It's crazy to me that a classic Pokemon was a monster in the early gens, and is now just a shitmon
>>56552496why is it censored
>>56552517i got it off the archive looking up gsc snorlax here idk why
Normal as a whole was OP back then, and lower power levels and lower bp moves made bulky setup hard to counter without having a dedicated phaser. The decline started in gen 4 with the introduction of a bunch of 100+ BP moves, especially Close Combat.
>>56552543Superpower was 120 BP
>>56552574Superpower had shit distribution in gen 3
>>56552574only really good for 1 use before switching thoughbeit
>>56552496SNORLAX DOES NOt have nipples stupid OP you made everyone look bad *grabs mask* OOGA BoOGA!!!
>>56552644Sir, you are bald
>>56552496Snorlax is viable in Gen 9 VGC.Who gives a fuck about the fanfic meta which banned sleep, Baton Pass, Shed Tail, OHKO moves, Double Team---like seriously who in their right mind would consider contemporary Smogon a genuine metric? They literally are not playing the game.
>>56552496>Keeping multiple offensive powerhouses in check is... LE BAD!
>>56553229sleep and Baton Pass are not banned in gen 2
>>56553246yeah but still, they just ban what they don't like about the game. they arbitrarily like that shit in gen 2 so they keep it.
>>56553229Can anybody ever run double team in a serious tourney? nobody I have saw playing uses double team. Explain yourself. Why is it so important if nobody relies on it.
>>56552574It also had mediocre distribution and lowered your attack, making it only good as a one-per-switch nuke.Close Combat, meanwhile, was put on virtually every fighting type ever and multiple non-fighters such as Staraptor, and if you were fast enough, it didn't matter if your defenses dropped, you could just keep spamming it for obscene damage.
>>56553328The efficacy of Double Team, Minimize, and other evasion boosters is entirely dependant upon the meta in question, which is itself dictated by the foundation of a generation.If you aren't seeing evasion boosting in Gen 9 VGC, or any other VGC, it's indicative of an opportunity cost most people don't take to be worth it.However, I can share real examples I saw last regulation: Minimize Alolan-Muk, and acupressure Hisuian-Qwilfish. The former could take Smeargle's Moody using Power of Alchemy while it hid behind Substitute and boosted until it could sweep with Knock Off, while the latter worked similarly but with, iirc, a Neutralizing Gas Weezing.So it's neither a worthless move / strategy nor is it predominant or braindead by any stretch of the imagination. Like most everything else in Pokemon, it is simply one of many options, which requires players to strategize whilst opening up avenues for creativity.
>>56553246OP isn't about gen 2
>>56553253They ban evasion because nobody but a handful of annoying assholes like it. Any format that puts evasion up to a vote inevitably bans it because NOBODY wants to put up with missing 100% accurate moves.Sleep is only banned in formats where the power level is so high that 1 missed turn can completely lose you the game. Darkrai is a complete shitmon in Ubers without sleep, but in the formats where Game Freak didn't knee cap Dark Void because of fanfic format (VGC), Darkrai is a top 5, sometimes top 3, Pokemon. Entirely because 1 turn of sleep in Ubers can amount to a won game. Gen 9 Ubers is so hyper offensive that 1 turn can mean you completely lose to the plethora of heinous setup sweepers from Dragonite to Zamazenta to Kingambit to Roaring Moon to Iron Valiant to etc.
>>56552496This says a lot more about Gen 2's playerbase than Gen 9's. Snorlax is de facto the best Pokemon in the game even in Ubers. The playerbase just doesn't want to ban it
>>56553722>They ban evasion because nobody but a handful of annoying assholes like it. Any format that puts evasion up to a vote inevitably bans it because NOBODY wants to put up with missing 100% accurate moves.Don't forget that not every pokemon have aerial ace or a move similar to it.
>>56553792Nor would anything use it unless they have Technician. 60bp is just too weak.
