>>3534406
Todd's sweet little lies are wearing off, quick give them another 3 second trailer!

>Omg guys. I played this when i was 8 and i loved it. now that im 17 and use 4chan i am a contrarian who thinks wizardry is awesome and skyrim is for noooormiiiies

>>3534406
Honestly i loved this game when i played it in 2011, then after a few years i started to watch e-celeb and they convinced me its overrated. i was 21 at the time
Fast forward to 2020s and now i think its one of the greatest open world games ever made and a really good game, i was a stupid kid who chases "good taste" in games so i was deseprate to fit in and agree with e-celeb and hardcore gamer opinion, even without playing said old games i just parroted they are better, then i played more and more games and come to realize that those e-celebs and their fans are just hypocritical pretensious shitters, the more i think about their taste the more i found them jarring, so i stopped listening to people and started to form my own opinions and i started to analyze what makes something fun to me and what makes something boring.
Today you have 12 year olds who watched some youtube tell them its shit so they mock the game even though their garbage weeb games is hundred times more shallow, more uninspired and has worse gameplay.
Yes Skyrim has fun gameplay.

>>3534414
>Yes Skyrim has fun gameplay.
Spamming left click like a brainless zombie while occasionally healing is fucking EPIC

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>>3534406
I've put like 1300 hours into skyrim and i still love it. on my most recent play i just discovered the whispering door quest, which i had never stumbled across before. it blew my mind that there was still content i had not encountered yet.
also, it's still the best game for going camping with your waifus.

>>3534406
Bethesda's products have always been low quality in game design and writing. They're good at building engines and designing immersive environments within their games. They sold well as long as Bethesda stayed on the cutting edge and could offer novel, graphically impressive, open world experiences. The other side of this is they age like milk so playing Skyrim 13 years after release and you can easily see past the smoke and mirrors for the POS it really is. The thing that gave Skyrim staying power which Oblivion lacked was a strong modding community to put lipstick on the pig.

Bethesda games have their charms, I know video essayists love to pretend they're liquid shit compressed into shit bricks laced with quantum shit with shit cubes on top but they're really not that bad. That said, I didn't enjoy skyrim at all, even when it came out. Was kind of surprised it sold as well as it did but you can't blame people for wanting to see what all the fuss is about.

>>3534406
oh look yet another bethesda/fallout/skyrim/morrowind thread. that's what 3? 4? 5? now. low impulse control retards cant stop spamming their tired threads over and over and when called out pretend they have no idea what you're talking about. stupid retards

>>3534406
i liked it a lot as a kid but i definitely fell out of it even at a young age.
i got super fascinated by mods because they could theoretically fix all of the issues it had, but when i grew up and got a computer that could run them i was disappointed.

>>3534406
Skyrim seemed good at first.. but after 500 000 hours.. I don't know bros, it just doesn't feel like the first time I played it...

It doesn't really make the thread sound authentic when you arbitrarily screech about ecelebs over and over while pretending to be a different person. If you like any elder scrolls game you're a dumbass, simple as.

>>3534406
Sure, it was good enough. Open world, lots of stuff to find, at least playable. For sure the skill trees are balanced like shit and the writing is garbage, but it feels good to sneak around and shoot things with a bow.

>>3534544
>it feels good to sneak around and shoot things with a bow.
Does it really? The stealth is pretty broken. Like it's not a good stealth game. I'd say even mgsv is a better open world stealth game.
>but you can do other things, its greater than the sum of its parts!
Haha not really

>>3534406
Nah it’s a good game if you wanna just chill and explore. I went through my hating Skyrim phase in my early 20s too. Game came out when I was 12 lol.
>>3534414
lol exact same thing for me too man.

>>3534432
The writing on Oblivion was very done. I replayed it like 6 months ago and was shocked how comfy that world is. Skyrim marked the peak of Bethesda. You could already see the cracks forming with that game. While it is the most complete and best game of all time the quests, dialogue, guilds, the heart and soul of the franchise, all started collapsing. But everything else was drastically improved.

But Bethesda has another problem. They could improve Oblivions combat and leveling system easily and trick everyone into thinking Skyrims combat and systems were a massive improvement. And they were. But now the world has Elden Ring. Not only can Bethesda not write good quests because of diversity hires and young people having poisoned educations, BUT I’d be massively surprised if they can even get the action right. They used improved action to hide the rot within on both Fallout 4 and Skyrim. But can they really have good action by modern standards? It’s highly doubtful. We might be left with a corpse full of rot and nothing pretty to cover it up with.

>>3534406
underrated by snobs and contrarians
overrated by normalfaggots and casuals

>>3534612
>The writing on Oblivion was very done
Agreed

>>3534618
Lmfao

>>3534432
Their writing is underrated because it's not full of try-hard reddit moral dilemmas and cheesy contrived excessive consequences like most crpg fans seem to want.

>>3534414
>played more and more games and come to realize that those e-celebs and their fans are just hypocritical pretensious shitters
Kek yeah it was actually fucking disappointing.
Bashing Skyrim and praising something else raised expectations that were not met.

For years I’ve been in the “Morrowind good, Oblivion/Skyrim bad” camp. I’ve recently played all three back to back and honestly, Oblivion and Skyrim aren’t as bad as I remembered. Not gonna say they’re high art or the greatest RPGs of all time, but they’re alright. If someone couldnt find any fun at all from playing them, they’re a pretentious hipster.

>>3534638
If you liked morrowind you never liked rpgs to begin with and were always a bad apple.

>>3534423
>1300 hours
>Only just discovered whispering door
Stop fucking jacking it to your shitty coomer mod game and you might experience even more of the trash base game content

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>>3534750
would you believe me if i told you i have never coomed to skyrim before? I just go on hiking adventures with my waifus.

>>3534439
bro, i told you already. millions of people have played skyrim, so it's expected there will be several threads on it here. it's not just the same 2 people reposting the same thing.

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There are certain games in which an interest in them indicates severe brain damage, similar to what you'd find in an old lady who spends most of her time watching daytime television, and those games are the TES series, the fallout series, Gothic, Arcanum, VTMB, Final Fantasy, Fire Emblem, Persona, Owlcat's Pathfinder, and Underrail. It is said without proper stimulus brain matter decays, which leads to an increased likelihood of mental illness, and it's no coincidence we find a correlation between that and these low engagement games, such as that skyrim grandma who developed dementia.

>>3534810
>those games are the TES series, the fallout series, Gothic, Arcanum, VTMB, Final Fantasy, Fire Emblem, Persona, Owlcat's Pathfinder, and Underrail
Oh and pile on Dragon Age and Mass Effect, but admittedly I think of those as bad movies rather than video games and forget they categorically exist unless constantly reminded.

>>3534754
No I wouldn't believe you

>>3534755
>millions of people have played skyrim
Maybe, it has sold 60 million copies and it's top 10 best selling games

>>3534754
>would you believe me if i told you i have never coomed to skyrim before?
Yes, because you're too fat to reach your own dick.

>>3534810
>anime fag
Opinion disregarded.
Also, YWNBAW.

It has beautiful world and good ost. https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=U2RHSLbg9hA
Still a good looking game where you like to spend your time.

>>3534855
>beautiful world and good ost
Reasons why I didn't use fast travel. Actually a big part of what makes the game enjoyable for me.

>>3534864
The world is a procedurally generated map populated with speedtree objects... It was so lazily slapped together half of said objects were floating and had to be manually affixed to the earth in the unofficial patch.... Think about what you are saying....

>>3534414
The irony is that of the major RPG studios, Bethesda is probably the most faithful to systemic RPGs like Ultima which way back in the day were considered more hardcore than the narrative RPGs that relied on stagecraft and story blocking. In fact Skyrim's project lead, Bruce Nesmith, was a TSR guy who designed dozens of D&D modules for them back in the 80s and 90s. I think he understands the design intent of roleplaying games.

If I had to take a guess at what happened, this perception flipped because of the role DMs play in the table top community. DMing gives someone a taste of game design. But more so when it comes to storytelling and character improv, their impact on the mechanics and systems is mostly rule adjudicating. So the most invested RPG fans who fancy themselves designers and participate in the forums are naturally way more attuned to quest writing than anything else. They also tend to have that IT guy overconfidence that young and naive people find authoritative and convincing.

>>3534722
>if you like X then it must mean you like Y and dislike Z because that’s the only way I can shove you into a little box in my mind
No.

>>3534868
Procedural generation is a great TECHNOLOGY feature

>>3534872
This has never not been true even in a single instance. Everyone who likes morrowind is a retard.

>>3534886
I guarantee you that Jeff K is far smarter than you, newfag.

major problems to me:
- the Civil War is interesting but the scarcity of soldiers made everything look like it's a brawl between gangs, not some noble trying to push away an Empire
- "You are the Chosen One" is boring. Boring. Boring
-the combat system is still bad. Mount And Blade have a fun combat system, Skyrim doesn't
-the cinematic experience made it way less ambitious than Daggerfall. I'm still convinced that while Skyrim is a better game Daggerfal is a better rpg

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>>3534845
shit bro, that's the best comback i've heard to my question yet. i like it, 7/10.

>>3534909
Civil War Complaint. Hardware issue. Have suspension of disbelief. Product of its time.

Chosen One - This sounds like someone noticed something and now thinks it's always bad. It's just a device to move things along. I mean ya the main story was bad, but this isn't a JRPG, who cares. Seems like a lot of people liked the setting and the dragons (other than always being attacked), so it seems pretty average in terms of story. That was just one tiny part of the game.

