, weapons and attacks>>681473628wrong.
>>681474202>Marika's trespass demanded a heavy sentence... If you can sentence someone (and follow it through), you have control over them. Could just be the fingers peddling more of their bullshit, but this is where the evidence comes from
>>681474896I lean towards "bullshit" since the Fingers know fuck-all about what's happening inside the tree.
>>681474202Anything Marika does that doesn't make sense I just chalk up to her being a woman.
>>681471406Yeah they were obviously meant to be related to sorcery and Rykard specifically. Since his hands look the same
>>681475024Which is fair, but there is enough evidence to run with the alternate interpretation. She's been under the control of the fingers and the EB, realized that they're full of shit, and now seeks freedom from them.
The thought of these massive sets of fingers barging in and taking over everything while being complete frauds is hilarious to me.
>>681475236My issue there is that if she is under control, how does she get away with doing so much shit? I mean how do you rationalize getting rid of Godfrey to begin with.
What’s the lore behind these guys?
>>681464880>Something causes her to rebel,Ranni killing her dearest son Godwyn might have something to do with it.
>>681475561Hornsent that failed to become "Tutelary Dieties" whatever the hell that means.
>>681464779The naming convention in the game has been eatablished since the very beginning, I dont know why people cant wrap their heads around this. It would be devient art oc if she didnt conform to this rule.
>>681475384My assumption is that while the control her, she not a complete puppet. She has some freedom to act and choose, so long as her decisions still align with the Fingers goals.
What’s the lore behind golems?
>>681475707They failed to become good enough to be lion dancers basically.
>>681475934You violated the NAP
What the fuck are the hornsent?Are the shamans numen?
>>681475934They're big guys
The fact that y’all are justifying the genocide of hornsent just because a select few of them decided to torture shamans really speaks volumes on how inhumane you guys are. Very eerily similar to the genocide of Palestine.
>>681476159The Shamans are like dancers, if you get the dancer's armorset and then use Boc to alter it you end up getting Marika's black dress. Also on a related note, there's a lot of references to dancers and dancing in Elden Ring almost as if there's some inherent power in the act of dancing itself.
>>681470132i only found this because i saw one of these glowing skulls with a broken rune inside it levitating
>>681473701anyone find the cloak yet?
>>681476904it has no effects
Fuck all this shit where niggas are trying to read plain English and Japanese like some 2000iq fags that think the curtains are blue means Metyr was spawned from the Elden Beast because you can get rid of a comma and read it differently.In the base game the Storm was tied to the golden lineage as well as the barbarians. In the DLC the storm is a divine power for the hornsent.Morgott and Mogh have the omen curse and are part of Godfrey's lineage.Nephali also has storm shit and is named Loux.That begs the question of what the fuck is the connection between Godfrey and the Hornsent? Why does the hornsent have storm shit, but also the golden line have storm shit, and also the Loux barbarians have storm shit, and why was his kids with Marika the only ones hit with horns?
Who are all the "shadow people"? Numens?Ghosts? I don't fucking know.
>>681477574Maybe you'd know if you properly read the item descriptions.
>>681464048some bits of hornsent lore explain the purpose of the pot people and fused abominations that surge from the pot, calling them "saints". They are as far as we know, the shamans, which are Marika's people. So maybe the hornsent were using the shamans "whose flesh melds well with others" inside the pots to create some kind of proxy saints in order to sacrifice them and create a god. Given the inhumane holocaust of her people, it's understandable that Marika did something to steal away the source of divinity right from under their noses, and then lock it up to prevent others from ascending.
>>681474074>have a nice looking model and arena for Godwyn bossfight>fight a ganksquad and another dragon in the base game>not used in the dlcFortissax had amazing ost for sure but boy it was disappointing that we didn't get to fight Godwyn after seeing that arena.
>>681464880I think it's more likely that>Marika being shamanfolk that get put into jars to torture and ascend godhood plans her betrayal>she finds contact with the GW or their envoys since the GW has been absent for some time>she seduces a primeval being to help her ascend the tower and steal godhood (the seduction and the betrayal)>when she's a godess, she gives birth to Messmer (part serpent/base serpent, hence the primeval being being the consort). >Marika uses Messmer as a sort of fire and forget weapon, unleashing him against the enemies of her people>she banishes the Shadow lands >at this point, the Ring gets involved in order to bound the laws and rules of the world, Destined Death rune is given to Malkieth for safekeeping>turns Hoarah Loux into her first Elden Lord
Could it be that the same way Marika's offspring were "cursed" by having red hair (since she defeated the fire giants), in the same way she was "cursed" for defeating the hornsent by having her other kids be omens?
>>681467645GW is just and outer god which are just some incomprehensible eldritch presences somewhere.
>>681477882There's literally nothing. The only connection is Godfrey and a Lion. That's the only commonality between it yet he's the link to everything.He literally wears a lion and does stomp dancing. His family has lightning and storm powers. His eldest son turns into death blight. His other two are horned people omens.Why did the giants have a storm lord? Were there different giants from the fire giants? Is that why there are so many giant hornsent in the DLC?Why is Godfrey's entire lore just>he came in from somewhere and was tough as shit but then got sad cause nobody good to fight is left so he swears on a broken axe and his ghost lion that he'll be a good lord but then he's tarnished and leaves and becomes a warrior again also he was super badass and drank erdtree sap without flinching
>>681462458Nah she's cool but I mean no cutscenes? What a letdown
>>681462458You sound obsessed.
>>681463843why is Elden Ring gameplay so fucking dogshit then?
>>681478630Why is your post so fucking dogshit?
>>681478630because you need to git gud
>>681462458She's some fujoshis si
>>681478481>Why did the giants have a storm lord?Who said they did?
>>681478728>>681478736you didn't beat the game
>>681478840Godfrey's armor does. He fought the storm lord alone during the war with the giants.>The age of the Erdtree began amongst conflict, when Godfrey was lord of the battlefield.>He led the War against the Giants. Faced the Storm Lord, alone. And then, there came a moment. When his last worthy enemy fell. And it was then, as the story is told, that the hue of Lord Godfrey's eyes faded.
>>681478973It might imply that the Storm Lord is a separate entity from the Giants. As in, he faced the Giants and then the Storm Lord.
>>681479168I know everyone thinks there's some super secret wrong translation because Ranni's entire ending got fucked because the translators read three conjunctions wrong so now you want to interpret everything to mean something else, but come on.