>>56553229Most of that stuff is fine if double targeting exists. Idk, but if smogon doubles bans that, then it's kinda stupid. If you want to play 6v6 singles, then Smogon bans are the way to go. If you don't, then just don't play 6v6 singles and stick to vgc : )
>>56553909What about dragon rush body slam or Kowtow Cleave
>>56553920>If you want to play 6v6 singles, then Smogon bans are the way to gomakes zero fucking sense
>>56553927>Dragon RushIt's got 75% accuracy and 100 base power so it's useless unless someone brings Minimize. Doesn't work on Double Team or other evasion boosts.>Body SlamIt's only used by Normal types kneecapped by the removal of Return that don't get Double Edge. Also doesn't work on Ghost types, and Steel and Rock types can easily tank it.>Kowtow CleaveOnly works in OU since Kingambit ain't dropping unless it gets nerfed into the ground.
>>56553957>>56553927I don’t even run Kowtow Cleave on gambit sucker punch is good enough dark stab and Tera blast coverage is too valuable
Isn't it funny how the guys who hate Smogon for banning evasion also hate stall?
>>56554012Isn't it funny that evasion has always been legal in Doubles and yet no one has ever successfully piloted an evasion based team to a tournament win?
>>56554019That's because stall strategies basically don't exist in Doubles due to double targetting. A defensive Pokemon can't save its teammate from taking damage in Doubles while a defensive Pokemon CAN absorb hits for others in Singles.
>>56554019So? Nobody cares about VGC.
>>56554012it's funny how smoggies like you have an entire headcanon built up that has hardly a shred of accuracy to itbeing incapable of understanding others' anti-aligned points of view is a sign of autism, after all
>>56554023>A defensive Pokemon can't save its teammate from taking damage in Doubles stopped reading>>56554142VGC has literally overtaken OU on Showdown
>>56554192OU is still above VGC on Showdown, though. It's just split between NatDex OU and regular OU.
>>56554192Defensive Pokemon don't learn Follow Me.
>>56554203it says "Natdex OU" niggado they share banlists? tiered mons? movepools? mechanics?they are not one "OU"
>>56554207But they do learn Wide Guard, Screens, Taunt, Fake Out, Thunder Wave, various Sleep moves, Confuse Ray, Heal Pulse, Life Dew, Safeguard, Parting Shot, Will-o-wisp, Imprison, and probably a few other things I missed that can keep their partner alive while crippling the other team's ability to deal damage
>>56554228They're both current gen OU, one just has all of the cut content and the other doesn't.
>>56554245>Butwhy are you conceding the point as if he's correct
>>56554245>Wide GuardOnly protects against spread moves.>ScreensDoesn't actually take hits for your teammate>TauntSame as above>Fake OutSame as above>Thunder WaveSame as above>various Sleep movessame as above...same as aboveToxapex, Blissey, Clodsire, Skarmory, and Corviknight can sponge hits for a teammate in singles so them setting up evasion is far more impactful. An evasive Toxapex isn't going to do anything in doubles because the opponent will just double into the other Pokemon and then finish Toxapex off when its alone.
>>56552496well thats power creep for youfunny how the strongest mon to survive power creep is the chancey/blissey lineonly being ass(or mid) in gen 9 strictly cause they did everything in there power to say fuck blissey
>>56553740They've tried playing without Snorlax and the game is worse off for it.
>>56552496Close Combat should have been nerfed Ages ago to something like 90 power, Fighting is already way too good offensively anyway, remember in gen 3 when you had to carefully consider what options to run instead of just clicking a massively powerful nuke with practically no real downsides?Oh also Snorlax deserves Slack Off and should have gotten it ages ago as well, Gamefreak is fucking retarded if they still think Snorlax is too good for it.
>>56553197based
>>56554245>a few other things I missed that can keep their partner alive while crippling the other team's ability to deal damageAlly Switch.But don't worry he's not smart anyway.
