What makes an RPG good?
>>3457303It is disliked by people who make threads like this.
>>3457303Gameplay, story (telling), battle system, itemization, damage formula, progression, side quests, character development.
>>3457303The social aspect, interacting with and affecting other people, companions, NPCs, factions.Immersive world, which is a whole topic by itself
>>3457303Characters, challenges, risks, decisions.
>>3457379>risksGood pointWhat would be the price for failure? Dying companions? Loosing progress? Items?
>>3457417All of the above. Sometimes just some hp or mana. People who don't understand incremental stakes shouldn't make rpgs
>>3457303Depends on what it tries to do. But generally you have two types, the storydriven and the gameplay driven ones. If a RPG is making its most priority to tell a story then it gets heavy weight on the writing aspect and vice versa.But still this is a videogame so game design is important even in a storydriven game. >Game Design (RPG mechanics, combat, encounter design, interactivity, itemization, all gameplay mechanics)>World Design (Exploration, level layout, variety of biomes, lore and environment depth)>Quest quality (context, branching paths, impact on the world and its characters, pacing, harmony, variety and direction)>Writing (Dialogue, Main plot, side plots)>Characters (Traits, development, catharsis, voice acting/performance and design)>Artistic merits (Visual depth, use of colors, ambience, atmosphere and symbolism)>Music (Soundtrack)>Technical aspect (How well it runs and how unplayable are its bugs because lets face it most rpgs with some depth in them have bugs, the question is how tolerable it is)If its hard for you to think about them, just use my tier list.
>>3457662The JRPG part
>>3457662So what's your reasoning for Deadfire over the first game? What did you like better about Deadfire?
>>3457657Meaning larian should stop operating
>>3457303In game learning curve of mechanics that gives the player an advantage in future plays.
>>3457664Fuck I need to replay The Last Story again.
>>3457824Turn BASED
>>3457303you can deviate from the main story and side quests and ROLE PLAY.strangely a thing that not a lot of /vrpg/ does. its all about "numbers go up, grind grind grind"
Form what I personally like is developing characters, character customization, developing parties, and how your character(s) stats/skills interact with the game. Even if it is a simple battle heavy RPG, developing characters for combat stats and skills wise is satisfying, and being able to frequently utilize skills you've obtained, even if it's just a stronger attack skill. A lot of other aspects just enhances the game, but even games with mediocre level design, story, and so on are tolerable enough to play through when the core draws me in enough.
>>3457911>developing characters, character customizationIt's no wonder all sorts of games are including things like this. It's simply free dopamine throughout the game. Feeding the player with level ups, perks, loot, skills and all that is a no-brainer. Constant progression, basically.I hope RPGs will focus on allowing more roles for roleplaying, reactivity, and more emergent sandboxy gameplay. More lively open worlds, where you can be more than a dungeon delving dude.Choices in quests would be great, but honestly I'm not expecting to be impressed by stories no matter how good they are, so I'm more interested in non-scripted events/stories that may occur randomly. Environmental storytelling works well too.
>>3457303Gotta agree with, >>3457358Above everything else I want to feel like I'm in another world with other inhabitants. Not just walking dialogue boxes and check lists.>>3457379>risks, decisionsNot enough games let you fuck up. Being able to make mistakes and build from them is peak.>>3457417Honestly for me it wouldn't even need to be a mechanical penalty. Just have >insert place/person< treat me differently. So I guess missing out on rewards, or being expected to give something up works.Like, failing to pull off a job for a 'crimeboss' npc leads to him crippling me or an npc.
>>3457969Yeah, would be nice if rpg would have that. Appeasing normies was a mistake.
>>3457311>Mention gameplay as a specific elements then mention elements all falling under the gameplay umbrella as specific elements Anon...
>>3457664Xenoblade 1 deserves to be up a tier or two. Persona 2 is too high, SMT4 too low.
>>3457662>hivemind consensus tier list, no ability to form his own opinions
>>3457664You put Cuckold of Fire in high tier.List disregarded.
>>3457303>What makes an RPG good?If we knew, we would be making more of them.
>>3459084I am reminded of DICE asking players why battlefield bad company 2 was so fun. “Please help, we don’t know how to make battlefield games anymore”
>>3457910>you can deviate from the main storyIn some way but not in a major as nobody have enough computing power for simulation engine needed for derailment of the story and going back to tabletop, many GMs would allow you some freedom and plot to put you back on story track they had prepared.
Wow. This thread again. What a good way to make a good discussion! >what is an good rpg guseWait...I know! But! That fucking retarded nigger over there also knows! WOWIE! What a great fucking discussion, because he obviously disagrees with me, because obviously, this great genre, which is known for it's freedom of play, has an easy way to generalize it's qualities (from all the fucking games in it's entire existence by the way) into a single distilled aggregrating post! Jesus Christ be praised, he has come back! Just because this anon has figured it out!
That I get to ogle at women and have monsters to collect
>>3457303>What makes an RPG good?Feeling like I can actually use the abilities I have to shape my experience. Being able to apply skills, abilities, spells and attributes I have at all points where it feels like I should. No cutscenes where the villain walks away while I could cast time stop and erase him from existence the moment time starts flowing again.