>>681470064>This is explicitly Miquella’s memoryNaw the remembrances aren't cut into the Erdtree by Marika any more than the Scadutree Remembrances are Miquella's.
Which endings fix the deathblight problem (Godwyn's mutated corpse spreading curses everywhere)
>>681459721Getting the full picture in Dark Souls was like building a house: every item description, NPC dialogue and environmental detail a brick that would ultimately come into place.Elden Ring, on the other hand, is like making a pile. It doesn't matter if you put dirt, gravel, shit or water (which would contradict your previous work), the purpose is to make it as big as possible.The Dark Souls method worked for Dark Souls, since it was contained in a smaller world. It does not work for the giant open slop world of Elden Ring, since you can see Miyazaki pulling lore and concepts from other games just to fill in the gaps, causing shit to contradict or make no sense until a hack like Vaati comes around with a 3 hour long video essay on how Elden Ring is a masterpiece of storytelling.
>>681478973I fuck your mother. Shat on your carpet. And then, there came a moment. When I ate your cereal.Warring against the Giants and facing the Stormlord can be two separate events. They are after all two separate clauses. Further evidence for this is the fact that STORMveil castle is far to the south, while the giants live in the far north. Seems like Godfrey conquered a myriad of foes for Marika.And this is why we get pedantic over commas and translations, anon.
>>681474172And then after those stealth sections you see thousands of updoots given to player messages referencing a Kojima game that has more mandatory boss fights than a Souls game.
>>681479694frenzy if you want to be drasticduskborn if you don't want to wreck everything
>Putrescent Knight is known as GloamEyedKnight in the game filesHow much shit did they retcon again?
>>681479906snake?,snake!
>>681458683What do you think this cut cutscene was about?
>>681480187You tell me
>>681480306Miquella about to give the tarnished a handjob
Did they goof too hard by getting grrm for elden ring?
>>681480448GRRM probably wrote a bunch of quality stuff that FromSoft butchered
Do you believe that what Malenia whispered to Radahn during their battle was planned all along?Miquella was originally supposed to be in the base game, the 1.0 version had remnants of Miquella's Rune of Abundance, the Age of Abundance ending, as well as a whole quest line about St Trina and exploring dreams, Absolutely nothing about Radahn or any brainwashing powers.I personally believe that the whisper was originally just headcanon bait (aka adding something vague to make people guess and drive online discussions), and when they ran out of time they quickly added Mohg's subplot to put Miquella's story on hold until DLC. Gideon and Varre are the only NPC's to ever mention Mohg and he doesn't even get his own Divine Tower. Also the internal name for his boss model is GreaterDemon.
>>681462458Her armor set is the best female knight set in the game, by a landslide, so worth it for that alone.But yeah, she should've had an intro cutscene plus victory/defeat lines, like Messmer, to give her some context. Otherwise it's just too random, basically a souped-up Loretta that comes out of nowhere.The DLC needed just a bit more budget.
>>681480187It never fucking ends, there's always scrapped concepts and retcons up the ass with these games that muddies the waters on interpreting the lore and narrative. It's a fools errant to try piecing this shit together. It just feels like it's impossible for Fromsoftware to come up with the lore first and then execute that since compilations always come up... sometimes maybe improvements too but who fucking knows since they keep changing so much stuff so late in development.
>>681481142complications*
>>681479827I attribute it more to the collaboration. The outlines of From's games are pretty simple. If you want to put together what the Old One is, why its there, and why you're being asked to deal with it it's pretty easy to work out. But Elden Ring is starting from a position of GRRM fantasy pantheon and their dynastic conflict. You don't fill that out with a few words here and there.Maybe if they approached Elden Ring a little more traditionally like they approached Sekrio's plot it would work out.
>>681480187Gundyr was originally Oceiros, that's why his design is a direct callback to Old King Doran from Demon's Souls. This is a pre-release screenshot showing "Gundyr" in Oceiros' arena. The final game's "Oceiros" is a "Dragon Angel" enemy/boss from a cut dragon area.You bet your ass Elden Ring is also rife with these kinds of rewrites/reshuffles. They don't just throw away assets when they cut an area/plotline.
>>681466124>Ever wonder why Godfrey stands defending the Erdtree, instead of entering himself to challenge Radagon? It's because Marika's will is for him to kill you, to stop anyone from becoming Elden Lord.Then why do we still see the guidance of grace?
>>681481384I just wonder at what point (meaning how many months / weeks / days before release) did they decide to put Twin Princes Radahn and Miquella as the final boss
>>681481387speaking of, what the fuck is graceit cannot come from Marika, it makes no sense since she's also Radagon, and he wouldn't allow it to point towards a method of burning the erdtreethe GW is out of the picture too
>>681464880>shadow realm gets shot into another world when a meteor with meytr hits>site of meteor deemed holy by people that worship crucible shit since it spit out meytr>hornsent construct emir ilim, stuffing shaman into jars to create gold/runes>hornsent piling bodies of shaman, divine gate takes appearance>marika uses gold formed from a mass of her own people's bodies to open the divine gate>REKTs crucible, creates erdtree/scadutree, returns to lands between with several other numen/shamans
>>681481620The new Radahn model is pretty high effort and has completely unique animations, so I suppose this was decided upon shortly after the release of the base game when they abandoned the OG Miquella story arc, as described here >>681480737
>>681475934some unknown crystal craftsman made them. you can control them for a time if you throw crystal darts at them or something
>>681462458From Software is creatively bankrupt.
>>681481142>fools errantits errandnot errant
>>681470132>le invisible bridge that leads to le nowherewow, bravo miyazaki
>>681458683My theory is that in true shintoism fashion, there exists in the world very powerful spirits that are called "gods" by the people. These gods like to manifest inside living beings, and can be identified by the eyes (Messmers, Fire giant, Shabriri, Malenia, etc). Marika was born one of these avatars and that's how she was able to rebel against the hornsent. Who was her god? Maybe the Erdtree.
>>681482909It could just be B-team left overs working on it while everyone else is working on other projects.
>>681483168Still From Slopware.
>>681458683Why do gods need a consort?
>>681483296Are you talking about that item? It's mistranslated by the way, Japanese says Miquella's lord wouldn't stand by his side.