>>56553328The problem with Double Team and the like is that it's a luck-reliant strategy. People do enter tournaments with such teams, but in a setting where every victory is crucial, spending turns reducing the chance of the opponent hitting you is eventually going to fuck you over when the rng causes the opponent to hit you anyway. Strategies relying on increasing your chance to win through luck just aren't going to work regularly ENOUGH to win entire tournaments.
Only one of these turns smogon's sacred cow into a cock sleeve. Connect the dots yourself.
>>56554489>Close Combat should have been nerfed Ages ago to something like 90 powereh i'd say 100 just because even though it's hardly a downside, it still has a downside, and moves like tbolt flamethrower ice beam, etc exist. 90 is more or less the baseline for "final attacking move with low chance (or no) secondary effects"either that, or gut it's availability and make a 90 BP fighting move with like a 10% to drop enemy defense by one for all the mons that lost CC
>>56552517>>56552525Because OOP got it from Twitter and you can't say the heckin k word over there
>>56554743that sacred cow being Finchinator kek
>>56555074Over Ice types of all fucking things, too. I get the obvious OP shit like G-Darm with Gorilla Tactics, but the rest of these Ice types getting banned makes no sense. It's just not a centralized issue to have to build around at all.
>>56555087no, you don't understand. One guy won a tournament with a snowstorm team so it's clearly an overpowered mechanic
>>56555069you're thinking of reddit anon. since elon bought twitter they're nearly as crass and unruly than us, but significantly dumber
>>56555087funny thing is that in banning all the ice types, they kinda also banned literally everything that checks gliscor, convenient that the majority of smogons council is stallfags
>>56555776All of those ice types checked the entire metagame.
>>56555087Kyurem has the same BST as fucking Kyogre. That it was allowed outside of Ubers at all shows that Smogon isn't being arbitrary. Kyurem really was overpowered after getting a bunch of new moves.
>>56555955It's 10 points lower, but still over 600. I've never noticed its stats were so high, I thought it was just a regular 600.
>>56554019Setting up in VGC is never free, as turns are extremely valuable. Speding 1 turn to minimize with an absolute shitmon AND redirect the attacks on its partner isn't worth it when you can spend it to attack with a broken 700 BST mon and fake out with another. Not to mention Fucking retard
>>56555996not him but why isn't it popular in battle spot singles either?
>>56556053Because you can create the setup opportunity only if you have a lot of turns to waste, aka when you have a good matchup in front of you. In BSS you can't have a 3 mon combo that can switch into everything once. In 6v6, you have enough mons to render OHKOs and even 2HKOs impossible from every mon. In BSS offence is the most common playstyle by far for this reason. Shit ass minimise mons cannot set up before they get murdered by retardedly strong mons (among those the ones banned in OU)
>>56556053Probably because it's a form of stall in a format where offense dominates.
>>56555768you can say nigger anywhere you just have to stop being a bitch and also get yourself on enough government watchlists where they can't ban you from anywhere
>>56552496>meta changes over time>HOLY SHIT WHAT, EVERYTHING IS DIFFERENT NOW
>>56556158This isn't a regular meta change. There's 20 years worth of new additions and mechanic changes separating the two metas.
>>56555776Stall, the pedophiles tactic. Need time to groom the kiddies you're battling after all
>>56556180Left: the symbol of creativity and pure, authentic PokemonRight: another insignificant meme-spouting smogtuber riding his more charismatic friend's coattails
>>56556180kek
>>56556196>the symbol of creativityBro?
>>56556196>left: dogfuckerfixed it for you
>>56556196>fury cutter venusar
>>56556180Smogon did nothing wrong.
>>56556388They banned Flutter Mane and that really hurt my feelings therefore they're evil.
>>56556196as much as i dislike verlisify, it gets harder and harder to prove him wrong with every passing year
>>56556610The inverse is true. He becomes more and more clownish as time goes on.
>>56556309>>56556326what's the problem with these?
