>abilities, held items, weather, terrain, entry hazards, trick room, and the gen gimmick (megas, z-moves, dynamax, tera).Pokéchads have the most mechanically complex RPG and it's not even close.
>>3658650Which is the better game, chess or go?
Hey, I remember this thread, it's a classic!
Can't believe this thread is gonna be the next big vee arr pee geeh copypasta.
Favorite Souls game?
>>3658733Trails of Reansteel 4
>>3658650my ex-girlfriend that i actually stayed friends with after we broke up was a pokemon autist who would transfer literally everything in her pokedex to the next iteration and once the gen1 pokemon were completely incompatible and couldn't be transfered she flipped out beyond all comprehension on the telephone
>>3658745
>>3658650>gen gimmick (megas, z-moves, dynamax, tera)The last and only time I ever played a Pokémon game was red and blue on a gameboy emulator and I refuse to believe these are even real things, you’re just making words up now
>>3658650>chadsWhat does you finding 4chan after 2016 have to do with video games?
>>3658755chan boomers are disgusting. grandpa thinks the only slang allowed is from early 2000
>>36587634chins is a boomer board, newfriend.
>>3658774for the most part/v/ and /b/ are still full of underage kids just like they were in peak we are anonymous we are legion we do not forgive we do not forget expect us, but the slow comfy boards are all internet boomers
forgot to attach relevant pici was actually planning on buying one of these in case the world even fell into violent revolution, but no one remembers this meme anymore, so it has no point
even gen1 was already incredibly complex team composition and moveset strategy for a children's bug catcher game, that being said, gen 2 and gen 3 was okayish and everything after sucks ass
>>3658650>Pokéchads have the most mechanically complex RPG and it's not even close.that isn't very complex at all
>>3658650>turn based>only 1 vs 1 at a timeThere goes that complexity with those restrictionsRtwp chads win
>>3658650The gen gimmicks were one of the worst things ever because of them exactly being gimmicks. It doesn't even utilize double battles that much in mainline when that's one of the more challenging modes that add a layer of complexity to battles. I like pokemon but it has a shitton of flaws it could fix. Legends Arceus was a breath of fresh air at least.
>>3658745understandable
>>3658782Saw a lady wear one of these into Costco during covid. Was pretty funny. Saw a mom wear one of those black skull masks too
>>3658650>1v1 and 2v2 only means that all battles boil down to picking the right pokemon typeSo much for all the complexity.
>>3659262Actually no. A Gyarodos isn't beating a Groudon if that same Groudon knows stone edge. Pokemon also has a ton of item variation. Even seemingly detrimental ones like Iron Ball have good use cases.>Leftovers - health recovery per turn>Black Sludge - health recovery per turn for Poison, health drain for everybody else>Weakness Policy - raises offenses when hit by a weakness>Life Orb - boosts damage output but drains HP with each attack>Eject Button - switches the user out when holder is hit by an attack>Red Card - switches the attacker out when holder is hit by an attack>Eject Pack - switches the holder out when debuffed>Iron Ball - user is grounded and Speed is halved>Air Balloon - immunity to Ground until hit>Assault Vest - attacks only, but boosted SpD>Loaded Dice - guarantees multi-hit moves will hit at least 4 times if possible>Flame/Toxic Orb - inflicts a status to the holder>Choice Band/Scarf/Specs - forces the use of one move but boosts a stat>Heavy-Duty Boots - immunity to entry hazards>Rocky Helmet - attacker takes damage on contact with the holder>Damp/Dry/Icy/Smooth Rock/Light Clay/Terrain Extender - extends the duration weather, defensive screens, terrain>White Herb - removes debuffs once>Power Herb - removes charge time for two-turn moves once>Throat Spray - boosts SpA after using a sound-based move>Room Service - lowers Speed after using Trick Room>Focus Sash - guarantees 1 HP from full health once>Grassy/Misty/Electric/Psychic Seeds - boost a stat when the holder is in a Terrain effect>various consumable Berries that boost stats or heal at low HP, restore status ailments, decrease damage that strikes weaknesses.Again, can you name me any more complex RPG than this?