>>681483101>leads to le nowhereyou get a cool sword :)https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Awv0Xr-q9ag
>>681458683As shown by Miquella, you need to shed your physical body and any base emotion to ascend to godhood. So you need someone to act as your physical self, like Marika with Radagon. And godhood doesn't even seem to be that fun., look at Marika.
>>681482909>recycling Pontiff>recycling New Londo>recycling Midir arena>recycling most of the Grand Archives>recycling Lothricthere's probably more that I forgot
>>681465864>generally agreed upon that Ranni broke the Elden RingMarika shattered the Elden Ring. Ranni killing Marika's perfect golden boy was the catalyst of Marika going nuts and shattering the Elden Ring. Stealing the Rune of Death by itself didn't lead to the civil war yet.
>>681483757here's how she shattered it
>>681483705It's funny because 3 already got all of those except Pontiff from DaS' recycling bin.
>>681480187This is the proof that lore discussion is pointless in this game
>>681481142Its because they're not trying to make some cutscene epic out of the lore, they're trying to make interesting shit you find when you explore first.
>they still don't think Ranni and Marika were working togetherngmi
>>681481861New Radahn looks like Guts and Griffith ditched the whiny mutt girl and just started dating in earnest.
>>681464880>Something causes her to rebel, probably a part of the deal with the Alien she's not ok with.Probably a mix of jealousy for Radagon and grief of Godwyn's death. Godwyn was the only child of Marika who didn't end up cursed from birth, her precious perfect golden boy. Messmer, Morgott, Mohg, Malenia and Miquella are all defective in some way. Godfrey gets exiled soon after Morgott and Mohg are born, Marika basically blaming him. Meanwhile all Radagon's kids turned out just fine, they only turned into weirdoes and monsters later in their lives. So the problem was Marika's womb all along.If you listen the "echos" in Marika churches in base game, she wasn't a very benevolent goddess. She was a bit of a cold and brutal conqueror. One of the echoes close to the capital city have her tell her own children that they can do whatever they want, but they have to become something great. If they achieve nothing, she considers them expendable.
>>681481861They're re-using a fair amount of Godfrey for it though. I wonder if any of the animations were ported over from regular Radahn.
Lorefags, who is Mesmer's dad?Second question: why was Godfrey sad there is no one strong left to fight, when there was a whole race to genocide for trying to jar his precious Marika?
>>681485060>First questionRadagon, idk>Second questionAsk papa Miyazaki, he won't know either.
Where did Miquella leave Torrent for Melina to find? In the promotional art he rides Torrent, and in the game you find that he has systematically abandoned everything in various places. Where did he leave his horse?
>>681485060>why was Godfrey sad there is no one strong left to fight, when there was a whole race to genocide for trying to jar his precious Marika?Two scenarios:1) The whole Shadow Realm thing happened before war against Giants and Castle Mourne being defeated.2) He wasn't sad, that was just Marika's excuse to expel him because their 3 babies after Godwyn turned out to be hideous mutants. Morgott and Mohg being Omens could be the real reason Godfrey was exiled. DLC shows why exactly Marika hates everything with horns so much.
>>681485060maybe the serpent under mount gelmir? Messmer is described as the "base serpent" and he has white snakes all over, maybe the serpent was Marika's first consort when she betrayed the hornsent before being with Hoarah Loux
So Messmer is Marika oldest kid and Radahn's direct onii-san.No mention of him ever in the base game, not even tangentially.And people still circle-jerk the lore lmao. It's just like that one daughter of Gwyn was only revealed in Ringed City.
>>681485259Is that definitely Miquella, could it be young Marika?
>>681467797Ah yes I see it clearly.I can't read English.
>>681474202She has less agency than you think.The religion isn't hers alone. Marika is the host of the Elden Ring and a god queen, not a god king.Her Golden Order is a compromise between the clergy (fingers and their readers), the Elden Lord's executive power and her own ambition, masked as her interpretation of the religion.The dogma wants a vessel and a separate Elden Lord who is in control.Taking Radagon as Elden Lord and then absorbing him makes most sense if it had to happen for the sake of her own plan. The secret absorption is a sacrilege. It's pointless to do so if it wasn't a risky move to her own benefit.For all we know, it enabled her to shatter the ring in the first place. At least, it was a way to game the power system that was in place until then.
>>681484062>they're trying to make interesting shit you find when you explore firstLike the recycled Tree Sentinels, the recycled dragons and the recycled Erdtree Avatars?Or do you mean interesting shit like the Abyssal Woods with the mandatory stealth section and recycled Winter Lanterns?
>>681473364Omens are covered with horns just like the hornsent, clear indications of the crucible's influence. They even have similar skin tones to the Hornsent NPC and the hornsent grandma. You're the one who's autistically reaching. I mean compare the two images. They have truly nothing in common beyond being big grey humanoids. The omen don't even use blood art like the bloodfiends do.
>>681462458yea, but lol
how much do you guys think lorecucks like vatiifag made over the years ?>make slideshow video with stolen content from reddit and 4chan>milk it to the max>average 5 million views per videoI remember /biz/fags making pocket money with text to speech reddit videos... but this is next level ngl
>>681460343>>681458683Marika seduced her way to the top of Hornsent society and then betrayed them to reach godhood status.It's literally in the fucking trailer bro.She wasn't antagonistic to the Hornsent in the beginning, after becoming a god, it's only much later, after the Golden Order became the de facto order of the Lands Between, that she enacted her vengeance and sent Messmer to annihilate them.Messmer was an older brother to Radahn, which means a lot of time had passed.>>681465790>>681460025First of all the Elden Beast is the envoy of the Greater Will, it's not a god. The Greater Will is the god.Second there's a difference between a god like Marika and the Outer Gods, like the Greater Will, the Formless Mother, the Goddess of Rot etc.Marika is nothing more than someone that manifests the order of the Greater Will in the Lands between. She's a vassal with limited freedom. That is why she gets punished when she shatters the Elden Ring. That is why Trina says Miquella is in a caged godhood or something like that.
>>681473829>it's not meant to be "speculated" or decipheredIt literally is by Miyazaki's own admission.Cope, seethe and dilate.
>>681458683Why was this scene from the original trailer cut from the game?
>>681464880Marika chooses to abandon messmer in the shadow realm, mainly because of the snek curse. She sent him there for the dual purpose of purging the hornsent and getting rid of him. I think you got everything else right.
