objectively speaking these are the biggest achievements in the medium. They might not be your personal favorites but they are the greatest games in terms of innovations, influence, legacy, and lasting impact on the player. nothing had a bigger impact on gaming when it came out than these 5 games
>>12427006>ff6 but cutscenesYeah, no
>>12427006>it's 1998 and I'm 12 years old
FF7 had an enormous impact on gaming and anime culture, but I don't think it really made any significant changes to the jrpg formula. It's still a SNES rpg on steroids. I think there's also an argument to be made that Quake was slightly more influential than Doom.
I can give you Mario and Doom, replace the others with:>Pong>Pacman >Space invaders
Good list but add Street Fighter 2.
>>12427006What did they foundation?
>>12427021OP's epic bacon thread, for one.
>>12427006>innovations, influence,no, FF7 influenced basically nothing. I agree with legacy and lasting impact though. You should reword you post into "the 5 games that had the longest lasting legacy in america ignoring GTA and halo."
>>12427016it didn't have big gameplay innovations but was a total revolution in terms of narrative storytelling, cinematics, character development, emotional weight. There's more to games than gameplay
>>12427029>GTA and halonegative influence isn't something to celebrate
>>12427006>4 5th gen games5th gen bro we can't stop winning!!
FF7 is the first AAA in video game history
>>12427031>a total revolution in terms of narrative storytelling, cinematics, character development, emotional weightI could counter half these points with just earlier games in the series. the revolution was this is when Japanese RPGs actually became popular to the white man. The earth existed before you were born.
>>12427056ffvi and iv are nowhere close to the storytelling ambition of vii. you are retarded and being old, fat and balding is not an argument.
>>12427056>a total revolution in terms of narrative storytelling, cinematics, character development, emotional weight>FF VII
>>12427006Only Mario 1 could be 'foundational,' the others came like ten years after games starting becoming somewhat relevant
FF7 is rambling bullshit. Horii > Gooch, always
>no sports games>no racing games>no simulators>no city-builders>no strategy gamesHas the person who made this list even played video games?
>>12427061Im staring into your soul and can see how little of the genre you actually know about. Its pathetic. Dont make sweeping statements that you cant substantiate.
>>12427076>le epic chosen hero defeats le epic cartoon bad guy in le epic generic medieval fantasy world part 18DQ simps are so dumb its unreal
>>12427083name one game before ffvii with a more complex plot or more cinematic storytelling, I'll wait retard-sama.
>>12427016Quake is just a Doom rehash, though.
>>12427094you called me fat and a retard and now you want game recommendations? You have a weird way of saying you respect my opinion.
>>12427090>le epic chosen hero defeats le epic cartoon bad guy in le epic generic medieval fantasy world part 18this but unironically. now just imagine>mining for resources is... le bad>100+ hours to drive this shit homelmao
>>12427094Phantasy star series
>Mario twice>Nintendo 3 times>4/5ths of the games are 5th gen shit
>>12427107I accept your concession>>12427118one (1) game =/= quadrilogy
>>12427029>FF7 influenced basically nothingI know, I know. It doesn't count because you're gay.
>>12427120Im sorry the list doesnt have alex kidd, ristar, dizzy the egg or whatever scrimblo retard on the ps1 you grew up playing but in reality no one actually gave a shit about those games.
>>12427139>quadrilogytetralogy
>1 good game
>>12427171>muh boomer shooter!easily the worst game on the list
>>12427176the poop games have zero replayability after all those years
>>12427202SM64 ans SMB are replayed more than doom
>>12427006With the exception of Super Mario Bros. none of these games were innovative or influential. 3D gaming isn't innovative. FPS are arguably the easiest games to design. Locking on is natural/intuitively understood to be needed in a 3D environment.
>>12427006>FF7no FF5 or Wizardry or MnM5>marionot crazy about platformers except Contra clones.>zelda octLink's Awakening was more impressive.>mario againno>DOOMtrue but everyone should play Catacombs 3D first or Wolfeinstein. also DOOM was egged on by Ultima Underworld 1. and TES 1: Arena was trying to copy Underworld 1.
