no difficulty
no exploration
ugly graphics

>>56550460
They tried something slightly different

>>56550460
They didn't want to rely on Kanto, and people hated that. Because of them, the series is stuck in a state of perpetual mediocrity, unable to evolve because they think retards will throw a fit if they can't use Pikachu and Charizard again.

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>>56550465
>No difficulty
They're the most difficult mainline games in the series.
>No exploration
That's simply not true. The exploration is all optional, but there are several side areas to explore, especially in B2/W2.
>Ugly graphics
Fair enough.

Also acceptable answers:
>Frontloaded with some of the ugliest Pokemon ever (starters, Watchog line, monkeys, Musharna line, Seismitoad line, Liepard line, Unfezant line)
>Very slow start. Games don't get good until Castelia
>Season mechanic, while visually cool, gatekeeps certain items that you will likely never get unless you replay the game during certain months
>Pokestar Studios tutorial in B2/W2 causing the game to hit a screeching stop.
>Incredibly high evolution levels for a large chunk of Pokemon
>Massive competitive power creep, but at this point that's the majority of gens since 6, 7, 8, and 9 are guilty of as much, if not more, power creep
>Dreamworld
>Too many tutorials in general
>Cheren and Bianca ruining the sense of adventure in B/W by showing up every route and town.
>None of the female gym leaders are attractive when every female gym leader from Gen 1 - 4 was attractive except for Fantina
>First gen to go multiculti. Everyone in Gens 1 - 4 were implicitly Japanese

>>56550488
>They're the most difficult mainline games in the series
baitimus maximus

>shit
bw
>great
bw2

>>56550488
>None of the female gym leaders are attractive
>Skyla and Elesa don't look at least marginally attractive

>>56550488
Forgot arguably the most important one - lack of a real hook
No new types or evolutions for previous Pokemon
It's not a major graphical overhaul
Online was already implemented in the prior gen
Gen 5 adds a bunch of shit that you'll probably never interact with while imposing unnecessary restrictions that hurts the game's replay value.

Contrarianism
>normies love gen 1, vpiss doesn't care
>normies love gen 2, vpiss only uses it to falseflag
>normies neutral to gen 3, vpiss barely discusses it
>normies love gen 4, vpiss hates it
>normies love gen 5, vpiss hates it the most
>normies don't care about gen 6, vpiss likes it
>normies love gen 7, vpiss hates it
>normies hate gen 8, vpiss badly attempts to make it seem good
>normies like gen 9, vpiss hates it
>bonus, normies love pla, vpiss hates it

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>>56550465
>ugly graphics
that's pretty much every single pokemon games made by gamefreak

>>56550488
>None of the female gym leaders are attractive when every female gym leader from Gen 1 - 4 was attractive except for Fantina

bro what do you mean thats just straight up false, skyla is one of the hottest girls in this series. also you dont need to do fantina
like yeah shes bad but not terrible

the rest of the points are fair enough
(except seismitoad i like seismitoad)
>>56550521
also fair point most of the stuff gen 5 had is gone due to nintendo wfc no longer being online and i dont think wiimfi has brought everything back yet,

>>56550484
if the new designs were any good and didn't largely retread Kanto tropes no one would have cared. Gives the impression that they wanted to try something new but had little confidence that they could pull it off on their own design ability. gen 4 designs were largely shit too, but they went under the radar since the region was mixed in with old designs

gen 5 to kanto is like dragon age dreadwolf to origins

>>56550537
atmosphere beats graphics

>>56550554
In which case Pokemon still fails

>>56550460
>Pokemon from the first routes are very ugly or very questionable designs. The first impression is bad.
>There is no evolution in the gameplay. None. It's the only generation that didn't contribute anything in this sense.
>Cheren and Bianca are very modest and forgettable "rivals".
>Very linear.
>Many interruptions. Many.
>Little Replay value.

>>56550589
>It's the only generation that didn't contribute anything in this sense.
It did, but they were even more reluctant to utilize it than base RS was with Double Battles.

>>56550598
It didn't add anything. Triple Battle and Rotation Battle are very lazy additions that aren't worth mentioning.

>>56550589
I also found the environments and UI to be really ugly. How do you go from the beautiful menus in HGSS to monochrome single file scrolling in BW? We're in gen 5 and still getting grid trees and grass tiles, and the bare minimum for background scenery in battles. Not that they couldn't have done this earlier, but gen 5 had tons of room and opportunity to spruce up UI, battle environments, get the QoL rolling in the competitive scene (changing natures, IVs, etc), but besides animating sprites it just felt like gen 4.5

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>>56550521
The hook is the refined gameplay and game design. It's the peak of the series in both of those with Gen 6 taking a massive slipslide in quality and the series never recovering.

