Why does everyone pretend these types of games are RPGs when they're not?
>>720581565RPG means nothing nowadays.
>>720582712If this image didn’t have that signature I would’ve assumed it was some sort of AI slop (unless it still is)
>>720581565>It has an inventory with items that have static stat number increasesSounds like an RPG to me.Name a game that is NOT an RPG that has this
>>720581565I dunno, Anon. You're very clearly playing the role of some obviously male "they/them" freak in Undertale.
Technically you can play different roles in UT
>>720584362THIS is AI slop.
>>720585419I don't know why but I feel nothing when I see AI slop even when I can't tell that it's AI slop.
>>720585775your eyes might not be able to tell but your soul still can
>>720584532Castlevania SOTN
>>720581565Because you role play in them. Definitionally making them RPGs.
>>720586272Also, my dick.
>>720586807your dick is connected to your soul
>>720584673Frisk is a girl, though? You are thinking of Deltarune.
>>720587120Frisk is a boy, why would he flirt with Toriel otherwise?
>>720587315Toby is a yurifag
>>720587315For the same reason she flirts with Papyrus. She's BI.
>>720581565>stats matter in combat and increase as you level up>choice matters and can change the flow of the story, moreso than in most RPGs actuallysounds like an RPG
>>720587354Then how come you can cuck a dyke or rape her straight?>>720587437Only men care about milfs though.
>>720587315Frisk is a boy.Chara is a girl.Simple as.
>>720587497>Only men care about milfs though.Alphys in canon finds Toriel attractive. And she's a girl.
>>720587571You ship Charisk while self-inserting as Frisk.
>>720587756Nope, chara asriel if anything.
>>720587497toby is also an ntrfag
>>720587668Alphys was originally supposed to be a man, plus she's a special case, she drools literally over everyone. I'd call her pansexual, because she most definitely masturbated with a pan.
tony fox here to announce chara is no longer canon in any way, shape or formthe update removing chara from undertale will roll out tomorrow, sorry
>>720587948Huh. Most of the time boy Frisk x girl Chara are Chara waifufags that just use Frisk as a self-insert fuel. Even though I follow girl Frisk supremacy, you aren't half bad yourself.
>>720588294desu toby should have done that and free us from the curse he inflicted upon the worldhopefully he won't repeat this mistake with DR
>>720588162So is Frisk. She flirts with freaking moldsmall for crying out-loud. She is as freaky as Alphys.
i wonder what will happen if i post the word avatar
>>720588294God I hope so
>>720588294Based. Based. Based. Based.
return to form when? I need more of these 2 idiots
>>720590360dont think this is a regular yellow thread bro.
>>720590510it is now
>>720581565Because modern language has devolved into a complete lack of meaning. No one tries to learn the meaning of words, only the context they're used, leading to a misunderstanding of the meaning. This mixed with the internet creates an abhorrent abomination of language as anything can mean anything, people try to redefine words to make themselves right, and genuine discussion is dead.UT being called an RPG is an example, because people saw games called RPG have choices, and you can choose to save or kill people in UT, therefore it must be an RPG!
>>720590782That's how language has always been, anon. The idea that language has definite rules and meanings which are correct was a delusion invented by 19th century scholars, trying pointlessly to make sense of the inherently nonsensical nature of human language.
>>720590782for me it has stats, items, equipment and turn based battles, that's a RPG (or at least a JRPG)
>>720590678Post your Steamworks IDsWhen the Mario Paint minigame came up I knew what I needed to do.https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=e0VUprkc1n0
>>720591957is that the same one from the Joel Mario Paint stream?Speaking of which, I'm still hoping Joel makes good on his word and plays UTY.
>>720588294Sebastian Wolf here to recant on what Robert said here. Chara is now officially the only Undertale character in existence. I will also be flagging any work without Chara for copyright.
>>720592071I don't know if Joel ever did that one in particular, I just pulled a random Bob Ross episode and got to work.I don't recall Joel saying he'd play UTY but if he does I hope he understands the assignment if he checks out the neutral route.
>>720591140Fuck you.My problem isn't that language naturally changes over time anon, it's the fact that while yes, words can change, they still have to have a definition behind them, not a vibe. And while to some degree the definition behind words will change, it has generally been at a slow enough pace that people can still be understood by everyone who uses the language. That's why it's important for people to understand the definition, so that people can understand each other.>>720591669Behold, a JRPG!
>>720581565Because "RPG" doesn't have the same kind of incessant obnoxious wannabe hardcore faggots who screech whenever someone calls a game a roguelike instead of a roguelite.Start being really fucking annoying, enter every discussion with 'ackshually it only has RPG Elements' and other shit.
>>720592401xcom is a RPG, just not a JRPG (it usually has no fixed story and gameplay comes first, while JRPGs tend to focus more on story over gameplay)
>>720592401>they still have to have a definition behind themWho decided that? Definitions are a post hoc clarification added on to words after the fact. The vibes came first. All that words need to exist are a shared idea or feeling between two people and the need to label that thing. A clear definition of that label is entirely optional and comes second to how people actually use it.> it has generally been at a slow enough pace that people can still be understood by everyone who uses the languageThis has never been true, and a couple hundred years ago it wasn't even close to true. It was perfectly normal for a person from one town to ask for a plate of eggs, and for the person serving him to be absolutely baffled why he was asking for a plate of eyes despite both of them speaking the same language, and its always been the case that old people have trouble understanding young people's slang.You mistakenly believe that the world exists as a clearly defined set of systems with hard rules, when its really a mess of whatever works and random bullshit that has been forced in to broad and vague classifications by us for the sake of making things easier to manage.
>>720592401I've always considered tactics games (at least the Xcom variety) to be an evolution of CRPGS.
>>720592330I'm pretty sure he did use that one on his stream. Also he said he was considering playing UTY in his chapter 4 stream, and said he would play it in his Bergentruck and Lightners Live streams.
I have missed these threads for a few months.Has there been any new Return to Form? Has Sig made any new art? Where DID that kid go?