Combat - For the time it was ok, but now it's horribly outdated and honestly I don't think they'll improve it for the next game. But we'll see.

Not ambitious - Skyrim is the most complete game of all time from a graphics, physics, features and content perspective.

But ya, all entitled to our own opinions. And please whoever you are reading this, don't quote me and be like "Most complete?! Bro's a newfag, he hasn't played Final Fantasy 3!" Just shut the fuck up.

>>3534950
I don't think you know what suspension of disbelief is, you can't just tell someone to have it, it's on the media to espouse it
Skyrim is worse than it's predecessors in doing that

>>3534909
Say what you will about its flaws, I appreciate that in Oblivion, you weren’t the chosen one, you were just his sidekick.

>>3535050
The Emperor literally sees you in his dreams. You were chosen all right.

>>3535106
Yeah. There's the whole thing about questioning god's plan and the necessity of acting regardless, and god even interferes. But the difference is your character doesn't have superpowers and no one treats them as something superhuman.

>>3534950
>Bro's a newfag
The fact you put it like that proves you are. Bix nood.

>>3535004
Yes you can tell someone.

Look at the final battle of Oblivion, that big Oblivion gate. Like 5 soldiers on each side.

>>3535159
I wish I could filter by IQ. These posts are the worst to read. Like, what are you expecting me, or anyone, to get out of this? Don't answer, I don't care.

>>3535174
>Look at the final battle of Oblivion, that big Oblivion gate. Like 5 soldiers on each side.
Skill issue. Worked on my machine.

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You guys need to chill. Have some more Shrek-ette. Don't mind the hair clipping, it happens.

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>>3535174
>Baurus and Joffre both got killed
feelsbadman.jpg

>>3535212
Always keep all the redshirts alive by toggling off their AI and then charging in by yourself to kill whatever

>>3534421
why are you shitting on morrowind anon, it's a good game !

>>3535212
Baurus died in the sewers. I'm glad captain Burd survived our battles. He's a real nord.

>>3535223
Autistic control freaks aren't fit to play RPGs.
Better to let the story play out naturally.

>>3535436
>Autistic control freaks aren't fit to play RPGs.
But that describes RPG enthusiasts lol

>>3535174
No retard, you can't
Yes you posted a bad example from oblivion which destroys suspension of disbelief, much like most of skyrim

>>3535439
You said Skyrim was worse than Oblivion. I gave a counter example of why that’s incorrect. But I’ll continue. ALL of the oblivion gates were tiny. Like 5 non scamp enemies in each. The scale is all wrong. But you tell yourself it’s a video game and enjoy it. You know the Xbox 360 can’t handle so much so you move on to other complaints like bad uninteresting weapons. Lack of wondrous magic. Things they could have fixed, given that Morrowind had some fun items/abilities.

>>3535499
>You know the Xbox 360 can’t handle so much
Or PCs. The NPCs are demanding, can't drop too many of them in one place.

>>3535436
*uses the developer console* heh, nothing personal, kid

>>3535499
>ALL of the oblivion gates were tiny. Like 5 non scamp enemies in each. The scale is all wrong.
NTA but I recently replayed Oblivion and finished it for the first time and this isn’t true, the gates are sprawling and have many dozens of enemies and often many completely optional sub-areas off the beaten track. They’re so annoying and tedious to fully complete that I eventually settled on only doing the plot/unique ones and completely ignoring the random ones in the world (iirc there’s like seven pre-canned generic oblivion worlds that each random gate links to)

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>>3534871

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>>3534406
Skyrim is an excellent game if you just want to turn your brain off and relax.
Sure it doesn't have super in-depth mechanics and quests and all the dungeons are just corridors, but it does a good job at just being the kinda game you can just chill and not have to think too much about when playing.
Of course some people will think that's a bad thing and while I do personally enjoy more complex and difficult games myself, sometimes you just need a game where you can relax and Skyrim is perfect for that.

It's also an excellent platform for porn mods.

>>3535499
But that's hardly true, the gates might BE small little dungeons but they give a much grander sense of scale
If we compare the towns then Oblivion and Morrowind absolutely shit all over Skyrim, where major cities just feel like dogshit hovels
See Morrowind has a much smaller world, but it feels bigger because of how slow your ass is if you're not blinding yourself early on, which means the world FEELS much bigger, even if it isnt

>>3535855
morrowind's small map is also more densely packed with stuff. wandering around you'll always find something, whereas in skyrim you'll walk through a featureless forest for a while and just find the same wold encounter again and again

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>>3535861
>morrowind's small map is also more densely packed with stuff
It objectively isn't. If we were to compare skyrim to morrowind we would see that skyrim not only has more POIs but also said POIs are densely clustered in between the games mountain ranges. Both of these games are shit and should not be played by anyone however, and if you need to compare your game to skyrim to pretend that it's good, well, it's a terrible game because skyrim is also terrible. If morrowind was good you'd compare it to good games, not seek out skyrim idiots to squabble with.

>>3535658
I remember when I first went in them. They were so empty I thought it was a trap or something. Then I realized no, that’s just the rate at which enemies appear. About 1 per in game mile.

>>3535855
Oh I agree with Oblivion towns and NPCs shitting all over Skyrim in terms of size, and basically everything else. It’s shockingly more comfy in Oblivion. And not in a “well Skyrim is supposed to be bleak! It’s cold” trust me I know it’s cold in Skyrim I’ve had npcs remind me a million times.
You don’t gotta convince me Oblivion is better than Skyrim. I would Rank Skyrim higher if I were a critique because I feel like if 100 normies played each, Skyrim would be ranked higher. It’s more well rounded. I can’t in good faith tell people they’ll love Oblivion because to love it you have to learn the entire level up system just to figure out how to abuse it. It’s so bad. But I’d play Oblivion right now over Skyrim 1000%. Skyrim is kinda brutal to replay because the NPC’s don’t exist essentially. The dragons attacking is annoying. While I love the Tundra, overall I don’t enjoy the world. Cities are 100x better than fallout 4, but worst than Oblivion. There’s just nothing better when thinking of a replay.

>>3535866
We always get these posts. And then when I ask what’s better I never get a response. It’s just trolling.

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will balloon tits make you guys chill out with the trolling and arguing?

>>3534406
Bro, just stop.

>>3534406
I disagree.

>>3534414
this is what I have always suspected, except I hadn't zeroed in on youtubers being the cause
I always just said "bandwagon faggots"

>>3535905
sounds like youre very low level
go in one at lvl 20 and you cant go 10 feet without tripping over a storm atronach

>>3535912
>in terms of size
....nah
only the imperial city is bigger than skyrim cities

anvil, skingrad, chorrol, bruma, cheydinhall, bravil, leyawin; they *might* be like 30% bigger in terms of area, but skyrim cities are pretty dense
like riften and markath are kinda stacked vertically

>>3534406
So many qursts in Skyrim involve going into dungeons. luckely for this games sake. I actually love dungeon crawling. But its still a big issue with this game lacking quest variety.

you would expect thieves guild quests to involve thieving, right? But no, it's delving into dungeons to kill or retrieve some items.

Skyrim has better exploration than Oblivion. However, Oblivion had better quests by far.

>>3536028
>Skyrim cities are dense
Combined if your fast player makes them seem to be the tiny shitty hovels they are

>>3534950
>>3534909
>>3535174
>Civil War
>Oblivion Crisis
Those are simply not stories that fit this sort of gameplay TES games offer. They cannot work in this format and shouldn't be written and put into the games.

>>3536275
>Those are simply not stories that fit this sort of gameplay TES games offer. They cannot work in this format
Why?

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>>3535861
This is blatantly, objectively incorrect. Morrowind map is an empty wasteland populated by mmo style mobs. Skyrim map is so densely packed with content that modders have a trouble even putting anything onto the map. It's why it feels like such a theme park, it's small and everything is next to each other. Modders can't improve cities and make them bigger because there are bandit camps and dungeons few steps behind the city walls, there is no room for anything anymore. If they want to add anything they always have to cope by making some pocket realms of oblivion. And even with minor entrances to those places, everything will still need patches, because there are only few empty areas left where everyone tries to squeeze in their content.

Theme park complaint is correct
Emptiness complaint is not and never was

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>>3536278
TES games are too small scale and devoid of strategical element to represent any big battles in believable way. They are not story-driven and at this same time they are anti-moviegames at their core so you can't lock player in an area and show big army in the background as a skybox or whatever, like moviegames like Witcher or Mass Effect do. They simply shouldn't bother with this sort of stories as long as they stick to Morrowind format of a very scaled down world just to make it seamlessly traversable because trying to represent big scale conflict is at odds with pursuing small scale design.

>>3536294
Meh, if the scale is an issue you could argue they shouldn't have made the games at all.

>>3536028
Idk how to even respond to this. I make a claim that A is true. You then say no A is not true because A is true. 30% more true in fact. So therefore B. Like what the fuck.

Dense cities suck btw. They took that trend to an extreme in fallout 4. Diamond city was extremely dense in terms of vendors and it made it feel tiny. And that is amplified in that it was the only real city in the game.

>>3536118
ok again, but with less ESL please

>>3536323
You shouldn't respond to me at all

>>3536279
>empty wasteland
>theme park
And nothing in between. Very nuanced criticism lol. Oh and
>they didn't leave empty room for modders!