I grew up with Gen 1 Pokemon so I don't need a "hook" to play the games. Especially not a new type with how fucking awful Fairy's been. I also don't particularly care for cross-gen evos, especially since the majority of them are bad or terrible.

>>56550607
They're worse than Singles and Doubles (especially Triples), but it's a still a new option to use for the main gameplay. It's not Inverse Battles where you couldn't even play them online.

>>56550617
>The hook is the refined gameplay and game design.
That was the appeal of third versions, not new generations.

>>56550505
>>56550539
You know, I forgot about Roxie. She's pretty good. Lenora, Skyla, and Elesa are either hideous or offensively boring, though. Still much better than Gen 8 which just has Bea and then some of the worst Pokegirls in the series (Meloni, that one Fairy crone)

>>56550627
They could've been even better, yes, but they were the last gen to be better than the previous gen even if only barely. They're not the beginning of the decline, but the end of the ascent.

>>56550641
The postgame of BW2 is very clean and I like how fast the battles are in gen 5. I didn't like BW at all, but BW2 will always be valuable to me as the last game with refined postgame battle challenges that are absolutely gimmick free. No megas etc that give you the upper hand against the opponents, just battling.

>>56550589
>There is no evolution in the gameplay. None. It's the only generation that didn't contribute anything in this sense

they should have leaned in to rotation battles cause i thought they were neat.
(not triple battles cause thats just double battles but with 3 mons instead of 2 that mode is lazy)
and if your talking about gimmicks i rather not have them for the most part cause the best one we got so far was from gen 9 terra type is the only gimmick i like.
the rest were too limited or in gen 8s case fucking bullshit with absolutely no counter play
(no dynamaxing yourself doesnt count, if your only counter play to a broken strat is to use said broken strat that is bad game design)
also i hate the fact that if theirs a gimmick that i like its gonna be gone by the next generation.cause aside from megas staying in gen 7 for some reason (no new ones were added and im not counting lets go)
every new gimmick leaves when the next gen comes out
only good that this brings is that dynamax was put in the trash where it belongs

>>56550558
shills BTFO

>>56550617
shit taste with crossgens but good post otherwise

>>56550621
They are additions, but it isn't an evolution of the gameplay. Examples of evolution? Defense and attack special split, holding items (Gen 2); natures, evs, ivs, double battles (Gen 3); physical and special attack split (Gen 4).

>>56550537
You're posting the best looking games on the GBA vs some pretty average Switch games.

>>56550662
I'm sorry you're either a furfag or a fatfag (or a fatfag furfag).

>>56550527
>bonus, normies love pla, vpiss hates it
that’s a fucking lie and i say that as someone who love pla. you can’t get anywhere without some retards shitting on it or worse calling it a spinoff. i blame jewtubers for this since beside the rare shinychads, most are too lazy and incompetent to make content related to it. nuzlocker in particular hate the game since it’s actually chalenging unlike every games since dp

>>56550668
NTA but you can't keep adding stuff like that forever. there is definitely room for something new, but GF is afraid to death of tampering with the core system which is why we're getting rotational gimmicks. Imo gen 5 just could've given the player complete freedom/control in manipulating everything introduced thus far, and it would've been very well received by players. No reason to still have EVs hidden, natures immutable, etc.

>>56550617
>unovabort hate munchlax
opinion forever discarded

>>56550668
If you to label Rotation Battles and Hidden Abilities as sidegrades that's fair

>>56550684
I hate all cross-gen preevos. They're shit.

>>56550707
>they’re le bad because bw was too shit to incluse any
ok borty

>>56550712
>>56550684
French plassfag posts

>>56550707
>discard beta tangrowth and lickilicky so the dex can have igglybuff and clefairy, 2 pokemon that are already underpowered before the second gym in any game

Yeah I get that they maybe went for a worldbuilding approach (and merch) but I agree. Togepi is good for the novelty and examples like tyrogue are a good idea to bring together the hitmons, but when you start giving absolute shitters like marril and chimecho even worse prevos instead of making new mons, I don't like the approach. It's not even fun catching a new pokemon in a new game only for it to evolve into an old pokemon.

