Now presenting: the greatest game ever made.
Its ugly. Starcraft vanilla is better
>>11494387is there a way to play the original (pre-reforged) WC3 & frozen throne? i kinda wanted to give it a chance.
>>11494394huh, just pirate it?
>>11494387RTS game where you control like 5 units waooowwww
>>11494398>RTS game where you control like 5 units Cannon Fodder did it better
>>11494387one of the greatest, not sure if greatest though.>>11494394torrent it. make sure you use a VPN though. got an ISP letter about it. could not believe they were honeypotting a fucking 22 year old game.
>>11494394https://archive.org/details/warcraft-iii-v-1.31Haven't tried this myself yet
>>11494398>control a smaller number of units with meaningful abilities and presence in the world, instead of 500 meaningless identical soldiers with slightly differing stats that die from the puff of a fart>implying this is a bad thingcommand and conquer faggots need to be roped
>>11494387It really is. I find to hard to think of a game that had a greater impact on video game industry of the 21st century across so many different genres. Its actually underrated.>>11494398Skill issue, you can have multiple control groups.
>>11494409Cannon Fodder is a legitimately terrible game. I have no idea how anybody enjoys that piece of shit.
>>11494390Apples and oranges. SC is sleek space kino, WC3 is colorful, cartoonish high fantasy. You're gay if you can't enjoy both.
>>11494394>>11494423Works. Keys are in CD-Key.txt
>>11494390Maybe soTheir football game is good though before they added all the extra crap
>>11494448>I have no idea how anybody enjoys that piece of shit.Not being a gay retard helps.
Is there a standalone game similar or exactly like founding of durotar?Top-down / bird's-eye perspective, real-time action rpg but you can control multiple heroes?
>>11494471The game sucks dude. It's the most basic, boring overhead shooter possible that boils down to waiting in a spot for a tiny sprite to move so you can shoot pinballs at it and watch it fly off the screen in a painfully unsatisfying way. The fact anybody even calls it an "RTS" is laughable.
WC3 on bnet was insanely fun. People used to get so fucking salty when you'd crush them.
who played LoaP?
>>11494484Throne of Darkness
>>11494484There's probably way better examples but this came to mind:https://youtu.be/fEVPmcbJmUE?si=g-r1oxiwo5rnZbTZ
>is the unironic spiritual successor to WC3 and last true Blizzard game before they shit the bed with WoW>*sells no copies and dies a gay death, forever relinquished to obscurity*
I DO YOUR BIDDING MASTERbasedany undead mods which make them into jeets?
I miss Tides of Blood
>>11494534I miss the old lore
Nah, that's AoE2.
>>11494563Any game with a historical setting is automatically gay and everyone I've ever met that played AoE was the biggest NPC imaginable.
>>11494573gb2/v/
>>11494387It’s a poop game
>>11494546I remember looking up WoW a few years ago and being confused as fuck when I saw the Jailer. Homoerotic fanfiction.net bullshit is more grounded and canon than whatever the Warcraft lore is now.
>>11494592funny words coming from the guy who has poop inside him right now
>>11494387This was my ultimate "it grew on me" game. I remember walking into Gametop somewhere around 2008 and buying the battlechest, taking it home and thinking how awful the character portrait animations looked, hated how everything was so ridiculously big and chunky, and I didn't really get the gameplay. I made it maybe 3 levels into the human campaign and I was bored out of my mind. I came back about 7 years later on a whim and ended up falling in love with it. I don't know if I was just too young and retarded to appreciate it originally or what, but my feelings did a complete 180. I think I initially compared it to Starcraft too much and just thought, "this is the same thing but uglier and slower", instead of appreciating the many nuances, which seems like a mistake many people make with these two. WC3 isn't as fast or meticulously balanced as SC, but man is it fun. Clashing groups of chunky, Hasbro-colored warriors into each other and watching them explode in comical gibs will never get old for me.
>>11494587/v/ loves trash like AoE2
>>11494387It's not even the best Warcraft game.
>>11494656if you think WC2 is better than 3 you are delusional. i bet you have some hyperspecific sperg reasons for thinking this too>uhh there's this one specific mechanic WC3 doesn't have, shit game lolplease kys
>>11494671the only semi-legitimate reason i can think of for hating WC3 over 2 is them butchering the lore. but that's also a very modern reason. in 2002 no one was boycotting WC3 because of the lore
>>11494563>>11494573AoE is fine it’s just formulaic to a fault. The missions are just>destroy enemies>build monument>gather x amount of resourceThere’s not much story or variation in gameplay, even the skins like galactic battlegrounds get repetitive if you play too much at once.>>11494614I don’t know why so many people are incapable of judging a game beyond muh graphics, good for you on coming around.>>11494752How in the blue hell did wc3 butcher the lore?
>>11494387What's the appeal to these games? Mobas aren't /vr/ but these are just like single player mobas, right?
I just finished WC3 the other day, but still have some Warcraft itch to be scratched. I don't have time to play through WC2 again, so does anyone know of a good Let's Player for Beyond the Dark Portal that I can watch on the side?I'm having a hard time finding playthroughs that are 1) complete, 2) not a speedrun, 3) commentated, and 4) by someone that doesn't have a thick accent and a terrible microphone. It's more fun to be able to listen to someone talk about their strategies or thinking than just pure sound effects and music. A blind playthrough would be even better for that purpose.
>>11494387it was at that point that you knew warcraft was on a death spiralnobody ever asked for "noble savage" orcs, soi trolls, and furries, they just wanted wc2 but better
>>11494881MOBAs spawned out of WC3, but they're only superficially similar. WC3 has some light RPG elements akin to a MOBA (e.g. 'hero' characters who can gain exp, use skills, obtain equipment, etc.) and shares the idea of "creeps" located around the map that you kill in addition to fighting other players, but is otherwise a fully-fledged RTS with tons of base building and dozens of units to control at once.The appeal is basically the same as any other RTS: managing and building a little virtual society, and then waging war against other enemy factions. WC3 does it especially well though, for a variety of reasons. It's easy to play but mechanically deep, has tons of cool features that a lot of similar games lack (like a fully-fledged night and day cycle, among other things), and it has a lot of special touches -- killing an enemy while they're next to a pool of water will cause the water to become red, or rapidly clicking on a pig 100 times will cause it to explode -- just lots of little fun things like that which make the whole game feel much richer.The story is decent in spite of cartoonish and campy, the environments are beautiful, and the sound design is fantastic. As is always the case with Blizzard games, the control is top notch, and online multiplayer through battle.net is (was...) awesome. This is to say nothing of the World Editor, which is dead simple to use but complex enough that you can effectively make new games with it. Quite possibly the greatest user-generated content program to ever ship with a video game.I could go on and on. There's no easy way to summarize the game and say, "it's good for X reason", because there are a ton of reasons. It's just one of those golden classics. Just go play it.
>>11494979>nobody ever asked for "noble savage" orcs, soi trolls, and furriesi agree, but i sure hope you didn't let this ruin the game for you because wc3 takes a steaming dump on wc2 in every other capacity
"Hero RTS" games killed the genre. No one asked for them and they got forced after this game was made. They did make for excellent custom maps though.
>>11495074>No one asked for them and they got forced after this game was made.This is RE4 logic. It's not WC3's fault that it was too good and everybody copied it, that's just how the industry works. Doesn't matter since this game was so good that it made everything else irrelevant anyway. I will happily live in the timeline where I get to play this for the rest of my life instead of world filled with a sea of 7/10 C&C-likes that never evolved. MOBAs are gay though, granted.
>>11495074It was inevitable, people were buying wc3 battlechests just for Dota.
>>11495117>It's not WC3's fault that it was too good and everybody copied itIt also wasn't Diablo 2's, or WoW's...They were on a roll.
>>11495148Every single game they made from Lost Vikings until the Activision merger was 10/10. Probably the most consistently good developer that ever existed. Then Bobby got involved...
>>11494387>Now presenting: the greatest game ever made.it was HUUUUGE in Europe that's for sureWe used to wipe our asses with pirated copies eventually
>>11495074how the fuck were they forced retard? MOBAs were entirely a user-driven thing
State your favorite race and team color. NOW.
>>11495217I usually go with red Orc and I turtle until I can mass 25~ Grunts and then send them all in at once. I like to keep things honest and simple. Undead is the faggiest race by far and I hate everything about them.