>>720593468You're referring to dialect, which are still developed through long periods of time. And while yes, dialects can develop into the point of those languages being different, that's a can of worms that's not worth getting into because of the inability to divide between dialects and languages.And again, you fucking faggot, I'm not saying 'oh, these things need to have this definition and never change', I'm making a point that the rapid evolution of language due to people using the wrong word in a context that their meaning is still able to be inferred is creating a situation where people are incapable of communicating. Lacking a definition turns words into literal meaningless garbage because they could mean literally anything. It removes the point of words entirely, leaving only understanding through context clues.
>>720594198>Has there been any new Return to Form?Maybe a chapter or 2, updates have slowed down>Has Sig made any new art?Some pieces, mostly deltarune related but there were a few UTY ones>Where DID that kid go?If you mean the comic, chapter 10 has kinda killed me, I am almost done with it but now I draw maybe a page per week because I am legitimately burned out, but I still lurk in the threads
>>720592325you're fired seb
>>720594392Where's my other 20K dollars, Toby? Otherwise I will leak Deltarune again.
>>720594343>If you mean the comicGlad you are still here.I was just making a reference to Undertale Yellow the Musical.https://youtu.be/7igkrXICjLk?si=k6ijKzJP-R_8rYBE&t=76
>>720594518you can find them up your ass
>>720594296>I'm making a point that the rapid evolution of language due to people using the wrong word in a context that their meaning is still able to be inferred is creating a situation where people are incapable of communicating. Lacking a definition turns words into literal meaningless garbage because they could mean literally anything. It removes the point of words entirely, leaving only understanding through context clues.And I'm saying its always been this way. Maybe its slightly faster now, but its not that much faster than it was before. Its just more noticeable because now all these different groups with their own unique dialects are smashed together in the same space with no way of telling which dialect they should be using based on the person they're talking to, and a severely handicapped in the usage of context clues via the lack of sound or bodily gestures to communicate them.
>>720586553Its an Action RPG
>>720594343If you ever give up, just dump all of what you have. We'd still rather have a bunch of uncolored comics with no typesetting than nothing at all.
>>720594706Yep. Chapter 5 is being leaked. People won't be ready for the ASSWHORE battle music.
>>720592325Ice Wolf here to remind you that I'm actually a girl(biological) who likes human men. I'm tired of waiting for one to ask me out, so I'm just going to take the next one I see home with me, by force if I have to.
>>720594936go ahead lil' bitch, do it
>>720587120Toby's words, not mine.
>>720594343Of nice, you are still alive
>>720596330That one deleted tweet? Tweets aren't canon. I wouldn't be surprised nowadays if Toby kneeled to girl Frisk because of how popular it is in nippon.
reminder that ceroba is fat
>>720596481Flat like a can of coke.
>>720596771nako is stacked after the 'tegrity infection
>>720596448wrong bitch, that one specific tweet is now canonfrisk has a 10 incher just like my dear friend motherfucker mike "el loco bandito" matei
>>720596872Correct
>>720596771not when I'm done with her
>>720596938Toby would never say this because he would never get Japanese pussy again if he did.
>>720597278Does Coke have chocolate milk?
>>720597448Does this artist have a hand fetish?
>>720597560I don't know. I don't remember they drawing hands before.
>>720597705Look at how detailed it is compared to everything else.
>>720597448the japanese already know and i give japanese pussy my own 10 incher every day
>>720597780I thought that was just for effect.>>720597862All my Japanese fanart disagrees with you, Mr.Toby. I think working on Deltarune for so long is making you crazy.
>>720597936its their headcanon and they understand it as such, but you don't, now bend over, you're taking my 10 incher next
>>720598034Whoa! Toby Fox is gay???
>>720598573i'm a serial rapist, and i don't discriminate, that's what the weird route is all about
>>720597448>>720597936>Japanese fanart>Posts korean comics
>>720598573He is at least bisexual.
>>720598738do you think a 0 iq avatarfag knows the difference
>>720598738I am racist.>>720598747Toby's canon? Irrelevant. We live in a fanon world now.
>Namefags>UT/DR fags>No Undertale Yellow discussionThis is beyond depressing. Where did the UTY fanbase go?
>>720598951killed by redditors
>>720598951they've dispersed, there's nothing left to discuss
>>720598951The namefags are clearly just shitposting, though.
>>720598951I'm actually here for other fangames. On the subject of that. Do you think it would be fitting to skip the intro in my UT fangame and have a cold open?
>>720599246What would the intro have been?
>>720598951You can waltz on right over to >>>/trash/ if you really want to talk about furries.
>>720599468you will never be a somethingawful goon but just like them you will also never be a woman, now go join lowtax
>>720598951>Where did the UTY fanbase go?Three of our oldest fangame devs are busy playing silksong
>>720599092Undertale still gets regular threads, and it’s a game that came out almost 10 years ago.Hell, Nine Sols still gets semi-regular threads while keeping the same energy.So what gives? Is there something about Yellow that makes it less interesting than UT?
>>720599246Some games benefit from a cold open. It depends on how it's written. Does the player get drawn in with more mystery from an intro, or from a mysterious world he's thrust into?
>>720599829Most Undertale/Deltarune threads have been dead lately, too. Archiving in ten to forty posts. This is one of the most active ones.
>>720599456A a poetic sounding narration from an unnamed narrator who addresses you directly. They tell you about the humans, the monsters, and the war.If you want a general vibe, its inspired by the lyrics of the opening of the epic of gilgamesh https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=QUcTsFe1PVs Going for that "long ago, when bread was first baked" feeling.
>>720599897I suspect a lot of people stopped checking /v/ because of constant thread nukes. It's not a good board if most threads that either don't fellate Nintendo, court flamewars/gooning or be an AI art thread are deleted. Why waste time browsing the catalog every day?
>>720599889I'd say the world, but the intro can be important to introducing the player to the world.
>>720600009I think you should keep it, then. I really like when people keep Undertale's fairytale vibe. Heck, even Yellow did it with its intro.
>>720600334The ONE thread that gained traction got deleted, so yeah, I can get that.
>>720600489I know, but at the same time, I could do a deltarune style cold open that ties into the game's main plot point without giving too much away, then drops the player into an unfamiliar environment with no one around to give you an explanation. Leaving the player to look around and try to figure out what's going on.
>>720600836Deltarune literally does have an entire intro with Gaster, though.