>>12427006I would argue that world of warcraft and minecraft belong on that list, and I would also argue that you do not need two mario games. >>12427083i think the anon you are arguing with is correct. While I think FF6 has an overall better story FF7 has much more world building and everything is far more zoomed in to the moment to moment. FF6 was a huge leap foreward but its still rather zoomed out. I imagine they would have done a more zoomed in story for FF6 if they did not have cartridge size limitations. Its odd that you have omitted everything multiplayer>>12427041command and conquer is very triple A, idk about that. I am surprised I have not seen your statement before. Maybe it becomes a true statement if you say the first triple a console game >>12427082>sports games Pong? >racing gamesthis genre is dead despite F-1 becoming more video gamey IRL. People play Mario Kart instead of F Zero X>SimulatorsThese are niche>city buildersyou could definitly argue that the sims belongs on this list>no stratagey gamesyeah, AoE2 or Starcraft or Dune matters alot. >>12427104quake 'invented' the polygon and the graphics card?Pokemon could go on this list instead of a second mario game. Multiplayer, birthplace of mobile gaming, mass occult indoctrination supported by the intelligence operation known as google, early e-sport, pokemon connects to alot. >>12427207doom is probobly replayed less than 64 but definitly more than mario brothers NES.
>>12427041>first AAA in video game historyi thought that is Myst?>>12427139>one (1) game =/= quadrilogyUltima 7. or Star Ocean 1.or Indiana Jones and the Fate of Atlantis .or Monkey Isle 2.
>>12427365>nothing is innovative because... because it just isnt, okay?!
>>12427391pokemon did not invent multiplayer, mobile gaming or esports. it didnt even invent monster catching rpgs.
>>12427006as a '91 chad I approve this message.
>>12427068Not bait. Just truth.
>>12427415>b-b-but megami tensei and DQ5!?!!?!Both games were the monsters fucking suck compared to the human party members and can't even level up in half of the smt games, no trading, no pvp, etc.I love SMT and DQ but this argument of "POKEMON WAS JUST A COPY" is beyond retarded
>>12427484pokemon was a groundbreaking and obviously important game, I just dont think its on OP's level where they brought a ton of new things to the table and created/redefined whole genres.
>>12427493Created the whole monster catching genre, much more impactful than adding fmv cutscenes that would be abandoned the very next gen
>>12427068I dont even think there's a modern equivalent that is better than ffvii in those categories. X comes close but that's about it. I'd love to hear what games do it better than ffvii so I can play them immediately.
>>12427496>createdit literally didn't.>fmv cutscenes that would be abandoned the very next genthey weren't. Maybe stop trying to throw in your pointless opinion about things you know nothing about. Your baby's rpg is not that deep.
>>12427502>it didn’t Might as well have done it because monsters that suck and can't even level up aren't exactly what people think about monster catching games.>baby rpg And that baby's rpgs is more complex and has a live pvp scene, can you say the same about your favorite cutscene simulator """"rpg""""? Yeah I guess not
>>12427484I would definitly credit pokemon for being why nocturne had such improved gameplay compared to past megaten games. I am suprised we do not have 5 romhacks for snes megaten to make demons better and maybe add press turn, instead we have 0. That being said the design documents for pokemon literally show it starting as a megaten clone. They removed world religion from megaten to create pokemon and made more money than jesus by doing it. Bill (gates) in pokemon is a archetypal refrence to Stephen ( Hawking) in Megaten for example. >>12427415It did not invent any of these things but it was a flashpoint that curated them all together. Pokemon put esports in every toys r us nation wide. >>12427493pokemon had absolutely nothing to do with the mass adoption of USB ports in computer hardware :^)
>>12427507Yeah smt really started with Nocturne, Persona 1 is cool too because it's like you have a full 5 demons party that can fire guns if you really think about it
Do you guys get tired of talking about the same shit day in and day out?
>>12427524Because new retro games are released today
>>12427006GTA3 deserves a spot too.
>>12427526There are hundreds of thousands of games released between 1971-2007 but you'd rather talk about the same 5 games every day?
>>12427515I do like persona 1. The gameplay is better than persona 2 which is unfortunate because persona 2 has much better presentation. Persona 2 needs a romhack like the snes games do.
>>12427006>Pong>Pac-Man>Space Invaders>Virtua Racing>Street Fighter IIFTFY
>>12427391>racing genre is dead literally on a boom right now and more popular than ever now that millenials can afford to blow thousands on simrigs
>>12427006You've never played a retro game you didn't play as a kid, huh.
>>12427727>millenialsgames journalist term that don't exist.>>>/trash/
>>12427006>ff 7 instead of the 6 others
>>12427984Final fantasy only became great with FF7
>>12427529Came here to post this
>>12427530>hundreds of thousands of gamesno there isnt.