>>681462458Ymir has a bossfight but its dogshit like gideon
>>681464217>>681464351Both wrong.The GO begins when Marika ascends to godhood. You mistake Golden Order supremacy with its existence. It became the only order through countless victories but it always existed.
Whats the reason behind there being so many of these little guys just laying around
>>681466656We don't know if the beast has any will beyond self preservation like an animal.
>>681464880>Marika asks for power to stop them, some aliens who fell in TLB probably in a meteor respond and make her a "god" with a heavy cost that probably involved discarding parts of her like miquella did, Then being reforged at the gates, I don't know how the ring itself comes into the picture.No. Marika makes contact with the fingers, or Metyr. Probably this is the bargain chip that makes her ascend to the echelon of Hornsent society. There she gains acces to information on the gates of godhood and becomes a god, betraying Hornsent trust.>Now that part of the deal is fullfilled, she's a slave to the aliens greater will's, well, will. Probably why she can't contact messmer anymore.No, she locks Messmer away because she is afraid of his fire and the serpent that possesses him.Keep in mind the Shadow crusade happens only much later in the timeline, well after she became a god.>The greater will has her pick several elden lords through a process of selection to have several demigod offspring.No, this was completely her choice. You can tell simply by the fact that she chose to remove grace from Godfrey and his Tarnished.She only loses the Greater Will's favour after she shutters the Elden Ring, after Godwyn's death.
>>681469290There's no puppeteering at all. It's all just natural occurrences.
>>681458683The divine door is a reference to humanity only having two genders, source: Miyazaki ( who made it up )
Marika and her consort Radagon were fused together body and soul, yet people won’t accept the same for Godwyn and Miquella lol
>>681463431>infiltrate fromsoft's HQ>find secret drawer >open the sealed documents containing the base lore for elden ring>"THE MORE QUEEN MARIKA SHARTED..."
>>681465228>>681465864>>681481781>>681478286Reading these replies makes me realize people still have no understanding of what happens in ER years after release lol.Some mistakes are so blatant that you have to wonder if these people even played the game.
>>681465648>but messages take THOUSANDS of years to travel back and forthYou know that's just the fingers bullshitting to cover how it hasn't had any actual connection to the Greater Will in ages, right?
>>681466785Yeah no.
>>681488997what's your theory genius
>>681489153It's not my theory, it's what's in the game. >>681488517 >>681487691 >>681487040
>OOOOOOOOOH RETCON RING>"Actually, Messmer is the oldest brother, we just haven't heard of his genocidal war at all because he's super secret and a good guy">There's this super cool donut steel OC of mine called Relanna, and she's a dual wielding sorceress sister of Renalla>Mohg actually wasn't a satanistic pedo, he was just being mindfucked by this femboy demigod who is now using his body as a puppet for his elder brother who he wants to fuck and become a god, or something>Well Elden Beast wasn't the divine agent of GW's will, Metyr was, and she's this cool finger aberration that lives in the finger sea underground>Marika was justified because she was really sad because her village got genocided turned into meat jars, which is why she she's genociding and turning dead warriors into meat jars>Well Miquella never wanted to ressurect Godwyn, so the whole Eclipse thing is a meme or something... ask G.R.R. Martin, idk>Melina? Never heard of her.
>>681458683
>>681489481I think GRRM didn’t write anything beond the character’s names.
>>681489861>mr martin we want to give you $$$$$$$$ to come up with character names for our new game>>ok>>godwyn>>godrick>>godfrey>>Malenia>>Miquella >>Mohg>>Margit>>Malikethfucking hack fraud
>>681489861I thought he wrote the pre-shattering and even offered to release a book about it. It was rejected by Miyazaki, since you can't make up shit if people know the lore.
>miquella's plan is literally the same as madara sharingan moon or whatever>peace through mindcontrolbravo kojima
>>681458683>Fromsoft "lore"ahahahahahahahahahahaImagine caring about Zanzishart. Imagine thinking these games have an actual story.
>>681462458>Ymir is supposed to be her magical superiorHe was her teacher but nothing implies that makes him superior. The sisters mastered full moon magic that literally changed the whole academy focus, meanwhile Ymir started studying fingers like a retard and the only thing he got was, kill Metyr, become a mother.
ive asked in others threads but, has ANYONE figured out if there's more to the scadutree chalice than just having 5 blessings near it?i just cant shake the feeling there's gotta be something else in there, you just dont make the biggest building in the map be just a gate to a chalice that has 5 blessings laying around, it just makes no sense to me.
>>681491674probably cut contentthe flower zone next to it also feels like they cut the original purpose for that placethe skadoosh fragments would feel better if there were in that shaman village instead of at the chalice
>>681470064>that stood in stark contrast with their afflicted selves>And so Miquella made his heartfelt wish>That Radahn would one day be his king consort>their>his???
>>681472029>>681472446Marika is called a "trumpet" by the Grandam. Trumpet means prostitute.Marika seduced someone at the very top of Hornsent society, plus she probably used the relationship she had with Metyr/the fingers to get a foot in the door, considering she was looked down upon as a shaman.
>>681493582>trumpet
>>681459721Are you retarded? Miquella's entire point is that his rune breaks 2/3 into the dlc and his charm on hornet goes
>>681488997Can't blame them. A lot of the plot is ambiguous and deliberately contradictory so there's room for plenty of speculation. All of the posts you replied to here >>681489379 are filled with speculation too. The biggest mistake of lorefagging is assuming that you know everything and treating everything written as is as gospel.
>>681473613Godwyn didn't know they were coming and they were invisible. It's not hard to backstab someone when he has the guard down.
>>681458683There is probably some extra criteria for ascension that we'll never learn
>>681493908Are we confirmed that this will be the only DLC? They could pull a crowns trilogy or Dark Souls 3 and have more than one. Elden Ring is From's golden goose so it makes sense to capitalize on that.
>>681493667Strumpet lol.Whatever.
>>681493759No, that's not speculation at all, it's either stated explicitely or you can deduce it from context, speculation is something else entirely.
>>681494287>or you can deduce it from contextSo speculation. Glad we agree.