>>11494946>just finished WC3>apparently has time to play WC3 or watch someone else play WC2, but can't play WC2 """again"""Be honest, you've never played WC2 to begin with and you just don't want to go back to janky old shit after playing through WC3 kino, but you didn't want to get called a zoomer newfaggot for watching a let's play instead of playing the game itself.
>>11495234i always imagine every undead player looking and acting like JP from grandma's boy but with black fingernails and only listening to burp metal
Every WarCraft RTS is good but the first one is the only one I really loved, because it was my first RTS and it had the least cartoonish setting of the three which is something I happen to likeI've never been a multiplayer RTS guy though, I'll only do turn-based war games when other humans are involved
>>11495276I meant what I said. I did the base campaigns for WC2 prior to playing WC3, and WC1 before that. But I'd forgotten how tedious the base WC2 missions are, and my enthusiasm for the game was sapped by the end. I recall the expansion levels being hard as fuck, with some involving a lot of trial and error or cheating in order to find the right approach.I'm definitely better at RTS games now than I was when I was younger, but I also have less time available for gaming. I'd rather watch a sped-up LP to remind myself of what happens than burn my time on failed mission attempts. If the campaign looks a lot better designed than the base game though, it might encourage me to go do it myself.
>>11494394i found my copy at the thrift store
>>11494867>I don’t know why so many people are incapable of judging a game beyond muh graphics, good for you on coming around.It's funny, because now I love the way it looks, on top of how it plays (though some of those character portrait animations are admittedly still pretty shit). I think I fucked up by going right into the campaign, though. I probably would've liked it more from the outset if I had just played skirmish first and been able to mess around. I've always despised lengthy tutorials, and those first two introductory missions with the cringe narrator voice, on top of the first 1-2 human missions that were a retread of what I had already experienced with SC were agonizing for a 17 year old with a very short attention span. I'm glad I gave it another chance though, as it has since become a top 10 all timer for me.
>Human: cheap units, fast expansion, highly adaptable>Orc: tough and durable>Undead: decay, slowly destroys through poison, ice, etc.i never really understood night elf, though. logically they seem like they'd be the opposite analog to UD but they only seem to display this visually rather than mechanically. they have a ton of messy units and no real obvious advantage from my experience.
>>11495446their buildings can walk and fight and it's awesomethat's good enough for me
>>11495490i guess their advantage is mobility then? i've never really played as them before, but i remember always feeling good when i'd match with a NE player because i'd harass the shit out of their whisps early game and rape them almost every time. weird thing is, they also have the highest win rate among grandmaster players so i guess there's something i'm missing.
>>11495493Haha no I don't know anything about multiplayer strategy or rankings. I just like how their buildings can walk and fight (because it is awesome). Someone else will have to explain their competitive features
>>11495524>i like it because it's coolbased, you enjoy games more than most of the tryhard clowns on this board
>>11494438You are incredibly tasteless person.
>>11495668Tell me why Cannon Fodder is a good game. I bet you won't.
>>11495446Night Elves are sneaky and crafty. Their units hide at night and can ambush you, Huntresses are fast and Dryad poison slows your troops, Druids of the Talon split up your army by throwing some into cyclones, and the Demon Hunter and Wisps deny you the use of your mana. They also have good situational awareness because Wisps can be stationed throughout the map, the Huntress and Priestess of the Moon have owl scouts, and their units see further at night than units of other races.
>>11495810I think many people never “got” night elves because they’re the least traditional-rts of the races and require finesse to play successfully. It’s kind of pointless just to mass units and throw the NE mmm-ball equivalent at enemies. They excel at using magic, which requires control, assigning hotkeys, etc. Most players (me included) were used to the “build units, units kill things” paradigm that goes with humans and orcs. Undead are probably the best race imo: they have durability along with really good magic that an experienced hand can use well but doesn’t have to if they prefer melee. NE do have some of the best rush cheez though.
love me 'craft, simple as
>>11494387I'm here just to say that you're right and it's a shame that the WoW story doesn't have been imported on W3 for who doesn't want to multiplay.
>poor guy at this ogre camp is still twitchingBrutal>>11497178Were there any custom maps "retelling" it?
>>11494390Sprites age better than polygons.
>>11497257i'm sick of people saying this. honestly most NES/SNES era games look like absolute dog shit these days, meanwhile something like Banjo-Kazooie still looks gorgeous to me in spite of its limitations. it has nothing to do with 2D vs 3D, but how the technology was leveraged. IMO, WC3 looks juicy as fuck to this day. i'd go so far as calling it one of the most visually appealing games ever.
>>11494508I stayed away because it looked like a copycat blizzard game. As I assume most people did.
>>11497451I don't blame you, but the irony is that it was more of a Blizzard game than the games Blizzard makes today, because it was made by the Millar brothers who worked on everything from Lost Vikings and Diablo to Starcraft and Warcraft, and left Blizzard for Jaleco around the time WC3 was released. I think they actually stole code and assets from WC3 when they left to use in this game because it has some overlapping stuff, like how a huge portion of the sound effects are ripped right from the Orc units in WC3, to say nothing of some outright identical game mechanics.>As I assume most people did.I think the bigger issue is that barely anybody even knows this game exists to begin with. I've never seen one thread about it on here, never met one person who played it aside from me, and I read something one time that said it sold like 150k copies total, which is nothing. I've been shilling it on here for years now and nobody gives a fuck, but that's okay. It's my little secret.I'm currently working on a custom scenario for WC3 which is basically this game remade in World Editor.
>>11497446It's a fun thing bringing up "3D doesn't age well" when it's a game that holds up real well. This and WoW both really.>>11497473>spoilerSomeone else was around here posted about his map progress recently, was going to be about a peon having a nightmare about his farm.
>>11497482Ah yes, Grooby's Nightmare...That's also me, I lied a little about only working on one map. I also made both threads.
1998
2002
>>11497490>>11497491SC is timeless. It's crazy how they made something look that good nearly 30 years ago, then they release the """remastered""" version with portraits that look akin to your average Clash of Clans tier android app icon.I'd be lying if I said WC3's approach to portraits was better, it isn't. Thing is, you have to realize there's a totally different approach and scale going on here. WC3 is 3D-rendered, which gives the game engine potential that SC could never hope to have. You might say, "but they still could have pre-rendered the portraits like they did in SC, even if the models and world were 3D", except this neglects the fact that WC3 has 10x as many units and structures. Go into World Editor sometime and look at the unit count -- there are 834 separate models for just units alone, not counting structures (some of those models are reused, but probably half at best). Pre-rendering all of that stuff would have been a financially impossible task, to say nothing of storage space.SC is the closest thing to digital chess. It's refined to an absurd degree, in both visuals and mechanics, and that's what I love about it. WC3, though, is a much, much more expansive game, so certain concessions had to be made. If putting up with those hammy 3D portraits means I get the building power that WC3 provides, I'm okay with it. WC3 is just as great as SC, just for different reasons.
>>11497485Oh kick ass, keep on cookin then. That last thread got me to look more into World Editor, as well as Noggit.
>>11497498God speed, brother. Just know that once you start, you won't be able to stop. Anything you think is wrong with the base game, you can fix. Anything you think it lacks, you can add. You can make your own game with this shit. It's so dead simple to learn that there's no real barrier to entry. It will become your cocaine if you let it.
>>11497491Always reminded me of a guy chewing/spitting tobacco or a horse eating. Funny animation.
>>11497485genuinely curious how youre such a wc3 autist but you also suck off a pump and dump console rts game made by fucking jaleco lmao. is it just because it was made by muh heckin ex bliz employees? whats the deal here?
I like warcraft as a kitchen sink of generic fantasy tropes. The more oc donut steel elements are what I like the least
>>11497520WC3 is the best game ever made, and it's a better game than Goblin Commander -- but GC is still a great game on its own merits. I played both around the same time and I was fascinated by GC's approach to RTS. I only learned years later, after being a fan of both, that they were made by some of the same guys. GC remedied some of the few complaints I have about WC3, so I see it as something of an evolution in spite of the limitations it has as a console-centric game. Simply put, it had some amazing ideas that I wish PC RTS games had taken forward. First and foremost, the fact that almost everything in the world is destructible rather than just particularly important objects. I also liked how it made the hero unit you, as the player, rather than a unit within the world that you control; such as how it lets you cast spells from anywhere rather than being confined to where a hero is. I like the omnipresent God approach it takes to control, where WC3 is limited very much by units alone.
