What are some things most people see as improvements or qol that you dislike?
Open world
>>57218527the higher pokemon distribution, having a tighter pool of Pokemon makes the areas more memorable for me, but now every area has like a dozen+ pokemon to find which gets overwhelming and kind of takes some of the fun out of finding them all for me.Even PLA does this to some extent, rolling out pokemon more gradually as you explore each map rather than spawning in a pile of pokemon everywhere you walk.
>>57218537This
>>57218537Yeah, this. A consequence of it is that for balance reasons, no more are you force into battle when you lock eyes with a trainer. You are now the one initiating them, and it is to me, quite sad, as that was part of the classic pokemon spirit.
>>57218527day/nightphys/spec split
>>57218584Forgot pic.
Buying competitive items with pokedollars
>>57218527Just randomly throwing in double battles
>>57218527Getting EXP by catching Pokemon.
>>57218527Gonna be that guy and say 3D models
>>57218527Gonna be that guy and say animated sprites
>>57218715
>>57218527I look down on anyone who runs away from trainer battles.
>>57218598>phys/spec splitHow is that a bad thing?
>>57218777more options isn't a good thing they should have just rebalanced the mons that were most impacted by it
>>57218527Exp share being always onShould be a toggle so eveeyone can enable or disable it to play how they want
>>57218822>Exp share being always onHow is that a bad thing?
>>57218823Overlevels your party and makes the game too easySome of the games that have modern exp share were not balanced around it
>>57218777>>57218823They just don't like these things. Why are you being so defensive? Surely there are "qol" things that you don't like.
>>57218527A real-time day/night cycle affecting encounters was not an improvement.
>>57218527the base shiny rate being changed from 1/8192 to 1/4096. I'm fine with there being a bunch of methods to make the odds better but the baseline being changed just irks me.
>>57218782But then you have a issue where pokemon stats are skewed into a certain way. A pokemon with fire and physhic types? It can only be a special attacker if its going to be offensive since why give a high phys attack stat if it can't use stab at all.>>57218823due to gamefreak making things easier, stuff like exp share is the problem rather than just rebalancing the games around it that.just so that you can have a evened level team and still have a challenge.
>>57218527Dexes with 400+ Pokemon. I like Pokemon, but there's "wow this dex has a good number of choices" and being full of a metric fuckton of Pokemon you'll never see or use. People will say regional identity is a meme argument but I find it jarring going from one grassy route to the next and suddenly every encounter is different.
>>57218849So is this an issue with the National Dex or just with large Regional Dexs?
>>57218828The trick is to never do wild battlesIf you run from everything you don't intend to catch and just do the trainer battles you'll be correctly leveled
>>57218848>why give a high phys attack stat if it can't use stab at all.Because it's physically strong. Who cares if it's bad online, most pokemon are.
>>57218848>due to gamefreak making things easier,The games have gotten harder though.
>>57218853>The trick is to never do wild battlesThat doesn't work in BDSP. Skip them altogether, It's still XY levels of bad, but without the toggle, where you are guarantee to outlevel everyone but Cynthia.
>>57218584>balancePlease, it worked like that in SwSh too.
>>57218823Because you're always overleveled
>>57219062No you aren't.
>>57218527Unlimited inventory in a senseAlthough I feel rather than limiting the amount of unique items there should be a limit on the quantity you can stack per item. Otherwise you get shit like SV where you could not spend a single cent on healing items and you'll still be running around with like 50 max potions
>>57218823Came here looking for exp share. I'm playing Blue for the first time in like 25 years, and you apparently don't get an Exp. All until way later. As a result, I'm in Silph Co. right now and I'm level 63. It's so fucking cumbersome to level up Pokemon the old school way. I evolved a Gyarados this way, and I did a couple other Pokemon too, but that shit just got so tiresome and so they're still at level ~20 while my main is 63. I wish I didn't even waste Exp on leveling them. When you don't have Exp. Share / Exp. All in a game, you end up with one fuckhuge Ironmon and the rest might as well not even be there. There's no reason to switch or stop using my level 63 mon.
>>57218718
>>57218654You could always sorta do that via the game corner thoIt just took extra steps
>>57218527None. QoL is great and there is literally no reason to dislike it other than being a retard contrarian.
>>57218527Lack of poison mechanism. Way too many berries given to you making buying Potions absolete
>>57219091I know that giving experience to all Pokemon gets a bad rap among many Pokemon fans, but it really is a quality of life feature. I find it hard to go back to old Pokemon games knowing that it's a pain to level up Pokemon the old fashioned way, or how you don't get EXP for catching Pokemon. I know for others they liked it because it made the game more challenging, but personally it just makes the game more tedious, especially if you're someone like me who likes to level up my entire team.