>>720600931I'd call that a cold open. Its not an intro explaining things and trying to get you into the mood like Undertale.
>>720601001Well, it depends if you want the game to be more like Deltarune versus Undertale. Fairy tale versus a young fantasy novel.
>>720600836>>720600489I should clarify that I'd still the DR style opening after the Undertale style fairy tale intro.
>>720600931Undertale plays its intro straight…well, for the most part. The meaning of the intro is subverted only at the very end.Deltarune's intro is both subversive and out-there. It's extremely mysterious and it leads you to believe that you're controlling a custom character, only to take it away from you. Maybe Deltarune will finally give your custom character back, but for now the has almost nothing to do with the game. It's more of a cold open.
>>720601065I would say its a lot more immediately fantastic than Deltarune, but its also more somber than Undertale. I wouldn't say its like a YA novel though, I hate YA. If I had to compare it to a novel, it would be like a weird cross between Lord of The Rings and Disc World.
>>720601336I say keep the intro, then.
>>720601495>>720601313I have a subversion planned involving that fairy tale intro that would only come into play at the end of the game, with the ending completely recontextualizing the intro based on which ending you got, but if I cut the intro then I can have the player feel just as lost and confused as the in the in universe player character (since there's an amnesia plot early on), which could really help to set the tone and immerse the player.
>>720601754How about playing the intro in parts during the game?
>>720602068No, that wouldn't work. The intro is supposed to frame the whole game as a story being told to you.
>>720602319Well, then I think making different versions might be the player?
>>720602654What?
>>720602738Like, different versions that play at each ending, and each tell a story from a different point of view.
>>720603020The endings would be different, but they all require that the story start by being told like its a fairy tale.
>>720603118I think you should do it in the intro, then.
>>720599897the only reason they die is because they get autosaged or worse. when untouched they still regularly reach bump limit. >>720598951my brother visits on saturdays and i refrain from the autism until later.
>>720601754What if it's like old games where the fairytale is explained in the manual (or webpage, readme, etc) rather than as an in-game intro? That might potentially be the best of both worlds.
>>720604704honestly might be a nice approach, could be lost on some people but others may feel its "novel" like a return to form
>>720604704That would be a cheap cop out that most players would miss. Besides, the ending hinges pretty heavily on that established narrator character from the opening. They need to be in the game for that payoff to work.
>>720604704Toby drops a lot of lore in ARG and websites outside his games, so you might be onto something here. If you're feeling adventurous, you could have the general story in the "manual" and throw in some easter eggs for the player to find.
>>720605671Maybe I could still throw the setup in the manual, but I would still likely have to cut that ending recontenxtualizing the beginning angle alongside any narrator related stuff.
Stop what you're doing and post Martlet's talons.
>>720605984
>>720605984>Zartlet, after killing Clover trying to get her giant grippers in the shredded remnants of her bootsWould she wrap them or just go barefoot?
>>720606172>wrap themwith what? She shredded her pants too. Realistically, her only choice is barefoot.
>>720606553Footwraps with cloth bandages. I worded it vaguely but I mean long-term, after the fight (and assuming she doesn't turn into goop, which a lot of fanart does assume), what she'll do about those big talons.
>>720605403I'd normally agree with you, but I think this case is special in that people are way more likely to read the webpage for a fangame. And framing the webpage's narration as an in-game character did work for Doki Doki Literature Club, for example.But I don't know the full details, and ultimately it's your story to tell. If you think presenting the back story as an in-game intro is vital for the payoff to work, go for it.
I wonder if the pregnancy guy'll be back this thread.
>>720599246>Do you think it would be fitting to skip the intro in my UT fangame and have a cold open?which fangame?
>>720607825I don't want to say which one for fear of spoilers. All you need to know is that the setting is different from regular Undertale's.
>>720608638Any time someone here says they can't elaborate without revealing who they are I assume it's the Oldentale guy
Do I want to know what game this comes from?
>>720609063just an undertale fangame.if you didnt like undertale you probably wouldnt like the fangame.
>>720609063Undertale Yellow. OP doesn't have the name because of an overzealous janitor who deletes video games he doesn't like on sight. It's good for a fangame and extremely good by the standards of Undertale fangames
>>720581565If it was an rpg it'd be shit. This is just a shmup with padding.
I've had some extra time and a micro-craving for RPG adventures, and so have played Undertale Yellow. Finished neutral and pacifist (killing Ceroba of course), but skimmed through genocide playthrough (due to general disinterest). Please enjoy the following blogpost(s) of a review.The quick rundown is that it's undeniably a fangame, following the derogatory meaning of "fanfiction", exhibiting all the usual excesses of a work that is so very derived from another's. Not terrible by any measure, but most of my thoughts are not dedicated to the game itself, but to how would I remix and improve it. What is terrible is the implication that Yellow is the best project the whole """fandom""" has to offer, since it garnered a not!general on /v/ee of all places. What a sad state of affairs, guess nothing since Red Riding Hood one-off battle way back when really took off.AS THE GAME ITSELFThe effort put into the visuals is respectable, but sometimes creeps into the annoying territory. I think the burning rock puzzles early on is the worst it gets with slow panning, but I did get frustrated with a couple of smaller things later on. I don't think I can hum any melody off the top of my head, but I did like plenty of music in the moment. The instant retry and running are nice features, but skip text is notably absent. And speaking of QoL from Deltarune, there are barely any mechanically interesting ACTs. The battles are overall harder to a comfortable degree. The most notable difficulty increase is turn length. Sourced straight from my ass, but some patterns feel way too long. I made liberal use of speedhack for final bosses as a bullet hell shitter, so no comments on the quality of shooting and dashing.