>>12428197FF7 wasn't even the best FF game on the PlayStation.
>>12427612pac man was just a one off novelty, doesnt really fit with the rest.
>>12428207FF8 and 9 are also much better than the first 6
The real revolution regarding FF7 was its marketing budget, partially thanks to the help of Sony.
>>12428207>FF7 wasn't even the best FF game on the PlayStation.This.
>>12428208Yeah I don't get why they never made another game like pacman
>>12427392>Monkey Isle 2You went too far with this one
>>12428229>8not really>9yes, absolutely
>>12427006Biggest achievements?Only Super Mario 64 and Doom count. The rest are rehashes of other respective games in their genres. OoT was not the only 3d game of its kind at the time. And neither was FF7.
>SpaceWar>Pong>Colossal Cave Adventure>Space Invaders>Donkey KongHere's your foundational five.
>>12427529Shenmue did open world cities two years prior.
>>12428603Shenmue is no more "open world" than your average JRPG town.
>>12428603shenmue wasn't pivotal for being open world it was pivotal for being simulationist
>>12428594Colossal cave adventure is maybe too niche, pitfall invented platforming not donkey Kong and you need to have pacman
>>12428205every console, handheld, personal computer, and arcade game combined, yes there are from that timeframe
>>12428706name 100,000. I'll wait.
yawn, why is this board so obsessed with fitting in with normalfaggots?
>>12428647>Colossal cave adventure is maybe too nicheIt was copied by every early text adventure game and RPG in the 70s. In turn those influenced the big titles of the early 80s, Ultima, Wizardry, Mystery House, King's Quest. Every strand of adventure game and every strand of RPG descends from these.>pitfall invented platforming not donkey Kong Donkey Kong isn't on the list just because of the platforming or the side-view, but also for the goal-based objective during a time when most games had you shoot all the shit or get all the shit. If anything, Pitfall was a step back to those collectathons. Even Smurf: Rescue in Gargamel's Castle was more forward-thinking than Pitfall.>you need to have pacmanIt's a contender for cultural impact maybe, but in terms of gameplay, maze games were a dead end.
>>12427006replace ocarina with the original zelda and replace the original mario with street fighter 2
>>12428813street fighter 2 lead to mortal kombat lead to injustice lead to the death of superman, its more of a top 10 than a top 5 game though. thinking the original zelda matters more than oot is insane though
>>12428708https://www.mobygames.com/platform/Wow as many as 300,000
Retards here really be comparing 2d platformers to text adventure rpgs
Objectively speaking, Dragon Quest 2 was more "foundational" than FF7 was.
>>12430089Definitely. jRPGs followed DQ2's structure of linear first part, open second part for years.
why are you guys posting about old games if you don't know actually anything about them? weird shit.
>>12427006Honestly a great list anon. If these were the only games I had to play for the rest of my life it would be a good time.
>>12427378>noFF5 may be the better (and definitely more replayable) game but there's no question it was less influential.
>>12427378Same goes for Link's Awakening, actually. I like the game better than OoT, but there's no doubt that OoT was more influential.
>some big buff black guy yelling at me for not being a tree hugger>some people dressed up as the warriors angry at nuclear reactors>a 6 foot 2 guy dressed as hot topic goth with mother issues is the final boss>minigames and shirtless bodybuilders bloating up my quest>my white mage is an alien my monk is dressed up as street hooker my cid is a crank who doesn't even have any big ambition to be with my crewwhy is ff7 so great again?
>>12428781>but in terms of gameplay, maze games were a dead end.Stealth games are an extension of Pac-Man.
>>12431621Stealth games descend from Metal Gear, which was a Zelda clone, which was influenced by ARPGs, which were influenced by Atari Adventure, which was an adaptation of Colossal Cave Adventure.
>>12431621>>12431679Cont. And if you're descending them from Castle Wolfenstein, then they descent from Berzerk, which descends from Western Gun, which descend from Space War.
>>12431679>Metal Gear, which was a Zelda clone
>>12427031But that doesn't make it foundational. Wizardry would be the foundation for RPGs. And I'd replaced Zelda with Space Invaders.
