In terms of console sakes?
>>683717262Fuck wrong image
>>683717324>likely>what ifthey already tried this and failed
>>683717262I bought a steam deck to get away from the retarded console wars.
>>683717595Now you complain about other launchers like epic
>>683717262Next thread.
>>683717682FUCCCCCCCCCCCCCCCCCKKKKKKKK
>>683718386War never changes, it just evolves
>>683717262valve already beats sony
>>683717585They tried partnering with OEMs, unfortunately those OEMs were all beholden to Microsoft.So they either tried just zero effort PCs running SteamOS builds built the same way a Windows system would be built complete with Nvidia GPU. Then priced them higher than their Windows systems. Because Microsoft makes them pay more to sell anything other than Windows.Dell/Alienware at least made an effort with the hardware, but even they gave up immediately when Microsoft's lawyers told them they were in violation of their contract.SteamOS hardware was already a risk, but Dell wasn't going to risk a fight with Microsoft that might make them pay more on their other systems.
The deck didn't even come close to Sony let alone Switch. Valve will need to start selling things in stores if they want mainstream appeal for hardware.
>>683719221They would need to spend a lot of money on advertising, they do not do that at all with their hardware. Homes the way they handled vr shows to me personally that they are never gonna be competitive with Sony, they let meta eat up the entire vr market.
>>683717262but you literally can install SteamOS on your desktop, the thing is Linux doesn't currently support Anti-Cheat so you kind of cuck yourself if you want to play anything thats Multiplayer
>>683719489They make enough money off of steam to not actually need to give a fuck about anything else but yea I dont see them actually putting much effort into becoming one of the big 3. Even Xbox sells more hardware.
>>683719489> HomesHonestly
>>683719221Pretty much, you're never going to sell "proper" console numbers if you aren't being sold in standard marketplaces. But on the other hand, valve probably has much better margins by selling through steam. I don't think they really expect to hit mainstream numbers.
>>683719221They're at two lines that can each do about 50k units a week right now. Which is a lot for a PC, but very little in the 'console' market.If they're going to supply mainstream stores, they'll probably need to add a third line and warehouse space that can buffer the systems they need to put them on the shelves in the necessary volume for peak demand times like the holiday buying season.
>>683719690Nah lots of anticheats work on linux. I think only the super invasive ones don't, but stuff like easy anticheat does.
>>683719748They would need exclusive games but valve doesn’t care about that, like system sellers that use the power of the hardware.>>683719991Vanguard doesn’t work as well as EA ANTICHEAT.So no sports games or cod. Games that sell gangbusters on console. They have a bit too much against them. Not to mention Fortnite isn’t on steam.
>>683719748Past tense. Xbox sold more hardware. Maybe the upcoming refresh will help boost their sales, but if it flops and Valve adds a third line Deck could pass the Xbox series in a few years.
>>683720171Unless they put it in stores no.
>>683719221Valve is only interested in doing things if they know it changes up the ecosystem and pushes new tech. I think they even admitted that the reason they made the deck was to create demand for a new niche in the market AKA blue ocean strategy IIRC similar to Nintendo but with a slightly different (but still similar) mindset.
>>683720141this, as much as I would like SteamOS to become a competitor to Windows, it simply isn't going to happen until shit like Ricochet or Vanguard are compatible with it, if/when it does you would easily see its market share go up when it comes to Desktops
>>683720478Pc store fragmentation hurts them, many people buy consoles just for Fortnite and cod and fifa, my brother just plays all the fifa games on his switch. The lack of those games and no system sellers would hurt it a bit.
>>683717262lol no
>>683720253If they add a third production line, they'll definitely have the volume they need to put it on store shelves and supply additional regions.They might already have the volume to supply it for Black Friday, or the holiday season.But they're already geared up to sell what they can produce with two lines directly, so there's not really been a reason for them to add the middle men.They need to basically have a separate line that does nothing but produce a cheap model that still has decent storage.
>>683719816Yea I think so. The lack of ea sports games, cod and Fortnite working on it also hurts them. Pc store fragmentation hurts them a bit, most gamers just want to hit click and play. The biggest games not running on the platform means that many might just buy a switch 2 or ps6 whatever.
>>683721448Not to mention many sports games like mlb the show and college football 25 don’t hit pc due to low sales on that platform. This sort of stuff makes a steam deck or deck like device a lot less appealing.
>>683721448It is a Catch 22.They can't get games on the platform until they have an install base large enough to get developers to pay attention.They can't get the install base until they have the games.Proton is mean to solve that problem, and really lowers the bar for developers but the proliferation of NT Kernel Malware bundled into many games creates new problems.If Microsoft puts their foot down and stops allowing Kernel level Malware in the wake of them getting bit by it after ignoring everyone else in the industry screaming at them that it was a problem that might help too.
>>683719221i bought mine from gamestop loli think thats the only place you can get them offlinethey even have a demo kiosk in store
>>683722039A bit more than catch 22, pc is an open platform and some games will never hit steam like Minecraft or Fortnite. Some people might be able to handle the jank but many want a plug and play experience when getting games.This overall hurts the platform, if steam had an utter dominance aka selling as much as the switch it could change but even then that might not be enough. Switch still doesn’t get a lot of ports that could easily run despite market dominance. People are gonna buy the device that is the easiest to get and download software. I’ve heard people pass on the deck because getting rocket league to run is too hard for them.