>>11497530>The more oc donut steel elementsthe fuck are you even talking about? what elements did it have that were "bro do not steal"? it included an entire program separate from the main game just for making your own content, it literally created dota that valve stole years later. i don't know how to parse this, man.
>>11497516Imagine that face telling you to effectove;u make your people prisoners in their OWN lands.
>>11497556>dude all of these people have covid zombie virus, we should probably kill them to keep it from spreading, especially since we know they're all fucked anyway...>NO ARTHAS, THERE HAS TO BE ANOTHER WAY (EVEN THOUGH I DON'T HAVE ANOTHER WAY), YOU'RE KILLING INNOCENT PEOPLE LOLArthas, literally, did nothing wrong.
>>11495672It's got this thing called soul. Something you clearly lack.
>>11497571not him, but you're in a warcraft 3 thread huffing the farts of a shitty amiga game and talking about anyone else lacking soul. what are you even doing with your life? go to bed man
>>11497562he never even tried though. they didn't once attempt to use magic to heal an affected villager, so it might have been possible
>>11497616Why would he try? He saw how the grain was turning people into evil undead agents overnight, it was spreading rapidly through the land, and he knew was trying to stop the problem at its source. Uther and Jaina offered 0 advice beyond "there's another way, u be a bad boi" and Arthas did what he knew was necessary.
>>11497638>Why would he try?because he's a paladin of the light. they instead could have gathered the townspeople and tested cures and healing magic on them, killing them if they started to become zombies. but he jumped straight to "we have to kill all our own people", and that's what shocked Uther and Jaina
>>11497446All N64 games are ugly, and unplayable without a CRTSprite games are at least readable on any display.
>>11497657>they instead could have gathered the townspeople and tested cures and healing magic on themThis logic ignores the fact that the disease was spreading too rapidly. There was no time. In the previous mission where you have to survive for 30 minutes, the grain (if you don't choose to stop the transport) effects 4 towns in the same period where you're defending one city. Then, in the mission where you have to kill the townsfolk, you have people turning into zombies overnight, while Malganis is already wandering around collecting their souls and adding them into his undead horde. There was literally no time to do anything about it except stop it at the source. Cities were being overrun in a matter of hours. Arthas knew this, and his cohorts failed to come to the same realization. They hated him for it, but he wasn't wrong.
>>11494387What blizzard did to the remaster was a crime against humanity. Ruined the original game as well. >>11494492>kid me try Bnet>got destryed in less then 5 min by a hero and two ghouls>never bother playing againjust stuck to TD and footman wars after that.
What's everyone's favorite unit? For me it's Demon Hunter
MY WIFE FOR HIRE!
>>11497553I mean the "original" aspects of the universe. Like jamaican trolls and native american minotaurs are a made up "warcraft thing", it's not a generic "euromyth/LOTR/D&D/wrpg thing" and it sucks
>>11498369Dreadlord. For non-heroes, Necromancer. Shame neither are competitively viable so I can't use them if I wanna play seriously
>>11498645>it's not as generic and that sucksOh. I thought you were bummed about the stronger character focus in the story. I'm not that upset with them attempting to 'flesh out' their own universe.
>>11494390>StarcraftGookclick is not a game
>>11498703SC is a great game. the fact it has a fan base of obsessed asians isn't the game's fault.
>>11498703Ironically through the game's development multiplayer was a secondary consideration, the game was first and foremost about the singleplayer campaign
>>11497696There's some inconsistency to the timing of the plague's onset, for gameplay reasons. In the transport mission you're talking about, the villagers become zombified immediately, because that adds to the level difficulty. But what's presented isn't totally "true to (game setting) life", because it's explicitly stated that it's transmitted by people eating bread made from infected grain, and that obviously can't happen instantaneously. Also, the transport is being escorted by undead creatures, and no one would accept grain from such a nightmarish convoy. So I think it's safe to presume that what happens during the level's gameplay is like an approximation / condensing of the period involving Arthas's defense of the main city. So while these towns fall within hours in-game, keep in mind that during this same period Jaina manages to find Uther, and then Uther has time to travel with his army from wherever he is all the way to the city Arthas is at. Since we last saw him chasing down escaped orcs, I doubt he was a few miles away to start with.Prior to the Culling, all we know is that the grain has arrived to Stratholme and has been at least partially distributed. But how long ago? To how many people? Arthas could have sent riders throughout the town warning people not to eat the grain, and it's possible people could have been saved. But he didn't even try.
>>11494387Expansion should have included a fifth multiplayer race (Demon) that included mermaids, blood elfs, red orcs, eredar, etc
>>11499053>5th raceYou do get to pseudo-play as naga and Draenei during the blood elf campaign, with workers and a few buildings, too. You could rig another race through the world editor using custom production buildings, etc.
>>11498917it's common for younger g*mers to never touch single-player. Sometimes they'll buy a strictly single-player game only to immediately hunt down an obscure third-party mod that makes it multiplayer and be an annoying help vampire about everything, having not even glanced at the tutorial.
>>11499064And that didn't felt like a human campaign at all, they got severely cucked. Jaina should have had a real human campaign for her to shine.Sucks that even the reign of chaos the "human" campaign is just an undead prelude where youre acting against human interests
>>11499053Orcs shoulda been green demons, I don't know any orc fans that enjoyed the noble savage shamanshit garbage they pulled
>not gaming on Dawn of War
>>11499075>>11499082Yeah, that was the first two games. They had to do something different for the third game, and I think it worked. The story is basically about Arthas, Thrall, and Tyrande.
>>11499075>severely cuckedAt least they got an actual campaign to their name, instead of an advertisement for an upcoming $15/month MMO.>>11499095Tyrande is such a boring character. The characterization in general in the NE campaign is rushed and awful.
Reign of chaos >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> frozen throne
>>11499107People only forget Tyrande was absolutely awful because Maiev manages to be even worse
>>11499127I'll replay that campaign soon enough, so that will refresh my memory. Right now I'm still reeling from the penultimate RoC mission>Tyrande! Furion, my brother! Look, I've found a power source that will allow me to fight off the demons and end their corruption, saving our forests and possibly the entire world! The only cost was my own, personal soul.>RRRGHHH NO ILLIDAN, THAT'S TOO GREAT A COST! I banish you! I'd rather you be gone than providing assistance in the fight that determines the fate of our planet! I would prefer to risk the fate of all lives than accept the partial sacrifice of only your own, even though the price is already paid and it's too late for you undo it.
Damn, the Arthas book was pretty shit. It's like the meme with the horse that is well drawn at first but then becomes a child's scribble. It gets really bad when it starts to cover the WC3 events, like a bad novelization of an RTS with a thin narrative spun between the bits of dialogue in the levels. The author lost it unfortunately, as Lord of the Clans was good and Rise of the Horde was kinda good.
>>11499205Every single one of the 4 main nelf heroes are unbearably unlikable. Based Cenarius died too soon, should have slapped some sense on all those whiny cunts
>>11499205Why was Tyrande never punished for literally murdering her own people? All to break out a dangerous prisoner and then just shooing him away instead of locking him up again (???)
>>11499269Because Malfurion is a simp
>>11499252>You're making me listening to this garbage about Illidan again? I could be knee-deep in dryad pussy right now. And I have four knees!
Say WoW never happened. How would you have wanted the story to go from here and how would you conclude it for good?
Who even enjoys the rexxar campaign? Not for lack of trying but I never managed to force myself through the whole thing, just watched videos of the story bits
>>11494427>command and conquer faggots need to be ropedWhat the fuck?
>>11499780it could have ended right there and it would have been kino
>>11499780Wacraft 4 could have introduced a 5th ragtag mercenary deserter race, with naga, panda and draenai and nerubians and such, in the service of some demi-god lord on a crazy quest to succeed the frost king. Campagin wise the lich king is busy consolidating his undead realm,. Meanwhile the blood elves make a deal with a split faction of the orcs who still worship chaos to fuck the night elves in exhange for evil powers. The humans and night elves and loyal orc faction form an alliance to deal with all this shit and growing undead army. Then about halfway into the campaign I could imagine the 5th faction Lord uses some spooky mind control magic to sow dissent among all the races, crumbling the alliances and baiting the lich king into making a push to grab more land, as he sneaks off to assassinate the lich king
>>11499780Thrall dies and orcs embrace their destiny as demonic slaves of destruction
>>11499780Furion dies and Maiev arrests Illidan and Tyrande to spend an eternity together
>>11499780With AI as good as it's getting couldn't fans replicate the character voices to create some worthy followup campaigns in the editor?