>Miquella's original rune was Rune of Abundance not charm or brainwashing, as datamined years ago>"Twinblade that contains the power of the Rune of Abundance. The holy power within the blade can call upon part of Miquella's own strength" - Abundance Twinblade>WOAH Mitsubishi planned the whole thing in advance with Malenia whispering something to Radahn (which was originally just headcanon bait)I swear this fanbase is retarded
>>681494070They said they originally planned two but merged them into shadow of the erdtree so I think getting a dlc2 after sote is unlikely.
discordtrannies are still coping? grim
>>681494341No, you cannot deduce speculation, you need leaps of logic to speculate. Deduction doesn't require leaps of logic.
>>681494370>aislop
>>681494370>Mitsubishi planned the whole thing in advance with Malenia whispering something to RadahnI'm pretty sure this is just people coping with the twist. Everyone agrees it came out of nowhere and didn't properly align with the things shown in the base game.
>>681494440>t. autistic tranny
>>681494440I'm pretty sure the "deduction" that Marika seduced a prominent hornsent just because the hornsent refer to Marika's war as a "betrayal" takes a leap of logic far enough to be considered speculation.
In case some of you don't know, the DLC actually added Marika's black dress as a playable chest piece.>WTF, whereAsk Boc to alter Dancer's Dress, it's the traditional attire of Marika's people or some shit, it looks the same as her iconic black dress once altered
>>681494287Two of the posts you replied to directly contradict each other. It's all just speculation, retard.
man, trying to discuss anything related to the lore online really is completely aids, I wish these games didn't go mainstream
>>681494586Quite the opposite. Multiple sources talk about seduction, affair and strumpet. Only a contrarian retard would go out of logic's way to assume this means something else entirely.>>681494846How do they contradict each other? It's not speculation, the retard is you for not having played the game and talking about it.
>>681494968The Godwyn and GEQ headcanon retards are EXTREMELY annoying, but the rest is more or less fine.BTW, reddit is currently going through a phase where they kneejerk real hard to anyone comparing the story to Berserk, e.g. Miquella being inspired by Griffith's rise to power. That shit is annoying too.
>>681495116>Multiple sources talk about seduction, affair and strumpet.Show them then, other than the Hornsent just insulting Marika because she genocided them.
>Godwyn genocides dragons, giants, crucibles, albinaurics, merchants, enslaves mistbegottens.>No one bats an eye>Ranni kills Hitler>EVERYONE LOSES THEIR MINDS>b-but muh death disease>only ones affected are leftover "Wandering Nobles of the Golden Order" who they did not already massacre
>Messmer has red hair just like Radagon's kids>but he was actually the first kid, born before Radagon split from MarikaEXPLANATION???
>>681495294>destroys the world>seduces the tarnished to go around cleaning up the rest>leaveswomen are trash in every universe
>>681495242LOLLMAOSure, retard.Leda speaking in the trailer, she has no reason to lie.https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=6uT8wGtB3yQGrandam's dialogue. She's not insulting Marika, as far as she knows she's talking to a Sculpted Keeper, she has no reason to lie.Plus I'm sure there are other sources which I can't remember right now.You did not play the game.
>>681495294It's really a disappointment that Ranni is completely removed from the DLC stuff, there's no way she wouldn't be aware of the shadow lands and Ymir and all that shit, also how her quest makes it a big deal that you need all these things to be able to kill the 2 fingers attributed to her but then Metyr just dies because boss fight
>>681495294The Godwyn/Ranni thing is just the justification for the gameplay mechanics, everyone (including the player) can respawn (except when they don't but eh).Dark Souls had to pull the same "everyone is actually undead/immortal" plot device to justify the bonfire respawn mechanic.
>>681495584>goldcuck forgot that his golden order killed everyonelove from kazakhstan>>681495642Metyr teleported out of the fight
>>681495642Hmm, was Yuria of Londor the only NPC who reacted to DLC events in Dark Souls 3, or was there more? I forget.And then of course there was the Sif thing in DS1, as well as Dusk reacting to what happened.
>>681495727>everyone can respawnwrong. you kill the only 2 killable tarnished, Godfrey and Gideon after you unleashed death by killing Maliketh. Shit eater was fought through invasions and killed with seedbed curse. Fia doesn't actually die.
>>681495996What about the assassination missions for Mt Gelmir?
>>681485060>Hornsent>WorthyGodfrey became depressed because there were no more great adversaries to defeat.
>>681496235>invasion>has been defeated>host vanquishedwhat about them?
>>681496235Those Tarnished lost the guidance of grace long ago. The only ones that still see the light are the ones mentioned in the intro and all of those either have an ending attached where they sacrifice their life to create a mending rune or are endgame bosses.
>>681486361Insane, like your "Morgot and Mohg are uniquely cursed with the blood flame" cope which is ironic considering "Mohg had wings, Morgot has a tail" was used prior to justify a crucible connection. Omen aren't differently labled hornsent, they're children of Marika's kin cursed by the Hornsent through the Formless Mother to take on a horrific twisted visage of a hornsent.The Demons in their nightmares that the Omen Killer mask is based on may actually be laughing Hornsent souls torturing the omen victim.
WTF is Crucible and where can I read about this? All I know is some people (?) can insta-grow animal/plant parts on their body to make powerful attacks. The Crucible Knight in the DLC can transform his legs into a horse's body lmao.
>>681490408He refused because they were planning on making it a movie from the start. The movie can’t be anything but a prequel.
Ok so marika somehow gets access to the gates through "seduction and betrayal" and becomes god.Did she become slave to GW at that exact moment?Does that mean miquella is slave to GW too? Because that would be retarded since miquellas whole thing us recognizing his mom fucked up and he's trying to do better.Also did metyr influence marika before or after she entered the gatesAnother important question, what the fuck did the GW even want out if TLB. It just did some random shit for a brief moment then fucked off.
>>681494552Did Fromsoftware unironically retcon their lore because Redditors liked Radhan? No way.. this makes elden ring ds2 teir in my book
>>681496958It's mentioned across a couple of item descriptions related to Erdtree incantations, Cruicible knight armor sets, various crafting materials etc.It's apparently the older form of the Erdtree, described as the blending together of all life. When Marika became queen, the Crucible became the Erdtree.Things "closer to it" have chimera traits such as horns, scales, wings, tails, etc.Misbegotten in particular are the most severely affected by it.They are very vague in their use of the term "closeness" in reference to it, making it seem more like a spiritual "closeness" rather than literal.