>>3659447The thing is those things hardly come in to play with most npcs in the base games. Maybe for shit like battle frontier/factory etc but outside of competitive pvp and modded/hacked roms Gamefreak doesn't really use those things the best they can. If pokemon added difficulty options it would be able to retain both the aging fanbase and kids.
>>3658858>Pokemon>Only 1 vs 12 vs 2 has been in the games for over 2 decades.
>>3658813Platinum and black white 2 are peak from a gameplay perspective
>>3658733Elden Ring
>>3659447I quite like pokemon but all the complexity only comes into play in the multiplayerI've beaten every pokemon out there with just my starter and some TM slaves and never cared to learn about anything more complex than using the attack that deals the most damage
>>3659920Cool, now let’s see your battle tower/frontier streaks.
>>3659631Im pretty sure the thread is talking about the complexity of the battle system and not the main campaign.Everyone who plays pokemon is fully aware that the real game actually starts in the post game.Its one reason why pokemon SV suck so much as it completely lacks a post game even with the dlc. I was begging to god every night that all battles in blueberry academy would be level capped but alas no not allowed
>>3658650>and the gen gimmick (megas, z-moves, dynamax, tera).fuck gen gimmicks, I do agree with the rest though, surprisingly deep gameplay potential completely ruined by easy in-game difficulty aimed at retarded toddlers
>>3659920honestly pokemon players aren't too brighti forget what the name of it was because i played it in the early '00s, but it was some free to play pokemon simulation before the DMCA existed that basically gave you a giant menu that let you customize and item and hidden stat twink your pokemon in any way you want, then ripped off all the game assets for graphics when you were in actual battlethere was an item called the light ball which only pikachu could equip, so i looked into exactly what it did and it gave multiplicative stats, and i ran it through excel, and created a pikachu that was so stacked into speed and special attack that it would always go first and one shot anything that wasn't totally immune to lightningall my friends from irc thought it was cool as fuck i created the pikachu from the fucking anime itself, but the regulars on this game were so pissed off i broke their legendary meta and just obliterated everything they had with pikachu, and they were so fucking autistic they would flame me for "not playing the game correctly" and while my irc friends were smart enough to swap in a rock pokemon to completely cockblock my strat, absolutely none of the regulars would do it at allit got to the point where first they bitched to the owners of the server to ban me, and they obviously weren't going to do that, then they all just refused to play against me, and then we got bored of playing this pokemon simulator with my irc friends and went back to playing tetrinet, quake 3, and broodwar bgh
>>3659958Thats more of a community problem than anything. When I played on showdown or with certain friends they got mad whenever I used stall, which isn’t an infallible playstyle but can be slow. This is because mostly everyone that plays competitively prefers hyper offense so they don’t bring answers to certain walls or create teams around having switch ins creating this situation where people who play the meta get pissed when you don’t use cookie cutter sets.Just ignore chats when playing with randoms and play with friends who are actually worthwhile having and not the dogshit people you knew.
>>3659968i know what you mean bro, but this was literally like 20 years ago, it was before i graduated high school in '03 and some point after rocket arena 3 came out, which google is way too confused to find me the answer on when it came out, but it had to have been at least after '99, and that's all i can remember for a date range
>>3659969honestly you don't sound too bright
I'm not too brigth hence why I just pick the coolest looking mon and grind until I can beat the game wit hitworks every time
>>3659997personally i think you and everyone on 4chan who hates me is illiteratei've been one of the most polarizing posters in this place since it opened
>>3660023being a namefag automatically places you on cockroach level, so the fact that you are considered even lower than that speaks to the quality of your posts.
>>3659631>>3659920Okay, but this thread wasn't talking about the single player campaign only. It was talking about overall, including multiplayer. In which case, yes. It is the most mechanically complex RPG out there. Literally, no other RPG has a robust enough system for PVP like Pokémon does.