>>720610308The original story, all the Martlet-Starlo-Ceroba stuff, is mostly dull. I found nothing annoying when it comes to pure prose, but I largely checked out when it came to character side stories. I entirely agreed with my main man Flowey, there ain't no time to waste on those losers. But it was pretty funny to find out the reason behind Toriel snatching the "Worst Mother" trophy away from Ceroba. If anything, Martlet was substantially better as a tragic character, sufferring different fates on all the different routes, probably because that was legit plot and not some TRAGIC BACKSTORY.I very much like Flowey playing the part of your best friend and technically being more determined among the two. Wish there were more opportunities for banter, playing up how Flowey doesn't expect Clover to remember any prior runs. The fact that the player character is given both a name and a goal, but not a more defined personality is weird. Except being a wimp I suppose, but that feels more like a contrivance so that pacifist route follows into Undertale proper, rather than a deliberate plot point. Another weird thing is the "a literal child fell down into the Underground" angle, which is emphasized by all the OCs, but isn't actually relevant. I think the only time it worked was when Ceroba realized that her fumbling in the Steamworks did nothing and the little kid enabled the power himself. Clover doesn't even wear a striped shirt, what is this shit?
>>720610420AS A FANGAMEThe elephant in the room is that Yellow is committed to the unenviable task of making a prequel to Undertale. "Unenviable", because as another indie goat once put it:>there's the group of distinctive and original games which inspire artistic respect, which do their own thing within a specific and deliberate range: games like a blurred line, sunset over imdahl, the way 1-6... finished one-offs. they're good games but in a way which discourages direct imitation or continuation: the fact that they're complete, that they've done just what they decided to do, is part of their power, but it also limits their hold on the imagination, and their influence.Even if that very last part sounds ironically inappropriate for Undertale, I believe it's why fandom is infamous for all the AUs. There can't really be sequels or prequels (no matter what delusional fanboys trying to tie UT and DR together think), it's a very self-contained story, anything spilling out of that containment can only go downhill. The exact timeline of all the fallen children, how or why they gave up, technology levels, state of the surface world, etc. Yellow was not subtle enough to sidestep all those uncertainties, which is a negative imho, but not a dealbreaker.Yellow also suffers from retreads in way too many places. Nefarious soul experiments, larper who based everything on human media, robots that give EXP somehow, ineffective dork of a character stepping up when shit hits the fan. A family of other boss monsters who are kitsunes with japanese flavor is so hilariously indulgent, I don't even need to elaborate why it's laughable. The implication that a grown woman dresses like a magical girl appeals to my depraved sensibilities, but doesn't salvage that situation. Flowey's role in the story works well as a remix, even if his betrayal is a bit too obvious.
>another totally not a general thread>>>/vg/
>>720610308>there are barely any mechanically interesting ACTsThis is one of the most common complaints with UTY battle system, the acts for most bosses do nothing, you just have to wait if you want to go the pacifist routeUndertale acts are also simpler when compared to Deltarune acts but at least in UT the bosses usually had more unique acts like challenging Undyne, paying to Muffet or the stuff you could with Mettaton
>>720610526FANFICTION FOR A FANGAMEAnd now for something completely different: fanfiction for a fangame.I'd say the biggest missed opportunity is copypasting of pacifism and genocide routes, just because it's what Undertale is about. The fans expect it, there isn't much to explore after the original game, and that is precisely why it shouldn't have been a thing. We already know what happens when a mongolian 5 year old is determined to kill/spare everybody, but what about a cowboy in pursuit of justice? What Yellow needed is to take a clue from westerns it's not even trying to ape, and what justice means as a seperate axis. Justice is not about the kind and the cruel, but the innocent and the guilty, and routes focused on that would give Yellow a character beyond "an Undertale fangame".While I think "missing poster" shtick was not good at all (because it highlights how recently all the kids fell down), the concept that a human child would seek justice among monsters is alright. I think blindly being nice to everybody, just like actively slaughtering everybody should have led the player into a softlock/badend sort of scenario, like Sans tried to be but for real. You've spared one too many begrudging monster, or harmed too many of those who did not deserve it, and so justice is not on your side. The route split shouldn't be about going all in, but different approaches to justice in the context of the Underground. If you feel like killing monsters is a step too far to consider just, then why not treat it like battles in Deltarune? Beat the shit out of monsters and spare them at gunpoint (at low health that is), because some people respect only force. A sharpshooter sheriff can shoot the hat off any outlaw to show what "dead or alive" really means.
>>720610568So the neutral route would be gunning straight for Asgore, as he is the one ultimately responsible, and playing into Flowey's plan. The wholesome route would involve actively getting into monsters' affairs, much to Flowey's chagrin, like any shonen hero would. The edgy route would be about hunting down those who directly killed other humans, which is another sidetrack for Flowey, but vengeance never meant resting easy. You don't need to go full Death Note, but a fangame NOT focused on constant mercy would certainly be more surprising to the fans.>tl;drIt's alright but nothing too impressive.
>>720610748P.S. oh shit wrong reply
didn't read any of that post
>>720588080>Making normal UTY discussion into Deltarune cuck fetish shit discussion>Projecting your fetishes parasocially onto Toby FoxDestroy all UTDR newgens now. I would rather take slop hmofa Ceroba posters here than any of this
>>720611785>slop hmofa CerobaI actually haven't seen too much of that in these threads, most people here vehemently oppose the idea of Ceroba being with anyone other than Chujin.
>>720599829Anon, without being biased as a UTY fan, it’s cause UTY just has way less content than UTDR combined. Plus, there’s not much shipping bait in UTY, and most of the wider UTY fanbase that’s left wouldn’t be interested in whatever is normally discussed on 4chan
>>720611785I'll be sure to wake up the AIslop guy so he knows he's cleared for this thread
>>720581565The worst part about JRPGs is how they confused people as to what an actual RPG is.
>>720611906Okay, that is true. I just think the hmofa posters are a loud group probably
>>720611990Every game is a role playing game dipshit, you play a role in every game.
>>720612012Eh, I'd say it varies.Personally, I think it'd be nice to have a bit more Ceroba hmofa stuff than we have now.
>>720611785I don't like NTR, its just painfully obvious that's what tobert is into, since he puts so much of it in his games.Though I guess if you wanted to make this into an on topic discussion, there's always that one thing we could talk about.
>>720612147>he puts so much of it in his games.Explain.
>>720612012Most of the hmofa stuff is Martlet or Kanako centric.
>>720612147Begone Redditor
>>720611912when the threads aren't getting banished we still usually manage to have good weekly threads that hit bump limit with tons of discussion. the weekend silksong came out is the first time we had trouble with that, and it was really just helped along by thread deletion.