>>681495163>the two incomplete plotlines that’s left>you’re a sperg why are you obsessed with it?Niggerfaggot.
>>681496958the crucible is some kind of pre erd tree source of primordial powerits why the crucible knights eventually got scorned after the age of the erd tree was in full swing because they are from a pre erd tree age and keeping them around is a bad look.
>>681472301finger,but hole!
>>681497626Godwyns plotline is over and done with. He's a corpse soreading cancer at the bottom that's all there is to it.GEQ is just retconned
>>681473220can we get this sword ingame?
>>681497361The man just loves Berserk and when he saw that people liked Radahn for some reason he got the idea of making the most blatant reference he possibly could.
>>681496958>WTF is CrucibleFantasy analogue for evolution
>>681496553The Tarnished all lost the guidance of grace and they all regained them when the game starts.The opening narration only names a few but every Tarnished gained it back.
>>681497626Godwyn literally got one of the longest questlines in the base game + an ending, the fuck more do you want, his huge cock with golden pubes??
>>681497240>Does that mean miquella is slave to GW too?No, Marika is still a god, that's why you can become Lord.But this begs the question, what Outer God is Miquella under the influence of? Is it even a requirement?
>>681494552>>681497361>>681497929It's in Radahn's armor description.Malenia told him that his consort awaits him, there's no retcon.
>>681491258>He was her teacher but nothing implies that makes him superiorRennala and her sister found their moons as children, implying Ymir still wasn’t all that impressed by them, while he was the magic instructor. His hat even says this.>He was her teacher but nothing implies that makes him superiorIt “charmed” the academy, and only one conspectus—the Lazuli—embraces the moon as equal to the stars.>meanwhile Ymir started studying fingers like a retardHe’s arguably the most revealing of what characters we got this dlc. Arguably more intriguing than even Miquella, to the lore enthusiasts.
>>681497361miyazaki has stated that they made the dlc story first. if that's true, then its likely that was planned from the start>>681498063no they didn't. that mage fucker in stormveil tells you he lost it long ago and is surprised you have it, for example. only the fuckers in the intro maintain the guidance
How do you gain access to this area? Also, there was a giant golem archer on the left side, and I dunno how to reach that one as well.
>>681498359Rogier?Guess you're right and I just don't remember right.
>>681498063>The Tarnished all lost the guidance of grace and they all regained them when the game starts.You are mistaking events. Marika took the grace from Godfrey and his people when he cast them out if the lands between, but then after the Shattering they came back with grace to become Elden Lord.Still, most of those lost the guidance because they stopped trying to become Lords. Rogier, Nepheli and others mention how they no longer see the light lighting the way as it used to while Gideon does and condemns all the tarnished that have stopped trying to fix the world.
>>681497858Yes same as Miquella and Radhan’a story were ended in the base game and could’ve been ignored, yet they made new shit. Stop with this mental gymnastics
>>681498430You have to find the grand stairway grace. Bit difficult to describe how to find but the first thing you need to do is open up the air spring in the area. Then you one of the areas you can only get to from jump through the spring, you can drop down onto some archways and make your way slowly across until you find a lift.
>>681498113Wasn’t Godwyn’s ending or even quest, that was Fia’s. Godwyn’s quest is granting him true death as Miquella desired.
>>681497240GW didn't do shit he fucked off long before Marika it isn't controlling or manipulating anyone>Because that would be retarded since miquellas whole thing us recognizing his mom fucked up and he's trying to do better.The tragedy and irony of his story arc is that his desire to do this leads him to make many of the same mistakes.
>>681498278That's the description for the new armor idiot. If that were in the original armor you get for defeating Starscourge Radahn no one would complain about it.
Who is the child buried at the Manus Metyr cemetery? What is his relation to Jolan and Ymir?
>>681498430Just skip it. Trust me.
>>681498513So everyone got it back but then lost it again over the course of post Shattering events.
>>681498773He's Ymir's child. Died for some non important reason. He's the reason Ymir went mental, he wants to bring him back.
>>681498754Yes, I know retard, what is your point? There's nothing to complain, there's no retcon.Malenia said something in the original trailer, now we know what she said, proof it's not a retcon.
>>681498430see those arches and pillars to the left? you have to find a way to jump on top of those. once you do so you'll find the lift upwards that'll lead you to the bridge. to get to the building at the end just jump down
>>681498278There’s nothing pertaining to this in hus armor description> The golden lion is said to symbolize Godfrey, the Elden Lord, and his beast regent, Serosh. From his youngest years, Radahn was naturally captivated by the Lord of the Battlefield.
>>681498430Reach the area boss (in the church of the butt), then bum around for a bit just before her boss room, there's an elevator that takes you to the grand staircase site of grace, which has the golem + that area you're curious about (there's a boss).
base game >Miquella wants to make his own version of the erdtree, a tree of abundance, and is almost successful until hos brother steals him to nurture his own dynasty instead>Tarnished arrives and ruins both plans, erdtree in ruin, haligtree withers, mihs dynasty was never bornSomber, tragic, but conclusive and alligns with the tragic fate of all demigodsDLC>All of the above was actually according to keikaku, miquella going inside coccoon then getting halfway through making roots then getting mohg to steal him and feed him his blood was the exact recipe required to enter the shadow realm that has a mcguffin that turns you into a god>Also remember Radahn? He doesn't like war he likes bussy actually Man...
>>681498359And why should I believe him? He’s trying to save face. That whisper thing is the most retarded way out they could think of
>>681498949The new one.
>>681499120>I don't believe anything and anyone, I'll make my own headcannon instead!
What do they eat in ener ilim
>>681498727Well if not GW she's clearly under the control of something related to it seeing as how she got punished for rebelling.I assume elden beast?
>>681498882No one's saying it's explicitly a retcon since nothing was actually changed from the base. What people are saying is that nothing pointed there being a connection between Miquella and Radahn in the first place. There were things that pointed to a relationship with him and Trina, for example and when that was proven here no one cared.The final boss feels like an asspull and no sort of, oh a whisper we know nothing about and can mean literally anything at all, is going to change that.
>>681499234Shamans
>>681462458How am I supposed to build for her swords if I'm not just breaking the game by going over 150? Minimum requirements with either dex or str to 50 for softcaps?
>Manus Metyr>Metyr, Mother of FingersSo who is Manus Celes?
