Is auto-fire cheating?
NahBesides it's not worth it wearing your controllers down and getting carpal tunnel over any videogame
>>11492876just never die and conserve your ammo wiselyproblem solved, and you did beat the game
If a game is balanced on having a weapon which is weaker, but autofires by default; then yes autofire for everything is cheating
>>11492876if it is in the game no, if it is in your gamepad YES.
>>11492876it sucks but yes. you are not meant to comfortably hold it down at an absurd rate of fire. the game is balanced around your rate of fire dipping with movement and multitasking. besides just the rate it's humanly possible to hit a button.
>>11492876The game difficultly is balanced around a main basic pistol that requires a button press to fire a single shot. And other higher damage weapons that semi auto-fire (single button press fires 3 to 5 shots).And the most rare weapons are vehicles armed with heavy weapons which have full auto-fire, but these are rare in the game. Using full auto-fire on weapons that were never designed to have it completely ruins the game difficulty and goes against what the game designers intended.
>>11492876Yes. All Metal Slug games after 1 are rife with pointless bullet sponges, though, so if you're not playing for internet clout, autofire away.
>>11493121>Using full auto-fire on weapons that were never designed to have it completely ruins the game difficulty and goes against what the game designers intended.Yeah, and not inserting quarters into the cabinet is ALSO cheating.
>>11493153But what if you own the cabinet?
>>11493005What if it's a toggleable option on a port? >>11493121>The game difficultly is balanced around a main basic pistol that requires a button press to fire a single shot.Maintaining a high rate of fire on the pistol isn't challenging moment to moment. It just becomes straining over repeated attempts/playthroughs.
>>11492876Yes it is. I'll still use it for accessibility purposes.
>>11493174>Maintaining a high rate of fire on the pistol isn't challenging moment to moment. It just becomes straining over repeated attempts/playthroughs.Sounds like that's a you problem. I play Metal Slug just fine without autofire.So did the tens of millions of other players who played it over the years.
>>11492876UNLESS you are disabled, have a physical issue (like missing fingers), or a health issue (arthritis) that prevents you from playing normally...then yes autofire is cheating.
>>11493205Did tens of millions 1cc it or did they beat it by putting in more quarters? If there's a higher tolerance for mistakes then you don't need to be as good at shooting.
For Metal Slug, I'd say yes, since the pistol was specifically progrmmed to not have a fast autofire, while other weapons were. Broadly speaking, it depends. Is it built into the game? Then no. Not built into the game? Then typically yes, it is cheating, but there's cases like the Famicom game Hector '87 - Hudson released a Hector branded revision of their autofire controller, which was even used at their own competition caravan event. In that particular case, the game seems to have been specifically designed around using (read: selling) autofire controllers.At the end of the day, who cares, play how you want. That said, regardless of what some people insist, rapid tapping is indeed a skill, and some games even had sections designed to challenge your tapping ability. Can you really say you beat Fatal Fury's arm wrestling bonus stage if you enabled autofire and just held the punch button for 5 seconds?
>>11493218>>11493174>1cc>It just becomes straining over repeated attempts/playthroughs.That's the problem right there. You doing this for internet clout. You are doing this to yourself. It's not the games fault.
>>11492876I think its on a case by case basis. A game like contra has a weapon with auto fire, so using the nes max controller for the auto fire would be cheating.But it does get fuzzy when talking about games like r-type on the pc engine, because the arcade did not have auto fire, but the pce does have it built into the controller.
Hey guys!Is it cheating if I hire a professional boxer to auto punch this boxing machine for me?Im trying to 1CC and get the highest score on this game for the world record.I've been going to Chuck E Cheese and punching this machine for hours everyday for weeks. Nonstop. But my wrist and hand hurts now. You guys don't understand. I NEED that highest record. There's a boxing machine forum website that are hosted by the Japanese and they claim to have the highest record on this machine. I need to that internet clout to prove the a Japanese wrong. I still don't have the highest score record, but I want to hire a boxer to auto punch for me. Is it cheating?
>>11493174>It just becomes straining over repeated attempts/playthroughs.Why are you playing so much that you are hurting your hands? Haven't you ever heard of taking a break? Lmao.
>>11493267Just make ask the operator to install an auto-hit circuit, so you can just hold the bag up and the machine will continually register hits. Any Japanese arcade operator worth their salt will already have one installed, it's only American boomers who pretend like rapidly hitting a bag is a test of skill.