>>57218852Large regional dexes. It's different if there's capacity for a lot of mon in the game but they're trade-only. I'm talking stuff like SwSh's base dex + DLC, completing all of it was a massive chore.
>>57218527Idk if this counts as qol but I don't like how some legendary capture rates are much higher than the previous standard. I feel more satisfied when the big guy puts up a fight.>>57218553>>57218849I agree with this. The gradual gradient of encounters between different routes within the same biome used to make it feel more "real". This is also why I'm in favor of the bw1 system wherein all the pokemon exist in the game but you're forced to use a select fraction throughout the main game.>>57218846The base rate should account for the median number of encounters per playthrough and be engineered so that you have a >50% chance to find one per playthrough, with the drawback being that the hunting methods are removed or nerfed. Going "to odds" for any fraction will always give you a 63% chance of finding the shiny, so the shiny rate should be (1/(aforementioned median number of encounters))
>>57219196>I know for others they liked it because it made the game more challengingIt doesn't make the game more challenging though. I just beat Silph Co. and I'm 75 now, whereas the trainers I'm fighting are 50. In an Exp Share game, maybe I'd have a whole team team of level 60 Pokemon. Is it "easier" to have a team of level 60 Pokemon as opposed to one leve 75 Pokemon? Maybe, but it doesn't matter either way. Waaay back when I found a Thunder Stone, I wanted to evolved Raichu, and I did, but I've never used him because it's just too much of a hassle. There's nothing difficult about it, it's just annoying, and having one mon just walk through the game one shotting everything is probably the easiest that a game could get.
>>57218527Most stuff that came after gen 5. But especially HM removal and casualized shiny odds. Fuck that shit>>57218537FPBP
>>57218527At least the candy are optional. You can just save them until the post game for whenever you need something instead of grinding. Sorta like using the missingno glitch in RGB to give yourself 255 rare candies.Unlike the forced exp share.
>>57218745Even in SV where if you do so much as 2 you're now going to be overleveled for multiple points?
>>57219091>When you don't have Exp. Share / Exp. All in a game, you end up with one fuckhuge Ironmon and the rest might as well not even be there. There's no reason to switch or stop using my level 63 mon.Have you considered to not be retarded?
>>57219380Just catch a new underleveled mon lol
>>57218777It fucked over a few early gen mons and Game Freak either took forever to fix them or just never bothered at all.
>>57218553I hate going through the first few routes of Pokemon games where it's nothing but rats & bugs & birds but I know what you mean. A lot of these areas have such a bloated encounter table that most of the biomes don't feel all that unique.
>>57218527The emphasis on trying to "improve" the graphics and go full 3D.I think if they hit their peak on the clean 2D/sprite look in HGSS and I would have been very happy if they just kept that as the norm. Instead of going full 3D models.The 3d graphics in these games aren't good enough for them to feel truly immersive. So I'd rather they just keep the SOVL instead
>>57218537>T. Hallway simulator lover
This is literally just a stealthy genwar thread btw
>>57219384This. I have a policy of switching up my whole team after every gym battle except my starter. Lets me use a lot of mons I normally wouldn't and keeps battles relatively interesting. For bonus points I choose a team with at least one type weak to the next gyms type if I know it ahead of time.
>>57219493Men who can only see discussion as war seek to create battles because they have yet to find victory in the world around them.
>>57219644Damn. That explains a lot honestly. Same with the endless waifu wars. It'd so tiring.
>>57219486Honestly I would love if the animations had as much charm as the old school battle simulator games. Whenever I defeat a gym leader and it does the slow motion knock out of its ace I get hype to see its defeat animation before remembering they start to fade before it even feels like the animation has even started.
>>57218527Exp candy would be good if there was no perma-exp share. As it is now, those items only exist to make the game even easier.
>>57219705Thats one way to look at it. To me it just makes the endgame grind better when i dont have to sos chain chanseys or run the league 100 times just to level my mons.
>>57218823Makes the games even easier
>>57219717You can do hyper training at level 50 now, and not even the DLC teams go over 90. There's basically no point in getting more than your raidmons to level 100, and raids are exclusively postgame.I never saw a reason to use them during the story because my entire party is gaining experience passively. But if there was no shared experience, they would have some value in bumping up a Pokemon that's falling behind a bit.
>>57218718Brown bricks? I love brown bricks in Pokémon.
>>57219465the problem with the earlygame having boring options is really just the result of having too many Bidoof like pokemon and not enough Shinx like pokemon. They could even actually use the baby pokemon for earlygame and let you catch something like Magby or Tyrogue when they're actually useful to you.