>>720581565>ugly nonhuman thing is actually the morally right and sympathetic character >play as human in a ugly nonhuman society and learn about how morally right and sympathetic they are I yawned so long I stopped breathing and died My soul is now leaving the thread
>>720612221>Anything involving Noelle>Anything involving Sans>Anything involving Rouxls
>>720612240>it was really just helped along by thread deletion.A shame too, since the threads that got deleted last time actually had some decent discussion and activity before the janny got 'em.And then I got sent to the shadow realm for three days for the trouble, too.
>>720612221Anon is probably referring to Asgore-Toriel-Sans when it’s not. It’s just a divorceSusie is also taking Noelle to the festival in the normal route despite Noelle getting cuck accusations. Neither Krusie nor Suselle will be pure endgame in my opinion
>>720612239No, I think I'll stay.
honestly while we "meme" about ceroba being retarded, and her versus toriels kid killing count, but I think they do work as a good contrast in character between eachother. Toriels avoidant approach to her issues, ceroba making her own issues worse with the one track mind way she handled things. things got a little (a lot) messy in the story with the original version of ceroba clashing with what she became but overall it feels like they made something that highlights some characters from the original game really well. Martlet on the other hand is fleshed out really well when you take every route together, and personally comes out as my favorite character at the end of all things, but when you just look at the pacifist route it just feels like they tried throwing "discount papyrus" at the wall.
>>720612418>Anon is probably referring to Asgore-Toriel-Sans when it’s not. It’s just a divorceIts spiritually NTR, and its mother NTR when Kris is kept up all night by Toriel getting boned.>Susie is also taking Noelle to the festival in the normal route despite Noelle getting cuck accusationsIf Suselle happens, then Kris is being cucked, if Krusie happens then Noelle is being cucked, when (you)elle occured Susie was cucked. If none happen then they're all cucked.
>>720612308>"Anything involving Noelle"Kinda? That really only works if you interpret Kris and Susie as being romantically involved, and that may or may not actually pan out.>"Anything involving Sans"Only in DR, and even then, that's not NTR if none of the involved parties are cheating on anyone else. That's just typical divorce shit, it happens.>"Anything involving Rouxls"Okay, you get that one, but that only really started being a thing in chapter 3, and it seems like that was a mostly one-off thing for his character, so I wouldn't say it applies to *anything* involving him.
>>720612396yeah, it was honestly just a shitty timing that threw off discussion for a bit, but inbetween the autism we have, and honestly even some of the worst autism we have is tolerable compared to a lot of the site, we were still getting good video game related discussion in.
>>720612571>mother NTRYeah that's not a term, you're just slapping NTR onto random shit at this point and insisting it makes sense when it doesn't.>If Suselle happens, then Kris is being cucked, if Krusie happens then Noelle is being cucked, when (you)elle occured Susie was cucked. If none happen then they're all cucked.Okay, I'm starting to get the feeling that this may be a sensitive subject for you, but someone not ending up in a relationship with someone else doesn't mean that person got cucked, it just means they're single.Especially if literally *none* of the various parties involved end up together, since there literally isn't anyone to do the cucking in the first place.
>>720610526> the unenviable task of making a prequel to Undertale>There can't really be sequels or prequels> it's a very self-contained storyIts a challenge, sure, but I don't think its impossible. You just have to keep in mind what Undertale is about, and make sure your prequel game flows from there. Undertale is a thematic story first, a character story second, and a lore story third. So your game should stem from the themes of Undertale. Have an interesting response to what Undertale had to say? A different take on the same themes? A different set of video game tropes that you think you the setting would lend itself to making a commentary on? Then from there you make your characters to fit that theme and play off each other while capturing that same silliness as Undertale. Finally you write your plot and lore to string all of those things together.What UTY got wrong in its methodology is that it started with the plot first, then the characters, then last it thought of the themes. That, and the writers refused to go back and rewrite things when they really should have.
>>720612617>That's just typical divorce shit,divorce shit is NTR
>>720613056Ah, you're one of those, I see now.I'm sorry you had a bad experience, divorce is a shitty thing to have to deal with, but you shouldn't let that develop into an overly generalized view of things like that, there's more nuance to these sorts of things than you might appreciate.
>>720612803>Yeah that's not a term, you're just slapping NTR onto random shit at this point and insisting it makes sense when it doesn'tIts the same as NTR in spirit. Sans is fucking Toriel, knows Kris hates him doing it, and doubles down specifically to fuck with Kris. Meanwhile Kris has to just sit there and listen to it because she's his mother and she's divorced, so he doesn't have any ground to stand on, even if anyone could tell you what she's doing is horrible.
>the mom NTR schizo is still aroundDepressing.
>>720613204>Ah, you're one of those, I see now.What's that supposed to mean>I'm sorry you had a bad experienceHaven't had any experiences with divorce at all. I just find the people who do it to be disgusting in most cases.The nuance is both parties mutually deciding that they don't want to be married anymore, or one spouse being a threat to the other's life, which is clearly not the case here. Toriel left Asgore because she randomly decided to start hating him for doing nothing wrong, took the house, the kids, and his job, and everyone suffered for it. The only person who benefits from this arrangement is Sans.
>>720613432You are talking about at least two people. He coined the term and now I'm using it here because it fits.
>>720613243>Sans is fucking TorielMetaphorically maybe.>knows Kris hates him doing itQuestionable, Sans doesn't really seem to be all there in that scene either, he's likely just as drunk as Toriel is (albeit way better at hiding it), and probably isn't actually focusing on how Kris feels about things.>doubles down specifically to fuck with Kris.Also questionable. We see Sans make jokes of that sort of nature towards Kris, but he only really does it once in the first chapter, and largely just makes his normal kind of jokes towards them after that.>what she's doing is horrible.How so? I understand if you're arguing that Toriel should try and ease Kris into having Sans as a part of their life like that, but the base concept of Toriel moving on from Asgore and getting with someone new isn't "horrible", it's just a part of life.If you're talking about her effectively abandoning Kris and Susie by not being where she said she'd be during an emergency, *then* you have a point, but the rest of that other shit is subjective.