>>3660024like i said, i'm very sorry that you can't read wordsif i didn't have a name, you would just assume i'm some "schizoposter", and you'd flame me anyway, so why does it bother you that i have a usernameaccept this classic [s4s] meme as my apology
let me apologize even further by throwing on my tripcode, but the whole point of yuji sakai, is that anyone can be yuji sakai, so it's very easy to figure out if you know anything about his lore
and now i'll completely take off everything, and apologize to you by walling you beyond all comprehension about how pokemon is one of the shittiest games ever made and i have absolutely no nostalgia for it, and you'll realize my writing style is so recognizable that you're just going to hate me anywaylet me go look up some exact dates. i played pokemon blue, collected that end of the pokedex and that's it. i got pokemon blue for christmas of '98, so i would have been 13 years old and my brother got pokemon red and he was 11 years old, and we also got two brand new game boy colors because my dad wanted to monopolize the old gameboy to play tetris, tetris, and more tetris, and more tetris, for like literally 5 hours straight sometimes, and got himself a power cable for the OG gameboy that christmas because he was sick of chewing through batterieswe both heard about the missingno rumor and caught that thing, it was cool, we were constantly battling each other with our new pokemon as we went through the game, but because i'm just better at games than him, i was always higher level, so i always wonhere's why i think pokemon is fucking stupid though. the three starters are esssentially a hidden difficulty gameplay mechanic, where charamander is objective the worst one. nothing you fight in the early game is particularly weak to him in the gyms, and by the time charizard can finally shit stomp stuff, you have other fire pokemon that are just better and he has no pointthe gameplay mechanics are extremely linear and shallow, and the whole terrain affecting your level up stats is a completely undocumented and hidden EV mechanic that's one of the dumbest idea's nintendo has ever had
the original giant rock paper scissors tree seems reasonable with the early game stuff, but the endgame stuff like ice and psychic just obliterates everything, significantly limiting the number of useful pokemon you can use, and instead of fix the problem, future generations of pokemon just added more endgame types like metal and other things that i don't honestly know because i didn't play any of these games because i have no nostalgia for them whatosevermy brother picked squirtle as his opening pokemon, so he didn't realize it, but that's why he had the game on ezmode, where squirtle can faceroll the whole early game, and while he beat the game first, he was still losing to me in pokemon link battles because i was higher level until he finally got mewtwo, and that was fucking aggravatingthen all of a sudden instead of do what we were agreed to do on christmas, where we were gonna trade each other everything we needed to complete our pokedex, he abruptly bought a gameshark instead, because of mew. we both entered the nintendo power contest to get pokemon #151, we didn't win, he thought this was BS so he bought himself the gameshark to get himself a mew, then started gamesharking himself every single pokemon in the game, and because he refused to trade with me, i had no choice but to use the gameshark to complete my own pokedexthe entire exp flow and economy of pokemon is stupid, the pokebux flow, whatever they call it, i don't remember, is a completely static amount based on the pokemon trainer encounters which never respond, so you can theoretically get yourself hardstuck, but the game gives you such a stupid amount of money that it never actually happenstwo of the absolute worst mechanics of all times are the master ball, as there is only one and exactly one and you're never quite sure when to use it unless you read a guide in advance and know about mewtwo
the other stupid mechanic being eevee and the evolve stones where you can only get one of the three evolves per playthrough, meaning you need to do 4 laps on this fucking game to complete the pokedexthe whole TM/HM mechanic is equally stupid, as any mechanic in an rpg that permanently locks you out of something forever is bad mechanic. there's generally no tradeoffs between techs, one is usually clearly always better than the other, because pokemon is a straight 1v1 rpg, where the math is faceroll and shit for the same reason dragon quest 1 is faceroll and shitthe whole PP system is smoke and mirrors, you almost never actually run out of PP unless you're dicking around on purposei was playing absolutely hardcore shit like quake and broodwar when i was playing pokemon, so once i gamesharked my pokedex, i had absolutely zero interest in continuing to play it, and my brother got pokemon yellow, my family was confused i didn't want it too, and i was like i don't like this game very much, it's way to easy for me and there's not much decision makingsome of the stuff they do to gate you like a metroidvania with surf and the ghost pokemon are interesting, but fishing? magikarp is terrible game design, you have to grind something that does absolute nothing useful until it becomes useful suddenlypersonally, i think the only good thing that came out of pokemon was the anime, that show was pretty cool and i caught basically every single episdoe of the first 4, maybe 5 seasons? i don't know, but as far as the game itself went, it was way to simple compared to everything else i was playing once you had that endless flowchart memorized, or just had it right in front of you while you played