>>57219727Then why are the newer games harder?
>>57218960Only for the Wild Area.
>>57219644>edgy subversive societal statementFound the Baphomet.
>>57219977You're so cringe.
>>57219091Literally a (you) problem
>>57219717There shouldn’t be an endgame grind.
>>57218527Pokemon GO
>>57219945imo its more annoying when I get to like the 4th badge and I go to the route next to that town and I'm still encountering route 1 shitters.
>>57220034>>57219382No, the issue is that if you don't have Exp. All / Exp. Share then there is no reason to ever use more than one Pokemon. You need to go very much out of your way and inconvenience yourself in order to do so. There is no such issue with Exp. All / Exp. Share, and even if we say that you end up overleveled (you will end up overleveled in a Pokemon game no matter what, btw) the amount that your collective Pokemon are overleveled will be much lower than the amount that you "Ironmon" ends up being in games without Exp. All / Exp. Share. I feel like you guys just say that you think Exp. All / Exp. Share are bad, but then you've never actually gone back and played gen 1.
>>57220658>if you don't have Exp. All / Exp. Share then there is no reason to ever use more than one Pokemontype advantages?
>>57220658There's no reason to do it either way, because participating Pokemon will always gain more exp.
>>57221595Nta but because progressive levels require more xp the main mon if you’re only using one would be maybe 5-10 levels ahead and you’d be doing it purely out of spite
>>57221615The lead mon will still gain exp, there's really no reason to ever switch off it. Higher levels do require more, but it's also gaining more. And singleplayer almost never goes high enough for the exp requirements to start catching up.
>>57218527i refuse to play anything with forced exp share
>>57221628>there's really no reason to ever switch off itHow do I beat Totem Araquanid with my lead Torracat?
>>57221675level it up until it can oneshot the spoder
>>57221675https://youtu.be/hkLszymNh3UYawnie, how many times do I need to post this?
>>57221572>type advantages?Your Pokemon is too fast at this point to ever go second. >>57221628>The lead mon will still gain exp, there's really no reason to ever switch off it.If you don't have Exp. All / Exp. Share, your Ironmon is easily 30+ levels ahead of whatever you're fighting, and there is absolutely zero reason to switch off it. If you have Exp. All / Exp. Share, there level difference is not quite this drastic, and there could feasibly be a reason to switch off it.
>>57221695How do you figure? If I'm 30+ levels ahead of something in one game, why wouldn't I be just as far ahead in a different game that grants the same amount of exp?Unless you're being the typical disingenuous cunt you always are, yawnie.
>>57221675A fight like that would be significantly tougher with just a Torracat, assuming it's not grossly overleveled.
>>57221705>why wouldn't I be just as far ahead in a different game that grants the same amount of exp?Because you're not loading all of the exp onto one Ironmon, you're spreading it out across the team.>yawnieI'm not your schizo bogeyman, retard. Jesus Christ.
>>57221705This is insanely dishonest you’d have to abuse candies to be +30; new games don’t have the same trainer structure
>>57221740And you'd have to abuse trainers and wild encounters to get that high in other games.
>>57221755No you don’t you just have to be using one Pokemon and not running from all the wild encountersWhy have you guys started doing this weird larp where juggling Pokemon in the first gens isn’t awkward as fuck?
>>57221755>And you'd have to abuse trainers and wild encounters to get that high in other games.No, you just fight the trainers.
>>57221853Not to get 30+ levels ahead of anything.
>>57221763>Why have you guys started doing this weird larp where juggling Pokemon in the first gens isn’t awkward as fuck?I think it's just zoomers with fake nostalgia. You see it all the time in everything else. I'm an oldfag and I'm replaying Blue for the first time pretty much since release, and it's obvious that Exp. Share / All is a good invention, because without it you end up with one OP as fuck Ironmon that ohkos the entire game and there's never a reason to switch off of it. >>57221856Go replay Blue, anon. I grinded some levels before Brock, but I have never grinded after that. You just fight the trainers and frun from all wild encounters and you end up at level 80 while fighting level 50 trainers.
>>57218553>>57218849I think that people really underestimate how useful Morning/Day/Night is for the bloated routes. It allows you to load a route with lots of Pokemon without it feeling bloated, or having situations where you're trying to find what's supposed to be a common Pokemon but being unable to.>>57219069A Pokemon game that took more from Western RPGs and had a weight capacity would be really cool to see. People want Pokemon to be an Open World RPG, which I do think fits the series well. However, if it wants to be good, I think it needs to be willing to actually take more from Western RPGs to create something worthwhile and immersive, and not just half-assed.>>57219186Them removing how Poison worked was dumb, especially when it was used as a soft tutorial for status conditions.>>57219333>HM removal and casualized shiny oddsThe shiny odds change just feels like they're really pushing shinys to be something for people to grind and not just a fun rare oddity.HM removal s my big one though. HMs worked awkwardly, but were nice for forcing the player to think about what Pokemon they used in their team and feeling immersive. The HM slave issue could've been solved by simply not having HMs be move slots, but somethign independent of battles. ROM hacks often just have it so that if a Pokemon could learn the HM, it can use it, and that works fine. They could even expand it by adding more overworld effects that Pokemon could use.HMs needed a rework, not a removal.