>>720613467>Toriel left Asgore because she randomly decided to start hating him for doing nothing wrong, took the house, the kids, and his job, and everyone suffered for it.We don't know the full story about what happened between them in the DR universe, but based on Asgore's dialogue in chapter 4, it sounds like he learned about all the weird dark fountain conspiracy shit by himself and didn't really know how to handle it in regards to his normal life and whatever went down with Dess, and *that's* what made Toriel divorce him.If that's the case, that sucks, and he pretty objectively doesn't deserve what's happened to him, but in the context of the world of DR, knowing that all the stuff about dark worlds and the bunker and whatnot is a fairly well kept secret, you can't really blame Toriel for thinking Asgore went off the deep end if that's all really what happened.Again, that sucks for Asgore, but it wouldn't be unreasonable from Toriel's perspective.
I feel like complaining about Toriel, Asgore, or Sans in Deltarune is kind of stupid because we don’t know the whole story yet and chapter 5, which is coming out in only a few months, will elaborate on it a lot more.
>>720613892>few monthsyou poor innocent fool.we are getting chapter 5 next october with toby posting "I AM TAKING TOO LONG" and the dog getting rushed by jack.
>>720613892>in only a few monthsIt could be 15 months away (more if it gets delayed)
>>720613968>inb4 it drops tomorrow during the UT anniversary instead
>>720613968Deltarune chapter 5 will drop at exactly 12:00:01 1/1/26 actually, Tony told me himself.
>>720613968>>720613989Current schizo theory is that it’ll come out on national flower day (March 21st)
Do you guys think Martlet has hollow bones, on account of being a bird?
>>720614092miracle of the universe
>>720612239/v/ whines about Reddit but they're the ones putting out actual UTY art
>>720614073Anon, you forgot the timezone.>>720614120But why?
>>720614174redditors make "art" (OC slop spam image 501290)we make fangames.
>>720614140indeed
>>720614186>Anon, you forgot the timezone.Timezones were invented by clock manufacturers to sell more clocks around the world by making people need to own multiple clocks in order to know what time it is in other "zones".
>>720614262>we make fangames.Yes, in the same sense that "we" put a man on the moon.Also, it only counts if there's an actual finished product to show off, that's why UTY continues to be the topic of discussion, because it's the only one of note to actually be a finished thing.
>>720614186Because Chapter 5 is gonna be in Flower King. This theory will die if the newsletter drops and he says the game will be in the second half of 2026.
>>720613554>How so?For one thing, she shouldn't be getting piss drunk with some random she met at a convenience store a few days ago and spending all night partying with him and (metaphorically) fucking him, while not at all caring about where her son is or how he's doing.Another thing is she shouldn't be fucking Sans at all. She shouldn't have wrecked a perfectly functional home over something stupid like hating Asgore, especially not if she has kids. She gave up that right when she took the wedding vow. This isn't normal, it isn't right, and its an evil thing to pretend it is. Its a genuine societal problem we have. That aside, she could at least wait until Kris is grown up and left before she starts bringing over ugly bastards to bone.>but he only really does it once in the first chapter, and largely just makes his normal kind of jokes towards them after that.That whole Clopen sequence is him actively preventing Kris from going into the store where he knows Toriel is. You could just say that's him messing around, but its very suspicious that he's doing it while there's a person inside the store, its a person he's trying to date, and its her son he's keeping out of the store, the son he knows something is up with on a meta level. Sans is fucking with Kris on purpose. Why I don't know, but he's targeting Kris for some reason.
>>720613782There's no way Asgore has done anything to deserve that level of hatred since he isn't in jail and everyone else still loves him. That's same kind of shit she gave him for killing six kids in Undertale, and even then he was still more justified than she was willing to admit.>but it wouldn't be unreasonable from Toriel's perspective.No, it would. First of all, she should believe him on the grounds that he's her husband. Second of all, if she does think he's crazy, then she should have tried to help him, not kicked him to the curb. Third, even if he was crazy, he still loved her and Kris, and would never do anything to hurt them, so she had no right to leave.
>>720614426>newsletter actually says that chapter 5 will come in january
>>720614136I don't know if Martlet has bones at all. Monsters don't have blood, who says they have any kind of organs. Maybe they're just masses of dust that externally look like animals with flesh.
>>720614490>For one thing, she shouldn't be getting piss drunk with some random she met at a convenience store a few days ago and spending all night partying with him and (metaphorically) fucking him, while not at all caring about where her son is or how he's doing.Yeah, I agree with that.>She shouldn't have wrecked a perfectly functional home over something stupid like hating AsgoreAgain, we don't know that's what happened. For more details, see the scene in chapter 4 where Asgore pulls out a fuckin' shadown crystal and monologues to himself about showing everyone something. Also my earlier reply.It's possible Toriel divorced Asgore because Asgore learned about the dark worlds and whatnot and to everyone else it just looked like he flew off the deep end, and if that's the case, Toriel isn't necessarily at fault there. Sure, that means Asgore's even more of a victim than it looks like, but you can't blame someone for thinking you've gone crazy when you start going off about pocket dimensions and conspiracies and shit.
>>720614174Also coming up with new takes on the gameDoes /v/ agree with pic?
>>720614772I've been making that argument for months now, it's kinda obvious when you actually think about it.
>>720596481yeah i made her fat with extra servings of cornsource: i'm part of big corn
>>720614772well chujin's a half decent father so it makes sense why redditors will try to twist every lore point they can to try and tear him down.
>>720614289Time is a scam invented by clock companies to keep us addicted to their minute munchers. WAKE UP SHEEPLE!
>>720614490I’m sorry your step dad molested you>>720614772I don’t give a fuck what faggots on reddit are saying
>>720585775every image youve ever seen was dictated by man. Charcoal on stone. Oil on canvas. Spray on stencil. pencil and fill on mspaint. Pen on tablet. Man on keyboard. One day perhaps, mind on mind. You feel what you feel regardless of how or why it was created. Thats your taste, anon. Try making some art. Youl understand better even if you dont like what you make.
>>720614839It wasn't enough you dominate the American farming sector, you have to control indie fan games as well?
>>720614373>Yes, in the same sense that "we" put a man on the moon.He could be one of the fangame devs, you know. Somewhere like a quarter of these threads are devanons. I would know, I'm one of them.