>>3536346
Idk why they are talking about room for modders. You really shouldn't be altering anything in game like that because there's a chance it'll break everyone elses mod. So even if there were wide open spaces you should still trigger your game that adds new physical places by having like, an NPC come up to talk to you about it. "Follow me to..." And then your big open world doesn't have to be in Oblivion, but somewhere off the map.

Fuck modders anyway, they are such hacks. "Hey I added more weapons. Hey I made boobs bigger. Hey I altered the inventory to be way more ugly. Hey I jarringly changed faces and now they are weird looking and out of place for the rest of the worlds graphics. Hey I'm heckin clever and made all dragons a pickle. I changed the dragons to pickles Morty!" The only legitimate mod in this list was making boobs bigger.

>>3536076
>Oblivion had better quests by far
You can tell the devs were excited by the NPC AI stuff, schedules or them just being more active than the ones on Vvardenfell. Many quests involve it in some way.

Take for example the ayleid statue quest, where you're tasked with fetching something from a dungeon, but you're stopped by a dude who invites you to a tavern, and the hostess brings a bottle to your table. Then you can persuade the guy to give you the location, or learn it from a book. Later you can persuade one of the thugs to fight on your side, and he'll expect a payment later on.

>>3536398
>>3536076
Oblivion quests are very creative and have a lot of twists and turns, but after every quest stage a huge popup pauses the game and tells you exactly what to do next, which lets them down. What lets down both Oblivion and Skyrim quests is how painfully linear they are. Sometimes you'll make a choice at the end, like wether to kill a guy or not, but there's no actual leeway involving exactly how to do the quests. Oblivion dungeons are boring and samey, but theu trump Skyrim dungeons which are straight lines which lead back to the entrance every time, and are rarely actually believable as locations which exist in the world.
Compare to Morrowind, there are very few large dungeons, but they're designed to be believable locations, more or less. And while the quests in general are more simple, you have a lot of freedom in how to finish them. Getting a diamond for the thieves' guild could mean stealing one from a lockbox, casting chameleon and nabbing one in plain sight or literally just finding/buying any diamond in the game.

>>3536512
There's a great non-linear quest in Skyrim where you have to get fire salts for a smith. You can get those salts by killing fire atronachs, or you can find them in the world and loot, steal or even buy them.

>>3536558
>le collect 1,000 things

For me, it's rescuing the clothes-less Nord from the witch
>ah, but which one, you ask?
All

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>>3536562

>>3536583
Sadly, you can't save someone from themselves.

>>3536583
>the sweltering
nash bros....

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>>3536583
>fus-ro-LAT SPREAD

>hey guys i hate a game everybody likes

>>3534810
>There are certain games in which an interest in them indicates severe brain damage, similar to what you'd find in an old lady (man) who spends most of his time watching braindead moe anime, and those games consist of repetitively posting the same weeb images on a Turkish Delight Manufacturing Board every day without ceasing. It is said without proper stimulus brain matter decays, which leads to an increased likelihood of mental illness, and it's no coincidence we find a correlation between that and these low engagement games, such as that moeblob grandpa who developed dementia.

Fascinating. I hope you continue to refine and develop your theory and receive copious amounts of grant money.

>>3536512
Elder Scolls quests have never particularly been amazing in the grand scheme of things. they are all vary linear and basic MMO esq fetch quest.

Oblivion was the closest that Elder Scrolls games came to having great quests.

most of Morrowind quests were not particularly good either, and neither were Skyrims or Daggerfalls.

i actually don't like Morrowinds Dungeons vary much. Sure, it's more 'realistic', but the dungeon crawler in me prefers the more labyrinth style of Daggerfall and Oblivion.

>>3537130
>prefers the more labyrinth style of Daggerfall
based
>and Oblivion
cringe

>>3536853
>*mad scramble to suck your penis*

>>3537130
imo morrowinds are the worst
theyre basically ALL fetch quests, with nothing special going on
oblivion had the most complicated quests
skyrims often had cool shit going on at least, or took you somewhere cool

>>3534406
When it came out I was hyped out of my mind. And then halfway through I was so fucking bored with it that I let a friend who was very into it finish it on my computer while I watch and drink beer or chat girls on facebook. I still haven't bothered to finish it myself, let alone play for more than an hour without immediately regretting it

>>3534414
I was like 15 when I played Skyrim for the first time around the release, and I've came to the realization that the game is massively flawed by myself. I even made a Steam review saying that the game kind of sucks and is not as good as others make it out to be, it somehow got popular because it was one of the only long negative reviews of Skyrim in my language and people were literally flaming me over it in DMs.

There definitely weren't any pretentious e-celebs on YouTube where I lived in circa 2012, and I wasn't watching English YT or reading English forums since I didn't really know the language.

Damn. I was a contrarian since the beginning. I am the real fucking deal.

And 12 years later, I still think that Skyrim is mediocre, as well as any other Bethesda game. And if you consider mashing LMB, walking around for 90% of the time, doing fetch quests and going to locations that are pin pointed on your map "fun gameplay" then I'm sorry anon.

>>3535848
>skyrim is fun when you lobotomize yourself and install porn mods
Says more than a thousand words about the target audience.

>>3537289
But it's not mediocre. You simply noticed it's not perfect. That doesn't mean it's the norm. It is no way average. To this day it hasn't been surpassed. So how is it average if nothing has reached a higher peak overall?

>>3537327
It's the usual "this one thing isn't as good as other game" while failing to account for the fact that Skyrim offers quite a lot of other things.
>>3537289
>I was a contrarian since the beginning
>2011
Uh, no you weren't.

>>3537327
Personally I consider Skyrim mediocre, as everything it does pretty much sums up to the game being mediocre, and yes, it has been surpassed by many games, it hasn't even surpassed its predecessor.

I could write an entire essay on why I think so but I don't want to waste my time. My main problem with Skyrim is that the game doesn't excel at anything. The story and the characters are generic and not that great (most of my friends have admitted that they haven't ever finished the story because it seemed not that interesting), combat, leveling and the experience system isn't good and it wasn't even up to the 2011 standards of RPG's. Zero meaningful choices to be made in the game and the world barely reacts to them. Exploration is decent, but it can't save the game from the other problems that it has. And the lore being contained in loredumps in the form of book items that you find along the way is a very questionable design choice to me.

Also a big problem is that the game has no actual replayability due to zero reactivity. Every playthrough feels the same regardless of the build. It's very shit and non immersive game design when you can play as a huge hammer wielding stupid orc and be able to join Thieves Guild, Brotherhood, Mages Guild and Warriors Guild at the same time.

>>3537384
this

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>>3537376
>Skyrim offers quite a lot of other things.
I'd prefer to get a good knife that excels at cutting things and does it extremely well, rather than a multitool that half asses everything and struggles at simple tasks like carving a stick, but technically it can do a lot of things, just not even remotely as well as specific tools designed for it. You get the idea?

>>3537384
>Zero meaningful choices to be made in the game and the world barely reacts to them

I don't think I've honestly ever seen a video game that genuinely reacts to what the player does in the way that people pretend video games have to in order to count as trve rpgs. can anybody list off even a single game that does this beyond broadly scripted 2, maybe 3 choice events? I honestly think fable is the only real example. There are games in which you can technically speaking influence the story but none of them actually involve altering the world in any kind of interesting way, it takes too much resources and is the reason why the only games that have even come close to doing so are games that are entirely advertised around the feature

>>3537384
>>3537386
pure contrarianism

>>3537402
There are a few games like that.

Reactivity does not necessarily mean that the player has to have an option to influence the main story, but mostly the world reacting to your player character and your choices. Even the little things.

Arcanum is a (flawed) game that does it well. The race and class you pick makes a big difference on how the story plays out. Some people will refuse to talk to you if you're certain class or race, and there's no way to get past that. Even if you advance certain skills you wont be able to travel, etc. There are always multiple choices to approach a quest, based on your class and build, and if you advance your skills you're going to lose travel options, there are so many details in this game that it really makes it feel like the experience is very unique for each playthrough.

Skyrim doesn't have any of that. Your race and build doesn't really affect anything in the game. Most quests are very linear fetch quests with some exceptions here and there. The playthrough is pretty much exactly the same, no matter if you play as a dumb 10IQ orc with a mace or a thief build. You can join the same factions, the main quests don't offer too many options for getting through them, etc.

>>3537407
Why don't you try to refute my points instead of throwing a buzzword at me? If you don't have anything meaningful to say at least spare your keyboard.

>>3537398
If the multitool enables me to build a more interesting project that's not possible with a good knife, in that case I would take the multitool.

>>3537384
>huge hammer wielding stupid orc joins Thieves Guild, Brotherhood, Mages Guild and Warriors Guild at the same time.
If you care about immersion, why would you do that?

>>3537424
it doesnt matter
these arguments are all fake
you just want attention for your fake opinion and theres nothing to be gained

>>3537419
Having a few choices changed because of buttons you pressed in the beginning of the game is not a reactive world, that is absolutely standard RPG fare for 30 years and is even present in garbage like dragon age inquisition. Reactivity is the ability to genuinely influence the way things happen in the generated game world as it's happening, which again only exists in games that are highly marketed around the feature (mount and blade comes to mind) due to how difficult this is to create
>Most quests are very linear fetch quests with some exceptions here and there.
is also the case for almost all RPGs including arcanum. The absolute maximum you are going to get from any kind of mass sold RPG is going to be having at maximum 3 ways to end a quest that all end up with the exact same result, or maybe 5 seconds of dialogue changed in a quest in 2 hours

>>3537436
On the other hand, you just want attention for being a retard on the internet.