>>57221853I fight all the trainers all the time.RBY I was just below level 80GSC, before Lance I was 55, before Red, 70RS I was level 63FRLG I was 70Emerald I was 66DP I was nearing 75Pt I was 71HGSS was 56, after Red I was 73BW I was level 58, B2W2 I was 63XY I was 81ORAS I was 64SM was 70USUM was 71LGPE NEVER PLAYEDSWSH was 73BDSP was 78PLA was 68SV was 72
>>57222295>RBY I was just below level 80That cannot possibly be true. See >>57219211>I just beat Silph Co. and I'm 75 now
>>57222295How are you going to criticize the use of exp candy when you go out of your way to make your Pokemon as high a level as possible?
>>57221890>but were nice for forcing the player to think about what Pokemon they used in their teamPlease don’t force your retardation on the rest of us.
>>57222356Hmm I see. I must've missed a handful of trainers somewhere. Probably Mt. Moon or Rock Tunnel.
>>57222374I'm not criticizing. Just explaining the levels I reached in each game after beating all trainers
>>57222486>I must've missed a handful of trainers somewhere.Try several handfuls, if you're not even 80 by the time you beat the game, especially with Elite 4 exp.
I fucking hate how powerful amie affection and its effects are on playthroughs.I want to pet my mons and do the dumb minigames sometimes but the gay friendship effects make battles take that much longer and gives bullshit RNG I shouldn't be surviving through.
>>57222486>>57222509Oh, and that was Silph Co. before going down to Fuchsia City and doing that whole thing or any of the bike path trainers or the snorlax path trainers or Koga.
>>57218527postgame
>>57222516I like the affection bonuses but the game should be balanced around assuming the player has them at all times like how Xenoblade does their character bonding mechanics. It IS training your Pokemon after all. Treating your mon like shit should penalize you harsher too outside of lowering Return's power (before it got axed).
>>57219977>"don't be a stupid freak who argues with everyone over inconsequential shit">edgy and subversive
>>57218537I was against this ever since playing BoTW. It just makes Pokemon easier to exploit progress-wise.
>>57222509I see. I was following a guide. Maybe it was incomplete?
>>57222516Bro I maxed out my Pokemons affection in Eternal X and Umbra Moon and regretted it so hard, turns the game into such a joke. Seeing it get baked in with the friendship mechanics in BDSP was too fucking much, especially with how little elsevthe games changed from DP. Built-in Shed Skin, Focus Band, Brightpowder, Scope Lens... like wtf is that shit?
>>57222423A teambuilding RPG should force you to consider what your team is.
>>57222857Yawnfag would say "just use bitter herbs".Which shouldn't be necessary.
>>57218823It makes challenge runs harder and prevents me from keeping my favorite Pokemon on my team all the time without them getting overleveled.
>>57219091Just switch the Pokemon at the head of your party so the lowest level is always the lead and this never happens.
>>57223771>just play the game like a retardThere is no reason to do this. Even in cases where you *want* to use another Pokemon, it is so insanely cumbersome to actually level them up that it's not even worth doing.
>>57219977You're actually underaged.
>>57223777No retard. Just rotate your team.
A lot of this thread seems to be people not understanding why other people don't play the game the most optimal and efficient way. It's a game. You play it to enjoy it in your own way. For some that means following the path of least resistance and only leveling your starter. And that's fine.But I'm curious, what enjoyment do you find in the games this way? I've done a solo Bulbasaur only run in Fire Red (couldn't beat Blue's Alakazam and Charizard back to back) but I did that for the challenge and not cause it was easy. Do you have a particular reason you play this way, is there a certain aspect of the games that you find fun when played like this?
>>57224861>A lot of this thread seems to be people not understanding why other people don't play the game the most optimal and efficient way.No, the issue is that *not* playing the game this way is insanely tedious, annoying, cumbersome, and requires extra grinding that using just 1 Pokemon does not. It's not that using 1 Pokemon is more fun, it's that leveling up a team without Exp. Share / All is super annoying, takes a long time, and isn't actually rewarding. It's actually probably faster to just make a beeline for Cinnabar to dupe rare candies than it is to keep a team of 6 decently leveled. The point of the conversation you are commenting on is to point out that Exp. Share / All are good addition to the games and that people who say otherwise have not actually gone back and replayed a game that does not have early Exp. Share / All access.