>>56556707>Fury Cutter VenusaurFury Cutter is one of the worst moves in the series, even after the X/Y buff that doubled its power. It's basically just Bug type Rollout. Venusaur doesn't even get STAB on it and the whole set revolves around getting bulky on Venusaur and spamming the move.>Focus Band AggronFocus Band is a notoriously shit item that works like Focus Sash but only a fraction of the time. He also has Stealth Rocks and Rock Polish on the set because you want your setup sweeper to forego a STAB move (mind you, Aggron has fucking HEAD SMASH) so you can set up rocks before dealing 30% to the opponent and fainting.
>>56556707t. Verlisify
>>56554489Close Combat is fine. It's other moves that need to be buffed.
>>56556860damn dude I overthink when I'm making sets and I know I've done dumb shit like that, I'd get torn apart too. but then again I don't have online dickriders or go to tournaments
>>56557280It's one thing to try something out of the norm to come up with some overlooked tech. That's a regular part of the comp experience and allows for metas like ADV OU to be fresh even 22 years later.The difference is that Verlisify goes fucking crazy with it. He does shit like Cacturne with only Sucker Punch and Destiny Bond (on a CHOICE BAND SET) rather than making anti-meta sets. His sets have one use case and suck ass in every other situation meaning he's often playing matches where his Pokemon are worse than useless.
>>56557347Emvee is a better Verlisify than Verlisify.
>>56556610>>56556678He's also been irrelevant for how long now?
>>56557636You say he's irrelevant, but a lot of shitposters use his talking points on /vp/. The whole "fanfic meta" discourse was started by him. Not to mention the whole "muh genned Pokemon = cheating" controversy.
>they've changed the requirements for suspect tests to be 1750 eloWhat a shock. Why even bother accepting community input if they hate it this much? Just go mask off and have the council make all the choices like they're clearly trying to push for.
>>56557669Is that where the term comes from? I've always found it a bit weird so hearing it comes from a turbo autist makes sense, mocking a fan made format for being fan made is ridiculous.
>>56555087>>56555776The reason why "Smogon loves stall" is a meme is because they don't think offensive threats should be able to smash down stall walls, which is why they ban Ice types so often, they're terrible walls but great attackers, all good ice types are glass cannons, Avalugg fucking sucks, but Iron Bundle is stupidly good.
>>56557748Ice types aren't banned any more often than Pokemon of other types. Smogon also never bans stall breakers like Nidoking or Crawdaunt
>>56553740banning snorlax means you have to ban other pokemon like zapdos too and play a more boring stall based metagame with blissey
>>56558024Just Zapdos and Raikou. MAYBE Gengar, but that's pushing it.
>>56554489Agree with this post entirelySlack Off would have been fantastic for it
>>56558026i cant tell if you're being genuine or sarcastic to prove a point bringing up gengar
>>56554489>>56558029Snorlax still wouldn't be good even with Slack Off. It needed that back in Gen 6 to stay relevant in OU. Now all that Slack Off would do is make it a decent NU Pokemon. At this point, to break into RU+ it needs:>+10 base hp>Return/other strong Normal STAB>Slack Off>Knock OffIf you want it to be OU, it needs all that and Simple
>>56557748>pack more than one stall wall>sack one>bring out one of many offensive threats that easily tears Kyurem a new assholeBraindead retards just don't like not being able to use Lando, Gliscor, or Waterpon without having to plan around threats. It's obvious that the dicksucking of those three in particular is the cause of all this and, surprise surprise, the now apparent cheating that happened with the suspect votes.
>>56558049??? It gets Return
>>56558055>bring out one of many offensive threats that easily tears Kyurem a new assholeYou mean the ones that easily die to the DDance sets? Kyurem can fuck over offense just as easily as stall. It has 130 in both attacking stats.
>>56558058Return was removed in Gen 8. Sorry you had to find out this way.
>>56558055Smogon doesn't make decisions based on how it affects stall. Stall is a low ladder trap this gen. It's shit and no one uses it in tourneys anymore.