>>683722065They only sell refurbished lcd steam decks in GameStop irc
>>683717324Don't tell these guys what an HDMI cable is
>>683720425This. Valve as usual just half asses something but the industry follows suit and usually improves on it. I honestly doubt we'll see a deck 3 because gaben said he won't do it until there's a good reason and a simple next gen chip swap isn't good enough. The Ally X has already surpassed the Deck and Microsofts new handheld is something to look forward to as well.
>>683717823>no touchpadsit's shit
>>683722453>pc is an open platform and some games will never hit steam like MinecraftDeck s a PC running a GNU/Linux based OS, and Minecraft has been playable on GNU/Linux from the start.Pretty easy to add Minecraft to a Steam Deck, but going to the desktop does shatter the 'console' perception even if just temporarily.>Fortnite.Because of the NT Kernel Malware. Hopefully Microsoft finally listens and closes that massive security flaw they intentionally left open.>getting rocket league to run is too hard for them.That really sucks because Valve actually had a great native version of RL. Until Epic bought it, killed Linux support, and made the game effectively exclusive to NT and their store.
pretty sure sony is making a ps5 portable, so no i don't think valve can beat that marketshare if it releases and is actually goodxbox is also making their own handheld, shit is going to be wild next gen
>>683723481And that is enough to hurt it in the market lol, try to tell parents to do all of that> game effectively exclusive to NT and their storeNot a bad thing, it is like complaining why dota is only on steam.The open nature of pc hurts the prospect of a steam deck console doing all too well in the market compared to a ps6 or switch 2 whatever
>>683722453One other thing about Fortnite, Valve is apparently working on Android/Linux game support so they can provide a unified Linux gaming experience supporting games for both GNU and Android.The Android/Linux version of Fortnite after all doesn't have the NT Kernel Malware that causes issues running the win32 version on the Deck.But given their history as a bad actor, I wouldn't put it past Tim to find a way to try to single out and block Deck even if it causes collateral damage to their player base.
>>683722549no they sell new lcds and oleds in store
>>683724124> Valve is apparently working on Android/Linux game supportNot gonna work. Epic already blocks root access as well as other stuff on Android. Ever since chapter 4. Emulating Fortnite via Android or on waydroid or something is nigh on impossible.Good thing overall though, cheating is bad.Epic is very harsh on that sorta stuff.
>>683724584And it isn’t collateral damage it works normally on non rooted devices. And root had practically gone the way of the dodo on Android.
>>683724254It is just refurbished THOUGHhttps://www.gamestop.com/steam-deck
>>683724058Maybe, but if there is a large enough group of users on the Deck, who are treating Steam as if it is a walled garden, then that creates pressure on developers to put their games on Steam.We've seen that happen with Steam even before the Deck because users treat it as their sole source of games even on NT.The big problem for consoles is with Steam powered 'console' style systems available providing a unified platform, it may be more difficult for actual console systems to gain traction. Will a PS5 portable play the normal PS5 games? How will players get their disc games onto the system? Will Sony try to support two different systems with PS6 and a PS5 portable simultaneously?Valve may have an easier time supporting the 4th-gen Steam Machines since they will present a unified platform and inherit the efforts that went into the Deck.
>>683719221They just have to make somethiing thats not shit,Every game is shit, every hardware is shit
>>683717262Sony puts their games inside Valve's storefront, they already lost.
>>683724124>I wouldn't put it past Tim to find a way to try to single out and block Deck even if it causes collateral damage to their player base.Tim’s dislike of Linux is incredibly autistic.Like he absolutely guts it in any game they own these days but still support it in UE and EAC, granted engine support is more lip service then anything.Probably hurts his feelings that the engine needs to improve support for the VFX industry which has widespread Linux usage.
>>683717262Nincels mad
>>683725021Not really, that is just the case of physical vs digital, not to mention many people buy consoles due to the fact they can buy physical copies, and sell them afterwards, physical copies also do well as advertising in shops. Xbox gets a smaller section in most shops due to the lack of physical games.>>683725275Tim is fine with Android though, they even had a Samsung mobile game tournament cup in Fortnite a few months ago.
>>683725471I suspect that has more to do with it being mobile more then anything.Like they support Mac but iOS is the real priority and Macs are just a side bonus.
>>683724738>it isn’t collateral damage it works normally on non rooted devicesI'm talking about even more draconian methods than that.Like if Valve makes the Deck's full-fledged Android/Linux game support report as if it was a Google Pixel for instance. Tim has proven he might do dumb shit like block everyone on all of those devices.
>>683725723Stop being skitzophrenic, android emulators already work like that. They emulate actual model numbers, but most games can figure out if you are emulating or use real hardware or have it rooted.
>>683725471>not to mention many people buy consoles due to the fact they can buy physical copiesIf Xbox is moving to a handheld, or Sony launches an additional handheld system, do you think they will play games on Disks? Or do you think they will have a new game format?A game card format might work for a new Xbox, but it would be more of a sticking point for Sony unless PS6 and their handheld share a game card format.
>>683725906I have to admit I don't know because I've never been interested in Fortnite, but is it playable on ChromeOS/Linux systems that support Android/Linux software?
>>683726040With Sony it will most likely use carts, their games sell really well in stores and they have no reason to go full digital. Physical sales made up a lot of Spider-Man 2s sales.With Xbox they are going all digital. But even then this is just a case of physical vs digital and is more of what the end user wants. You could still buy it digitally and it would work on ps6 and ps5. The lack of physical games will hurt them a bit in stores, many people still buy stuff in stores and games that take up retail space are great for not only advertising but also game sale and console salesOne console has a ton of games that you can physically buy the other doesn’t and only has a small corner at the end. People are gonna buy the one with physical games.