>>11500859My experience with people writing stories and characters says no. Good god, no.
>>11501158And you think Metzen and/or modern blizzard would do better? Lol
>>11500440>c&c faggotsA bunch of contrarians bitch on here about how they like the C&C-rts paradigm vs Blizz-rts. To me it’s kind of a non-starter, since Generals was popular and much more like a blizzard rts than C&C had been before. Then they fucked off for 5 years and ceded the rts genre before coming back with the sort-of-okay/lackluster c&c3 and good ra3. And as we all know, rts kind of died after sc2. I don’t think C&C has done much of note since. EA gradually fucked it and gave up when it couldn’t materialize into a $1B per game franchise bc rts is niche now, unfortunately.>>11500859>fan-made campaignsYou’d pretty much have to do it with bootleg versions of the game because now everything you make in the editor legally belongs to blizzard (i.e. Microsoft). Unless you want that.
>>11494387Yes
Might be cool to get a WC3 general going. We could organize games and play online using LAN tunneling software, and with the World Editor we could produce infinite custom content and share it with other /vr/gins. I'd argue WC3's editor is even easier to get into than DOOM mapping, and those guys have kept their gen alive for a long time with much more demanding software.
>>11501674Not enough interest anon, thread would never sustain itself. Your best bet is to use these occasional threads to ask around if anyone is interested to set up a couple games with you
>>11501738>Not enough interest anonI guarantee there are more people interested in WC3 than Roller Coaster Tycoon and the dudes in that general get decent activity. Also, the entire point of a general is exposing new players to try the game, or harkening old vets back.
>>11501895By all means feel free to try but be prepared to be constantly bumping the thread to save it from page 10 till you get discouraged and let it go
>>11501953>don't ever try anything, just give up like me lmaoAt least you didn't give up on your career as a Shutterstock model.
>>11501979I literally just told you to go for it but not to get your hopes up too much. What is stopping you now? What are you waiting for?
>>11501994>SEE? IF YOU'RE GONNA DO IT, WHY DON'T YOU DO IT RIGHT NOW! LMAO!Putting aside the fact I literally just mentioned it, the current thread is still up. I hope you're actually trying motivate me by using some 4D chess reverse psychology and you aren't just the fat defeatist faggot you're acting like.
>>11501979>Hey, Bob, thanks for coming to the studio today>Alright, we're gonna need you to take your shirt off and stand over here... yep, okay... now, now put your hands behind your back and look down at your belly in disappointment... oof, yep, alright... one more... one more... yep, okay, perfect>Alright guys, that's a wrap, time to make some money
>>11502141>Alright guys, that's a wrap, time to make some moneyBob was probably in the studio for 10 hours doing random fat person tasks like standing on a scale, trying to put on pants but they wont fit, failing to scratch his back. The life of a stock image model is not easy.
>>11498703t. buttblasted whiteboi that couldn't compete.
>>11502001NTA He is encouraging you to both do it but to reign in your expectations of what may happen so you do not get discouraged if nobody goes for it. I personally have seen people learn to make and post videos on here in a single webm thread only for all of them to just disappear and never post any videos after just a few weeks after the thread died and then never again. So I get where he is coming from a little bit.
>>11502215>buttblasted whiteboy>whiteboi made the gameuh oh, stinky
>>11502259>nice guy centrist reddit faggotrygo big or go home, kid
>>11502259>reign inrein in
Vashj sexo. The only good non-annoying female character
>>11502734Vashj is definitely one of the better characters, I would say she's the best female character in wc3, and there's a lot of detail in her movement too compared to other heroes. Love me some lamia/lamia-like girls, Blizz did good with this one. Just too bad the Naga Sea Witch is better suited as a 2nd hero rather than first, except for maybe Night Elf, i've made her work as 1st hero playing Night Elf thanks to Moon Wells.
I heard she was meant to die in the early drafts
>>11497530>>11498645i don't really care about most fantasy settings that go kitcken sink like DnD or TES (the psudes who jerk off to kirkbride's MW fanfiction don't really matter to how bethesda treats the setting) because it all blurs together and isn't as memorable.
>>11503264>i don't really care about most fantasy settings that go kitcken sink like DnD or TESLmao dude what do you think Warcraft is?
>>11501895Agreed. Really, how much interest is there in playing the original Doom now, yet those fags have a general up all the time, ditto stuff like rct. If you have to broaden it as just rts general, so be it.>>11502259Begone, redditor samefag.>>11502745>naga sea witchOne of the better neutral heroes imo but requires skill. I struggle with toggling spells fast enough, so I usually just stick with the neutral warrior heroes as damage sinks.
>>11502734So how does she hold the bow with those fuck-huge claws?>>11503156She was, I think they changed it so late that even in the official strategy guides they mention it happening. A good change on their part.>>11503281>how much interest is there in playing the original Doom nowA huge amount. It's still one of the absolute best games of all time, and it's even more fun to play now than it was at launch, thanks to the sheer amount of content and engine improvements.A WC3 general with new content could work. But for one, the game doesn't have a lot of ladder-style interest anymore, and new ladder maps isn't going to change that. Secondly, people hated Reforged and trying to set up an older version is going to be technically beyond the reach of many people (not here, but it affects the broader community). Lastly, a tolerably enjoyable scripted map in WC3 takes a lot more work and polish than a tolerably enjoyable standard Doom map, so the minimum effort to be involved is higher (I can't speak to RCT content).
>>11503354>trying to set up an older version is going to be technically beyond the reach of many peopledude you can literally download the original game from archive.org as a zipped folder, click the game icon and play. what are you talking about?
>>11503361And then play with others?
>>11503371>https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ngt6NF1b3Ioan unironic 2 minute process
You just know Maiev is desperate for Illidans demon infused cock
>>11503354>WC3 general with new content could workThat’s why I think an rts general might attract more staying power around here. Of course, Warcraft would always be a huge part of the discussion, but I agree the content isn’t there right now. But >>11503449 is right, setting up to play with others independent of blizzard is pretty simple. You can pretty much run your own wc3 ecosystem from the last pre-reforged patch.
>>11503467Isnt she a mega lesbian?
>>11503591I thought she was just pretending so that Naisha would keep coming back after dying in each mission
>>11499084>first major intro to 40k>AI mod for offline skirmishes>had lots of fun getting good at TauThat vespid early harass was so fun and absolutely horrible for anyone else.When it came to WC3, most of my time spent playing it was through custom games or Dota. I couldn’t get into it when it first came out because my PC wasn’t ready for Blizzard’s first 3D game.
>>11503576>That’s why I think an rts general might attract more staying power around here. An RTS general would turn into a bunch of faggots talking about AoE and Red Alert all the time. I don't want that, I want to talk about based WarCraft. If anything, a Blizzard general would be better; I would not mind sharing a thread with SC and Diablo bros.>just finished my newest WC3 map, check it out guys>man, Duriel is kicking my ass...>should I play the SNES or PS1 version of Norse by Norse West?>anybody want to get a StarCraft match going?This sounds extremely comfy actually...
It's so depressing to witness one of the greatest rts franchises with an unfinished saga destroyed by a disgusting skinner box mmo. At least they should have finished the story in Warcraft 4 before started twisting and raping the corpse in the spinoff.At this point the one enduring feeling I'm left when thinking about Warcraft is "what could have been"
>>11504375This is why every time somebody says:>dude blizz went to shit after WoWNo, they went to shit WITH WoW. Before WoW, Blizzard had a very formal business structure:>make superbly high-quality game>a year or so later, release expansion pack for the game that greatly expands the content>support game for years, constantly updating and tweaking it until it's perfect>rinse and repeatAnd then came WoW. Blizzard abandoned the "game>expansion>long term support" system they had thrived on, and created an MMO instead (read: games as a service), that not only charged a monthly fee but had expansion packs on top of it. Worst still, they abandoned any semblance of lore or coherency in the game universe just so people could play as le heckin elf and panda in le kewl fantasy world. They sold it all out. People ate it up, and they got greedy, and then Activision saw that they were capable of producing pure cancer and bought them up right quick. Frankly, I'm surprised SC2 and D3 even exist given how much blood Blizzard could smell in the water with WoW. They won't be making that mistake again, though. It's all mobile games and online shooters from here on. What a disgrace.
never forget.