>>681464880she can't contact messmer because she is being jailed and tortured by the elden beast
>>681499023It really is sherlock Holmes tier writing.
>>681499345>malenia goes out of her way to fight radahn, who is holding back the stars, blocking the fate of empyreans>no connectionSure thing bro.>The final boss feels like an asspullThey are the writers, not you. It makes perfect sense in the context of the story. Nothing in the base game contradicts it. You cannot prove they had different intentions in the beginning.You are just mad because it was not what you imagined. Literal spastic child that doesn't get his way behaviour.
>>681499506Ranni's two fingers, I guess.
>>681499506Manus = Latin for "hand"Celes = Latin for "heavenly"Manus Celes = Heavenly HandBasically Ranni's fingers crash landed there, you can still see the crater.
>>681499645Sherlock Holmes is a poor man's Auguste Dupin.
>>681474202>What she wants as an end-goal is almost completely ambiguousShe wants to kill God, anon. Everything points to that. She made the Lands Between into a gigantic battle royale to get someone strong enough to kill a god. She tells Hewg to smith a weapon to kill a god.
>Before the dlcThe two and three fingers are a representation of the entropic forces of the universe, order and caos>After the dlc The fingers are ayylmao that look like fingersWhy?
>>681499891>Basically Ranni's fingers crash landed there, you can still see the crater.I was actually under the assumption that the Fingers crawled away from the Divine Tower, which is why it isn’t there, and is in fact *hiding from Ranni*.
>>681500431Those two things are not mutually exclusive.
>>681498908>>681499010>>681498701I haven't found the grace stairway grace, but I found the way now. Cheers, Anons.
>>681500431Are both not true? I thought the fingers and everything finger related were direct creations of the greater will, which is apparently "the" god that created the planet in the first place and is probably itself a giant ball of spaghetti fingers.
>>681500462Adding to this, the Fingers are scrapping against the wall, we're looking at their back when we see them so they were likely trying to claw their way out when Ranni killed them.No idea why she stripped naked before hand though.
>>681500462I think they landed there, the cathedral was built because of that, then moved to the tower and then moved back again under the cathedral to hide.
>>681462458The most powerful wizards are still these two ancient motherfuckers.
>>681500462that's what I understood happened while playing my first playthrough as well, it's been a while though
>>681499758>malenia goes out of her way to fight radahnThis could be a number of things, but nothing to deduce that Miquella wanted Radahn dead to puppet his body and turn him into a consort. We have items of Miquella praying for Godwyn's rest, items that point to his charm powers, items that call him scary and items that show his intent to eliminate the influence of Outer Gods; and yet we have nothing that connects Miquella and Radahn at a personal level, nothing saying they were close as children, nothing saying that Miquella was searching for a consort, etc. Hell, even the theory that he beguiled Mohg was fringe and only a thing because, well, he could have done it, not because of any proof that he actually did.Sure, the writers can do whatever the fuck they want and it wouldn't be the first DLC that added stuff not alluded to in the base, but it still comes from nowhere.
>>681500528That's the way yes. If you follow along there you'll come to a lift, and then at the top of the lift is the grace.Grab the grace, you'll need it. The place you marked is filled with death and reused assets.
>>681485259now that we know miquella had nothing to do with melina and no other known contact with her, my guess is this is actually young marika and marika's daughter melina is the one responsible for giving Torrent to the tarnished since it's marika's grace that leads us through the base game and the DLC
>>681500635>No idea why she stripped naked before hand thoughThe Fingers are big, and it likely got a bit personal between the two of them… She probably let out her inner animal, killing it.She seems to be in a state of shock too, when you find her. “Did I just do that?”>>681500667Maybe they can fly like stars, like Mom.
>>681499314>elden beast?Yes he's the one who put her in time out>>681498134>Is it even a requirement?It never was. Outer gods are trivial in the grand scheme of things. Outer gods can influence an empyrean but they're not taking GW's place when the empyrean ascends. Outer gods are like ants to the GW. I think most of the outer gods who are vying for control over the demigods are just natural forces/phenomenon that got displaced by the sealing of Destined Death who are just trying to return to their natural state. For example rot is a process that no longer has a place in the world after the sealing of destined death, so it takes the form of the rot god to try to exert control on the world as it once did. If Malenia where to take Marika's place as vessel of the elden ring, the rot god wouldn't take the greater will's place, rot would just be canonized as a part of order.
>>681500732all mindbroken
>>681498134I don't think it is, in both the japanese and english versions of the game the outer gods have a rather literal name, they are gods from outside the microcosm.The Greater Will also isn't called a god or an outer god, probably since it's different from the gods of the setting and not foreign like the outer gods.For one thing it's far more powerful, not even the Frenzied Flame can destroy the Microcosm as easily as the Greater Will created it.
>>681500431You see the several two fingers across the towers in the base game and they were always terminals to the GW. Nothing was changed from what we already knew, not even the fact that their connection to their creatir was severed long ago.
>>681500520Yes they are when metyr looks like this.The thing even has 4 fingers ignoring the symbolism of using a 5 finger hand to represent the the fundamental forces of the universe, now what's the point of it?
>>681500732Is Lusat a Sellian or of the Nox culture? Why is his staff being guarded by the Nox around one of those giant chairs you find in the Eternal Cities? Sellia is said to be his “home”, but that is misleading since it’s a bleed of old + new.
Wait, it reduces damage from headshots and critical hits, but you're already taking extra damage for wearing it anyways... It's basically useless.
>>681500937Then back to my original question, just replace GW woth elden beast here>>681497240Was marika a slave to elden beast immediately after entering the gates?Would miquella be a slave to it too? If not, why?
>>681500839>This could be a number of thingsYes, before it could, now we know. Your point? Saying it could be a number of things doesn't prove they changed idea.>nothing to deduce that Miquella wanted Radahn dead to puppet his body and turn him into a consortAnd nothing pointed to something else. Lack of evidence doesn't disprove future evidence.>and yet we have nothing that connects Miquella and Radahn at a personal level, nothing saying they were close as children, nothing saying that Miquella was searching for a consortAgain, lack of evidence doesn't disprove future evidence.It doesn't come from "nowhere", we just have more details on established characters.>I don't like it because... they didn't warn me first!You wanted your headcannon to be real and were disappointed when it didn't align with the actual canon, now you're butthurt. Childish behaviour.