>>683726487> playable on ChromeOS/Linux systems that support Android/Linux softwareNo>I have to admit I don't know because I've never been interested in FortniteI know because I’ve emulated Android games before.
I just want something smaller and cheaper.
>>683724124im not sure what android games you would play on the deck but if it means waydroid and arm emulation get more development then ill be happy.
>>683726556I don't know. Stores seem to be phasing out physical media independent of devices supporting it.
>>683726672Not all games run via emulation many block it due to the unfair advantages pc gamers have and that is totally fair you don’t want to be battling a guy in pubg mobile with a keyboard and mouse. Way too unfair.
>>683726672>NoAre you talking about third-party 'emulators' though, or ChromeOS/Linux official ability to run Android/Linux software?Because Valve was partnered with Google, and has engineers familiar with ChromeOS's container setup.
>>683726556>With Sony it will most likely use carts, their games sell really well in stores and they have no reason to go full digitalSony hates used games sales and shifted their plans once Microsoft got all the bad press from the Bone.
>>683723413>muh ACKpads
>>683725471android is as locked down as windows so tim epic can blame any failures on the company whose balls hes washing. when he actually has to do something (like have a useable store close to as good as steam) it becomes obvious how incompetent epic is.
>>683726935You can cope but it is true. Physical is here to stay for a good while. And companies like Nintendo and Sony benifit from it.>>683727090Both. Fortnite doesn’t run on chrome os.
>>683727271Nta but I will continue to use EGS
>>683727318>Physical is here to stay for a good whileMaybe, but I can't help but think it will be a niche thing. Like how stores got rid of CDs and Blu Ray but kept selling vinyl.
Is the Steam Deck sold in stores in the United States?I've just discovered that it's cheaper for me to travel to the United States, buy a Steam Deck there, and come back playing on the plane, than to buy one in my country of motherfuckers where the cheapest model of Steam Deck is costing fucking $1250.
>>683727719As long as units are moving off the shelf at a descent rate physical will stay.But digital is becoming more popular with consoles and it's only going up. It's less of will it stay and more when will it become to niche to be in most stores.
>>683726917I need to experience this masterpiece on the deck
>>683727978Gamestop sells Steam Deck in their store now. Both brand new and used.
>>683727978maybe inquire your government to not have 100% tax on imports
>>683727978HUE bros ?
>>683728001>As long as units are moving off the shelf at a descent rate physical will stay.That's been the problem sadly. Outside of some small niche items and major releases it hasn't been.Spiderman for PS5 may have sold well in a physical release on launch day, but is that enough to justify stores dedicating space to a bunch of physical media?Especially now that a customer buying a physical game almost always involves employee time to open the locked case they're kept in.It wouldn't surprise me if digital code cards take over. They have the same shelf appeal, and don't have the same concerns since they don't activate until after the sale is final.
>>683717262I stopped using SteamOS when I installed Windows on my Deck.
>>683728606why?
>>683728510Yeah, it's fucking awful but people love their convenience over everything else and causes more issues then people realize.
>>683727719In the case of music, the way we listen to it has changed. Now music is basically in the "air", you listen to it with any device that connects to your headphones.But this isn't true of all media. Look at the case of books for example, ebooks haven't replaced paper books, much to the regret of Amazon who thought that Kindles would completely replace real paper.Physical games still account for a large proportion of console sales. The fact that stores are closing doesn't mean that no one buys physical games any more, people are just buying them direct from the Internet and having them delivered to their homes.I don't think that's going to change any time soon on consoles, unless consoles open up like PCs and allow the user to manage everything. In that case, it won't make sense to buy physical games anymore, just as a guy who has a hacked Switch doesn't buy games, he just copies and pastes the data he gets from the Internet. In this hypothetical future, physical consoles games would disappear and the companies would all have to make a profit Steam-style.
>>683728510Nintendo games still sell too well physically, there is a 50/50 split between physical and digital for switch games.
>>683729430And Sony it is too important for their fire party lineup.
>>683728606I dunno why anyone would install Windows on Steam Deck. Everything is literally worse. Windows is a server/desktop OS down to the kernel level so your battery just dies.
>>683719221Sell a Deck Pro through Steam, then sell a cheaper Deck vanilla through retail
>>683717262I wouldn't mind if I could put steamos on one of those chinkhelds, like the ones by anbernic. Mite b kul.
>>683729747Not really, it doesn’t use more power than steam os the biggest issue is the chipset more than the operating system
>>683729968Can their old phone processors run it?
>>683730036stupid comparison. they use different soc and different driver dlls (rdna 2 vs rdna3). steam deck is objectively worse with windows.
>>683730264Steam barely gets driver updates on windows compared to steamos. You can say the same thing about why games run worse on Linux on the rog ally and legion go and is more inefficient.
>>683730171I don't know but I know at least one of their systems does run a version of linux, so it should be possible, hypothetically
imagine buying a handheld that uses win11christ.
>>683730625Imagine buying a pc gaming handheld
>>683729747Practically no one does. Not even a fraction of a percent. Not enough to show up in the survey data.Even lower numbers than Linux users installing onto systems that ship with NT.
>>683717262not a single handheld is worth buying
>>683717823>no touchpadsinfinitely better than the ugly thing at bottom
>>683730880double amputee detected
>>683717324Honestly if this is like $150 - $200 then yeah it'd be decent for the price
>>683731009It will never be that cheap. It won’t even be as cheap as the series s.