Look, this fucker thinks that Skyrim has good combat, LMAO.

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>>3537453

>>3537442
>is also the case for almost all RPGs including arcanum.
>that is absolutely standard RPG fare for 30 years and is even present in garbage like dragon age inquisition.
Unfortunately not present in Skyrim, apparently one of the greatest RPG games that is definitely over average according to some folks in this thread.
>Reactivity is the ability to genuinely influence the way things happen in the generated game world as it's happening, which again only exists in games that are highly marketed around the feature (mount and blade comes to mind) due to how difficult this is to create
Not really the definition of the reactivity that everyone has been talking about on forums for decades at this point.

>>3534414
You had me til you started shit talking about weeb games even though you never play them.

>>3537461
That you can't define, and instead can only murkily refer to by saying "it's what EVERYONE thinks" like a redditfag. Just go jerk off and play NWN dude lol i cant believe there are people like this on the earth

>>3537493
cope, seethe and mald. you can't dispute anything they're saying

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if i give you more tiddies will you guys calm down?

Skyrim was gaming at it's peak, we've been in the dark ages for a while now. I still remember the first time I played it as an underage twink in 2012, being amazed that you could see ants crawling on a stump.

>>3537535
It's just boring. It's fucking unoriginal. I can name the mods you're using just from the images you're posting. You're a bore. I see better shit posted on the Skyrim thread on /aco/.

>>3537539
>the peak of gaming is whatever you played when you’re a teenager
Yup.

>>3537589
would you mind providing the link? i'll check it out.

>>3537606
Cope harder, bitch.

>>3537384
“Many games better. But I’m too cool to name one.” Yawn. It was at this point I knew you were a jabroni.

As far as replay ability I replayed it more than almost any other game. Because I have imagination. You rely on other people for their imagination and to force feed you “8 million unique endings!”. Also the comment about lore dumps being totally optional is hilarious. “No! It’s only heckin good game design to force the player to sit and listen for minutes at a time!” like what the fuck even is that.

I’m fine with you having an opinion and I’m glad you offered a few supporting statements. That makes you better than most I guess.

>>3534408
wizardry influenced the genre that skyrim is, zoomie. grandfathered
>>3534406
this game made me hate triple a open worlds

>>3534616
western final fantasy?

>>3537639
Why do you think that post is cope? Why the oddly hostile response? Do you suffer from poor reading comprehension?

>>3537493
>pointing out that someone doesn't know the meaning a well established and defined term in the community is apparently reddit, even though it's the same crowd that thinks that a man dressed up as a woman is a real woman
>words mean whatever i think they mean!!!
>humpty dumptyism
Calm down. Just admit that you didn't really know what the word meant, and your knowledge of the genre is lacking.

>can't refute any of my points so proceeds to insult me
NPC behavior.

>>3537669
No shit. it's why young people like you feel the need to constantly blow it while screaming zoomer at eachother. you're deeply ashamed of being young for some reason nobody can fathom and feel like playing a bunch of shitty games we all finished 20 years ago will prove that you're better than the others

>>3536076
One of the major problems with the game for me was the Thieves' Guild. If you want to steal things, you have to do it every playthrough, and it's so linear, it gets very boring.
It's effectively the only way to unlock fences, because the speech skill is badly balanced so that it's nearly impossible to level it high enough to access fences that way. I'd be the most expensive shit I could and fast travelling between every fucking vendor in the game and my speech would barely hit 70 by the time I was tired of the playthrough.

>>3537697
>I'd be crafting* the most expensive

>>3537697
How does anyone level the speech skill in that game? It's borderline pointless,compounded by the fact that the thieves guild just drops a necklace on you that makes you pass all speech checks.

>>3537651
>As far as replay ability I replayed it more than almost any other game. Because I have imagination. You rely on other people for their imagination and to force feed you
Haha, I fucking cannot believe real hands typed this. Holy shit. You can't be that retarded.

At this point, why the fuck should you limit yourself to Skyrim? Garry's Mod or Minecraft are better for in game solo imagination LARPing since you can build and set up NPC's like dolls and set up my own quests in your mind? Hell, if you have so much imagination then write a fucking book. Why do you even need a game? Or maybe tell me, why should I use Skyrim as a base for my imagination instead of a better game with actual systems to support my imagination?

Yes, games as well as books and things like rulesets are there to spoon feed you and set up a world to play in, if you haven't realized that yet. Some games do that well, some games limit you heavily in your campaign and do that badly. If you're so imaginative, why would you limit yourself to crap like Skyrim instead of playing actual DND?

>>3537693
>you're deeply ashamed of being young for some reason nobody can fathom and feel like playing a bunch of shitty games we all finished 20 years ago will prove that you're better than the others
your insecurities are showing. I do not care at all about status wrt video game playing. Can you not imagine an earnest interest in retro game history? Is nothing you do earnest?

>>3537709
I have used this board for like a year. You are one of literally hundreds of zoomers on /vrpg/(out of the 500 people max that use this board kek) mocking/getting mad at other people about liking video games you think are for evil normies dude. Screaming I KNOW YOU ARE BUT WHAT AM I isnt gonna change reality

>>3537705
I'm just in awe at your reading level

>>3537716
?

>>3537706
>Haha, I fucking cannot believe real hands typed this. Holy shit. You can't be that retarded.

Uh huh, yes, right. You're aware you are anon and I'm not your mother say I don't give a fuck about your random nobody opinions right? Also what I said was pretty straight forward. Some play throughs I'd build a character and I'd hold me self to a set of rules. This drastically affects gameplay. But you need to devs to program literal different options into the game. I mean you admitted this, you NEED to see the world change. NPC behavior. Also "They expect me to read?! I must be force fed lore!" Again, there's a common theme here of needing to be treated as Foie gras.

>At this point, why the fuck should you limit yourself to Skyrim?

Who said I am, retard.

>Hell, if you have so much imagination then write a fucking book. Why

Right, I'm making a game.

>Or maybe tell me, why should I use Skyrim as a base for my imagination instead of a better game with actual systems to support my imagination?

Well, you can play other games that allow role play. I role played in RDR2 as well. But that games quests allow no role play. They went out of their way to make sure you NEVER have a second way to do a quest. I actually never played minecraft, it was a bit childish for me, and I'm not an artist. But generally the answer is, nothing is as in depth as Skyrim. It has physics and multiple ways to beat many quests, with expansive environments. But also, it's not like I've been playing for 20 years. I played when it came out, a couple characters. Then I replayed a few times throughout the years.

>If you're so imaginative, why would you limit yourself to crap like Skyrim instead of playing actual DND?

So the hundreds of games you mentioned earlier, you ignore them to and recommend a table top game?

You can't stay focused or address the issue at hand. I'm done here.

>>3537671
It was a mistake actually. I apologize.

>>3537738
Rare polite /vrpg/ anon. Bless you.

>>3534406
I just scrolled through Bethesda's catalog, and I don't think they've ever released an outstanding game, besides maybe Prey. Everything ranges from 'OK' to outright bad. I also think >>3534432 is spot on.
What bugs me the most is that Bethesda doesn't fucking learn. How long have they been going downhill? And how the fuck there's still people eagerly waiting for TESVI?

>>3537763
People have hope. It’s like rooting for an old fighter past his prime. They always think they can return to former glory. I might even buy the next elder scrolls. But I’m not looking forward to it.

>>3534414
This is what I don't get, people have to point to E-celebs every time someone says Skyrim isn't that good. This is a lame cowardly deflection that isn't a real defense. You are a fucking insecure bethdrone

Bethesda's influence to the games industry is so massive that it cannot be seen by the dysgenic plebs who have no internal monologue/inner voice.

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>>3534406
I got mixed feelings.
One one hand, hiking across Skyrim's vast scenery and distinct biomes is still a joy, more than a decade after release.

Then I remember the kindergarten tier block puzzles in the dungeons and the special ed tier slow delivery of NPC voice acting.
The coping ends and I realize once more the game is simply goyslop for normgroids and I feel ashamed for wasting my time on it.

>>3537850
>simply goyslop for normgroids and wasting my time
That's entertainment in general. You notice it if you do anything remotely demanding outside of them, and maybe you would not be ashamed of relaxing with a video game.

>>3534950
No, Skyrim is uniquely awful in its tendency to make the whole world revolve around you to a frankly revolting degree. I think insecure narcissists are the only people who might seriously look at how you're treated in the game and view it as a goal. Of course, ironically, whenever you AREN'T being celebrated, NPCs have a tendency to completely infantilize you. It's like paradoxically the worst of both worlds, and no, that's not good writing because they aren't even different NPCS, and it still shows an unnerving obsession with the player that should frankly be downplayed.
The only reason why it slips by is because so few people actually care about story to begin with.

>>3535391
Morrowind had:
Miss chance
Damage ranges on weapons
Directional light attacks

It unironically had more in-depth melee combat than Skyrim.

>>3537814
It's just obnoxious because basically nobody has ACTUALLY tried to compete with them via a first person open world physics RPG with lifesim elements.

>>3538013
wow so deep. so much was lost

>>3538021
Wait until you hear about the writing.