>>720614767>Toriel isn't necessarily at fault thereNo, she is. First of all, you should trust your husband more than anyone else in the world. If he says there's a fantasy world in the school closet and he means it, you should believe him. Second, if you do think he's crazy, you shouldn't divorce him and dedicate yourself to hating him and shit talking him, you should get him help.Toriel was completely and utterly in the wrong.She should be more like Roba. Her husband actually was crazy, and she still remained loyal. She even did shit more insane than him, after he died, out of loyalty. Perfect wife material. She does need some coaching on how to be a better parent though.
>>720614679>she should believe him on the grounds that he's her husband.Okay, I think you might be confusing the role of being someone's spouse for the role of being a concubine. Toriel wasn't obligated to blindly believe anything Asgore said to her simply because they were married, and that applies to real marriages too. Just because you're married to someone doesn't mean you have to hear them out when they start talking about the earth being flat or some shit.>if she does think he's crazy, then she should have tried to help him, not kicked him to the curbYeah, maybe, but that kinda depends on how far Asgore really went with it while they were still together. I doubt things went straight from [happy marriage] to [divorce] in a single incident, especially with what we see in chapter 3. Asgore's fixation on the dark worlds could've easily torn things apart over the course of several years, and not just a few months or so.>even if he was crazy, he still loved her and Kris, and would never do anything to hurt them, so she had no right to leave.Maybe, maybe not. From the perspective of a normal person, if your spouse suddenly went off the deep end about pocket dimensions and a secret conspiracy involving the ancient prophecy your world's religion is centered around, I don't think it's necessarily unreasonable to worry that they might be willing to hurt people they previously cared about, intentionally or not.Asgore's a victim, I agree, and this is a shitty situation for pretty much everyone involved, but until we have more details on what actually happened, it's not fair to just paint Toriel as some kind of scheming villain and Asgore as a pure innocent soul who did no wrong.
>>720614990Could be, sure, but I doubt the ratio of devanons to normal anons is so skewed in favor of devs.Also, I don't see you arguing my second point, so really it's more like having put Sputnik in orbit. Neat, but not too much of an accomplishment by itself if you don't do anything after that.So, we'll just have to see how things pan out.
>>720614772Chujin's theories were proven correct in the genocide ending. Martlet, his prime candidate for vaxxing, became a boss monster when injected with a human soul serum. Sure it wasn't his serum, but it was a serum made from human soul extract.I think he was right about everything except methodology, and my own personal theory is that he was trying to use his body as a DT extractor, but vastly over estimated his own durability and power. He does have a savior complex though.
>>720614935yeah what are you gonna do about it
>>720615205a spouse should have the courage to stop their husband/wife from committing terrible wrongs. Ceroba ideally should have tried dragging chujin back to sanity but, easier said than done, especially when he's keeping so much of it secret.
>>720615450>Chujin's theories were proven correct in the genocide ending. Martlet, his prime candidate for vaxxing, became a boss monster when injected with a human soul serum.Wrong, Chujin's theory is still wrong. Martlet didn't turn into a boss monster when she injected herself with the DT syringe, she just gave herself an artificial version of the DT boost that Undyne gets in the UT genocide route. She didn't become a boss monster, she just got stronger.And that's ignoring the fact that it still wasn't enough to actually defeat a human, which means that Chujin's idea was wrong on multiple fronts.
>>720610584Good review anon, pretty much hit the nail on the head, especially re: justice as a plot point. I was really hoping Yellow would play the whole "oh shit I'm being attacked with lethal force by monsters with deadly intent" thing seriously in contrast with Undertale, but nope, just more spareslop.Leaning on Flowey was also kind of cheap in my opinion, I already didn't like the meta stuff in Undertale but at least it was relatively subtle until the finale, where it then made a modicum of sense - I like it even less in Yellow.Yellow also kind of suffers from just throwing new characters at you with no buildup - but treating them as if they're returning characters, if that makes sense. My immediate response to most new characters is Yellow was "who the fuck is this dweeb" followed by "why should I care?". This applies for bosses as well. Axis and Ceroba are basically the only exceptions.I haven't done genocide yet but I expect just killing everyone will actually make for a better story, ironically. Sure hope it doesn't get kneecapped by meta shit like Undertale's genocide route did.
i ignore any posts made by redditors or toriel defenders (usually one and the same)
>>720615224>Just because you're married to someone doesn't mean you have to hear them out when they start talking about the earth being flat or some shit.Yes it does. Marriage implies a level of trust and loyalty strong enough that you would rather die than part with this person, and take a vow before God that you will in fact die before parting with them. That means you should trust them, since you've mutually sworn your lives to each other. Don't think I'm saying the woman should be a slave to the man either. This cuts both ways. If Toriel comes to Asgore and says that there's a demon possessing Kris and forcing him to do things he doesn't want to do, then he should believe her.A concubine by contrast is basically just a whore on retainer. She doesn't owe you shit except sex because that's what you pay her for. And you don't owe her anything more than a house and a paycheck.Marriages are first and foremost about trust. Trust so strong that you would stake your life on it. Asgore trusted Toriel and came to her for help, and Toriel responded by sticking a knife in his back. That is evil. There's nothing short of severe character assassination of Asgore the game could do to make Toriel in the right here.
>>720581565>Role-Playing Game>the game has you play the role of a character>thats literally every game everRPG never meant anything from the start.
>>720615551I'd pin that more on stupidity than a fault of character. She was too naive to realize that Chujin can be wrong or that what he was doing was a bad idea. Still leagues better than Toriel, who sees Asgore doing something she knows is wrong, then leaves and lets him do it completely unopposed for a few centuries.
>>720615914>Marriage implies a level of trust and loyalty strong enough that you would rather die than part with this person, and take a vow before God that you will in fact die before parting with them.First of all, the UTDR world's religion doesn't actually have a central deific figure other than the Angel, and that thing's not really a traditional god figure so much as it is some kind of religious G-man.That aside, while I agree that a relationship such as a marriage should be built primarily on trust and love, that really only extends so far before it starts to hurt both the people directly involved in the relationship, and the people and world around them.I don't care how much you love your partner, if they start going "alright wife, now hit the second tower", you probably shouldn't be blindly going along with whatever they say and do.Given that the dark fountains are said to literally cover the earth in eternal darkness when there are enough of them active, I don't think it's unreasonable to not want to go any further down that rabbit hole than necessary, unless you really like the Lord of Hollows ending to DS3.