>>57218527Open worldExp shareSwitch modeDestiny Knot/Everstone breeding mechanicsBottle capsShiny charmMasuda methodShow effectiveness of movesDisplay active effects and buffs of your pokémon and the opponent'sInfinite TMsAbility to forget HMsDeletion of HMsExp candyEV training bracesEV feathersDisplay of EV trainingJudge functionTurning HOME points into BPThe list goes on.
>>57224871>the issue is that *not* playing the game this way is insanely tedious, annoying, cumbersomeSee here is the thing, that is all subjective. I have gone back and played old pokemon games and I disagree. That's why I'm asking the question. What compels you to go back and play these games if you aren't enjoying them? I had assumed you were playing them because you enjoyed them. Are you just rushing through them in order to say you've done so?
>>57218537thisi hate botwfags for ruining both zelda and pokemon>hurr durr run around in empty plains so much fun!
>>57224929better than running around in empty hallways
>>57224933exceptempty plains existempty hallways dont
>>57224934yes they dose all of gen 1 and 2
>>57224902I'm curious about you dislike of these things. There doesn't seem to be much rhyme or reason to your list. It feels like you just listed everything you could think of. Any particular reasons you have?Maybe it could help if you explain some qol that you did like.
>>57219977reddit
I know this is a bait thread but after playing PLA I found that the whole team Exp Share was just badly balanced in X&Y. I'm replaying X rn and while I enjoy the game, having a whole squad ten levels above every gym leader past gym 3 is ridiculous. I didn't even dump most exp on One Mon or something and I'm not doing anything different than when I play other games, just looking for trainers to fight between towns. It makes me wonder if they added the whole squad EXP share AFTER balancing the game and what would happen if I played without it.
>>57224929It was fun though. Botw was fun for the same reason Mario 64 or Odyssey were fun. They made moving through the world enjoyable and engaging.Going from one point to the next was fun because you had several different traversal options like gliding, sledding, horse back. You could approach situations in whatever way you wanted and since the game was designed as a web of interacting physics you could let your imagination actually get creative with solutions.Botw may have led to a lot of poorly aped attempts to copy its open world (SV) but the game itself is the best open world I've ever seen implemented.
>>57224926>See here is the thing, that is all subjective.It is not subjective to say that it is incredibly annoying and tedious and that there is no reason to lead with the Pokemon you want to level, and then swap into your "main" Pokemon to level it. >What compels you to go back and play these games if you aren't enjoying them? You cannot read, anon. You cannot read. You've wandered into this thread with the sole desire to shitpost. It is not fun (or rewarding, or necessary) to level more than one Pokemon in Gen 1 where you don't get Exp. All until very late. So late, in fact, that's it's not even worth using by the time you get it. Once again, because you are a shitposter who can't read, the conversation is to say that modern Exp. All / Shares are massive improvements to the game that *also* serve the dual purpose of making it so that you don't end up with 1 Pokemon who is 30+ levels higher than everything else. Not only does it kinda curb this issue, but it also gives you reason to use more than 1 Pokemon, because it's not a hassle to keep them leveled.>Are you just rushing through them in order to say you've done so?I wanted to replay Blue because I hadn't played it pretty much since it came out. You need to learn to read and to stop shitposting.
>>57225000>It is not subjective to say that it is incredibly annoying and tediousIt literally is subjective. Something that annoys one person isn't going to annoy another. Same with their tolerance for a repetitive action becoming tedious. I for example would find it tedious to just use the same pokemon using the same attack over and over again. You argue that is somehow less tedious than training multiple pokemon. So even though some of your arguements make sense I'm still not getting the full through line of your logic.
>>57224861"I-I'm just choosing to play the game less optimally!" is a massive cope used by people as a cover to hide the fact that they're just terrible at the games, and that people who aren't terrible at the games are able to spot the shit game design. If this was a real excuse you same retards wouldn't be whining about XY being too easy.
>>57225048>You argue that is somehow less tedious than training multiple pokemon. Objectively correct.
>>57225063>whining about the xyYou realize that you're making an assumption right? I have never played XY and have no opinions on it. Not evergbody with a different opinion than you is secretly the same person.And also, some people play games to play them perfectly and optimally and that's fine. That's why speed running is so popular. But some people would rather enjoy the experience of the game in other ways. Thats why challenge runs like type runs or nuzlockes exist. Or people building teams with mons they like because they want the experience playing the game with a pokemon they like.There is no need to be hostile. Different ways to experience the game is part of the appeal of pokemon. There is no need to dick measure who is the cooler better dude at playing pokemon.