>>12427104>arbitrary geometry 3D>native internet multiplayer>designed for modding with game logic running in a VM>responsible for OpenGL's success with GLQuake>pioneered client-side prediction with QuakeWorld>origin of machinima>origin of Speed Demos Archive>origin of QuakeCon>engine widely licensed, descendants still used todayDespite Doom being the most important game in OP pic and deserving of a slot, Quake is still more important.
>>12431703This is so dumb.
>>12430089and ultima and wizardy is more foundational than any dqdoesnt change the fact theyre all shit games unlike ff7
>>12431606>too dumb to realize barret's crusade had nothing to do with environmentalism>too dumb to realize aeris isn't an alien>too dumb to realize cid's ambitions are central to his character>too dumb to realize the hot topic goth isnt the real villian>too soulless to appreciate minigame varietysorry anon its a game for people with 3 digit iq
No such list is credible without Elite, the first fully 3D open world game, which influenced GTA among other things.
>>12427031FF7 was incredible, but most of its innovation was rather specific to 5th gen. It's not like you can credit Final Fantasy for the idea of doing cutscenes in a videogame.
>>12431703>Quake invented 3D
>>12431757It was cool how the backgrounds would seamlessly turn into FMVs and vice-versa with the realtime characters moving on them. It's a great example of that kind of thing being done repeatedly in a large-scale game.
>>12431767Exactly. That's not something that really mattered much after devs could just do full 3d cinematic cutscenes in-engine.
>>12431761doomfags are fucking delusional retards
>>12431761wasnt it the first fps with a fully 3d engine?
>>12431868Terminator Future Shock predates it by a year
>>12431871And Geograph Seal predates that by another year
>>12431868idfag propaganda. Geograph Seal beat it by two years.
>>12427006This is the foundation for all of gaming today.
>>12431684>zoomie who started with snake eater
foundational of gaming
>>12432183if that were true 360 games would have been green instead of brown, and also modern gaming would be better. zone of enders 2 is worth being a daily driver
>>12432183I really don't get what he means when he said he invented camera. Mega Man Legends came out a year earlier and had a ton of real-time cutscenes with complex camera work.
>>12432475MML has some great cutscenes, but filmic presentation is laced throughout MGS. Picrel alone was revolutionary.
>>12432267is this just ps1 shenmue?
>>12433192Basically yes, an adventure open world game with a schedule for majors npc ,proto QTE and a fighting system Shenmue is much more refined especially the fighting system which is very bad in mizzurna fallsBut Mizzurna has a better story
>>12432475he meant the ingame camera item
>>12427006Retard.
>>12428557What is Super Mario Bros. a rehash of tho? Genuinely curious.
>>12433498It's not. Closest thing I can think of is Pitfall and it's not scrolling.
>>12433506I figured. That one came to mind too but as you say it isn't close enough.
>>12433498Pac-Land
>>12427006Grand Theft Auto 3 and Gran Turismo should be on there but this board isn't ready to accept it
>>12427006Ty the Tasmanian Tiger should be on there, being the first strayaformer.
>>12433581taking a concept with trash execution and making it 100x more playable and fun is not rehashing.
>>12427006Missing jet set willy.
>>12427104Criminally retarded post. Quake literally transformed the landscape of gaming more than you can possibly realize. And I don't just mean "le other early shooters used Quake engine".
>>12427006>OoT>SMB 1whoa is that an inconsistent retard slopfest
>>12434950Quake invented the internet.
>>12434990(doombabbies actually believe this)
>>12433506>Pitfall and it's not scrollingPitfall II though does vertically
>>12427016>I think there's also an argument to be made that Quake was slightly more influential than Doom.Make it
>>12431703A list of objectively true and technically knowledgeable facts and you have spergs crying about MUH FUTURE SHOCK
>>12435690Without Quake there's no Half-Life.