>>56554818It effectively doesn't have a downside and if you get a single attack boost off you win the game anyway due to Fighting types typically having insanely good coverage anyway even after Knock Off got mildly gutted in distribution (it's another move that should have it's power nerfed to shit).>>56557279The last thing we need is for the game to become even more coomerbrained and hyper offense focused, it's already atrociously bad enough as is.>>56558049Okay hear me out, I know Gluttony is a very thematically fitting ability, but what if Snorlax got Fluffy as an ability? Honestly I don't think it would be that good anyway by this point, with how absurd the powercreep has been, a fat wall with recovery is pretty mediocre, I am still so pissed off over Return being removed, though it does feel kinda funny and fitting that Gamefreak removed a move that represents effort and love towards Pokemon from the games.
>>56557669People who think Verlisify is irrelevant don't actually watch him at all and just regurgitate almost decade old talking points formulated in bad faith to begin with.Like these dudes talking about 10 year old sets like he hasn't been streaming battling on BSS & VGC as recently as last month with stuff like Fissure spam.I actually cop'd that idea and used it for my own fun on Showdown. Just like I take his thoughts on Smogonism and use it to formulate my own understanding of why I've always hated it and how it's objectively shitty.But again, you actually have to watch the dude---which his haters don't, not even for a second.
>>56558217Hi Verlis
>>56558217He's an eternal contrarian that has 0 good ideas of his own. I'm not going to take that furfag seriously.
>>56557682Touretards regularly state ladder doesn't mean shit and that only tournaments matter. You only need the ability to read between lines to see how these suspect requirements are tailored toward their hardcore audience who's actually invested in smogonism and not just on there for free singles battles---which is the vast majority of people.
>>56558222Being in favor of pure Pokemon as it exists on the cartridge is contrarianism to you.
>>56558238It's a stupid thing to be in favor of. Game Freak is well known to be the stupidest developer in the world. Why should anyone care what they think is "real" Pokemon?
>>56558250This. Game Freak can barely program a menu without it lagging. Why should I care about what they have to say about how games are made?
Of course some fudge packer has to derail the thread into being about his lord and savior Verlisify.
>>56557685If you seriously don't understand why highlighting that it is a fan format is crucial, you're simply a newfag and aren't aware that for many years people assumed Smogon formats carried a sense of legitimacy that they actually do not."Fanfic meta" is a reminder to people that the policies are arbitrary and based off nothing but the whims and fancies of those who devote themselves to the cause. Their zealotry makes it easy for the unitiated to doubt their own judgment when it comes to recognizing contradictions in their decision-making and rationales.
>>56558270the first verlisify post in the thread got one initial reply, and the 2nd one got 4 repliesseems like the verlisify haters are the ones "derailing", jumping at the chance to talk about him
>>56558276>"Fanfic meta" is a reminder to people that the policies are arbitrary and based off nothing but the whims and fancies of those who devote themselves to the cause. Their zealotry makes it easy for the unitiated to doubt their own judgment when it comes to recognizing contradictions in their decision-making and rationales.I mean, yeah it's a fan format. But who really cares, it's a fan format. That's a literal description of what it is, but people use it like some kind of insult, on the same board where there's a fanfic general and romhack general where people talk about what is essentially fanfiction of the games.But the people who use the term fanfic meta treat it like it's some form of insult, which is funny.
>>56558287Verlisify is a clown and doesn't get enough hate or bullying.
>>56558276>"Fanfic meta" is a reminder to people that the policies are arbitrary and based off nothing but the whims and fancies of those who devote themselves to the cause.It's not arbitrary, it's what the community votes for and wants. Each ban has to receive 60% or more ban votes to go through and sometimes very clearly overpowered Pokemon either don't get banned or take incredibly long to get banned.
>>56558276The stupidest Smoggie is smarter than the smartest Game Freak employee.
And the shittiest shill got shot three times. By each voter!
So it was probably welliou who did the laddering and handed his accounts off, right? He's the only one I recognize off-hand from the group of banned shitters.Also lol at the one who took one of his accounts and voted the OTHER way. I bet he was PISSED.