>>11493251I was pointing out the problem with the argument. Manual fire might've been intended for the arcade experience but so was the ability to offset that difficulty by increasing the number of continues, at a cost obviously. But now that you're playing the game outside the conditions it was designed for and you can have unlimited continues at no cost whatsoever it falls down to you to be the game designer and rebalance the difficulty with your own set of rules. Limiting the number of continues (with 1cc being the extreme) is one such rule. Using auto-fire is another. Basically I'm just wondering how people that play arcade games approach this issue. Asking if it's "cheating" was just engagement bait.
>>11493405 Then just go play a console game or console port. You don't see people complaining about lap times in Cruisin' USA on arcade cabinets VS Cruisin' USA lap times on the Nintendo 64.I don't INTENTIONALLY go to the arcade cabinet of Cruisin USA and bitch on the internet about having to spend money, or having no save states when I mess up a turn. Or complaining about the arcade seat being too uncomfortable for long gaming 1CC sessions. No. I just play the Nintendo 64 version at home on a comfortable seat or couch with a controller like any other normal person.
>>11492876>Is auto-fire cheating?If it's not programmed into the game by default, then yes.The only exception is if you are physical disability or if yoy have a physical injury. You get a pass.
>>11492876The real question is why would you need autofire? Just enjoy the game for what it is. You play. You die. You insert another quarter.
>>11493405You talk like having to make your own rules is mandatory. It's not.You play, at the end of the game you take a note of how many credits it took, and next time you try to do better. No need for bullshit made up rules that only exist in your head.
I don't think so since the game wants you to press quickly and this can wear out your control. MS2 is most guilty of this because of the infamous train level
>>11494072>The real question is why would you need autofire?
This debate is very similar to the challenge/difficulty debate. First you have something which used to be a norm (players enjoying wanting difficult games / players getting used to tapping buttons fast), then this norm disappeared almost entirely except for some niche games here and there which sole gimmick were "we're like, oldschool, man", and now you have people who can't comprehend the norm was ever different and who come up with all kinds of bullshit excuses, even to the point of revisionism, either because they can't accept things were ever different or because they can't handle seeing games remind them they don't have the skillsets to play them.This could be an interesting study of human nature, which has no equivalent in other forms of media, if only it wasn't so pathetic.Webm related: the norm games like Metal Slug were built on.
>>11494082>1987The same year Hudson saved everyone from mindless button mashing. Best third party controller manufacturer, better than Hori.
>>11494089Explain to me how you plug that into the Metal Slug cabinets that used to be in every street corner in Japan
>>11494092Explain to me how you're expecting fair game design from an arcade game.
>>11494082The problem is that modern players are playing the game so much that they hurt their hands. Playing for hours and hours and hours each day. They are chasing internet glory to make their YouTube videos and internet clout. It's like these fools can't comprehend that playing ANY game that long will cause hand problems. Doesn't matter what genre of game. Fighters, Shoot em ups, beat em ups, FPS, etc will cause hand issues. You are supposed to take breaks and play in moderation. But these Shmup and RunNGun players...some of them play for 8 to 12 hours a day. It's crazy. They obsess about glory and winning records that they look for shortcuts. They become so obsessive. To the point where they try to argue to change the rules to make it easier for themselves. The Japanese are a funny case study on this. Like your picture showed, Older Japanese players just accepted the game as is and played as needed. But modern players either can't or won't play that way anymore. They can't even accept that's how most older generations played. So they argue about adding weird features to old games like autofire or save states or other custom cheats claiming everyone are fools and this game needs to cater to their needs.The worst part is that metal Slug is extremely mild when it comes to Button pressing. It's not even that hard.
>>11494102Games are about personal glory. You've forgotten that they're GAMES
>>11494081Have you tried getting good? Even if you can't mash fast enough, simply get there with a better weapon.
>>11494081The quality of the game drops of a cliff at that exact moment. The last level in particular is just objectively terrible.
>>11494081I played this level when I was 8 years old. It was fun. Played it inside a laundromat while my Mom did laundry. I can't believe you are struggling to match what my 8 year old self could do.Get good.
>>11494108Pretty much. Such a stark contrast with the first game which was well designed start to finish and never resorted to any cheap tricks.
>>11494081That section alone is proof that the game wasn't designed around autofire circuits. Adding autofire completely negates the challenge of that section.
>>11492876At least in the first game it made your performance against certain fights noticeable easier when you had a pistol. If it's the case in 3 how could it not be "cheating"?
>>11494102You don't learn how people normally think with engagement bait. You just get outraged.Whether or not auto fire is cheating and whether it's a cheat we ought to do are different questions. You phrased it so fewer people would talk about what we ought to do.