>>683729896That is the ultimately the plan, but Valve need to either see sales drop off enough they can bank units to send to retail, or they need to add additional production lines just for the retail system.So far they've been adding lines when they've added systems. Once AMD spins up a fab to make a chip it isn't hard to get them to just keep churning out the same chip.
>>683731114Do you have a source
>>683730880This>>683730974You’ll get myopia
>>683731257So nothing lol
>>683731257Go back and watch Valve's dev day streams about the Deck hardware. They talked about retail. They need a lot of production volume to do it, and they aren't there yet.You can also see in tear down videos of the LCD and OLED Deck that the chips and the parts are different. They come off of different production lines.You can also see in the Survey data over time. Deck sold about 2 million in its first year, 3 million in the second, and is on pace to sell 5-6 this year which may put them at 10 total. The very bottom end of console shipments to retail would require them to double that to be able to supply at least 10 million every year.
>>683717823Based
>>683732098> and is on pace to sell 5-6 this year which may put them at 10 totalDo you have any source for that, no analysts are saying this. And it sold 1.5 million the first year and second, back in 2023 omitda said they would hit 3-4 million by the end of 2023. Your guesstimates are too optimistic,
>>683732336And honestly I trust an actual company whose job is analysing hardware sales over a who on 4chan.https://omdia.tech.informa.com/pr/2023/apr/omdia-steam-deck-installed-base-to-surpass-three-million-during-2023#:~:text=The%20report%2C%20which%20focuses%20on,1.9%20million%20units%20in%202023.
>>683732336> would hit 3-4 million total unit sales
>>683730512depends on the soc, i know of one or two arm chinkhelds that run linux but they share socs with sbcs by rpi/orpi/pine64 that already had drivers reverse engineered and upstreamed. most phone chips dont have drivers for linux available.
>>683718759Epic is too complacent and inept to ever create a console, OS or VR ecosystem. And they're just as allergic to making new games as Valve.
>>683719083the problem with the "Steam Machines" or whatever they were called wasn't that they were beholden to Microsoft, it's because there were two many variations on the hardware which is retarded when your idea is to make PC gaming available for console tards. They should have required specific hardware minimums at least so things could be labelled "playable on Steam Machine" for normies. The fact that they had multiple companies making multiple SKUs with different hardware in each one is the complete opposite of the entire purpose imo.
>>683733639> Epic is too complacent and inept to ever create a console , OS or They just want to sell services and battle Netflix.>VR ecosystem . Practically abandoned, meta has most of the market
>>683733639> And they're just as allergic to making new games as ValveThey aren’t they make them all the timeIn fortnite
>>683732336>>683732478We're all just guessing really, those numbers might be accurate based on what things looked like over a year ago. That probably assumed more slowdowns than actually occurred and is from before Valve added a second line for the Deck OLED which wasn't something people were expecting. Deck seems to have hit 1 million around August 2022, which is when the cake party happened, and the 2 million number was disclosed in early 2023 at a KDE developer event.1.85 million a year would imply batch sizes of around 35k a week, which seems low for a device with a custom SOC, let alone something that would justify the OLED's updated chip.Valve confirmed early on when they were running batches of 10k, which they doubled to 20k, and then again when they hit 50k.50k a week is 2.6 million a year, two lines at 100k a week is 5.2 million a year. But maybe 50k a week was abnormal and they went down.If the 35k number is true, then double with the OLED would be 70k a week, 3.6 million a year.Bottom end of retail console supply would be about 10 million a year. So really if the much slower ramp is true, then that just shows you how much further from being on store shelves the Deck may be.
>>683734374> That probably assumed more slowdowns than actually occurred and is from beforeNot really they accounted for new hardware being made in order to retain users
>>683733832That was definitely one of Valve's take aways which is why the Deck and the whole 'Deck Verified' program exist.But the number of different companies and systems is simply a side effect of an OS made widely available to different vendors.Just speaking of my social circle, a few people bought the Alienware Steam Machine from Dell, a few people like me built our own.Microsoft's legal threats nuking the market was total overkill on their part in my opinion.Even if they hadn't done it, first and second-gen Steam Hardware was basically just glorified dev kits for the Linux community and developers.Annually they probably wouldn't have sold half what the Deck did its first year.
>>683717262why the fuck would you want to install steamOS on a pc
>>683734717But they didn't count on the new hardware being on its own production line, or for the older system to stay in production.Really the difference between 35k a week per line, and 50k a week per line isn't that massive.Either one is still well short of what Valve needs to hit to supply retail.The best selling open platform gaming computer of all time only sold 15 million total. Even the more pessimistic numbers put Deck LCD+OLED on pace to pass that, but its still not impressive compared to walled garden consoles.
>>683735606> The best selling open platform gaming computer of all time only sold 15 million totalWhich one?
>>683717262bazzite.ggIt's basically SteamOS.
>>683736002Commodore 64I think that is original hardware only, not the modern retro revival systems.
>>683735496Windows 11
>>683735496Autism
>>683736638The opportunity for Valve comes when Microsoft makes the rumored push for ARM in the home market, forcing OEMs to only sell AMD64 NT systems to business customers.Even then, I'm not sure if they would try partnering with OEMs that have signed Microsoft contracts again.Right now the rumors point more towards Valve adding a mini PC using a new custom AMD SOC to their hardware lineup, and maybe they would release an ISO for small-scale OEMs.If Dell is basically forced by Microsoft to turn Alienware into a ARM Xbox manufacturer, that is going to create an opening for companies that want to be the next Alienware catering to PC gamers.