>>11504359>An RTS general would turn into a bunch of faggots talking about AoE and Red Alert all the time.You’ll get faggots talking about pre-WoW and post-WoW Blizzard instead, so either way you’ll end up with some funky discussion.
>>11504398Ahhhh... ehhh... you might be right, unfortunately. There's no winning here:>Blizzard general: gay WoW discussion that's unavoidable hopefully deleted on occasion>RTS general: AoE remake, SC remastered, D2R and other cancer that's viable by board rulesThis is why a strict WC3 gen might be the best option. If anything, there's comfort in knowing we'd only talk about classic WC3, since we all know that absolutely nobody wants to talk about refunded.
>>11504402>This is why a strict WC3 gen might be the best option. If anything, there's comfort in knowing we'd only talk about classic WC3, since we all know that absolutely nobody wants to talk about refunded.It's also the surest way for the general to be death on arrival and you'll bumping the thread by yourself after a couple days. These occasional war3 threads are successful because they are just that: occasional.
I support a comfy classic blizzard general. There's enough overlap between fans of the 3 franchises
>>11504405>you'll bumping the thread by yourself after a couple daysMaybe, but what's the harm at the end of the day? If it doesn't work, it doesn't work. If it does, then we have a way to continue making and sharing pre-reforged content and organizing games. I see no downside here except the minor, fleeting butthurt ensuing from failure. I could see a WC3 gen being very active and successful if certain things are provided in the OP:>any easy way to download the game>an easy way to organize online matches>a 10 minute, foolproof tutorial for matchmaking>links to existing custom contentI think you underestimate how many people played this game in the past, how many still play it now, and how many people visit this board/website in general and could be coaxed into playing. What might start as a weekly 150 reply thread with a few autists shamelessly bumping could turn into a DOOM gen tier community in 2 years. Don't kill the seed before it grows.
>>11504413tutorial for mapmaking* (I realize you can't create some amazing map with only 10 minutes of knowledg
>>11504415knowledge but it would be enough to entice people into recognizing how cool and versatile World Editor is)... auto-reply fucked me here, I need to lay off the sauce.
>>11504413It really wouldn't hurt to welcome lost vikings fans. Oh and diablo and starcraft too
>>11504421That was my thought too, though I do think anon brought up a good point about it turning into a bunch of faggy WoW discussion. At the end of the day though, there's no perfect solution. I would definitely support a /blizz/ over an /rts/, either way.
>>11504424Wow talk will pop up wether it's a war 3 or blizz general, it's inevitable and honestly fine, it's impossible to pretend wow doesn't exist and it's natural to vent about its negative influence over the franchise. To mitigate the issue and ensure it doesnt turn into a wowtard general we can clearly state in the OP that it's a general meant for fans of classic blizzard as in pre-wow blizzard
>>11504439>we can clearly state in the OP that it's a general meant for fans of classic blizzard as in pre-wow blizzardGood idea. Maybe it should be something like "/cbg/ - Classic Blizzard General" then, with focus on everything from stuff released during the Silicon and Synapse days to TFT. I love me some LV, SC and Diablo on top of WarCraft 3, so like I said, I wouldn't mind this in the slightest. It would definitely get more bumps than a pure WC3 gen either way. I really don't see the harm in trying. I'm going to ruminate on this tomorrow and think about the best way to structure such a gen, but if anybody else has a plan and/or wants to make it before me, then go for it.
>>11504452I'm off to bed but feel free to keep bouncing your ideas for the general in here. No point in starting it before we're through with this thread.
>>11504468>No point in starting it before we're through with this threadAgreed. I can't do this alone though, we will need the commitment of several autists if we want any chance of succeeding; mostly in terms of providing spoonfed links to content for the initial OP that one person alone can't muster, e.g. "here's a list of popular SC mods" or "here's a link to popular WC3 scenarios that work without Reforged". Anybody who wants to contribute their knowledge in this thread, it would be greatly appreciated. I can provide a lot of stuff on my own, but we need focused contributions from hardcore poopsockers of individual games. My basic spitball is this:>/cbg/ - Classic Blizzard General>provide wink wink nod nod hints on how people can download the games, but don't link them directly (at least in the case of games that aren't available commercially anymore as this could trigger the jannies because of muh piracy)>links to popular mods and custom content, like devilutionX for D1 or classic custom maps for WC3>downloads for recent custom content made by /vr/ users in previous threads (when appropriate, obviously not in the first thread, but going forward), maybe even take a hint from DOOM gen and get some tailored community projects going>resources for playing online in D1, D2, SC, WC3 etc., now that battle.net 1.0 has been effectively shut down>could even throw in some fun junk like links to OSTs, wallpapers, etc.I really want to do this, man. I think it would be so cool if we had an active group of dudes on here that talked about the old Blizzard games, made new content and played together. There will always be people who try to shut down a good general, and there will always be people who try to ruin or pervert it, but I think it's worth taking the chance and trying to make it happen. I love these games, and I know you and a lot of other people do, too.
>>11503576FYI generals with broad topics do the opposite of encouraging more discussion and engagement. I have seen it happen too many times to ever encourage it.t. eight of diamonds
>le ""general""I do not recognize those festering separatist cliques as anything but a cancer sore in need of removal and I denounce any """"person"""" viewing or using them in any manner.
This is now a Wc3 custom games thread.Shout out to the best custom map of all time.
>>11494602I have your mom’s poop on my dick
Can the Warcraft 2 campaigns still be enjoyed today? I grew up with StarCraft and C&C will I find it too primitive?
>>11504505Then fuckin do it queer
>>11504985>posts soijackopinion immediately discarded
+1 support for a classic blizzard general ideaBtw what's the best internet source of pre-wow warcraft lore? When you look shit up on the wikis, even when you stick to the early story sections it's always mangled by the revisionist and retcon shit that came later. I wanted to brush up on the untampered war1 and war2 lore without having to replay the games(and read the manuals? which I never did)
>>11505646>internet sources of pre-wow warcraft lorePDFs of the original game manuals are the best sources, easily. The manuals for wc1-2 have maps, descriptions of the different nations/clans, and good chronologies from each race’s perspective. The wc3 manual has extensive backstories for the four races, and some of that recapitulates the material from 1&2 as well. That’s pretty much the only unadulterated source of lore before wow. And honestly, the wow lore until post-wotlk is generally ok and doesn’t retcon what preceded it. It’s only since the panda expansion that blizzard started twisting everything to suit whatever next xp they’re trying to sell.
>>11505364>Can the WarCraft 2 campaigns still be enjoyed today?Yes. And you can think of the entirety of Tides of Darkness (aside from the last couple levels on both campaigns) as a tutorial. Beyond the Dark Portal is pretty intense.You're going to fucking hate Dragons and Gryphons with an extreme passion, more so the Dragons.
>>11505675>Beyond the Dark Portal is pretty intenseTruth. The missions are way harder than anything in tides of darkness. The last human mission used to wipe me 8/10 times.
>>11505667>the wow lore until post-wotlk is generally okthis shit is gross. makes me feel violated like nothing else https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=qAIrj_Vqdfc
>>11505682>The last human mission used to wipe me 8/10 timesThat one is pretty damn crazy, you don't have a single second to spare. Most of the human missions have you under constant pressure right from the start, honestly I find the Orc campaign in Beyond The Dark Portal a lot easier in comparison.
>>11504402>Ahhhh... ehhh... you might be right, unfortunately. There's no winning here.I enjoy talking about all this Blizz stuff, and I sadly wouldn't be helping with some of my own weird nostalgia and current infatuation with solo/private servers.>>11505667>It’s only since the panda expansion that blizzard started twisting everything to suit whatever next xp they’re trying to sell.What Cataclysm did to Westfall alone is pretty shameful https://www.wowhead.com/npc=46612/lieutenant-horatio-laine
>>11505719Post more predigital old school art!