>>12427094TO, System Shock, FE4, i think even DOOM fits your criteria just fine
>>12427061>ffvi and iv are nowhere close to the storytelling ambition of vii.The claim was:>a total revolution in narrative storytelling, cinematics, character development and emotional weightAnd the simple, incontrovertible fact is that nothing FF7 did along those lines counts as "a total revolution." Simply being better than what came before and better than everyone else in the field at the time, or even being influential or the first to do something, doesn't make it a "total revolution." Especially when FF7's budget dwarfed its competition. Frankly, you're taking away from FF7's real accomplishments and importance with this exaggeration. >>12427094>name one game before ffvii with a more complex plot or more cinematic storytellingLook at Wing Commander IV (1996). Its 3-4 hours worth of cutscenes are literal filmed cinema with real actors. Betrayal at Krondor (1993) has a long and complex plot.What FF7 did was rely on in-engine mechanics to depict cutscenes, which is what EVERY Final Fantasy game had done since FF2 on FC/NES. They leveraged greater storage space to depict more detailed environments and expand the cutscenes from roughly 4ish (FF6) to 10ish hours in FF7. And they enhanced the in-engine cutscenes with cleverly-integrated FMV clips.So let's review:- Depicting cutscenes in-engine was not new (nor, by 1997, limited to the Final Fantasy franchise).- Elaborate, detailed cinematic cutscenes were not new.- Long, complex plots were not new.These were all things that people across the industry were already doing. Square with Sony's deep pockets was just in the best position to deliver a massive epic story, primarily in-engine with highly detailed, dramatic and spectacle-heavy cutscenes, before anyone else. Doing something that everyone else is already trying to do, just doing it a little better, isn't "total revolution."
>>12436886the intro bombing sequence alone was radically different in tone, setting and cinematic techniques than any jrpg that came before it, stop being a fucking retard comparing it to 16 bit sprites standing around on a flat background while you scroll through text.
>consolebabbies think faggot fantasy invented cutscenes
>>12436926https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Gish_gallop
>>12435690out of the box tcp/ip netplay and later clientside prediction with quakeworld changed multiplayer forever
>>12436926>the intro bombing sequenceIt was amazing how it zooms out on Aeris and zooms back in on the train on the other side of the city, it perfectly depicted the scale of this huge place. It's the same level of brilliance as the opening shot of Star Wars.
>>12431726>barrets crusade has nothing to do with environmentalismok you figure out later on its cause shinra fucked up his town but why does he have to yell at me about politics in the first hour of the game? It's not comfy in a comfy game genre. I don't remember terra yelling at side characters what I think about MAGITEK and ESPERS.>hot topic goth isnt real villainoh its the nerd working for dieselpunk google or hot topic goth mother? Ah geez dood considering the game is always shoving "SEPHIROTH" in the plot all the time why can't he be the real villain?>you have no soul cause you dont like minigamesI don't though. Whats so fun about following a strict plot path and being semi forced into doing minigames along the way. I want side quests I want world building. Even non /vr/ jarpigs like yakuza despite having all kinds of minigames don't put them in my way so much.
thanks you guys, I see the light now and no longer enjoy FFVII.
>>12427006Let me fix that list for you OP.Doom and Super Mario Bros are easy ins. Agreed.I would add Minecraft, love it or hate it, it changed gaming. Basically invented the survival crafting genre, and was the first major pioneer of early access neverending development. I would also say it was the first indie game to truly go big in the internet era. I would say pick an earlier RPG than FF7. Maybe earthbound? Or Just an older Final Fantasy. The genre was well established long before FF7 came along. Replace Mario 64 with Gran Turismo to get some racing/simulator representation. Thats my input that nobody cares about.
>>12436939>It's the same level of brilliance as the opening shot of Star Wars.Yeah but what was "revolutionary" about it?It's a really good introduction, one of the best in videogame history in my opinion.But how is it a "revolution" to use FMV technology to implement a 2-minute opening cutscene that's effectively on par with hollywood movies from 2 decades prior?There was a revolution happening in videogames, but it wasn't kicked off by Final Fantasy 7 it was kicked off by the explosion of 3D graphics hardware in the early 90s, and development of vastly cheaper and better storage. Final Fantasy 7 was just an early example to deliver on the potential, by adding a shitload of spectacle to an otherwise strict JRPG formula game.
>>12437068FFVII is a great game, it just wasn't revolutionary.
>>12436104Right, so Quake is a good tech demo. No one ITT has said anything about its actual gameplay because it's just another take on the Doom formula that everyone was doing.
>>12427006I would replace FF7 with Starcraft. I think Diablo could also have a spot on this list somewhere but Starcraft 100% deserves a spot. It basically defined the way all RTS games are designed, and was the most important game in e-sports becoming a thing, love or hate them. It basically killed the RTS genre because it was so good that no other RTS could compete with itQuake is arguably more innovative than doom, because it was true 3D. Doom is the better and more popular game, and did spark the FPS/3d genre, so it doesn't matter muchI think having SM64 and OOT on the same list is a bit redundant. I think the first Zelda or even Adventure for Atari 2600 would be more innovative than OOT.