>>11495020If you're playing competitively, you play by the rules of the competition. If you're playing for fun, do whatever you find most enjoyable. If you're playing to challenge yourself, don't use it (unless it were programmed in by developers). If you're playing to brag, you should qualify if you used autofire or not, because while in some games it doesn't make a huge difference, especially if the game itself has a relatively low speed cap, in others it can fundamentally change the difficulty level (try playing Zero Wing AC without max autofire of the green/homing weapon).
>>11494497There's still challenge on the later ones where you have to juggle the train and the enemies. The final train in MSX still gets me even with autofire.
>>11492876No, this game is massively improved with autofire and all slowdown removed. It's one of my favorite games ever, but it's honestly hard to recommend because played vanilla it's honestly terrible because you are mashing like a spastic and the game is running at 5fps
>>11493405this is a stupid comparison, unlimited continues can be easily isolated from the basic function of the game. autofire changes things in a far less accountable manner.
>>11495307>No, this game is massively improved with autofire Too easy with autofire. It's boring m. >and all slowdown removed.Not related to the topic at all.
>>11495326if it's easy then do a no-miss run, I've done that for the first 7 games. I don't care if mashing like a spastic adds to the difficulty, it's not fun at all and detracts from the experience. Covering one eye and hopping up and down on one leg would be harder too, why don't you try that?
>>11493405>I was pointing out the problem with the argument. Manual fire might've been intended for the arcade experience but so was the ability to offset that difficulty by increasing the number of continuesThe ability to offset difficulty is literally the "Game difficulty setting" in the Arcade Operator Menu of Metal Slug. If you can't handle the 'very hard' difficulty setting, then you should lower it to medium or easy. Stop pretending that you are more skilled than you actually are.
>>11495331>I've done that for the first 7 gamesAutofire? You didn't beat it.
>>11495332Tell me, is doing 1cc on easy more or less difficult than beating the game on very hard but with unlimited continues?
>>11495336Both eyes uncovered and sitting down? You didn't beat it.
>>11495331>if it's easy then do a no-miss run, Lmao. The autism is evolving. First it was 1CC no death runs.Now it's "no miss all bullets must hit every enemy" run.What random challenge will they add next? One hand challenge? Blindfold challenge? >I've done that for the first 7 games.No you haven't. I guarantee one of your shots missed or went off screen.
>>11495346"no miss" is weeaboo for no death.
>>11495346no-miss is a very common term for arcade games and shooters, and means no death. but good job embarrassing yourself there retard.
>>11495350>"very common" During the peak of arcades, no one is Western arcades was running around yelling 'no miss' clear!
>>11495348How in the world did the Japanese even come up with the term no miss? Some English mistranslation that stuck around, and now Westerners who want to be cool copied it?
>>11495340>Tell me, is doing 1cc on easy more or less difficult than beating the game on very hard but with unlimited continues?If you can't master doing 1cc on Easy Difficultly, then you shouldn't even be THINKING about Very Hard mode.
Why is Metal Slug confound so many users here?
>>11495761its just one schizo from /shmupg/ that has to sperg about 1ccs and autofire.
>>11492876>Is auto-fire cheating?If you are going for a world record? Yes. It's cheating. The record holder organization Twin Galaxies keeps track of all gaming world records and they do not allow autofire. Every arcade game must be played in the same way the cabinet was used in arcades.If you want to play by yourself for fun? No. Do what you want. Use all the cheat codes you want. It's for fun. Just don't expect others to applaud your efforts.
>>11492876If you play with one of these then yes. Otherwise no.
>>11492876no, anyone who says it is is a low-IQ retard. It's a way of not runing your buttons/hand. If you are afriad of the bullets going to fast from the pistol, just lower the rate of the autofire but the average VResident is probably too dumb to know how to do that in MAME.
>>11495981Just play console versions. Why are you obsessed with the "inferior" arcade version that don't have all the features you like?
>>11495981>It's a way of not runing your buttons/hand.Your buttons will not break that easily. If your hand is that fragile, then you shouldn't be playing metal Slug.
>>11495987try playing it and other arcade games over a lifetime, yes mashing can absolutely hurt your hands
>>11495993>try playing it and other arcade games over a lifetimeThen replace the buttons on your arcade cabinet or arcade stick. They literally sell replacement buttons. These buttons are not designed to last a lifetime. The manufacturers expect it to break at a certain point.>yes mashing can absolutely hurt your handsThen don't play Metal Slug if it hurts your hands. The rest of us will be fine.
>>11496006yeah I'd like to make sure they work as long as possible instead of just replacing them and wasting my money lol. no I will continue to play metal slug and other arcade games, and good luck
>>11495984who says i'm obsessed lmao, no I will take the one that costs 0 dollars and is more accurate over hunting down a copy on sega saturn or whatever and finding an autofire pad.