How's Finch handling his #1 most hated Pokemon getting unbanned?
>>56558468>Thankfully, we can confirm that despite these efforts, the result was not impacted for any of these testsFucker knew what was going on, he's just throwing the necessary people under the bus to maintain his position.
>>56558468https://youtu.be/WAtDyYZ3cjE?si=dkotodXFltvnpnIhHe's saying it's one of the worst days of his life. He'll be shedding tiers during his business class flight to an out of state work function.
>>56558468fucking smoggies lmao
>>56554489>Oh also Snorlax deserves Slack OffWAIT the fuck? It doesn't have it? That's almost as funny as Hypno being unable to learn Dream Eater
>>56558545Sometimes Pokemon just don't get moves you really think they should. Machamp can't learn Mach Punch, for example.
>>56558558Flareon didn't get Flare Blitz for a long ass time and when it finally did it was too powercrept to do anything.
>>56552574Superpower's distribution was extremely limited, its downside (lowering Attack and Defense) actually mattered, and it only had 5 PP to boot. Close Combat's downside (lowering Defense and Sp. Def) might as well not be there because every time you brainlessly push that button, you were either switching out afterward ANYWAY, or KOing what you're facing. This is doubly so if the Pokemon you're using it with is fast. It's a stupid move.
>>56558722They should just make flareon a special attacker at this point or give it some better physical moves to use. It has literally always been complete fucking garbage in both competitive and regular gameplay and I just can't stand that
>>56558204>effectively doesn't have a downsideit does come into play when priority comes into the equation, which is why i figured it relevant enough to warrant +10 power compared to the usual 90 for "final STAB" moves. 95 could maybe work too.
>>56558276>”Fanfic meta" is a reminder to people that the policies are arbitrary and based off nothing but the whims and fancies of those who devote themselves to the cause.Smogon’s bans aren’t arbitrary. They’re based on votes and their tiering system is based on usage.Meanwhile GameFreak’s format’s bans are mostly arbitrary and on the whims of the developer.
>>56559494and the votes are based on..... lmao
>>56552496>censoredkys you zoomie faggotGOD I can't stand your kind.
>>56559536The will of the community. Their votes are based on the will of the community. It's way better than arbitrarily banning all Mythical Pokemon even though Celebi, Mew, and Phione are dogshit.
>>56559983Is the will of the community making a few dozen fake accounts to stuff ballots?
>>56559998Kyurem was unbanned because of that. None of the cheating affected the other suspect tests.
>>56552496What I never understood is why Redditorinos think that KYS is a "death threat". Threatening someone and saying KYS is not coherent. KYS is a dismissive command. You say it because someone is being a faggot and you want them to shut up, you aren't implying that if they don't you'll do it for them.Maybe that's where all these "online death threats" the media talks about come from. They deliberately misinterpret some anonymous account telling a tranny to kill Xe/Xerself as a threat instead of the anon just being dismissively hostile.
>>56560256Yeah in any case KYS would be "incitation to suicide" but not a death threat
>>56560233And we're just supposed to take Finch's word for it?You can't be this gullible irl
>>56560409Finch wasn't the one doing the investigating.
>>56559983Anon, you are really gullible if you think smogon and especially (((Finch))) can be trusted to handle this system, there's been incredibly strange overwhelming surge in votes or lack thereof in recent suspect tests, something is clearly not right and it's very options the council is aware of it, the whole post from the kike read like he was nervously attempting to cover his own ass and pretend the entire system hasn't been fucked for ages.>>56560256That would require zoomies to have an innate desire to learn and understand things instead of mindlessly regurgitating garbage they heard or saw somewhere else like the good little mindless parrots they all are.
>>56560409overestimating the intelligence of a smogontard
>>56552496>having to dedicate multiple slots to counter a threat is more acceptable when there’s less mons in the gamewow!
>>56560494Mind actually pointing out other examples of suspect tests having blatant rigged voting, and not just vagueposting?