>>683717823>gets fucked by hardware and warranty issuesHeh, nothing personnel kid.
>>683717262since no one can afford a home in the west no one will be buying home consoles dumbass. console sales will only decline across the board until someone start killing bankers. this is why mobile gaming is the biggest market on earth, brown peoples lives are tied to shart phones. they are happy owning nothing and dont need a large hand held when they have a samsung galaxy or iChink.
Digital only shit with steamy drm no thanks.
>>683737208Never gonna happen, fucking nobody uses Windows on ARM shit and nobody ever will, modern Windows is actually worthless without its compatibility.
>>683737528Don’t know how many people would stomach constant steam game advertisements on their operating system.>>683737515Same with pc, even if valve somehow manages to get steam on Android no one will download it because everyone just wants to play mobile games not pc games.
>>683737536>fucking nobody uses Windows on ARM15% of the user base according to Microsoft, and you act like normal users or OEMs supplying them would have a choice.They have no more option to say no to the ARM switch than Mac users.>modern Windows is actually worthless without its compatibilityThe compatibility layer is already suffering to the point people here routinely advise the use of the IOT version of NT because it keeps the old version of the win32 support layer.The situation with using Microsoft platforms for PC gaming isn't going to get better. There is no money in it for them.
>>683738498And ms is gonna do this why ? Do you have any sources for your skitzobabble?> The compatibility layer is already suffering to the point people here routinely advise the use of the IOT version of NT because it keeps the old version of the win32 support layer.Speak English.Pretty sure most people here use windows 11
>>683738498> you act like normal users or OEMs supplying them would have a choice.Why wouldn’t they have a choice, Microsoft already knows Qualcomm is incompetent >>683737208> If Dell is basically forced by Microsoft to turn Alienware into a ARM Xbox manufacturerWhen I need to take my meds> want to be the next Alienware catering to PC gamersThis feels like fan fiction at this point
>>683737208Why would steam do be the platform for gamers? Come on man many people just play cod and Fortnite and FC 25 and sports games. And valorant. And many people use other launchers.
>>683739142>ms is gonna do this whySame reason a corporation does anything. Increase value for shareholders.The vast majority of the revenue for NT comes from business customers. Their plan is to shift NT back into that market.Replacing the general purpose version of NT in the home market with a platform that shares more in common with the Xbox's cut down OS.Similar to the split that used to exist between NT and Windows, or that Apple has today with MacOS and iOS.>Pretty sure most people here use windows 11But how many of them actually paid for it? That is the problem. Microsoft makes almost no money from PC Gamers.They want the money that comes from regular subscription payments and store revenue.Without the expense of maintaining permanent legacy compatibility.It maybe not happen tomorrow, but NT will not be the platform for PC gaming forever.You may not believe it, but Valve does.
>>683739443>Microsoft already knows Qualcomm is incompetentWhich is why they put out a request for sample hardware from multiple ARM vendors.You think if Microsoft wants a chip for ARM "Xbox" hardware sold by OEMs that Nvidia or other companies wouldn't supply them?>>683739846Do you see anyone else in the industry preparing alternatives to NT after Microsoft EOLs it for the home market?Epic has no complaints about supporting walled garden platforms. You think they won't be first in line to abandon their store for NT in favor of being featured on Microsoft's new ARM platform?
>>683740168>It maybe not happen tomorrow, but NT will not be the platform for PC gaming foreverValve better work with other storefronts and companies to support Linux then>Epic has no complaints about supporting walled garden platformsNot really they shat om Microsoft for their uwp program back in the day>You think they won't be first in line to abandon their storeThey are more likely to do it than steam Microsoft and epic games do not see eye to eye at all. Pic relatedThere is a reason why fortnite doesn't work with arm on windows and a reason why halo isn't on EGS>Do you see anyone else in the industry preparing alternatives to NT after Microsoft EOLs it for the home marketMost companies do not care or think it will happen
>>683740973>Valve better work with other storefronts and companies to support Linux thenThey are, but there is only so much they can do. Especially when some see Valve as a bigger threat than Microsoft.>(Tom) shat om Microsoft for their uwp program back in the dayYet they are currently on every walled garden platform, while practically ignoring open platforms with a future. Tim also at that time said he wanted to support Wine. Yet the minute Wine became a viable solution for gaming he ignored it.>Most companies do not careExactly. This is a niche concern. Most companies only care about mainstream users. But for those of us in the niche who don't want walled gardens it is a big deal. Most of the industry will just shrug their shoulders and lock themselves in. They won't think better of it until it is too late.
>>683717262Tbh I'd love to build a living room rig that runs steam os
>>683741802>Yet they are currently on every walled garden platform,they are on android and even the alt store on iOS. They just do not care about desktop Linux.>But for those of us in the niche who don't want wallDon't you mean people who just want to use desktop Linux?
>>683741959Bazzite.gg, ChimeraOS and a few other GNU/Linux distributions fill that niche.There is really no reason to wait for Valve.
>>683742098they even went against Samsung after they removed alternative stores.
>>683717262Yes, woke pozzed S@yny is finished.
>>683741802>while practically ignoring open platforms with a futureThey do not want to bother with steam os as the amount of people who will try to sideload epic is too small to count and they do not want to pay platform fees to steam which is more than understandable
Not really. I think Sony will blow itself up and Valve will survive, if that counts.