>>11496008>wasting my money lol. It's like $10 dollars for a replacement set of high quality buttons. Maybe don't buy Starbucks for 1 day.>no I will continue to play metal slug and other arcade games, and good luckThe stop complaining about your hand hurting and expecting us to care.>my hand hurts when I play this game! >then don't play this game. >NoOOoo I nEed to plaY aND hUrT myself MoRe! There's no helping people like you.
>>11496017>the one that costs 0 dollarsWhat costs 0 dollars?
>>11495981>>11496017So you admit that the arcade version, the version without any of the cheats or hacks or autofire, is the one you really want to play? Lmao.
Are auto-fire scorefags maybe even worse than speedrunners? At least speedrunners are kinda aware they're dorky, but these auto-fire guys legit think they're the "cool guys" of gaming with their blatant cheating lol>b-but the japanese do it, that means it's legitno
>>11496027He's tsundere for the arcade version. He just won't admit it.
>>11496027>>11496019>I am willing to potentially damage my hands and needlessly spend money to play games mental damage. the japanese use autofire because they're not dumb, westoids literally can't be helped they WANT to suffer
>>11496064If your hand is so weak that a few rounds of Metal Slug will cause injury, then you shouldn't be playing Metal Slug!>JapanNot a good example. These are the same people who play 9 to 10 hours a day of Shmups without breaks and without rest and ruin their health.At least Esports team members in Western countries are forced by team managers to take breaks and excerise.
>>11496068i'm talking about accumulated damage and its compounded when you play multiple games lmao. Like if you are serious about 1ccing games, using autofire is a no-brainer and its just replicating something you already could do in the game, just without the strain on your muscles. what is the big deal with you people?
>>11496074There's nothing wrong with it, and I tried it out myself using auto-fire on Aero Fighters on ZSNES and it's indeed much more pleasant to playBut you have to admit it's kinda cheating, and when you guys start bragging about high scores or 1cc etc you look like liars>its just replicating something you already could do in the gamethis could turn into a slippery slopereminds me of those minecraft cheaters on youtube who modify the game to increase the drop rates of stuff, technically they still have to play the game with skill like everyone else but things just happen more often for them so they have more tries
>>11496090that's not the same at all lmao. that's literally altering the game. this is mimicking something that you could already do. it is not cheating at all, which is why its the standard for the japanese. button mashing is not a skill, but for some reason in the west people are obsessed with not allowing accessibilty features or anything to help you not harm yourself over the course of years.
>>11496074>i'm talking about accumulated damage and its compounded when you play multiple games lmao.You should be taking breaks from games to prevent injury in the first place. And if you do get injured, stop playing. Your body CAN heal itself with time.
>>11496094>this is mimicking something that you could already do. But you just admitted you can't do it though. That's why you need autofire.
>>11493174>portCreeping into "you didn't beat the game" territory
>>11496129I can do it, I just don't want to. that's the whole point I've been making, you need to take a remedial reading course
>>11496127if only there was a way to play longer while mitigating the potential injury
>>11496145>I can do it, I just don't want to.Then you don't need autofire. You are just lazy. Play a couple rounds. Take regular breaks. And don't play if your hand is sore. It's literally the same method sports players use.
>>11496145Lmao. Give us a break. All autofire will do is make you play even LONGER and harder until you get injured agaib. Your problem isn't your hand. Your problem is obsession.
>>11496132I mean If he wants autofire then go play the Playstation 1 version.
>>11496179why wouldI button mash when I can just use autofire? I don't have this mentally damaged idea in my mind that you guys do where I have to mash buttons or else I'm not playing the game or something. I take breaks lmao, I'm talking about accumulated damage over a lifetime of playing a couple hours a day, I've repeated myself like 4 times already >>11496186sure keep telling yourself that, whatever you need to justify your button mashing I guess. You're probably due for a button change soon, better get on that
>This faggot again I missed you autofire-schizo.
>>11495710The point is that limiting continues is also a difficulty modifier, maybe even the most important one.