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>>3538013
There actually isn't any point to these things because Morrowind combat isn't dynamic. Like a miss doesn't functionally effect the outcome of combat. Like bethesda (and elder scrolls fans because they have severe brain damage) think dice roll = rpg, but if random damage doesn't make battles dynamic then there's no point for it to exist. Like if combat is just two guys standing face to face and hitting each other, then why does it even matter? Skyrim just trimmed the fat. It looks worse because it was built on a shitty foundation. The more snake oil that gets removed the more obvious it becomes that what was there to begin was just garbage.

>>3538017
>first person open world physics RPG with lifesim elements.
What does this even mean? These are extremely specific qualifiers which are completely meaningless. Like if I play Red Dead Redemption 2 in first person mode is it a better game than Elder Scrolls? Its the same genre of open world goyslop, it certainly doesnt have less """""RPG""""" mechanics. What about Dying Light? What about STALKER? Cyberpunk? Far Cry? The Long Dark? Sons of the Forest? You'll notice none of these games pretend to be RPGs, but are no less of an "RPG" than morrowind. Plenty of garbage for you to consume if you just stop pretending to like RPGs and look at what you really want.

>>3538027
Seems like a brainlet criticism. Whether or not you do damage effects the outcome of the fight, the likelihood you do damage comes down to a variety of factors, none of which is "snake oil" just because it's not fromsoft action animation combat. Dice rolling is a mechanic, yes. Skyrim's mechanics are actually more obscure and more fake. Many perks outright lie to you about what theh do.

>>3538027
>Extremely specific qualifiers
>Completely meaningless

Pick one. You couldn't name a single game that fit all of them, despite naming many that fit some of them, so it means exactly what it says- Companies aren't making that type of game.

>>3538031
>Whether or not you do damage effects the outcome of the fight
The whole point of random hit chance is that you have to dynamically adapt to things not going according to plan. If you are just hitting the enemy over and over at point blank regardless that doesn't matter. Either you can hit the enemy or you can't, the damage is averaged. If you have a 5% hit chance versus a far superior enemy then you might as well have a 0% hit chance.

>>3538032
>You couldn't name a single game that fit all of them
I named 7 games that fit all of those qualifiers.

>>3538033
No, there is not a singular point of random hit chance in all games. In Morrowind, the point of random hit chance is to simulate the skill of the character with the weapon their wielding, the general fatigue and ability of the character to fight, and to weigh that against the enemy's agility, fatigue, and skill at defending themselves.
Morrowind doesn't have static hit chances, and it has ways to modify hit chance- So if you're having trouble hitting somebody, drink Sujamma to improve your strength or switch to a weapon you're more skilled in.

>>3538034
Where are they? Your whole post capped by saying none of those were RPGs, you categorically admitted to not doing it.

>>3538036
>there is not a singular point of random hit chance in all games
Yes, randomness exists in games to prevent them from being deterministic. But morrowind is falsely random, as its combat is a DPS race and missing is just a consequence factored into average damage per swing.
>drink Sujamma to improve your strength
Strength doesn't increase your hit chance by the way, its just boils down to who has a higher agility/luck score, weighted heavily in the attackers favor due to weapon skill. DnD randomness on the other hand has dynamic effect ranges and a sense of uncertainty which simulates actual quality interactions which are mentally stimulating and interesting. I do not think Morrowind's system is very representative of reality when its just slamming two averaged numbers together and the bigger number wins.

>>3538037
By my definition they are not RPGs, by your definition everything is an RPG. The argument is that you can't find games to play because you are looking in the wrong genre, as bethesda has tricked you. Immersion isn't a quality unique to RPGs, most games strive to have that and many are far more immersive than elder scrolls.

>>3538013
Nope. Morrowind doesn't have power attacks, blocking or bashing. You can't stagger with a power attack, can't interrupt an enemy attack with a bash and then disarm them with a power bash.

Morrowind boils down to keeping stamina full for better hit chance and using the best directional attack for your weapon, at most. The depth is passive.

>>3538063
>morrowind has these things
>NOOOOOO well it doesn't have these other things!!!!!!!!

>>3538068
Morrowind "unironically" didn't have more in-depth melee combat than Skyrim, you simpleton.

>>3538051
>The argument is that you can't find games to play because you are looking in the wrong genre, as bethesda has tricked you.
Really well said.

Honestly, arguing with Bethesda drones is just pointless. Once you tell them that their favorite game is more of an action game with RPG elements (aka. a bad RPG) rather than an actual cRPG, and has much more in common with Far Cry 3, nu-Assassin's Creed or Dying Light rather than something like NWN, Arcanum or BG, they usually sperg out because you've shattered their whole reality with that statement, as it's irrefutable. They've always considered themselves trve RPG gamers, and telling them something like that is almost like showing proof to a religious person that their God doesn't exist.

After they acknowledge that fact, since trying to disprove it would out them as idiots, it's all cope and mental gymnastics from there on.
>but all RPG's are like this! (even though I haven't played anything other than Skyrim and Fallout)
>you're supposed to make your own fun and do the RP by yourself!
>aktchually, all quests are technically fetch quests! and muh skyrim is not all fetch quests, look at those 2 out of 100 generic quests that have 2 ways to get through them instead of 1!
>well, skyrim is not reactive, but it's not like there are other games that are reactive, they just pretend that they're reactive, name 75 games that are ACTUALLY reactive and more than skyrim
>but man, skyrim is so chill when i lobotomize myself with weed lol

The best thing is how Bethesda fans suddenly started having standards with Fallout 4 even though it's basically Skyrim with guns, just because they've tuned down with pretending that their games are RPG's, and did things like turning the dialogue box into a dialogue wheel, which was unironically a good decision since dialogues don't matter in their games anyway.

>>3538161
didn't read any of your autismo rant. Skyrim is still an rpg and I will keep enjoying it. Fallout 4 is great too. cry more about it.

i think i played skyrim years ago but it never clicked. would it be worth it to get anniversary edition and nolvus for a first playthrough?

>>3538171
If you're interested in it, then go ahead and give it a try.

>>3538161
>*tips fedora*

>>3538171
get special edition. anniversary comes with a bunch of shitty mods

>>3538174
>*tips fedora*
Indeed.

>>3538163
>didn't read any of your autismo rant.
>proceeds to comment in context of what i wrote which means that you've read my rant
Bethesda drones can't even lie on the fucking internet.
>Skyrim is still an rpg and I will keep enjoying it. Fallout 4 is great too.
Can't stop lying. Far Cry 3 is a great RPG game too. It even has more endings than Skyrim!

>>3538184
i have special edition but nolvus requires anniversary edition and the shitty mods

>>3538184
this is true if you're just playing vanilla, if you start going apeshit with the mods you'll have to bite the bullet since all big mods now are based on AE

>>3537705
When your speech gets to 30 and 50, take the bribery and persausion perks. Get caught pickpocket a guard, and you will be able to use bribe and, or persausion for them to ignore your crimes. this levels speech up quicker than selling items does. Make sure you have the thief stone and even better well-rested bonuses applied while doing this.

You can use persausion on every guard in each city once per day.

i have a character in Skyrim who has almost maxed put speech and bought most of the perchasable houses in the game.

>>3538186
you'll never have friends or get laid. neck yourself and end it now.

For me, it's the cooking pot at the Riverwood Trader

>>3538186
Far Cry 3 is a RPG. You're forgetting that it was made during the fad where EVERYTHING had to be a RPG. Pure racing games, shooters, etc. stopped being a thing.

Levelling up, narratives, immersive player characters and being able to make narrative decisions were ham-fisted into everything.

>>3534432
TES was never an actual RPG. It was always a poorly balanced action game.

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>>3538307
>It was always a poorly balanced action game.
wtf I love TES now

>>3538267
Far cry is a shooter with light rpg elements. No action in the game is based on character skill.

>>3538365
character skills are not necessary for an rpg

>>3538366
They are literally the core of what makes a RPG.

>>3538368
nah

>>3538369
what is then

>>3534406
>It's just... not good. Like at all. And the crazy thing is that I liked it when it came out.
Yeah, it's good enough if you just need to kill time and somehow have nothing better to do, but basically nothing interesting happens at any point in the game.

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I love Skyrim and it's a fantastic game, and nothing you fags say will change that.

>>3538467
If you need to mod the game to enjoy it, the game was not good to begin with.

>>3538467
boobies

>>3538246
I have multiple IRL acquaintances and I have gotten laid with multiple women in my life, and I have a fucking great taste in video games to top it off.

I'm euphoric right now.

>>3534618
Some it was not undone to this very day. Very done.

>>3538527
>I'm euphoric right now.
3/10 bait

>>3538010
You just gave GabeN a narcissistic injury.

>>3538051
Really, anon? How do *I* define RPGs? Where did I define it? I remember saying that there aren't any games that I feel compete with what I want out of Bethesda titles. Then you listed a bunch of games that, by your own admission, don't meet the standards I asked for. So what gives?
You didn't invent somebody in your head to talk to, did you?

>>3538575
>You didn't invent somebody in your head to talk to, did you?
First day on /vrpg/, friend?

>>3534406
I knew it was shit the day it came out.

>>3534432
Morrowind was god-tier writing for an RPG though.

>>3538586
Caius Cosades is one of the greatest implementations of the Mentor in the Hero's Journey and did a wonderful job of integrating game mechanics into the narrative.

>>3538527
"acquaintances" are not true friends, and prostitutes you paid for don't count. you're a fat, unwashed autist and you'll never amount to anything.

>>3538468
modding doesn't make bad games into good games, it makes good games better.

Skyrim is probably the best game ever made. There is very little wrong with it and most criticisms are that its a 13 year old game. Yes, better than Morrowind and Oblivion, those games are unfortunately both broken in ridiculous ways.