>>56560618>dedicating multiple slots with not many options is okay and totally isn't a solved metagame bro
>>56560620In that very thread, they admit that other suspects, including the Volcarona suspect were compromised by this same user... But why anyone would think it was just this one guy and not multiple others who were probably smart enough to use other IPs would just be kidding themselvesThe voting system has been broken for well over a decade plus at this point... this just reveals the rot
>>56560637Also, going "tee hee, there was cheating, but not enough to change the other suspects" is hand waving the fact the vote was compromised to begin with...All of the suspects should be redone, but we know that ain't gonna happen with this sorry ass leadership at Smogon
>>56560637One guy cheating does not mean everyone was cheating.
>>56560643Every other ban vote was by such a huge margin that one guy getting reqs 12 times wasn't going to swing the vote.
Ready to apologize to Kyurem, /vp/?
>>56559536>and the votes are based on..... lmaoFun. Keeping the meta fun enough to not kill the entire community.There's a reason so many people play sim leagues instead of simply using hackmons against the broader casual community in game.
>>56560746>There's a reason so many people play sim leagues instead of simply using hackmons against the broader casual community in game.yeah, it's because I haven't bought a Nintoddler system or game since 3DS & XY
>>56560715there is no telling how many times this was done across suspect tests, within suspect tests by any individuals, and by any particular individual, especially considering this retard got caught by not using burner ips.I'm just adding this onto the huge list of things dumbass smogonigs delude themselves into believing in spite of commonsense and logic.
>>56560752The Switch has been fantastic. It's just Game Freak that's continued to shit the bed and lie in it.
>>56560768It's not common sense or logical to think that there is more of this considering many of the players involved have been caught and banned. It wasn't just one guy, he was getting the reqs and passing them off to other decorated players who couldn't have been bothered to get the reqs themselves. All told, 10 different guys got banned.
>>56560752Not as valid a point as you thought it was. The logic I brought up applied back when you had your 3DS.When gen5 came out the sims started with a fully blank slate of no rules. We all voted the clauses back in over time because it was complete fucking ass. No species clause. No sleep clause. No evasion clause. Might not have even had the time pools at the very beginning, but I can't remember. Some matches were so unfun people would metagame the time pool to stall the matches over 30m in pure spite while they went to take a shower or something.
>>56560790When I had a 3DS I wasn't even aware Showdown! existed you presumptious retard.
>>56560799Don't project the apparent fact that you're an ignorant retard onto others. The assertion that your ignorance is in any way, shape, or form a counterargument to what I said is laughable.
>>56560809You are implicitly claiming Showdown! was anywhere near as widely known and used 10 years ago as it is now. Such that the playerbase at large recognized they had a "choice" between simulator and cartridge. How stupid.
>>56560691Nobody said this. The point is that it's incredibly easy to cheat so people can abuse the system with it. Why is that so hard to understand?
>>56561091It's not incredibly easy to cheat. It took one very skilled player without a life several weeks just to get 11 accounts the reqs to vote, and he gave his accounts to other skilled players who didn't feel like getting the reqs to vote. Just because cheating has happened before doesn't mean it is rampant.
>>56561113Because Smogon has NEVER had a history of people spoofing accounts during tournaments, or illegally scouting their opponents' teams with smurf acts, or mods abusing their positions, or issuing fraudulent bans to people, or....