>>720616065dunno why retarded nominalists latched onto rpgs specifically, when almost every genre is just as non-descript in its nameat least with rpgs you can trace their lineage from wargames to dungeon crawlers to divergent jrpgs and crpgs, go explain why shooters and action and fighting games are all technically different
>>720615614She gained the power of a boss a monster, which is for Chujin's purposes, a boss monster. He didn't care about soul longevity, he just wanted an army of super strong monsters.>And that's ignoring the fact that it still wasn't enough to actually defeat a humanHad Clover not had jaundice superpowers nor suddenly gained save load powers then she would have won. Additionally, she mogs the shit out of Axis, which also successfully killed a human. So she's more than capable of killing humans, just not that specific one. The idea is to create an army of them, so for hard cases like Clover, you would just send more than one.
>>720616230>Still leagues better than Toriel, who sees Asgore doing something she knows is wrong, then leaves and lets him do it completely unopposed for a few centuries.Okay, I love Ceroba more than anything, and I tend to defend her as much as I can around these parts, but when you put it like this, is what she did really *that* much better?To be clear, we're comparing what Toriel did, being disgusted by Asgore's plan and leaving but not actually opposing the plan in any meaningful sense, to what Ceroba did, going all in on Chujin's plan to the utter detriment of her surviving family member, her friends, herself, and an innocent child who just so happened to stumble along.Motivations aside, when you compare their actual actions, what's worse, stepping out of the way and letting someone else do something bad, or doubling down and doing the bad thing yourself even when it's already caused so much suffering already?
>>720615351I'd consider DRY1 to be a big achievement, and Naranja is nothing to scoff at either.
>>720614840That and he get in the way of their ships...>>720615737Honest this is the best way to go else you went up auguring for hours or more lily banned.Also I just had a funny idea where Toriel is some monster equivalent of a white library woman that think human are an inferior race, but try to hide it. Also her reaction to Clover dating Kanako/swing girl would be hilarious.
>>720616236>I don't care how much you love your partner, if they start going "alright wife, now hit the second tower", you probably shouldn't be blindly going along with whatever they say and do.You don't have to blindly go along with what they say and do, you just have to hear them out and trust them. If she heard him out, and honestly listened to everything he had to say and show her, and still didn't believe him, then she should've tried to get him help.
>>720616236(nta) Marriage is a religious concept in nature. Its existence in Deltarune implies there is at least one faith espousing marriage, which Toriel and/or Asgore nominally practice. It doesn't really matter if the deity they were married before actually exists or not.>I don't care how much you love your partner, if they start going "alright wife, now hit the second tower", you probably shouldn't be blindly going along with whatever they say and do.We're talking about mutual respect and co-operation here, not obedience. The reason married couples are called "partners" is because that's what you're supposed to be. Toriel doesn't have to take Asgore at face value and follow along with everything he says (or vice-versa) but she does have an obligation to hear him out in good faith. If something's too much to believe... ask for proof. Investigate together, as a team.As partners.
>>720616396>She gained the power of a boss monsterLike fucking hell she did, she's still a complete pushover compared to Asgore.And keep in mind, we only ever fight Asgore in UT when he doesn't wanna fight us, which we know in-universe causes a person's stats to lower.That means that Zenith Martlet trying her hardest to kill Clover doesn't even measure up to half of Asgore's strength when he actively doesn't want to fight Frisk.Yeah, I don't think she gained the power of a boss monster here.
>>720616454Intentions matter. Ceroba at least believed she was doing the right thing. She genuinely thought nothing would go wrong with what she did. And what she did, she did out of loyalty.What Toriel did was out of ego and malice. She knew it was wrong to leave and let Asgore do as he wished, but she did anyways because she didn't want to stop it or be a party to it. Then she continued to sit there and let it happen while 6 children died.Even from a utilitarian perspective like you're arguing. Toriel killed 6, Ceroba only killed 2.
>>720616801Undertale's stats and UTY's stats are not directly comparable since they're counted differently. Undertale's stats aren't even comparable with other Undertale stats because Toby put no serious thought into them at all.
>>720616801not that anon, but the stats in base undertale are purposefully inflated because anime and arent representative of their actual in battle stats unlike UTYaccording to the wiki, asgore's actual attack is 10 and his defense is -30, we don't know his real 'actually trying to fight' stats but for all intents and purposes zenith martlet is statwise more powerful than even undying undyne outside of hp
>>720616513Why would Toriel have any kind of reaction to what Clover does with a monster she's never even met? How does she know about any of this?
>>720616740>If she heard him out, and honestly listened to everything he had to say and show her, and still didn't believe him, then she should've tried to get him help.And what exactly says she didn't? Unless I'm forgetting some line of dialogue where Toriel says she instantly threw Asgore out of the house the second he started acting strange, there's nothing saying that she didn't at some point try and actually help Asgore or try and see things his way before deciding to end things with him.We know the aftermath of what happened, but we still don't know what actually happened by itself, which is my primary argument. It's not fair to cast any particular judgement of Toriel or Asgore until we know the full story.
>>720616916Did she really? As I understood it, she went to the Ruins and sealed herself in so that she could intercept any Fallen that came to the Underground and keep them away from Asgore. But actually putting her foot down and completely barring them from leaving by force was beyond her personal moral boundaries. Fighting Asgore was likewise a bridge too far for her since she still loved him on some level.I would say she is spineless and cowardly, not malicious, and certainly not murderous.
ROBASLOP!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!
>>720617145When did I say she had the right to end things with him over that? She should stay with him and try to get him help, or otherwise convince him to stop chasing these dark worlds forever if necessary. Its till death do us part, so she isn't off the hook until she's dead.>It's not fair to cast any particular judgement of Toriel or Asgore until we know the full story.And my primary argument is that nothing short of brutal character assassination of Asgore could justify that, and if it is that, then Toby is a hack and none of this matters at anyway.