>>3538671
Skyrim doesn't need mods, it was successful when new. Really no game needs mods. The obsession with "modding" is so cringe because 98% of mods are useless bullshit and the remaining 2% aren't even necessary to play the game.

>>3534406
I cannot count how many times I've seen praise for this game. I bought it like 4 times on different hardware, hell even on Switch with the intention to play it. I never went too far, got my fusrodah, entered some random caves, looted the shit out of them, learned some spells from the academy and that's it. Its just so fucking boring.

I would rather play Fallout 4 or 67 anyday, at least there is some interesting shit on the map and I can use guns. Even Morrowind seems superior, I mean it behaves more like an RPG and at least has some fancy giant ass mushrooms out there.

>>3534406
This is what I say whenever I play whatever jarpig some faggot here relentlessly shills.

>>3538688
>The obsession with "modding" is so cringe because 98% of mods are useless bullshit
Yeah, I'd be fine with people pretending it NEEDS mods to FIX the game, if their mods were actually centered around mechanics.
Instead it seems they just needed an illusion of changing the game.

>>3538816
Skyrim NEEDS mods to fix its broken systems though. Ordinator for perks that do what they say they do and actually elaborate on the mechanics of the skills you play, and I'd say any mod that adds goldsinks into the game is essential because Skyrim's economy is uselessly slanted towards making you rich simply for want of things to actually purchase.

>>3538824
>fix its broken systems!!
>more perks and money sinks
Lol

>>3538836
yes, that's adding depth

>>3538847
Then say "adding depth" instead of "fixing broken systems", so you won't come off as a dumbass kid who just learned they can download mods and now thinks he's a game designer.

>>3538855
I'm not that anon
And it's this same thing. Skyrim has the only functional RPG system in TES series and it's still handicapped by how bland it is. Mods like Vokriinator fix it and make it the only TES games with actual build variety and actual choices to make in developing your character. Which does mean that it fixes the game and help it realize it's true potential

>>3538859
>build variety and actual choices to make in developing your character
I had that and never even considered looking at perk mods.

>>3538013
>unfun mecanic
>unfun mecanic, since you always went for max dps anyway unless it's enchanged
>skyrim also has that lmao

meanwhile skyrim has dual wielding, and proper shields that are not RNG memes

>>3538836
Not more perks, -perks that elaborate on gameplay and don't lie about what they do-. A level 100 max perk two-hand warrior's gameplay looks identical to one at skill level 35 or 50.

Yes, the economy is a system. Not having a purpose for gold is an example of a broken system. It's not just "adding depth" because Skyrim didn't have an end-game for wealth at all.

>>3538867
>defending Skyrim

>>3538942
I'm not going to entertain the idea that Skyrim is broken and requires mods because it has the usual flaws of every fucking RPG, depending on how you play. A self-sufficient loot goblin usually ends up with piles of money.

>>3538956
Could you maybe try playing some other RPGs before talking about them

>>3534406
anon this ia 13 year old game. Of course you don't like it anymore a lot of other games build upon it and now skyrim is basic.

>>3538963
>g-go play games
Why don't you go on a shopping spree with your money sink mods, faggot.

>>3538943

i'm genuinly tired of the modern skyrim hate that came from shitty e-celebs influencing zoomers. I was here in 2011, everyone liked it, except maybe a few morrowind autists. But it was such a better game than oblivion that it didn't matter.

And no, you are not one of those actual old school autists

Recently played Morrowind/Oblivion/Skyrim back to back to compare them. Oblivion and Skyrim weren’t as bad as I remembered, and I finished both games for the first time. Skyrims okay. I had fun but I got burnt out on it after a month or two and then it’s time to move on.

>>3538669
Nah, I have at least 2 true friends and I'm in a friend group. Never been to a prostitute, I'm fit at 13% body fat and I can bench 150kg.

If you really think that you need to behave like a complete normie, have normie interests, like normie games (like shatrim) and never be a contrarian in order to have friends and get laid, I think you're the one who's autistic here amigo.

>>3534439
>low impulse control retards cant stop spamming their tired threads over and over and when called out pretend they have no idea what you're talking about. stupid retards

stop projecting

brainiac

>>3538688
Completely agree. Notice no modder really gets rich or famous. Because they don't ever make any good mods. No good mod exists.

>>3539050
Put a price tag on a mod and suddenly it isn't a necessity anymore. I wonder what mod has made the most money.

>>3538688
I’d argue “transmute ore sanely” is virtually a requirement if one wishes to use that spell. Similar to how a mod to delay dark brotherhood attacks was virtually a requirement for Morrowind.

>>3539089
>I’d argue “transmute ore sanely” is virtually a requirement
Is this a joke

>>3539054
Ya I’d love to see the data. I’d love making a legit content mod, add a whole new guild. Hire voice actors. Get it done well. But then for what? To have a bunch of gamers cry that I charge for it? It’s funny when the little retards like Asmon try using capitalism to justify non payment. “You aren’t owed a living.” Ya, but if Bethesda agrees to allow it, and someone pays for it, then it’s a legal transaction. And if gamers refuse, then fine, I won’t make a mod. Just as I’m not “owed anything” neither are gamers. Hence shit mods.

>>3539134
If you can make professional quality content, go for it. Who cares what the sheep say, trying to be friends with them is futile.

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>>3539050
>Notice no modder really gets rich or famous. Because they don't ever make any good mods. No good mod exists.
What the fuck is this retardation? Modders constantly go on to create their own studios and games eventually. See here 3 examples
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Tripwire_Interactive
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Game-Labs
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Derek_Paxton
>>3538688
This sounds like a consolefag cope. Modding communities were making standalone gems or improved otherwise shit games to cult classic status since forever

>>3539128
>Is this a joke
Have you ever tried transmuting ore?

>>3539214
Oscuro ended up working at Obsidian

>>3539194
The consensus among mod enjoyers is that anyone who makes good content is the enemy and needs to be destroyed. So I’m just working on my own game. It’s good advice though. Lions don’t care for the opinions of sheep.

>>3539226
Apparently not enough to think it needs a mod lol.
To each their own. I was just completely surprised, never would've guessed that mod to be on the "required mods" list.

>>3539231
And OOO is a stupid, unbalanced broken ass mod.

>sounds like consolefag cope!!
Cringe.

>>3539233
>So I’m just working on my own game.
That's a way better option.

>>3539238
I don’t care for the mod and never used it (I dislike massive overhauls on principle, I like small a la carte mods that do specific things I want), just bringing it up as an example of a modder who got a job

>>3539214
I've never seen modding do anything interesting.

>>3539248
What is the type of thing that would interest you?

>>3539248
bro, there's tons of mods that let you suck cock in first person. you would absolutely be interested in that.

>>3538684
skyrim released the same year as dark souls and dragon's dogma, both of them have superior gameplay in every single department. Skyrim needs mods to make it better by removing the parts that make skyrim skyrim (like the shit gameplay) It has a pretty nice world and towns and shit like that but it needs mods to populate and make it intersting.

>>3539248
Fallout Sonora and Nevada.

>>3539958
So a game, Dark Souls, that only has combat, did better than a game with combat, AI, NPC's with actual dialog and who are involved in quests, a main story line, side guilds, hundreds of quests, open world exploration etc. It's why nobody takes bethesda haters seriously. You're all FUCKING STUPID.

>>3540067
Don't forget that you can also play Skyrim from both first and third person, unlike those other games. And that Skyrim has stealth. Among other things.

>>3540067
skyrim's ai is dogshit, it's npc and "dialog" are bad, the main "storyline" is bad, side guilds are... fine. they were better even in oblivion. 100s of quests doesnt = quality. open world is good i gave it that point already. Skyrim did the bare minimum and the only reason it has any staying power is because of mods.

All elder scrolls games are bad.

>>3538684
Skyrim is a shallow game cluttered with identikit dungeons and inane fetch-quests.

>>3538967
Stay mad, lol.

>>3538976
It's my honest opinion on it, and I'd have it regardless of what any youtuber said on the matter. You're right that I'm no old school autist though, at least not Morrowind old, I started with Oblivion.

>>3537959
>That's entertainment in general.

Not for me.
When I play prestigious RPGs like Front Mission III, or Betrayal @ Krondor I get a sense of spiritual renewal like I'm fulfilling my purpose in life.

It's like the difference between eating at McDonald's and eating at a kosher deli.

Just like junk food so too there is also junk gaming, which "tastes" good but is lacking in the "nutrition" needed for growth as a gamer.

>>3540913
>I'm fulfilling my purpose in life.
Consumption of entertainment?

>>3541104
Every animal, whether in nature or confined by humans, consumes (nutrients) regularly or it dies.

Entertainment is all there is.
You are what you do, and what activities (quests/minigames) you choose in the great game of life defines who you are.

Just as an olympic athlete is on a higher level than some guy who goes bowling on the weekends, so too a man of culture working his way through the Goldbox games stands above a normgroid gooning to Bethsharts's Elder Slop series.

Order in which I played Bethesda's games: Oblivion, Morrowind, Fallout 3, Fallout NV, Skyrim, Fallout 4
It was Fallout 3/NV/4 that made me not care to play TES anymore. Every time I finish a Fallout game, I realize I liked it much more than TES. I still haven't completed the Dragonborn DLC for Skyrim, feels like pulling teeth.
I just prefer guns and not having to deal with alchemy/enchanting (weapon modification is a much preferred system.)
I'll inevitably play TES6 at some point, but it probably will just feel like shittier Fallout 4.