Fun and worthwhile exploration. If it has that, I'll enjoy it. It's basically the only thing I care about, though I also enjoy build autism.
>>3457303Good story.Good music.Functional gameplay that is unobtrusive.At least one character I can wank to. Two is ideal, but generally unrealistic given my incredibly high standards.
>>3457303Different ways to accomplish the same thing Characters World building AtmosphereMusic In that order
It needs 2 out of these 3:1. Good gameplay - good amount of depth, build choices, requires thought etc2. Great story - enjoyable characters, choices, pacing etc3. Immersion - excellent world building, side characters, little towns you visit, the music that engages you
>>3457303What makes a great RPGs is, in Order:1. Good exploration; in an RPG you must be able to find and get things by yourself. Exploration needs purpose, rewards and must be fun to do by itself.2. Good dungeons. Dungeons make an RPG. An RPG without Dungeons is, well, not an RPG, really.3. Role-playing options through decision making. Be It by permadeath mechanics, different choice-based outcomes etc.4. Simple yet varied character building. Be It through classes ir equipment or, ideally, both.5. No multibranching skill trees, cant think of something gayer than that.6. Good enemy design. Enemies must be fun and challenging to fight against. Fighting must be a real risk, one you only engage with in a calculated manner, because even at higher levels, you know that you may lose It all If you are too careless.
>>3457662What the fuck is this tier list
>>3457417Add bad endings ontop of all of that.
>>3457662This tier-list is so fucking normie-core, you should grab a bud light and go to a superbowl party, holy fuck.Also>New Vegas>Above Diablo 2>and half of all those other gamesGo jump off a cliff.
>>3457303It has to be fun
>>3463837>bud lightThis guy didn’t get the memo I see. /vrpg/ is now a Coors board.
>>3457303>What makes an RPG good?When you have a table, sheets of paper, dice and at least 4-5 people.Digital RPGs can be a fun distraction, but it doesn't hold a candle to TTRPG with a group of friends.
>>34639195e storygames post. Back to tg you go
>>3463937OSR is a joke, also I don't play 5e.
>>3463946Sorry, Pathfinder storygamer.Dungeon crawling is what D&D was meant to be, If OSR has turned into a joke its because storygamers got a hold of It through the rulings not rules nonsense.
>>3464056OSR is mostly just the socially inept autist shortcut because doing math with people seems less intimidating than roleplaying.Even then I don't railroad players, and I do dungeon crawling every once in a while, I just don't believe going 100% into B/X D&D is inherently superior.
>>3463837You mad? lol
>>3457662Solid tier list, i dont agree with few picks, like Witcher 1 is unplayable clunkfest with awful everything except story, shouldn't be good, but maybe you like it for its story. Ultima 5 deserves to be a tier higher but its alright where it currently is.Disco Elysium should be a tier lower, i dont think its story is that goodWitcher 3 should be a tier lower, its gameplay leaves a lot to be desired, i suppose you were manipulated by the expansions.Fable should be in trash, its an abhorrent gameTyranny should be in mehSkyrim should be a tier lower next to Oblivion and Kingdom Come.I would swap Fallout 2 with 1 but im fine with it like this.Yeah a solid list overall, looks like you know one or two things about the genre. I recommend you check out Legends of Grimrock and Knights of the Chalice
>>3457664This is also a solid one, i would change Persona 2, it doesnt belong near that tier lol Also Final Fantasy 6 is overrated as fuck, bring it down, it didn't age that well. Tactics Ogre is too slow for its own good and the story wasn't that good either. I would pump Chrono Trigger a tier, i know its a basic game and nothing really special about it, but its imo the best gateaway jrpg.Is Vagrant Story really that good? it has a good story but it aged so poorly its in a dire need of a remake. Where is Dark Souls?
>>3464079Yeah, OD&D or AD&D ARE better systems, I agree with that.That said, hexcrawls with many Dungeons are the only non-railroading way to go.You, however, have to build an interesting world to be played. No need to be overcomplex, interesting objectives for delving and retrieving Dungeon stuff is enough, and plenty of opportunity to parlay with monsters and factions in Dungeon and in the wilderness.That is roleplaying for me, at least, no need to speak in funny Voices and no need to be shy.
>>3464079Storming into 8 x 8 dungeons with random mobs of enemies that you mindlessly slaughtered and collected loot and then moved on to the next dungeon were already old-hat by 1983, and one of the driving impetuses for the creation of Ravenloft, with its dungeons designed with an isometric perspective, using real architecture, with a plot that was designed to create depth and had a compelling backstory. OSR lovers are mostly just like you said, autists who don't like all the story and plot and drive of the typical D&D game and just want to smash hordes of enemies.Also, I really dislike the stupidity of making races a class.
>>3457303Charm and soul. Without those, your rpg is worthless.
same sex romance
>>3461030Yeah pretty much.A side to this is make the world feel alive. That it isn't just a backdrop.
>>3457303>What makes an RPG good?Excessive cyoa elements.
>>3457662>pic relatedtasty bait