>>57225068Well, it can't be helped if we don't even agree on the meanings of subjective and objective. Such a fundamental disagreement means we can't really have a discussion on it like I had hoped. Oh well.
>>57225143You didn't want to have a discussion. You came in here to shitpost and purposely misconstrue what anyone was saying.
>>57224938hes just trolling by listing random shit. like literally nobody cares if ev training is easier because its tedious busywork to begin with that you can only really effectively do postgame to begin with
>>57224902>Infinite TMs>Ability to forget HMs>Deletion of HMstoo far
>>57225145I'm not shit posting. Exp share always being on being a good or bad thing based on a person's prefered way to play the games. Hence the discussion of subjectivity. After all, battling the pokemon IS the gameplay of the game. Battling is the central mechanic point of the game. And you train pokemon by battling with them. If you aren't enjoying battling with the pokemon while training them then it stands to reason that you enjoy battling them in other ways. Maybe you find training battling to be a speed bump and only care about battling in fully trained teams. Or maybe you just want to clear the game fast. I don't know what you play pokemon for, so I asked hoping to get some clarity on the matter.So you can call me dumb, thats fine. Maybe I am. But I am not asking disingenuously. From the point of view I have your arguement makes it seem like you don't want to battle with your pokemon. So I'm trying to ask questions that will help me understand your reasoning better.
>>57225243>I'm not shit posting.Well you're certainly not attempting to read or understand.>Exp share always being on being a good or bad thing based on a person's prefered way to play the games.I truly don't think so. If Exp. All is always on, you have an entire team that is always useable, and your main mon is not 30+ levels above what you're fighting. If Exp. All is not available until later in the game (like in Gen 1), what ends up happening is that you have one Ironmon that is so ridiculously overleveled that there's no reason to ever switch.>After all, battling the pokemon IS the gameplay of the game.Correct. Tediously leveling Pokemon is not the gameplay, actually battling is the gameplay. This is why a lot of the difficulty hacks auto level your Pokemon to the level caps per area or give you infinite rare candy with which to accomplish this same feat. Difficulty hacks rarely (never?) make you level your own Pokemon, because that's not the game. Battling is the game. >If you aren't enjoying battling with the pokemon while training them then it stands to reason that you enjoy battling them in other ways.Correct. I enjoy actually battling. If you have Exp. All, there is more reason and opportunity to do this. You are more able to switch for type advantage or attack immunity or whatever. In Gen 1, you literally just have one fuckhuge Pokemon and nothing else matters, and leveling other Pokemon is an actively bad thing to be doing, and it's also not fun.
>>57225270But this all is still assuming that the player wants to only use one pokemon the whole run. It's also a very 'skip the journey to reach the destination' sort of mentality because with this kind of thinking you might as well just skip the games and go play on a battle simulator. The logic hear is ignoring the fact that exploring the unknown, discovering new monsters and experimenting with them, and building a team with the knowledge you gain is also a part of the gameplay. It may not be gameplay you enjoy, but it is the kind that some people do.Exp Share is great because it lets you build a team fast. As a hobby I train up random wondertrade mons before wondertrading them again for something new to train and Exp Share is really great for that. But it's cons come in the fact that when it is always on it fast tracks you through the exploring and experimenting stages of the game. If you're going back into older games with knowledge about what you're going to find and what already works then you are going to not be getting much of that from the game already. The best part of exploring and experimenting is when you do it in a game were you don't know what you will find. But EXP Share increases the pace which you get through that part of the game. And since its always on even when a new game comes out the pace that you move through the exploration stage of the game is a lot faster and thus ends sooner. So if you like that sorta thing then Exp Share always been on hinders that.Hopefully that better articulates my point.
>>57225340>But this all is still assuming that the player wants to only use one pokemon the whole run.No, it is despite the player wanting to use more than one Pokemon. I already detailed this earlier. I *wanted* to use both Vaporeon and Raichu when I got the respective stones, and I spent way the fuck too long leveling them up to like 20, but even at 20 they weren't up to snuff and I just gave up because it was 1) annoying, 2) a lot of wasted exp for my "main", and 3) not fun or good.>exploring the unknown...it's Pokemon, bro. There's nothing unknown. >building a teamYou can build a team much more easily with Exp. All. >it fast tracks you through the exploring and experimenting stages of the gameNo, it allows you to "explore and experiment" in the first place. Not having Exp. All, most people will end up with one Pokemon that is 30+ levels higher than everything else. Having Exp. All, you might actually care about the Pokemon in your party and you might actually find reasons to use them.