>>3542625
I loved Skyrim but for some reason I never had any desire to play the dlc. It just didn’t really interest me to play another linear quest line. I had done enough I guess.

>>3534612
>young people having poisoned educations
this is not talked about enough, the media we indulge in is hyper derivative and we rarely read. So we're just making diluted versions of other games or shows.

>>3543049
We are replacing the native population with a foreign population and therefore it's beneficial to keep whites ignorant, and those that replace them ignorant. So university teaches gym class, listening to youtube for music appreciation. For philosophy you don't study Greece, you study MLK. You learn about oppression. Law is totally corrupt. So students who get through this system learn absolutely nothing real and are in no way liberal citizens ready to contribute. They are usually just retarded savages with a large ego. And it shows. Fallout 4 has a whole main guild where a civil rights org fights for the rights of robots. It's FUCKING STUPID. But that is all people know now. They are animals. And they know how to be heckin cute. So I'm 99% sure the next Elder Scrolls with have at least 1 cat quest. Probably more.

>>3537714
I don't really care if people like skyrim I just personally think it sucks. Somebody saying wow this sucks isnt screaming in your ear to unenjoy something posthaste

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I fucking hate this piece of shit game, I think I'm going to reinstall it again now. Fuck you Todd.

>>3544287
Wouldn't it be better to play it without hating it? You know, just enjoy the time you spend with it.

Any good nsfw mods?

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>>3544370

I played Daggerfall as an 11 year old and never forgave Todd for what he's done. The only Elder Scrolls games are Arena and Daggerfall. 3-5 are a different series known as the Todd Scrolls, made for casual console normies and fake IGN reviews, but the casuals don't even enjoy this type of crap, they were all tricked into buying, Todd is a marketing genius making inferior games that are so profitable. Truly a Godd

>>3534406
i like hitting things with big axe

>>3549259
Rueful axe is a beautiful one

Should I finally play this piece of trash? I was waiting until the game is complete, then until mods are done and now I've lost the will to play this piece of garbage.

>>3549272
No, you should go goon off on /v/

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>>3549272
do you like chill games with immersive atmospheres and comfy locations? do you like going hiking and camping with your waifus?

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>>3549791
Do you huge axes and killing elves with huge axes?

So like, are all the mods availible on nexus?
I jsut got skyrim special edition on the sale, and I'm wondering if I want characters to look like this>>3537535
would I find all the stuff on nexus?

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>>3549807
i can even give you the list of mods to make her, bro.

>>3549811
Go I ahead, I'll be waiting here.

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>>3549814
racemenu and bodyslide are the utilities you need, read the guide:
https://www.nexusmods.com/skyrimspecialedition/mods/19080
https://www.nexusmods.com/skyrimspecialedition/mods/201
here's the head, make sure to get the requirements:
https://www.nexusmods.com/skyrimspecialedition/mods/56930
body:
https://www.nexusmods.com/skyrimspecialedition/mods/20024
bodypaint and tattoos:
https://www.nexusmods.com/skyrimspecialedition/mods/22487
clothing:
https://www.nexusmods.com/skyrimspecialedition/mods/56805

go for it!

>>3549818
cool thanks

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>>3549820
you are welcome!

>>3549807
>are all the mods availible on nexus?
The vast majority are, but if you go deep enough in the rabbit hole you'll eventually find more obscure sites, and if you're a coomer there's also loverslab, and eventually you'll come across some cunt who deleted/hid a mod that you needed and will have to search around or ask other people for a reupload.

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>>3544327
Because the game is not good, and the few redeeming qualities aren't prominent enough to ignore the glaring flaws and pretend it's not shit.
But still, its huge modding scene gives me a feeling of "I can fix it!" combined with a desire to try new stuff every now and then so I always end up reinstalling it in hopes that I can make it fun even if I know that's unlikely. And the more mods I install in an attempt to fix it, the more broken this already buggy mess becomes until it turns actually unplayable.
This time I just wanted to play a murderhobo hunter-gatherer sort of character and wander around exploring and trying to immerse myself, but even with fewer mods than in my last install I ended up breaking stuff in ways that I didn't even know they could be broken, and can't find any working solutions online so it's going to be a pain in the ass to fix it. If I do manage to fix it after all the time I already spent modding and troubleshooting it, then maybe, maybe I might get to enjoy the game...

>>3550890
sounds like a (you) problem. I run nearly 700 mods and don't have a single crash or broken thing.
my guess is you're probably too dumb to understand the basic game mechanics, and that's admittedly a very low bar.

>>3550894
>sounds like a (you) problem
It kinda is because this time my stupid ass installed over 400 mods at once without stopping to test the game even once until I thought I was "finished". I had some 600 in my last install and the broken shit was small and sparse enough to be easily-ignored because when something breaks significantly after installing 1 or 2 new mods it's very easy to fix it.
And that doesn't change the fact that the game is shitty enough to need literal hundreds of mods to become half-decent.

>>3534432
>They're good at building engines and designing immersive environments within their games
Highly questionable statement .
>>3534406
Played it for 30 minutes when it came out and then uninstalled it, typical Bethslop.

>>3534612
The only thing Oblivion has is a strong opening sequence which hooks you into playing it probably for a fair bit longer than it deserves. Skyrim of course utterly fails at this by going for spectacle, eschewing any sort of intrigue or mystery to keep you playing.

>>3550996
Damn elves. I bet they had something to do with this.

>>3537763
Prey is outstanding because of how bad and uncharismatic it is.

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13 years. You Morrowfags have been screeching for 13 years.

>>3534406
I remember when it came out I made like 100 daggers and it unlocked the endgame armor and weapons. I went around for another couple hours feeling like sauron smiting shit and then got bored and dropped it.

The setting was at least better than oblivion but couldn't hold a candle to how interesting morrowind was. Playing that back on the xbox back in the day (I know talk about casual but I was 13 cut me slack) was a found memory. Morrowind blew my young mind in it's scope

>>3552743
18 years

>>3534406

Still a better game than numerous crpg shit praised here

>>3552969
No it's not

>>3552743
I’m playing Skyrim right now. I am going to put on Pelinals armor and kill every elf in the game. I turned off their essential status. Mer pass: revoked
>t. Morrowfag

>>3552666
Prey is great but it’s an Arkane game, not a Bethesda game. Bethesda just published it due to some fuckery with owning the rights to the original and unrelated Prey.

The reason I love Morrowind so much is that it has no limits and doesnt take itself seriously in the gameplay department whatsoever.
You start as a slug who struggles to kill insects (although its not that bad if you build your character properly), late game you are a demigod flying around the map and 90% of all enemies are just annoying bugs you squash without really thinking about it.
Most of the time you put a character to rest when you start brewing infinite mana potions and craft over the top meme spells because you can just toy around with the world because nothing can touch you. Its the only rpg I know off where you can become that powerful after beating the BBEG and its a shame.
Its also why I dont like the DLCs that much, those Goblins and Werewolves were just too strong.

Skyrim takes itself too seriously and thats why it aged like shit. Goes for the Witcher 3 and 2 as well. Grumpy Gerald with his raspy voice makes me laugh out loud, its so stupid.

>>3553552
>takes itself too seriously
There is no such thing. If it's not serious then it's shit. Hard rule, no exceptions. Whedontards need to hang.

>>3534406
All bethesda games age poorly beside skyrims for porn like the internet or ai.

>>3534636
That's cringe and wrong

>>3554246
That's my penis going in and out of your mouth at a very fast pace

SHOULD I FUCKING TRY THIS MASTERPIECE OF SHIT OR NOT?
I didn't quite like Oblivion because of horrendous graphics and auto-leveling of everything.
I tried Skyrim for about 5 hours and I didn't like the graphics and I know there is also auto-leveling, also I was waiting for complete edition. So now there is the complete edition AND a shitload of mods, but I am not sure if I like this game. Should I play it out of spite? Is this even good?

>>3554268
Skyrim has way better level scaling than Oblivion, but you may want to check out the Requiem overhaul mod. It removes level scaling, takes inspiration from older CRPGs, and manages to keep the vanilla feel. It's a very well-made overhaul.

>>3554268
Skyrim splits the difference between Morrowind and Oblivion in terms of leveling. I prefer Morrowinds unique NPCs, but it’s better than Oblivion at least. Enemies scale in discrete tiers, and eventually that type of enemy will stop scaling, e.g. bandits cap out at 28. No more infinite scaling. There’s still leveled items but it’s somewhat toned down from oblivion e.g. no more you’re level 24 and now everything in the game is glass and Daedric. Personally I removed Daedric and dragonbone from the leveled lists since they’re not craftable but everything else is, and called that good.

An issue is with the encounter zones, each area has a predefined range, like 15-25, everything will scale to you within that range. So if you’re under 15 everything is 15, if you’re 23 it’s 23, and if you’re 35 it’s just 25. Most areas in the game have too low of a range and so the late game is trivial. I spent a few hours and made a little mod that set each areas encounter zone to max out its enemy type, and nothing respawns.

>>3554292
>overhaul
I hate mods like this because although I’ll likely agree with some of the changes, I’m sure to dislike others. I prefer mods that do just one thing and then combining them a la carte.

>>3554345
I have a dislike for overhauls as well, because they go overboard. Requiem however only does what is necessary to reach its goals, but a game like Skyrim did need a touch here and there to get more depth out of it.