>>683742098They ignore open platforms with a future at their own peril.Court precedents that can be overturned on a dime are no match for real technical solutions.
>>683742757>They ignore open platforms with a future at their own peril.Lol lmao.
>>683742757desktop Linux has no future especially compared to mobile
>>683742613>the amount of people who will try to sideload epic is too smallSo let me get this straight, mainstream users with no technical skill at all are very likely to jump through hoops and ignore scary messages about installing a third-party software source on their walled-garden Apple device.Meanwhile, a platform populated almost entirely by Enthusiasts and more technical users aren't likely to go to desktop mode, and install a third-party launcher? Which is a completely normal activity, presents no warnings, and extremely easy to do.I don't have the stats handy, but I'd bet that most Steam Deck users probably have at least one flatpak they've installed.Plus remember there is nothing special about Deck. Putting a Flatpak on Flathub would give Epic access to far more than SteamOS.
>>683743151Linux can fully survive a switch to a mobile future with its software library intact.Can NT users say the same?
>>683742998You're really just making my point for me there. Epic is going to jump head first into going walled garden only.They'll only think better of it when they realize platform owners have all the power.
>>683717262>>683717324Who cares? Valve is doing this to push and mature gaming on linux, that's the important thing, not how many sales it can get against the Playstation
>>683743602>Valve is doing this to push and mature gaming on linux???
>>683743212the amount of users on iOS is a lot more than desktop linux.>Meanwhile, a platform populated almost entirely by EnthusiYes, most will not move out of gaming mode at all. Epic games already know this.>probably have at least one flatpak they've installed.They don't, you underestimate the average normie
>>683742998Thanks, doc
>>683718759Timmy is a cool guy that collects rocks. I would hang with him. I would not hang with Gabe. Gaben is fat fuck.
>>683743350>Linux can fully survive a switch to a mobile futurepeople will not play pc games on their phones. Especially on android where everyone wants free stuff. The sales of aaa games were poor on iOS and would be worse on android.
>>683717262>>683720478>>683743602It’s still not Open Source even though people are demanding it. This is why should not trust some corporate company like Valve. Proton is open source but not SteamOS?! They’re clearly hiding the fact they broke open source software laws and they don’t want to be sued.
>>683743438nah they are just gonna egg platform holders to open their anusus up to third party stores, they do not want to build their own os or anything, just having the ability to sell stuff alongside bigger players. They don't really belive in valve, epic has already tried multiple times but he gave up making his own store.
>>683743831this math does not add up
>>683743831>the amount of users on iOS is a lot more than desktop linux.It was only last year that there were a lot more users playing games on MacOS than there were playing games on GNU/Linux based OSes.Now Steam for GNU/Linux is almost twice the MacOS user share on Steam. Apple made the switch to ARM. They didn't care.Because really, the amount of users on mobile today is in fact a lot more than desktop platforms in general. That is where the mainstream money is. It isn't going to change. You continue to make my point for me. How long is Microsoft really going to keep NT in the x86 compatible home desktop market? They don't make money from users who buy games from Steam or EGS.They've already made ARM versions.They've put out requests for ARM hardware.Odds are the 'next Xbox' will be ARM.NT on ARM is Microsoft's iOS.>Yes, most will not move out of gaming mode at all.Less likely than users installing a third-party store on mobile devices which involves jumping through significantly more hoops?>They don't, you underestimate the average normieSteamOS and desktop Linux are still pretty far from being a 'normie' platform.Epic continues to ruin their reputation with some of the most valuable enthusiasts.
>>683717262I installed it on a PC, and it's fuckimg rad. Not my daily driver PC, but a mini box for the living room couch. Would recommend for a living room box, but it does have the flaw of not waking from sleep via controller. Also AMD only lol. Good luck figuring out how to get Gamescope working with Nvidia.
>>683744861>Less likely than users installing a third-party store on mobile devices which involves jumping through significantly more hoops?Less users so yea>Epic continues to ruin their reputation with some of the most valuable enthusiasts.Linux isn't their most valuable users, it us people on PlayStation and Xbox. Epic could drop pc today like they did with apple and not get hurt financially.Unless everyone and PlayStation and Xbox somehow convert into Linux users nit happening.
>>683744378>It’s still not Open Source even though people are demanding it.There is no closed source special sauce in SteamOS. They distribute the source and even the iso.You can easily make another distribution that is essentially 'SteamOS', you just couldn't call it 'SteamOS'.Epic could take it, swap out the launcher, release 'EpicOS' tomorrow, and there would be nothing Valve could do.They could even make it so all you have to do is put it on a SD Card and it would just show up ready to use.
>>683745210and Linux players aren't valuable. Epic knows this and also knows that they would have a hard time selling their own gamer os whatever.
>>683745210>Linux isn't their most valuable usersPer capita it is.>Epic could drop pc today like they did with apple and not get hurt financially.Like I said, you keep making my point for me.Epic is going to dive head first into the walled gardens.I doubt their strategy is going to work.You can't 'fight for freedom' on a platform that has no freedom and no future.
>>683745681>Per capita it is.nope>>683745681>You can't 'fight for freedom' on a platform that has no freedom and no future.So no desktop Linux gotcha>Epic is going to dive head first into the walled gardens.Cause there is no other realistic alternatives, making their own operating system or console. Come on. They will continue to do what they are trying to do. Slowly make other platforms more open. And making fortnite into a massive platform foe gamers.