>>11505774https://archive.org/details/Warcraft_II_-_Manual_-_PCThe unit lists in particular always have a chunk of art in each manual.
>>11499780>>11499780The only fitting conclusion would be an epic showdown between the lich king(ice) and sargeras(fire)
>>11505791
>>11505702BTDP is definitely brood war-level difficulty end to end. I love the heroes as simply beefed-up regular units and the overall aesthetic. But damn it’s frustrating when you do your best to plan for every contingency and still find yourself getting wrecked by multiple attacks from all sides with no breaks.>>11505686>>11505719Not saying there wasn’t cringe lore during the vanilla-to-wotlk run, but it pales in comparison to the shit Blizz has tried to pass off since.>cataclysm changes>muh iron horde>garrosh bs>the jailer lol
We're gnomes and dwarves the same race in Warcraft 2?
Threads like this just make me wanna replay all this shit all over again
>>11504505I think there's no pressure to nail an exhaustive OP the first time, it can naturally evolve and be modified over time to be more complete, especially since if the thread just flops hard from the start it was a whole lotta work for nothing. If someone is interested in something specific that isn't yet clarified they can just ask in the thread.I think the only top priority to begin with would be to explain the purpose of the thread and provide simple instructions on what to do should anons want to play Warcraft 3, StarCraft or Diablo 2 together. Other specifics can come later.
>>11502734Stay the fuck away from my wife
>franchise about orcs and humans>no orc campaign (besides the shitty post release spinoff not part of the main narrative)>"""human""" campaign is about elves consorting with demonsSuch a lame depressing way to close off the saga. At least the lich king is half human half orc so there's that I guess
>>11499780The dev team is on record saying the cutscene department made the cutscene and then they had to make an ending around it. Same for RoC. This ending makes no fucking sense. He should have imprisoned Illidan within the Frozen Throne. Thematically, it makes the most sense with Illidan returning to a prison.
>>11505971doesn't seem like it, they were explicitly represented by at least two different units
>>11503354>So how does she hold the bow with those fuck-huge claws?clawfully well
>>11507035>no carlos
>>11506991I miss the more intimate dark fantasy vibe of Warcraft 2. WC3 went too big in scope throwing in so much shit it became a clusterfuck that lost focus
>>11507445y u no carlos?
>>11507558There was a time, even up to that first WC3 trailer, where I felt you could seamlessly blend the setting with Diablo's. It's at least still neatly violent to a good extent, even if not as graphically.
>>11505675For me it was the plague bringing little cunts who kept sneaking through the fog of war and dropping the purple braps on my base. I fell for it every time.
>>11507030im asking because they look the exact same and come from the same placethen in war 3 gnomes aren't mentioned and the flying machine (gnomish flying machine in war 2)is dwarven as well as the other technologicalesque unitsif anything I would assume gnomes are a subtype or faction of dwarves. in lotr gnomes are a type of elf
>>11507746It probably wouldn't have hurt to call it a "dwarven flying machine" in WC2 if they weren't that different. It's also really light world building that they'd attempt to flesh out in further games.The guy at the end of pic related also makes no mention of gnomes being related to dwarves but it's also WoW so I don't know if you care.
>>11507802>it's also WoW so I don't know if you care.I definitely don't lol, fuck that shitJust wanted to see if there's any prewow(where regardless if they were always meant to be separate, they were heavily reimagined anyway) hard evidence I might have forgotten or missed that clearly separates dwarves and gnomes as being completely distinct folk in the early lore
>>11507812No hard evidence, just a safe assumption. There's also nothing in there about how goblins relate to orcs but it's more blatant that they're different races.
>>11507620The sleeper has awakened!
>>11506991>no orc campaignThe post-release rpg campaign was ok, not great, but I didn’t mind it and respect that the developers tried something different rather than give people the “4 races, 4 campaigns” expected outcome. The three we got are challenging, and I think reception for TFT would’ve been much colder if they’d cut each campaign down to 3-4 missions to accommodate orcs. Orcs seemed like their story had come full circle at the end of RoC; didn’t feel like they’d fit anywhere into the main TFT plot.
>>11507859I'm really not convinced they were meant to separate, like if you see how they mirror the races:Elven archer - Troll axethrowerElven ranger - Troll berserkerElven destroyer - Troll destroyerElven Lumber Mill - Troll lumber millThen you haveGnomish flying machine - Goblin zeppelinGnomish submarine - Giant turtle(controlled by goblins as the manual says)Gnomish Inventor - Goblin AlchemistDemolition Squad(dwarf) - Goblin SappersNow for the gryphon riders there's no goblin equivalent because the horde uses dragons but you can see how the demolition squad occupies the space that is part of the gnome/goblin dichotomy. And what building do you need to create the (dwarven) demolition squad? The Gnomish Inventor of course.Now by itself I wouldn't say that was enough evidence but like I said >>11507746 there's the fact they come from the same place and look exactly the same. Then gnomes aren't mentioned at all in Warcraft 3 and suddenly the flying machine is now dwarven along with all other gadgety units - the siege engine, mortar team and rifleman(interesting that the description of the gnomish inventor building says they are adept at making gunpowder)I'm now even more convinced that dwarves/gnomes were intended to be interchangeable or that gnome was meant to describe a subrace or faction of particularly crafty dwarves.I'd be happy to be proven wrong if there's any mention on the manuals referring to "dwarves AND gnomes". If they were indeed separate, does the Warcraft 3 manual say anything about how gnomes, a major part of the alliance, has completely vanished? Again, not interested in wow revisionism
>>11507894>The three we got are challenging, and I think reception for The Frozen Throne>would’ve been much colder>>11507962>I'm really not convinced they were meant to separateYou'll have to reach out to Metzen to see what his intent was for 1995 and how it changed by 2002. When it came to WoW he was no longer the writer but instead creative director.
>>11507962btw, pic is the description of the alliance: humans, elves and dwarves with dwarves being the suppliers of "ingenious technologies". no mention of gnomesso yeah you can't tell me they are not the same
>>11508029>btw, pic is the description of the alliance: humans, elves and dwarves with dwarves being the suppliers of "ingenious technologies". no mention of gnomesI'm fine with reading this as "dwarvish Inventor" or even just treating them as a subrace, though I'm still going to prefer to regard them as a different race entirely.They at least seem to be differentiated by personality: I would not ever regard the dwarven demolition crew as "odd and eccentric", and the speech used by the gnomish flying machine pilot is more what I'd expect a 'gnome' to sound like.
>>11499780I would have liked the Illidari to be a proper faction, if you make an MMO anyway, but if it's not wow. Like Illidan has united so many races under him, he could easily be a full-fledged faction on the same level as the Horde or Alliance. He has Blood Elves, Draenei (Broken), Naga, Fel Orcs and even Satyr, who could represent his presence on Azeroth. That would have been cool. Nightelves obviously should not join the Alliance. There is no reason for them to. They are a huge Empire on their own. Wow ruined everything by cutting away like half of the Alliance's forces and making them neutral, so the Horde can play on an equal footing. Sylvanas should also be her own faction and have Elven Undead, Evil bandit Humans and Ogres on her side. She should not just control Undead. The Forsaken should be a broader multicultural alliance.
>>11507894>Orcs seemed like their story had come full circle at the end of RoC; didn’t feel like they’d fit anywhere into the main TFT plot.And that's a story problem, hence me making that post. It's a series primarily about orcs and humans, the rest should be ancillary stuff to compliment it. I was saying it's disappointing that they made the final installment(before wow rape) about undead vs a demonic night elf with mermaids. The "human campaign" is not about humans in the slightest, if anything they are minor antagonists(garithos) and the "orc campaign" is a spinoff about the misadventures of an half ogre.And I can't help but lament how lame orcs became. As someone who was such an orc fan in Warcraft 2 it feels like they were completely stripped of their essence. Sure if they wanted to have some goodie orcs through the thrall storyline that's fine but don't let that be the main fate of the entire faction. The frozen throne orc campaign should have been though the pov of someone splitting from thrall and reconnecting with demons or the pov of chaos orcs opposing thrall from straying their brethren from their ways. Then they could have had a significant role in the final battle as part of Illidans forces in northrend.At least Arthas was still kinda sorta human, orcs were completely absent (besides the talking piece of armor stuck in the ice)
Were there any significant characters from warcraft 1 or 2 still alive(not killed in-game or by the manuals) that warcraft 3 forgot about?