In my opinion Requiem is the most professional and impressive mod, because Skyrim with Requiem doesn't feel modded at all.

>>3534810
yeah i'm sure those tranime visual novels you read are far more intellectually stimulating than .those lowly rpgs you despise so much. furthermore, wtf even is 'proper stimulus' when it comes to gaming? brain training for nintendo DS nigga? im genuinely curious if you actually though this out.

One more thing, I HAVE to install mods to play Skyrim right? BUT if I would start installing mods I couldn't be stopped. How to draw a line?

>>3554462
You will be stopped by reference limit

>>3554462
You don't have to install mods. Maybe it's better if you don't. Many people have complained they can't enjoy the game properly because they start obsessing over mods.
I play vanilla.

>>3554496
But how about unofficial fixes...

>>3554462
A modlist is finished not when there is nothing left to add, but nothing left to take away

>>3534406
Bad troll. Weak bait. Not biting.

>>3537714
>calling everyone that likes older games zoomers whilst unironically enjoying zoomer slop
this angle doesn't really work as well you think it does

>>3534406
It's objectively worse than Oblivion. That said though I still am doing a 100% completion playthrough of the anniversary edition as a final send off and then never picking it up again, ever, even if they make new versions.

>>3554750
>says the bethesda drone for the 55th time

>>3534406
yeah im 40 hours into another playthrough, yeah i like morrowind more but I gravitate so much towards this game. I tried Far Cry 3, I've finished Cyberpunk and i don't understand why anybody would play those over an elder scrolls or even fallout

>>3535391
this place is just endless contrarianism, anything well-regarded is going to get shit on
i don't know if there's a singlegame i've never seen shit on on here. maybe mount & blade? i'm sure i could find it if i searched for it though

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Modded Skyrim ruined my life.

>>3554809
looks good bro! keep up the modding.

>>3554780
IQ is real. Those games are for retarded people and children. Far Cry 3 was such an absolute empty piece of SHIT.

>>3554809
this doesn't even look like a dunmer female dude. that is just a human with blue skin. n'wah, do even you care at all about the game (and its lore) that you're turning into softcore porn?

>>3554781
>this place is just endless contrarianism, anything well-regarded is going to get shit on
>i don't know if there's a singlegame i've never seen shit on on here.
I agree, and I’ve asked the same question. Deus Ex is all I can think of really

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>>3554824
>this doesn't even look like a dunmer female dude. that is just a human with blue skin
The Elder Scrolls series isn't consistent in how it depicts its fantasy races or its art-style and setting in general. See the dunmer in Daggerfall for example, they don't have some of the more alien features found in Skyrim or Morrowind, they just have sharper features and elf ears. Sure, my character in that photo doesn't even have sharp features, but the point I'm trying to make is that canonicity of visual elements in the Elder Scrolls series is weak.

>do even you care at all about the game (and its lore)
I have roughly 1000 hours in vanilla, that is, unmodded, Skyrim across various platforms and have gotten all achievements before I started modded it. I have a similar playtime in Morrowind and have beaten the game and its DLC mostly-vanilla several times over with the difficulty slider on max. I haven't played much Oblivion I'm ashamed to admit but I have gotten most of the way through the main quest on my several attempts to get into it. And I have maybe around a hundred or two hours in Daggerfall, and I've seen things you people wouldn't believe. Quest locations that are physically impossible to reach in dungeons. I've watched liches fall through the floor. All those moments will be lost in time, like a single HALT in a swarm of guards after a failed pickpocket.
Do you know of the battle between Nerevar and Ysmir? Do you know of the Senche and the Alfiq? Of the Igma and the Tsaesci? What makes you the arbiter of whether or not I care about this game and its lore?

>that you're turning into softcore porn?
Daggerfall has some pretty saucy shit in it, I'm just retvrning to tradition.
But more seriously, I just have an install that I use to jack off. Can a man not use his Skyrim copy in the way he likes? At the end of the day its just a video game, its nothing sacred, it's not like I'm making porn of Paradise Lost or Dante's Inferno or Hamlet.

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>>3554809
based

>>3554462
Just try out the mods incrementally, be sure to back up your saves before installing a new one, and simply remove a mod if you don't like it after trying it. After a while you'll build up a modlist that suits your tastes.

Also you definitely don't need mods to play Skyrim, the game itself is fine even in 2024. I would recommend modding the game *after* you've done a playthrough or two and are looking for new content or changes to things you don't like.

>>3534406
It's overrated. But, a good game, nonetheless.
The game lacks character expression. Skill-based dialogue would've helped with making your character "feel more real."
Narrative agency is exception and binary. That's why people say Skyrim is a bad RPG, because it doesn't give much opportunity for players to insert their ego in the narrative. That's why New Vegas gets dickrode a lot.
I would just prefer having skill-based dialogue than narrative agency since TES is a narratively linear series by design. Gatekeeping player characters that are shit at magic from joining a faction of mages would make the game feel immersive and reciprocative of player agency. Also, if your character is a powerful mage before joining should have some unique dialogue. Small things like that can go a long way.

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>>3534406
IT'S UP
https://www.nexusmods.com/skyrimspecialedition/mods/119892

>>3555126
TES system should have kept creating custom classes, and capping any non-class skills at the base value + racial mod. Should’ve kept the stats too.

>>3555672
Modded non-VR Skyrim already ruined my motivation to try to be with real women, if I could afford VR I don't think I would ever leave my Skyrim gooncave

>>3555766
I personally really liked that aspect of the class systems in Elder Scrolls back when the games still had class systems. Being able to use and train skills that weren't in your class was the perfect balance between encouraging players to roleplay as their class but not being overly restrictive. And plenty of the vanilla classes were poorly designed so the player would inevitably have to train skills outside of those classes to progress through certain quests, plenty of classes in Daggerfall and Morrowind had an overabundance of weapon skills but very little utility skills like lockpicking so they couldn't complete any quests that required lockpicking. That could be considered a design flaw on Bethesda's part for not giving an non-lockpicking option for those classes but limiting the leveling on non-class skills just seems really unfun even if Bethesda had better quest design.

>>3534406
Skyrim is great if you treat it as fantasy Garry's Mod.
Every year or so I get the urge to try out some ultra-specific way to play, so I throw in a bunch of mods I think sound fun and then just dick around for 20 hours or so. Last time I did a monk playthrough in VR so I was literally just punching shit. Was fun.
Now I'm getting the urge to play again to try some sort of a summoner playthrough. Necromancer? Some other type of summoner? not sure

>>3556721
People play Skyrim and it’s not as a Nord with an axe?

>>3534406
It's very bad at being an actual RPG with choices, builds and classes sure, but it's still a fantastic game that came at just the right time where technology was becoming very good but DEI bullshit wasn't yet a thing. It's my favorite game, because Skyrim feels like home, and cleansing it of bandits, imperials and thalmors then simply admiring the view of the forests and the snow is so peaceful. And Skyrim's music by Jeremy Soule is absolutely perfect. But of course he got accused of rape by some retard roastie and he has been replaced by a literal israeli now.

>>3534547
Power fantasies feel good. That's why no one plays mages in vanilla Skyrim, they suck at the power fantasy. To this day I don't get why they didn't just let destruction level affect damage like it works for all other weapons like bow, one handed and the like. Casting the flame spell at level 10 destruction or 100 does the exact same damage, it's stupid.

If mages were good, a good portion of people who complain about Skyrim and love Morrowind/Oblivion wouldn't exist.

>>3556722
This might come as a shocker but for many people the appeal of RPGs is being able to try out a variety of different builds and playstyles and make different choices each playthrough.

>>3556738
>mages in vanilla Skyrim, they suck at the power fantasy
??? Ragdolling foes with fireballs feels more powerful than playing warriors to me. Enemies barely get a chance to fight back.

>>3556721
>Some other type of summoner? not sure
Conjuration + restoration + shield, grab a follower too and support your allies as they deal with enemies with healing, guardian circle and turn undead.

I've had most fun with sword & board, but I would like to make some sort of alchemist next time.

>>3556841
In vanilla Skyrim magic is simply extremely underpowered, at least in terms of damage. At best you can get a +50% damage increase on your destruction magic, maybe an addition +50% when wearing a certain late-game headgear. Compare that to weapon skills which get +50% damage solely from skill leveling, another +100% from perks, with a massive bonus to the weapon's base damage from smithing (likely around 12-15 with enchants, potions, and max smithing), and maybe another ~+100% damage from enchants.
With all this combined you'll be looking at over 120 damage on an ordinary daedric sword which attacks faster and doesn't have to worry about mana, meanwhile expert level destruction spells can do at most 90 damage but with slow cast time and mana issues.
The ability to stagger-lock enemies at range does mitigate this issue but anyone who is minmaxing with physical weapons probably has the damage to make stagger irrelevant anyways.

There are plenty of mods to fix this.

>>3557318
>With all this combined you'll be looking at over 120 damage on an ordinary daedric sword
>expert level destruction spells can do at most 90 damage
Adept level fireballs do 120 damage cast with both hands at range in 15ft radius, potentially hitting multiple opponents
>mana issues
No issues for dedicated casters.

Learn to play, scrub.

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>>3557335
try casting magic against this shit

>>3557342
>poisons you with weakness to fire 100% for 30 seconds
Here, have 600pts worth of fireballs while you try to run up to me

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>>3557350
>he has to use poisons of all things to make his build viable
come back when you can get that damage with a regular swing