>>57223777Switching Pokemon is the entire game. Sometimes I even switch them if they haven't leveled up yet just because it's fun to use more Pokemon. It's not fun to use the same one over and over.
>>57224861It's not people, it's just one person, Yawnfag.
>>57225398>Switching Pokemon is the entire gameAccording to who?>It's not fun to use the same one over and over.Agreed, which is exactly why the games with team exp share are better. It gives you an actual reason to use different Pokemon.
>>57225404The exp share games prevent you from using all your Pokemon because they level up too quickly...
>>57225398>Switching Pokemon is the entire game.I agree. That's why it's nice that difficulty hacks level your Pokemon up to the caps for you. That's also why Exp. All is nice; it allows you to actually switch your Pokemon. >it's fun to use more PokemonAgree. That's why Exp. All is better than not having it.
>hack buffs my shitmonYeah, no thanks. I prefer struggling and making up a creative solution to defeat my opponent and laughing while doing so because Poketards cry about "muh unusable shitmon"
>>57225400I'm not your bogeyman, schizo. I'm just an oldfag who has recently replayed Blue, and I am also aware that there is a vocal minority who hate Exp. All, and my opinion is now that those people is now that they are fake nostalgia zoomers who have not actually played Gen 1 anytime recently.
>>57225358>...it's Pokemon, bro. There's nothing unknownSee, this is what I'm getting at. In your example you're going back and playing a game that you already have forward knowledge of. You already know all 150 pokemon. But when these games first came out we didn't. Finding a pokemon you've never seen before and capturing it and using it and discovering it can evolve are all things that get fast tracked through in the modern games with essy access online information. The part of the game is the exploration I'm talking about getting fast tracked.As an example, one of my favorite SV memories is stumbling onto toedscool for the first time and being excited to capture it and add it to my team. But with how fast everything leveled up in the games I ended up evolving it pretty quickly and then never using it because it was too strong to make any of the fights interesting. So even though I really like Toedscool I never got to use it as much as I would like. And with Exp Share making leveling so easy I didn't have any reason to stick with it and try to make the effort I put in work because I didn't need to put in any effort to level it up.Contrast this to Butterfree and Raticate, two other mons I enjoy because I invested effort into raising them when first playing Blue. Since I had to put in the time to actually raise them I had incentive to figure out how to make them useful despite their shortcomings. So I grew a firm attachment to these mons that wouldn't have happened with exp share.
>>57225411Wow I feel like a dummy typing all that out when you put it so eloquently.
>>57225430>But when these games first came out we didn't.Anon, even when I was 8 years old, I still overleveled the starter. That's what everyone did. There are memes about it. You're making less sense the more you talk.
>>57225063As a person who has beaten every game multiple times, XY is the easiest. How do you define optimal gameplay?
>>57225443Yes you did. And I didn't. And many other kids did or didn't because they play games differently.That's the main point that you have yet to respond to. That people do things differently than you. I was trying to make a lot of points to connect that all together, but you seem to be cherry picking your responses so I'm losing faith that you're discussing this honestly.
>>57218823It used to be trivial to get one monster that was extremely overleveled to beat the game. Now you can get an entire party that is extremely overleveled for the same amount of effort.
>>57225676>And many other kids did or didn't*Most* other kids did. *Most* kids (and most people) played the games this way, because it is the most convenient and therefore most "fun" way to play the games. It is not fun to sit around and grind your Pokemon's levels by switching them out for 2 hours. That's not fun, and it's also unnecessary and a waste of time. I already told you that I even wanted to use Vaporeon and Raichu during this playthrough, but gave up because it's just so god damn annoying to do. And that's on an emulator with speed up. Why would I center my argument in favor of Exp. All around fringe cases that account for maybe 10% of all players, if we're being generous?
>>57219486HGSS really do have an almost perfect aesthetic.
>>57225443I didn't overlevel my started. I would divide my experience out evenly so that all the Pokemon on my party were the exact same level. If one pulled away, due to say having a favorable matchup against a gym and getting a few levels all at once, it'd get put at the bottom of the party until the others caught up, even if it meant using other others in non-favorable matchups, because I HAD to maintain a balanced party. Not every kid just rushes through the game, gets a Nidoking, and uses it exclusively.
>>57225624>As a person who is bad at the games, XY is the easiestftfy
>>57225714>Not every kid just rushes through the game, gets a [Pokemon], and uses it exclusively.Most kids and most players do. This is why Exp. All is good. Exp. All allows *most* players to become more incentivized to use more Pokemon because they are more easy to use if they are already getting Exp. And in these cases, it also reduces how overleveled the "main" mon can get, which is also a better outcome. Now, ideally you can turn Exp. All off and play the game however you want to play it. But if there is only one option, Exp. All is the correct option because it benefits *most* players by allowing them to use multiple Pokemon.