>>11508141The Burning Legion was right. The orcs weren't worth holding onto, they might as well die and be folded into the Scourge. They proved utterly incompetent in the end, and despite all of their cope, their absence from anything significant in TFT is proof of that.Their only accomplishments were sucker punching a race on Draenor, sucker punching a kingdom on Azeroth, and then blowing up their own homeworld. Pathetic.
>>11508141>>11508481Warcraft is inherently racist and orcs becoming the good guys is blizzard's reparation. The visual and audio impact of white versus nonwhite can't be explained away. The back to kalimdor and demon blood storylines were all about "redeeming" the act of creating evil orcs, literally. Mannoroth probably represents someone at blizzard. We'll never know if they needed to make that penitence, all we know is they were wildly successful and the big bad orcs lived on as a huge IP for 10 more years. captcha: XXX48M
SOVL
>>11508326Garona comes to mind
>>11507746>im asking because they look the exact same and come from the same placeThey look similar, but you don't see full-body portraits of them. And I don't think they sound the same, do they? Like the dwarves sound like Scottish humans or something maybe, while the gnomes have weird high voices? I mean it's hard to imagine the two groups aren't related, and if you asked a writer at Blizzard from that time whether they could interbreed, the answer would probably be "We don't really care and so haven't decided, but yeah, most likely they can."Maybe it's like Chihuahuas and Great Danes - same species, but so different that you'd be silly not to strongly distinguish the two groups. I mean what ultimate distinction are you looking for? They're fantasy races so my talk of interbreeding is a bit silly since they don't breed to begin with, being fictional... in fantasy, it'd make more sense for them to have been created by different gods or something, and for that to be the ultimate division between them.For me, it's good enough that they have two different names and seemingly different vocal pitches.
The coolest WarCraft unit is the water elemental from WarCraft 1. This is objective truth
>>11494387Pure anus.
>>11508864Read >>11507962 and especially >>11508029The fact that the alliance description talks of dwarves(when there's only 2 dwarf units) with zero mention of gnomes(2 units and a building) and it says the dwarves provided ingenious technologies when it's the gnome units and building (submarine, flying machine, inventor) that are the technological ones...The voice thing means little when there's only one "dwarf voiced" and one "gnome voiced" unit so that's like the peasant and the knight(both human) sounding different
>>11508867More like the coomest. Shame how when they brought back water elementals in war 3 they had none of the same appeal if you catch my drift
The slightly altered lord of the rings fantasy races are obvious.Savage brutal orcs. Dwarves and hobbits aka gnomes.Undead a classic fantasy and d&d faction.Dark elves less fair, altered to be nightime and moon oriented, still about nature and beauty and helping the lands while trying to stay hidden in the wilderness.The humans are civilized good, law and order middle ages europeans that have chivalry and justice. The orcs brutal african cannibal savages and slavers operating on primitive brute force and black magic beliefs like pre colonial africa. Trolls are similar evil like new world cannibal carib of the pre european caribbean, and hatians that exist on superstition, black magic, and a primitive way.Warcraft 3 was one of the best games ever.The official game was excellent, and the custom map content kept it good much longer.A few years prior to reforged they already broke a third of the most unique maps in a pointless update that removed an invisible editor unit they depended on. Since most content creators had long since moved on at least half never got updates to fix them.I thought that was bad enough. I never imagined they would trash such an old game with the reforge update and never let you access it again.That was a big wakeup that nothing digital is safe, digital worlds full of memories can be walled off forever and never revisited again, even if you bought them and think you own them.In spite of the fact that digital spaces are easier to preserve than real world spaces, greedy corporations own and exercise control over them and will ruin things even when there is no profit motive.Tranny run wow retroactively removed tons of easter eggs and content that added charm for years bwcause they didn't match thier woke sensibilities.Even a company you like can have the workforce change, be bought out and turn into something entirely different owned by people that won't just leave the old outdated stuff people love alone and make new stuff.
>>11508326Khadgar and all the people he was with when closing the portal?>>11508923What's the significance between being a dwarven subrace compared to being their own race?
>>11508961>Khadgar and all the people he was with when closing the portal?I thought they all died/lost forever in twisting netherAlways felt like a cheap way to get rid of people so new characters can take over. Like for example why not further develop Alleria Windrunner by having her take the role Sylvannas did on the story? Why do we need another Windrunner when there's one that was already established and not confirmed dead?
>>11508986The heroes who went BTDP were hard as fuck for trying to cross a dimensional rift with medieval science and no way home, where they could've easily fallen into a vat of acid or unbreathable vacuum or demon rape dungeon on the other side. It's perfectly fitting and realistic that none of them ever saw azeroth again, they knew they weren't coming back.
>lion with bat wings and scorpion tail>called a wyvernBruh it's a fucking manticore. Wtf Metzen>>11509000>characters not coming back when they are missing with no corpseLol do you even fantasy.I don't follow WoWshit but my first thought was "there's no way haven't brought back those fuckers by now" so I checked the wiki and of course they did
>>11509006I like them better dead. I remember nothing about the story of BTDP if there was one
>>11509006there's something nostalgic and sad about following behind a character you can never catch, like Arne Saknussem, someone separated by a gulf of spacetime.
>>11502340what kind of argument is this? white people made basketball too but all the best players are black people
>>11509029>be white>make game>make millions of dollars>move on>some slant decides to spend 30 years playing your game>w-we areu besto...cool story yu-jun, have sex
>>11509065bird couldn't even out shoot shaq
>>11509097your mom did poop on my dick while riding cowgirl thoughever
Wait how the fuck did medivh return in wc3 and how did he turn good? We literally kill the evil cunt in wc1
>>11509432It is never explained in-game but he was basically revived by his mom in a book you likely never heard of.
>>11509432I'm curious, are you unironically wondering about that for the first time 23 years after W3 original release?
>>11509486NTAI never gave it much thought if at all because W3 immediately made me think it had about as much depth in character consistency as cable TV cartoons like the Simpsons and Futurama when I was playing it. So I never even thought about stuff like the mysterious crow man coming back from the dead. He is just fine now and he isn't going to explain shit, okay with me.
>>11509486I had never played warcraft 1 so when it came to that wtf line in 3 where he says his own brethren killed him I just brushed away the confusion to me not being familiar with wc1(guessing that maybe in game after you kill him there's like a quest to revive him and he repents or something) but I've played it and nah, he's just an evil wizard betrayer that aids the orcs. Really poor storytelling from warcraft 3 to asspull this out of nowhere offscreen revival and change of heart with zero justification
How bad is the Warcraft movie? Thinking of watching it today
>>11510049It's good. It steals from good movies. The Vikings guy is highly watchable as Lothar. It's biggest problem is the human storyline has zero effort put in and is more like a fisher-price knights movie. Orcs were obviously the priority so it's firmly in the WoW-verse rather than WC2. Every unit and doodad from WC3 they put in the movie is another point added to my unironic critical opinion, not enough but a strong 6 or 7.
>>11508986>I thought they all died/lost forever in twisting netherNah he's back from the Warcraft, too, at least he still had a beard here.>>11510059>WoW movie steals from other moviesSurprisingly consistent with it taking from other MMOs.
>spider king is a beetleReally?
>>11508141Tbh, I didn’t care that much at the time. I saw an epic trailer that led into an epic game, full of new things, all done excellently. If it had been just another orc v human slugfest it’d be far less memorable. Loved all the choices they made. Even retconning the orc siege weapon from catapults to demolishers in TFT was cool to me.if it’s not my favorite, it’s definitely one of my most-replayed of all time.
>>11509097disregard that, i suck cocks
>>11510262It's like a cuckoo thing. The spiders are just hardwired to follow whatever comes out of a royal egg as their leader. One day the beetles swapped out the royal egg with one of their own, and the rest is (Blizzard-tier) history.
>>11510049It is only bad in the sense that whoever was in charge of doing CGI should be slapped.
>>11510325>retconning the orc siege weapon from catapults to demolishersis there a difference?
>>11494390starcraft is shit, warcraft 3 was amazing and played to this day unlike shitcraft
>>11494457i can still hear menu sound effects playing inside my head
>>11510757Bait
>>11505971As of Lord of the Clans they were separate, but I'm not sure about WC2
>>11494387I dont care for multiplayer slop, how's the campaign?