>>683742206>they had a generic unicorn in the children's story themed dream world of the Pyro>this is clearly a MLP referenceI remember when retards pretended to get mad over that.
>>683744378Nobody gives a fuck about open source. >but INobody that matters.
>>683745978>making their own operating system or console. Come on.Valve is. Already 5% of their paying users. More than that for revenue.>So no desktop Linux gotchaDoesn't matter really. Free UNIX platforms cannot die. Those who ignore them will be consigned to the dust bin of history along with DOS, Windows, classic MacOS, BeOS, every consoles, and the rest.>Slowly make other platforms more open.Now that actually is impossible.
I'll never understand why people insist on wanting steamOS on their desktop. Just install any distro and then install steam, basically the same thing
>>683746927>Valve is.Epic has no doesn't have the ability to make their own os or design hardware.>>683746927>Those who ignore them will be consigned to the dust bin of history along with DOS, Windows, classic MacOS, BeOS, every consoles, and the rest.so the Nintendo switch will be beaten by the steam deck? When steam has no mascot as recognisable as Mario?>Now that actually is impossible.Did it with apple
>>683717823NOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOO
>>683747316>Epic has no doesn't have the ability to make their own os or design hardware.Perhaps they should look into developing those abilities. It really isn't hard these days.All they really have to do is make a flatpak, and then have it run at launch.Long term, if you can't self host you're not going to survive.>so the Nintendo switch will be beaten by the steam deck?Steam Deck is just one Free UNIX system. UNIX is the start of the modern era. UNIX will be there at the end.Nintendo Switch almost certainly won't even be around 5 years from now.>Did it with appleOnly until that case gets overturned. Legal solutions are temporary.Open source technical solutions are forever.
>>683743602console gaymers can only think of video games in terms of our team vs their team
>>683740973what's MG+?
>>683747697>Nintendo Switch almost certainly won't even be around 5 years from now.Nintendo will continue to survive though making new consoles that reach millions>>683747867Minimum guarantees
I don't know if Valve's intention is even to really compete with consoles. They don't even try to stock in really any stores. They don't sell in many countries where other consoles do sell and they haven't advertised in major areas where consoles tend to advertise. They seem to just want to bring the viability of handheld PCs forward.
>>683737369Asus has the best warranty in the business
>>683717262sony will beat sonyall valve has to do is wait
>>683739142Lol no they don't. Most people here have a pc that doesn't meet the requirements for 11. /v/ is poorfag and third worlder central.
>>683719221they will just wait and sony will die on its own
>>683719690>Linux doesn't currently support Anti-Cheatwhy are you lying? LOLEAC runs perfectly
>>683748152https://store.steampowered.com/hwsurvey>>683748168
>>683720141>Vanguard doesn’t work as well as EA ANTICHEATboth work
>>683748293vanguard doesn't work nor does EA anticheat
>>683743831I have a Deck so I've been following "the scene" a tiny bit, and I'm going to say you're wrong.>Yes, most will not move out of gaming mode at all.>They don't, you underestimate the average normie.The average normie is not buying a Deck. The average normie is not buying the linux-based emulation machine that you need to order online. They're getting a Switch.While I don't think most Deck users do much tinkering (I certainly haven't), I'm farily certain most of them have at least tried out the desktop mode. It's right there. It's even introduced during the onboarding tutorial. It's not some secret dual boot mode you have to hold a button during startup to boot into... or anything like that. It's just a menu option on the Gaming mode UI.>>683743212A small portion of a huge market is better than a large portion of a much smaller market. Plus let's be real, Epic's main draw is Fortnite. They're playing on phones or Switches, not the Deck.
>>683747998They're still ramping Deck up, and they're going to add more SteamOS hardware in the future.Valve still needs to at least double their production scale to be at the bottom of 'console' sales volume.Right now they are 'only' at the point where the Deck is the best selling gaming PC of the modern era.
>>683739142>>683748152Why the fuck would I use Win11 when Win10 LTSC support lasts until 2032?
>>683748469>. It's even introduced during the onboarding tutorial. It's not some secret dual boot mode you have to hold a button during startup to boot into... or anything like that. It's just a menu option on the Gaming mode UI.It is only shown when you are Trying to switch the steam deck off.
So, like, in the main menu that you access often? Plus I'm pretty sure setting up a password for it was part of the introduction.
>>683744060>The sales of aaa games were poor on iOS and would be worse on android.What? You're telling me that games designed for an entirely different type of hardware don't sell well when chopped up and tried to repurpose as phone games? I would never...
>>683748469>Epic's main draw is Fortnite. They're playing on phones or Switches, not the Deck.Obviously, but Epic could easily access the Deck's market if they wanted to.They say they want Open Platforms, but they ignore them when they exist.Just like Tim said he wanted Wine not native Linux, but now ignores both solutions.
>>683717262remember when gabe promised they would release it for pc too?I know it's only meant for ayymd but novidya is finally updating their shitty drivers for linux now
>>683748742No it is only shown as an option to go into when you switch it off.>>683749007I know
>>683730653I actually play more on the Deck than my PC desu.
SteamOS is just Arch with only flatpak support because it's focused on sandboxed applications with system updates curated by Valve. Just fucking install EndeavourOS/CachyOS or some shit and only use flatpaks. Same experience.