>>56561113Yeah that's cool and all but I know from personal experience it does not that nearly that long to set up alt accounts for that shitshow of a site
>>56560620That post came out a bit fucked due to me having just woken up, but case in point, look at the absurd amount of votes some Pokemon like Gouging Fire got when in the past most suspect tests were fairly indecisive and yet in other cases Pokemon like Goldengo and Kingambit's suspect tests seem to be mysteriously short on votes despite a large number of the playerbase agreeing they're retarded cancers that should have been gone, similar story with the Tera suspect test, it just doesn't add up and like other anons said, (((Finch))) was trying to wave it away that tampering also happened in previous posts to avoid suspicion, which just makes him come out as even more suspicious, the same faggot responsible for this shit was around in previous votes too, but oh those certainly weren't tampered, at all, trust us. Come on dude, you can see the corruption and dirt in full display and you don't even need to go far to do it, considering how painfully incompetent the kike is I have to wonder how he's keeping his position, either through money or because he knows the secrets from the old council faggots and they're too afraid of the skeletons in their closet to kick him off.>>56561113Dude, I have made the mistake of hanging around a few smogon chatrooms like OU and such and it's very fucking obvious the admins are full of dirt and corrupt, they all but openly admit to rigging tourneys and cheating in them and they're all pedos and openly admit it, fuck it sometimes gets even worse than /vp/ (many of said pedo mods also hang around this miserably shit board), it's a microcosm of corruption, degeneration and shittery, but since it mostly keeps to itself a large number of people ignore it, typically to save their own dirty arses, I remember getting instabanned by one of the mods during the whole pedopedia scandal for simply bringing it up.
>>56554489snorlax paws typed this post
>>56558049>snorlax is ZUWtf did I miss
>>56554019It's not about evasion being OP, no one thinks that. If you had a theoretical button that when pressed randomly made you instantly win the game 10% of the time and lose 90% of the time that would obviously not be OP, it would still be stupid luck-based strategy that the meta is better without.
>>56552644Snorlax has nipples fag.
>>56558801Even the "good" Eevees are bad at this point, their stats are just not minmaxed enough for the modern game. Unless you give Flareon +50 bst it's going to be shit regardless.
>>56564824The main limiting factor is how bad their movepools are. If it's not Sylveon, it sucks.
>>56556610in what capacity? for muh cheating or for his other opinions (which I'm unaware of aside dogfucking)?
>>5655999811 votes you buffoon>>56560409You really think people really cheat and create fake accounts to manipulate the meta, and get away with it even though cheat detection is extremely simple, and do that on the regular? Read a book you probably don't even know what an IP address is
>>56564706So, Focus Blast or any other high powered, low accuracy move on which games are decided by whether they land or not... Fuck, Smogon banned Sleep based off Darkrai and Iron Valiant gambling on 70% Hypnosis and Sleep turns rolling or not rolling an early wake upPeople need to stop crying about "muh luck based RNG" when everything about Pokemon is determined by RNG rolls, right down to the damage formula
>>56564981You sound like a butthurt smogonpedo, this entire situation and suspiciously high % on previous tests give ample evidence that cheating is in fact very easy to get away with, the tard who rigged the Kyurem vote was an amateur and a retard who got caught because he was especially retarded and French (same thing).
So it was only Kyurem that had a rigged vote?Nothing else?
>>56555966Ode for the days in Gen 6/7 when Kyurem Black was still OU. No moves, no boots, but didn't need them when you could band into first turn 724 attack power Outrages. The mind games stall had to play every time this boy got onto the field, because one wrong switch cost them a wall and cracked their entire team apart.
>>56565005>People need to stop crying about "muh luck based RNG" when everything about Pokemon is determined by RNG rolls, right down to the damage formulaSmogon players typically have a death allergy to anything involving luck or chance. Someone actually made a special mod where literally all RNG was removed and all moves were perfectly accurate, which predictably proved boring at the end of the day. Don't show them Dragon Quest; they'll have a heart attack.
>>56560256I think it got popularized because it's more rhetorically powerful and socially advantageous to claim that you were sent death threats. Since our society worships victimhood.
>>56552496Snorlax is so overcentralizing that it's paradoxical.Because he's on 100% of teams, you always know what you're up against. Picking a Pokemon that counters the top threat at the cost of being bad against everything else would normally be throwing, but if the top threat is on literally every team? Your cheese strat is now viable.
>>56570765Gen 1 Ubers being populated by mostly Psychic types doesn't make Mew and Mewtwo balanced in that tier.