>>11496548You realize literally everyone in the west that actually plays arcade games (proficiently) uses autofire right? It's not one schizo, and it's not a Japanese thing.Thank fuck everyone who actually cares about these games isn't afflicted with this mind disease, if I had to endure autofire debates amongst actual shmup players I'd kill myself. No one cares that you play the Gradius NES port without autofire
>>11495987>>11496006Yeah damn you actually don't get it. You will eventually fuck your wrist up if you actually play games (more than 3 hours a week) while mashing furiously. Taking a break will help but you either pick 1. Playing way less than you'd like, or 2. Hand/wrist damage longterm.>>11496068Retards like this will babble about esports but western pros in basically every game also have exploded wrists. Every old Melee player has melted wrists, every good white Starcraft player, etc.If this isn't an issue to you, you are a nonplayer, complaining about the way people who actually play games do so. No one cares about your gay boomer bushido code, they care about playing games and not having rocket wrists, dipshit
>>11497098The Japanese will play games for hours non-stop everyday for years without a break and destroy their health. They aren't a good example.Western Fighting Game and Esports players are much better about their health. They sign contracts worth thousands if not millions to fight on Esports teams. So their health is important and monitored. Including their wrist and hands. Everything is carefully monitored by Team managers and the company. It's structured to make sure theres little to no injury. That's why the West is superior in taking care of players.
>>11497098Just because people use the thing, going hellbent to try to latch into this discussion like a damn parasite will label you a schizo. Don't underestimate an autist, you're marked.
>>11495984console versions are just ports, but straight downgrades with more slowdown, less animation, more input lag, etc.
>>11493173Why do boomers go absolutely nuts for Neo Geo like this? Is it the indignation of a poorfag that they want to overcome?Just saying thats a lot of trouble to go through for 16bit 2D arcade game
>>114974411. Arcade cabinets are cool. Shut your face.2. World Records are only recognized on original hardware.3. It's also about preservation and sharing your experiences with your kids, friends, neighbors, etc.4. Lastly, they are built tough and the only viable way of playing original Metal Slug with others. Good luck trying that with your janky computer setup with your Chinese off-brand controller running on Mame.
>>11497441>Why do boomers go absolutely nuts for Neo Geo like this? Is it the indignation of a poorfag that they want to overcome? Because its sexy. People love seeing it and playing on it. Arcade cabinet = "Netflix and chill with your girlfriend"Emulating on computer = "Inviting your girl to Netflix and chill, but then using your laptop, and pulling out an HDMI cable to connect to your TV." Not sexy at all. No Bueno.
>>11497531>>11497550Notice how there's no mention of gameplay here. Just about showing off to hypothetical people. Being able to overclock on emulator trumps your entire list.
>OverclockYou didn't beat the game. Fuck off and never come back you fucking spammer
>>11497596>Being able to overclock on emulator trumps your entire list.Emulators are not sexy
>>11497601What did I spam? Performance is the number one complaint about MS2, of course people will mention it. >didn't beat the gameStill obsessed with impressing random people. Overclocking makes it harder fyi.
>>11497441>Just saying thats a lot of trouble to go through for 16bit 2D arcade gameYeah, those types of games are trash that only losers play. Not worth it.
>>11497596>Notice how there's no mention of gameplay here???The arcade cabinet version IS the definitive version.
>>11497627The question was what tangible difference is there between playing the arcade version on an emulator versus an actual arcade cabinet. That guy listed a bunch of superficial reasons.
>>11497637The emulator isn't real or official. Therefore it can't be trusted. This is based on multiple world record holders getting caught using emulators while claiming it was real original hardware.
>>11497639>The emulator isn't real or official.For a third time, it's all about impressing other people. Look, you can just say you like having the cabinet as some sort of trophy to show to people (like you did in this thread by posting pictures of it) and be done with it. You don't have to pretend it's got anything to do with playing the game itself.
>>114976371. The arcade cabinet is the *baseline standard* which all Other versions are compared. It can be controlled and monitored. Emulators can't monitored. Users can secretly mess with the settings or the emulator code to give themselves unfair advantages.2. All competition is done live in person with the cabinet. So it make sit much harder to pull off nonsense.3. All parts are original. You are using an official original stick. Not some third party stick that using extra features. Or random buttons that give autofire.
RA says I beat the game on hardcore mode, so I beat the game :)>waah they allow autofire and that's cheating CHEATINGThe set developer can programmatically prevent specific unlocks if autofire is detected, which would prevent you from mastering the set and thus truly beating the game. If they couldn't be arsed to do it that's their issue, not mine :)
>>11498274Emulation didn't exist when the game was created. Developers didn't anticipate users using emulation to artificially add autofire.
>>11492876Metal Slug 7/XX: NoMetal Slug 1-6: YesArcade cabinets didn't have autofire, so it's considered cheating to have it turned on.
>>11497441>Neo Geo>boomersNigger, boomers took their grandkids to play on those.
>>11498983Lol, a boomer who hasn't caught on yet that the word had become a catch-all term for everyone over 30
>>11492876Does the pope shit in the woods?