>>683749063yes but it is too small, and most aren't playing on a deck
>>683749063I have nothing against an Epic Store on linux (although I'm already playing my free Epic games on the Deck without an issue so I don't really care) but I understand why Tim would fear that the development and maintenance costs of a Linux client for the handful of HARDCORE ENTHUSIASTS PC gamers who also want to buy v-buck cards for Fortnite might not end up profitable.
>>683749081yeah but that screen is in the menu that shows up when you press the steam-button, which is available always whether a game is running or not. so it's like the start menu in windows. not exactly an obscure feature.
>>683749161and the market for people who would actually install egs on a steam deck is too low for them to care>>683749278Yea that is just crazy I doubt the people who will going through those hoops will buy vbucks.
>>683749081>when you switch it offI have gone to that menu to "Switch to Desktop" a thousand times. I have never gone into that menu to turn it off.
>>683749548I mean, there aren't any "hoops" to speak of outside of using Linux in general. But that single hoop in itself is a pretty good filter for Fortnite players.Although who knows in the future. I'm not one of those "Linux will be mainstream in 5 years' time!" people, but how every device is now becoming a walled garden shitshow it's entirely possible something linux-based could become "the new macbook". You know, the standard laptop students buy.
>>683749970>it's entirely possible something linux-based could become "the new macbook". You know, the standard laptop students buy.And when I say this, it's not because I think people will suddenly get more interested in Linux. It's because I don't think zoomies know fuck all about Windows or Mac either. Their computers are just web browser machines. Their text editor is Google docs. Their messaging app is discord or whatever website.So no one would even notice if the OS underneath it was Linux. And modern Distros are becoming pretty idiot-proof.
>>683717262What's preventing you from just installing it on your PC? The deck is functionally a PC anyway.
>>683750281The SteamOS you can download is not identical to the one that ships with the Deck, nor does it have the best driver support for whatever non-Deck PC you're installing it on.
>>683717262the deck is a very nice device imoprice/performance and functionality is unmatched
>>683750459You can in fact download the same one that is on the Deck.But as you say, the hardware choices in the Deck are the secret sauce that makes it work so well.If you've built a PC to run Windows it isn't going to work for you.But there are distributions like Bazzite.gg that offer similar functionality for gaming and broader hardware compatibility.
>>683717823Steam deck has a tdp limiter that you can access with a single button. This guy chose not to utilize it. If he deagged it to 3 watts, the performance would still be just as good except the battery would last as long as the ally
>>683753279He already used the tdp limiter on both the ally and steam deck oled
>>683752115$649 dolaroos
I don’t care about steamOS, but I want to know how they made a pc with console-like pricing, and if they could do the same with a more powerful steam machine. $500-$700 for a series x level pc would be great. I know you can build them, but not without ridiculous cost cutting, deals, and questionable parts
>>683754457why is the NES game drawing 9.5W then?
>>683755462It's a indie game...Indie games that mimick the look of retro stuff are always harder to run than the games they're based off
>>683754603The steam deck itself is build with relatively high quality parts, something you don't find on modern consoles anymore, so really it must be them being happy with less profit than public shareholder companies, cutting cost in logistics, and maybe eating the R&D cost on the steamOS as something they wanted to do either way, so they didn't factor that into the price.
>>683755948from all the interviews with Gabe he really sees this as an important step in their linux plan that's been going on for 15 years now.I'm not saying he's selling the deck cheap out of charity, but more like a loss-leader approach where he's imagining the Steam Deck 3 sold in every Walmart and under every christmas tree in 20 years.
>>683756240>but more like a loss-leader approachDeck isn't sold for a loss. Just at a lower profit than many other systems.It has two big advantages that keep the cost down, the custom SOC, and the fact that Valve's GNU/Linux initiative costs them less than what Windows licenses would cost.
>>683756978Every console has its own OS without licensing costs. They also all use custom SOCs.
>>683717324fpbp
>>683756978Maybe not at an outright loss, but their margins are razor-thin if any. I seriously doubt Valve could sell the Deck at its current price and still pay their employees and R&D etc. if they didn't fund the project with other Steam income.
>>683759246The chipset has less tflops then chinese chinkshit phones selling for half the price
>>683760205At the begining maybe now ppffffttt, even asus isn't selling the rog ally at a loss and it is pretty much the same price as the oled steam deck in the uk. Never belive hardware manufacturers when they say their shit is expensive to build, they are almost always lying. Corpos are scum
>>683760205chinese chinkshit phone manufacturers aren't paying $250k/yr to their Seattle-based employees
>>683757169Yes, that is normal for a console, but not for a PC like the Deck.
>>683759246Them not having to split the money with another store is also helping.
>>683760205Chinkshit works by taking existing parts and creating some kind of a frankenstein's monster out of them. Of course you can keep costs down when you have no original research or development, zero customer service, no HR, no marketing etc. Just one underpaid chink slave you pay to figure out how to mash the parts together and then you rely on "the specs" to sell it to some fat retard.That's not at all the same as designing a device from the group up to be "the perfect gaming handheld" that you tinker with for years and create a special OS for with the intention of creating a brand. Chinkshit doesn't care if all their phones break a month after shipping or if the users find it uncomfortable to use, they're already operating under a new name.
>>683761949>>683760345Also I'm not saying the Deck is perfect, just that they tried to. Have you seen the amount of different prototypes they went through? Chinkshit mentality would be just to find the first plastic housing that fits the screen and the components, preferably from some surplus sale if possible, slap it together and put it on sale right away.There is so much more that goes into manufacturing a physical product that just the price of the parts alone. And that shit gets expensive.