>>11510930Really cool. Perhaps a bit convoluted and melodramatic but tends to come with the territory of epic medieval fantasy. If you're into lord of the rings or dungeons & dragons or warhammer and the like you're bound to enjoy it. Pretty dynamic gameplay and narrative for RTS standards, they do a good job at twisting the regular "destroy the enemy base" formula to keep things engaging.
>>11510930>multiplayer slopdon't knock it till you try it. anyway, campaign is fine, but mostly just an introduction to the concepts of the game. skirmish and world editor will provide limitless entertainment, though.
>>11510930Good storytelling and gameplay variety, underwhelming story and difficulty. Which makes it the best classic Blizzard campaign, since the others do come up short on gameplay variety.
I heard development of WoW started before WCIII is this true?
>>11511120If you search the archive of this image, it'll take you to a thread about it.
I wish the divine of my world help gamers cure the world
>>11499780Jaina Thrall sexoIllidan Maiev sexoTyrande Malfurion sexoKael Vashj sexoSylvannas Arthas sexo
Is there a mod, or even better, an option, that changes the health bars to your team color? I get confused in bigger battles, which health bar shows which unit.
>>11510708>is there a difference?Functionally, no. Unit stats are almost identical, same passive ability. Blizzard clearly thought catapults were generic and replaced them with something more distinctive like the siege weapons for the other races, especially since undead already had the catapult-like siege mechanism. I think they must have based the demolished on a lithobolos, which used torsion to “launch” stones.
>>11511182Why does this look so much better than the final version
Turning orcs into dindus was a mistake
>>11512386You like the artstyle more. Plus no rainbow pimps.
What happened to the "let's have a warcraft/blizzard general" anon? Did he drop the idea already?
>>11494387I legit never understood the appeal of WC3 proper. I always felt this was the game where RTS died as a genre and it was all downhill starting with WC3. It has a decent enough story, it has serviceable gameplay and pretty graphics but it just doesn't feel that great to play, much worse than SC or even WC2 if I'm honest. Now custom games are a whole other ballpark and I do understand why those were popular, it's what most people actually played because base WC3 and FT kinda suck.
>>11514171Maybe he saw where the thread went and thought otherwise, or he's just busy.
>>11514268>Maybe he saw where the thread wentwhats wrong with the thread? its a good one, we're on track
>>11514321>initially wanted a WC3 general >>11504402>concedes in wanting a Classic Blizzard General >>11504505>most of the discussion afterwards is story related, not much interest in playing the gamesThat "Diablo general" that's popped up hasn't been too encouraging either.
How would you change it mechanically from Warcraft 3? Would you ditch or deemphasize heroes or focus and flesh them out even more over regular units? Would you bring back aquatic units? Would you keep the resource management and building systems similar or spice them up?
>>11514370Instead of having such a specific game it would make more sense to just have an ARPG and RTS general even if it would barely be alive it would live longer than just a Blizzard general.
>>11514187>base WC3 and FT kinda suck.What does it feel like, having no taste?>>11514370Any one of those general threads would be welcome amidst the sea of stupid troll posts, dumb zoomers, and spergs that comprises most of this board. Every time good threads pop up they have to fight against dying to the millionth GameCube/n64 hate thread this month. RTS’s are about as “retro” as you can get nowadays, so there should be a general or two up frequently.
>>11514467Hard disagree. Generally Warcraft players are bound to share more common interests(or at least tolerate) StarCraft and Diablo more than Age of Empires and Command & Conquer.Having a [single blizzard game] general likely won't sustain itself but combining the 3 franchises it might have a chance.
>>11514441Gold, lumber, and food seems like a well rounded system. Yes to every other change. The logical move to get some separation from WoW and mobas without completely losing the plot is to scale everything up, making heroes less relevant.
Warcraft 3 has a magical charm to its aesthetics that I can't quite figure out. It perfectly rides the line between cartoon silliness and sword & sorcery grit. The wonky buildings, hand painted textures, bright saturated colors, exaggerated anatomy and melodramatic story are all treated with an earnestness and care without becoming pure silliness. There's this interesting undercurrent of "cool" violence and pulpy muscle bound heroes and scantily clad babes that turns the dial back from Disney and into its own space.The weird thing is that World of Warcraft feels like it turned the dial a few notches closer to Disney and some of that grit is lost. There's just nothing out there like Warcraft 3 in tone--that can balance stylized cartoonism and sword & sorcery pulp so well.
>>11514912>The weird thing is that World of Warcraft feels like it turned the dial a few notches closer to Disney and some of that grit is lostI never saw world of warcraft as cartoony/disney like in anyway until they updated the graphics 5 or whatever expansions in. I think many people see the progression of a non realistic art style as a sliding scale between a stick figure and a pixar movie but warcraft 3 and world of warcraft were never that for me.
>>11514924I'm going to second this, though WoW felt slightly less saturated with its colors compared to WC3.
>>11514171I'm still here, but I have more to worry about than shitposting alone. Besides, the thread isn't even over yet. Your disdain for this issue is curious to me.
>>11514924I read the whole Wow Diaries book and they were very clearly inspired by Disney. Some of the wood textures and the way they would expand the wood beams in unrealistic ways are straight out of classic Disney films (like this Black Cauldron scene)--which isn't a bad thing Disney had had some fantastic artistry in it over the years. But Warcraft 3 was definitely a big pivot away from what everyone else was doing in the realms of Daggerfall, Everquest, Ultima (that realistic classic fantasy look).I remember when WoW launched and people complained that it looked "cartoony" but I think that term just has a lot of baggage. WoW is just larger than life. Everything is THICK and chunky and organically shaped and the hand painted textures are timeless unlike the photo bashed textures of Everquest or Half Life 1. But I do think at some point Warcraft went from exaggerating classic fantasy art into a cycle of regurgitation that has proceeded to "feminize" and further cartoonize the original style into something sort of gay and lame.What I can't put my finger on is what makes Warcraft 3 such a perfect example of exaggerated fantasy art in my mind.
>>11514946Having the foundation of WC2, where they went apeshit writing lore, didn't hurt
>>11514912Warcraft 3 is basically what happens when a group experienced with one form of aesthetics when using a particular set of tools (note: 3D modeling) tries to sincerely branch out into a new style they are not used to with those same tools. For anyone who points to Warcraft 1+2 keep in mind that those are games using hand drawn sprites but the 3D CGI stays firmly within dark fantasy. All of their games up to Warcraft 3 always used dark or gritty aesthetics when working with 3D models.Warcraft 3 is the first time they actually tried to do their cartoon hand drawn art style of prior games in 3D form. The result is a unique blend that got lost over time.
I will never forgive WoW for destroying the franchise
>>11494390You are Korean.
>>11515639I don't even play StarCraft multiplayer, I'm a campaignchad. StarCraft is beautiful.Compare pic related to >>11494492Compare >>11497490 to >>11497491Cope all you want about your rancid low quality polygons with "muh color, muh charm, muh cartoony aesthetic" rationalizations. Warcraft 2 looks better than Warcraft 3
>>11515663This anon is objectively correct. I love WarCraft 3, but WC2 and especially StarCraft mog the shit out of it in terms of aesthetic and gameplay.
Hell warcraft 1's medhiv looks less stupid than warcraft 3's >>11497491
>>11515483If only it and the other Blizzard games were less popular and less fun >>11495148
millennials looked at this and went "wow such an improvement!"
>>115164732024 version
>>11516473nigga u gay
>>11516501How are Warcraft 1/2 remasters? Worth a go?I despise StarCraft remastered so I have high standards
>>11516473Hell yeah
>>11514912I really don’t get the hate for the wc3 art style. 3D was the trend in every rts at the time, and wc3 did it better and more distinctively than most. All these “muh graphics” posts read like hyperzoomers who grew up on shitty Chinese mobas.>>11515671Holy mother of contrarian, tryhard opinions…
>>11516637What’s contrarian? WC2 is a better game. WC3 is a story being pushed on you and the game itself takes a backseat. It all comes down to what you prefer.
>>11516637the unit animations are still amazing, miles ahead of the first two warcraft games
>>11516683Yeah… what a great example
really makes you think