>>56550682
Not possible? Gen 6 added megas which had a real impact in the competitive meta. Sadly they weren't used in-game except for 2 battles, but they are a good idea that shows that the system can continue to evolve.

>>56550725
megas were more of an add-on than a fundamental change. all of the other changes impacted the stat distribution/gameplay of every single pokemon. Every pokemon needs to consider its IVs/EVs/moves/hold items, as those are the core mechanics. There's room for core mechanics to be altered/added yet, but GF hasn't done this since gen 4

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>>56550721
Some of the beta-babies were okay. I do like the designs of Elekid and Magby. I just don't think any of them should exist. You're just taking an evolution slot that stops you from giving some Pokemon evolutions. Raichu can't get an evolution because Pichu exists, for example.

As much as I like preevo Paras, I'm glad Parasect didn't get stuck as the final stage Pokemon in a line of shitmons with no hope of an evolution ever.

>>56550718
>m-muh boogeyman
typical

>>56550737
Megas modify stats, abilities and types.

>>56550739
Yeah the designs were alright, it's just really hard to imagine any gameplay that would support their existence besides just dex collection. Magby/Elekid/Smoochum have their utility as their evos are too strong for the start of the game, but there's no circumstances where a prevo of paras and goldeen is going to help you out, even before the first badge. And like you said, it's too bad we'll never see 3rd stages for mons like raichu due to it, although I do like pichu's design.

Too many Gen 5 mons felt like funny knock offs of the classics, which was a common joke among older players years ago. Like Bert & Ernie, just makes you think of the Hitmons. Audio is like Chansey but not as strong as Blissey. Genesect was meant to parallel Mewtwo, but then Mewtwo came back with the Mega form just as Gen 5 was closing out. Unfezant, not quite as iconic as Pidgeot who can also Mega now. It was a failed reboot sort of.

>>56550745
It's a power up, but it doesn't change anything fundamental about the mechanics that pokemon has used since gen 4. At the end of the day you still have a pokemon using: 6 stat attributes, an ability, a hold item, and 4 moves. It may have higher stats, better abilities and a different type (in exchange for the hold item slot) but the mechanics are the same as gen 4, i.e. you could plop a mega charizard into gen 4 and it would still run fine, since the game has data for it to interpret its stats, new ability and type. You couldn't however put a gen 3 mon into a gen 2 battle system, because there's no data for abilities.

>>56550484
B-But you don't understand! I NEED to have Charizard on my team as soon as I step out onto Route 1! How dare they make me wait until the post game before I can bring it over?!

>>56550617
So many of gen 4's cross-gen evolutions miss the point of the original design.

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>>56550739
Raichu WASN'T getting an evolution after Pikachu got adopted by the fanbase as the best thing since sliced bread, you hilariously young motherfucker. Whatever hope Gorochu had of becoming a thing in Gen 2 died when Game Freak changed their chosen mascot for the pokémon everyone was going crazy over. Because no-one gave a shit for Raichu (to the point they outright referenced its real-world reception in Gen 7, where you had to go out your way to get a Kantonian Raichu as Alola had a regional form), thus why bother even giving it a further form, no normalfag or kid would want to get rid of their Pikachu. And seeing as they then went and bullshitted reasons to not evolve the two most popular base stage pokémon of Gen 4 and Gen 7, seeing Pika refuse the stone in Gen 1 just shows they're self-aware enough to set the stage to keep shilling merch of the massively-popular base stage and ignore its evolutions.

>>56551429
Like?

>>56551462
Honchkrow
Dusknoir
Tangrowth
Magnezone
Mammoswine
Lickilicky

>>56551471
>maybe
>didn't play three so can't comment
>not a fucking chance
>not a fucking chance
>not a fucking chance
>not a fucking chance
Thanks for confirming you're just seething.

>>56550712
>they're bad because they tend to be lazy and ruin existing lines
I'd rather have new mons anon

>>56552026
I’d rather have a good game sagie

>>56552040
Like Pokemon White.

>>56552040
what's a "game sagie"? Is that a nuPokémon feature?

Three bullets for the yawnigger.

>>56552042
>Like [bad game]
What did she mean by this

>>56550460
zoomers like it and it makes millennials and cordies seethe
actually that's a good thing

>>56552054
>good games are bad
>i am a woman
Why are you constantly lying?

>thread about Gen 5
>instant gen 4 and 6 seethe
hmm...

Better then plass

>>56552056
>projecting

>>56552063
No, I'm just saying what you did.