>>681501150Sellians are descendants of the Eternal so they probably consider themselves the same for the most part. Continuing their legacy. The night sorceries were clearly made because they were left without true stars / glintstone. Staff of Loss attests to this. I don’t think the Nox we fight are true Nox, though. More like imitators of some lost culture. They’re all silver tears falling apart into silver sludge when found. They can barely shape/form shields/spears.
>>681501210>If not, why?because its dead
>>681500732Gideon still created his own unique brand of magic and can use primeval incantations without turning into a vegetable or a ball so he wins.
>>681501018The thing is covered in fingers anon. The thing can be compared to fungus budding off finger buds.
>>681501150that side of things to do with the Nox and the carrians and the gravity men and the different magic cities don't seem to follow any logic frankly, I tried looking into it at some point but it just seems contradictory is a lot of placesFor example I'm sure there's 2 different Nox civilizations, either that's intentional and they didn't bother connecting the two or stuff changed at some point during development and they didn't fix the spaghetti left behind
>>681501381>Nothing said that Rennala had a twin sister, but nothing said that she didn't so it's fine!I don't care about any of the theories that said that Godwyn would be the final boss or anything like that. I'm just pointing out why people would be confused as to why Radahn is suddenly the final boss of the dlc.
>>681501000>>681500937Isn't the Greater Will just one Outer God?The GW is Marika's Outer God, didn't the previous Gods and Lords have different Outer Gods? Like Placidusax and his God, didn't they have a different tutelary Outer God?
>>681501210Well, I think Marika made a bargain with Metyr and the Elden Beast in order to have them help her.They would get what they want and Marika would get her deathless eternal world, of course the Metyr and presumably the Elden Beast as well, aren't approved of by the Greater Will for a reason.If I had to guess why the Elden Beast fell, Placidusax was the previous Elden Lord so he would need a god to be consort too, if nobody was hosting the Elden Ring like Marika was, that means he would have been the king consort to the Elden Beast.But the god who Placidusax was consort to fled when Bayle attacked and the Elden Beast has a scar, so i think after abandoning her people the Greater Will no longer approved of the Elden Beast.
>>681501567And if Marika, or the Numen, are said to be related to the Nox, then are we to just assume that the ‘shaman’ were the ones that got left up top on the surface, while the ones below were left to try and restart their cities? It is very confusing. Sellia is also evidence that some just tried getting out of the underground, rather than stay underground?
>>681501436>Miquella counted on you killing the elden beast on top of all the other convuluted shit he did in his 4d chess keikakkuThat's even more retarded
>>681501646Regardless of whether or not you consider the GW to be some godlike being is irrelevant when it can be compared to space and all its cosmic horrors in general “Invoking the ire of the Greater Will” may as well be a saying for attracting anything to do with aliens
>>681501210To some extent>Godhood would be Miquella's prison. A caged divinity... is beyond saving.Marika only got put in the time out corner because she tried to destroy the ring, mostly anything else seems to be fair game to him.
>>681501469>he doesn’t want to be a space vegetable Keep your sad and wet and mushy brain
>>681501162It's a pvp item since all pvpers do is fish for crits
>>681501612Why do you care how dumb people feel? You sound like a woman.I just play a videogame made by From which makes perfect sense in the context of what we see in the game and that's all that matters.>>>Nothing said that Rennala had a twin sister, but nothing said that she didn't so it's fine!>the three sistersBut actually that is correct.
>>681501717The Nox were probably sent underground recently in the grand scheme of things, probably when the shattering war began. They were part of Erdtree society as emphasis is put on their betrayal, and the Nameless Eternal City underneath Lyendell is shaped like that missing lower section of Lyendell which the main gate should lead to but is currently a big ass moat.
>>681501749>counted on youif you failed he would have just picked a new tarnished
>>681501869It means if the god steps out of line, the even bigger god will bully you into a form of submission, perhaps even to the point of forming an alternate ego that aligns with it, as with Radagon. Being against the Ring is hopeless, since it may just be able to mold its current host or vessel.
>>681502000I’m pretty sure the Nox got banished long before Marika.
>>681501717I think what they were going for is that the Nox are the goo children of the actual land that got shaped by the outer gods when they meteor landed and all that if that makes sense, the underground was also not underground at some point I guess
Bleed bolts are great, lmao. Nice ambush though, Miyazaki.
>>681501797I don't know about that. Where is it stated that the GW is different from the Outer Gods?What about the part regarding Placidusax and his god?
>>681501532But that's my point. Is like some one at from took the most brain dead reading of the concept and made metyr just an alien made of fingers.Why the two finger work for the greater will?Why the three fingers want caos?What do the finger creepers represent and what is their relation with rykard?
>>681502173Placidusax god would be the Marika equivalent since he was the Elder Lord of that God. It is possible that that order was also beholden to the GW.
>>681502173It isn’t different. Outer just means outside, and god just means godlike.
>>681502328The way I understood it is they were under a different Outer God.
>>681502138I’m still not sure who predates who, Nox or the ancient astrologers.
>>681502138>the underground was also not underground at some point I guessThe mountaintops were raised while the underground was buried. This is why you see the same trees, even those lightning balls, up above as well as down below.
>>681502173His remembrance says he was once Elden Lord, but the god he was consort too fled and he awaits its return.Additionally, the church inside Faram Azula has an Elden Rune depiction on it, it shows up in a loading screen as well.Also the Greater Will is never called a god or Outer God in English or Japanese, the game never equates it to either in the first place.
>>681501646The only previous lord we know of was Placidusax and the god that abandoned him is probably just the greater will.Malenia is an avatar of the rot god yet she got sponsored by 2 fingers as a potential successor to Marika aka the vessel of the elden ring which is the vassal of the GW.>>681502173Why would you assume they're the same? He's never referred to as an outer god? I think people got caught up on this because we're used to all incomprehensible ayylmaos being referred to as old/outer gods in cosmic horror settings.
>>681502291two fingers receive signals from metyr not from the greater will, ymir implies that perhaps metyr never even got any orders from TGW
>>681502291Where is this screenshot from? I don't remember this cutscene.
Holy shit the guy randomly asking for the lore for any random thing and getting an answer must be seething.
>>681503216The ash of war for the Gazing Finger, which is just her headm is called Kowtower's Resentment so she's probably not a loyal vassal.
>>681503535Hoax made by modder