>>57225695>Why would I center my argument in favor of Exp. All around fringe cases that account for maybe 10% of all players, if we're being generous?From my experience it's maybe a quarter of people did the "overleveled starter" thing. Most people had at least a few Pokemon all at the same high level they could switch between, and a handful having a full party. It's just natural to end up with multiple strong Pokemon because there will always be at least one gym your starter can't just power through. No one who picked Charmander beat Misty with Charmeleon.
>>57225729>From my experience it's maybe a quarter of people did the "overleveled starter" thing.That's a bogus number you pulled out of your ass that is not at all reflective of the reality. I cannot entertain someone who says things so dishonestly.
>>57225729>No one who picked Charmander beat Misty with Charmeleonlmfao
>>57225726I don't think it's most, I think it's minority, maybe even a tiny minority. Like, it's unnatural. You have to be told to do it. You, just through playing normally as a child, will fill out your party. I've seen this in two of my own children as, before I got them Switches, I let them play the older games on my old Game Boy and DS. I didn't bother telling them ways to optimize the games, I just let them play, and both of them would usually just catch a bunch of Pokemon, find the ones they like, and use all of them.
>>57225695Your personal anecdote is not really concrete here. My arguement assumes nothing about the data because we have none, yours relies on assuming the data we don't have skews a certain way.
>>57225757>My arguement assumes nothing about the data because we have none, yours relies on assuming the data we don't have skews a certain way.You can read what my argument is. A support piece of evidence is that most people played the game this way. You don't even have to agree with this fact in order to read my argument and see the logic in it outside of this fact. If you want to participate in the conversation, you need to actually read it. >>57225746>I don't think it's most, I think it's minority, maybe even a tiny minority.You would be woefully mistaken. >You have to be told to do it. Absolutely not. What? What a dumb thing to say.
>>57225769Come on man, I would rather you put effort into the discussion than deflecting with "trust me bro".Regardless, I had fun talking about pokemon so thanks for that.
>>57225746>You have to be told to do itNo you don’t. If a child gets his starter, starts spamming moves to beat everything with his starter, then catches a lv2 Wurmple, then sees that the Wurmple is fucking garbage and dies while they get rewarded by using the starter which easily beats everything, they’re just going to keep using the starter.
>>57225778>Come on man, I would rather you put effort into the discussion than deflecting with "trust me bro"....but you're the one who started doing the "trust me bro" shit. There are a litany of memes demonstrating the phenomenon I am describing. You, on the other hand, have nothing but "well, I didn't play the game that way" and then you started making up things like "most people spent 40 hours tediously leveling all of their Pokemon evenly" when that's not the case at all. You are so incapable of arguing against my logic that you began making things up, and now you're saying that I'm the one doing it. Typical shitposter playbook, which fits because you began this by purposely misinterpreting what is being said.
>>57225780Unless they want to engage in the fantasy of being a good trainer and try to bring the best out of their pokemon. Like something Ash would do in the show, train up an underdog pokemon. Thats why I like using Raticate and Butterfree.
>>57225790>You are so incapable of arguing against my logic that you began making things up, and now you're saying that I'm the one doing it. Typical shitposter playbook
>>57225726You know, back in the day we trained a weak pokemon we wanted to use by hand and we liked it!Making a weak pokemon stronger and maybe even evolving it manually was rewarding. I’ll never forget finally evolving my shitty Caterpie into a Butterfree as a kid, Butterfree’s still one of my favorites to this day because of that childhood experience.With the modern party-wide exp gain you just don’t get experiences like that anymore, because games have to be as convenient as possible nowadays
>>57225833>You know, back in the day we trained a weak pokemon we wanted to use by hand and we liked it!No we didn't. I'm an oldfag who played Gen 1 when it came out. I went into this playthrough wanting to use different Pokemon because I remembered just using the starter the whole game, but it was just too tedious even with emulator speed up to actually level other Pokemon. >With the modern party-wide exp gain you just don’t get experiences like that anymore, because games have to be as convenient as possible nowadaysModern party-wide exp gain allows you to actually use more than one Pokemon, as the devs intended.
>>57225833Are you RPing as me to keep the discussion going?
>>57225717And how does that make mebad at the game?
>>57225937It doesn't. Yawnfag is just delusional. If people don't think all Pokémon games are equally easy, he get's angry.
>>57225937>how does thinking the 1st grade math test is easier with the calculator make me bad at math?