there is a LOT of shit they could have done to make the original 150 have a lot more variance, and they didn't. it's mostly just a numbers game where some pokemon are objectively better than others, unlike final fantasy, where everything you do is situational, and if you just mindless mash the fight command, you're usually gonna diei became personal friends with tom "zileas" cadwell in 2002, the now rockstar game designer behind warcraft 3: frozen throne, classic wow, dota all stars, and league of legends, and love or hate those games you gotta admit someone likes them. he taught me a lot of about video game design math, amd if i had the common sense to hold on his to MIT phd disseration, "the cost effectiveness of a marine against a zergling on a theoretically infinite plane", i would be holding on to a riot games trade secret, how they crunch the gold value of speed and mana/cooldown value of hastes/slows. there is a LOT of shit gamefreak could have done with the pokemon to increase the variance of what you can do, and game freak just didn't fucking do itand honestly, pokemon wasn't even the first pokemon. shin megami tensei was, but the plot of that game was too controversial to be released in the US, as NOA's policy was the christians won't stop accussing video games of causing violence so we don't want any religion in our games at all, which i don't think they broke the embargo on at all until DOOM finally got ported to the SNES
because pokemon was cute and cuddly and so brain dead that a 6 year old could eventually beat it, the game popped off beyond all comprehension, and is massively popular with people younger than me, but why would i want to play some boring ass 1v1 battle where you lose serious tempo for trying to switch out a hard counter when i can go EN TARO ADUN EXECUTOR and control a whole fucking army of zealot/dragon/high templar, then go ANADAURANADUR, YOUR BLOOD IS MINE, FOR KHALINDOR with the demon hunter and a shit ton of huntresses in warcraft 3, or play quake, a game where it's just all reflexes and timing and map knowledge, and us quakers view the spawn system like the weather, where sometimes you get fucked over on a field goal, sometimes you get giftwrapped a 55 yarder, and a single frag doesn't really decide a game, it's your net damage and controlthere is literally no reason that pokemon couldn't be a consecutive 6v6 clusterfuck with targetting selection, they couldn't use ATB because square still had the patent on that, but they could have made it a party based system and then suddenly you have lots of reasons to rotate your pokeballs around depending on what you're up again, and you could use the FF1 mechanic where the lower you are in the row order, the lower chance you have to get hit, in order for there to be some sort of reason to rotate your party around. but that would require game freak to actually write an intelligent AI for their pokemon trainers and do math more complicated that sqrt(damage*hp) vs sqrt(damage*hp)basically i think pokemon sucks ass, it's just trendy because it's so cutesey, and if SOCIETY bottom text was a little different, and SMT got a US release, pokemon never would have gained any traction at all beyond being this weird multiplayer version of it
as you can see, i don't need a username to be recognizeable when i do what i do, so i'm using a username to do you a fucking favor. if you honestly find me that annoying, just install 4chanx and filter methe only time i ever checked out another pokeman game aside from pokemon blue when when i rented pokemon stadium to see what was up with that thing, and oh my god that game sucked, it had basically no point to itnothing personal against its fanboys and fangirls, but if you guys consider FF to be baby's first rpg, then this one is fetus' first rpg, it's that braindead to anyone who knows how to do basic math and minmax
>>3658650>Laundry list of mechanics=goodAnd yes the poketard is back again.
>>3660308Any counter arguments?
>>3660307Do you really think you aren’t a schizo after posting all of that drivel?
>>3659955Exactly. Battle Frontier is ridiculous. The Factory is an exercise in masochism unless you use the data ripped from the game cartridge and meticulously apply it, but even then you can still get screwed over by chance. The Tower is probably one of the easier modes to break, but most of the work is creating a team with excellent IVs, doing the breeding, doing the EV training, getting the TMs and whatnot. There are some pretty solid strats to punk the AI in order to get sustainable streaks going.
>>3659631You're right. There should be a hard mode or something in the main campaign that features good AI, better enemy team sets and additional rules in and out of battle. The Battle Frontier is pretty janky. At least the Gen 4 one is. You've got to literally break the game in order to do some of those streaks.
